My niece needs some auto parts. I called Advanced Auto Parts. They
need the money before they can order the parts from the factory
(Ford). Cool........I have a 15k limit on my card. Ready for my card
number? Well we have to have you come down here and bring the card to
order it.
What?
Well.......this is a part that comes from the dealer. We have to get
you to come in to pay for it.

I can only guess they suspect foul play. Anyone else get turned down
for trying to order over the phone?

On Nov 8, 7:03*pm, Metspitzer wrote:
My niece needs some auto parts. *I called Advanced Auto Parts. *They
need the money before they can order the parts from the factory
(Ford). *Cool........I have a 15k limit on my card. *Ready for my card
number? *Well we have to have you come down here and bring the card to
order it.
What?
Well.......this is a part that comes from the dealer. *We have to get
you to come in to pay for it.

I can only guess they suspect foul play. *Anyone else get turned down
for trying to order over the phone?

LOL...

@Metspitzer:

Ask any one of your friends who might run a business where the public
purchases things from them that accepts a credit card as payment...

Transactions which are non-swiped cost the business double what
swiped transactions cost... 2% of the transaction total vs 4%...

Apparently the Auto Parts store didn't want to pay 4% of the total
sale on a special order...

With retail business being sluggish, every penny adds up...

This is why some businesses still take imprints of the credit cards,
it proves the card was present at the time of sale...

~~ Evan

On Tue, 8 Nov 2011 16:28:33 -0800 (PST), Evan
wrote:

On Nov 8, 7:03*pm, Metspitzer wrote:
My niece needs some auto parts. *I called Advanced Auto Parts. *They
need the money before they can order the parts from the factory
(Ford). *Cool........I have a 15k limit on my card. *Ready for my card
number? *Well we have to have you come down here and bring the card to
order it.
What?
Well.......this is a part that comes from the dealer. *We have to get
you to come in to pay for it.

I can only guess they suspect foul play. *Anyone else get turned down
for trying to order over the phone?

LOL...

@Metspitzer:

Ask any one of your friends who might run a business where the public
purchases things from them that accepts a credit card as payment...

Transactions which are non-swiped cost the business double what
swiped transactions cost... 2% of the transaction total vs 4%...

Apparently the Auto Parts store didn't want to pay 4% of the total
sale on a special order...

With retail business being sluggish, every penny adds up...

This is why some businesses still take imprints of the credit cards,
it proves the card was present at the time of sale...

~~ Evan

That is a very good reason.

On 11/8/2011 16:28, Evan wrote:

This is why some businesses still take imprints of the credit cards,
it proves the card was present at the time of sale...

In the past ten years the only businesses I have had take credit card
imprints have been hotels. I use a secure or virtual account number to
guarantee the reservation, but they have never honored it at the desk
unless the reservation included prepayment.

On Nov 9, 12:03*am, Bob wrote:
On 11/8/2011 16:28, Evan wrote:

This is why some businesses still take imprints of the credit cards,
it proves the card was present at the time of sale...

In the past ten years the only businesses I have had take credit card
imprints have been hotels. *I use a secure or virtual account number to
guarantee the reservation, but they have never honored it at the desk
unless the reservation included prepayment.

Sounds to me like you haven't dealt with a small enough business,
the big chain stores use electronic capture of signature of the
person using the card as well as store CCTV footage to document
who made the purchase rather than keeping a printed copy of
the receipt on file in the store for the required retention period...

Smaller stores still imprint the card, especially when the card
doesn't swipe and the numbers had to be punched in manually,
as the card is either swiped or imprinted to prove it was there
at the time of purchase... Smaller stores also still deal with
keeping extra copies of the receipts on file in case of a
charge back during the retention period...

LOL... Using a "secure" or "virtual" account number to do
anything where you have to reserve something is stupid,
as the virtual account number won't match your name
and address like the info on your actual real account will,
hotels tend to like knowing the real name of the person
reserving the room in case of a no show as they have
the information to send the bill -- this is why your attempts
at anonymous reservations with a credit card that didn't
match the name you reserved under were not honored
without payment of a deposit...

~~ Evan

Evan wrote:

the big chain stores use electronic capture of signature of the
person using the card as well as store CCTV footage

Smaller stores still imprint the card,

Here in Canada we've had a small chip on our credit cards for about 2
years now. About 75% of the retailers I go to (big box, grocery stores,
restaurants, etc) have chip-enabled readers where you slide in the card
and enter a 4-digit pin to complete the transaction. This replaces the
requirement to sign anything, and the cashier doesn't ask to see the
card (let alone take an imprint of it).

I believe that if 3 incorrect attempts are made to enter the PIN within
a short span of time that the card is automatically disabled.

At gas pumps here in Canada, when you slide in your credit card to pay
at the pump, we don't have to enter our zip-code (or postal code in our
case) to complete the transaction, which is something you have to do at
many pumps in the US (or at least in california).

At some pumps here, I don't even have to slide my card into a reader -
just wave it near a small panel on the pump marked with a "wavy" logo
that indicates some sort of RF transciever (this is NOT speed-pass).

I understand that Europe also has CC's with chip-and-pin.

But the US is being backwards about this by not introducing credit cards
with "chip-and-pin" technology. You should ask your banks and credit
card companies why they prefer to soak you with high fees and interest
rates as a way to pay for CC fraud rather than impliment technology to
reduce fraud.

LOL... Using a "secure" or "virtual" account number

I've never heard of the use of a secure or virtual account number. How
does that work? I assume by virtual account number you mean a
credit-card number that is different than the one embossed on your real
card. ?

Home Guy wrote:

But the US is being backwards about this by not introducing credit cards
with "chip-and-pin" technology. You should ask your banks and credit
card companies why they prefer to soak you with high fees and interest
rates as a way to pay for CC fraud rather than impliment technology to
reduce fraud.

Careful - your northern superiority complex is showing. Chip & Pin got a
foothold in Europe because of the poor and expensive phone systems that were in
place at the time. Credit card companies needed a secure and sure way of
validating a translation without having to make an expensive phone call.

Meanwhile, in the US ubiquitous and inexpensive local phone calls made it
possible to roll out cash registers, vending machines, gas pumps and cheap
validation terminals all across the country. The sheer number of terminals in
the US is several orders of magnitude larger than in Canada. The cost of
replacing all those terminals would ultimately be passed on to the consumer - an
expense the US isn't in a particular hurry to take on.

That said, Visa has announced plans to support Chip & Pin in the US for those
banks that want to issue those cards. They'll be available in a year or so.

On 2011-11-09, Home Guy wrote:

with "chip-and-pin" technology. You should ask your banks and credit
card companies why they prefer to soak you with high fees and interest
rates as a way to pay for CC fraud rather than impliment technology to
reduce fraud.

The CC companies couldn't care less about fraud or making it safer for
the customer. The reason for "high fees and interests rates" seems
pretty self evident.

The whole industry is a rip-off and different states deal regulate it
--or not!-- it in different ways. CA initially issued universally
usable ATM cards. You could go into most any retail store and either
buy merchandise or request cash, money pulled directly from your
checking acct, with no involvement by the CC companies, whatsoever.
Unlike debit cards, where CC companies get a piece of the action.

I moved from CA to CO. The banks, here, claim no such practice has
ever existed anywhere. This I found hilarious, as the bank I was
trying to open an account at here in CO has also has branches in CA
that do exactly that. Whether or not CA still has usable-everywhere
ATM cards, I do not know, having moved 3 yrs ago.

nb

On Nov 9, 8:28*am, Home Guy wrote:
But the US is being backwards about this by not introducing credit cards
with "chip-and-pin" technology. *You should ask your banks and credit
card companies why they prefer to soak you with high fees and interest
rates as a way to pay for CC fraud rather than impliment technology to
reduce fraud.

If someone watches you punch in your PIN, then they steal your chip,
how's that any better?

On 11/9/2011 05:28, Home Guy wrote:

I've never heard of the use of a secure or virtual account number. How
does that work? I assume by virtual account number you mean a
credit-card number that is different than the one embossed on your real
card. ?

Some credit card issuers offer virtual account numbers on their web
sites. Features may vary, but it's a different number than the one on
your plastic card. It's good for only one merchant, and in some cases
you can specify a time and dollar limit. You can also cancel it early.
This came in handy for me when I used a virtual number to subscribe to
an online publication. Deep down in the terms and conditions was an
evergreen clause -- automatic renewal unless I cancelled. I chose not
to renew and forgot about it. When I was notified that "there is a
problem with your credit card" I simply ignored it.

On 11/9/2011 8:05 AM, Evan wrote:
On Nov 9, 12:03 am, wrote:
On 11/8/2011 16:28, Evan wrote:

This is why some businesses still take imprints of the credit cards,
it proves the card was present at the time of sale...

In the past ten years the only businesses I have had take credit card
imprints have been hotels. I use a secure or virtual account number to
guarantee the reservation, but they have never honored it at the desk
unless the reservation included prepayment.

Sounds to me like you haven't dealt with a small enough business,
the big chain stores use electronic capture of signature of the
person using the card as well as store CCTV footage to document
who made the purchase rather than keeping a printed copy of
the receipt on file in the store for the required retention period...

Smaller stores still imprint the card, especially when the card
doesn't swipe and the numbers had to be punched in manually,
as the card is either swiped or imprinted to prove it was there
at the time of purchase... Smaller stores also still deal with
keeping extra copies of the receipts on file in case of a
charge back during the retention period...

Maybe something unique to where you travel? I haven't seen any small
merchants imprint cards for a really long time. Low end CC terminals
such as the popular Verifone vx-510 are inexpensive:

http://www.1nbcard.com/content/verif...h-printer.html


And even mobile business folks and businesses that set up say at shows
use terminals with embedded aircards like this:

http://www.1nbcard.com/content/credi...es.html?&sl=EN


Or swipe adapters for smartphones running a virtual terminal.


LOL... Using a "secure" or "virtual" account number to do
anything where you have to reserve something is stupid,
as the virtual account number won't match your name
and address like the info on your actual real account will,
hotels tend to like knowing the real name of the person
reserving the room in case of a no show as they have
the information to send the bill -- this is why your attempts
at anonymous reservations with a credit card that didn't
match the name you reserved under were not honored
without payment of a deposit...

~~ Evan

Evan wrote:
On Nov 8, 7:03 pm, wrote:
My niece needs some auto parts. I called Advanced Auto Parts. They
need the money before they can order the parts from the factory
(Ford). Cool........I have a 15k limit on my card. Ready for my card
number? Well we have to have you come down here and bring the card to
order it.
What?
Well.......this is a part that comes from the dealer. We have to get
you to come in to pay for it.

I can only guess they suspect foul play. Anyone else get turned down
for trying to order over the phone?

LOL...

@Metspitzer:

Ask any one of your friends who might run a business where the public
purchases things from them that accepts a credit card as payment...

Transactions which are non-swiped cost the business double what
swiped transactions cost... 2% of the transaction total vs 4%...

Apparently the Auto Parts store didn't want to pay 4% of the total
sale on a special order...

With retail business being sluggish, every penny adds up...

This is why some businesses still take imprints of the credit cards,
it proves the card was present at the time of sale...

~~ Evan
Hmmm,
I and wife have couple retail business established over the years after
we retired. It is not a franchise chain stores but we do well. We often
get orders from outside our city as far away as South of the border.
We eat the difference in card processing service charge. That is called
customer service. We only do this to known repeat customers who we
personally saw at least couple times. No, to total stranger first timer.

On 11/8/2011 7:03 PM, Metspitzer wrote:
My niece needs some auto parts. I called Advanced Auto Parts. They
need the money before they can order the parts from the factory
(Ford). Cool........I have a 15k limit on my card. Ready for my card
number? Well we have to have you come down here and bring the card to
order it.
What?
Well.......this is a part that comes from the dealer. We have to get
you to come in to pay for it.

I can only guess they suspect foul play. Anyone else get turned down
for trying to order over the phone?



If they have to order it from the dealer, why are you dealing with them?
Or not ordering it online yourself, if you know the part numbers? No
disrespect to Advance and the other FLAPS, but that is not where to buy
serious parts, it is where to buy wiper blades and cheaper generics for
non-critical systems where the part isn't model-specific.

But to answer your question, yeah- they wanna make sure you at least
have the card, and aren't just scamming for resellable parts using
somebody else's CC number. They also don't trust their own employees
that much- with a card in hand, they have a virtual paper trail. I don't
recall using a CC over the phone in years, other than to confirm a hotel
room.

--
aem sends...

On Tue, 08 Nov 2011 19:30:52 -0500, aemeijers
wrote:

On 11/8/2011 7:03 PM, Metspitzer wrote:
My niece needs some auto parts. I called Advanced Auto Parts. They
need the money before they can order the parts from the factory
(Ford). Cool........I have a 15k limit on my card. Ready for my card
number? Well we have to have you come down here and bring the card to
order it.
What?
Well.......this is a part that comes from the dealer. We have to get
you to come in to pay for it.

I can only guess they suspect foul play. Anyone else get turned down
for trying to order over the phone?



If they have to order it from the dealer, why are you dealing with them?
Or not ordering it online yourself, if you know the part numbers? No

My sister started this transaction. My only part is supplying the
cash.

It turns out that even though I drove 25 miles or so to show them the
card they were not able to order the part.


disrespect to Advance and the other FLAPS, but that is not where to buy
serious parts, it is where to buy wiper blades and cheaper generics for
non-critical systems where the part isn't model-specific.

But to answer your question, yeah- they wanna make sure you at least
have the card, and aren't just scamming for resellable parts using
somebody else's CC number. They also don't trust their own employees
that much- with a card in hand, they have a virtual paper trail. I don't
recall using a CC over the phone in years, other than to confirm a hotel
room.

Metspitzer wrote:
On Tue, 08 Nov 2011 19:30:52 -0500, aemeijers
wrote:

On 11/8/2011 7:03 PM, Metspitzer wrote:
My niece needs some auto parts. I called Advanced Auto Parts. They
need the money before they can order the parts from the factory
(Ford). Cool........I have a 15k limit on my card. Ready for my card
number? Well we have to have you come down here and bring the card to
order it.
What?
Well.......this is a part that comes from the dealer. We have to get
you to come in to pay for it.

I can only guess they suspect foul play. Anyone else get turned down
for trying to order over the phone?



If they have to order it from the dealer, why are you dealing with them?
Or not ordering it online yourself, if you know the part numbers? No

My sister started this transaction. My only part is supplying the
cash.

It turns out that even though I drove 25 miles or so to show them the
card they were not able to order the part.




Ever heard of Internet?

Greg

disrespect to Advance and the other FLAPS, but that is not where to buy
serious parts, it is where to buy wiper blades and cheaper generics for
non-critical systems where the part isn't model-specific.

But to answer your question, yeah- they wanna make sure you at least
have the card, and aren't just scamming for resellable parts using
somebody else's CC number. They also don't trust their own employees
that much- with a card in hand, they have a virtual paper trail. I don't
recall using a CC over the phone in years, other than to confirm a hotel
room.

Metspitzer wrote:

My niece needs some auto parts. I called Advanced Auto Parts.
They need the money before they can order the parts from the
factory (Ford).

Tell then that if they don't take your order over the phone, that you'll
simply take your business to the parts counter of the closest Ford
dealership.

Which I would guess would sell you that same part for less than what
Advance is quoting, given that Advance has to buy it from a Ford dealer
(or a Ford parts depot) and will apply their own mark-up to the price.

Home Guy wrote in :

Metspitzer wrote:

My niece needs some auto parts. I called Advanced Auto Parts.
They need the money before they can order the parts from the
factory (Ford).

Tell then that if they don't take your order over the phone, that you'll
simply take your business to the parts counter of the closest Ford
dealership.

Which I would guess would sell you that same part for less than what
Advance is quoting, given that Advance has to buy it from a Ford dealer
(or a Ford parts depot) and will apply their own mark-up to the price.



The trade gets about 20% off consumer-retail for OE auto parts. They add
that back when they sell to the consumer, so your buy price at Advance will
likely be pretty close to what you would pay at the dealer. Unless that
particular Advance store is clueless and jacks the price to the point where
consumers will notice...


--
Tegger

Metspitzer wrote in
news
My niece needs some auto parts. I called Advanced Auto Parts. They
need the money before they can order the parts from the factory
(Ford). Cool........I have a 15k limit on my card. Ready for my card
number? Well we have to have you come down here and bring the card to
order it.
What?
Well.......this is a part that comes from the dealer. We have to get
you to come in to pay for it.

I can only guess they suspect foul play. Anyone else get turned down
for trying to order over the phone?





Oh yeah. More and more places are refusing to take credit card orders by
phone. And fraud is the problem.

My wife works for a bank, and she has to attend all their fraud seminars.
Fraud is the primary reason the interest rate is so high on credit card
balances: Somebody's gotta pay for all that fraud.

--
Tegger

On Wed, 9 Nov 2011 01:21:39 +0000 (UTC), Tegger
wrote:

Metspitzer wrote in
news
My niece needs some auto parts. I called Advanced Auto Parts. They
need the money before they can order the parts from the factory
(Ford). Cool........I have a 15k limit on my card. Ready for my card
number? Well we have to have you come down here and bring the card to
order it.
What?
Well.......this is a part that comes from the dealer. We have to get
you to come in to pay for it.

I can only guess they suspect foul play. Anyone else get turned down
for trying to order over the phone?





Oh yeah. More and more places are refusing to take credit card orders by
phone. And fraud is the problem.

My wife works for a bank, and she has to attend all their fraud seminars.
Fraud is the primary reason the interest rate is so high on credit card
balances: Somebody's gotta pay for all that fraud.

I can understand that fraud would be a problem for the bank but not
for the merchant. Ok maybe I can, but it still sucks.

Metspitzer wrote in
:

On Wed, 9 Nov 2011 01:21:39 +0000 (UTC), Tegger
wrote:


My wife works for a bank, and she has to attend all their fraud
seminars. Fraud is the primary reason the interest rate is so high on
credit card balances: Somebody's gotta pay for all that fraud.

I can understand that fraud would be a problem for the bank but not
for the merchant. Ok maybe I can, but it still sucks.



The merchant still needs to pay his suppliers, usually in 30-days. Less if
he wants to take advantage of 2%-in-10 or other deals offered by the
supplier. Then he needs to wait to get reimbursed by the bank. This takes
time, and time affects cash-flow. Since most businesses only get to keep
about 5%-15% of their gross, late payments can be devastating, and failure
to manage cash-flow often results in bankruptcy, or at least loss of credit
with suppliers and a bad reputation.

Plus, this would need to be done one-by-one, for each instance of fraud.
The labor alone would be a killer.

So they're careful about who they allow to pay by phone.

Yes, it sucks.

--
Tegger

On Nov 8, 7:03*pm, Metspitzer wrote:
My niece needs some auto parts. *I called Advanced Auto Parts. *They
need the money before they can order the parts from the factory
(Ford).

Then your next call should have been to the Ford dealer.

You can look up the part and price here, but the dealer parts guy
might give you the wholesale discount if they like you.
http://www.fordparts.com/
-----

- gpsman

gpsman wrote in news:5948e2bd-245d-4d3b-8158-
:

On Nov 8, 7:03*pm, Metspitzer wrote:
My niece needs some auto parts. *I called Advanced Auto Parts. *They
need the money before they can order the parts from the factory
(Ford).

Then your next call should have been to the Ford dealer.

You can look up the part and price here, but the dealer parts guy
might give you the wholesale discount if they like you.
http://www.fordparts.com/


I've found that dealerships generally won't give a consumer ANYthing off
retail unless he buys a lot of parts from them.

A consumer who buys a lot of parts may get 10% off, but I think would be
very unlikely to ever get more than that. Greater discounts are reserved
for the trade, which may get 15%-25% off, depending on their volume and
relationship with the dealer.

--
Tegger

On 11/9/2011 8:34 AM, Tegger wrote:
....

I've found that dealerships generally won't give a consumer ANYthing off
retail unless he buys a lot of parts from them.

A consumer who buys a lot of parts may get 10% off, but I think would be
very unlikely to ever get more than that. Greater discounts are reserved
for the trade, which may get 15%-25% off, depending on their volume and
relationship with the dealer.

Well, one just walking in off the street, I'd not expect anything different.

OTOH, if one has established relationship w/ a dealership, one may have
a totally different experience.

We've dealt w/ a particular dealership here since trucks began to
replace wagons for farm use and anything needed is on account. Discount
from list varies some but is generally 20% although occasionally
negotiate a little on really major items (like the front transfer case
gearset last year ). Shop rates are fixed, though, unfortunately,
but they're entitled to make a living, too...

--

On Nov 9, 9:34*am, Tegger wrote:
gpsman wrote

You can look up the part and price here, but the dealer parts guy
might give you the wholesale discount if they like you.
http://www.fordparts.com/

I've found that dealerships generally won't give a consumer ANYthing off
retail unless he buys a lot of parts from them.

How'd you find that out?

A consumer who buys a lot of parts may get 10% off, but I think would be
very unlikely to ever get more than that. Greater discounts are reserved
for the trade, which may get 15%-25% off, depending on their volume and
relationship with the dealer.

I can only speak for my own experience.

I couldn't say exactly what percentage of discount I have enjoyed on
my measly 5 purchases (total ~$1000) from 2 (Ford) dealerships, but I
remember being really happy every time.
-----

- gpsman

"Metspitzer" wrote in message
news
My niece needs some auto parts. I called Advanced Auto Parts. They
need the money before they can order the parts from the factory
(Ford). Cool........I have a 15k limit on my card. Ready for my card
number? Well we have to have you come down here and bring the card to
order it.
What?
Well.......this is a part that comes from the dealer. We have to get
you to come in to pay for it.

I can only guess they suspect foul play. Anyone else get turned down
for trying to order over the phone?



I just bought some shocks, went online @ Advanced Auto Parts. If you put
the code #P20 in, you get 20% off. So, figure I'd just run down to Advance
& get them over the counter for same price. NOT! Told me go home, order
online for the discount, mark it for pickup @ whatever store and head down
to the store in about an hour. Anyways, that's the only way to get 20% off,
so I did it. Glad there are 3 of their stores within 7 miles of my place.