Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) - a guy
came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked him if everyone
that would be doing the work on my house was working here legally - he
laughed at me - "Americans won't do that kind of work . . ." - I don't want
to support the illegal immigration mess - is is possible to find a roofing
company here in the Dallas area that employs legal workers?

On 7/27/2011 8:41 AM, AngryOldWhiteGuy wrote:
Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) - a guy
came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked him if everyone
that would be doing the work on my house was working here legally - he
laughed at me - "Americans won't do that kind of work . . ." - I don't want
to support the illegal immigration mess - is is possible to find a roofing
company here in the Dallas area that employs legal workers?


I guess illegality doesn't bother me as much as getting a good job done.
Illegals are all over and most probably do good work but some is bad.
I'd look for quality.

"AngryOldWhiteGuy"
wrote in :

Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) - a
guy came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked him
if everyone that would be doing the work on my house was working here
legally - he laughed at me - "Americans won't do that kind of work . .
." - I don't want to support the illegal immigration mess - is is
possible to find a roofing company here in the Dallas area that
employs legal workers?

Find out from the IRS and Texas equivalent whther the company is paying
taxes, especially SS, Medicare and workers' comp. Whether the workers
would get benefits is less of a concern to me than whether the taxes are
paid to support my retirement grin.


--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid

On 2011-07-27, AngryOldWhiteGuy wrote:
Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) - a guy
came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked him if everyone
that would be doing the work on my house was working here legally - he
laughed at me - "Americans won't do that kind of work . . ."

I hate that line of BS. It's one of the biggest myths (lies!) ever
foisted off on the American public. The worst part is, it's the
dirtbag politicians of both parties that are perpetuating these lies.
The truth is right where I live, where apparently, illegals are not
want to tread. We've got almost no illegals, here at 8k ft in the CO
Rockies, and "Americans" do all the construction, from sewers to
rooftops, and cook in all the restaurants and are damn happy to have
the work. Back in CA, where I came from, you couldn't even work in
the trades unless you spoke Spanish AND were willing to work for the
same wages paid 35 yrs ago!! There is no mystery why we are overrun
with illegals. Big business can't take domestic construction and
other service industries offshore. If you can't export the jobs,
entice the underpaid illegals, here, while Uncle Sam turns a blind eye.

Grrrr.... don't even get me started!!

nb --angry American

Frank wrote:
On 7/27/2011 8:41 AM, AngryOldWhiteGuy wrote:
Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) - a guy
came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked him if
everyone
that would be doing the work on my house was working here legally - he
laughed at me - "Americans won't do that kind of work . . ." - I don't
want
to support the illegal immigration mess - is is possible to find a
roofing
company here in the Dallas area that employs legal workers?


I guess illegality doesn't bother me as much as getting a good job done.
Illegals are all over and most probably do good work but some is bad.
I'd look for quality.

Hi,
But some folks can't even distinguish good work from bad looking at the
roof, LOL! One pays little extra for quality. I have a ceramic coated
metal roof tiles(European origin) which will last my life time at least.

On Jul 27, 10:17*am, notbob wrote:
On 2011-07-27, AngryOldWhiteGuy wrote:

Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) - a guy
came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked him if everyone
that would be doing the work on my house was working here legally - he
laughed at me - "Americans won't do that kind of work . . *."

I hate that line of BS. *It's one of the biggest myths (lies!) ever
foisted off on the American public. *The worst part is, it's the
dirtbag politicians of both parties that are perpetuating these lies.
The truth is right where I live, where apparently, illegals are not
want to tread. *We've got almost no illegals, here at 8k ft in the CO
Rockies, and "Americans" do all the construction, from sewers to
rooftops, and cook in all the restaurants and are damn happy to have
the work. *Back in CA, where I came from, you couldn't even work in
the trades unless you spoke Spanish AND were willing to work for the
same wages paid 35 yrs ago!! *There is no mystery why we are overrun
with illegals. *Big business can't take domestic construction and
other service industries offshore. *If you can't export the jobs,
entice the underpaid illegals, here, while Uncle Sam turns a blind eye.

Grrrr.... don't even get me started!! *

nb --angry American

I truly feel sorry for these people but think all illegals should be
removed from the US. I too wish the politicians woud get this through
their thick heads.
In spite of the fact that they might be productive, they are a drag on
the economy.
To educate a student in the public school system here in Delaware
costs $15,000 and the schools are full of anchor kids. The state did
a study a couple of years ago and promptly buried it when they found
it was costing the average citizen of Delaware about $100 apiece to
support the people that should not be here.

AngryOldWhiteGuy wrote the following:
Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) - a guy
came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked him if everyone
that would be doing the work on my house was working here legally - he
laughed at me - "Americans won't do that kind of work . . ." - I don't want
to support the illegal immigration mess - is is possible to find a roofing
company here in the Dallas area that employs legal workers?



Most of the fruit and vegetables you eat are probably farmed by illegals.
Don't eat any of it unless you know who farmed it.
My next door neighbor had the entire roof of his split level 30 x 60
house torn off and reshingled in one day.
The shingles were delivered the day before, along with a big dumpster.
Early the next morning they showed up and got right to work.
There must have been 10 of them up there in the heat of summer.
They never broke for lunch either. All I heard all day was hammering,
Spanish, and salsa music.
I don't know if they were legal or not.
They were done at about 5 PM after cleaning all the debris from the ground.



--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

On Wed, 27 Jul 2011 07:41:23 -0500, "AngryOldWhiteGuy"
wrote:

Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) - a guy
came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked him if everyone
that would be doing the work on my house was working here legally - he
laughed at me - "Americans won't do that kind of work . . ." - I don't want
to support the illegal immigration mess - is is possible to find a roofing
company here in the Dallas area that employs legal workers?


You can do a verbal test to see if the crew is legal.

Loudly shout: "IMIGRATION OFFICER, Halt in the name of the law!!" If
they scatter in all directions, then you have your answer.

Or, ask the Dallas company if they participate in the E-Verify
program?

"willshak" wrote in message
m...
AngryOldWhiteGuy wrote the following:
Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) - a guy
came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked him if
everyone that would be doing the work on my house was working here
legally - he laughed at me - "Americans won't do that kind of work . .
." - I don't want to support the illegal immigration mess - is is
possible to find a roofing company here in the Dallas area that employs
legal workers?



Most of the fruit and vegetables you eat are probably farmed by illegals.
Don't eat any of it unless you know who farmed it.

blah

blah

blah

OK - I know illegals do a lot of work here - and I'm not saying they do bad
work - I just don't want them to do any work for me - I can't change the
world, but I can change what I do.

I'll keep looking for a legal roofer here in Dallas . . .

In ,
AngryOldWhiteGuy
spewed forth:
"willshak" wrote in message
m...
AngryOldWhiteGuy wrote the following:
Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) -
a guy came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked
him if everyone that would be doing the work on my house was
working here legally - he laughed at me - "Americans won't do that
kind of work . . ." - I don't want to support the illegal
immigration mess - is is possible to find a roofing company here in
the Dallas area that employs legal workers?



Most of the fruit and vegetables you eat are probably farmed by
illegals. Don't eat any of it unless you know who farmed it.

blah

blah

blah

OK - I know illegals do a lot of work here - and I'm not saying they
do bad work - I just don't want them to do any work for me - I can't
change the world, but I can change what I do.

I'll keep looking for a legal roofer here in Dallas . . .

try www.dal-roof.com ask for John, he uses mexicans but I believe they
are all legal

"willshak" wrote

Most of the fruit and vegetables you eat are probably farmed by illegals.
Don't eat any of it unless you know who farmed it.
My next door neighbor had the entire roof of his split level 30 x 60 house
torn off and reshingled in one day.
The shingles were delivered the day before, along with a big dumpster.
Early the next morning they showed up and got right to work.
There must have been 10 of them up there in the heat of summer.
They never broke for lunch either. All I heard all day was hammering,
Spanish, and salsa music.
I don't know if they were legal or not.
They were done at about 5 PM after cleaning all the debris from the
ground.



--

Bill

I had my pool replastered. 32,000 gallon in ground pool, built in the late
70s. They came (they being a couple of Anglo-Saxon looking types, and about
12 Hispanics) at 7 AM on Monday. They were jackhammering it out and running
back and forth with wheelbarrows so full I know I couldn't do it. At 2 PM
Tuesday, we were refilling the pool. Same way with the landscaping.
Wrecked out a bunch of old walkway, and installed pavers, irrigation, and
plants. Took about three days. They were busting it with sledge hammers.
I told the contractor that he should get them a jackhammer at least. He
said they wouldn't know what to do with it, but THEY preferred sledges.
Darn fine work that it would have taken Anglos much longer to git r' done.
Americans WILL do the work, it just takes twice as long and costs twice as
much.

Steve

AngryOldWhiteGuy wrote:
Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) - a
guy came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked him
if everyone that would be doing the work on my house was working here
legally - he laughed at me - "Americans won't do that kind of work .
. ." - I don't want to support the illegal immigration mess - is is
possible to find a roofing company here in the Dallas area that
employs legal workers?

Get some more bids, take the one that is highest and you'll probably get
American workers. Last time I had roof work done in central Florida- about
15 months ago the price was $50/per hour per man. Ouch! All good ol' boys
though. I supplied materials (left over from original job 15 years ago).

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

"ChairMan" nospam@nospam wrote in message
m...
In ,
AngryOldWhiteGuy spewed
forth:
"willshak" wrote in message
m...
AngryOldWhiteGuy wrote the following:
Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) -
a guy came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked
him if everyone that would be doing the work on my house was
working here legally - he laughed at me - "Americans won't do that
kind of work . . ." - I don't want to support the illegal
immigration mess - is is possible to find a roofing company here in
the Dallas area that employs legal workers?



Most of the fruit and vegetables you eat are probably farmed by
illegals. Don't eat any of it unless you know who farmed it.

blah

blah

blah

OK - I know illegals do a lot of work here - and I'm not saying they
do bad work - I just don't want them to do any work for me - I can't
change the world, but I can change what I do.

I'll keep looking for a legal roofer here in Dallas . . .

try www.dal-roof.com ask for John, he uses mexicans but I believe they are
all legal


Thanks for the referral ChairMan - but just to be clear - I have nothing
against Mexicans - or Martians - all I want is for them to be here legally.

"Steve B" wrote in message
.. .

"willshak" wrote

Most of the fruit and vegetables you eat are probably farmed by illegals.
Don't eat any of it unless you know who farmed it.
My next door neighbor had the entire roof of his split level 30 x 60
house torn off and reshingled in one day.
The shingles were delivered the day before, along with a big dumpster.
Early the next morning they showed up and got right to work.
There must have been 10 of them up there in the heat of summer.
They never broke for lunch either. All I heard all day was hammering,
Spanish, and salsa music.
I don't know if they were legal or not.
They were done at about 5 PM after cleaning all the debris from the
ground.



--

Bill

I had my pool replastered. 32,000 gallon in ground pool, built in the
late 70s. They came (they being a couple of Anglo-Saxon looking types,
and about 12 Hispanics) at 7 AM on Monday. They were jackhammering it out
and running back and forth with wheelbarrows so full I know I couldn't do
it. At 2 PM Tuesday, we were refilling the pool. Same way with the
landscaping. Wrecked out a bunch of old walkway, and installed pavers,
irrigation, and plants. Took about three days. They were busting it with
sledge hammers. I told the contractor that he should get them a jackhammer
at least. He said they wouldn't know what to do with it, but THEY
preferred sledges. Darn fine work that it would have taken Anglos much
longer to git r' done. Americans WILL do the work, it just takes twice as
long and costs twice as much.

Steve

I'm assuming that the 12 Hispanics were 12 illegal workers - Hispanics are
fine - as are Norweigans, or Chinese - just as long as they are living and
working here legally.

On 2011-07-27, Steve B wrote:

Darn fine work that it would have taken Anglos much longer to git r' done.
Americans WILL do the work, it just takes twice as long and costs twice as
much.

Yeah, those stinkin' ungrateful American wretches, expecting fair
compensation for blue collar hard labor while, you GET fair
compensation for whatever it is you do.

I once worked in the swimming pool biz and busted my chops 6 days a
week, 12-16 hrs day. Jack hammering, shoveling, sweating in 100+
degree temps, covered in gunite dust till I was black with it. But, I
got paid good for it. That was when pools cost $8-15K. Now, you pay
$50-100K for the same pool and the illegals are still getting what I
made 30 yrs ago, but you don't mind cuz you don't wanna pay more money
to "Americans", even if YOUR pay scale kept pace.

I hope you get hit by a gunite truck driven by illegals.

nb --hard ass workin' white boy

--
vi ...the heart of evil

On 2011-07-27, AngryOldWhiteGuy wrote:

fine - as are Norweigans, or Chinese - just as long as they are living and
working here legally.

Bingo! Hell, a third of my family is now Mexican. My adorable
grandaughters are half Mexican. I love Mexican food. All are
naturalized or native born. Fine by me. That's why I always use
the term, illegals. Couldn't care less about nationality.

nb

--
vi ...the heart of evil

Uh, I've heard it as "La Migra" which is pronounced "lah
MEE-gruh". That works better.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Oren" wrote in message
...

You can do a verbal test to see if the crew is legal.

Loudly shout: "IMIGRATION OFFICER, Halt in the name of the
law!!" If
they scatter in all directions, then you have your answer.

Or, ask the Dallas company if they participate in the
E-Verify
program?

"AngryOldWhiteGuy" wrote
in message ...

"Steve B" wrote in message
.. .

"willshak" wrote

Most of the fruit and vegetables you eat are probably farmed by
illegals.
Don't eat any of it unless you know who farmed it.
My next door neighbor had the entire roof of his split level 30 x 60
house torn off and reshingled in one day.
The shingles were delivered the day before, along with a big dumpster.
Early the next morning they showed up and got right to work.
There must have been 10 of them up there in the heat of summer.
They never broke for lunch either. All I heard all day was hammering,
Spanish, and salsa music.
I don't know if they were legal or not.
They were done at about 5 PM after cleaning all the debris from the
ground.



--

Bill

I had my pool replastered. 32,000 gallon in ground pool, built in the
late 70s. They came (they being a couple of Anglo-Saxon looking types,
and about 12 Hispanics) at 7 AM on Monday. They were jackhammering it
out and running back and forth with wheelbarrows so full I know I
couldn't do it. At 2 PM Tuesday, we were refilling the pool. Same way
with the landscaping. Wrecked out a bunch of old walkway, and installed
pavers, irrigation, and plants. Took about three days. They were
busting it with sledge hammers. I told the contractor that he should get
them a jackhammer at least. He said they wouldn't know what to do with
it, but THEY preferred sledges. Darn fine work that it would have taken
Anglos much longer to git r' done. Americans WILL do the work, it just
takes twice as long and costs twice as much.

Steve

I'm assuming that the 12 Hispanics were 12 illegal workers - Hispanics are
fine - as are Norweigans, or Chinese - just as long as they are living and
working here legally.

They were all doing so well, I saw no need to stop the work to chat with
them. What makes you ass-u-me that they were all illegals?

Steve

"notbob" wrote in message
...
On 2011-07-27, Steve B wrote:

Darn fine work that it would have taken Anglos much longer to git r'
done.
Americans WILL do the work, it just takes twice as long and costs twice
as
much.

Yeah, those stinkin' ungrateful American wretches, expecting fair
compensation for blue collar hard labor while, you GET fair
compensation for whatever it is you do.

I once worked in the swimming pool biz and busted my chops 6 days a
week, 12-16 hrs day. Jack hammering, shoveling, sweating in 100+
degree temps, covered in gunite dust till I was black with it. But, I
got paid good for it. That was when pools cost $8-15K. Now, you pay
$50-100K for the same pool and the illegals are still getting what I
made 30 yrs ago, but you don't mind cuz you don't wanna pay more money
to "Americans", even if YOUR pay scale kept pace.

I hope you get hit by a gunite truck driven by illegals.

nb --hard ass workin' white boy

Dang, Bob. Don't hold back. Tell us how you really feel. Through life, I
have always negotiated. I never worked for anyone, nor had anyone work for
me without everything being agreed to in front. I took advantage of no one.

BTW, when I work, I get $85 an hour.

Steve

On 7/27/2011 8:41 AM, AngryOldWhiteGuy wrote:
Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) - a guy
came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked him if everyone
that would be doing the work on my house was working here legally - he
laughed at me - "Americans won't do that kind of work . . ." - I don't want
to support the illegal immigration mess - is is possible to find a roofing
company here in the Dallas area that employs legal workers?




Based on what I saw in Louisiana after Katrina/Rita, I doubt it. Almost
every roofing crew I saw was little brown men, most working their asses
off, with only Spanish or other languages to be heard. I have no way of
knowing which were legal and
which were not, but that is between them, the contractor, and La Migra.
As long as the contract is with a licensed and insured company, and the
job is done to accepted workmanlike standards, I don't really care if
the work crew is from Mars.
I spend several weeks down in LA every year, and usually get to see one
or more construction sites. You pretty much have to speak Spanish to be
a foreman or crew leader down there. Spanish speaking /= illegal, of
course, but you can do the
math on the odds, versus a crew up here in the frozen north.


--
aem sends....

On 7/27/2011 8:41 AM, AngryOldWhiteGuy wrote:
Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) - a guy
came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked him if everyone
that would be doing the work on my house was working here legally - he
laughed at me - "Americans won't do that kind of work . . ." - I don't want
to support the illegal immigration mess - is is possible to find a roofing
company here in the Dallas area that employs legal workers?




Based on what I saw in Louisiana after Katrina/Rita, I doubt it. Almost
every roofing crew I saw was little brown men, most working their asses
off, with only Spanish or other languages to be heard. I have no way of
knowing which were legal and
which were not, but that is between them, the contractor, and La Migra.
As long as the contract is with a licensed and insured company, and the
job is done to accepted workmanlike standards, I don't really care if
the work crew is from Mars.
I spend several weeks down in LA every year, and usually get to see one
or more construction sites. You pretty much have to speak Spanish to be
a foreman or crew leader down there. Spanish speaking /= illegal, of
course, but you can do the
math on the odds, versus a crew up here in the frozen north.


--
aem sends....

In ,
AngryOldWhiteGuy
spewed forth:
"ChairMan" nospam@nospam wrote in message
m...
In ,
AngryOldWhiteGuy
spewed forth:
"willshak" wrote in message
m...
AngryOldWhiteGuy wrote the following:
Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced
(insurance) -
a guy came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I
asked
him if everyone that would be doing the work on my house was
working here legally - he laughed at me - "Americans won't do
that
kind of work . . ." - I don't want to support the illegal
immigration mess - is is possible to find a roofing company here
in the Dallas area that employs legal workers?



Most of the fruit and vegetables you eat are probably farmed by
illegals. Don't eat any of it unless you know who farmed it.

blah

blah

blah

OK - I know illegals do a lot of work here - and I'm not saying
they
do bad work - I just don't want them to do any work for me - I
can't
change the world, but I can change what I do.

I'll keep looking for a legal roofer here in Dallas . . .

try www.dal-roof.com ask for John, he uses mexicans but I believe
they are all legal


Thanks for the referral ChairMan - but just to be clear - I have
nothing against Mexicans - or Martians - all I want is for them to be
here legally.

Johns' crews have been working for him for about 15-20 yrs, tell him I
sent ya
Good luck

On Wed, 27 Jul 2011 16:34:15 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

Uh, I've heard it as "La Migra" which is pronounced "lah
MEE-gruh". That works better.

I guess, if you speak Spanish.

"La Migra", a song by Dutch metal band Dreadlock Pussy :-/

On 2011-07-27, Steve B wrote:

BTW, when I work, I get $85 an hour.

But you weren't 40 yrs ago. If the "Americans" building pools got
your same pay increases, they'd still be building pools and making a
living wage, as they were back then. That's why most of the unions
were busted and illegals allowed to flood the labor force. People
like you don't think hard working "Americans" deserve the same pay
increases you got. They're not worthy of just compensation for
busting their hump on a roof where it's 130F and they earn a living by
the sweat of their brow. They're not worthy cuz they didn't go to
college ...blah blah....

(why am I arguing with this dolt?)

nb

"Steve B" wrote in message
...

"AngryOldWhiteGuy" wrote
in message ...

"Steve B" wrote in message
.. .

"willshak" wrote

Most of the fruit and vegetables you eat are probably farmed by
illegals.
Don't eat any of it unless you know who farmed it.
My next door neighbor had the entire roof of his split level 30 x 60
house torn off and reshingled in one day.
The shingles were delivered the day before, along with a big dumpster.
Early the next morning they showed up and got right to work.
There must have been 10 of them up there in the heat of summer.
They never broke for lunch either. All I heard all day was hammering,
Spanish, and salsa music.
I don't know if they were legal or not.
They were done at about 5 PM after cleaning all the debris from the
ground.



--

Bill

I had my pool replastered. 32,000 gallon in ground pool, built in the
late 70s. They came (they being a couple of Anglo-Saxon looking types,
and about 12 Hispanics) at 7 AM on Monday. They were jackhammering it
out and running back and forth with wheelbarrows so full I know I
couldn't do it. At 2 PM Tuesday, we were refilling the pool. Same way
with the landscaping. Wrecked out a bunch of old walkway, and installed
pavers, irrigation, and plants. Took about three days. They were
busting it with sledge hammers. I told the contractor that he should get
them a jackhammer at least. He said they wouldn't know what to do with
it, but THEY preferred sledges. Darn fine work that it would have taken
Anglos much longer to git r' done. Americans WILL do the work, it just
takes twice as long and costs twice as much.

Steve

I'm assuming that the 12 Hispanics were 12 illegal workers - Hispanics
are fine - as are Norweigans, or Chinese - just as long as they are
living and working here legally.

They were all doing so well, I saw no need to stop the work to chat with
them. What makes you ass-u-me that they were all illegals?

Steve

My bad . .

"notbob" wrote in message
...
On 2011-07-27, Steve B wrote:

BTW, when I work, I get $85 an hour.

But you weren't 40 yrs ago. If the "Americans" building pools got
your same pay increases, they'd still be building pools and making a
living wage, as they were back then. That's why most of the unions
were busted and illegals allowed to flood the labor force. People
like you don't think hard working "Americans" deserve the same pay
increases you got. They're not worthy of just compensation for
busting their hump on a roof where it's 130F and they earn a living by
the sweat of their brow. They're not worthy cuz they didn't go to
college ...blah blah....

(why am I arguing with this dolt?)

nb

Gee, Bob, I don't know. I was a "working man", starting my own welding
business, and turned it into a steel erection contractor business. I worked
offshore oilfield, doing 24, 36, and 48 hour gigs. I have worked 12-16
hours a day for months at a time. I've stayed at sea for months at a time.
I owned businesses, and corporations. I have a total of maybe 12 hours of
college. Trade school - welding. In house training for various companies I
worked for. Union trade classes. I don't consider myself anything special
as far as the working class is concerned. Today, I got up at 0530, and at
0600 started working with my helper on my construction project on my own
property, rather than hire it out. Steel work. Welding. I'm 62, had a
five way bypass and have an artificial heart valve. I'm on my third 18 year
old helper, drove two of them into the ground because they couldn't keep up
with me.

You wanna join me in a chorus of Working Class Hero? I don't get your
point, and think you have me confused with someone else.

Big deal, I wrote a book about my heart surgery. Anyone with high school
English can do the same thing.

Being stupid in life can be temporary or permanent, everyone has the right
to do what they want. Sean Hannity used to be a dishwasher.

Steve

--


Heart surgery pending?
www.heartsurgerysurvivalguide.com
Heart Surgery Survival Guide
Now on facebook, too.

AngryOldWhiteGuy wrote:
Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) - a
guy came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked him
if everyone that would be doing the work on my house was working here
legally - he laughed at me - "Americans won't do that kind of work .
. ." - I don't want to support the illegal immigration mess - is is
possible to find a roofing company here in the Dallas area that
employs legal workers?

You make a good point and it's a point that has a great deal of support. But
consider...

The illegal alien is illegal because the government says he is. He can't
become a "legal" alien because of all the hoops, waiting time, quotas, and
bureacracy.

Frankly, he is the kind of immigrant we should be glad to have. He's
demonstrated he's not afraid to take risks, work hard, provide for his
family, and is generally quite law-abiding.

I don't have an answer to the immigration problems, but I do believe the
individual illegal alien is not the one at fault

HeyBub wrote:
AngryOldWhiteGuy wrote:
Due to hail damage I may be getting my roof replaced (insurance) - a
guy came by with an estimate after looking at the roof - I asked him
if everyone that would be doing the work on my house was working here
legally - he laughed at me - "Americans won't do that kind of work .
. ." - I don't want to support the illegal immigration mess - is is
possible to find a roofing company here in the Dallas area that
employs legal workers?

You make a good point and it's a point that has a great deal of
support. But consider...

The illegal alien is illegal because the government says he is.

No, he/she is illegal because he/she circumvented the procedure to enter the
US legally. There IS a procedure, you know, and many follow it.
______________

He
can't become a "legal" alien because of all the hoops, waiting time,
quotas, and bureacracy.

Why reward an illegal act? How is that fair to those who follow the
procedure to enter legally?
______________________

Frankly, he is the kind of immigrant we should be glad to have. He's
demonstrated he's not afraid to take risks, work hard, provide for his
family, and is generally quite law-abiding.

Risk taking, work hard are generally true but "law abiding" is a bit more
iffy. I would agree that most of the initial illegals themselves are
relatively law abiding but there is getting to be a very large problem with
their offspring. They tend to associate with each other - la raza - and
many wind up in hispanic gangs such as sur trece (Sur-13). Check prison
population records.

As far as the original illegals go, it is true that they aren't generally
out there sticking up convenience stores or committing other overt crimes
save, with some frequency, those related to drugs. However, they frequently
ignore laws/regulations that are inconvenient to them...things like having
auto insurance...zoning laws...noise ordinances...et cetera.

Part of the reason for that is lack of knowledge and part cultural. Almost
of the illegals will have less than a 9th grade education. Most will have
less than a primary education. Many will have none. Very few are literate
in English; a large percentage are functionally illiterate in Spanish.

In the US, many of our laws/ordinances are designed to prevent someone from
infringing on the rights of others. I don't know if latin american
countries have similar or not but if so I can definitely tell you they are
not enforced; consequently, if someone wants to have a party at 3AM and
blare salsa through loud speakers, they do so. It never even occurs to them
that they might be disturbing their neighbors.

If they want to come to the US, let them go through the legal procedures;
let them assimilate into the US society rather than create barrios; let them
learn to at least read English and speak it well enough to get along in it.


--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

dadiOH wrote:

No, he/she is illegal because he/she circumvented the procedure to
enter the US legally. There IS a procedure, you know, and many
follow it. ______________

He
can't become a "legal" alien because of all the hoops, waiting time,
quotas, and bureacracy.

Why reward an illegal act? How is that fair to those who follow the
procedure to enter legally?
______________________

Frankly, he is the kind of immigrant we should be glad to have. He's
demonstrated he's not afraid to take risks, work hard, provide for
his family, and is generally quite law-abiding.

Risk taking, work hard are generally true but "law abiding" is a bit
more iffy. I would agree that most of the initial illegals
themselves are relatively law abiding but there is getting to be a
very large problem with their offspring. They tend to associate with
each other - la raza - and many wind up in hispanic gangs such as sur
trece (Sur-13). Check prison population records.

As far as the original illegals go, it is true that they aren't
generally out there sticking up convenience stores or committing
other overt crimes save, with some frequency, those related to drugs.
However, they frequently ignore laws/regulations that are
inconvenient to them...things like having auto insurance...zoning
laws...noise ordinances...et cetera.
Part of the reason for that is lack of knowledge and part cultural. Almost
of the illegals will have less than a 9th grade education. Most will have
less than a primary education. Many will have none. Very few are literate
in English; a large percentage are functionally
illiterate in Spanish.
In the US, many of our laws/ordinances are designed to prevent
someone from infringing on the rights of others. I don't know if
latin american countries have similar or not but if so I can
definitely tell you they are not enforced; consequently, if someone
wants to have a party at 3AM and blare salsa through loud speakers,
they do so. It never even occurs to them that they might be
disturbing their neighbors.
If they want to come to the US, let them go through the legal
procedures; let them assimilate into the US society rather than
create barrios; let them learn to at least read English and speak it
well enough to get along in it.

Again, you make good points, except the last one.

Following the accepted procedures demands a fifteen-year wait! If I were a
Mexican with the above desires and ambitions, I'd look hard at the
alternatives.

HeyBub wrote:
dadiOH wrote:

No, he/she is illegal because he/she circumvented the procedure to
enter the US legally. There IS a procedure, you know, and many
follow it. ______________

He
can't become a "legal" alien because of all the hoops, waiting time,
quotas, and bureacracy.

Why reward an illegal act? How is that fair to those who follow the
procedure to enter legally?
______________________

Frankly, he is the kind of immigrant we should be glad to have. He's
demonstrated he's not afraid to take risks, work hard, provide for
his family, and is generally quite law-abiding.

Risk taking, work hard are generally true but "law abiding" is a bit
more iffy. I would agree that most of the initial illegals
themselves are relatively law abiding but there is getting to be a
very large problem with their offspring. They tend to associate with
each other - la raza - and many wind up in hispanic gangs such as sur
trece (Sur-13). Check prison population records.

As far as the original illegals go, it is true that they aren't
generally out there sticking up convenience stores or committing
other overt crimes save, with some frequency, those related to drugs.
However, they frequently ignore laws/regulations that are
inconvenient to them...things like having auto insurance...zoning
laws...noise ordinances...et cetera.
Part of the reason for that is lack of knowledge and part cultural.
Almost of the illegals will have less than a 9th grade education.
Most will have less than a primary education. Many will have none.
Very few are literate in English; a large percentage are functionally
illiterate in Spanish.
In the US, many of our laws/ordinances are designed to prevent
someone from infringing on the rights of others. I don't know if
latin american countries have similar or not but if so I can
definitely tell you they are not enforced; consequently, if someone
wants to have a party at 3AM and blare salsa through loud speakers,
they do so. It never even occurs to them that they might be
disturbing their neighbors.
If they want to come to the US, let them go through the legal
procedures; let them assimilate into the US society rather than
create barrios; let them learn to at least read English and speak it
well enough to get along in it.

Again, you make good points, except the last one.

Following the accepted procedures demands a fifteen-year wait! If I
were a Mexican with the above desires and ambitions, I'd look hard at
the alternatives.

Maybe they could go to Canada?

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

"Frank" wrote in message ...


I guess illegality doesn't bother me as much as getting a good job done.
Illegals are all over and most probably do good work but some is bad.
I'd look for quality.

We hired a contractor recently (checked him out first) and we had no doubt
everyone who showed up the first two days was a citizen. After that (when
it was too late to call a halt) the percentage of English-speaking workers
dropped sharply. Short of putting a clause in the contract that everybody
has to have either a U.S. birth certificate or a green card, what can you
do?

On 7/28/2011 11:12 AM, HeyBub wrote:
dadiOH wrote:

No, he/she is illegal because he/she circumvented the procedure to
enter the US legally. There IS a procedure, you know, and many
follow it. ______________

He
can't become a "legal" alien because of all the hoops, waiting time,
quotas, and bureacracy.

Why reward an illegal act? How is that fair to those who follow the
procedure to enter legally?
______________________

Frankly, he is the kind of immigrant we should be glad to have. He's
demonstrated he's not afraid to take risks, work hard, provide for
his family, and is generally quite law-abiding.

Risk taking, work hard are generally true but "law abiding" is a bit
more iffy. I would agree that most of the initial illegals
themselves are relatively law abiding but there is getting to be a
very large problem with their offspring. They tend to associate with
each other - la raza - and many wind up in hispanic gangs such as sur
trece (Sur-13). Check prison population records.

As far as the original illegals go, it is true that they aren't
generally out there sticking up convenience stores or committing
other overt crimes save, with some frequency, those related to drugs.
However, they frequently ignore laws/regulations that are
inconvenient to them...things like having auto insurance...zoning
laws...noise ordinances...et cetera.
Part of the reason for that is lack of knowledge and part cultural. Almost
of the illegals will have less than a 9th grade education. Most will have
less than a primary education. Many will have none. Very few are literate
in English; a large percentage are functionally
illiterate in Spanish.
In the US, many of our laws/ordinances are designed to prevent
someone from infringing on the rights of others. I don't know if
latin american countries have similar or not but if so I can
definitely tell you they are not enforced; consequently, if someone
wants to have a party at 3AM and blare salsa through loud speakers,
they do so. It never even occurs to them that they might be
disturbing their neighbors.
If they want to come to the US, let them go through the legal
procedures; let them assimilate into the US society rather than
create barrios; let them learn to at least read English and speak it
well enough to get along in it.

Again, you make good points, except the last one.

Following the accepted procedures demands a fifteen-year wait! If I were a
Mexican with the above desires and ambitions, I'd look hard at the
alternatives.



(Sorry for the direct reply, HeyBub- this new version of Tbird
rearranged the 'reply to' choices, and I haven't got used to it yet.)

I'd be curious about the demographics of 'most' of the illegals. If I
was 20-something, with spouse and kids to feed, and there was no legal
work 'back home', well, waiting 15 years isn't much of an option. Your
kid is hungry, you do what you gotta do. Yeah, you probably should have
not had the kid in the first place, but that isn't the kid's fault.

Mebbe if NAFTA hadn't made US Megafarm food so cheap in Mexico that the
local farmers can't make a living (so the newspapers claim), some of the
field workers could find jobs closer to home. As long as there are no
paying jobs down there, people will travel to where the jobs are. Throw
in a government that has lost control of much of the country, and the
Long Walk looks pretty inviting.
--
aem sends....

On 7/28/2011 6:08 PM, aemeijers wrote:
....

Mebbe if NAFTA hadn't made US Megafarm food so cheap in Mexico that the
local farmers can't make a living (so the newspapers claim), some of the
field workers could find jobs closer to home. As long as there are no
paying jobs down there, people will travel to where the jobs are. Throw
in a government that has lost control of much of the country, and the
Long Walk looks pretty inviting.

Well, subsistence farming won't cut it for Mexico; they haven't been
self-sufficient in food supplies since in forever. Mexico City is 21M;
for comparison NYC is 19. All those mouths have to have food and
they're certainly not farming.

In light of the recent other thread the devolved into similar claims
corn I have done quite a bit of looking into the Mexican farm economy
and US exports and simply don't see that they're the root cause of the
problems; w/o them Mexico would be starving for sure.

It appears the root cause is the last item you named before; the loss of
government stability and growth in local economies other than the
(relative) handful provided by manufacturing and related owing (mostly)
also to NAFTA in the border area manufacturing. (Of course, those have
exacerbated the problems in the US but who's counting?)

Farming took a hit this year from a late hard freeze but it appears that
the government was the one that had to supply more seed corn to replant;
it appears that much of the ag sector is still government controlled
rather than private. I would suspect that removing those controls would
go far in advancing their progress.

I don't know how it's going to end but it isn't a sustainable model;
both governments have to get control of their borders and solve their
rampant economic woes but both appear total inept at either.

It's become so bad here we're now "minority majority" and most are
undocumented except for the newborns, of course. They have almost
bankrupted the hospital and I expect it's only a matter of time before
it either is forced to close or the City/County will have to come to the
rescue and support it w/ tax revenues. Of course, like everywhere else,
those are declining as well as more and more dollars go to the cash
economy and hence aren't taxed and the more affluent who can flee the
encroaching hordes while still have at least chance to sell a
house...not a pretty current sight nor a promising outlook.

--

On Thu, 28 Jul 2011 10:12:33 -0500, "HeyBub" wrote:

dadiOH wrote:

No, he/she is illegal because he/she circumvented the procedure to
enter the US legally. There IS a procedure, you know, and many
follow it. ______________

He
can't become a "legal" alien because of all the hoops, waiting time,
quotas, and bureacracy.

Why reward an illegal act? How is that fair to those who follow the
procedure to enter legally?
______________________

Frankly, he is the kind of immigrant we should be glad to have. He's
demonstrated he's not afraid to take risks, work hard, provide for
his family, and is generally quite law-abiding.

Risk taking, work hard are generally true but "law abiding" is a bit
more iffy. I would agree that most of the initial illegals
themselves are relatively law abiding but there is getting to be a
very large problem with their offspring. They tend to associate with
each other - la raza - and many wind up in hispanic gangs such as sur
trece (Sur-13). Check prison population records.

As far as the original illegals go, it is true that they aren't
generally out there sticking up convenience stores or committing
other overt crimes save, with some frequency, those related to drugs.
However, they frequently ignore laws/regulations that are
inconvenient to them...things like having auto insurance...zoning
laws...noise ordinances...et cetera.
Part of the reason for that is lack of knowledge and part cultural. Almost
of the illegals will have less than a 9th grade education. Most will have
less than a primary education. Many will have none. Very few are literate
in English; a large percentage are functionally
illiterate in Spanish.
In the US, many of our laws/ordinances are designed to prevent
someone from infringing on the rights of others. I don't know if
latin american countries have similar or not but if so I can
definitely tell you they are not enforced; consequently, if someone
wants to have a party at 3AM and blare salsa through loud speakers,
they do so. It never even occurs to them that they might be
disturbing their neighbors.
If they want to come to the US, let them go through the legal
procedures; let them assimilate into the US society rather than
create barrios; let them learn to at least read English and speak it
well enough to get along in it.

Again, you make good points, except the last one.

Following the accepted procedures demands a fifteen-year wait! If I were a
Mexican with the above desires and ambitions, I'd look hard at the
alternatives.

All good things come to he who waits.