OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

mm wrote:
OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.
Hi,
Nillion dolloar for sure. An ordinary bomb is equivalent to GOOD TV set.

"mm" wrote in message
...
OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

I have seen it listed from $ 600,000 to $ 1.2 million. Not sure if the
higher price would include an atomic warhead or if that is just the high
expolosive version.

"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message
m...

"mm" wrote in message
...
OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

I have seen it listed from $ 600,000 to $ 1.2 million. Not sure if the
higher price would include an atomic warhead or if that is just the high
expolosive version.

Try eBay or Craig's List, I've seen them on there for half the cost.

"K. Lance" wrote in message ...

"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message
m...
I have seen it listed from $ 600,000 to $ 1.2 million. Not sure if the
higher price would include an atomic warhead or if that is just the high
expolosive version.

Try eBay or Craig's List, I've seen them on there for half the cost.



I am saving my boxtops for one.
Either that or order one from China.

"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message
m...

"K. Lance" wrote in message
...

"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message
m...
I have seen it listed from $ 600,000 to $ 1.2 million. Not sure if the
higher price would include an atomic warhead or if that is just the
high
expolosive version.

Try eBay or Craig's List, I've seen them on there for half the cost.



I am saving my boxtops for one.
Either that or order one from China.

That's not as funny as you think. If China for any reason had to go to war,
they have tremendous manufacturing capacity (as we had in WWII) to make
weapons. Right now they're making anti-ship missiles and special "carrier
killer" torpedoes in amounts that are essentially indefensible against.
They're able to do it using former Soviet weapons designers and because they
have mass manufacturing know-how (they got from us!) and cheap labor. Our
military may not be ready to face a force that can seriously hurt it - we've
been up to our necks fighting goat-herders and suicide bombers, not a
credible national military force. Especially one that wants to prove it
deserves a place at the table of world powers. Taiwan is where you can
expect WWIII to start, and if we open up any more SOLIC's like Libya, they
may feel the time may never be better to assert control over Taiwan by
military force.

--
Bobby G.

"Robert Green" wrote in message
...
"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message
m...

"K. Lance" wrote in message
...

"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message
m...
I have seen it listed from $ 600,000 to $ 1.2 million. Not sure if
the
higher price would include an atomic warhead or if that is just the
high
expolosive version.

Try eBay or Craig's List, I've seen them on there for half the cost.



I am saving my boxtops for one.
Either that or order one from China.

That's not as funny as you think. If China for any reason had to go to
war,
they have tremendous manufacturing capacity (as we had in WWII) to make
weapons. Right now they're making anti-ship missiles and special "carrier
killer" torpedoes in amounts that are essentially indefensible against.
They're able to do it using former Soviet weapons designers and because
they
have mass manufacturing know-how (they got from us!) and cheap labor. Our
military may not be ready to face a force that can seriously hurt it -
we've
been up to our necks fighting goat-herders and suicide bombers, not a
credible national military force. Especially one that wants to prove it
deserves a place at the table of world powers. Taiwan is where you can
expect WWIII to start, and if we open up any more SOLIC's like Libya, they
may feel the time may never be better to assert control over Taiwan by
military force.

--
Bobby G.



I agree. China has the population and could crank out lots of war materials
if they need to.

If it really comes to WW3 our carrirers will not be worth much. A nuke
exploded within a couple of miles will take them out. What does China call
their anti ship missle, a Silkworm ? Anyway if they launch 6 or 8 at a
time,the carrier does not stand much chance even without a nuke. That is
what hapened to Germany in ww2. They had a superior tank, but the US would
send 5 of the Shermans after one. Usually lost 3 or 4 to get each German
tank.
I think part of the Vietnam problem was we did not really want China to get
involved and that was close to 40 years ago.

On 3/29/2011 7:05 PM, Robert Green wrote:
(snip)

ct WWIII to start, and if we open up any more SOLIC's like Libya,

Okay- I (and Google) give up- what does SOLIC mean?

--
aem sends...

On Mar 30, 12:05*am, "Robert Green"
wrote:
"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message

m...

"K. Lance" wrote in message

...



"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message
om...
I have seen it listed from $ 600,000 to $ 1.2 million. *Not sure if the
higher price would include an atomic warhead or if that is just the
high
expolosive version.

Try eBay or Craig's List, I've seen them on there for half the cost.

I am saving my boxtops for one.
Either that or order one from China.

That's not as funny as you think. *If China for any reason had to go to war,
they have tremendous manufacturing capacity (as we had in WWII) to make
weapons. *Right now they're making anti-ship missiles and special "carrier
killer" torpedoes in amounts that are essentially indefensible against.
They're able to do it using former Soviet weapons designers and because they
have mass manufacturing know-how (they got from us!) and cheap labor. *Our
military may not be ready to face a force that can seriously hurt it - we've
been up to our necks fighting goat-herders and suicide bombers, not a
credible national military force. Especially one that wants to prove it
deserves a place at the table of world powers. *Taiwan is where you can
expect WWIII to start, and if we open up any more SOLIC's like Libya, they
may feel the time may never be better to assert control over Taiwan by
military force.

--
Bobby G.

You are right. China is the one to watch. Militarily and
commercially. However they have their own internal troubles. They
nearly own you now.

On Mar 30, 12:10*am, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote:
"K. Lance" wrote in ....

"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message
om...
I have seen it listed from $ 600,000 to $ 1.2 million. *Not sure if the
higher price would include an atomic warhead or if that is just the high
expolosive version.

Try eBay or Craig's List, I've seen them on there for half the cost.

I am saving my boxtops for one.
Either that or order one from China.

Having trouble with the nieghbours?

"K. Lance" wrote in :


"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message
m...

"mm" wrote in message
...
OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

I have seen it listed from $ 600,000 to $ 1.2 million. Not sure if
the higher price would include an atomic warhead or if that is just
the high expolosive version.

Try eBay or Craig's List, I've seen them on there for half the cost.




There was a HF Super Coupon for one. I think it expired though. A 20% off
coupon might be the better deal though.

K. Lance wrote:
"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message
m...

"mm" wrote in message
...
OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

I have seen it listed from $ 600,000 to $ 1.2 million. Not sure if
the higher price would include an atomic warhead or if that is just
the high expolosive version.

Try eBay or Craig's List, I've seen them on there for half the cost.

harbor freight. don't forget the 20% off coupon when you go to check out.

On 3/28/2011 8:18 PM, mm wrote:
OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

More than the stuff it blows up usually.

Jim

On 3/28/2011 8:18 PM, mm wrote:
OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

The Bugatti Veyron EB 16.4 is a rear mid-engined super car. It is
the most expensive modern car in the world at $2,600,000. Right
off the assembly line of sorts. snicker

TDD

On Mar 29, 3:35*am, The Daring Dufas
wrote:
On 3/28/2011 8:18 PM, mm wrote:

OT *What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

The Bugatti Veyron EB 16.4 is a rear mid-engined super car. It is
the most expensive modern car in the world at $2,600,000. Right
off the assembly line of sorts. snicker

TDD

The first law of capitalism is that a thing is worth what people are
prepared to pay for it.
I expect the Chinese make a similar one half price. Or soon will be.
Soon Boeing be moving the production line there anyway. Or Mexico.
The USA has fallen way back on all forms of technology except weapons
because you are warmongering *******s. It's neccesary for wars to be
started constantly in order to sell weapons. Even Obama has fallen
into the trap. He is in the pocket fo the capitalist *******s as was
Bush &co.
Your gov. does not give a toss about you., You did not vote for them.
You got to vote for the limited number of people put in front of you
by lying, cheating capitalist arms manufacturers..
It could be fixed tomorrow but it won't be.

On 3/29/2011 2:40 AM, harry wrote:
On Mar 29, 3:35 am, The Daring
wrote:
On 3/28/2011 8:18 PM, mm wrote:

OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

The Bugatti Veyron EB 16.4 is a rear mid-engined super car. It is
the most expensive modern car in the world at $2,600,000. Right
off the assembly line of sorts.snicker

TDD

The first law of capitalism is that a thing is worth what people are
prepared to pay for it.
I expect the Chinese make a similar one half price. Or soon will be.
Soon Boeing be moving the production line there anyway. Or Mexico.
The USA has fallen way back on all forms of technology except weapons
because you are warmongering *******s. It's neccesary for wars to be
started constantly in order to sell weapons. Even Obama has fallen
into the trap. He is in the pocket fo the capitalist *******s as was
Bush&co.
Your gov. does not give a toss about you., You did not vote for them.
You got to vote for the limited number of people put in front of you
by lying, cheating capitalist arms manufacturers..
It could be fixed tomorrow but it won't be.

I'll have you know that my parents were married sir! I'm no ******* but
people who know my mother refer to me as SOB which is much more
accurate. ^_^

TDD

On Tue, 29 Mar 2011 03:25:28 -0500, The Daring Dufas
wrote:

On 3/29/2011 2:40 AM, harry wrote:
On Mar 29, 3:35 am, The Daring
wrote:
On 3/28/2011 8:18 PM, mm wrote:

OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

The Bugatti Veyron EB 16.4 is a rear mid-engined super car. It is
the most expensive modern car in the world at $2,600,000. Right
off the assembly line of sorts.snicker

TDD

The first law of capitalism is that a thing is worth what people are
prepared to pay for it.
I expect the Chinese make a similar one half price. Or soon will be.
Soon Boeing be moving the production line there anyway. Or Mexico.
The USA has fallen way back on all forms of technology except weapons
because you are warmongering *******s. It's neccesary for wars to be
started constantly in order to sell weapons. Even Obama has fallen
into the trap. He is in the pocket fo the capitalist *******s as was
Bush&co.
Your gov. does not give a toss about you., You did not vote for them.
You got to vote for the limited number of people put in front of you
by lying, cheating capitalist arms manufacturers..
It could be fixed tomorrow but it won't be.

I'll have you know that my parents were married sir! I'm no ******* but
people who know my mother refer to me as SOB which is much more
accurate. ^_^

But it is pretty bad, Duf, when your own mother calls you an SOB. ;-)

On 3/29/2011 6:28 PM, zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Tue, 29 Mar 2011 03:25:28 -0500, The Daring Dufas
wrote:

On 3/29/2011 2:40 AM, harry wrote:
On Mar 29, 3:35 am, The Daring
wrote:
On 3/28/2011 8:18 PM, mm wrote:

OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

The Bugatti Veyron EB 16.4 is a rear mid-engined super car. It is
the most expensive modern car in the world at $2,600,000. Right
off the assembly line of sorts.snicker

TDD

The first law of capitalism is that a thing is worth what people are
prepared to pay for it.
I expect the Chinese make a similar one half price. Or soon will be.
Soon Boeing be moving the production line there anyway. Or Mexico.
The USA has fallen way back on all forms of technology except weapons
because you are warmongering *******s. It's neccesary for wars to be
started constantly in order to sell weapons. Even Obama has fallen
into the trap. He is in the pocket fo the capitalist *******s as was
Bush&co.
Your gov. does not give a toss about you., You did not vote for them.
You got to vote for the limited number of people put in front of you
by lying, cheating capitalist arms manufacturers..
It could be fixed tomorrow but it won't be.

I'll have you know that my parents were married sir! I'm no ******* but
people who know my mother refer to me as SOB which is much more
accurate. ^_^

But it is pretty bad, Duf, when your own mother calls you an SOB. ;-)


"People who know my mother call me that." GEEZ!

TDD

On Mar 29, 3:40*am, harry wrote:
On Mar 29, 3:35*am, The Daring Dufas
wrote:





On 3/28/2011 8:18 PM, mm wrote:

OT *What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

The Bugatti Veyron EB 16.4 is a rear mid-engined super car. It is
the most expensive modern car in the world at $2,600,000. Right
off the assembly line of sorts. snicker

TDD

The first law of capitalism is that a thing is worth what people are
prepared to pay for it.
I expect the Chinese make a similar one half price. *Or soon will be.
Soon Boeing be moving the production line there anyway. Or Mexico.
The USA has fallen way back on all forms of technology except weapons
because you are warmongering *******s.

So how many high tech wonders of the world origninated and are based
in the "UK? Intel? Microsoft? Cisco? AMD? Boeing? IBM?
Dell?
HP? Do you even have one company that produces
computer chips that is British? Notice I said produces, so that
leaves
out ARM, which is just a modest design firm. There is one huge UK
semicondutor plant, owned and operated by Intel, a US company,
in Ireland.

Unbelievable that you keep bringing this up, after all the times
you've
made an ass of yourself. Anything else I can help you out with?





*It's neccesary for wars to be
started constantly in order to sell weapons. Even Obama has fallen
into the trap. He is in the pocket fo the capitalist *******s as was
Bush &co.
Your gov. does not give a toss about you., You did not vote for them.
You got to vote for the limited number of people put in front of you
by lying, cheating capitalist arms manufacturers..
It could be fixed tomorrow but it won't be.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

You could be fixed tomorrow too. Hope you get your head cracked
at your next leftist riot over there.

On Mar 29, 4:47*pm, "
wrote:
On Mar 29, 3:40*am, harry wrote:





On Mar 29, 3:35*am, The Daring Dufas
wrote:

On 3/28/2011 8:18 PM, mm wrote:

OT *What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

The Bugatti Veyron EB 16.4 is a rear mid-engined super car. It is
the most expensive modern car in the world at $2,600,000. Right
off the assembly line of sorts. snicker

TDD

The first law of capitalism is that a thing is worth what people are
prepared to pay for it.
I expect the Chinese make a similar one half price. *Or soon will be.
Soon Boeing be moving the production line there anyway. Or Mexico.
The USA has fallen way back on all forms of technology except weapons
because you are warmongering *******s.

So how many high tech wonders of the world origninated and are based
*in the "UK? * Intel? * Microsoft? *Cisco? *AMD? * Boeing? *IBM?
Dell?
HP? * Do you even have one company that produces
computer chips that is British? * Notice I said produces, so that
leaves
out ARM, which is just a modest design firm. * There is one huge UK
*semicondutor plant, owned and operated by Intel, a US company,
*in Ireland.

Unbelievable that you keep bringing this up, after all the times
you've
made an ass of yourself. *Anything else I can help you out with?

*It's neccesary for wars to be
started constantly in order to sell weapons. Even Obama has fallen
into the trap. He is in the pocket fo the capitalist *******s as was
Bush &co.
Your gov. does not give a toss about you., You did not vote for them.
You got to vote for the limited number of people put in front of you
by lying, cheating capitalist arms manufacturers..
It could be fixed tomorrow but it won't be.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

You could be fixed tomorrow too. *Hope you get your head cracked
at your next leftist riot over there.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

All of the above. The technologies they use were invented here in the
UK and Germany. They were stolen/given to you.

"harry" wrote in message
...

The first law of capitalism is that a thing is worth what people are
prepared to pay for it.

And the second law of capitalism is there is someone around the corner who
will sell it cheaper and knock the bottom out of the price.

I expect the Chinese make a similar one half price.

Got a name and model number? If you're thinking of the DH-10 (ha, fat
chance) it's unlikely their first presumably successful design was arrived
at cheaply. They had to buy a lot of the technology from Russia and
Ukraine, what they couldn't steal elsewhere--that probably pushed up the
cost.

Soon Boeing be moving the production line there anyway. Or Mexico.

Let us know when that happens.

The USA has fallen way back on all forms of technology except weapons
because you are warmongering *******s.

Makes a nice bumper-sticker even if it's not true. But bumper-stickers seem
to be all you need.

It's neccesary for wars to be
started constantly in order to sell weapons. Even Obama has fallen
into the trap. He is in the pocket fo the capitalist *******s as was
Bush &co.

Hey, Einstein, remember who pushed for this current fracas? Two nations:
France and Britain.

Those Storm Shadow cruise missiles Tornados are currently hauling into
Libya, at least ‚¬800,000 each, whose taxes are paying for those, hmmmm?

"mm" wrote in message
...
OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

Hellfires are $82k per copy. Don't know about Tomahawk. That is a larger
surface launched missile, right? Love watching the Hellfire strikes on
youtube. Now you see 'em, now you don't.

Steve

Heart surgery pending?
www.cabgbypasssurgery.com

On Mar 28, 9:22*pm, "Steve B" wrote:
"mm" wrote in message

...

OT *What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

Hellfires are $82k per copy. *Don't know about Tomahawk. *That is a larger
surface launched missile, right? *Love watching the Hellfire strikes on
youtube. *Now you see 'em, now you don't.

Steve

Heart surgery pending?www.cabgbypasssurgery.com

Hellfire ~100lbs
Tomahawk ~3000 lbs

Helfire range ~8km
Tomahawk range ~2500km

Based on performance & capacity ..... those Tomahawks look like a
bargain

But I wouldn't waste one even on heavy armor.


later (current?) procurement cycle supposed to reduce cost by ~50%
thus getting it down to ~ 1/2 million each

Our first 12 production units for the AH-64 Apache 30mm Ammunition
Magazine cost ~$150k each (1982) by the third production buy (120
units) we'd gotten the price down to $50k each.

Cost reduction is driven by learning curve, value engineering design
changes and lot size increases.

cheers
Bob

On Mar 29, 8:25*am, DD_BobK wrote:
On Mar 28, 9:22*pm, "Steve B" wrote:





"mm" wrote in message

.. .

OT *What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

Hellfires are $82k per copy. *Don't know about Tomahawk. *That is a larger
surface launched missile, right? *Love watching the Hellfire strikes on
youtube. *Now you see 'em, now you don't.

Steve

Heart surgery pending?www.cabgbypasssurgery.com

Hellfire ~100lbs
Tomahawk ~3000 lbs

Helfire range *~8km
Tomahawk range ~2500km

Based on performance & capacity *..... those Tomahawks look like a
bargain *

But I wouldn't waste one even on heavy armor.

later (current?) procurement cycle supposed to reduce cost by ~50%
thus getting it down to ~ 1/2 million each

Our first 12 production units for the AH-64 Apache 30mm Ammunition
Magazine cost ~$150k each (1982) *by the third production buy (120
units) we'd gotten the price down to $50k each.

Cost reduction is driven by learning curve, value engineering design
changes and lot size increases.

cheers
Bob- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Cost reduction is about increasing profit. Absolutely nothing to do
with selling price.

On Tue, 29 Mar 2011 00:50:23 -0700 (PDT), harry
wrote:

On Mar 29, 8:25*am, DD_BobK wrote:
On Mar 28, 9:22*pm, "Steve B" wrote:





"mm" wrote in message

.. .

OT *What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

Hellfires are $82k per copy. *Don't know about Tomahawk. *That is a larger
surface launched missile, right? *Love watching the Hellfire strikes on
youtube. *Now you see 'em, now you don't.

Steve

Heart surgery pending?www.cabgbypasssurgery.com

Hellfire ~100lbs
Tomahawk ~3000 lbs

Helfire range *~8km
Tomahawk range ~2500km

Based on performance & capacity *..... those Tomahawks look like a
bargain *

But I wouldn't waste one even on heavy armor.

later (current?) procurement cycle supposed to reduce cost by ~50%
thus getting it down to ~ 1/2 million each

Our first 12 production units for the AH-64 Apache 30mm Ammunition
Magazine cost ~$150k each (1982) *by the third production buy (120
units) we'd gotten the price down to $50k each.

Cost reduction is driven by learning curve, value engineering design
changes and lot size increases.

cheers
Bob- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Cost reduction is about increasing profit. Absolutely nothing to do
with selling price.

You misunderstood him. Price reduction is enabled by cost reduction.

On Mar 29, 10:56*am, mm wrote:
On Tue, 29 Mar 2011 00:50:23 -0700 (PDT), harry
wrote:





On Mar 29, 8:25 am, DD_BobK wrote:
On Mar 28, 9:22 pm, "Steve B" wrote:

"mm" wrote in message

.. .

OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

Hellfires are $82k per copy. Don't know about Tomahawk. That is a larger
surface launched missile, right? Love watching the Hellfire strikes on
youtube. Now you see 'em, now you don't.

Steve

Heart surgery pending?www.cabgbypasssurgery.com

Hellfire ~100lbs
Tomahawk ~3000 lbs

Helfire range ~8km
Tomahawk range ~2500km

Based on performance & capacity ..... those Tomahawks look like a
bargain

But I wouldn't waste one even on heavy armor.

later (current?) procurement cycle supposed to reduce cost by ~50%
thus getting it down to ~ 1/2 million each

Our first 12 production units for the AH-64 Apache 30mm Ammunition
Magazine cost ~$150k each (1982) by the third production buy (120
units) we'd gotten the price down to $50k each.

Cost reduction is driven by learning curve, value engineering design
changes and lot size increases.

cheers
Bob- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Cost reduction is about increasing profit. *Absolutely nothing to do
with selling price.

You misunderstood him. *Price reduction is enabled by cost reduction.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -
I don''t misunderstand at all. Selling price is nothing to do with
the cost price except that cost price has to be less.
Re. the missiles, as there is no competition, there is no incentive to
reduce the price at all.
Capitalists like to eliminate competition so they have a monopoly &
charge what they like.
That's why the *******s come over here buying up our businesses &
closing them down.
The latest being Kraft foods and Cadbury.

On Tue, 29 Mar 2011 00:50:23 -0700 (PDT), harry wrote:

On Mar 29, 8:25*am, DD_BobK wrote:
On Mar 28, 9:22*pm, "Steve B" wrote:





"mm" wrote in message

.. .

OT *What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

Hellfires are $82k per copy. *Don't know about Tomahawk. *That is a larger
surface launched missile, right? *Love watching the Hellfire strikes on
youtube. *Now you see 'em, now you don't.

Steve

Heart surgery pending?www.cabgbypasssurgery.com

Hellfire ~100lbs
Tomahawk ~3000 lbs

Helfire range *~8km
Tomahawk range ~2500km

Based on performance & capacity *..... those Tomahawks look like a
bargain *

But I wouldn't waste one even on heavy armor.

later (current?) procurement cycle supposed to reduce cost by ~50%
thus getting it down to ~ 1/2 million each

Our first 12 production units for the AH-64 Apache 30mm Ammunition
Magazine cost ~$150k each (1982) *by the third production buy (120
units) we'd gotten the price down to $50k each.

Cost reduction is driven by learning curve, value engineering design
changes and lot size increases.

cheers
Bob- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Cost reduction is about increasing profit. Absolutely nothing to do
with selling price.

I see the clueless Brit is back from his riots.

On Mar 30, 12:28*am, "
wrote:
On Tue, 29 Mar 2011 00:50:23 -0700 (PDT), harry wrote:
On Mar 29, 8:25 am, DD_BobK wrote:
On Mar 28, 9:22 pm, "Steve B" wrote:

"mm" wrote in message

.. .

OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

Hellfires are $82k per copy. Don't know about Tomahawk. That is a larger
surface launched missile, right? Love watching the Hellfire strikes on
youtube. Now you see 'em, now you don't.

Steve

Heart surgery pending?www.cabgbypasssurgery.com

Hellfire ~100lbs
Tomahawk ~3000 lbs

Helfire range ~8km
Tomahawk range ~2500km

Based on performance & capacity ..... those Tomahawks look like a
bargain

But I wouldn't waste one even on heavy armor.

later (current?) procurement cycle supposed to reduce cost by ~50%
thus getting it down to ~ 1/2 million each

Our first 12 production units for the AH-64 Apache 30mm Ammunition
Magazine cost ~$150k each (1982) by the third production buy (120
units) we'd gotten the price down to $50k each.

Cost reduction is driven by learning curve, value engineering design
changes and lot size increases.

cheers
Bob- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Cost reduction is about increasing profit. *Absolutely nothing to do
with selling price.

I see the clueless Brit is back from his riots.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Hello mosquito brain. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz :-)

On Mar 29, 12:50*am, harry wrote:
On Mar 29, 8:25*am, DD_BobK wrote:









On Mar 28, 9:22*pm, "Steve B" wrote:

"mm" wrote in message

.. .

OT *What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

Hellfires are $82k per copy. *Don't know about Tomahawk. *That is a larger
surface launched missile, right? *Love watching the Hellfire strikes on
youtube. *Now you see 'em, now you don't.

Steve

Heart surgery pending?www.cabgbypasssurgery.com

Hellfire ~100lbs
Tomahawk ~3000 lbs

Helfire range *~8km
Tomahawk range ~2500km

Based on performance & capacity *..... those Tomahawks look like a
bargain *

But I wouldn't waste one even on heavy armor.

later (current?) procurement cycle supposed to reduce cost by ~50%
thus getting it down to ~ 1/2 million each

Our first 12 production units for the AH-64 Apache 30mm Ammunition
Magazine cost ~$150k each (1982) *by the third production buy (120
units) we'd gotten the price down to $50k each.

Cost reduction is driven by learning curve, value engineering design
changes and lot size increases.

cheers
Bob- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Cost reduction is about increasing profit. *Absolutely nothing to do
with selling price.

Harry-

Wrong again.

We bid these projects & supplied the machinery on a Firm Fixed Price
Basis.

Bids were audited prior to award. Fee (profit) was negotiated base
on bid prices.

If we came came up with cheaper ways to make the item...... the bid
for the "next" buy had to include this cost reductions.

You don't know anything about the bid & procurement process.

Don't let the facts confuse you.

cheers
Bob

On Mar 30, 5:16*am, DD_BobK wrote:
On Mar 29, 12:50*am, harry wrote:





On Mar 29, 8:25*am, DD_BobK wrote:

On Mar 28, 9:22*pm, "Steve B" wrote:

"mm" wrote in message

.. .

OT *What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

Hellfires are $82k per copy. *Don't know about Tomahawk. *That is a larger
surface launched missile, right? *Love watching the Hellfire strikes on
youtube. *Now you see 'em, now you don't.

Steve

Heart surgery pending?www.cabgbypasssurgery.com

Hellfire ~100lbs
Tomahawk ~3000 lbs

Helfire range *~8km
Tomahawk range ~2500km

Based on performance & capacity *..... those Tomahawks look like a
bargain *

But I wouldn't waste one even on heavy armor.

later (current?) procurement cycle supposed to reduce cost by ~50%
thus getting it down to ~ 1/2 million each

Our first 12 production units for the AH-64 Apache 30mm Ammunition
Magazine cost ~$150k each (1982) *by the third production buy (120
units) we'd gotten the price down to $50k each.

Cost reduction is driven by learning curve, value engineering design
changes and lot size increases.

cheers
Bob- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Cost reduction is about increasing profit. *Absolutely nothing to do
with selling price.

Harry-

Wrong again. *

We bid these projects & supplied the machinery on a Firm Fixed Price
Basis.

Bids were audited prior to award. * Fee (profit) was negotiated base
on bid prices.

If we came came up with cheaper ways to make the item...... the bid
for the "next" buy had to include this cost reductions.

You don't know anything about the bid & procurement process.

Don't let the facts confuse you.

cheers
Bob- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

What you say exactly confirms what I said. After the contract is
secured, cost savings increase the profits.
Best not to mention any possible savings before the bid eh?

And if there are any changes to the specification, hey, you better
look out, more opportunities for profit once the buyer is commited.

The main reason for improvements (real or imaginary), is to boost
profits after the customer can't escape without vast losses. These
"improvements" are pre-known by the manufacturer, ready to pull out of
the bag like magic. A whole line of them, planned out for years
ahead.

This is aside to what can be done by creative accounting.

That's just the legal stuff too.
There is also the strong possibilty that the "competitors" are in
cahoots behind the scenes. Pre-deciding which work they want etc.

As it's "only" taxpayer's money, no-one is worrying too much.

There is endless scope. The pen is mightier than the lathe when it
comes to creating money.

On 3/28/2011 8:18 PM, mm wrote:
OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

I checked the completed auctions on ebay and none had sold so it is
really hard to tell the real price.

mm wrote:

OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

CNN keeps saying 1.4 mil/per.

Which is actually pretty cheap compared to sending in manned aircraft.

G. Morgan wrote in
:

mm wrote:

OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

CNN keeps saying 1.4 mil/per.

http://www.navy.mil/navydata/fact_di...&tid=1300&ct=2

says $569,000 each.
it doesn't say if that includes warhead.
I doubt it. a nuke WH(TLAM-N) would substantially raise the cost.
I don't believe the conventional WH is going to cost $831K,more than the
Tomahawk itself.


Which is actually pretty cheap compared to sending in manned aircraft.


You don't risk a pilot....
but you usually get the piloted aircraft back and can reuse it.
and you can attack multiple targets,and targets of opportunity.

TLAM is good for high-risk targets.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
localnet
dot com

On Mar 29, 3:14*pm, Jim Yanik wrote:
G. Morgan wrote :

mm wrote:

OT *What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

CNN keeps saying 1.4 mil/per.

http://www.navy.mil/navydata/fact_di...&tid=1300&ct=2

says $569,000 each.
it doesn't say if that includes warhead.
I doubt it. a nuke WH(TLAM-N) would substantially raise the cost.
I don't believe the conventional WH is going to cost $831K,more than the
Tomahawk itself.



Which is actually pretty cheap compared to sending in manned aircraft.

You don't risk a pilot....
but you usually get the piloted aircraft back and can reuse it.
and you can attack multiple targets,and targets of opportunity.

TLAM is good for high-risk targets.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
localnet
dot com

But neither do you have to find and train pilots. As you don't have
to carry//support the pilot, the aircraft will be much smaller.

Air wars in the future will be fought with drones/robot planes.
All you need to win is the production line and the best technology/
tactics.
These robot aircraft willbe able to perform high G manouvers that no
human pilot could survive.
They are being designed right now in Europe and, I imagine, America
and Russia.

On 3/30/2011 3:29 AM, harry wrote:
On Mar 29, 3:14 pm, Jim wrote:
G. wrote :

wrote:

OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

CNN keeps saying 1.4 mil/per.

http://www.navy.mil/navydata/fact_di...&tid=1300&ct=2

says $569,000 each.
it doesn't say if that includes warhead.
I doubt it. a nuke WH(TLAM-N) would substantially raise the cost.
I don't believe the conventional WH is going to cost $831K,more than the
Tomahawk itself.



Which is actually pretty cheap compared to sending in manned aircraft.

You don't risk a pilot....
but you usually get the piloted aircraft back and can reuse it.
and you can attack multiple targets,and targets of opportunity.

TLAM is good for high-risk targets.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
localnet
dot com

But neither do you have to find and train pilots. As you don't have
to carry//support the pilot, the aircraft will be much smaller.

Air wars in the future will be fought with drones/robot planes.
All you need to win is the production line and the best technology/
tactics.
These robot aircraft willbe able to perform high G manouvers that no
human pilot could survive.
They are being designed right now in Europe and, I imagine, America
and Russia.

Lots of tongue wagging about remotely piloted fighter aircraft in all
the technology TV programs and much has been written in science and
technology publications too. I imagine it will be a lot like the F-117
Nighthawk Stealth Fighter that flew for years before it was revealed.
Suddenly we will find out that new tech RPV's have been secretly used
in The Middle East to go after terrorists and take down other fighters.

TDD

On 3/28/2011 9:18 PM, mm wrote:
OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.


Much about this on the news a few days ago, although I can't find
sources at the moment. What I remember: The '99 price of a cruise
missile is ~600K, Raytheon is now the main contractor and has made
modifications upping the cost. Some of the mods include being able to
change course of the missile in flight. Late model tomahawks are more
like 1.4 M. Prices also vary by launch platform and other variants,
something he

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/smart/bgm-109.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomahawk_missile

Hard to say just what the cost is of the ones being expended.

It's a lot of money compared to other smart weapons, but the
outstanding value is that they can be deployed against any target
without risking air frames and air crews. They can also be sent off in
large numbers quickly. That is why you see them used so extensively
early in air campaigns, the trend is toward using these very early on to
take down air defences and heavily defended targets.

There probably will be very few more expended and there appears to be
a large inventory of them so there is no pressing need to replenish as
there are more in the pipeline (~200/year). There likely won't be
additional requested. Note that the US is deploying AC130 gunships and
you don't do that unless you own the airspace.

Something here on aircraft involved:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/mobile/uk-12785746

Considering how fast the conflict blew up in Libya it's a nice bit of
work getting all the forces and countries involved put together.
Obviously there was a lot of planning involved early on, and it appears
that they were on the move even as the politics were working their course.

On a side note, the sudden ebb and flow of military fortunes in Libya
is nothing new. These are the same towns that flowed back and forth
between axis and allies in WWII. Then as now, controlling the air over
land that you can't hide in, is key.

Jeff

On Tue, 29 Mar 2011 02:39:08 -0400, Jeff Thies
wrote:

On 3/28/2011 9:18 PM, mm wrote:
OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.


Much about this on the news a few days ago, although I can't find
sources at the moment. What I remember: The '99 price of a cruise
missile is ~600K, Raytheon is now the main contractor and has made
modifications upping the cost. Some of the mods include being able to
change course of the missile in flight. Late model tomahawks are more
like 1.4 M. Prices also vary by launch platform and other variants,
something he

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/smart/bgm-109.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomahawk_missile

Hard to say just what the cost is of the ones being expended.

It's a lot of money compared to other smart weapons, but the
outstanding value is that they can be deployed against any target
without risking air frames and air crews. They can also be sent off in
large numbers quickly. That is why you see them used so extensively
early in air campaigns, the trend is toward using these very early on to
take down air defences and heavily defended targets.

There probably will be very few more expended and there appears to be
a large inventory of them so there is no pressing need to replenish as
there are more in the pipeline (~200/year). There likely won't be
additional requested. Note that the US is deploying AC130 gunships and
you don't do that unless you own the airspace.

Something here on aircraft involved:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/mobile/uk-12785746

Considering how fast the conflict blew up in Libya it's a nice bit of
work getting all the forces and countries involved put together.
Obviously there was a lot of planning involved early on, and it appears
that they were on the move even as the politics were working their course.

On a side note, the sudden ebb and flow of military fortunes in Libya
is nothing new. These are the same towns that flowed back and forth
between axis and allies in WWII.

I'm sure. Tobruk is certainly famous.

Then as now, controlling the air over
land that you can't hide in, is key.

Jeff

Thanks .

On Mar 29, 7:46*am, mm wrote:
On Tue, 29 Mar 2011 02:39:08 -0400, Jeff Thies
wrote:





On 3/28/2011 9:18 PM, mm wrote:
OT *What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

* Much about this on the news a few days ago, although I can't find
sources at the moment. What I remember: *The '99 price of a cruise
missile is ~600K, Raytheon is now the main contractor and has made
modifications upping the cost. Some of the mods include being able to
change course of the missile in flight. Late model tomahawks are more
like 1.4 M. Prices also vary by launch platform and other variants,
something he

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/smart/bgm-109.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomahawk_missile

Hard to say just what the cost is of the ones being expended.

* It's a lot of money compared to other smart weapons, but the
outstanding value is that they can be deployed against any target
without risking air frames and air crews. They can also be sent off in
large numbers quickly. That is why you see them used so extensively
early in air campaigns, the trend is toward using these very early on to
take down air defences and heavily defended targets.

* There probably will be very few more expended and there appears to be
a large inventory of them so there is no pressing need to replenish as
there are more in the pipeline (~200/year). There likely won't be
additional requested. Note that the US is deploying AC130 gunships and
you don't do that unless you own the airspace.

* Something here on aircraft involved:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/mobile/uk-12785746

* Considering how fast the conflict blew up in Libya it's a nice bit of
work getting all the forces and countries involved put together.
Obviously there was a lot of planning involved early on, and it appears
that they were on the move even as the politics were working their course.

* On a side note, the sudden ebb and flow of military fortunes in Libya
is nothing new. These are the same towns that flowed back and forth
between axis and allies in WWII.

I'm sure. * Tobruk is certainly famous.

Then as now, controlling the air over
land that you can't hide in, is key.

* Jeff

Thanks .



- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

They are doing fine destroying tanks in the open desert. However in
towns and cities it will be near impossible. The battle will be won
or lost in the cities.

On Mar 29, 7:39*am, Jeff Thies wrote:
On 3/28/2011 9:18 PM, mm wrote:

OT *What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

They keep saying a million dollars, or a little less, but does that
include amortizing billions of dollars of development costs?

What is the marginal cost of another missile?

It's hard to believe anything costs a million dollars after there is
an assembly line of sorts.

* *Much about this on the news a few days ago, although I can't find
sources at the moment. What I remember: *The '99 price of a cruise
missile is ~600K, Raytheon is now the main contractor and has made
modifications upping the cost. Some of the mods include being able to
change course of the missile in flight. Late model tomahawks are more
like 1.4 M. Prices also vary by launch platform and other variants,
something he

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/smart/bgm-109.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomahawk_missile

Hard to say just what the cost is of the ones being expended.

* *It's a lot of money compared to other smart weapons, but the
outstanding value is that they can be deployed against any target
without risking air frames and air crews. They can also be sent off in
large numbers quickly. That is why you see them used so extensively
early in air campaigns, the trend is toward using these very early on to
take down air defences and heavily defended targets.

* *There probably will be very few more expended and there appears to be
a large inventory of them so there is no pressing need to replenish as
there are more in the pipeline (~200/year). There likely won't be
additional requested. Note that the US is deploying AC130 gunships and
you don't do that unless you own the airspace.

* *Something here on aircraft involved:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/mobile/uk-12785746

* *Considering how fast the conflict blew up in Libya it's a nice bit of
work getting all the forces and countries involved put together.
Obviously there was a lot of planning involved early on, and it appears
that they were on the move even as the politics were working their course..

* *On a side note, the sudden ebb and flow of military fortunes in Libya
is nothing new. These are the same towns that flowed back and forth
between axis and allies in WWII. Then as now, controlling the air over
land that you can't hide in, is key.

* *Jeff

The war will be lost without boots on the ground which seems
unlikely.
All these millions couls have been spent on healthcare or new
infrastructure.Why not? No money in it. No competition for cruise
missiles, they can charge what they like. The US gov.should buy
missiles from Moscow. That would bring the price tumbling down.

On 3/29/2011 3:48 AM, harry wrote:
On Mar 29, 7:39 am, Jeff wrote:
On 3/28/2011 9:18 PM, mm wrote:

OT What does a Tomohawk missile really cost?

snip
On a side note, the sudden ebb and flow of military fortunes in Libya
is nothing new. These are the same towns that flowed back and forth
between axis and allies in WWII. Then as now, controlling the air over
land that you can't hide in, is key.

Jeff

The war will be lost without boots on the ground which seems
unlikely.

Certainty is something that those who rely on common sense thinking have.

I've posted in this group before the historic animosities between
Cyrenaica and Tripolitania. Something he

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyrenaica

I've also pointed out that per capita more al Qaeda recruits have
come from Cyrenaica that anywhere else in the world. What Ghadaffi says
about his enemies ties to al Qaeada has some truth behind it.

The forces behind this and other conflicts is complex and the prudent
course of action needs some coyness. The George W Bush cock sure
approach is a sure way to throw away lives and futures. Putting our
boots on the ground would make us a more direct player in a game that we
are better off playing a more peripheral role. Putting forces on the
ground where we can't tell who are our allies is ludicrous. The only
surety is that we will find less allies than we expected. What we have
now is a deep respect of the air power that we can exert.

As far as being unable to "win", I find this a foolish statement. For
us, there is no winning, only looking towards a more favorable outcome.

For the Ghadaffi forces, much as it was as in WWII, controlling
supply lines and destroying armour decides the fate of those boots on
the ground. They are deeply in trouble, they are melting away rather
than be destroyed in the exposed positions they have to take. Ghadaffi's
home town will be under assault soon enough. These are ideal conditions
to exert air power.


All these millions couls have been spent on healthcare or new
infrastructure.Why not? No money in it. No competition for cruise
missiles, they can charge what they like. The US gov.should buy
missiles from Moscow. That would bring the price tumbling down.

It's chump change relative to the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. A few
hundred million on Tomahawks is a rounding error. Only thinking of the
small picture is the surest way to be lost in the wilderness.

IMHO, we aren't doing badly playing the hand we have the way we have.
Time, and not that much of it, will tell.

Now, I've left myself exposed to those who think in common sense and
who will always be terminally upset. But it's only usenet. What
matters what myself or anyone else here thinks?

Jeff