I used to use Roundup when I lived in NM and never really worried about the
trees because there are so few out there. Then I moved Central TX where live
oaks are pretty much everywhere. I listen to KBLJ AM talk radio on Saturday
mornings and would often hear to substitute garden vinegar with a bit of
orange citrus oil mixed in as a substitute for Roundup. I bought some last
year but I didn't get the chance to use any until this year. I have to say,
vinegar and citrus oil works as well, if not better, than Roundup, for
clearing up that grass and the weeds that grow in the cracks in the sidewalk
and driveway. The grass and weeds died almost immediately and so far haven't
come back. I prefer to use a defoliant there because pulling those
particular weeds can be difficult and tend to grow back right away if I pull
them.

BTW, I never use any weed control products on my yard because of the trees
on my property. I've been pulling them the old fashion way with very good
results. The grass usually just takes the place of the weeds. The weeds were
pretty bad when I moved into my new property 5 years ago but I bought a weed
puller that did the job.

FWIW, It's one of these: http://www.kk.org/cooltools/weedhound.jpg

Jim

On Sep 11, 5:20*pm, "JimT" wrote:
I used to use Roundup when I lived in NM and never really worried about the
trees because there are so few out there. Then I moved Central TX where live
oaks are pretty much everywhere. I listen to KBLJ AM talk radio on Saturday
mornings and would often hear to substitute garden vinegar with a bit of
orange citrus oil mixed in as a substitute for Roundup. I bought some last
year but I didn't get the chance to use any until this year. I have to say,
vinegar and citrus oil works as well, if not better, than Roundup, for
clearing up that grass and the weeds that grow in the cracks in the sidewalk
and driveway. The grass and weeds died almost immediately and so far haven't
come back. I prefer to use a defoliant there because pulling those
particular weeds can be difficult and tend to grow back right away if I pull
them.

BTW, I never use any weed control products on my yard because of the trees
on my property. I've been pulling them the old fashion way with very good
results. The grass usually just takes the place of the weeds. The weeds were
pretty bad when I moved into my new property 5 years ago but I bought a weed
puller that did the job.

FWIW, It's one of these:http://www.kk.org/cooltools/weedhound.jpg

Jim

Jim, post this on rec.gardens as well. They are very helpful.

Also, what is "garden vinegar"? Different from ordinary household
vinegar?
If so, where get?

TIA

"Higgs Boson" wrote in message
...
On Sep 11, 5:20 pm, "JimT" wrote:
I used to use Roundup when I lived in NM and never really worried about
the
trees because there are so few out there. Then I moved Central TX where
live
oaks are pretty much everywhere. I listen to KBLJ AM talk radio on
Saturday
mornings and would often hear to substitute garden vinegar with a bit of
orange citrus oil mixed in as a substitute for Roundup. I bought some last
year but I didn't get the chance to use any until this year. I have to
say,
vinegar and citrus oil works as well, if not better, than Roundup, for
clearing up that grass and the weeds that grow in the cracks in the
sidewalk
and driveway. The grass and weeds died almost immediately and so far
haven't
come back. I prefer to use a defoliant there because pulling those
particular weeds can be difficult and tend to grow back right away if I
pull
them.

BTW, I never use any weed control products on my yard because of the trees
on my property. I've been pulling them the old fashion way with very good
results. The grass usually just takes the place of the weeds. The weeds
were
pretty bad when I moved into my new property 5 years ago but I bought a
weed
puller that did the job.

FWIW, It's one of these:http://www.kk.org/cooltools/weedhound.jpg

Jim

Jim, post this on rec.gardens as well. They are very helpful.

Also, what is "garden vinegar"? Different from ordinary household
vinegar?
If so, where get?

TIA

===

This is what I used.:
http://www.garden-ville.com/sites/36...ages/20new.gif

http://buckmoorefeed.com/images/OrangeOil.jpg

I've read where people have used kitchen vinegar but I doubt it works as
well. As for buying, try any dedicated garden store.
I put about 2 tbls of oil to 1 pint of vinegar in a spray bottle. I soaked
them well but next time I'm going to use a lot less and see how it works.
Jim

On Sep 12, 12:05*am, "JimT" wrote:
"Higgs Boson" wrote in message

...
On Sep 11, 5:20 pm, "JimT" wrote:





I used to use Roundup when I lived in NM and never really worried about
the
trees because there are so few out there. Then I moved Central TX where
live
oaks are pretty much everywhere. I listen to KBLJ AM talk radio on
Saturday
mornings and would often hear to substitute garden vinegar with a bit of
orange citrus oil mixed in as a substitute for Roundup. I bought some last
year but I didn't get the chance to use any until this year. I have to
say,
vinegar and citrus oil works as well, if not better, than Roundup, for
clearing up that grass and the weeds that grow in the cracks in the
sidewalk
and driveway. The grass and weeds died almost immediately and so far
haven't
come back. I prefer to use a defoliant there because pulling those
particular weeds can be difficult and tend to grow back right away if I
pull
them.

BTW, I never use any weed control products on my yard because of the trees
on my property. I've been pulling them the old fashion way with very good
results. The grass usually just takes the place of the weeds. The weeds
were
pretty bad when I moved into my new property 5 years ago but I bought a
weed
puller that did the job.

FWIW, It's one of these:http://www.kk.org/cooltools/weedhound.jpg

Jim

Jim, post this on rec.gardens as well. *They are very helpful.

Also, what is "garden vinegar"? *Different from ordinary household
vinegar?
If so, where get?

TIA

===

This is what I used.:http://www.garden-ville.com/sites/36...ges/20new..gif

http://buckmoorefeed.com/images/OrangeOil.jpg

I've read where people have used kitchen vinegar but I doubt it works as
well. As for buying, try any dedicated garden store.
I put about 2 tbls of oil to 1 pint of vinegar in a spray bottle. I soaked
them well but next time I'm going to use a lot less and see how it works.
Jim- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

What makes you think spraying vinegar on weeds is any better for trees
than using Roundup? Roundup works by being absorbed and taken in
through leaves. I've never had any issues with it affecting any
trees. You just don't spray the trees with it.

wrote in message
...
On Sep 12, 12:05 am, "JimT" wrote:
"Higgs Boson" wrote in message

...
On Sep 11, 5:20 pm, "JimT" wrote:





I used to use Roundup when I lived in NM and never really worried about
the
trees because there are so few out there. Then I moved Central TX where
live
oaks are pretty much everywhere. I listen to KBLJ AM talk radio on
Saturday
mornings and would often hear to substitute garden vinegar with a bit of
orange citrus oil mixed in as a substitute for Roundup. I bought some
last
year but I didn't get the chance to use any until this year. I have to
say,
vinegar and citrus oil works as well, if not better, than Roundup, for
clearing up that grass and the weeds that grow in the cracks in the
sidewalk
and driveway. The grass and weeds died almost immediately and so far
haven't
come back. I prefer to use a defoliant there because pulling those
particular weeds can be difficult and tend to grow back right away if I
pull
them.

BTW, I never use any weed control products on my yard because of the
trees
on my property. I've been pulling them the old fashion way with very
good
results. The grass usually just takes the place of the weeds. The weeds
were
pretty bad when I moved into my new property 5 years ago but I bought a
weed
puller that did the job.

FWIW, It's one of these:http://www.kk.org/cooltools/weedhound.jpg

Jim

Jim, post this on rec.gardens as well. They are very helpful.

Also, what is "garden vinegar"? Different from ordinary household
vinegar?
If so, where get?

TIA

===

This is what I
used.:http://www.garden-ville.com/sites/36...ages/20new.gif

http://buckmoorefeed.com/images/OrangeOil.jpg

I've read where people have used kitchen vinegar but I doubt it works as
well. As for buying, try any dedicated garden store.
I put about 2 tbls of oil to 1 pint of vinegar in a spray bottle. I soaked
them well but next time I'm going to use a lot less and see how it works.
Jim- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

What makes you think spraying vinegar on weeds is any better for trees
than using Roundup? Roundup works by being absorbed and taken in
through leaves. I've never had any issues with it affecting any
trees. You just don't spray the trees with it.

====

Personally, I keep both away from the trees.
I wasn't aware of the problems with RU until I started listening to KBLJ (A
very conservative AM station). There is quite a bit of debate regarding RUs
use and other foliage isn't the only concern. So yes, I'm relying on the
advice of others as I'm not a chemist.

Jim

On 9/12/2010 12:40 PM JimT spake thus:

wrote in message
...

[remaining attribution totally ****ed up by the totally BRAIN DAMAGED
Google Groups]

I used to use Roundup when I lived in NM and never really worried
about the trees because there are so few out there. Then I moved
Central TX where live oaks are pretty much everywhere. I listen
to KBLJ AM talk radio on Saturday mornings and would often hear
to substitute garden vinegar with a bit of orange citrus oil
mixed in as a substitute for Roundup. I bought some last year but
I didn't get the chance to use any until this year. I have to
say, vinegar and citrus oil works as well, if not better, than
Roundup, for clearing up that grass and the weeds that grow in
the cracks in the sidewalk and driveway. The grass and weeds died
almost immediately and so far haven't come back. I prefer to use
a defoliant there because pulling those particular weeds can be
difficult and tend to grow back right away if I pull them.

BTW, I never use any weed control products on my yard because of
the trees on my property. I've been pulling them the old fashion
way with very good results. The grass usually just takes the
place of the weeds. The weeds were pretty bad when I moved into
my new property 5 years ago but I bought a weed puller that did
the job.

FWIW, It's one of these:http://www.kk.org/cooltools/weedhound.jpg

Jim, post this on rec.gardens as well. They are very helpful.

Also, what is "garden vinegar"? Different from ordinary household
vinegar? If so, where get?

This is what I
used.:http://www.garden-ville.com/sites/36...ages/20new.gif

http://buckmoorefeed.com/images/OrangeOil.jpg

I've read where people have used kitchen vinegar but I doubt it
works as well. As for buying, try any dedicated garden store. I put
about 2 tbls of oil to 1 pint of vinegar in a spray bottle. I
soaked them well but next time I'm going to use a lot less and see
how it works. Jim

What makes you think spraying vinegar on weeds is any better for
trees than using Roundup? Roundup works by being absorbed and
taken in through leaves. I've never had any issues with it
affecting any trees. You just don't spray the trees with it.

====

Personally, I keep both away from the trees. I wasn't aware of the
problems with RU until I started listening to KBLJ (A very
conservative AM station). There is quite a bit of debate regarding
RUs use and other foliage isn't the only concern. So yes, I'm relying
on the advice of others as I'm not a chemist.

I wonder if the acidity of vinegar could be a problem. Seems like it's
going to change the pH of the soil; what effects could that have?


--
The fashion in killing has an insouciant, flirty style this spring,
with the flaunting of well-defined muscle, wrapped in flags.

- Comment from an article on Antiwar.com (http://antiwar.com)

On Sep 12, 3:40*pm, "JimT" wrote:
wrote in message

...
On Sep 12, 12:05 am, "JimT" wrote:





"Higgs Boson" wrote in message

...
On Sep 11, 5:20 pm, "JimT" wrote:

I used to use Roundup when I lived in NM and never really worried about
the
trees because there are so few out there. Then I moved Central TX where
live
oaks are pretty much everywhere. I listen to KBLJ AM talk radio on
Saturday
mornings and would often hear to substitute garden vinegar with a bit of
orange citrus oil mixed in as a substitute for Roundup. I bought some
last
year but I didn't get the chance to use any until this year. I have to
say,
vinegar and citrus oil works as well, if not better, than Roundup, for
clearing up that grass and the weeds that grow in the cracks in the
sidewalk
and driveway. The grass and weeds died almost immediately and so far
haven't
come back. I prefer to use a defoliant there because pulling those
particular weeds can be difficult and tend to grow back right away if I
pull
them.

BTW, I never use any weed control products on my yard because of the
trees
on my property. I've been pulling them the old fashion way with very
good
results. The grass usually just takes the place of the weeds. The weeds
were
pretty bad when I moved into my new property 5 years ago but I bought a
weed
puller that did the job.

FWIW, It's one of these:http://www.kk.org/cooltools/weedhound.jpg

Jim

Jim, post this on rec.gardens as well. They are very helpful.

Also, what is "garden vinegar"? Different from ordinary household
vinegar?
If so, where get?

TIA

===

This is what I
used.:http://www.garden-ville.com/sites/36...ages/20new.gif

http://buckmoorefeed.com/images/OrangeOil.jpg

I've read where people have used kitchen vinegar but I doubt it works as
well. As for buying, try any dedicated garden store.
I put about 2 tbls of oil to 1 pint of vinegar in a spray bottle. I soaked
them well but next time I'm going to use a lot less and see how it works.
Jim- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

What makes you think spraying vinegar on weeds is any better for trees
than using Roundup? * *Roundup works by being absorbed and taken in
through leaves. * I've never had any issues with it affecting any
trees. *You just don't spray the trees with it.

====

Personally, I keep both away from the trees.
I wasn't aware of the problems with RU until I started listening to KBLJ (A
very conservative AM station). There is quite a bit of debate regarding RUs
use and other foliage isn't the only concern. So yes, I'm relying on the
advice of others as I'm not a chemist.

Jim- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

So, what exactly did they say about using Roundup around trees? To do
a lawn renovation, per the Roundup directions, you can spray the lawn
with Roundup and then re-seed a week later. If what's on the surface
after a week doesn't interfere with seed germination, I find it hard
to believe it's going to harm a tree from the roots.

On 9/12/2010 12:05 AM, JimT wrote:
"Higgs wrote in message
...
On Sep 11, 5:20 pm, wrote:
I used to use Roundup when I lived in NM and never really worried about
the
trees because there are so few out there. Then I moved Central TX where
live
oaks are pretty much everywhere. I listen to KBLJ AM talk radio on
Saturday
mornings and would often hear to substitute garden vinegar with a bit of
orange citrus oil mixed in as a substitute for Roundup. I bought some last
year but I didn't get the chance to use any until this year. I have to
say,
vinegar and citrus oil works as well, if not better, than Roundup, for
clearing up that grass and the weeds that grow in the cracks in the
sidewalk
and driveway. The grass and weeds died almost immediately and so far
haven't
come back. I prefer to use a defoliant there because pulling those
particular weeds can be difficult and tend to grow back right away if I
pull
them.

BTW, I never use any weed control products on my yard because of the trees
on my property. I've been pulling them the old fashion way with very good
results. The grass usually just takes the place of the weeds. The weeds
were
pretty bad when I moved into my new property 5 years ago but I bought a
weed
puller that did the job.

FWIW, It's one of these:http://www.kk.org/cooltools/weedhound.jpg

Jim

Jim, post this onrec.gardens as well. They are very helpful.

Also, what is "garden vinegar"? Different from ordinary household
vinegar?
If so, where get?

TIA

===

This is what I used.:
http://www.garden-ville.com/sites/36...ages/20new.gif

http://buckmoorefeed.com/images/OrangeOil.jpg

I've read where people have used kitchen vinegar but I doubt it works as
well. As for buying, try any dedicated garden store.
I put about 2 tbls of oil to 1 pint of vinegar in a spray bottle. I soaked
them well but next time I'm going to use a lot less and see how it works.
Jim




The vinegar in your kitchen is about 5% acetic acid and this is 20% but
is misnamed as 20% vinegar which would make it diluted to 1%.

http://www.gardenguides.com/102345-v...d-control.html

I'd be concerned about getting vinegar on cement as it may corrode it.

Frank wrote in news:i6ie5u$okp$1
@news.eternal-september.org:

The vinegar in your kitchen is about 5% acetic acid and this is 20% but
is misnamed as 20% vinegar which would make it diluted to 1%.

http://www.gardenguides.com/102345-v...d-control.html

I'd be concerned about getting vinegar on cement as it may corrode it.

Muriatic acid is generally used at 31 or so % for etching concrete prior to
other treatments. Therefore 20% acetic acid may not be too bad.
Saturating the soil with 20% HAc will of course just about destroy anything
close by. Note that acetic acid is one a relatively few chemicals that
will attack/discolor stainless steel.

In areas like sidewalks or driveways 20% HAc might be OK. After a few
hours, I would rinse it well, though, and perhaps add some lime to sort of
neutralize the acid.

--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid

"Han" wrote in message
...
Frank wrote in news:i6ie5u$okp$1
@news.eternal-september.org:

The vinegar in your kitchen is about 5% acetic acid and this is 20% but
is misnamed as 20% vinegar which would make it diluted to 1%.

http://www.gardenguides.com/102345-v...d-control.html

I'd be concerned about getting vinegar on cement as it may corrode it.

Muriatic acid is generally used at 31 or so % for etching concrete prior
to
other treatments. Therefore 20% acetic acid may not be too bad.
Saturating the soil with 20% HAc will of course just about destroy
anything
close by. Note that acetic acid is one a relatively few chemicals that
will attack/discolor stainless steel.

In areas like sidewalks or driveways 20% HAc might be OK. After a few
hours, I would rinse it well, though, and perhaps add some lime to sort of
neutralize the acid.

--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid

I think that's prudent advice. I did notice a bit of discolrazation. Trying
to keep the solution on the weeds seems to be the best advice. I also think
I used more than necessary as I wasn't aware of it's effectiveness.
Jim

On 9/11/2010 11:05 PM, JimT wrote:
"Higgs wrote in message
...
On Sep 11, 5:20 pm, wrote:
I used to use Roundup when I lived in NM and never really worried about
the
trees because there are so few out there. Then I moved Central TX where
live
oaks are pretty much everywhere. I listen to KBLJ AM talk radio on
Saturday
mornings and would often hear to substitute garden vinegar with a bit of
orange citrus oil mixed in as a substitute for Roundup. I bought some last
year but I didn't get the chance to use any until this year. I have to
say,
vinegar and citrus oil works as well, if not better, than Roundup, for
clearing up that grass and the weeds that grow in the cracks in the
sidewalk
and driveway. The grass and weeds died almost immediately and so far
haven't
come back. I prefer to use a defoliant there because pulling those
particular weeds can be difficult and tend to grow back right away if I
pull
them.

BTW, I never use any weed control products on my yard because of the trees
on my property. I've been pulling them the old fashion way with very good
results. The grass usually just takes the place of the weeds. The weeds
were
pretty bad when I moved into my new property 5 years ago but I bought a
weed
puller that did the job.

FWIW, It's one of these:http://www.kk.org/cooltools/weedhound.jpg

Jim

Jim, post this onrec.gardens as well. They are very helpful.

Also, what is "garden vinegar"? Different from ordinary household
vinegar?
If so, where get?

TIA

===

This is what I used.:
http://www.garden-ville.com/sites/36...ages/20new.gif

http://buckmoorefeed.com/images/OrangeOil.jpg

I've read where people have used kitchen vinegar but I doubt it works as
well. As for buying, try any dedicated garden store.
I put about 2 tbls of oil to 1 pint of vinegar in a spray bottle. I soaked
them well but next time I'm going to use a lot less and see how it works.
Jim





Thanks Jim

I've always suspected Roundup wasn't as environmentally friendly as
Monsanto would have us believe. I have a neighbor that sprays that stuff
as though it were water. He actually believes it's safe to drink.


Just something to think about

Roundup: Label - Keep out of reach of children, harmful if swallowed,
avoid contact with eyes or prolonged contact with skin. Remove clothing
if contaminated. Spray solutions of this product should be mixed, stored
and applied only in stainless steel, aluminum, fiberglass, plastic and
plastic-lined steel containers. This product or spray solutions of this
product react with such containers and tanks to produce hydrogen gas
that may form a highly combustible gas mixture. This gas mixture could
flash or explode, causing serious personal injury, if ignited by open
flame, spark, welder’s torch, lighted cigarette or other ignition
source. Avoid direct applications to any body of water. Do not
contaminate water by disposal of waste or cleaning of equipment. Avoid
contamination of seed, feed, and foodstuffs. Soak up a small amounts of
spill with absorbent clay. Do not reuse container for any other purpose.

http://www.organicconsumers.org/monsanto/roundup.cfm


LdB

"Higgs Boson" wrote
"JimT" wrote:

mornings and would often hear to substitute garden vinegar with a bit of
orange citrus oil mixed in as a substitute for Roundup. I bought some
last

Also, what is "garden vinegar"? Different from ordinary household
vinegar? If so, where get?

It's no different. It's a sales gimmick to charge more where in fact, they
can get away with a cheaper process (doesnt have to be food grade so they
charge *more*). The citrus oil may be cheaper at a garden store though as
it also doesn't have to be edible grade and will be sold in quantity. I
just use straight vinegar.

Keep in mind it kills grass as well as weeds.

"cshenk" wrote in message
...
"Higgs Boson" wrote
"JimT" wrote:

mornings and would often hear to substitute garden vinegar with a bit of
orange citrus oil mixed in as a substitute for Roundup. I bought some
last

Also, what is "garden vinegar"? Different from ordinary household
vinegar? If so, where get?

It's no different. It's a sales gimmick to charge more where in fact,
they can get away with a cheaper process (doesnt have to be food grade so
they charge *more*). The citrus oil may be cheaper at a garden store
though as it also doesn't have to be edible grade and will be sold in
quantity. I just use straight vinegar.

Keep in mind it kills grass as well as weeds.

I'm not sure that is entirely true. A gal of 20% garden vinegar was about
$13. In theory that should be the equivalent of 4 gal of 5% vinegar. You can
buy a pint of Medina Orange Oil for $16 but you have to remember it's
concentrated too.
FWIW: I'm not one of those guys that hates paying retail at specialty
stores. If it's something that's at HD for half the price that's fine but
usually specialty stores charge more for convenience, and they have bills to
pay too.

People here really give pool supply stores crap for charging more for
chemicals. That's sort of a pet-peeve for me. Where else can you walk in,
get your water tested, get advice, get your Polaris worked on, get your pump
seal replaced, and get almost anything you need all in one place? I don't
mind paying a little more for the convenience. g

Funny, but I often get talked out of buying things at specialty stores.

Jim

On Sun, 12 Sep 2010 15:38:14 -0500, "JimT" wrote:


"cshenk" wrote in message
m...
"Higgs Boson" wrote
"JimT" wrote:

mornings and would often hear to substitute garden vinegar with a bit of
orange citrus oil mixed in as a substitute for Roundup. I bought some
last

Also, what is "garden vinegar"? Different from ordinary household
vinegar? If so, where get?

It's no different. It's a sales gimmick to charge more where in fact,
they can get away with a cheaper process (doesnt have to be food grade so
they charge *more*). The citrus oil may be cheaper at a garden store
though as it also doesn't have to be edible grade and will be sold in
quantity. I just use straight vinegar.

Keep in mind it kills grass as well as weeds.

I'm not sure that is entirely true. A gal of 20% garden vinegar was about
$13. In theory that should be the equivalent of 4 gal of 5% vinegar. You can
buy a pint of Medina Orange Oil for $16 but you have to remember it's
concentrated too.

....or for $30 you can buy enough concentrate to make 5 gallons of RoundUp.
That's enough to last me all summer.

FWIW: I'm not one of those guys that hates paying retail at specialty
stores. If it's something that's at HD for half the price that's fine but
usually specialty stores charge more for convenience, and they have bills to
pay too.

People here really give pool supply stores crap for charging more for
chemicals. That's sort of a pet-peeve for me. Where else can you walk in,
get your water tested, get advice, get your Polaris worked on, get your pump
seal replaced, and get almost anything you need all in one place? I don't
mind paying a little more for the convenience. g

Funny, but I often get talked out of buying things at specialty stores.

Jim

wrote in message
...
On Sun, 12 Sep 2010 15:38:14 -0500, "JimT" wrote:


"cshenk" wrote in message
om...
"Higgs Boson" wrote
"JimT" wrote:

mornings and would often hear to substitute garden vinegar with a bit
of
orange citrus oil mixed in as a substitute for Roundup. I bought some
last

Also, what is "garden vinegar"? Different from ordinary household
vinegar? If so, where get?

It's no different. It's a sales gimmick to charge more where in fact,
they can get away with a cheaper process (doesnt have to be food grade
so
they charge *more*). The citrus oil may be cheaper at a garden store
though as it also doesn't have to be edible grade and will be sold in
quantity. I just use straight vinegar.

Keep in mind it kills grass as well as weeds.

I'm not sure that is entirely true. A gal of 20% garden vinegar was about
$13. In theory that should be the equivalent of 4 gal of 5% vinegar. You
can
buy a pint of Medina Orange Oil for $16 but you have to remember it's
concentrated too.

...or for $30 you can buy enough concentrate to make 5 gallons of RoundUp.
That's enough to last me all summer.


So far I haven't used much of vinegar or oil, but that's not the point. That
amount will last at least 3 years for me. I only use it sparingly. I had
some of that concentrate RU left over from when we lived in NM. I took me
years to use that too. I think my wife got a hold of it and used it like
normal RU on my side yard. One of my neighbors trees isn't looking too
healthy. On the plus side, there are no weeds in my side yard. g

Jim

In article ,
"JimT" wrote:

I used to use Roundup when I lived in NM and never really worried about the
trees because there are so few out there. Then I moved Central TX where live
oaks are pretty much everywhere. I listen to KBLJ AM talk radio on Saturday
mornings and would often hear to substitute garden vinegar with a bit of
orange citrus oil mixed in as a substitute for Roundup. I bought some last
year but I didn't get the chance to use any until this year. I have to say,
vinegar and citrus oil works as well, if not better, than Roundup, for
clearing up that grass and the weeds that grow in the cracks in the sidewalk
and driveway. The grass and weeds died almost immediately and so far haven't
come back. I prefer to use a defoliant there because pulling those
particular weeds can be difficult and tend to grow back right away if I pull
them.

BTW, I never use any weed control products on my yard because of the trees
on my property. I've been pulling them the old fashion way with very good
results. The grass usually just takes the place of the weeds. The weeds were
pretty bad when I moved into my new property 5 years ago but I bought a weed
puller that did the job.

FWIW, It's one of these: http://www.kk.org/cooltools/weedhound.jpg

Jim

I bought one of those and took it back the next day. I decided it was
for shallow-rooted weeds in loose soil in a well-manicured lawn. Worked
great on about 1 weed out of 10 in my yard. Otherwise useless. I commend
your non-chemical approach, but a garden trowel is faster, easier, and
better than the weedhound IME.

"Smitty Two" wrote in message
news
In article ,
"JimT" wrote:

I used to use Roundup when I lived in NM and never really worried about
the
trees because there are so few out there. Then I moved Central TX where
live
oaks are pretty much everywhere. I listen to KBLJ AM talk radio on
Saturday
mornings and would often hear to substitute garden vinegar with a bit of
orange citrus oil mixed in as a substitute for Roundup. I bought some
last
year but I didn't get the chance to use any until this year. I have to
say,
vinegar and citrus oil works as well, if not better, than Roundup, for
clearing up that grass and the weeds that grow in the cracks in the
sidewalk
and driveway. The grass and weeds died almost immediately and so far
haven't
come back. I prefer to use a defoliant there because pulling those
particular weeds can be difficult and tend to grow back right away if I
pull
them.

BTW, I never use any weed control products on my yard because of the
trees
on my property. I've been pulling them the old fashion way with very good
results. The grass usually just takes the place of the weeds. The weeds
were
pretty bad when I moved into my new property 5 years ago but I bought a
weed
puller that did the job.

FWIW, It's one of these: http://www.kk.org/cooltools/weedhound.jpg

Jim

I bought one of those and took it back the next day. I decided it was
for shallow-rooted weeds in loose soil in a well-manicured lawn. Worked
great on about 1 weed out of 10 in my yard. Otherwise useless. I commend
your non-chemical approach, but a garden trowel is faster, easier, and
better than the weedhound IME.

It worked really well for one type of weed that really liked my yard.
Like this. http://www.rusticgirls.com/images/thistle_weed.jpg

Also a few others. It works well for getting at weeds that just snapped off
when hand picking but left the root. You're right. It's sort of a one trick
pony, but if you need it for that trick it works well. It busts up hard dirt
for the grass to grow back too.

BTW: Vinegar is a chemical, but I know what you mean. g

Jim