"The City of Austin Tuesday released photos of the web of tunnels a man dug
underneath his East Austin home. Under the yellow home are three stories of
tunnels... "

http://www.kvue.com/news/local/Insid...-94200924.html

Bumper sticker:
"South Austin: We're all here because we're not all there"

On Wed, 19 May 2010 07:24:32 -0500, "HeyBub"
wrote:

"The City of Austin Tuesday released photos of the web of tunnels a man dug
underneath his East Austin home. Under the yellow home are three stories of
tunnels... "

http://www.kvue.com/news/local/Insid...-94200924.html

Bumper sticker:
"South Austin: We're all here because we're not all there"


It's not clear *why* search warrant was served or did this follow a
code enforcement inspection and then the police were called?

I saw that on another list. Makes me wonder. If he'd shored up the
tunnels better, and not gone so close to the surface. Mighta been no
one noticed, ever.

My prediction is that the local government charges him a lot of money
to clear out all the stuff, and then back fill the holes he spent so
much time digging. We can't have anyone be different than the rest.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"HeyBub" wrote in message
...
"The City of Austin Tuesday released photos of the web of tunnels a
man dug
underneath his East Austin home. Under the yellow home are three
stories of
tunnels... "

http://www.kvue.com/news/local/Insid...-94200924.html

Bumper sticker:
"South Austin: We're all here because we're not all there"

On Wed, 19 May 2010 18:30:25 -0700, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

-snip-

I like the one this guy (who was an engineer) made on the sly:

http://www.mypnw.us/STUFF/Interestin....nukehome.aspx


I'm in awe of these guys. I've been plugging away for 20 years just
lowering the floor in my basement 3feet.g

"The Subterranean Fortress literally goes down 4 stories deep. Because
of the depth and the thickness of the cement the computer room is
Electro Magnetic Pulse (EMP) wave proof."

How deep or how much concrete does one need to EMP-proof stuff?

Jim

In article ,
"Jon Danniken" wrote:

Stormin Mormon wrote:
I saw that on another list. Makes me wonder. If he'd shored up the
tunnels better, and not gone so close to the surface. Mighta been no
one noticed, ever.

My prediction is that the local government charges him a lot of money
to clear out all the stuff, and then back fill the holes he spent so
much time digging. We can't have anyone be different than the rest.

I like the one this guy (who was an engineer) made on the sly:

http://www.mypnw.us/STUFF/Interestin....nukehome.aspx

Jon

Wow. Reminds me a bit of Christopher Walken's Blast From the Past.

I heard a year or so ago that one industry that's positively thriving in
these otherwise unsettled times, are the professional home shelter
builders. Nervous people everywhere are buying in with stuff ranging
from fortified tornado proof closets with three days worth of supplies,
to complete underground bunkers designed for long term sustainability.

At least he remembered the bathroom, and the sewage ejector. Very
important.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Jon Danniken" wrote in message
...

I like the one this guy (who was an engineer) made on the sly:

http://www.mypnw.us/STUFF/Interestin....nukehome.aspx

Jon

I don't know any specifics. My guess, it depends on how strong a
pulse, and how nearby. However, the rebar would help dissipate the
pulse.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message
...


"The Subterranean Fortress literally goes down 4 stories deep. Because
of the depth and the thickness of the cement the computer room is
Electro Magnetic Pulse (EMP) wave proof."

How deep or how much concrete does one need to EMP-proof stuff?

Jim

On May 19, 2:02*pm, Oren wrote:
On Wed, 19 May 2010 07:24:32 -0500, "HeyBub"
wrote:

"The City of Austin Tuesday released photos of the web of tunnels a man dug
underneath his East Austin home. Under the yellow home are three stories of
tunnels... "

http://www.kvue.com/news/local/Insid...in-tunnel-home...

Bumper sticker:
"South Austin: We're all here because we're not all there"

It's not clear *why* search warrant was served or did this follow a
code enforcement inspection and then the police were called?


A search warrant is required for authorities (typically the police,
but could
apply to the fire marshal, building inspector or health inspector as
well)
when a home owner denies entry and refuses to grant permission for the
government agents to enter private property...

It is the ONLY legal way for the authorities to gain entrance to
private
property without some sort of exigent emergency situation existing...

~~ Evan

"Smitty Two" wrote in message
news
In article ,
"Jon Danniken" wrote:

Stormin Mormon wrote:
I saw that on another list. Makes me wonder. If he'd shored up the
tunnels better, and not gone so close to the surface. Mighta been no
one noticed, ever.

My prediction is that the local government charges him a lot of money
to clear out all the stuff, and then back fill the holes he spent so
much time digging. We can't have anyone be different than the rest.

I like the one this guy (who was an engineer) made on the sly:

http://www.mypnw.us/STUFF/Interestin....nukehome.aspx

Jon

Wow. Reminds me a bit of Christopher Walken's Blast From the Past.

I heard a year or so ago that one industry that's positively thriving in
these otherwise unsettled times, are the professional home shelter
builders. Nervous people everywhere are buying in with stuff ranging
from fortified tornado proof closets with three days worth of supplies,
to complete underground bunkers designed for long term sustainability.


Here in rural Maine I have seen quite a few "Get Away Homes" go up after
"9-11" , for use if the owners ever have to escape the cities to the south
of us for whatever reasons..Boston , NY , Hartford , ect......Usually a
small 2 story home with attached garage on a long private road in the woods
with a whole house back up generator connected to 2 large propane tanks...In
the cellar they have 4-5 oil tanks for the boiler...A concrete block out
building for what I assumed is for gasoline and other flammables
storage.....They also have a woodstove..Large concrete vault in the cellar
for weapons , ammo and other important stuff needed if the SHTF...They also
double as vacation homes...Smart investment...

Jon Danniken wrote:
Stormin Mormon wrote:
I saw that on another list. Makes me wonder. If he'd shored up the
tunnels better, and not gone so close to the surface. Mighta been no
one noticed, ever.

My prediction is that the local government charges him a lot of money
to clear out all the stuff, and then back fill the holes he spent so
much time digging. We can't have anyone be different than the rest.

I like the one this guy (who was an engineer) made on the sly:

http://www.mypnw.us/STUFF/Interestin....nukehome.aspx

Jon


There are some folks who used the old missile silos as homes in the
Midwest. Example he http://www.silohome.com/

Evan wrote:


A search warrant is required for authorities (typically the police,
but could
apply to the fire marshal, building inspector or health inspector as
well)
when a home owner denies entry and refuses to grant permission for the
government agents to enter private property...

It is the ONLY legal way for the authorities to gain entrance to
private
property without some sort of exigent emergency situation existing...


There are other ways:
1. Permission of the owner or someone the authorities believe is acting as
the owner's agent.
2. If the property is abandoned, looks abandoned, or looks like it should be
abandoned (the last applies to most trailer houses).

Remember, the 4th Amendment prohibits only "unreasonable" searches. You can
be searched at airports, points of entry, "stop and frisk" (Terry stops),
and so on. Further, there is no LAW against an unlawful search; the only
sanction is that anything found can't be used against you.

Evan wrote:
On May 19, 2:02 pm, Oren wrote:
On Wed, 19 May 2010 07:24:32 -0500, "HeyBub"
wrote:

"The City of Austin Tuesday released photos of the web of tunnels a man dug
underneath his East Austin home. Under the yellow home are three stories of
tunnels... "
http://www.kvue.com/news/local/Insid...in-tunnel-home...
Bumper sticker:
"South Austin: We're all here because we're not all there"
It's not clear *why* search warrant was served or did this follow a
code enforcement inspection and then the police were called?


A search warrant is required for authorities (typically the police,
but could
apply to the fire marshal, building inspector or health inspector as
well)
when a home owner denies entry and refuses to grant permission for the
government agents to enter private property...

It is the ONLY legal way for the authorities to gain entrance to
private
property without some sort of exigent emergency situation existing...

~~ Evan

The spot next to the neighbor where it was caving in should be enough
for an inspection.

On Thu, 20 May 2010 19:33:05 -0400, Tony
wrote:

Evan wrote:
On May 19, 2:02 pm, Oren wrote:
On Wed, 19 May 2010 07:24:32 -0500, "HeyBub"
wrote:

"The City of Austin Tuesday released photos of the web of tunnels a man dug
underneath his East Austin home. Under the yellow home are three stories of
tunnels... "
http://www.kvue.com/news/local/Insid...in-tunnel-home...
Bumper sticker:
"South Austin: We're all here because we're not all there"
It's not clear *why* search warrant was served or did this follow a
code enforcement inspection and then the police were called?


A search warrant is required for authorities (typically the police,
but could
apply to the fire marshal, building inspector or health inspector as
well)
when a home owner denies entry and refuses to grant permission for the
government agents to enter private property...

It is the ONLY legal way for the authorities to gain entrance to
private
property without some sort of exigent emergency situation existing...

~~ Evan

The spot next to the neighbor where it was caving in should be enough
for an inspection.

It does resemble a gun turret.... "lets the weapon be aimed and fired
in many directions."

Jim Elbrecht wrote:
On Wed, 19 May 2010 18:30:25 -0700, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

-snip-
I like the one this guy (who was an engineer) made on the sly:

http://www.mypnw.us/STUFF/Interestin....nukehome.aspx


I'm in awe of these guys. I've been plugging away for 20 years just
lowering the floor in my basement 3feet.g

"The Subterranean Fortress literally goes down 4 stories deep. Because
of the depth and the thickness of the cement the computer room is
Electro Magnetic Pulse (EMP) wave proof."

How deep or how much concrete does one need to EMP-proof stuff?

Jim

It ain't the depth so much as the expanded-metal-mesh in the concrete.
Faraday cage, etc.

--
aem sends...

On May 20, 5:15*pm, "HeyBub" wrote:
Evan wrote:

A search warrant is required for authorities (typically the police,
but could
apply to the fire marshal, building inspector or health inspector as
well)
when a home owner denies entry and refuses to grant permission for the
government agents to enter private property...

It is the ONLY legal way for the authorities to gain entrance to
private
property without some sort of exigent emergency situation existing...

There are other ways:
1. Permission of the owner or someone the authorities believe is acting as
the owner's agent.
2. If the property is abandoned, looks abandoned, or looks like it should be
abandoned (the last applies to most trailer houses).

Remember, the 4th Amendment prohibits only "unreasonable" searches. You can
be searched at airports, points of entry, "stop and frisk" (Terry stops),
and so on. Further, there is no LAW against an unlawful search; the only
sanction is that anything found can't be used against you.


Did you actually read what I wrote ?

"when a home owner denies entry and refuses to grant permission for
the
government agents to enter private property" a code enforcement
officer,
building inspector, health inspector, firefighter or police officer
can not
FORCE their way into your home without an emergency situation
existing that effects the property in question... This is generally
allowable under either the "public safety" or "exigent circumstances"
exceptions to the search warrant requirement...

As far as police officers are concerned they do not need a warrant to
enter if they have probable cause a crime is being committed and that
evidence of said crime would be destroyed if they left to obtain a
warrant...
As soon as all occupants of the property have been secured, no further
searching is to be conducted until one of the officers explains the
probable cause to a judge or magistrate and authorization in the form
of a search warrant is granted...

Umm... I don't know where you are coming up with your information
but any official who needs to force entry to a premises (even if it is
abandoned or for some reason the owner can not be identified)
the public official MUST obtain a warrant to enter... Period...
No exceptions other than being given permission from an owner
or tenant whom has legal control and authority over the property
-- and the building department knows exactly who the owner
is... After all you need to obtain a certificate of occupancy after
an inspection after the property is finished being built or when it
changes ownership after a sale...

The 4th Amendment only applies to your rights when a criminal
offense is being considered... Not a civil violation of building
code...
Entirely different rules apply... The public official must ask the
homeowner for permission to enter, if it is refused then the official
must describe whatever violation they believe to exist to a judge
or magistrate and obtain a search warrant to enter which is
enforced and served upon the property owner by the police
to assist the inspector in gaining entry to carry out their duties...

~~ Evan

On May 20, 7:33*pm, Tony wrote:
Evan wrote:
On May 19, 2:02 pm, Oren wrote:
On Wed, 19 May 2010 07:24:32 -0500, "HeyBub"
wrote:

"The City of Austin Tuesday released photos of the web of tunnels a man dug
underneath his East Austin home. Under the yellow home are three stories of
tunnels... "
http://www.kvue.com/news/local/Insid...in-tunnel-home....
Bumper sticker:
"South Austin: We're all here because we're not all there"
It's not clear *why* search warrant was served or did this follow a
code enforcement inspection and then the police were called?

A search warrant is required for authorities (typically the police,
but could
apply to the fire marshal, building inspector or health inspector as
well)
when a home owner denies entry and refuses to grant permission for the
government agents to enter private property...

It is the ONLY legal way for the authorities to gain entrance to
private
property without some sort of exigent emergency situation existing...

~~ Evan

The spot next to the neighbor where it was caving in should be enough
for an inspection.


Not without asking for and obtaining permission from the owner...
If the owner had refused, the visible holes in the ground from
various "plain view" locations would have been enough to
establish that the homeowner's rights to privacy inside their
home could be overruled because of the greater need for
the safety of the others living around them to investigate
the cause of the sinking ground around the structure...

~~ Evan

Evan wrote:
On May 20, 5:15 pm, "HeyBub" wrote:
Evan wrote:

A search warrant is required for authorities (typically the police,
but could
apply to the fire marshal, building inspector or health inspector as
well)
when a home owner denies entry and refuses to grant permission for the
government agents to enter private property...
It is the ONLY legal way for the authorities to gain entrance to
private
property without some sort of exigent emergency situation existing...
There are other ways:
1. Permission of the owner or someone the authorities believe is acting as
the owner's agent.
2. If the property is abandoned, looks abandoned, or looks like it should be
abandoned (the last applies to most trailer houses).

Remember, the 4th Amendment prohibits only "unreasonable" searches. You can
be searched at airports, points of entry, "stop and frisk" (Terry stops),
and so on. Further, there is no LAW against an unlawful search; the only
sanction is that anything found can't be used against you.


Did you actually read what I wrote ?

"when a home owner denies entry and refuses to grant permission for
the
government agents to enter private property" a code enforcement
officer,
building inspector, health inspector, firefighter or police officer
can not
FORCE their way into your home without an emergency situation
existing that effects the property in question... This is generally
allowable under either the "public safety" or "exigent circumstances"
exceptions to the search warrant requirement...

As far as police officers are concerned they do not need a warrant to
enter if they have probable cause a crime is being committed and that
evidence of said crime would be destroyed if they left to obtain a
warrant...
As soon as all occupants of the property have been secured, no further
searching is to be conducted until one of the officers explains the
probable cause to a judge or magistrate and authorization in the form
of a search warrant is granted...

Umm... I don't know where you are coming up with your information
but any official who needs to force entry to a premises (even if it is
abandoned or for some reason the owner can not be identified)
the public official MUST obtain a warrant to enter... Period...
No exceptions other than being given permission from an owner
or tenant whom has legal control and authority over the property
-- and the building department knows exactly who the owner
is... After all you need to obtain a certificate of occupancy after
an inspection after the property is finished being built or when it
changes ownership after a sale...

The 4th Amendment only applies to your rights when a criminal
offense is being considered... Not a civil violation of building
code...
Entirely different rules apply... The public official must ask the
homeowner for permission to enter, if it is refused then the official
must describe whatever violation they believe to exist to a judge
or magistrate and obtain a search warrant to enter which is
enforced and served upon the property owner by the police
to assist the inspector in gaining entry to carry out their duties...

~~ Evan

Oh, BS. If the neighbors report smoke, and the first truck sees smoke
coming out of the house, they WILL break the door open. Same if they
smell decomp and the neighbors complain, and nobody answers the door.
'Exigent circumstances' applies pretty much to ANY public health and
safety issue. If house is apparently abandoned, and they are searching
for a lost kid or hear screams, again, they WILL enter to look. What
they find may indeed get tossed from any followup criminal prosecution,
but under those circumstances, they won't really care.

--
aem sends...

On Fri, 21 May 2010 19:38:57 -0400, aemeijers wrote:

Evan wrote:
On May 20, 5:15 pm, "HeyBub" wrote:
Evan wrote:

A search warrant is required for authorities (typically the police,
but could
apply to the fire marshal, building inspector or health inspector as
well)
when a home owner denies entry and refuses to grant permission for the
government agents to enter private property...
It is the ONLY legal way for the authorities to gain entrance to
private
property without some sort of exigent emergency situation existing...
There are other ways:
1. Permission of the owner or someone the authorities believe is acting as
the owner's agent.
2. If the property is abandoned, looks abandoned, or looks like it should be
abandoned (the last applies to most trailer houses).

Remember, the 4th Amendment prohibits only "unreasonable" searches. You can
be searched at airports, points of entry, "stop and frisk" (Terry stops),
and so on. Further, there is no LAW against an unlawful search; the only
sanction is that anything found can't be used against you.


Did you actually read what I wrote ?

"when a home owner denies entry and refuses to grant permission for
the
government agents to enter private property" a code enforcement
officer,
building inspector, health inspector, firefighter or police officer
can not
FORCE their way into your home without an emergency situation
existing that effects the property in question... This is generally
allowable under either the "public safety" or "exigent circumstances"
exceptions to the search warrant requirement...

As far as police officers are concerned they do not need a warrant to
enter if they have probable cause a crime is being committed and that
evidence of said crime would be destroyed if they left to obtain a
warrant...
As soon as all occupants of the property have been secured, no further
searching is to be conducted until one of the officers explains the
probable cause to a judge or magistrate and authorization in the form
of a search warrant is granted...

Umm... I don't know where you are coming up with your information
but any official who needs to force entry to a premises (even if it is
abandoned or for some reason the owner can not be identified)
the public official MUST obtain a warrant to enter... Period...
No exceptions other than being given permission from an owner
or tenant whom has legal control and authority over the property
-- and the building department knows exactly who the owner
is... After all you need to obtain a certificate of occupancy after
an inspection after the property is finished being built or when it
changes ownership after a sale...

The 4th Amendment only applies to your rights when a criminal
offense is being considered... Not a civil violation of building
code...
Entirely different rules apply... The public official must ask the
homeowner for permission to enter, if it is refused then the official
must describe whatever violation they believe to exist to a judge
or magistrate and obtain a search warrant to enter which is
enforced and served upon the property owner by the police
to assist the inspector in gaining entry to carry out their duties...

~~ Evan

Oh, BS. If the neighbors report smoke, and the first truck sees smoke
coming out of the house, they WILL break the door open. Same if they
smell decomp and the neighbors complain, and nobody answers the door.
'Exigent circumstances' applies pretty much to ANY public health and
safety issue. If house is apparently abandoned, and they are searching
for a lost kid or hear screams, again, they WILL enter to look. What
they find may indeed get tossed from any followup criminal prosecution,
but under those circumstances, they won't really care.

Any evidence turned up in such an investigation probably won't get tossed,
either.