I had to replace my water heater today. The old one developed a leak
somewhere, don't know exactly but enough to make a 3-4 foot puddle every
day. Wouldn't have been so bad except the old one was installed with no
thought of ever replacing it, water and gas both plumbed with hard lines,
and you know the new unit never lines up to the existing pipes. Thanks be
for flex line!

What about efficency? The model I picked has an energy factor of 0.62,
almost the highest of any available locally (there's an 0.63, but with half
the warranty). The 0.62 makes it eligible for a $50 rebate from my gas
company. Nice. But on the rebate form I see that tankless heaters are
eligible with an energy factor of 0.82 or better. My tank-type water heater
doesn't look so good in comparison, but of course it cost a *lot* less than
a whole-house tankless.

So I'm in for about $450 less the rebate, plus a few sore muscles and a very
uncharitable attitude towards the previous installer. It'll be interesting
to watch my gas bills over the next year to see if there's a noticeable
difference.

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On Nov 14, 10:12�pm, wrote:
I had to replace my water heater today. �The old one developed a leak
somewhere, don't know exactly but enough to make a 3-4 foot puddle every
day. �Wouldn't have been so bad except the old one was installed with no
thought of ever replacing it, water and gas both plumbed with hard lines,
and you know the new unit never lines up to the existing pipes. �Thanks be
for flex line!

What about efficency? �The model I picked has an energy factor of 0.62,
almost the highest of any available locally (there's an 0.63, but with half
the warranty). �The 0.62 makes it eligible for a $50 rebate from my gas
company. �Nice. �But on the rebate form I see that tankless heaters are
eligible with an energy factor of 0.82 or better. �My tank-type water heater
doesn't look so good in comparison, but of course it cost a *lot* less than
a whole-house tankless.

So I'm in for about $450 less the rebate, plus a few sore muscles and a very
uncharitable attitude towards the previous installer. �It'll be interesting
to watch my gas bills over the next year to see if there's a noticeable
difference.


the tankless have lots of negatives. often no hot water at all in a
power falure, anemic temperature water, in freezing weather, a
noticeable water wasting delay between valve on and hot water arrives.

burner needs time to turn on and get hot.

often low flow needs, likea valve cracked open for shaving gets no hot
water at all

On Sun, 15 Nov 2009 03:12:37 GMT,
wrote:

I had to replace my water heater today. The old one developed a leak
somewhere, don't know exactly but enough to make a 3-4 foot puddle every
day.

Wide or deep?


So I'm in for about $450 less the rebate, plus a few sore muscles and a very
uncharitable attitude towards the previous installer.

Well, if you were a plumber, you'd have with you a piece of pipe and a
couple right angle couplings. I don't see how you can complain that
he put in hard pipe. That's what almost all plumbers use, right?

It'll be interesting
to watch my gas bills over the next year to see if there's a noticeable
difference.

On 2009-11-15, wrote:

the tankless have lots of negatives. often no hot water at all in a
power falure, anemic temperature water, in freezing weather, a
noticeable water wasting delay between valve on and hot water arrives.

Anemic water temperature is a problem with design, not with the
product.

Wayne

"Wayne Whitney" wrote in message
...
On 2009-11-15, wrote:

the tankless have lots of negatives. often no hot water at all in a
power falure, anemic temperature water, in freezing weather, a
noticeable water wasting delay between valve on and hot water arrives.

Anemic water temperature is a problem with design, not with the
product.

Wayne

So it can be a poor design and yet be a good product? Or do you mean too
low a capacity specified?

On Nov 15, 2:05�pm, "Ed Pawlowski" wrote:
"Wayne Whitney" wrote in message

...

On 2009-11-15, wrote:

the tankless have lots of negatives. often no hot water at all in a
power falure, anemic temperature water, in freezing weather, a
noticeable water wasting delay between valve on and hot water arrives.

Anemic water temperature is a problem with design, not with the
product.

Wayne

So it can be a poor design and yet be a good product? � �Or do you mean too
low a capacity specified?

if the owner lives where very cold weather occurs...........

tankless might be fine in summer but totally unusable by late winter
when lowest incoming water temps occur.

some tankless manufacturers recommend putting 2 tankless in series for
such situations

On 2009-11-15, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

"Wayne Whitney" wrote in message

Anemic water temperature is a problem with design, not with the
product.

So it can be a poor design and yet be a good product? Or do you
mean too low a capacity specified?

Sorry, I don't mean product design, I mean system design. It's the
equivalent of putting in a 40 gallon tank heater for a family of eight
and then running out of hot water.

Cheers, Wayne

On 2009-11-15, wrote:

if the owner lives where very cold weather occurs...........

Then you have to design appropriately. 35 degree F incoming water,
120 degree desired water, determine the design flow required, pick the
right size tankless heater. All I'm saying is that if your tankless
system doesn't give enough hot water, it was a sizing error, not a
problem with the product category.

Cheers, Wayne

wrote:
On Nov 15, 2:05?pm, "Ed Pawlowski" wrote:
"Wayne Whitney" wrote in message

...

On 2009-11-15, wrote:

the tankless have lots of negatives. often no hot water at all in a
power falure, anemic temperature water, in freezing weather, a
noticeable water wasting delay between valve on and hot water
arrives.

Anemic water temperature is a problem with design, not with the
product.

Wayne

So it can be a poor design and yet be a good product? ? ?Or do you
mean too low a capacity specified?

if the owner lives where very cold weather occurs...........

tankless might be fine in summer but totally unusable by late winter
when lowest incoming water temps occur.

some tankless manufacturers recommend putting 2 tankless in series for
such situations

If that's how they specify using their products, I wouldn't give them much
credence.

On Nov 15, 2:44*pm, Wayne Whitney wrote:
On 2009-11-15, wrote:

if the owner lives where very cold weather occurs...........

Then you have to design appropriately. *35 degree F incoming water,
120 degree desired water, determine the design flow required, pick the
right size tankless heater. *All I'm saying is that if your tankless
system doesn't give enough hot water, it was a sizing error, not a
problem with the product category.

Cheers, Wayne

My calculations sez dont buy tankless.

Jimmie