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Jim2009

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On Thu, 22 Jan 2009 16:45:38 -0600, "Jim2009"
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On Wed, 21 Jan 2009 22:58:45 -0600, "Jim2009"
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"bud--" wrote in message
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Jim2009 wrote:
"Jeff Wisnia" wrote in message
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On Jan 20, 1:20 am, "Jim2009" wrote:

Dryer Box; I took apart the fuse holders and cleaned all contact
points
(including the fuses) with emery cloth and then with water. One
screw
assembles each fuse holder locking the holder (threads) and the
wire
connection bar in place.

I found a corroded connection on one gate/post (when you flip the
level on
the box). It was on the heater side. It was not to bad, looked
like
a bit
of the copper in the gate had transferred to the post which is
more
like
silver. I also squeezed the gate prongs together to tighten the
fit.

I found a major problem inside the outlet box after removing the
cover, one
side of one of the female prongs was broken. The male side prong
(cord
side) had some heat damage. I cleaned up the prongs on the cord.
Replaced
the dryer outlet with a new one. Hooked everything back up, ran
the
dryer
on high heat without clothes for 30 mins, check the fuses - both
were
just
slightly warm, nothing at all like before.

Washed a load, put them in the dryer, opened a beer. Checked the
fuses
about 20 mins into the load, heater side was hot again! (as it
was
in
the
beginning) But the motor side is now just slightly warm! I
removed
the
fuse from the heater side and found some small arc points on the
fuse
tip
and the screw head it contacts. I tightened the screw a bit, took
the
30A
fuse from the motor side and stuck it in the heater side, put a
new
15A in
the motor side. (I'm out of 30's, will get new ones tomorrow). I
ran
the
dryer for another 10 mins, checked fuses - both just slightly
warm.
(Maybe
it was not long enough for it to get hot, will run longer
tomorrow.)

If the load on the 15A fuse was 21A (from measurements below) the fuse
should blow. Time depends on type of fuse. For a 15A SquareD breaker
the
trip time would be 25-125 seconds. If you actually had 21A through a
15A
fuse the holder could be shorted from the center contact to the screw
shell. Unscrewing the fuse should kill the heat or the whole dryer
(depending on which).

I justed pulled the fuse and checked the socket with an ohms meter, no
short. I did another AIR cycle test and discovered I been telling you
wrong
I got my wires (sides) switched! Doh..Doh..!#%#!#$#@ So when I put the
15A
fuse in ...in was in the heater only side and not the motor/heater side.
I
know I ran it on the heat cycle, but I must have ran it at the end of
the
cycle, cool-down portion so little or no heat.

I may tighten the screw inside the fuse holder a bit more, I
didn't
want to
over do it.

Anyone have an idea how many Amps each side (heater/motor) should
draw? I
think I need to replace the box, but I would like to make sure the
dryer is
not the problem.

I'm not an expert in dryers, but I don't think there is one side
for
the heater and one side for the motor. I would expect the heater
current flows through both legs, providing the heater with 240V.
The
motor could be 120 and if so, would flow through one leg.

If it were me, I'd replace that box with a breaker as suggested. I
would not trust it, regardless of what else you find. And while I
was
at it, since the main fuse panel is apparently located in a similar
environment and by all indications is likely even older, I'd get
that
replaced by a new breaker panel too.

I agree with that, I've never seen a normal sized electric dryer
here
in
the US of A which didn't have the heaters powered with 240 volts
using
both legs of the feed circuit.

That said, I'm a little suprised that the 15 amp fuse the OP said he
put
in "the motor side" didn't blow.

At this point I'll allign with the folks who have told you to junk
that
Dryer Fuse Box and install a breaker box.

For several years I had ongoing problems with a fused disconnect
switch
supplying 240 volts to the supplementary resistance heaters in one
of
our home's heat pump air handlers. The switch contacts would
oxidize,
start heating up and raise the temperature of the end cap of its
adjacent cartridge fuse to the point where the fuse link would melt
or
sometimes the solder jointing the fuse link to the end cap melted
and
disconnected it.

That fused disconnect and air handler are in our attic, which is
definitely not a "moisture laden" area.

Cleaning and "tightening" the switch contacts would only solve the
problem for a few winter months before it recurred.

I gave up and replaced the entire fused disconnect with an identical
one
and a couple of years later the same damn thing started happpening.

I (think) I finally put the problem to bed by replacing that fused
disconnect with an unfused "pull out" disconnect about 5 years ago.
There was no need for fuses there anyway, because the line feeding
that
disconnect is protected by breakers at its feed end, the disconnect
is
just a code required safety feature to protect service techs.

Jeff
--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)
The speed of light is 1.8*10^12 furlongs per fortnight.

Well, I got a new Clamp Amp Meter, at Home Depot $50. Harbor Freight
was
out of the cheap ones even after I called to confirm their stock.

I tightened the screws (the screw under the head of each fuse) in the
fuse holders and installed two new 30A fuses. I believe these screws
came loose from the hot and cold cycles. It's a ground level room
that's
not heated. I did two loads tonight and they never got hot, just a
very
slight temp increase.

If they stay cool you might have fixed it (or as noted above).

The name plate reads "Motor 4 Amps - Heater and Accessories 23 Amps".

I tested both lines, before and after the fuse, and at the dryer
outlet
and found no difference per side.

-Cold start Dryer running on AIR cycle, the Motor side tested at =
21.73A, the Other side (I call it the heater side) tested at = 3.71A.

Yeah the above statement does not make sense, will retest it. I had it
running on a Heat Cycle for about 20 seconds then I flipped it to the
Air
only cycle and took readings, maybe the heat stayed on for a few seconds
or
more likely I read my notes wrong?

Don't know as how those make sense. If the heater ran on 120V it would
draw a lot less than 21A. Presumably the heater is not running on "air
cycle". If the meter sets the range automatically you may be reading
the
decimal point wrong, like 21 mA. 3.71A is reasonable for the motor.

Yeah, the heater uses both sides. Plus, I had my sides switched in my
notes, so on the Air cycle the motor side = 3.71A, the heater only side
is
0, (I just re-tested it). When I run a Heat Cycle the motor/heater side
increases from 3.71 to 23.6 +-.3, and the other heater only side
increases
from 0 to 21.5 +-.3.

-Dryer warm running on low/med/or high heat. Motor side = 21.5 +-.3,
the
Other side was slightly higher = 23.6 +-.3. I took several readings
over
a 40-50 min period, all about the same per side.

Heater appears on both fuses and is 21.5A approx. compared to the
nameplate of 23A

Motor appears on only one wire (should be "other side")and is 23.6 -
21.5
= 2.1A approx. compared to the nameplate of 4A. Should increase with
more
load in the dryer, or wet load.

Umm, I gave you bad info, so that's not true. The motor is 3.71A, the
heater on the motor side is approx 20A (23.6 - 3.71 = 19.89), and the
other
side (heater only side) is approx 21.5A.

Thank you for your time,
Jim

You don't understand how that thing is wired. You have 3 wires. The
heater connects from the red to the black. That is from fuse 1 to fuse
2. and is nominaly 240 volt.
The heater does not know the white wire even exists - so whatever the
heater draws on the one fuse, it draws EXACTLY the same on the other
fuse. The motor and the timer motor run on nominally 120 volts , which
is from one fuse to the neutral.

I'm just saying what the meter reads, no heat 3.71A on one leg, with heat
the same leg increases about 20A, and the other from 0 to about 21.5A. I
don't know why they are different but it's plain to see that there are.

I think you still have a connection problem somewhere and you are
still making heat somewhere other than at the element.

Hmm, OK, I will keep that in mind. Maybe after the fuse box is replaced the
increase with heat will be equal on both legs.

Cheers,
Jim

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