HeyBub wrote:
The Daring Dufas wrote:
It was Republicans who freed the slaves. Something Negro Americans
refuse to believe. The Klan members were Democrats, another simple
fact that Negro Americans have forgotten. The Democrats have pulled
wool over the eyes of my darker skinned brethren and it makes me sad
for them because the Democrats keep them enslaved. They just use a
different approach. BTW, I'm not a Republican and I'm certainly not
a Democrat.


Quick quiz: Roughly, what percentage of the population of London is
African-American?

=
=
=
=
=
=
=
=
=
=

Roughly zero. Blacks in London would be properly called "African-Anglos."
This shows how we've adapted to obfuscation.


Except that many of them come from the Caribbean...

--
BikeFan

HeyBub wrote:
The Daring Dufas wrote:
It was Republicans who freed the slaves. Something Negro Americans
refuse to believe. The Klan members were Democrats, another simple
fact that Negro Americans have forgotten. The Democrats have pulled
wool over the eyes of my darker skinned brethren and it makes me sad
for them because the Democrats keep them enslaved. They just use a
different approach. BTW, I'm not a Republican and I'm certainly not
a Democrat.


Quick quiz: Roughly, what percentage of the population of London is
African-American?

=
=
=
=
=
=
=
=
=
=

Roughly zero. Blacks in London would be properly called "African-Anglos."
This shows how we've adapted to obfuscation.


Believe it or not we have a lot of Africans here
in Birmingham, AL. These wonderful folks are "real"
Africans from one or more of the 53 countries that
make up Africa. There are a lot of people from
Kenya, Ethiopia, Nigeria, Tanzania, Zimbabwe, Somalia
and South Africa that I know or have met and talked
with about their home countries. Negro Americans have
no clue about Africa. My African friends tell me that
a Black American wouldn't last 5 minutes on the streets
of some of their cities much less the bush. The funniest
thing I have ever heard, is some politically correct
moron calling one of my real African friends an "African
American African". That had me laughing so hard I could
barely catch my breath.

TDD

On Oct 20, 7:15*am, "HeyBub" wrote:
CJT wrote:

So she DIDN'T **** over her brother-in-law?

Apparently she tried, and with enough vigor to cause the resignation
of a dedicated civil servant. *That should be enough to call her
judgment and ethics into question.

Hmm. Inasmuch as the Alaska Director of Public Safety serves at the pleasure
of the governor (most appointments are 'at will' employment), I see the
double-standard again in play.

Clinton fired all twelve U.S. Attorneys and, after some grousing, got away
with it. Bush fired a similar wad of U.S. Attorneys and is being
investigated by several congressional committees.

Point is, when a Democrat fires someone who serves at the pleasure of the
chief executive, the prerogatives of the chief's office are recognized and
accepted. When a Republican does pretty much the same, the Republican is
vilified.

The Republicans, however, didn't just let them go; they stated that
they were let go for performance-related reasons, hence the
investigations.


Being a Republican is sorta like being a Negro. We have to work twice as
hard and be twice as good to compete with the other party.

The current administration hasn't even accomplished "as good" or even
"competent" much less "twice as good."

Of course the next generation of Republicans, if there even will be
one, will have to work very hard to repair their damaged image.

nate

In ,
Al. E. Gator Sr. Gator for Prez.comspewed forth:
"ChairMan" wrote in message
.com...
In ,
Al. E. Gator Sr. Gator for Prez.comspewed forth:
"Kurt Ullman" wrote in message
...
In article ,
GoBama wrote:


I don't think they have rednecks in Alaska, do they?

Who do you think works the pipeline??

sure isn't rednecks, they're too fat,stupid, and lazy to work,
rather sit home and whine
about their disability checks

you forgot plagiarize, too
perfect description of a democrat
only in that diseased hillbilly mind of yours

seems to me with a name like al e gator, you might be the redneck.
funny how didn't reply in the other NG about your plagiarizing or to the
fact that you're illiterate and were handed your ass in your hat.

"JCE" wrote in message
...
On 18 oct, 08:48, "Bob F" wrote:
wrote in message

...

Excuse me, but I'mnotrunning for president. And if I was, I would
expect it to be fair for anyone to investigate who my friends are,
what goes on in the church I attend, who helped launch me into
politics, etc.

The term "friends" is over used in everyday language, a friend is
somebody you have known a long time, had a lot to do with and
one likes. It is not a person whom you have had occasional contact
with.

Nor do I think it fair to place everyone one has had contact with
under a microscope. If a real friend has had a messy divorce, what
does
that have to do with a candidate. If one goes over to looking at
anything
and everything, hoping to find something which will grab the publics
attention and create guilt by association, that is slime ball
politics.

The fact that the media went all out onJoetheplumber, who had the
audacity to ask a simply question of Obama, while turning a realtively
blind eye toward William Ayers, is OK with you?

Joe was being used for political exploitation and willingly part of
that
game. He was in the 15 minutes of fame mode, that many dream
about being it. By now he may have had too much and with for
relief.

And no blind ey has been cast on Ayers. He was "played" as
much as the slime balls could. He has said virtually nothing.

Now shall we return to Birth Certificates and a father who is supposed
to be Arab, according to the slime balls.


I don't know who you are responding to, but it's not me.

On Oct 20, 7:15*am, "HeyBub" wrote:
CJT wrote:

So she DIDN'T **** over her brother-in-law?

Apparently she tried, and with enough vigor to cause the resignation
of a dedicated civil servant. *That should be enough to call her
judgment and ethics into question.

Hmm. Inasmuch as the Alaska Director of Public Safety serves at the pleasure
of the governor (most appointments are 'at will' employment), I see the
double-standard again in play.

Clinton fired all twelve U.S. Attorneys and, after some grousing, got away
with it. Bush fired a similar wad of U.S. Attorneys and is being
investigated by several congressional committees.

Point is, when a Democrat fires someone who serves at the pleasure of the
chief executive, the prerogatives of the chief's office are recognized and
accepted. When a Republican does pretty much the same, the Republican is
vilified.

Being a Republican is sorta like being a Negro. We have to work
twice as
hard and be twice as good to compete with the other party.

:^) Well, except for your not being black, or working, or being
good.
But as usual, your publicists did try to spin a campaign out of
nothing at all, and a very earnest effort it was, right up until their
engines stalled, and they crashed and burned in the sovereign nation
of Alaska.
Speaking of publicists, there was a whiny gop rumor which
insinuated, roughly, that "well, maybe somebody Obama might have
known, somewhere, might have done something, sometime, when Obama was
kid": And that effort earned this reply from a Democrat:
"So what?
Is that going to convince thinking people to vote for the fart
and the tart ?"

JCE wrote:

Now shall we return to Birth Certificates and a father who is supposed
to be Arab, according to the slime balls.

Nobody with any sense has claimed Obama's father was an Arab. His father was
a Muslim (there are Muslims that are not Arabs and vice-versa). Of course,
according to Islamic law, that makes Obama a Muslim (just like someone born
of a Jewish mother is Jewish).

Obama could, of course, renounce Islam and adopt Christianity. Doing so,
however, makes him an apostate and subject to an extreme sanction.

Florida wrote:
:^) Well, except for your not being black, or working, or being
good.
But as usual, your publicists did try to spin a campaign out of
nothing at all, and a very earnest effort it was, right up until their
engines stalled, and they crashed and burned in the sovereign nation
of Alaska.
Speaking of publicists, there was a whiny gop rumor which
insinuated, roughly, that "well, maybe somebody Obama might have
known, somewhere, might have done something, sometime, when Obama was
kid": And that effort earned this reply from a Democrat:
"So what?
Is that going to convince thinking people to vote for the fart
and the tart ?"

Especially when the other choice is the colored and the dullard.

HeyBub wrote:
JCE wrote:
Now shall we return to Birth Certificates and a father who is supposed
to be Arab, according to the slime balls.

Nobody with any sense has claimed Obama's father was an Arab. His father was
a Muslim (there are Muslims that are not Arabs and vice-versa). Of course,
according to Islamic law, that makes Obama a Muslim (just like someone born
of a Jewish mother is Jewish).

Obama could, of course, renounce Islam and adopt Christianity. Doing so,
however, makes him an apostate and subject to an extreme sanction.


You are talking the biggest load of horse manure. HE IS A CHRISTIAN.
Now either you know that and are bearing false witness or you are the
dumbest ignoramus for miles around.

Which is it BUB?

--
BikeFan
To the GOP, Neocons and Bush from Oliver Cromwell:
"You have been sat too long here for any good you have been doing.
Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go!."

jdoe wrote:

On Mon, 20 Oct 2008 15:28:36 -0400, BikeFan
wrote:


HeyBub wrote:

JCE wrote:

Now shall we return to Birth Certificates and a father who is supposed
to be Arab, according to the slime balls.

Nobody with any sense has claimed Obama's father was an Arab. His father was
a Muslim (there are Muslims that are not Arabs and vice-versa). Of course,
according to Islamic law, that makes Obama a Muslim (just like someone born
of a Jewish mother is Jewish).

Obama could, of course, renounce Islam and adopt Christianity. Doing so,
however, makes him an apostate and subject to an extreme sanction.



You are talking the biggest load of horse manure. HE IS A CHRISTIAN.


he is? when he was a kid he was a muslim, when did he get baptized?
just because he attended a christian church occasionally doesn't make
him a christian, like everything else in his past all you get is smoke
and mirrors, no real facts

A pox on you. How dare you criticize the messiah, that's not the
politically correct thing to do. ;-)

Boden
__________________________________________
Never argue with an idiot.
They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

jdoe wrote:
On Mon, 20 Oct 2008 15:28:36 -0400, BikeFan
wrote:

HeyBub wrote:
JCE wrote:
Now shall we return to Birth Certificates and a father who is
supposed to be Arab, according to the slime balls.

Nobody with any sense has claimed Obama's father was an Arab. His
father was a Muslim (there are Muslims that are not Arabs and
vice-versa). Of course, according to Islamic law, that makes Obama
a Muslim (just like someone born of a Jewish mother is Jewish).

Obama could, of course, renounce Islam and adopt Christianity.
Doing so, however, makes him an apostate and subject to an extreme
sanction.


You are talking the biggest load of horse manure. HE IS A CHRISTIAN.

he is? when he was a kid he was a muslim, when did he get baptized?

You dont have to be baptised to become a christian. Thats only how some of the sects do it.

just because he attended a christian church occasionally doesn't make him a christian,

Just because you claim he's not a christian doesnt mean that he isnt one.

A christian is someone who is stupid enough to believe that that fool that was stupid
enough to get nailed up by the romans is the son of some damned god or other.

like everything else in his past all you get is smoke and mirrors, no real facts

You wouldnt know what a real fact was if one bit you on your lard arse.

BikeFan wrote:

Nobody with any sense has claimed Obama's father was an Arab. His
father was a Muslim (there are Muslims that are not Arabs and
vice-versa). Of course, according to Islamic law, that makes Obama a
Muslim (just like someone born of a Jewish mother is Jewish).

Obama could, of course, renounce Islam and adopt Christianity. Doing
so, however, makes him an apostate and subject to an extreme
sanction.


You are talking the biggest load of horse manure. HE IS A CHRISTIAN.
Now either you know that and are bearing false witness or you are the
dumbest ignoramus for miles around.

Which is it BUB?

Neither. I'm not disputing that Obama is a Christian. I'm sure he is!

Under Islamic law, "Any child of Muslim parents is considered a Muslim..."
And any Muslim who denounces Islam and harkens to another faith is
considered a heretic and an apostate.

Now someone born of a Jewish mother is Jewish even if they convert to (say)
Christianity. That is, one can be a Christian and a Jew. This is not the
case with Islam.

One does not inherit the faith with Christianity, as he does with Judaism or
Islam.

Obama has said that Reverend Wright "brought him to Christ twenty years
ago." The natural question is what Obama considered himself before then. For
over a billion people, Obama, having been born of a Muslim father, was
considered a Muslim.

jdoe wrote:
On Mon, 20 Oct 2008 15:28:36 -0400, BikeFan
wrote:

HeyBub wrote:
JCE wrote:
Now shall we return to Birth Certificates and a father who is supposed
to be Arab, according to the slime balls.
Nobody with any sense has claimed Obama's father was an Arab. His father was
a Muslim (there are Muslims that are not Arabs and vice-versa). Of course,
according to Islamic law, that makes Obama a Muslim (just like someone born
of a Jewish mother is Jewish).

Obama could, of course, renounce Islam and adopt Christianity. Doing so,
however, makes him an apostate and subject to an extreme sanction.


You are talking the biggest load of horse manure. HE IS A CHRISTIAN.

he is? when he was a kid he was a muslim, when did he get baptized?
just because he attended a christian church occasionally doesn't make
him a christian, like everything else in his past all you get is smoke
and mirrors, no real facts
__________________________________________
Never argue with an idiot.
They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Who freakin' cares? GWB is a card-carrying "Christian" and if they're
all like that I say let's try a Muslim, it couldn't get much worse.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

On Oct 20, 12:35*pm, N8N wrote:
On Oct 20, 7:15*am, "HeyBub" wrote:





CJT wrote:

So she DIDN'T **** over her brother-in-law?

Apparently she tried, and with enough vigor to cause the resignation
of a dedicated civil servant. *That should be enough to call her
judgment and ethics into question.

Hmm. Inasmuch as the Alaska Director of Public Safety serves at the pleasure
of the governor (most appointments are 'at will' employment), I see the
double-standard again in play.

Clinton fired all twelve U.S. Attorneys and, after some grousing, got away
with it. Bush fired a similar wad of U.S. Attorneys and is being
investigated by several congressional committees.

Point is, when a Democrat fires someone who serves at the pleasure of the
chief executive, the prerogatives of the chief's office are recognized and
accepted. When a Republican does pretty much the same, the Republican is
vilified.

The Republicans, however, didn't just let them go; they stated that
they were let go for performance-related reasons, hence the
investigations.



Being a Republican is sorta like being a Negro. We have to work twice as
hard and be twice as good to compete with the other party.

The current administration hasn't even accomplished "as good" or even
"competent" much less "twice as good."

Of course the next generation of Republicans, if there even will be
one, will have to work very hard to repair their damaged image.

nate- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Fear not, the Dumbcraps won't be outdone by the Republicans. They
will **** things up worse that the Republicans ever thought about
doing. They can't help themselves.

HeyBub wrote:
BikeFan wrote:
Nobody with any sense has claimed Obama's father was an Arab. His
father was a Muslim (there are Muslims that are not Arabs and
vice-versa). Of course, according to Islamic law, that makes Obama a
Muslim (just like someone born of a Jewish mother is Jewish).

Obama could, of course, renounce Islam and adopt Christianity. Doing
so, however, makes him an apostate and subject to an extreme
sanction.


You are talking the biggest load of horse manure. HE IS A CHRISTIAN.
Now either you know that and are bearing false witness or you are the
dumbest ignoramus for miles around.

Which is it BUB?

Neither. I'm not disputing that Obama is a Christian. I'm sure he is!

Under Islamic law, "Any child of Muslim parents is considered a Muslim..."
And any Muslim who denounces Islam and harkens to another faith is
considered a heretic and an apostate.

Now someone born of a Jewish mother is Jewish even if they convert to (say)
Christianity. That is, one can be a Christian and a Jew. This is not the
case with Islam.

One does not inherit the faith with Christianity, as he does with Judaism or
Islam.

Obama has said that Reverend Wright "brought him to Christ twenty years
ago." The natural question is what Obama considered himself before then. For
over a billion people, Obama, having been born of a Muslim father, was
considered a Muslim.

So you're trying to squirm out of the false witness accusation while
still being one.

--
BikeFan
To the GOP, Neocons and Bush from Oliver Cromwell:
"You have been sat too long here for any good you have been doing.
Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go!."

HeyBub wrote:
BikeFan wrote:

Nobody with any sense has claimed Obama's father was an Arab. His
father was a Muslim (there are Muslims that are not Arabs and
vice-versa). Of course, according to Islamic law, that makes Obama a
Muslim (just like someone born of a Jewish mother is Jewish).

Obama could, of course, renounce Islam and adopt Christianity. Doing
so, however, makes him an apostate and subject to an extreme
sanction.


You are talking the biggest load of horse manure. HE IS A CHRISTIAN.
Now either you know that and are bearing false witness or you are the
dumbest ignoramus for miles around.

Which is it BUB?

Neither. I'm not disputing that Obama is a Christian. I'm sure he is!

Under Islamic law, "Any child of Muslim parents is considered a
Muslim..." And any Muslim who denounces Islam and harkens to another
faith is considered a heretic and an apostate.

Now someone born of a Jewish mother is Jewish even if they convert to
(say) Christianity. That is, one can be a Christian and a Jew. This
is not the case with Islam.

One does not inherit the faith with Christianity, as he does with
Judaism or Islam.

Obama has said that Reverend Wright "brought him to Christ twenty
years ago." The natural question is what Obama considered himself
before then. For over a billion people, Obama, having been born of a
Muslim father, was considered a Muslim.

Those billion people are also stupid enough to buy the line that some angel whispered
in the ear of some goat ****er and he just wrote down what the angel told him too.

So what ?

BikeFan wrote:
HeyBub wrote:
BikeFan wrote:
Nobody with any sense has claimed Obama's father was an Arab. His
father was a Muslim (there are Muslims that are not Arabs and
vice-versa). Of course, according to Islamic law, that makes Obama
a Muslim (just like someone born of a Jewish mother is Jewish).

Obama could, of course, renounce Islam and adopt Christianity.
Doing so, however, makes him an apostate and subject to an extreme
sanction.


You are talking the biggest load of horse manure. HE IS A CHRISTIAN.
Now either you know that and are bearing false witness or you are
the dumbest ignoramus for miles around.

Which is it BUB?

Neither. I'm not disputing that Obama is a Christian. I'm sure he is!

Under Islamic law, "Any child of Muslim parents is considered a
Muslim..." And any Muslim who denounces Islam and harkens to another
faith is considered a heretic and an apostate.

Now someone born of a Jewish mother is Jewish even if they convert
to (say) Christianity. That is, one can be a Christian and a Jew.
This is not the case with Islam.

One does not inherit the faith with Christianity, as he does with
Judaism or Islam.

Obama has said that Reverend Wright "brought him to Christ twenty
years ago." The natural question is what Obama considered himself
before then. For over a billion people, Obama, having been born of a
Muslim father, was considered a Muslim.

So you're trying to squirm out of the false witness accusation while
still being one.

Uh, no, I don't think so. I just don't know to what you refer or what you
mean by "false witness." To the best of my knowledge:

1. Islamic law considers those born of a Muslim father to be Muslim.
2. Obama was born of a Muslim father.
3. Therefore, under Islamic law, Obama was once a Muslim.
4. Obama now says he is a Christian and he is the best judge of that
condition. I take him at his word.
5. Some (many? all?) Muslims, however, would consider him an apostate. I
think apostasy is dependent on the age of the individual who adheres to
another faith. If the renouncing of Islam takes place when the renouncing
individual has attained his majority, the penalty is considerably more
severe than the corresponding condition vis-a-vis Christianity.

If any of the above is false, I'd welcome being corrected.

HeyBub wrote:
BikeFan wrote:
HeyBub wrote:
BikeFan wrote:
Nobody with any sense has claimed Obama's father was an Arab. His
father was a Muslim (there are Muslims that are not Arabs and
vice-versa). Of course, according to Islamic law, that makes Obama
a Muslim (just like someone born of a Jewish mother is Jewish).

Obama could, of course, renounce Islam and adopt Christianity.
Doing so, however, makes him an apostate and subject to an extreme
sanction.


You are talking the biggest load of horse manure. HE IS A
CHRISTIAN. Now either you know that and are bearing false witness
or you are the dumbest ignoramus for miles around.

Which is it BUB?

Neither. I'm not disputing that Obama is a Christian. I'm sure he
is! Under Islamic law, "Any child of Muslim parents is considered a
Muslim..." And any Muslim who denounces Islam and harkens to another
faith is considered a heretic and an apostate.

Now someone born of a Jewish mother is Jewish even if they convert
to (say) Christianity. That is, one can be a Christian and a Jew.
This is not the case with Islam.

One does not inherit the faith with Christianity, as he does with
Judaism or Islam.

Obama has said that Reverend Wright "brought him to Christ twenty
years ago." The natural question is what Obama considered himself
before then. For over a billion people, Obama, having been born of a
Muslim father, was considered a Muslim.

So you're trying to squirm out of the false witness accusation while
still being one.

Uh, no, I don't think so. I just don't know to what you refer or what
you mean by "false witness." To the best of my knowledge:

1. Islamic law considers those born of a Muslim father to be Muslim.

Irrelevant to whether he actually is a muslim or not.

2. Obama was born of a Muslim father.
3. Therefore, under Islamic law, Obama was once a Muslim.

Irrelevant to whether he actually is a muslim or not.

4. Obama now says he is a Christian and he is the best judge of that condition. I take him at his word.

5. Some (many? all?) Muslims, however, would consider him an apostate.

Who cares ? That matters is that he claims to believe in that
fool that was stupid enough get nailed up by the romans.

I think apostasy is dependent on the age of the individual who adheres to another faith. If the renouncing of Islam
takes place when the renouncing individual has attained his majority, the penalty is considerably more severe than the
corresponding condition vis-a-vis Christianity.

Who cares ? That matters is that he claims to believe in that
fool that was stupid enough get nailed up by the romans.

If any of the above is false, I'd welcome being corrected.

None of them have any relevance what so ever to whether he is a muslim or not except 4.

Near Zero. Very few Americans of any kind live in London.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"HeyBub" wrote in message
m...

Quick quiz: Roughly, what percentage of the population of London is
African-American?

=
=
=
=
=
=
=
=
=
=

Roughly zero. Blacks in London would be properly called "African-Anglos."
This shows how we've adapted to obfuscation.

One of my Dad's friends is as white as can be. But, he grew up in Africa.
So, he calls himself African American, on the forms. He gets some funny
looks from the Personnel people.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...

of some of their cities much less the bush. The funniest
thing I have ever heard, is some politically correct
moron calling one of my real African friends an "African
American African". That had me laughing so hard I could
barely catch my breath.

TDD

As good, defined how? The GWB admin should thrill the pieces out of the
liberal democrats. The GWB folks increased federal spending, ran up the
deficit, removed a lot of liberties, gave the government all kinds of new
powers. What's for a liberal not to like?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"N8N" wrote in message
...


The current administration hasn't even accomplished "as good" or even
"competent" much less "twice as good."

nate

By the religion of pieces?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"HeyBub" wrote in message
...
His father was
a Muslim (there are Muslims that are not Arabs and vice-versa). Of course,
according to Islamic law, that makes Obama a Muslim (just like someone born
of a Jewish mother is Jewish).

Obama could, of course, renounce Islam and adopt Christianity. Doing so,
however, makes him an apostate and subject to an extreme sanction.

Hmm. Attending Jeremiah Wright's church for twenty years?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"BikeFan" wrote in message
...
HE IS A CHRISTIAN.
Now either you know that and are bearing false witness or you are the
dumbest ignoramus for miles around.

Stormin Mormon wrote:
As good, defined how? The GWB admin should thrill the pieces out of the
liberal democrats. The GWB folks increased federal spending, ran up the
deficit, removed a lot of liberties, gave the government all kinds of new
powers. What's for a liberal not to like?


You're implying that I'm a liberal. As it is, Obama says more of the
right things as far as this "conservative" is concerned WRT the actions
of the current administration.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Attending church makes you a Christian like shining a light on you makes
you glow in the dark.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"jdoe" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 20 Oct 2008 15:28:36 -0400, BikeFan

You are talking the biggest load of horse manure. HE IS A CHRISTIAN.

he is? when he was a kid he was a muslim, when did he get baptized?
just because he attended a christian church occasionally doesn't make
him a christian, like everything else in his past all you get is smoke
and mirrors, no real facts
__________________________________________
Never argue with an idiot.
They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Well, at least we're back to home repair. Hammer and nails.

Hey, the nail up guy did some other stuff, too.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Rod Speed" wrote in message
...

A christian is someone who is stupid enough to believe that that fool that
was stupid
enough to get nailed up by the romans is the son of some damned god or
other.

In article ,
"HeyBub" wrote:

Uh, no, I don't think so. I just don't know to what you refer or what you
mean by "false witness." To the best of my knowledge:

1. Islamic law considers those born of a Muslim father to be Muslim.
2. Obama was born of a Muslim father.
3. Therefore, under Islamic law, Obama was once a Muslim.
4. Obama now says he is a Christian and he is the best judge of that
condition. I take him at his word.
5. Some (many? all?) Muslims, however, would consider him an apostate. I
think apostasy is dependent on the age of the individual who adheres to
another faith. If the renouncing of Islam takes place when the renouncing
individual has attained his majority, the penalty is considerably more
severe than the corresponding condition vis-a-vis Christianity.

If any of the above is false, I'd welcome being corrected.

What's your tiresomely repetitive point? That Muslims shouldn't be
elected President? That Islam is bad? That Islam is a race, like
Judaism? What exactly are you trying not to say?
--
Everybody lies. George W. Bush and Dick Cheney just suck at it.

Ken Lay wrote:
In article ,
"HeyBub" wrote:

Uh, no, I don't think so. I just don't know to what you refer or
what you mean by "false witness." To the best of my knowledge:

1. Islamic law considers those born of a Muslim father to be Muslim.
2. Obama was born of a Muslim father.
3. Therefore, under Islamic law, Obama was once a Muslim.
4. Obama now says he is a Christian and he is the best judge of that
condition. I take him at his word.
5. Some (many? all?) Muslims, however, would consider him an
apostate. I think apostasy is dependent on the age of the individual
who adheres to another faith. If the renouncing of Islam takes place
when the renouncing individual has attained his majority, the
penalty is considerably more severe than the corresponding condition
vis-a-vis Christianity.

If any of the above is false, I'd welcome being corrected.

What's your tiresomely repetitive point? That Muslims shouldn't be
elected President? That Islam is bad? That Islam is a race, like
Judaism? What exactly are you trying not to say?

I don't care whether Obama is a Muslim.

He says he's not a Mohammaden, but Sharia says he is. To a billion people
(more or less) who follow Islamic Law, what Obama says conflicts with the
facts as they know them.

So, then, my point is this: Obama says he's a Christian. To a huge number of
people either he's not a Christian or, if he is, he is also an apostate. I
would think this would be worrisome to someone who says he cares deeply
about what the world thinks.

(I, myself, don't give a fig what Egyptians or the Finns think.)

In article , HeyBub wrote:
BikeFan wrote:
HeyBub wrote:
BikeFan wrote:
Nobody with any sense has claimed Obama's father was an Arab. His
father was a Muslim (there are Muslims that are not Arabs and
vice-versa). Of course, according to Islamic law, that makes Obama
a Muslim (just like someone born of a Jewish mother is Jewish).

Obama could, of course, renounce Islam and adopt Christianity.
Doing so, however, makes him an apostate and subject to an extreme
sanction.


You are talking the biggest load of horse manure. HE IS A CHRISTIAN.
Now either you know that and are bearing false witness or you are
the dumbest ignoramus for miles around.

Which is it BUB?

Neither. I'm not disputing that Obama is a Christian. I'm sure he is!

Under Islamic law, "Any child of Muslim parents is considered a
Muslim..." And any Muslim who denounces Islam and harkens to another
faith is considered a heretic and an apostate.

Now someone born of a Jewish mother is Jewish even if they convert
to (say) Christianity. That is, one can be a Christian and a Jew.
This is not the case with Islam.

One does not inherit the faith with Christianity, as he does with
Judaism or Islam.

Obama has said that Reverend Wright "brought him to Christ twenty
years ago." The natural question is what Obama considered himself
before then. For over a billion people, Obama, having been born of a
Muslim father, was considered a Muslim.

So you're trying to squirm out of the false witness accusation while
still being one.

Uh, no, I don't think so. I just don't know to what you refer or what you
mean by "false witness." To the best of my knowledge:

1. Islamic law considers those born of a Muslim father to be Muslim.
2. Obama was born of a Muslim father.
3. Therefore, under Islamic law, Obama was once a Muslim.
4. Obama now says he is a Christian and he is the best judge of that
condition. I take him at his word.
5. Some (many? all?) Muslims, however, would consider him an apostate. I
think apostasy is dependent on the age of the individual who adheres to
another faith. If the renouncing of Islam takes place when the renouncing
individual has attained his majority, the penalty is considerably more
severe than the corresponding condition vis-a-vis Christianity.

If any of the above is false, I'd welcome being corrected.

I consider "fundamentalism" of any religion to have "falseness" and to
be used for evils justified by one "holy book" or another...

Back when the first 5 "books" of the "Old Testament" were written,
people "officially became adults" at age of 13 years. Please keep in mind
the age of those being celebrated at Bar-Mitzvah and Bat-Mitzvah
ceremonies.

Nowadays, it is not too infrequent for "Bat Mitzvah" cemonies for young
women to be performed at 12 years of age.

Women do on average hit puberty a year or 2 before men do.

Also, with modern better knowledge of nutrition and modern better food
abundance, people have their bodies hitting puberty and adulthood at
earlier ages than before.
But with modern increased need for education and professional
development, along with this producing increased rate of disparity in
rate of achievement of emotional maturity from some individuals to others,
it is now common for people to find need (largely justified by 1st-world
experience in this area) to not get married until age well into the 20's -
when "horniness" of most women is approaching peak and horniness of most
men have "already peaked" (reverse of girls mostly "hitting puberty"
before boys do).

So we have a situation where "in order to be successful", people
nowadays experience a great need to be enduring formal education to an
age significantly past that at which people were "officially adults in
biblical times". That means "ideal" of maintaining virginity until an age
close to or past that where many people are experiencing
biologically-necessary urge to "break virginity" or "do it again".

And when various ones or others of our people are faster/slower in
achieving "emotional maturity", this matters more in modern times than in
biblical times. In modern times, men who have not been still advancving
their emotional maturity at age 30 or "low 30's" are ones who abandoned
that job before that job was done. I believe that is great basis for
USA's Constitution to require the President of USA to be at least 35 years
old.

- Don Klipstein )

Boden wrote in :

jdoe wrote:

On Mon, 20 Oct 2008 15:28:36 -0400, BikeFan
wrote:


HeyBub wrote:

JCE wrote:

Now shall we return to Birth Certificates and a father who is
supposed to be Arab, according to the slime balls.

Nobody with any sense has claimed Obama's father was an Arab. His
father was a Muslim (there are Muslims that are not Arabs and
vice-versa). Of course, according to Islamic law, that makes Obama a
Muslim (just like someone born of a Jewish mother is Jewish).

Obama could, of course, renounce Islam and adopt Christianity. Doing
so, however, makes him an apostate and subject to an extreme
sanction.



You are talking the biggest load of horse manure. HE IS A CHRISTIAN.

Actually,Obama himself says it was in Rev.Wright's church where he "became
a Christian".(in one of his books)That would be as an adult.
Obama was born to a Muslim,and according to Islamic experts,that makes him
a Muslim,Obama was educated as a Muslim in two Indonesian
schools(registered as a Muslim in both;no "error"),Obama said himself in
one of his books that he studied Islam and prayed in mosques.NY newspapers
have reported that Obama went to mosque with his stepfather in Indonesia.
All that makes Obama a Muslim.

Islamics all believe that once a Muslim,there's no leaving Islam,else you
are an apostate(murtadd).
And Islam calls for every devout Muslim to KILL apostates.


he is? when he was a kid he was a muslim, when did he get baptized?
just because he attended a christian church occasionally doesn't make
him a christian, like everything else in his past all you get is
smoke and mirrors, no real facts

A pox on you. How dare you criticize the messiah, that's not the
politically correct thing to do. ;-)

Boden
__________________________________________
Never argue with an idiot.
They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.


"Joe the Plumber" demonstrates how Obama will support the First Amendment;
Immediately,the DemocRATs launched into denigrating Joe,investigating his
background for ammo,they also failed to LISTEN to what Joe actually
asked;Joe did NOT claim to make $250K or more,he said he was considering
BUYING a business that made that amount.
Then the DemocRATs try to use that false premise as the basis for their
attacks on Joe.

question Obama and get investigated,attacked.
Just wait until he gets to be President and has the IRS and FBI to use on
people,like the Clintons did.
Heck,he's ALREADY tried to use Missouri officials and the Federal
prosecutors to suppress people saying things he didn't like.

Of course,the liberal MSM doesn't call him on any of that.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

Stormin Mormon wrote:
Hmm. Attending Jeremiah Wright's church for twenty years?


Surely your sig means "Learn more about Joseph Smith?

--
BikeFan
To the GOP, Neocons and Bush from Oliver Cromwell:
"You have been sat too long here for any good you have been doing.
Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go!."

In article ,
"HeyBub" wrote:

I don't care whether Obama is a Muslim.

He says he's not a Mohammaden, but Sharia says he is. To a billion people
(more or less) who follow Islamic Law, what Obama says conflicts with the
facts as they know them.

So, then, my point is this: Obama says he's a Christian. To a huge number of
people either he's not a Christian or, if he is, he is also an apostate. I
would think this would be worrisome to someone who says he cares deeply
about what the world thinks.

So who should define what he is? You? Sharia law? Vatican law?

Have you forgotten what country you live in?

Or is there now some kind of law (perhaps passed under the Bush
administration) that says Americans have to pick a stupid faith and stay
there for all our lives because of what others think?

I think Obama and McCain both care deeply about the perception of the
United States in the eyes of the world. I think most Americans do,
whatever their political bent. I also think most Americans don't give a
crap about what others think of their religion (and with so many
freakazoid religions in this country, that's probably a good thing).

So I still don't get your point in belaboring the whole issue.
--
Everybody lies. George W. Bush and Dick Cheney just suck at it.

HeyBub wrote:
Ken Lay wrote:
In article ,
"HeyBub" wrote:

Uh, no, I don't think so. I just don't know to what you refer or
what you mean by "false witness." To the best of my knowledge:

1. Islamic law considers those born of a Muslim father to be Muslim.
2. Obama was born of a Muslim father.
3. Therefore, under Islamic law, Obama was once a Muslim.
4. Obama now says he is a Christian and he is the best judge of that
condition. I take him at his word.
5. Some (many? all?) Muslims, however, would consider him an
apostate. I think apostasy is dependent on the age of the individual
who adheres to another faith. If the renouncing of Islam takes place
when the renouncing individual has attained his majority, the
penalty is considerably more severe than the corresponding condition
vis-a-vis Christianity.

If any of the above is false, I'd welcome being corrected.
What's your tiresomely repetitive point? That Muslims shouldn't be
elected President? That Islam is bad? That Islam is a race, like
Judaism? What exactly are you trying not to say?

I don't care whether Obama is a Muslim.

He says he's not a Mohammaden, but Sharia says he is. To a billion people
(more or less) who follow Islamic Law, what Obama says conflicts with the
facts as they know them.

You seem to be an expert on Islam. What religion are you that you are so
obsessed with it?


So, then, my point is this: Obama says he's a Christian. To a huge number of
people either he's not a Christian or, if he is, he is also an apostate. I
would think this would be worrisome to someone who says he cares deeply
about what the world thinks.

(I, myself, don't give a fig what Egyptians or the Finns think.)





--
BikeFan
To the GOP, Neocons and Bush from Oliver Cromwell:
"You have been sat too long here for any good you have been doing.
Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go!."

So the Liberal Democrats want us to elect a man whose loyalty is to the
Religion of Pieces?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Rod Speed" wrote in message
...
Obama has said that Reverend Wright "brought him to Christ twenty
years ago." The natural question is what Obama considered himself
before then. For over a billion people, Obama, having been born of a
Muslim father, was considered a Muslim.

Those billion people are also stupid enough to buy the line that some angel
whispered
in the ear of some goat ****er and he just wrote down what the angel told
him too.

So what ?

I have a hard time thinking that Oh Bomb Us would say anything that a
conservative could agree.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Nate Nagel" wrote in message
...

You're implying that I'm a liberal. As it is, Obama says more of the
right things as far as this "conservative" is concerned WRT the actions
of the current administration.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Go look at the web page, see how much JS information, and how much about
Jesus. You may be surprised.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"BikeFan" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
Hmm. Attending Jeremiah Wright's church for twenty years?


Surely your sig means "Learn more about Joseph Smith?

--
BikeFan
To the GOP, Neocons and Bush from Oliver Cromwell:
"You have been sat too long here for any good you have been doing.
Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go!."

Ken Lay wrote:
In article ,
"HeyBub" wrote:

I don't care whether Obama is a Muslim.

He says he's not a Mohammaden, but Sharia says he is. To a billion
people (more or less) who follow Islamic Law, what Obama says
conflicts with the facts as they know them.

So, then, my point is this: Obama says he's a Christian. To a huge
number of people either he's not a Christian or, if he is, he is
also an apostate. I would think this would be worrisome to someone
who says he cares deeply about what the world thinks.

So who should define what he is? You? Sharia law? Vatican law?

It's difficult. In religious law, the religion determines. One can claim
this and that to their heart's content but if the claim conflicts with
religious law, the adherents to the religion will not accept the claim.
Under Catholic doctrine, a civil divorce is not a divorce in the eyes of the
Vatican. Under Jewish law, a woman cannot divorce her husband.

Now under Catholic rules, one who abandons the faith can be excommunicated.
Under Jewish law, one who adopts another religion is still Jewish. Under
Sharia, a person who strays from the one true path is a target for any of
the true believers. (I think they get two extra virgins for dispatching the
heretic - not sure whether these virgins are male or female.)


Have you forgotten what country you live in?

No. But many countries are not as enlightened as we. Leaving aside the
50-odd Muslim-majority countries, you can't hold office in Spain unless you
are Catholic; you can't even VOTE in Finland unless you are a Lutheran. You
may not be a peer in England (or even a member of the Royal Society) unless
you harken to the Anglican Communion. Again, religion and religious law play
important parts in many countries.


Or is there now some kind of law (perhaps passed under the Bush
administration) that says Americans have to pick a stupid faith and
stay there for all our lives because of what others think?

There are many laws that mandate particular religious faiths and practices.
We don't have them here, true, but they are common in the rest of the world.


I think Obama and McCain both care deeply about the perception of the
United States in the eyes of the world. I think most Americans do,
whatever their political bent. I also think most Americans don't give
a crap about what others think of their religion (and with so many
freakazoid religions in this country, that's probably a good thing).

If you think that how the rest of the world views us, it would seem
incumbent upon you to understand how religion drives much of the planet.


So I still don't get your point in belaboring the whole issue.

Educating the benighted.

Stormin Mormon wrote:
Go look at the web page, see how much JS information, and how much about
Jesus. You may be surprised.

Repent before its too late!


--
BikeFan
To the GOP, Neocons and Bush from Oliver Cromwell:
"You have been sat too long here for any good you have been doing.
Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go!."

On Oct 21, 9:28*am, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:
So the Liberal Democrats want us to elect a man whose loyalty is to the
Religion of Pieces?

There's no evidence that Obama's loyalty is to Islam. Otherwise, why
would he have
converted to Christianity? Your argument makes no sense.

I was baptized in the Lutheran church, but I am now an atheist. Would
you consider
that my loyalty is to Christ?

Cindy Hamilton

"BikeFan" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
Hmm. Attending Jeremiah Wright's church for twenty years?


Surely your sig means "Learn more about Joseph Smith?

--
BikeFan

There's a huge difference. Mohammed was just another sand jockey, who never
got his endowments, secret temple passwords, or plastic panties. Joseph
Smith was a true prophet of God sent to save mankind. Sheesh, at least
understand the Mormon's point.

HTH

Steve ;-)