Damn plumbing. Never did fancy it.

Replacing 3 handle faucet setup in a shower. Actually got a specific kit
made aware of in this NG.. All new handles, flanges, stems, seats, the
works for $35 called a remodel kit. Got stems and seats out of both hot
and cold OK. The diverter won't budge. Got pretty good wrench on it. Did
some muscle, some tapping (praying sweat joints behind wall don't give),
soaked with product like Liquid Wrench for several hrs. NG.

Only thing I can think of now is heating it. keeping in mind to open the
valve so that the seat washer doesn't melt down into the supply pipe and
that there's a plastic washer on the diverter.

Stem is long which limits some options.

I scribbled a blue arrow on this pic. That's where I'm thinking of
heating it.

http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=r0t4aw&s=3

Looking close, it looks like there's some goop where the stem base meets
the wall pipe where it should separate. If it's the same goop that looks
like is in the bonnet, that's soft goop. The bonnet does come off easily.

Ideas & Suggestions?

Red Green wrote:

Damn plumbing. Never did fancy it.

Replacing 3 handle faucet setup in a shower. Actually got a specific kit
made aware of in this NG.. All new handles, flanges, stems, seats, the
works for $35 called a remodel kit. Got stems and seats out of both hot
and cold OK. The diverter won't budge. Got pretty good wrench on it. Did
some muscle, some tapping (praying sweat joints behind wall don't give),
soaked with product like Liquid Wrench for several hrs. NG.

Only thing I can think of now is heating it. keeping in mind to open the
valve so that the seat washer doesn't melt down into the supply pipe and
that there's a plastic washer on the diverter.

Stem is long which limits some options.

I scribbled a blue arrow on this pic. That's where I'm thinking of
heating it.

http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=r0t4aw&s=3

Looking close, it looks like there's some goop where the stem base meets
the wall pipe where it should separate. If it's the same goop that looks
like is in the bonnet, that's soft goop. The bonnet does come off easily.

Ideas & Suggestions?


You're planning to heat that with an open flame, as in "torch"?
Uh Uh.

I sure wouldn't try it.

If it is 100% essential that the diverter stem come out,
put the longest wrench you can find on the thing and pray.

Worst that can happen then is that you'll have to open the
wall to replace it.
\
Jim

Speedy Jim wrote in
:

Red Green wrote:

Damn plumbing. Never did fancy it.

Replacing 3 handle faucet setup in a shower. Actually got a specific
kit made aware of in this NG.. All new handles, flanges, stems,
seats, the works for $35 called a remodel kit. Got stems and seats
out of both hot and cold OK. The diverter won't budge. Got pretty
good wrench on it. Did some muscle, some tapping (praying sweat
joints behind wall don't give), soaked with product like Liquid
Wrench for several hrs. NG.

Only thing I can think of now is heating it. keeping in mind to open
the valve so that the seat washer doesn't melt down into the supply
pipe and that there's a plastic washer on the diverter.

Stem is long which limits some options.

I scribbled a blue arrow on this pic. That's where I'm thinking of
heating it.

http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=r0t4aw&s=3

Looking close, it looks like there's some goop where the stem base
meets the wall pipe where it should separate. If it's the same goop
that looks like is in the bonnet, that's soft goop. The bonnet does
come off easily.

Ideas & Suggestions?


You're planning to heat that with an open flame, as in "torch"?
Uh Uh.

I sure wouldn't try it.

If it is 100% essential that the diverter stem come out,
put the longest wrench you can find on the thing and pray.

Worst that can happen then is that you'll have to open the
wall to replace it.
\
Jim


Well Jim, plumbing is really not in my skill base. I get by fixing common
crap like toilets and sinks, can sweat, done some PVC Sched 40 pipe
setup/welding, etc.

With these limitations yea, that's why I'm asking here BEFOREHAND. It's
not like I'm gonna be putting an oxyacetylene torch to it. I'm just
thinking propane to heat it, wrench and some tapping. Not planning on
getting it cherry red, warp brass, melt sweat joints inside! Just some
heat to try and free up whatever is causing it to be frozen. What do you
think a plumber would do then? Maybe the answer is warn the customer it's
frozen and could require wall opening if things snap.

I'm curious to see any other replies.

Thanks,
Red...

Red Green wrote:

Speedy Jim wrote in
:


Red Green wrote:


Damn plumbing. Never did fancy it.

Replacing 3 handle faucet setup in a shower. Actually got a specific
kit made aware of in this NG.. All new handles, flanges, stems,
seats, the works for $35 called a remodel kit. Got stems and seats
out of both hot and cold OK. The diverter won't budge. Got pretty
good wrench on it. Did some muscle, some tapping (praying sweat
joints behind wall don't give), soaked with product like Liquid
Wrench for several hrs. NG.

Only thing I can think of now is heating it. keeping in mind to open
the valve so that the seat washer doesn't melt down into the supply
pipe and that there's a plastic washer on the diverter.

Stem is long which limits some options.

I scribbled a blue arrow on this pic. That's where I'm thinking of
heating it.

http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=r0t4aw&s=3

Looking close, it looks like there's some goop where the stem base
meets the wall pipe where it should separate. If it's the same goop
that looks like is in the bonnet, that's soft goop. The bonnet does
come off easily.

Ideas & Suggestions?


You're planning to heat that with an open flame, as in "torch"?
Uh Uh.

I sure wouldn't try it.

If it is 100% essential that the diverter stem come out,
put the longest wrench you can find on the thing and pray.

Worst that can happen then is that you'll have to open the
wall to replace it.
\
Jim



Well Jim, plumbing is really not in my skill base. I get by fixing common
crap like toilets and sinks, can sweat, done some PVC Sched 40 pipe
setup/welding, etc.

With these limitations yea, that's why I'm asking here BEFOREHAND. It's
not like I'm gonna be putting an oxyacetylene torch to it. I'm just
thinking propane to heat it, wrench and some tapping. Not planning on
getting it cherry red, warp brass, melt sweat joints inside! Just some
heat to try and free up whatever is causing it to be frozen. What do you
think a plumber would do then? Maybe the answer is warn the customer it's
frozen and could require wall opening if things snap.

I'm curious to see any other replies.

Thanks,
Red...



I wasn't being critical of your skills.
Just a cautionary.

I *like* using heat, just as you describe.
But I'm fearful of directing a flame into a
wall cavity.

If I _had_ to use flame here, I would open the
wall enough that I could bend a suitable metal
sheet around the valve body as a heat shield.
I would also use a household sprayer to mist
the cavity with water.

Still think I would use the big wrench first though G.

Jim

Speedy Jim wrote in
. net:

Red Green wrote:

Speedy Jim wrote in
:


Red Green wrote:


Damn plumbing. Never did fancy it.

Replacing 3 handle faucet setup in a shower. Actually got a specific
kit made aware of in this NG.. All new handles, flanges, stems,
seats, the works for $35 called a remodel kit. Got stems and seats
out of both hot and cold OK. The diverter won't budge. Got pretty
good wrench on it. Did some muscle, some tapping (praying sweat
joints behind wall don't give), soaked with product like Liquid
Wrench for several hrs. NG.

Only thing I can think of now is heating it. keeping in mind to open
the valve so that the seat washer doesn't melt down into the supply
pipe and that there's a plastic washer on the diverter.

Stem is long which limits some options.

I scribbled a blue arrow on this pic. That's where I'm thinking of
heating it.

http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=r0t4aw&s=3

Looking close, it looks like there's some goop where the stem base
meets the wall pipe where it should separate. If it's the same goop
that looks like is in the bonnet, that's soft goop. The bonnet does
come off easily.

Ideas & Suggestions?


You're planning to heat that with an open flame, as in "torch"?
Uh Uh.

I sure wouldn't try it.

If it is 100% essential that the diverter stem come out,
put the longest wrench you can find on the thing and pray.

Worst that can happen then is that you'll have to open the
wall to replace it.
\
Jim



Well Jim, plumbing is really not in my skill base. I get by fixing
common crap like toilets and sinks, can sweat, done some PVC Sched 40
pipe setup/welding, etc.

With these limitations yea, that's why I'm asking here BEFOREHAND.
It's not like I'm gonna be putting an oxyacetylene torch to it. I'm
just thinking propane to heat it, wrench and some tapping. Not
planning on getting it cherry red, warp brass, melt sweat joints
inside! Just some heat to try and free up whatever is causing it to
be frozen. What do you think a plumber would do then? Maybe the
answer is warn the customer it's frozen and could require wall
opening if things snap.

I'm curious to see any other replies.

Thanks,
Red...



I wasn't being critical of your skills.
Just a cautionary.

I *like* using heat, just as you describe.
But I'm fearful of directing a flame into a
wall cavity.

If I _had_ to use flame here, I would open the
wall enough that I could bend a suitable metal
sheet around the valve body as a heat shield.
I would also use a household sprayer to mist
the cavity with water.

Still think I would use the big wrench first though G.

Jim



I wasn't being critical of your skills

I was!

Weather it burns or breaks the wall will end up open:-) At least if it
breaks I can shut the water off. If it burns, then I'll probably wanna
break it fast. That skill I have.

Thanks again.

Red Green wrote in news:Xns9A74E479F15CBRedGreen@
216.168.3.70:

Speedy Jim wrote in
. net:

Red Green wrote:

Speedy Jim wrote in
:


Red Green wrote:


Damn plumbing. Never did fancy it.

Replacing 3 handle faucet setup in a shower. Actually got a specific
kit made aware of in this NG.. All new handles, flanges, stems,
seats, the works for $35 called a remodel kit. Got stems and seats
out of both hot and cold OK. The diverter won't budge. Got pretty
good wrench on it. Did some muscle, some tapping (praying sweat
joints behind wall don't give), soaked with product like Liquid
Wrench for several hrs. NG.

Only thing I can think of now is heating it. keeping in mind to open
the valve so that the seat washer doesn't melt down into the supply
pipe and that there's a plastic washer on the diverter.

Stem is long which limits some options.

I scribbled a blue arrow on this pic. That's where I'm thinking of
heating it.

http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=r0t4aw&s=3

Looking close, it looks like there's some goop where the stem base
meets the wall pipe where it should separate. If it's the same goop
that looks like is in the bonnet, that's soft goop. The bonnet does
come off easily.

Ideas & Suggestions?


You're planning to heat that with an open flame, as in "torch"?
Uh Uh.

I sure wouldn't try it.

If it is 100% essential that the diverter stem come out,
put the longest wrench you can find on the thing and pray.

Worst that can happen then is that you'll have to open the
wall to replace it.
\
Jim



Well Jim, plumbing is really not in my skill base. I get by fixing
common crap like toilets and sinks, can sweat, done some PVC Sched 40
pipe setup/welding, etc.

With these limitations yea, that's why I'm asking here BEFOREHAND.
It's not like I'm gonna be putting an oxyacetylene torch to it. I'm
just thinking propane to heat it, wrench and some tapping. Not
planning on getting it cherry red, warp brass, melt sweat joints
inside! Just some heat to try and free up whatever is causing it to
be frozen. What do you think a plumber would do then? Maybe the
answer is warn the customer it's frozen and could require wall
opening if things snap.

I'm curious to see any other replies.

Thanks,
Red...



I wasn't being critical of your skills.
Just a cautionary.

I *like* using heat, just as you describe.
But I'm fearful of directing a flame into a
wall cavity.

If I _had_ to use flame here, I would open the
wall enough that I could bend a suitable metal
sheet around the valve body as a heat shield.
I would also use a household sprayer to mist
the cavity with water.

Still think I would use the big wrench first though G.

Jim



I wasn't being critical of your skills

I was!

Weather it burns or breaks the wall will end up open:-) At least if it
breaks I can shut the water off. If it burns, then I'll probably wanna
break it fast. That skill I have.

Thanks again.



ok, WHEther it turns...

No sense being totally ignorant about the English language too.

Speedy Jim wrote in
. net:

Red Green wrote:

Speedy Jim wrote in
:


Red Green wrote:


Damn plumbing. Never did fancy it.

Replacing 3 handle faucet setup in a shower. Actually got a specific
kit made aware of in this NG.. All new handles, flanges, stems,
seats, the works for $35 called a remodel kit. Got stems and seats
out of both hot and cold OK. The diverter won't budge. Got pretty
good wrench on it. Did some muscle, some tapping (praying sweat
joints behind wall don't give), soaked with product like Liquid
Wrench for several hrs. NG.

Only thing I can think of now is heating it. keeping in mind to open
the valve so that the seat washer doesn't melt down into the supply
pipe and that there's a plastic washer on the diverter.

Stem is long which limits some options.

I scribbled a blue arrow on this pic. That's where I'm thinking of
heating it.

http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=r0t4aw&s=3

Looking close, it looks like there's some goop where the stem base
meets the wall pipe where it should separate. If it's the same goop
that looks like is in the bonnet, that's soft goop. The bonnet does
come off easily.

Ideas & Suggestions?


You're planning to heat that with an open flame, as in "torch"?
Uh Uh.

I sure wouldn't try it.

If it is 100% essential that the diverter stem come out,
put the longest wrench you can find on the thing and pray.

Worst that can happen then is that you'll have to open the
wall to replace it.
\
Jim



Well Jim, plumbing is really not in my skill base. I get by fixing
common crap like toilets and sinks, can sweat, done some PVC Sched 40
pipe setup/welding, etc.

With these limitations yea, that's why I'm asking here BEFOREHAND.
It's not like I'm gonna be putting an oxyacetylene torch to it. I'm
just thinking propane to heat it, wrench and some tapping. Not
planning on getting it cherry red, warp brass, melt sweat joints
inside! Just some heat to try and free up whatever is causing it to
be frozen. What do you think a plumber would do then? Maybe the
answer is warn the customer it's frozen and could require wall
opening if things snap.

I'm curious to see any other replies.

Thanks,
Red...



I wasn't being critical of your skills.
Just a cautionary.

I *like* using heat, just as you describe.
But I'm fearful of directing a flame into a
wall cavity.

If I _had_ to use flame here, I would open the
wall enough that I could bend a suitable metal
sheet around the valve body as a heat shield.
I would also use a household sprayer to mist
the cavity with water.

Still think I would use the big wrench first though G.

Jim


If it is 100% essential that the diverter stem come out,

In the end I left it. Not worth the risk since it works. What needed to
be changed was the H&C stems along with the flanges and handles. A shame
having the new one right in hand but I'm here typing and not trying to
fix broken stuff in the wall unable to shower (other shower needs fixin'
too).

At least I was able to take the bonnet and bonnet rubber sleeve that goes
under bonnet off of the new diverter and put it on the stuck stem. No
runs, no drips, no errors.

Only 123,475 more fish to fry. Some very big.

Thanks again,
Red...