Today I tried connecting some 70-LED light strings to DC (using a
single 1N4003 diode). Half the string would light. Changing the
polarity made the other half light. This also applies to additional
strings connected to the female connector at the end of the string.
This could make an interesting multi-string flasher, automatically
switching the polarity.

I have a few 70-LED icicle lights that work this way too.

I tried it on some others: rope lights, 25- and 35-LED strings, and
even an incandescent (considering the 1A limit of the diodes). These
would all light dimly on either polarity.
--
48 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

using what dc voltage?
we use these indoors and outdoors but i haven't played with them yet.

Mark Lloyd wrote:
Today I tried connecting some 70-LED light strings to DC (using a
single 1N4003 diode). Half the string would light. Changing the
polarity made the other half light. This also applies to additional
strings connected to the female connector at the end of the string.
This could make an interesting multi-string flasher, automatically
switching the polarity.

I have a few 70-LED icicle lights that work this way too.

I tried it on some others: rope lights, 25- and 35-LED strings, and
even an incandescent (considering the 1A limit of the diodes). These
would all light dimly on either polarity.
--
48 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

On 7 Nov 2006 10:05:41 -0800, "buffalobill"
wrote:

using what dc voltage?

120VDC half-wave rectified, what did you expect? I wired a normal
receptacle with the tab between the hot screws removed and a diode
connected between then, and then repeated that with the diode wired
the other way (to get the other polarity).

The 1N4003 diode can handle up to 200V (not the 1N4004 as I mistakenly
posted earlier, that one's 400V). The diode has a current rating of
1A, more than sufficient for several of these light strings.

we use these indoors and outdoors but i haven't played with them yet.


I had a few last year, but hadn't tried DC yet.

Mark Lloyd wrote:
Today I tried connecting some 70-LED light strings to DC (using a
single 1N4003 diode). Half the string would light. Changing the
polarity made the other half light. This also applies to additional
strings connected to the female connector at the end of the string.
This could make an interesting multi-string flasher, automatically
switching the polarity.

I have a few 70-LED icicle lights that work this way too.

I tried it on some others: rope lights, 25- and 35-LED strings, and
even an incandescent (considering the 1A limit of the diodes). These
would all light dimly on either polarity.
--
48 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."
--
48 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

Why do you need the diode? The LEDs themselves are diodes.


Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 7 Nov 2006 10:05:41 -0800, "buffalobill"
wrote:

using what dc voltage?

120VDC half-wave rectified, what did you expect? I wired a normal
receptacle with the tab between the hot screws removed and a diode
connected between then, and then repeated that with the diode wired
the other way (to get the other polarity).

The 1N4003 diode can handle up to 200V (not the 1N4004 as I mistakenly
posted earlier, that one's 400V). The diode has a current rating of
1A, more than sufficient for several of these light strings.

we use these indoors and outdoors but i haven't played with them yet.


I had a few last year, but hadn't tried DC yet.

Mark Lloyd wrote:
Today I tried connecting some 70-LED light strings to DC (using a
single 1N4003 diode). Half the string would light. Changing the
polarity made the other half light. This also applies to additional
strings connected to the female connector at the end of the string.
This could make an interesting multi-string flasher, automatically
switching the polarity.

I have a few 70-LED icicle lights that work this way too.

I tried it on some others: rope lights, 25- and 35-LED strings, and
even an incandescent (considering the 1A limit of the diodes). These
would all light dimly on either polarity.
--
48 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

On Tue, 07 Nov 2006 17:23:08 -0500, Stubby wrote:
Why do you need the diode? The LEDs themselves are diodes.

So he could tell how the set of lights was wired.

At least, that was why last year I did exactly what he described.

sdb

--
Wanted: Omnibook 800 & accessories, cheap, working or not
sdbuse1 on mailhost bigfoot.com

sylvan butler wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2006 17:23:08 -0500, Stubby wrote:
Why do you need the diode? The LEDs themselves are diodes.

So he could tell how the set of lights was wired.

Is that a question or an unclear statement????

I'm saying that 70 LEDs in series, all pointing the same way, will not
benefit from having one additional 1N4003 in series with them.

On Wed, 08 Nov 2006 17:26:09 -0500, Stubby wrote:
sylvan butler wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2006 17:23:08 -0500, Stubby wrote:
Why do you need the diode?

So he could tell how the set of lights was wired.

Is that a question or an unclear statement????

It ends with a period, therefore it is a statement. As for it being
unclear, well, I guess it is since you say it is. To me it seems like a
reasonable answer to your query...
Q: "Why do you need..."
A: "So [i] can tell..."

I'm saying that 70 LEDs in series, all pointing the same way, will not
benefit from having one additional 1N4003 in series with them.

I understood you the first time. And as I said, by using the diode, he
was able to tell that the LEDs WERE NOT "all pointing the same way," to
wit:

Mark Lloyd wrote:
Today I tried connecting some 70-LED light strings to DC (using a
single 1N4003 diode). Half the string would light. Changing the
polarity made the other half light.

Thus we see that using the diode to remove half of the A.C. wave from
the string prevented half of the LEDs from lighting, which effect was
reversed by reversing the polarity to the string. Therefore we know
that the string of LEDs is actually wired as two anti-parallel strings.

Of course, if you were making a string of LEDs intended to run from
A.C., you might also wish to use a series diode in addition to the LEDs
themselves. Why? Because a normal rectifier diode has a much greater
tolerance for inverse or reverse voltage than does a normal LED. If the
peak-inverse-voltage (PIV) specification of a diode is exceeded, the
diode will usually be destroyed. Some diodes are made to tolerate this
effect, but the LEDs I know of are not intended for such operation.

sdb


--
Wanted: Omnibook 800 & accessories, cheap, working or not
sdbuse1 on mailhost bigfoot.com

On Wed, 8 Nov 2006 18:57:55 -0700, sylvan butler
wrote:
[i]
On Wed, 08 Nov 2006 17:26:09 -0500, Stubby wrote:
sylvan butler wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2006 17:23:08 -0500, Stubby wrote:
Why do you need the diode?

So he could tell how the set of lights was wired.

Is that a question or an unclear statement????

It ends with a period, therefore it is a statement. As for it being
unclear, well, I guess it is since you say it is. To me it seems like a
reasonable answer to your query...
Q: "Why do you need..."
A: "So can tell..."

I'm saying that 70 LEDs in series, all pointing the same way, will not
benefit from having one additional 1N4003 in series with them.

I understood you the first time. And as I said, by using the diode, he
was able to tell that the LEDs WERE NOT "all pointing the same way," to
wit:

Mark Lloyd wrote:
Today I tried connecting some 70-LED light strings to DC (using a
single 1N4003 diode). Half the string would light. Changing the
polarity made the other half light.

Thus we see that using the diode to remove half of the A.C. wave from
the string prevented half of the LEDs from lighting, which effect was
reversed by reversing the polarity to the string. Therefore we know
that the string of LEDs is actually wired as two anti-parallel strings.

Of course, if you were making a string of LEDs intended to run from
A.C., you might also wish to use a series diode in addition to the LEDs
themselves. Why? Because a normal rectifier diode has a much greater
tolerance for inverse or reverse voltage than does a normal LED. If the
peak-inverse-voltage (PIV) specification of a diode is exceeded, the
diode will usually be destroyed.

I once thought so. It's not true. BTW, if it was, it would make it
risky to test LEDs of unknown polarity.

Reverse biasing will not hurt a diode (LED) as long as the proper
series resistor is present. It limits current to a safe value.

Note that exceeding the PIV causes "breakdown" which just means the
diode starts conducting. It is not damaged unless the current becomes
excessive. Zener diodes are operated this way (in breakdown) all the
time. Right now, I have a device (part of a holiday light controller)
that has 2 LEDs on RS232 outputs. these switch polarities (+/-), so
the LEDs are reverse-biased half the time. They haven't been harmed
yet (during about 60 hours of operation).

Some diodes are made to tolerate this
effect, but the LEDs I know of are not intended for such operation.

sdb
--
47 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

In , Mark Lloyd wrote in part:
sylvan butler wrote:

Of course, if you were making a string of LEDs intended to run from
A.C., you might also wish to use a series diode in addition to the LEDs
themselves. Why? Because a normal rectifier diode has a much greater
tolerance for inverse or reverse voltage than does a normal LED. If the
peak-inverse-voltage (PIV) specification of a diode is exceeded, the
diode will usually be destroyed.

I once thought so. It's not true. BTW, if it was, it would make it
risky to test LEDs of unknown polarity.

Reverse biasing will not hurt a diode (LED) as long as the proper
series resistor is present. It limits current to a safe value.

Note that exceeding the PIV causes "breakdown" which just means the
diode starts conducting. It is not damaged unless the current becomes
excessive. Zener diodes are operated this way (in breakdown) all the
time. Right now, I have a device (part of a holiday light controller)
that has 2 LEDs on RS232 outputs. these switch polarities (+/-), so
the LEDs are reverse-biased half the time. They haven't been harmed
yet (during about 60 hours of operation).

Some LEDs are intolerant of reverse breakdown. GaN and InGaN ones (most
other than infrared, red, orange, yellow and yellow-green) can be
significantly degraded, sometimes to the point of producing zero light at
a significant fraction of normal current or even zero light at normal
current, by reverse breakdown. It appears to me that some localized
electrolysis process or microscopic localized heating causes a partial
short. This damage occurs even from static electricity, and many of these
LEDs are considered static-sensitive.
Thankfully, in my experience at least, these LEDs tend not to get
damaged by exceeding their typically 5V reverse voltage limit by small or
moderate amounts. I can usually get away with testing one with a 9V
battery (and appropriate resistor) with wrong polarity because in my
experience they usually need more voltage than that to break down.

I suspect that at least some other LEDs can suffer localized heating
effects within their chips during reverse breakdown, and in that case
would not tolerate full rated power input during reverse breakdown. At
least with LEDs other than ones with GaN or InGaN chemistry, I don't hear
of this being so bad as to have an unnoticeable zap of static electricity
causing actual damage.

- Don Klipstein )

wrote:

[snip]

So if I wanted to test a LED with a 9v battery, how do I know which
leads on the LED to connect to the POS and to the NEG on the battery,

You won't hurt the LED if you hook it up backwards;
you just won't get light.

and what size resistor do I use?

1Kohm works.

Does it matter if the resistor is on
the POS or NEG side?

No.


Also, reading what you said, does this mean that if I connect the LED
backwards on the battery it will burn out?

Not on a 9v battery...

On Sun, 12 Nov 2006 01:24:25 -0600, wrote:

On Sat, 11 Nov 2006 06:59:18 +0000 (UTC), (Don
Klipstein) wrote:

In , Mark Lloyd wrote in part:
sylvan butler wrote:

Of course, if you were making a string of LEDs intended to run from
A.C., you might also wish to use a series diode in addition to the LEDs
themselves. Why? Because a normal rectifier diode has a much greater
tolerance for inverse or reverse voltage than does a normal LED. If the
peak-inverse-voltage (PIV) specification of a diode is exceeded, the
diode will usually be destroyed.

I once thought so. It's not true. BTW, if it was, it would make it
risky to test LEDs of unknown polarity.

Reverse biasing will not hurt a diode (LED) as long as the proper
series resistor is present. It limits current to a safe value.

Note that exceeding the PIV causes "breakdown" which just means the
diode starts conducting. It is not damaged unless the current becomes
excessive. Zener diodes are operated this way (in breakdown) all the
time. Right now, I have a device (part of a holiday light controller)
that has 2 LEDs on RS232 outputs. these switch polarities (+/-), so
the LEDs are reverse-biased half the time. They haven't been harmed
yet (during about 60 hours of operation).

Some LEDs are intolerant of reverse breakdown. GaN and InGaN ones (most
other than infrared, red, orange, yellow and yellow-green) can be
significantly degraded, sometimes to the point of producing zero light at
a significant fraction of normal current or even zero light at normal
current, by reverse breakdown. It appears to me that some localized
electrolysis process or microscopic localized heating causes a partial
short. This damage occurs even from static electricity, and many of these
LEDs are considered static-sensitive.
Thankfully, in my experience at least, these LEDs tend not to get
damaged by exceeding their typically 5V reverse voltage limit by small or
moderate amounts. I can usually get away with testing one with a 9V
battery (and appropriate resistor) with wrong polarity because in my
experience they usually need more voltage than that to break down.

I suspect that at least some other LEDs can suffer localized heating
effects within their chips during reverse breakdown, and in that case
would not tolerate full rated power input during reverse breakdown. At
least with LEDs other than ones with GaN or InGaN chemistry, I don't hear
of this being so bad as to have an unnoticeable zap of static electricity
causing actual damage.

- Don Klipstein )

So if I wanted to test a LED with a 9v battery, how do I know which
leads on the LED to connect to the POS and to the NEG on the battery
and what size resistor do I use?

470 ohm is generally OK. If you want, you could calculate an ideal
value. It's (supplyvoltage-LEDvoltage)/LEDcurrent. Resistors also have
a power rating, but you don't need to worry about that here.

BTW, 9V batteries can supply plenty of current for testing LEDs. I was
using one when testing the SSRs (LED input) for Holiday light control.

Does it matter if the resistor is on
the POS or NEG side?


Not in a simple series circuit. All resistor locations are
electrically identical. Resistors are not polarity sensitive. Just
make sure it's in series with the LED.

Also, reading what you said, does this mean that if I connect the LED
backwards on the battery it will burn out?


No. Failure to use a resistor will, but you don't need to do that.

Just make sure that resistor is in series with the LED in all cases.
If the LED doesn't light, reverse its polarity. You're supposed to be
able to tell by the length of the leads, but you may find it easier to
try it.

BTW, I've done a lot of that when setting up LED circuits.

Thanks

--
44 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

On Sat, 11 Nov 2006 06:59:18 +0000 (UTC), (Don
Klipstein) wrote:

In , Mark Lloyd wrote in part:
sylvan butler wrote:

Of course, if you were making a string of LEDs intended to run from
A.C., you might also wish to use a series diode in addition to the LEDs
themselves. Why? Because a normal rectifier diode has a much greater
tolerance for inverse or reverse voltage than does a normal LED. If the
peak-inverse-voltage (PIV) specification of a diode is exceeded, the
diode will usually be destroyed.

I once thought so. It's not true. BTW, if it was, it would make it
risky to test LEDs of unknown polarity.

Reverse biasing will not hurt a diode (LED) as long as the proper
series resistor is present. It limits current to a safe value.

Note that exceeding the PIV causes "breakdown" which just means the
diode starts conducting. It is not damaged unless the current becomes
excessive. Zener diodes are operated this way (in breakdown) all the
time. Right now, I have a device (part of a holiday light controller)
that has 2 LEDs on RS232 outputs. these switch polarities (+/-), so
the LEDs are reverse-biased half the time. They haven't been harmed
yet (during about 60 hours of operation).

Some LEDs are intolerant of reverse breakdown. GaN and InGaN ones (most
other than infrared, red, orange, yellow and yellow-green) can be
significantly degraded, sometimes to the point of producing zero light at
a significant fraction of normal current or even zero light at normal
current, by reverse breakdown. It appears to me that some localized
electrolysis process or microscopic localized heating causes a partial
short. This damage occurs even from static electricity, and many of these
LEDs are considered static-sensitive.
Thankfully, in my experience at least, these LEDs tend not to get
damaged by exceeding their typically 5V reverse voltage limit by small or
moderate amounts. I can usually get away with testing one with a 9V
battery (and appropriate resistor) with wrong polarity because in my
experience they usually need more voltage than that to break down.

I suspect that at least some other LEDs can suffer localized heating
effects within their chips during reverse breakdown, and in that case
would not tolerate full rated power input during reverse breakdown. At
least with LEDs other than ones with GaN or InGaN chemistry, I don't hear
of this being so bad as to have an unnoticeable zap of static electricity
causing actual damage.

- Don Klipstein )

So if I wanted to test a LED with a 9v battery, how do I know which
leads on the LED to connect to the POS and to the NEG on the battery,
and what size resistor do I use? Does it matter if the resistor is on
the POS or NEG side?

Also, reading what you said, does this mean that if I connect the LED
backwards on the battery it will burn out?

Thanks

In article ,
wrote:
On Sat, 11 Nov 2006 06:59:18 +0000 (UTC), (Don
Klipstein) wrote:

In , Mark Lloyd wrote in part:
sylvan butler wrote:

Of course, if you were making a string of LEDs intended to run from
A.C., you might also wish to use a series diode in addition to the LEDs
themselves. Why? Because a normal rectifier diode has a much greater
tolerance for inverse or reverse voltage than does a normal LED. If the
peak-inverse-voltage (PIV) specification of a diode is exceeded, the
diode will usually be destroyed.

I once thought so. It's not true. BTW, if it was, it would make it
risky to test LEDs of unknown polarity.

Reverse biasing will not hurt a diode (LED) as long as the proper
series resistor is present. It limits current to a safe value.

Note that exceeding the PIV causes "breakdown" which just means the
diode starts conducting. It is not damaged unless the current becomes
excessive. Zener diodes are operated this way (in breakdown) all the
time. Right now, I have a device (part of a holiday light controller)
that has 2 LEDs on RS232 outputs. these switch polarities (+/-), so
the LEDs are reverse-biased half the time. They haven't been harmed
yet (during about 60 hours of operation).

Some LEDs are intolerant of reverse breakdown. GaN and InGaN ones (most
other than infrared, red, orange, yellow and yellow-green) can be
significantly degraded, sometimes to the point of producing zero light at
a significant fraction of normal current or even zero light at normal
current, by reverse breakdown. It appears to me that some localized
electrolysis process or microscopic localized heating causes a partial
short. This damage occurs even from static electricity, and many of these
LEDs are considered static-sensitive.
Thankfully, in my experience at least, these LEDs tend not to get
damaged by exceeding their typically 5V reverse voltage limit by small or
moderate amounts. I can usually get away with testing one with a 9V
battery (and appropriate resistor) with wrong polarity because in my
experience they usually need more voltage than that to break down.

I suspect that at least some other LEDs can suffer localized heating
effects within their chips during reverse breakdown, and in that case
would not tolerate full rated power input during reverse breakdown. At
least with LEDs other than ones with GaN or InGaN chemistry, I don't hear
of this being so bad as to have an unnoticeable zap of static electricity
causing actual damage.

- Don Klipstein )

So if I wanted to test a LED with a 9v battery, how do I know which
leads on the LED to connect to the POS and to the NEG on the battery,

If the LED has leads of unequal length, then the longer lead is
positive.

If the LED has a round body with a flange and the flange has a flat spot
on the same side as one lead, then that side is negative.

I have seen some exceptions - often through more-disparaged
apparently-to-me surplus channels, indicating that they are rejects.

and what size resistor do I use?

220 ohm, any tolerance, wattage 1/4 watt or any larger size is good for
something like about 98-99% of LEDs with a 9V battery continuously, and
probably something like 99.96% of LEDs for at least 3 seconds. And much
closer to 100% if the LEDs have leads of style typical for soldering into
pads with holes in a printed circuit board (or anything bigger, such as
more than 2 leads for 1 chip ["high-flux'] or more overtly heatsinkable
design).

Does it matter if the resistor is on the POS or NEG side?

No. There is tradition in favor of the resistor being on the POS side,
but that gets into stepping towards the "tradition" side of the borderline
between "tradition" and "general good practice".

Also, reading what you said, does this mean that if I connect the LED
backwards on the battery it will burn out?

With a 9V battery, usually not. By a factor of a large majority,
usually not. But on the other hand blame only yourself if you get
victimized by LEDs burning out on your watch if you power an LED backwards
from a 9V battery.

- Don Klipstein (Jr) )

In article Xer5h.298125$R63.194834@pd7urf1no, Randy Day wrote:
wrote:

[snip]

So if I wanted to test a LED with a 9v battery, how do I know which
leads on the LED to connect to the POS and to the NEG on the battery,

You won't hurt the LED if you hook it up backwards;
you just won't get light.

Usually - but not guaranteed.

and what size resistor do I use?

1Kohm works.

Largely good, despite my previous post recommending 220 ohms when
battery voltage is 9V.

Does it matter if the resistor is on
the POS or NEG side?

No.

Also, reading what you said, does this mean that if I connect the LED
backwards on the battery it will burn out?

Not on a 9v battery...

Usually not, good chance hardly ever or rarely and possibly so unlikely
as to possibly next well-traceably happen halfway to a time when the USA
does not have a "national debt", but LED manufacturers typically disclaim
responsibility of LED failures being of anyone's fault other than yours if
you can be held responsible for reverse voltage above 5V.

- Don Klipstein )

Don Klipstein wrote:
In article Xer5h.298125$R63.194834@pd7urf1no, Randy Day wrote:

wrote:

[snip]


So if I wanted to test a LED with a 9v battery, how do I know which
leads on the LED to connect to the POS and to the NEG on the battery,

You won't hurt the LED if you hook it up backwards;
you just won't get light.


Usually - but not guaranteed.
and what size resistor do I use?

1Kohm works.


Largely good, despite my previous post recommending 220 ohms when
battery voltage is 9V.

I figured I'd err on the high side,
for testing.

Does it matter if the resistor is on

the POS or NEG side?

No.


Also, reading what you said, does this mean that if I connect the LED
backwards on the battery it will burn out?

Not on a 9v battery...


Usually not, good chance hardly ever or rarely and possibly so unlikely
as to possibly next well-traceably happen halfway to a time when the USA
does not have a "national debt", but LED manufacturers typically disclaim
responsibility of LED failures being of anyone's fault other than yours if
you can be held responsible for reverse voltage above 5V.

Hmm. News to me. Said responsibility shall no doubt be limited to
replacement cost of said device even in instances where said device can
be shown to have manufacturing defect(s), even where said device was
solely and directly responsible for burning the house down. Have I got
that right?

- Don Klipstein )

On Sun, 12 Nov 2006 07:36:03 +0000 (UTC), (Don
Klipstein) wrote:

In article Xer5h.298125$R63.194834@pd7urf1no, Randy Day wrote:
wrote:

[snip]

So if I wanted to test a LED with a 9v battery, how do I know which
leads on the LED to connect to the POS and to the NEG on the battery,

You won't hurt the LED if you hook it up backwards;
you just won't get light.

Usually - but not guaranteed.


I did overload one once. There was a loud POP (immediately after
connecting voltage). Half the LED disappeared (moved too fast to see).

and what size resistor do I use?

1Kohm works.

Largely good, despite my previous post recommending 220 ohms when
battery voltage is 9V.


1K does sound large for that use.

Does it matter if the resistor is on
the POS or NEG side?

No.

Also, reading what you said, does this mean that if I connect the LED
backwards on the battery it will burn out?

Not on a 9v battery...

Usually not, good chance hardly ever or rarely and possibly so unlikely
as to possibly next well-traceably happen halfway to a time when the USA
does not have a "national debt", but LED manufacturers typically disclaim
responsibility of LED failures being of anyone's fault other than yours if
you can be held responsible for reverse voltage above 5V.

- Don Klipstein )

In tyG5h.292669$1T2.171966@pd7urf2no, Randy Day wrote in part:
Don Klipstein wrote:

Usually not, good chance hardly ever or rarely and possibly so unlikely
as to possibly next well-traceably happen halfway to a time when the USA
does not have a "national debt", but LED manufacturers typically disclaim
responsibility of LED failures being of anyone's fault other than yours if
you can be held responsible for reverse voltage above 5V.

Hmm. News to me. Said responsibility shall no doubt be limited to
replacement cost of said device even in instances where said device can
be shown to have manufacturing defect(s), even where said device was
solely and directly responsible for burning the house down. Have I got
that right?

If the LED is defective, return it without abusing it. Return unused
ones that can be shown to have a defect first becoming apparent when one
was abused, but the abused one you have to eat. Yes, defective electronic
components do only cost their manufacturer what they were sold for, or
replacements thereof - and maybe lost future sales.

If a defective electronic component burns your house down, then the
blame normally goes to the electronic component being in an inadequately
fault-tolerant product/installation or being used in a risky manner. If
you leave a homebrew electronic circuit running unattended on your bed and
it starts a fire, I doubt your fire insurance company will go after the
component manufacturers.

- Don Klipstein )