I have a builder grade Comfort Maker single stage furnace that has a
bad heat exchanger. It is 5 1/2 years old and still under warranty.
The part is free, but install is $1500. They gave me the option of
replacing, or installing a new Trane 2 stage furnace for $3500. They
said that I could save $500-$700 per year with the 2 stage. I have dual
zone heating with the second Comfort Maker furnace in the attic. It is
working fine. Is it worth having the better furnace installed, or is
the guy blowing smoke? I have used this HVAC company for many years,
but I know nothing about HVAC except change filters and service twice
per year. The total heating area is approximately 3300 square feet. Any
help would be appreciated.

Drewink

drewink wrote:
I have a builder grade Comfort Maker single stage furnace that has a
bad heat exchanger. It is 5 1/2 years old and still under warranty.
The part is free, but install is $1500. They gave me the option of
replacing, or installing a new Trane 2 stage furnace for $3500. They
said that I could save $500-$700 per year with the 2 stage. I have dual
zone heating with the second Comfort Maker furnace in the attic. It is
working fine. Is it worth having the better furnace installed, or is
the guy blowing smoke? I have used this HVAC company for many years,
but I know nothing about HVAC except change filters and service twice
per year. The total heating area is approximately 3300 square feet. Any
help would be appreciated.

Drewink

Are you getting the replacement part directly from the manufacturer?
Did you call around on the labor quote? Ask how many guys they're
going to use and how many hours they're charging. I think you'll find
prices vary quite a bit.

drewink wrote:
I have a builder grade Comfort Maker single stage furnace that has a
bad heat exchanger. It is 5 1/2 years old and still under warranty.
The part is free, but install is $1500. They gave me the option of
replacing, or installing a new Trane 2 stage furnace for $3500. They
said that I could save $500-$700 per year with the 2 stage. I have dual
zone heating with the second Comfort Maker furnace in the attic. It is
working fine. Is it worth having the better furnace installed, or is
the guy blowing smoke? I have used this HVAC company for many years,
but I know nothing about HVAC except change filters and service twice
per year. The total heating area is approximately 3300 square feet. Any
help would be appreciated.

Drewink


Where do you live?? How much do you use this furnace?? (same question
posed a different way)

What is the efficiency rating of the furnace with a bad heat exchanger
and what is the efficiency of the new unit?

Until we know the answers to these questions, we can't possibly answer
your question.

You MUST do something as a bad heat exchanger is DEADLY.

Efficiency ratings of the old furnace and the new one and how much you
use the furnace will tell you how long the payback is on a new furnace.

5.5 years is an unusually short lifetime on a heat exchanger. Did he
say what was the likely cause???? Suspicious minds want to suggest that
either the the builder grade furnace is really low grade or defective
from the factory (possible, but doubtful), or the HVAC guy is not
telling the whole story. Some HVAC service people have been know to
stick screwdrivers thru the heat exchanger just to promote a sale. Well
actually, a good heat exchanger will stand up to a moderate blow from a
flat head screwdriver. A heat exchanger that is dangerously weak with
rust will fail in these conditions.

Did he SHOW you the hole, or did you see it first and call him????

Is there a safety consideration when you have a bad heat exchanger? Can
carbon monoxide get pumped into your living area?


Robert Gammon wrote:
drewink wrote:
I have a builder grade Comfort Maker single stage furnace that has a
bad heat exchanger. It is 5 1/2 years old and still under warranty.
The part is free, but install is $1500. They gave me the option of
replacing, or installing a new Trane 2 stage furnace for $3500. They
said that I could save $500-$700 per year with the 2 stage. I have dual
zone heating with the second Comfort Maker furnace in the attic. It is
working fine. Is it worth having the better furnace installed, or is
the guy blowing smoke? I have used this HVAC company for many years,
but I know nothing about HVAC except change filters and service twice
per year. The total heating area is approximately 3300 square feet. Any
help would be appreciated.
Drewink


Where do you live?? How much do you use this furnace?? (same question
posed a different way)

What is the efficiency rating of the furnace with a bad heat exchanger
and what is the efficiency of the new unit?

Until we know the answers to these questions, we can't possibly answer
your question.

You MUST do something as a bad heat exchanger is DEADLY.

Efficiency ratings of the old furnace and the new one and how much you
use the furnace will tell you how long the payback is on a new furnace.

5.5 years is an unusually short lifetime on a heat exchanger. Did he
say what was the likely cause???? Suspicious minds want to suggest that
either the the builder grade furnace is really low grade or defective
from the factory (possible, but doubtful), or the HVAC guy is not
telling the whole story. Some HVAC service people have been know to
stick screwdrivers thru the heat exchanger just to promote a sale. Well
actually, a good heat exchanger will stand up to a moderate blow from a
flat head screwdriver. A heat exchanger that is dangerously weak with
rust will fail in these conditions.

Did he SHOW you the hole, or did you see it first and call him????

"Stubby" wrote in message
. ..
Is there a safety consideration when you have a bad heat exchanger? Can
carbon monoxide get pumped into your living area?

Based on my experience, raw gas. Fun.

"drewink" wrote in message
ups.com...
I have a builder grade Comfort Maker single stage furnace that has a
bad heat exchanger. It is 5 1/2 years old and still under warranty.
The part is free, but install is $1500. They gave me the option of
replacing, or installing a new Trane 2 stage furnace for $3500. They
said that I could save $500-$700 per year with the 2 stage. I have dual
zone heating with the second Comfort Maker furnace in the attic. It is
working fine. Is it worth having the better furnace installed, or is
the guy blowing smoke? I have used this HVAC company for many years,
but I know nothing about HVAC except change filters and service twice
per year. The total heating area is approximately 3300 square feet. Any
help would be appreciated.

Drewink


Saturday, I stopped at my heating contractor's store for a filter. Their
posted labor rate is $85 per hour. Any idea what yours charges?

Robert Gammon wrote:
drewink wrote:
I have a builder grade Comfort Maker single stage furnace that has a
bad heat exchanger. It is 5 1/2 years old and still under warranty.
The part is free, but install is $1500. They gave me the option of
replacing, or installing a new Trane 2 stage furnace for $3500. They
said that I could save $500-$700 per year with the 2 stage. I have dual
zone heating with the second Comfort Maker furnace in the attic. It is
working fine. Is it worth having the better furnace installed, or is
the guy blowing smoke? I have used this HVAC company for many years,
but I know nothing about HVAC except change filters and service twice
per year. The total heating area is approximately 3300 square feet. Any
help would be appreciated.

Drewink


Where do you live?? How much do you use this furnace?? (same question
posed a different way)

What is the efficiency rating of the furnace with a bad heat exchanger
and what is the efficiency of the new unit?

Until we know the answers to these questions, we can't possibly answer
your question.

You MUST do something as a bad heat exchanger is DEADLY.

Efficiency ratings of the old furnace and the new one and how much you
use the furnace will tell you how long the payback is on a new furnace.

5.5 years is an unusually short lifetime on a heat exchanger. Did he
say what was the likely cause???? Suspicious minds want to suggest that
either the the builder grade furnace is really low grade or defective
from the factory (possible, but doubtful), or the HVAC guy is not
telling the whole story. Some HVAC service people have been know to
stick screwdrivers thru the heat exchanger just to promote a sale. Well
actually, a good heat exchanger will stand up to a moderate blow from a
flat head screwdriver. A heat exchanger that is dangerously weak with
rust will fail in these conditions.

Did he SHOW you the hole, or did you see it first and call him????

I live in Maryland so the usage for heat is up to 8 months per year. He
did not show me the hole. He said it was rusted. I did have a leak from
a clogged drain last year. He found it during the fall inspection. The
efficiancy on the old unit is 80% (Comfort Maker FBF Series). The
proposed Trane is also an 80% but 2 stage vs. 1. Summers are hot so AC
runs constantly for 3 months.

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
"Stubby" wrote in message
. ..
Is there a safety consideration when you have a bad heat exchanger? Can
carbon monoxide get pumped into your living area?

Based on my experience, raw gas. Fun.

Gas is OFF! House no go boom.

On 18 Sep 2006 06:53:38 -0700, "drewink" wrote:


Robert Gammon wrote:
drewink wrote:
I have a builder grade Comfort Maker single stage furnace that has a
bad heat exchanger. It is 5 1/2 years old and still under warranty.
The part is free, but install is $1500. They gave me the option of
replacing, or installing a new Trane 2 stage furnace for $3500. They
said that I could save $500-$700 per year with the 2 stage. I have dual
zone heating with the second Comfort Maker furnace in the attic. It is
working fine. Is it worth having the better furnace installed, or is
the guy blowing smoke? I have used this HVAC company for many years,
but I know nothing about HVAC except change filters and service twice
per year. The total heating area is approximately 3300 square feet. Any
help would be appreciated.

Drewink


Where do you live?? How much do you use this furnace?? (same question
posed a different way)

What is the efficiency rating of the furnace with a bad heat exchanger
and what is the efficiency of the new unit?

Until we know the answers to these questions, we can't possibly answer
your question.

You MUST do something as a bad heat exchanger is DEADLY.

Efficiency ratings of the old furnace and the new one and how much you
use the furnace will tell you how long the payback is on a new furnace.

5.5 years is an unusually short lifetime on a heat exchanger. Did he
say what was the likely cause???? Suspicious minds want to suggest that
either the the builder grade furnace is really low grade or defective
from the factory (possible, but doubtful), or the HVAC guy is not
telling the whole story. Some HVAC service people have been know to
stick screwdrivers thru the heat exchanger just to promote a sale. Well
actually, a good heat exchanger will stand up to a moderate blow from a
flat head screwdriver. A heat exchanger that is dangerously weak with
rust will fail in these conditions.

Did he SHOW you the hole, or did you see it first and call him????

I live in Maryland so the usage for heat is up to 8 months per year. He
did not show me the hole. He said it was rusted. I did have a leak from
a clogged drain last year. He found it during the fall inspection. The
efficiancy on the old unit is 80% (Comfort Maker FBF Series). The
proposed Trane is also an 80% but 2 stage vs. 1. Summers are hot so AC
runs constantly for 3 months.

5 1/2 years sounds like "way too little" for Maryland.

$1500 labor-only sounds like "way too much" from the folks that
installed the old unit.

I'd either learn to check the HE myself or get a recommend
from a neighbor/friend and have a different contractor take
a peek at it.

To check yourself, you'd need a hinged mirror kinda like
the dentist uses, and screwdriver/wrenches to remove
some furnace components fastened with sheet-metal screws.
Folks in this forum can help with instructions.

Regards,
Puddin'

Pease pudding hot,
Pease pudding cold,
Pease pudding in the pot
Nine days old.

On 18 Sep 2006 05:45:30 -0700, "drewink" wrote:

I have a builder grade Comfort Maker single stage furnace that has a
bad heat exchanger. It is 5 1/2 years old and still under warranty.
The part is free, but install is $1500. They gave me the option of
replacing, or installing a new Trane 2 stage furnace for $3500. They
said that I could save $500-$700 per year with the 2 stage. I have dual
zone heating with the second Comfort Maker furnace in the attic. It is
working fine. Is it worth having the better furnace installed, or is
the guy blowing smoke? I have used this HVAC company for many years,
but I know nothing about HVAC except change filters and service twice
per year. The total heating area is approximately 3300 square feet. Any
help would be appreciated.

Drewink

You have been punked!

There is no such thing as a bad heat exchanger. It is just a ploy by
hvac criminals to get your money.

Think about it.
So what if the heat exchanger leaks. There are millions of homes
heated by natural gas and propane that dump 100% of the flue gases
into the home.

And funny thing is, they have been using this heating system for a
couple of hundred years without a problem.

The only precaution I suggest you use is to buy a couple of detectors
and hang one near your bed and another in your living quarters down
low. Many are made to plug in the wall socket and are just the right
height to give you an early warning.

Their solution: $1500. Mine: $40.

DK wrote:
On 18 Sep 2006 05:45:30 -0700, "drewink" wrote:

I have a builder grade Comfort Maker single stage furnace that has a
bad heat exchanger. It is 5 1/2 years old and still under warranty.
The part is free, but install is $1500. They gave me the option of
replacing, or installing a new Trane 2 stage furnace for $3500. They
said that I could save $500-$700 per year with the 2 stage. I have dual
zone heating with the second Comfort Maker furnace in the attic. It is
working fine. Is it worth having the better furnace installed, or is
the guy blowing smoke? I have used this HVAC company for many years,
but I know nothing about HVAC except change filters and service twice
per year. The total heating area is approximately 3300 square feet. Any
help would be appreciated.

Drewink

You have been punked!

There is no such thing as a bad heat exchanger. It is just a ploy by
hvac criminals to get your money.

Think about it.
So what if the heat exchanger leaks. There are millions of homes
heated by natural gas and propane that dump 100% of the flue gases
into the home.

And funny thing is, they have been using this heating system for a
couple of hundred years without a problem.

The only precaution I suggest you use is to buy a couple of detectors
and hang one near your bed and another in your living quarters down
low. Many are made to plug in the wall socket and are just the right
height to give you an early warning.

Their solution: $1500. Mine: $40.

I asked for a breakdown of labor. 2 men. $95 per hour. 8 hours each
plus $200 for misc. gasketing and admin. I think I need a new
contractor.

"DK" wrote in message
...

There are millions of homes
heated by natural gas and propane that dump 100% of the flue gases
into the home.

Really?

Stubby wrote:
Is there a safety consideration when you have a bad heat exchanger?
Can carbon monoxide get pumped into your living area?

Is DEATH due to carbon monoxide poisoning a safety concern????

People die from this every year in areas where natural gas and propane
air furnaces are used.

It is the SINGLE biggest risk with these units, not reliability of
supply, not fire, not explosions.



Robert Gammon wrote:
drewink wrote:
I have a builder grade Comfort Maker single stage furnace that has a
bad heat exchanger. It is 5 1/2 years old and still under warranty.
The part is free, but install is $1500. They gave me the option of
replacing, or installing a new Trane 2 stage furnace for $3500. They
said that I could save $500-$700 per year with the 2 stage. I have dual
zone heating with the second Comfort Maker furnace in the attic. It is
working fine. Is it worth having the better furnace installed, or is
the guy blowing smoke? I have used this HVAC company for many years,
but I know nothing about HVAC except change filters and service twice
per year. The total heating area is approximately 3300 square feet. Any
help would be appreciated.
Drewink


Where do you live?? How much do you use this furnace?? (same question
posed a different way)

What is the efficiency rating of the furnace with a bad heat
exchanger and what is the efficiency of the new unit?

Until we know the answers to these questions, we can't possibly
answer your question.

You MUST do something as a bad heat exchanger is DEADLY.

Efficiency ratings of the old furnace and the new one and how much
you use the furnace will tell you how long the payback is on a new
furnace.

5.5 years is an unusually short lifetime on a heat exchanger. Did
he say what was the likely cause???? Suspicious minds want to
suggest that either the the builder grade furnace is really low grade
or defective from the factory (possible, but doubtful), or the HVAC
guy is not telling the whole story. Some HVAC service people have
been know to stick screwdrivers thru the heat exchanger just to
promote a sale. Well actually, a good heat exchanger will stand up
to a moderate blow from a flat head screwdriver. A heat exchanger
that is dangerously weak with rust will fail in these conditions.

Did he SHOW you the hole, or did you see it first and call him????

drewink wrote:
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:

"Stubby" wrote in message
. ..

Is there a safety consideration when you have a bad heat exchanger? Can
carbon monoxide get pumped into your living area?

Based on my experience, raw gas. Fun.


Gas is OFF! House no go boom.


House never go boom, gas valve will not allow gas to flow unless hot
surface igniter reaches flash point temp for gas.

Raw gas is VERY unlikely EVER leak into a home, UNLESS an earthquake,
tornado, hurricane, plane crash into house... happens

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
"DK" wrote in message
...

There are millions of homes
heated by natural gas and propane that dump 100% of the flue gases
into the home.

Really?

Sure. Many millions more use burning sticks, dried camel dung, charcoal,
whatever.

drewink wrote:
Robert Gammon wrote:

drewink wrote:

I have a builder grade Comfort Maker single stage furnace that has a
bad heat exchanger. It is 5 1/2 years old and still under warranty.
The part is free, but install is $1500. They gave me the option of
replacing, or installing a new Trane 2 stage furnace for $3500. They
said that I could save $500-$700 per year with the 2 stage. I have dual
zone heating with the second Comfort Maker furnace in the attic. It is
working fine. Is it worth having the better furnace installed, or is
the guy blowing smoke? I have used this HVAC company for many years,
but I know nothing about HVAC except change filters and service twice
per year. The total heating area is approximately 3300 square feet. Any
help would be appreciated.

Drewink



Where do you live?? How much do you use this furnace?? (same question
posed a different way)

What is the efficiency rating of the furnace with a bad heat exchanger
and what is the efficiency of the new unit?

Until we know the answers to these questions, we can't possibly answer
your question.

You MUST do something as a bad heat exchanger is DEADLY.

Efficiency ratings of the old furnace and the new one and how much you
use the furnace will tell you how long the payback is on a new furnace.

5.5 years is an unusually short lifetime on a heat exchanger. Did he
say what was the likely cause???? Suspicious minds want to suggest that
either the the builder grade furnace is really low grade or defective
from the factory (possible, but doubtful), or the HVAC guy is not
telling the whole story. Some HVAC service people have been know to
stick screwdrivers thru the heat exchanger just to promote a sale. Well
actually, a good heat exchanger will stand up to a moderate blow from a
flat head screwdriver. A heat exchanger that is dangerously weak with
rust will fail in these conditions.

Did he SHOW you the hole, or did you see it first and call him????


I live in Maryland so the usage for heat is up to 8 months per year. He
did not show me the hole. He said it was rusted. I did have a leak from
a clogged drain last year. He found it during the fall inspection. The
efficiancy on the old unit is 80% (Comfort Maker FBF Series). The
proposed Trane is also an 80% but 2 stage vs. 1. Summers are hot so AC
runs constantly for 3 months.


Rusted does not make a bad heat exchanger. Rust can accumulate for
MANY years before the heat exchanger will leak combustion products to
the house. Just because it has rust on it does not mean that it is
defective.

In southern texas, we use the furnace lightly for three months, and run
the AC a few hours a month EACH AND EVERY month. Some homeowners
here sweep out the flaked off rust for several years before they
replace. YMMV, so what we do here is NOT a wise practice everywhere.

Given your usage, you should ask about the delta cost of a condensing
furnace. 90+% efficient. The extra 13-15% increase in efficiency could
have a relatively quick payback if you elect to replace.

"drewink" wrote in message
ups.com...
I have a builder grade Comfort Maker single stage furnace that has a
bad heat exchanger. It is 5 1/2 years old and still under warranty.
The part is free, but install is $1500. They gave me the option of
replacing, or installing a new Trane 2 stage furnace for $3500. They
said that I could save $500-$700 per year with the 2 stage. I have dual
zone heating with the second Comfort Maker furnace in the attic. It is
working fine. Is it worth having the better furnace installed, or is
the guy blowing smoke? I have used this HVAC company for many years,
but I know nothing about HVAC except change filters and service twice
per year. The total heating area is approximately 3300 square feet. Any
help would be appreciated.

Drewink

My furnace was about one year old when it sprung a leak in the condensate
tank (??) within the furnace. Rather than go for a tear down of the furnace
to fix/replace, Trane offered a replacement (similar) furnace. I took the
new furnace. Have you tried calling Trane direct?
MLD

Leaky heat exchangers can and do KILL!!

Do get quotes for NEW 90+ and compare to your contractor

do you use bleach or other chemicals where your furnace is?? they are
associated with premature heat exchanger failures.

if this is the case you may may be better off with a 90+ that uses
outside air for combustion.

get your chimney checked BEFORE buying new furnace! If your chimney has
troubles go to 90+ direct vent

On 18 Sep 2006 09:39:00 -0700, "
wrote:

Leaky heat exchangers can and do KILL!!

Do get quotes for NEW 90+ and compare to your contractor

do you use bleach or other chemicals where your furnace is?? they are
associated with premature heat exchanger failures.

if this is the case you may may be better off with a 90+ that uses
outside air for combustion.

get your chimney checked BEFORE buying new furnace! If your chimney has
troubles go to 90+ direct vent

No, they don't.
Never have. Never will!

It is just an old hvac sales ploy to take money out of your pocket
and put in their pocket.

Here is a picture of a unit that dumps 100% of the flue gases
directly into the living quartes.

http://www.dearbornheater.com/

Stubby writes:

Is there a safety consideration when you have a bad heat exchanger?
Can carbon monoxide get pumped into your living area?

Yup, that's the primary concern. I have a coworker that was very
close to dying along with his whole family as a child as a result of a
cracked heat exchanger and CO poisoning .


--
Todd H.
http://www.toddh.net/

DK wrote:
On 18 Sep 2006 09:39:00 -0700, "
wrote:

Leaky heat exchangers can and do KILL!!
No, they don't.
Never have. Never will!

It is just an old hvac sales ploy to take money out of your pocket
and put in their pocket.

Here is a picture of a unit that dumps 100% of the flue gases
directly into the living quartes.

http://www.dearbornheater.com/

Ahh please excuse my bad attitude after nearly dying from carbon
monoxide poisioning from a bad hot water tank flue. The chimney cap
cracked causing the flue liner to fall in and gave 2 of us poisioning.
luckily my buddy mark who was here is a volunteer fireman and
recognized the symptoms.......

as is we were both very ill for a couple days.

direct vent appliances marked 99% efficent are different than regular
furnaces and must have sensors to protect you from co2 and oxygen
depletion.

THE RUKES ABOUT CRACKED HEAT EXCHANGERS ARE THERE BECAUSE IT HAS CAUSED
DEATH AND SEVERE ILLNESS.......

wrote:
DK wrote:
On 18 Sep 2006 09:39:00 -0700, "
wrote:

Leaky heat exchangers can and do KILL!!
No, they don't.
Never have. Never will!

It is just an old hvac sales ploy to take money out of your pocket
and put in their pocket.

Here is a picture of a unit that dumps 100% of the flue gases
directly into the living quartes.

http://www.dearbornheater.com/

Ahh please excuse my bad attitude after nearly dying from carbon
monoxide poisioning from a bad hot water tank flue. The chimney cap
cracked causing the flue liner to fall in and gave 2 of us poisioning.



luckily my buddy mark who was here is a volunteer fireman and
recognized the symptoms.......

as is we were both very ill for a couple days.

direct vent appliances marked 99% efficent are different than regular
furnaces and must have sensors to protect you from co2 and oxygen
depletion.

THE RUKES ABOUT CRACKED HEAT EXCHANGERS ARE THERE BECAUSE IT HAS CAUSED
DEATH AND SEVERE ILLNESS.......



I have another contractor coming out tomorrow to evaluate the heat
exchanger. He said that the replacement cost that the original
contractor quoted was at least double what he would normally charge.

Yes, have another contractor confirm whether the heat exchanger is
cracked, and the cost to replace. Secondly, be leary of quotes of how
much you will save. Add up your gas bills for the last 2 years. If
you have gas hot water, reduce it by 20%. I had a guy tell me that he
could save me $500/year on heating with a brand new ultra high
efficiency furnace. However, he never bothered to ask how much I was
paying now. I was only paying $750/year heating my home, so there is NO
way his furnace could save me that much.

Buyer Beware


drewink wrote:
wrote:
DK wrote:
On 18 Sep 2006 09:39:00 -0700, "
wrote:

Leaky heat exchangers can and do KILL!!
No, they don't.
Never have. Never will!

It is just an old hvac sales ploy to take money out of your pocket
and put in their pocket.

Here is a picture of a unit that dumps 100% of the flue gases
directly into the living quartes.

http://www.dearbornheater.com/

Ahh please excuse my bad attitude after nearly dying from carbon
monoxide poisioning from a bad hot water tank flue. The chimney cap
cracked causing the flue liner to fall in and gave 2 of us poisioning.



luckily my buddy mark who was here is a volunteer fireman and
recognized the symptoms.......

as is we were both very ill for a couple days.

direct vent appliances marked 99% efficent are different than regular
furnaces and must have sensors to protect you from co2 and oxygen
depletion.

THE RUKES ABOUT CRACKED HEAT EXCHANGERS ARE THERE BECAUSE IT HAS CAUSED
DEATH AND SEVERE ILLNESS.......



I have another contractor coming out tomorrow to evaluate the heat
exchanger. He said that the replacement cost that the original
contractor quoted was at least double what he would normally charge.

Yes, have another contractor confirm whether the heat exchanger is
cracked, and the cost to replace. Secondly, be leary of quotes of how
much you will save. Add up your gas bills for the last 2 years. If
you have gas hot water, reduce it by 20%. I had a guy tell me that he
could save me $500/year on heating with a brand new ultra high
efficiency furnace. However, he never bothered to ask how much I was
paying now. I was only paying $750/year heating my home, so there is NO
way his furnace could save me that much.

Buyer Beware


drewink wrote:
wrote:
DK wrote:
On 18 Sep 2006 09:39:00 -0700, "
wrote:

Leaky heat exchangers can and do KILL!!
No, they don't.
Never have. Never will!

It is just an old hvac sales ploy to take money out of your pocket
and put in their pocket.

Here is a picture of a unit that dumps 100% of the flue gases
directly into the living quartes.

http://www.dearbornheater.com/

Ahh please excuse my bad attitude after nearly dying from carbon
monoxide poisioning from a bad hot water tank flue. The chimney cap
cracked causing the flue liner to fall in and gave 2 of us poisioning.



luckily my buddy mark who was here is a volunteer fireman and
recognized the symptoms.......

as is we were both very ill for a couple days.

direct vent appliances marked 99% efficent are different than regular
furnaces and must have sensors to protect you from co2 and oxygen
depletion.

THE RUKES ABOUT CRACKED HEAT EXCHANGERS ARE THERE BECAUSE IT HAS CAUSED
DEATH AND SEVERE ILLNESS.......



I have another contractor coming out tomorrow to evaluate the heat
exchanger. He said that the replacement cost that the original
contractor quoted was at least double what he would normally charge.

On 18 Sep 2006 15:02:28 -0700, "TrailRunner" wrote:

Yes, have another contractor confirm whether the heat exchanger is
cracked, and the cost to replace. Secondly, be leary of quotes of how
much you will save. Add up your gas bills for the last 2 years. If
you have gas hot water, reduce it by 20%. I had a guy tell me that he
could save me $500/year on heating with a brand new ultra high
efficiency furnace. However, he never bothered to ask how much I was
paying now. I was only paying $750/year heating my home, so there is NO
way his furnace could save me that much.

Buyer Beware

Like I said, all these guys are crooks.






drewink wrote:
wrote:
DK wrote:
On 18 Sep 2006 09:39:00 -0700, "
wrote:

Leaky heat exchangers can and do KILL!!
No, they don't.
Never have. Never will!

It is just an old hvac sales ploy to take money out of your pocket
and put in their pocket.

Here is a picture of a unit that dumps 100% of the flue gases
directly into the living quartes.

http://www.dearbornheater.com/

Ahh please excuse my bad attitude after nearly dying from carbon
monoxide poisioning from a bad hot water tank flue. The chimney cap
cracked causing the flue liner to fall in and gave 2 of us poisioning.



luckily my buddy mark who was here is a volunteer fireman and
recognized the symptoms.......

as is we were both very ill for a couple days.

direct vent appliances marked 99% efficent are different than regular
furnaces and must have sensors to protect you from co2 and oxygen
depletion.

THE RUKES ABOUT CRACKED HEAT EXCHANGERS ARE THERE BECAUSE IT HAS CAUSED
DEATH AND SEVERE ILLNESS.......



I have another contractor coming out tomorrow to evaluate the heat
exchanger. He said that the replacement cost that the original
contractor quoted was at least double what he would normally charge.

On 18 Sep 2006 12:57:16 -0700, "
wrote:


DK wrote:
On 18 Sep 2006 09:39:00 -0700, "
wrote:

Leaky heat exchangers can and do KILL!!
No, they don't.
Never have. Never will!

It is just an old hvac sales ploy to take money out of your pocket
and put in their pocket.

Here is a picture of a unit that dumps 100% of the flue gases
directly into the living quartes.

http://www.dearbornheater.com/

Ahh please excuse my bad attitude after nearly dying from carbon
monoxide poisioning from a bad hot water tank flue. The chimney cap
cracked causing the flue liner to fall in and gave 2 of us poisioning.
luckily my buddy mark who was here is a volunteer fireman and
recognized the symptoms.......

as is we were both very ill for a couple days.

direct vent appliances marked 99% efficent are different than regular
furnaces and must have sensors to protect you from co2 and oxygen
depletion.

THE RUKES ABOUT CRACKED HEAT EXCHANGERS ARE THERE BECAUSE IT HAS CAUSED
DEATH AND SEVERE ILLNESS.......

I suspect you guys were doing some bad pot.

In any case, everyone should have a detector to monitor carbon
monoxide, don't you agree.

DK wrote:
On 18 Sep 2006 12:57:16 -0700, "
wrote:


DK wrote:
On 18 Sep 2006 09:39:00 -0700, "
wrote:

Leaky heat exchangers can and do KILL!!
No, they don't.
Never have. Never will!

It is just an old hvac sales ploy to take money out of your pocket
and put in their pocket.

Here is a picture of a unit that dumps 100% of the flue gases
directly into the living quartes.

http://www.dearbornheater.com/

Ahh please excuse my bad attitude after nearly dying from carbon
monoxide poisioning from a bad hot water tank flue. The chimney cap
cracked causing the flue liner to fall in and gave 2 of us poisioning.
luckily my buddy mark who was here is a volunteer fireman and
recognized the symptoms.......

as is we were both very ill for a couple days.

direct vent appliances marked 99% efficent are different than regular
furnaces and must have sensors to protect you from co2 and oxygen
depletion.

THE RUKES ABOUT CRACKED HEAT EXCHANGERS ARE THERE BECAUSE IT HAS CAUSED
DEATH AND SEVERE ILLNESS.......

I suspect you guys were doing some bad pot.

In any case, everyone should have a detector to monitor carbon
monoxide, don't you agree.

I do have a Carbon Monoxide detector. I will post tomorrow what this
new guy says. He came highly regarded on my community web site. You all
have saved me a ton o' cash. Thanks alot!

spake thus:

DK wrote:

On 18 Sep 2006 09:39:00 -0700, "
wrote:


Leaky heat exchangers can and do KILL!!

No, they don't.

Never have. Never will!

It is just an old hvac sales ploy to take money out of your pocket
and put in their pocket.

Here is a picture of a unit that dumps 100% of the flue gases
directly into the living quartes.

http://www.dearbornheater.com/


Ahh please excuse my bad attitude after nearly dying from carbon
monoxide poisioning from a bad hot water tank flue.

Yes, but no carbon monoxide here. Lessee, how much of my high-school
chemistry do I remember?

CH4 + 02 -- CO2 + H20

Not sure of the proportions, but that's what happens when you burn
*natural gas* (not propane). Propane, yes, you'll get CO.


--
Napoleon won the battle of Waterloo. The German Wehrmacht won World War
II. The United States won in Vietnam, and the Soviets in Afghanistan.
The Zealots won against the Romans, and Ehud Olmert won the Second
Lebanon War.

- Uri Avnery, Israeli peace activist
(http://counterpunch.org/avnery09022006.html)

David Nebenzahl wrote:
spake thus:

DK wrote:

On 18 Sep 2006 09:39:00 -0700, "
wrote:


Leaky heat exchangers can and do KILL!!

No, they don't.

Never have. Never will!

It is just an old hvac sales ploy to take money out of your pocket
and put in their pocket.

Here is a picture of a unit that dumps 100% of the flue gases
directly into the living quartes.

http://www.dearbornheater.com/


Ahh please excuse my bad attitude after nearly dying from carbon
monoxide poisioning from a bad hot water tank flue.

Yes, but no carbon monoxide here. Lessee, how much of my high-school
chemistry do I remember?

CH4 + 02 -- CO2 + H20

Not sure of the proportions, but that's what happens when you burn
*natural gas* (not propane). Propane, yes, you'll get CO.


--
Napoleon won the battle of Waterloo. The German Wehrmacht won World War
II. The United States won in Vietnam, and the Soviets in Afghanistan.
The Zealots won against the Romans, and Ehud Olmert won the Second
Lebanon War.

- Uri Avnery, Israeli peace activist
(http://counterpunch.org/avnery09022006.html)

A different contractor came out today. He found no rust, and no
problems with the heat exchanger. He said it looked like a normal, 5
year old furnace. Go figure.

"drewink" wrote in message
ups.com...


A different contractor came out today. He found no rust, and no
problems with the heat exchanger. He said it looked like a normal, 5
year old furnace. Go figure.


Yeah. Go figure. Go tell the first guy he's either an idiot or a crook, and
then call the Better Business Bureau. That'll help someone else before they
get bent over.