Just bought a house. In the downstairs/basement, there is a room that
we've expanded to become an office. We want to put in laminate
floors. They are the snap together type that you can buy from Home
Depot. (The only place nearby with them, we live up north in Canada!)
Currently there is a low-pile carpet on there that's been there for
at least 20 years now, and is REALLY glued to the floor. A woman
working at Home Depot told us that we HAD to remove the carpet before
putting down this flooring. We will be renting a machine called/made by
Eddy (?) to pull up the carpet and then lay the flooring. She says if
we don't remove the carpet and put down the (proper) foam underneath,
that the flooring will eventually come apart.

It seems to make sense and I'd hate to have it come apart, but I was
just hoping to verify that this is true information and not just a ploy
to get us to rent a machine and buy the more expensive foam.
Can anyone tell me if this is indeed the best way to go?
Thanks

HomeDecoy wrote:
Just bought a house. In the downstairs/basement, there is a room that
we've expanded to become an office. We want to put in laminate
floors. They are the snap together type that you can buy from Home
Depot. (The only place nearby with them, we live up north in Canada!)
Currently there is a low-pile carpet on there that's been there for
at least 20 years now, and is REALLY glued to the floor. A woman
working at Home Depot told us that we HAD to remove the carpet before
putting down this flooring. We will be renting a machine called/made by
Eddy (?) to pull up the carpet and then lay the flooring. She says if
we don't remove the carpet and put down the (proper) foam underneath,
that the flooring will eventually come apart.

It seems to make sense and I'd hate to have it come apart, but I was
just hoping to verify that this is true information and not just a ploy
to get us to rent a machine and buy the more expensive foam.
Can anyone tell me if this is indeed the best way to go?
Thanks

It could be worse, you could rent the machine to pull up the carpet
(never heard of that machine) and find that your concrete floor is not
flat enough to lay the laminate flooring. The snap together stuff
needs a very flat surface to lay on.

I'm not the flooring manufacturer but if the carpet is *extremely* low
and dense like the hideous crap in the office building I am festering
in right now you could probably put the flooring on it without a
problem. That said, the stuff in your basement is probably not
anywhere close enough to compact enough to lay the flooring on. Any
deflection will cause it to pop apart or crack.

when istalling snap together flooring there are several things to
remember.

1) it's almost too easy
2) the floor underneath must be flat and hard, or the seams will
separate, this doesn't actualy hurt the flooring, but you will need to
undo it all the way back to the seperation to fix it.
3) it must be flat.

there are options for flattening the floor in your basement, I used a
tounge and grrove plywood with plasic risers and leveling strips glued
to the bottom, I got from home depot in 2'x2' sections and they work
great but add about $1.5 per square foot to your floor cost., easier to
just lay out the thin foam sheet if the floor is flat to start.

because it must be flat and hard, you do need to remove the carpet,
sorry.

Empress2454 #124457


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HomeDecoy wrote:
Just bought a house. In the downstairs/basement, there is a room that
we've expanded to become an office. We want to put in laminate
floors. They are the snap together type that you can buy from Home
Depot. (The only place nearby with them, we live up north in Canada!)
Currently there is a low-pile carpet on there that's been there for
at least 20 years now, and is REALLY glued to the floor. A woman
working at Home Depot told us that we HAD to remove the carpet before
putting down this flooring. We will be renting a machine called/made by
Eddy (?) to pull up the carpet and then lay the flooring. She says if
we don't remove the carpet and put down the (proper) foam underneath,
that the flooring will eventually come apart.

It seems to make sense and I'd hate to have it come apart, but I was
just hoping to verify that this is true information and not just a ploy
to get us to rent a machine and buy the more expensive foam.
Can anyone tell me if this is indeed the best way to go?
Thanks

HomeDecoy, 9/12/2006, 2:21:36 PM,
. com wrote:

Just bought a house. In the downstairs/basement, there is a room that
we've expanded to become an office. We want to put in laminate
floors. They are the snap together type that you can buy from Home
Depot. (The only place nearby with them, we live up north in Canada!)
Currently there is a low-pile carpet on there that's been there for
at least 20 years now, and is REALLY glued to the floor. A woman
working at Home Depot told us that we HAD to remove the carpet before
putting down this flooring. We will be renting a machine called/made
by Eddy (?) to pull up the carpet and then lay the flooring. She says
if we don't remove the carpet and put down the (proper) foam
underneath, that the flooring will eventually come apart.

It seems to make sense and I'd hate to have it come apart, but I was
just hoping to verify that this is true information and not just a
ploy to get us to rent a machine and buy the more expensive foam.
Can anyone tell me if this is indeed the best way to go?
Thanks

The foam underlayment is almost certainly a moisture barrier also.
Your best source of information for requirements is the manufacturer,
believe it or not. Read the instructions or visit the website for what
you must do to get it right.

"HomeDecoy" wrote in message

It seems to make sense and I'd hate to have it come apart, but I was
just hoping to verify that this is true information and not just a ploy
to get us to rent a machine and buy the more expensive foam.
Can anyone tell me if this is indeed the best way to go?
Thanks

Absolutely correct. The foam is NOT a moisture barrier, it is a potential
source of problems. Do the job right.

I've never heard of a machine to remove the carpet though I used an ice
scraper to get hte padding up. Your way sounds easier.

"badgolferman" wrote in message


The foam underlayment is almost certainly a moisture barrier also.

No, it is not.

Edwin Pawlowski, 9/12/2006, 3:10:05 PM, hCDNg.244$c03.101@trndny05
wrote:


"badgolferman" wrote in message


The foam underlayment is almost certainly a moisture barrier also.

No, it is not.

Why do you say that? When I installed my laminate flooring the foam
pad they sold me had a plastic layer on the bottom side that was the
moisture barrier. The instructions clearly stated on how to tape the
seams together to prevent moisture emanating up from the concrete pad.
I still have some of it saved for when I do another small room.

In article . com, "HomeDecoy" wrote:
Just bought a house. In the downstairs/basement, there is a room that
we've expanded to become an office. We want to put in laminate
floors. They are the snap together type that you can buy from Home
Depot. (The only place nearby with them, we live up north in Canada!)
Currently there is a low-pile carpet on there that's been there for
at least 20 years now, and is REALLY glued to the floor. A woman
working at Home Depot told us that we HAD to remove the carpet before
putting down this flooring. We will be renting a machine called/made by
Eddy (?) to pull up the carpet and then lay the flooring. She says if
we don't remove the carpet and put down the (proper) foam underneath,
that the flooring will eventually come apart.

It seems to make sense and I'd hate to have it come apart, but I was
just hoping to verify that this is true information and not just a ploy
to get us to rent a machine and buy the more expensive foam.
Can anyone tell me if this is indeed the best way to go?

1. I don't know about that machine but you definitely need to
pull up the old carpet.

2. Then you'll really see what horrors are lurking beneath. If
the floor is really bad, you may need to nail down some
fiberboard sheets to create a clean new surface. You don't
need "perfect" but the floor does need to be reasonably
flat and even.

3. Install whatever underlay/foam the laminate floor
manufacturer recommends. You can kiss goodbye to any
warranties on the floor if you fail to do so.

4. You might consider installing an existing moisture
barrier under or with the underlay if you think there's
any significant chance of moisture working up through
that floor.

--
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
| Malcolm Hoar "The more I practice, the luckier I get". |
| Gary Player. |
| http://www.malch.com/ Shpx gur PQN. |
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

According to Edwin Pawlowski :

"badgolferman" wrote in message

The foam underlayment is almost certainly a moisture barrier also.

No, it is not.

It depends on _which_ underlayment you use.

Some are vapor barrier, some aren't.
--
Chris Lewis, Una confibula non set est
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.

"badgolferman" wrote in message

Why do you say that? When I installed my laminate flooring the foam
pad they sold me had a plastic layer on the bottom side that was the
moisture barrier. The instructions clearly stated on how to tape the
seams together to prevent moisture emanating up from the concrete pad.
I still have some of it saved for when I do another small room.

Correct for what you had. It is made for laminate or engineered wood
floors. The stuff used for carpeting is different and allows moisture to
pass, not be stopped.

Check with the manufacturer's web site. You can get by without a vapor
barrier if the test says there's no moisture present, but why not put it
down anyway. It's cheap. 6 or 10 mil polyethylene. You don't have to
buy the stuff sold by the flooring manufacturer. Same with the foam layer.

Pergo has a spec on flatness: 1/4" over 6 feet IIRC. I used a long,
straight metal ell and swept it around on the floor. Floor leveler
(plaster) can be used in some cases.

Be sure to purchase the installation kit. It has a solid block you use
to set the joints with. And spacers for setting the floor 1/4" from the
walls.


HomeDecoy wrote:
Just bought a house. In the downstairs/basement, there is a room that
we've expanded to become an office. We want to put in laminate
floors. They are the snap together type that you can buy from Home
Depot. (The only place nearby with them, we live up north in Canada!)
Currently there is a low-pile carpet on there that's been there for
at least 20 years now, and is REALLY glued to the floor. A woman
working at Home Depot told us that we HAD to remove the carpet before
putting down this flooring. We will be renting a machine called/made by
Eddy (?) to pull up the carpet and then lay the flooring. She says if
we don't remove the carpet and put down the (proper) foam underneath,
that the flooring will eventually come apart.

It seems to make sense and I'd hate to have it come apart, but I was
just hoping to verify that this is true information and not just a ploy
to get us to rent a machine and buy the more expensive foam.
Can anyone tell me if this is indeed the best way to go?
Thanks

According to HomeDecoy :
Just bought a house. In the downstairs/basement, there is a room that
we've expanded to become an office. We want to put in laminate
floors. They are the snap together type that you can buy from Home
Depot. (The only place nearby with them, we live up north in Canada!)
Currently there is a low-pile carpet on there that's been there for
at least 20 years now, and is REALLY glued to the floor. A woman
working at Home Depot told us that we HAD to remove the carpet before
putting down this flooring. We will be renting a machine called/made by
Eddy (?) to pull up the carpet and then lay the flooring. She says if
we don't remove the carpet and put down the (proper) foam underneath,
that the flooring will eventually come apart.

It seems to make sense and I'd hate to have it come apart, but I was
just hoping to verify that this is true information and not just a ploy
to get us to rent a machine and buy the more expensive foam.
Can anyone tell me if this is indeed the best way to go?

A couple of random points:

1) HD carries _several_ different types of foam. As do most other
DIY places (Rona, Fitzgerald, Builder's Warehouse, BBM etc). There
is quite a variety - some vapor barrier, some insulated, some neither,
some both. _Check_ what you need, and make sure that's what you get.

[If you're in Ottawa, you might want to check out BBM out in
Kanata. They have a couple, and they're real cheap.]

2) If the basement is a hard low-pile carpet (eg: a solid
berber or some forms of indoor/outdoor carpet), without any underlay,
think: it ain't any softer than the foam, is it? If you don't
need vapor barrier/insulation, you _might_ be just as well off using
the carpet as the underlay instead of foam. If you can contact the
manufacturer, they might agree.
--
Chris Lewis, Una confibula non set est
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
I've never heard of a machine to remove the carpet though I used an ice
scraper to get hte padding up. Your way sounds easier.

I had never heard of that either but the woman said she had used it on
hers and it really did the trick. I saw the machine and it had a big
blade in the front. She said it works really well. The name of the
machine wasn't Eddy but the company apparently was. I didn't catch
the spelling and haven't been able to find it online due to this.
Once I have it, I will be sure to relay the info about it and most
importantly, if it works. She swore by it and it didn't seem that she
was just faking it to sell the rental to us.


Malcolm Hoar wrote:
1. I don't know about that machine but you definitely need to
pull up the old carpet.
2. Then you'll really see what horrors are lurking beneath. If
the floor is really bad, you may need to nail down some
fiberboard sheets to create a clean new surface. You don't
need "perfect" but the floor does need to be reasonably
flat and even.

Hmmm I hope the floors turn out to be pretty flat.


3. Install whatever underlay/foam the laminate floor
manufacturer recommends. You can kiss goodbye to any
warranties on the floor if you fail to do so.

Sounds right. I will be sure to read before attempting any of this.


4. You might consider installing an existing moisture
barrier under or with the underlay if you think there's
any significant chance of moisture working up through
that floor.

The woman did say that the other foam we needed was indeed a vapor
barrier type, as she had asked if this was in a basement. While the
carpet down there is VERY flat and has no under padding we had thought
we could get away without tearing up the carpet. In this case, we've
already spent a couple hundred to tear down a wall, put up a new one,
remove the panelling, put up drywall, re-route the wiring/lighting and
remove the baseboard heaters. After reading posts here, I think that if
we're going to the trouble to do all of this, I figure that we might
as well do it right and remove the carpet. I'd hate to see it pop
apart after a year or two, forcing us to redo it properly.

Thanks for everyone's opinions

HomeDecoy wrote:
A woman
working at Home Depot told us that we HAD to remove the carpet before
putting down this flooring. We will be renting a machine called/made
by Eddy (?) to pull up the carpet and then lay the flooring.

Machine to remove carpet? What for? Cut it and pull it up.

I agree with the other advice you have received, including the ice
scraper in some cases. Often you don't even need that.


--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

In article , "badgolferman" wrote:
Edwin Pawlowski, 9/12/2006, 3:10:05 PM, hCDNg.244$c03.101@trndny05
wrote:


"badgolferman" wrote in message


The foam underlayment is almost certainly a moisture barrier also.

No, it is not.

Why do you say that? When I installed my laminate flooring the foam
pad they sold me had a plastic layer on the bottom side that was the
moisture barrier. The instructions clearly stated on how to tape the
seams together to prevent moisture emanating up from the concrete pad.
I still have some of it saved for when I do another small room.

It depends on the manufacturer/product.

Some products combine both functions (underpad and vapor
barrier) into a single sheet. But in other cases you
need to install two separate layers.

Read the actual product labels/instructions carefully to
see what you've got/need.

--
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
| Malcolm Hoar "The more I practice, the luckier I get". |
| Gary Player. |
| http://www.malch.com/ Shpx gur PQN. |
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Machine to remove carpet? What for? Cut it and pull it up.
I agree with the other advice you have received, including the ice
scraper in some cases. Often you don't even need that.

It is really GLUED down and it would take me weeks to get that sucker
up. I've tried in a few places to see how glued down it was and it
quite the struggle just to lift up a tiny bit of it. The machine
apparently will do it in 1/2 a day. Seems good to me!

In article , (Chris Lewis) wrote:

2) If the basement is a hard low-pile carpet (eg: a solid
berber or some forms of indoor/outdoor carpet), without any underlay,
think: it ain't any softer than the foam, is it? If you don't
need vapor barrier/insulation, you _might_ be just as well off using
the carpet as the underlay instead of foam. If you can contact the
manufacturer, they might agree.

I wouldn't do that even with the laminate manufacturers blessing.
This is basement and the old carpet will soak up any moisture and
be a perfect breeding ground for mold and other odors. The old
materials in the pile and/or backing are potentially food for
other organisms too. Using a pad of rottable material in a basement
doesn't seem like a good idea, IMHO.

--
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
| Malcolm Hoar "The more I practice, the luckier I get". |
| Gary Player. |
| http://www.malch.com/ Shpx gur PQN. |
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

RayV wrote:

It could be worse, you could rent the machine to pull up the carpet
(never heard of that machine) and find that your concrete floor is not

The machine is basically a winch mounted on a small platform with a base
of angled spikes. The base gives it a good hold on the carpet in one end
of the room and the winch line attaches with a clamp to the carpet at
the other end (you pull up a foot or so). It just pulls the carpet back
with more force than a human can come up with.

Pete C.

HomeDecoy wrote:

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
I've never heard of a machine to remove the carpet though I used an ice
scraper to get hte padding up. Your way sounds easier.

I had never heard of that either but the woman said she had used it on
hers and it really did the trick. I saw the machine and it had a big
blade in the front. She said it works really well. The name of the
machine wasn't Eddy but the company apparently was. I didn't catch
the spelling and haven't been able to find it online due to this.
Once I have it, I will be sure to relay the info about it and most
importantly, if it works. She swore by it and it didn't seem that she
was just faking it to sell the rental to us.


Different type of machine from what I thought. Sounds like a power
scraper instead of a power puller.

It's highly unlikely that a HD employee would be motivated to sell you
and unnecessary rental of an item.

Pete C.

"Pete C." wrote in message

It's highly unlikely that a HD employee would be motivated

Yep

Pete C. wrote:
RayV wrote:

It could be worse, you could rent the machine to pull up the carpet
(never heard of that machine) and find that your concrete floor is not

The machine is basically a winch mounted on a small platform with a base
of angled spikes. The base gives it a good hold on the carpet in one end
of the room and the winch line attaches with a clamp to the carpet at
the other end (you pull up a foot or so). It just pulls the carpet back
with more force than a human can come up with.

Pete C.

Sounds like it is the opposite of a carpet stretcher. Hope I never
need one.

HomeDecoy wrote:
Machine to remove carpet? What for? Cut it and pull it up.
I agree with the other advice you have received, including the
ice scraper in some cases. Often you don't even need that.

It is really GLUED down and it would take me weeks to get that sucker
up. I've tried in a few places to see how glued down it was and it
quite the struggle just to lift up a tiny bit of it. The machine
apparently will do it in 1/2 a day. Seems good to me!

Oh glued carpet. I have never worked with glued carpet, although I have
seen some.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

"HomeDecoy" wrote in news:1158085296.150653.149290
@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com:

Just bought a house. In the downstairs/basement, there is a room that
we've expanded to become an office. We want to put in laminate
floors. They are the snap together type that you can buy from Home
Depot. (The only place nearby with them, we live up north in Canada!)
Currently there is a low-pile carpet on there that's been there for
at least 20 years now, and is REALLY glued to the floor. A woman
working at Home Depot told us that we HAD to remove the carpet before
putting down this flooring. We will be renting a machine called/made by
Eddy (?) to pull up the carpet and then lay the flooring. She says if
we don't remove the carpet and put down the (proper) foam underneath,
that the flooring will eventually come apart.

It seems to make sense and I'd hate to have it come apart, but I was
just hoping to verify that this is true information and not just a ploy
to get us to rent a machine and buy the more expensive foam.
Can anyone tell me if this is indeed the best way to go?
Thanks


I don't know about the thicker laminates but don't put that .25-.30
laminate over any carpet. Any flexing of the joints is gonna snap them
little by little until it is enough to fall apart. Laterally they lock
very nicely and strong on a flat surface.

...and I'd hate to have it come apart

Then don't do it.

Mannington makes nice snap together laminate. Check their site for
installation instructions and see if there is a vendor near you. Edges are
water resistant.... most other brands are not.



"HomeDecoy" wrote in message
ups.com...
Just bought a house. In the downstairs/basement, there is a room that
we've expanded to become an office. We want to put in laminate
floors. They are the snap together type that you can buy from Home
Depot. (The only place nearby with them, we live up north in Canada!)
Currently there is a low-pile carpet on there that's been there for
at least 20 years now, and is REALLY glued to the floor. A woman
working at Home Depot told us that we HAD to remove the carpet before
putting down this flooring. We will be renting a machine called/made by
Eddy (?) to pull up the carpet and then lay the flooring. She says if
we don't remove the carpet and put down the (proper) foam underneath,
that the flooring will eventually come apart.

It seems to make sense and I'd hate to have it come apart, but I was
just hoping to verify that this is true information and not just a ploy
to get us to rent a machine and buy the more expensive foam.
Can anyone tell me if this is indeed the best way to go?
Thanks

Some are, some aren't. Depends on the brand.



"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
news:hCDNg.244$c03.101@trndny05...

"badgolferman" wrote in message


The foam underlayment is almost certainly a moisture barrier also.

No, it is not.