Hello All,


We've decided to get a Keeprite Two Stage Variable Speed Mid-efficiency
gas furnace for our renovated 1500ft=B2 80 year old story and a half
bungalow and
have narrowed it down to two installers. Both have included duct
cleaning, re-routing of the basement cold air return to the floor, and
installation of the two fresh air ducts now required by the City of
Edmonton, Alberta, where we live. Both installers are members in good
standing with the BBB.

The difference between the two installers are system upgrades, and
therefore, price. Installer 1 quoted $3600 complete, including (1) a
radius return with 2 fins, and (2) a manually-operated 50% damper that
is put in position at Halloween and returned to open when the outside
water tap is turned back on. We tried to get the
price reduced by not including the damper, but Installer 1 believes
that the system should be installed complete to allow for the most
comfort in the house. Installer 2 quoted $2900 complete, but without a
radius return or damper. When asked if these would be useful upgrades,
Installer 2 disagreed.

I've done as much research as I could on radius returns and dampers,
including the forums posted by the knowledgeable folks on this site,
and understand that there are some benefits with these (radius return -

quieter, and more efficient use of filter; damper - keep too much cool
air from recirculating in the winter, especially with a variable speed
motor running constantly). In addition, we would like to go with
Installer 1, because he knew pretty much more than the other three
Installers who quoted combined and was easier to discuss things with.
However, we're not certain if the extra $700.00 for the two upgrades is

worth it.

Any commments would be greatly appreciated.=20

Regards, DL

Knowing more means he knows how to do a better job, and that is
definately worth $700.00!! I don't understand what the damper controls
from your post, but I find very few contractors who understand air
flow. That is a BIG plus. Go with #1. You will probably get more
than the damper and radius elbow for the $700, but they may all be
little things that add up to a lot over the years in better comfort and
performance.

Stretch

As I understand it, the 50% damper is a manually operated unit that
helps to control the amount of cool air coming in the house through the
4" fresh air intake of the gas furnace. It's placed near the gas
furnace for easy access. This will really only be useful in cold
climates. From May - October the air temperature outside is 'roughly'
similar to that inside the home, i.e., not significantly different for
the most part. During this time the damper is left open at 100% air
flow. From November - April the air is generally below freezing, and
usually much below that, at least in Alberta. Because cold air expands
when it heats, less is required for fresh air exchange within the
house. The 50% damper is manually engaged during November - April,
reducing the amount of cold air coming in the house, but not the total
amount of air required for air exchanges. As a bonus, apparently it
also saves 10's of dollars in heat savings every year.

Some contractors like to install a Hoyme damper for a similar purpose.
It operates as follows (from the Hoyme website):

"The COMBUSTION FRESH AIR DAMPER, Series 'HOM' is motorized and used
for the control of fresh air for combustion. It is patented and Code
Certified to be field installed and interlocked with a thermostat of a
furnace or aquastat of a boiler, using either oil, propane or natural
gas. The damper is placed at the terminating end of an insulated fresh
air inlet duct beside the furnace. When the thermostat asks for heat,
this motorized damper opens to allow fresh air for complete combustion.
When the furnace stops, the damper closes to prevent the entry of
unnecessary cold air. This results in added comfort with a definite
saving of fuel."

Installer 1 (from my first post) who wants to install the 50% damper
does not believe the Hoyme damper is useful in residential applications
(he will install them in some commercial applications). In fact, he
believes that they may be dangerous. I must admit that I don't
completely follow his logic (other websites laud the Hoyme Damper), but
he seems to know what he's talking about. Perhaps it's related to the
fact that he wants to install a two stage variable speed furnace and
recommends that the motor run constantly.

Hope that explains the 50% damper more fully. And thanks for the
response.

DL

I think your advise is good, Stretch. After four on-site assessments
and quotes and much research, we have decided to go with Installer 2,
despite the higher cost of the install.
Already we're impressed -- someone's coming by to do a site assessment
before the actual install date, and the included duct cleaning is to be

scheduled on a day just before the new install. Installer 1, who we
actually hired before we changed our minds, was just going to come in
and do the whole thing in one fell swoop, assessment, duct cleaning,
and install.