I purchased a house with a realtor. She was suppose to be experience.
I have learned that realtors are just in it for the commision. If they
say "I want to help you find a house" that is code "I want my 3%".
This is a life long decision you are making. The realtor is not going
to live with you. Realtors are in it to close the deal quickly. Do
your homework. Study where you want to live. Don't let the realtor
influence you. If you lose house, it was not meant to be.

My advise

1. Negotiate the commision the realtor receives on the buy and sell
2. Never pay list and negotiate the price with sellers
3. Ask for closing cost
4. If the realtor is getting tired of looking, fire the realtor. YOU
ARE MAKING A LIFE LONG DECISION.
5. Get your own inspector. They are usually aligned with the realtor.
6. Negotiate the price further if the inspector finds something.
7. Find your own mortgage. Look at credit unions or "lending tree".
8. Never get a realtor who is friend. Getting into confrontations is
uncomfortable.

Realtors are not your friend. They are suppose to be working for you.
At the end, you are going to be living in the home.

writes:

I purchased a house with a realtor. She was suppose to be experience.
I have learned that realtors are just in it for the commision. If they
say "I want to help you find a house" that is code "I want my 3%".

Well, yeah, they do need to put food on the table. And like folks in
any profession, nearly half of the ones you meet are going to be below
average.

This is a life long decision you are making. The realtor is not
going to live with you. Realtors are in it to close the deal
quickly. Do your homework. Study where you want to live. Don't
let the realtor influence you. If you lose house, it was not meant
to be.

True. You can trust the realtor though if they're a trustworthy
person. The tough part is getting a good one among the masses out
there because it is a profession that attracts more than its share of
the get rich quick crowd.

1. Negotiate the commision the realtor receives on the buy and sell

You can't really do this for a buyers agent though since the listing
agreement on the sellers end dictates the commission a buyers agent
will receive.

2. Never pay list and negotiate the price with sellers

Of course.

3. Ask for closing cost

Ask your financing person for teh closing cost.

Realtors do indeed have a way of downplaying this to get you to sign
on the dotted line.

4. If the realtor is getting tired of looking, fire the realtor. YOU
ARE MAKING A LIFE LONG DECISION.

But balance this with Realtors who seem to be spending their entire
lives with one couple who can't get the fencepost out of their butts
and make a decision. First time homebuyers are the reason many
realtors like to get their brokers license, create teams, put the
newbies on the buyers agent side of things, and then concentrate
themselves only on listings where they don't have to do so much
running around.

5. Get your own inspector. They are usually aligned with the
realtor.

Absolutely. Avoid inspectors recommened by realtors. You know for
sure they are not ones who are prone to pointing out dealbreaking
problems.

6. Negotiate the price further if the inspector finds something.

Legally, you can't negotiate sales price at that point, but yes, you
can negotiate the hell out of a credit $$ for repairs.

7. Find your own mortgage. Look at credit unions or "lending tree".

I disagree. Credit union mortgage rates have never been competitive
in my opinion.

I've had much better luck with independent mortgage brokers reselling
wholesale mortgages from Wells Fargo, or other commercial wholesale
lenders. Lending tree might be a way to find such folks, but you can
get horse f*cked by an unscrupulous mortgage broker even easier than
you can screwed by a Realtor.

8. Never get a realtor who is friend. Getting into confrontations is
uncomfortable.

Agreed.

Realtors are not your friend. They are suppose to be working for you.
At the end, you are going to be living in the home.

Agree das well. It's best to always have it crystal clear in your
mind that the Realtor doesn't work for you, by definition, they get
paid when a sale transaction takes place.

Sounds like you had a pretty rough first home buying experience.

Best Regards,
--
Todd H.
http://www.toddh.net/

Sure you can. In NJ most contracts have inspection contingincies.
Anything serious (or even minor) can lead to renegotians or walking
away from deal scot free. Until closing, nothing is set in stone!!!!

Todd H. wrote:
. 6. Negotiate the price further if the inspector finds something.


Legally, you can't negotiate sales price at that point, but yes, you
can negotiate the hell out of a credit $$ for repairs.

writes:

Sure you can. In NJ most contracts have inspection contingincies.
Anything serious (or even minor) can lead to renegotians or walking
away from deal scot free. Until closing, nothing is set in stone!!!!

Todd H. wrote:
. 6. Negotiate the price further if the inspector finds something.

Big Jim,

Check your attribution. I didn't write that. The original poster
did.

Legally, you can't negotiate sales price at that point, but yes, you
can negotiate the hell out of a credit $$ for repairs.

If you read my reply to the original poster's post (which you
evidently quoted and snipped) you'll find me giving that exactly same
advice.

--
--
Todd H.
http://www.toddh.net/

wrote in message
ups.com...
Todd H. wrote:
. 6. Negotiate the price further if the inspector finds something.

Legally, you can't negotiate sales price at that point, but yes, you
can negotiate the hell out of a credit $$ for repairs.

When we bought our house, the contract said that if the inspector found any
defect that would cost more than $2,500 to repair, either party could cancel
the sale. That is a fine starting point for renegotiating the sales price.

"Andrew Koenig" writes:
wrote in message
ups.com...
Todd H. wrote:
. 6. Negotiate the price further if the inspector finds something.

Legally, you can't negotiate sales price at that point, but yes, you
can negotiate the hell out of a credit $$ for repairs.

When we bought our house, the contract said that if the inspector found any
defect that would cost more than $2,500 to repair, either party could cancel
the sale. That is a fine starting point for renegotiating the sales
price.

Practically, of course. :-) But within the framework of that
existing contract, the mindset is that sales price on the contract
can't change.

--
Todd H.
http://www.toddh.net/

On 22 Aug 2006 09:06:15 -0700, wrote:

I purchased a house with a realtor. She was suppose to be experience.
I have learned that realtors are just in it for the commision. If they
say "I want to help you find a house" that is code "I want my 3%".
This is a life long decision you are making. The realtor is not going
to live with you. Realtors are in it to close the deal quickly. Do
your homework. Study where you want to live. Don't let the realtor
influence you. If you lose house, it was not meant to be.

My advise

1. Negotiate the commision the realtor receives on the buy and sell
2. Never pay list and negotiate the price with sellers
3. Ask for closing cost
4. If the realtor is getting tired of looking, fire the realtor. YOU
ARE MAKING A LIFE LONG DECISION.
5. Get your own inspector. They are usually aligned with the realtor.
6. Negotiate the price further if the inspector finds something.
7. Find your own mortgage. Look at credit unions or "lending tree".
8. Never get a realtor who is friend. Getting into confrontations is
uncomfortable.

Realtors are not your friend. They are suppose to be working for you.
At the end, you are going to be living in the home.



Some points are valid and some invalid but saying all realtors are
just in it for the money is wrong. As in any profession, there are
good and bad ones. Unfortunately, like other professions, it's hard
to find the good ones and keep them.

It's also unfortunate that the bad ones almost always get the
publicity and the good ones go un-noticed (at least on the net from my
observation).

) writes:

1. Negotiate the commision the realtor receives on the buy and sell

Find out what it is, and get it in writing.

2. Never pay list and negotiate the price with sellers
3. Ask for closing cost

Closing costs can vary. Ask for a worksheet. We have them.

4. If the realtor is getting tired of looking, fire the realtor. YOU
ARE MAKING A LIFE LONG DECISION.

Be clear about what you want to see. Home sellers only want interested,
qualified buyers through their homes. If your realtor has shown you more
than 15 homes, then one of you doesn't understand the goal.

5. Get your own inspector. They are usually aligned with the realtor.

(Ontario, Canada). It's illegal for realtors to 'align' you with an
inspector, lawyer or other necessary party. I give my clients any
business cards that I happen to have and suggest the phone book for other
names/numbers.

6. Negotiate the price further if the inspector finds something.
7. Find your own mortgage. Look at credit unions or "lending tree".
8. Never get a realtor who is friend. Getting into confrontations is
uncomfortable.

Realtors are not your friend. They are suppose to be working for you.
At the end, you are going to be living in the home.

It doesn't hurt to have a friendly relationship with a realtor that you're
working with. It sure beats the alternative.

I'm sorry that you feel that you had a negative experience. I wonder how
your realtor feels about it.

In article . com,
wrote:
I purchased a house with a realtor. She was suppose to be experience.
I have learned that realtors are just in it for the commision. If they
say "I want to help you find a house" that is code "I want my 3%".
This is a life long decision you are making. The realtor is not going
to live with you. Realtors are in it to close the deal quickly. Do
your homework. Study where you want to live. Don't let the realtor
influence you. If you lose house, it was not meant to be.

My advise

1. Negotiate the commision the realtor receives on the buy and sell


Well, you can't unless you are the seller. This is determined when you
list.


2. Never pay list and negotiate the price with sellers


Could be terrible advice in a seller's market.


3. Ask for closing cost


Could be terrible advice in a seller's market.


4. If the realtor is getting tired of looking, fire the realtor. YOU
ARE MAKING A LIFE LONG DECISION.


This is reasonable.


5. Get your own inspector. They are usually aligned with the realtor.


Not a bad idea.


6. Negotiate the price further if the inspector finds something.


Of course!


7. Find your own mortgage. Look at credit unions or "lending tree".


Good idea.


8. Never get a realtor who is friend. Getting into confrontations is
uncomfortable.


Often good advice, although a friend might better look out for your
interests.


Realtors are not your friend. They are suppose to be working for you.
At the end, you are going to be living in the home.


They are required by law to be working for you. I'd say that many of
them do a good job of it. However, ultimately you are responsible for
yourself.


Dimitri

wrote:
1. Negotiate the commision the realtor receives on the buy and sell

"On the buy"? You are kidding, right? What realtor would be interested
in showing you homes if they know you are going to cut them out of their
commission on the buy side?

My advice is that you find your next home yourself. Good luck.

Seems to me for most situations one should always find one's
home mostly or even entirely by one's self.

Why waste a realtor's time and also risk him/her not showing
you everything available in which you might be interested
when so much info is available on the web these days re
asking prices, basic home appearance, taxes, HOA fees,
demographics, nearby recreation and colleges, recent sales
in the neighborhood, etc.?

Shop around using the net and then your car/bicycle. Pick
out several homes in which you're interested, then call the
listing agent (or enlist your "own" agent) and get into the
houses to narrow the decision.

Ultimately, in my recent travails in selling my house (now
on hold), I think I did a better job establishing comps than
my agent did, perhaps because her interest was a quick sale.
She left out information she surely had about what was
happening in my neighborhood regarding upcoming development.

I used to think the seller's agent worked for the seller to
get the best price. Now, from input and more experience, I
think agents are mere tools, to be treated with civility but
also, definitely kept at arm's length. Do your own research.

"Travis Jordan" wrote
My advice is that you find your next home yourself. Good
luck.

"Elle" wrote:

I used to think the seller's agent worked for the seller to
get the best price. Now, from input and more experience, I
think agents are mere tools, to be treated with civility but
also, definitely kept at arm's length. Do your own research.

Yep. The local real estate association has even revised all their standard forms
to remove references to buyers and sellers agents.

"Rick Blaine" wrote
"Elle" wrote:

I used to think the seller's agent worked for the seller
to
get the best price. Now, from input and more experience, I
think agents are mere tools, to be treated with civility
but
also, definitely kept at arm's length. Do your own
research.

Yep. The local real estate association has even revised
all their standard forms
to remove references to buyers and sellers agents.

This is mighty interesting.

It's not a complaint (everyone has to make a living;
salespeople are salespeople) but rather a strong caution
that things perhaps have changed.

"Elle" ) writes:
"Rick Blaine" wrote
Yep. The local real estate association has even revised
all their standard forms
to remove references to buyers and sellers agents.

This is mighty interesting.
It's not a complaint (everyone has to make a living;
salespeople are salespeople) but rather a strong caution
that things perhaps have changed.

It's not that interesting, really, and realtors are not plotting against
you in secret.

Here in Ontario, Canada, we're complying with new government legislation.
This year the new Real Estate and Business Brokers Act came into effect.
References to 'agency' in the forms must be (and have now been) changed
over to 'representation'. Also, all signs, business cards and other
advertising now must refer to the 'broker' as the 'brokerage'.

"Elle" wrote
I used to think the seller's agent worked for the seller
to get the best price. Now, from input and more
experience, I think agents are mere tools, to be treated
with civility but also, definitely kept at arm's length.
Do your own research.

On the other hand...

Yesterday I asked my agent if the lockbox could come off my
house (so showings would be by appointment only) and if I
could raise the price way higher than what is indicated in
our written agreement. I explained my reasoning, based in
information I did not have before. We had a good discussion
about where we think my neighborhood is going. (She has
several other irons related to real estate in the fire, from
condo property management to being a landlord.) She was very
agreeable, I'm sure had my pulse, and immediately offered to
take my house fully off the market. I said I wanted to see
whether pricing settled down and possibly re-list in the
Spring. (As I posted elsewhere, pricing has been bizarre in
my track, near cookie cutter home neighborhood, with many
homes going for over 50% of their prices from last year.) We
agreed that we would resume listing sometime in 2007. Also,
I told her that she should keep my home in mind if any eager
buyers offering a pretty penny (I was vague about that) come
this way. She said, "Absolutely." I presume she'd call me
and say something like: "xyz is interested in a house here.
I think he has in the ballpark of abc to spend, and, per our
earlier discussions, I want to sign a one-week agent listing
yada contract with you to show him your house."

I don't know if she legally could have insisted my house
remain listed at the current offering price, whence I think
I might be obligated to sell to anyone who came along and
offered cash and closing in a reasonable period. Either way,
she was quite willing to do what I wanted. We agreed my
strategy was a bit of a gamble but lean towards prices not
declining from what they are now and possibly going further
up.

So I think "agents/representatives" are to be kept at arm's
length, but I have hope for better relations (or better
understanding) with mine and that her work will be worth the
money I pay as commission.

"Elle" writes:

So I think "agents/representatives" are to be kept at arm's
length, but I have hope for better relations (or better
understanding) with mine and that her work will be worth the
money I pay as commission.

Good story. Seems like you have a reasonable agent that knows that
goodwill begets repeat business.

--
Todd H.
http://www.toddh.net/

In article t,
Elle wrote:

[snip!]

I don't know if she legally could have insisted my house
remain listed at the current offering price, whence I think
I might be obligated to sell to anyone who came along and
offered cash and closing in a reasonable period.


No. You're the seller. You can change the price or pull it off the
market entirely.


However, I'm very confused from the rest of your post what exactly your
motivation for selling is. If you want to make a profit, it sounds like
you can already make a big one. What do you think is going to happen in
the spring and where will you live once you sell? I don't blame the agent
for deciding not to do business with you. Something seems fishy.


Dimitri

"D. Gerasimatos" wrote
Elle wrote:

[snip!]

I don't know if she legally could have insisted my house
remain listed at the current offering price, whence I
think
I might be obligated to sell to anyone who came along and
offered cash and closing in a reasonable period.


No. You're the seller. You can change the price or pull it
off the
market entirely.

The contract I had with the agent said I would let the agent
list the house until Oct. 15th at an asking price specified
in the contract. ISTM this is a legally binding agreement.
In theory the agent could hold my feet to the fire and try
to find a buyer willing to pay, say, full price and being
very reasonable about the other terms. But I am not in the
real estate business. I can only suppose that when a seller
changers his/her mind, for various reasons it is in the
agent's interests to nullify the contract or be open to
writing a new one.

However, I'm very confused from the rest of your post what
exactly your
motivation for selling is. If you want to make a profit,
it sounds like
you can already make a big one.

Correct. I have left out details so as to protect my
privacy. Here's a little more. Hopefully it makes more
sense. I'll hear out input. This is indeed a very helpful
forum.

I live in a roughly ten-year-old housing development out
West. I think it's called "tract housing": The architecture
of the homes is very simple, and the homes are very similar
in size. They're starter homes for single folks and/or small
families. The neighborhood is large enough that there are
nearly always a few dozen homes on sale spring through
summer. These homes sell, for the most part. They're quite
practical, bathroom, heating and cooling wise, with nice
yards for the size. So I have a lot of data on recent home
sales. Comps are fairly easy to compute (at least, compared
to neighborhoods with much larger homes and much more
diversity in architecture).

I have watched the local housing market since I bought here
three years ago. In the past year, appreciation went from
flat to zooming over 50% for many of the homes. Some
neighbors who had sold (but not yet moved out) reported on
California investors coming out our way, driven, I thought,
by the expectation that less expensive housing would
ultimately cause a bubble in my area. My agent also
indicated she had seen some of these investors.

This is what I knew about eight days ago. Yet, things still
just did not seem to add up. For example, while the average
appreciation has been about 50%, a few homes in the last six
months were selling at twice their value of a year ago. This
included the house right next door to mine, which is
actually a tad smaller than mine and not in particularly
superior shape. Toss in what seemed some odd behavior by my
agent (but maybe was not), and I decided to revoke a
counteroffer and slow things down, to find out what was
going on, if possible. Why on earth was the market
commanding such prices? It has been like an Enron stock
run-up. (God forbid something like that is occurring with
housing where I am.)

By about Tuesday, I had a much more rational explanation for
the odd pricing of homes in my large, but humble,
neighborhood. I learned that four very separate, diverse
large businesses have contracts for building (and two are
building right now) literally on the edge of my
neighborhood. The roads to my neighborhood are being greatly
enlarged (oy, the construction!), so this is evidence that
the commitments are real and serious. Now things make a lot
more sense.

As I think I mentioned, I never bought my house with an
expectation it would appreciate like this. I got really
lucky, at least on paper so far.

What do you think is going to happen in
the spring and where will you live once you sell?

I intend to move to another state, closer to family and to a
climate I prefer. I have been studying the housing in
several towns in this area. If I can get the selling price
of my neighbor (where I am now), I can afford a much nicer
home. I am talking around $30k more in home sale profit, all
told, come spring of next year. That's not peanuts to me.
That's serious money. I make my living from my stock and
bond investments, otherwise. If I wait two years, the profit
could be quite a bit more. But I think information will be
more vastly available by next year, so the pricing of the
homes will settle down and make more sense, incorporating
the expectation for a higher demand for housing in the
coming years in my area.

OTOH, of course prices could fall. But I think it's far more
likely they will hold or rise further.

I don't blame the agent
for deciding not to do business with you.

I would not blame her, either. However, we do in fact now
have an addendum to the contract, saying I would re-list
sometime in 2007. She was very nice about it. But again, if
she thinks I am a jerk, I can understand. I am not too wild
about all she disclosed to me, either, prior to my signing
our first agreement.

Something seems fishy.

Hopefully it seems less so now. I am not the conventional
nuclear family, looking to sell my home because of a job
transfer, needing more space, or whatever. My income depends
in part on what I pay for housing.

On 22 Aug 2006 09:06:15 -0700, someone wrote:

I purchased a house with a realtor. She was suppose to be experience.
I have learned that realtors are just in it for the commision. If they
say "I want to help you find a house" that is code "I want my 3%".

What did you expect?

You are either a dumbass or a troll.


Reply to NG only - this e.mail address goes to a kill file.