On Sat, 06 Feb 2010 19:48:02 -0800, Mycelium
wrote:


You are the moron. I do not need to explain why to anyone that has
ever done a production run on board here, and has also had contact with
major contract manufacturers over there and seen it done in the big boys
realm.

Big boys. Ha. You definitely aren't a big boy except in your own
feeble brain

The biggest retailer in the world has gotten duped by the Chinese. A
news show showed the elaborate methods the Chinese manufacturing
companies would go through to dupe Wal-mart. That's a big boy idiot.
You think the same thing doesn't happen to your precious mobo's?

Yep you're a naïve retard with delusions of having a brain.

The fact that you would need it explained is proof enough that you are
moronic as it gets about the industry from the get go.

Christ your not only retarded your naive as well.

You must be looking in a mirror, shaking your fist at yourself.
Bwuahahahahahahaha!

On Sat, 06 Feb 2010 19:49:58 -0800, Mycelium
wrote:

On Sat, 06 Feb 2010 21:15:00 -0500, Hammy wrote:


And quit cherry picking dip**** I said from the picture it looks like
a 1206 and I have a **** load of 1206 MLCC's in 10uF 16 TO 35Vdc so
**** off.

You said that it was a high voltage cap. Make up your mind, microbrain
boy. Is it microfarads or kilovolts?

Can you read idiot? I said nothing of the kind the OP said its a HV
cap.

Fred Abse Inscribed thus:

On Fri, 05 Feb 2010 15:22:48 +0000, baron wrote:

Attached pictures of a capacitor failure in a 6 months old computer !

I see voids in the solder, although the component appears still to be
attached. I see no discoloration or debris ejection.

I'd remove it and measure it.

I didn't remove it but did measure its value in order to compare it with
the data sheet value. Its between 18 & 20 pf. Its data sheet value
states 22 pf +/-10% @ 3Kv.

So my conclusion is that the failure is due to lead free solder, rather
than simple capacitor failure and that the holes visible at the ends
are due to arc formation across the fracture.

For the benefit of others the capacitor is in the high voltage feed to
one of the two back lights in the LCD panel. In this case the bottom
one. However the protection circuits disable both back lights if one
fails as this one has.

--
Best Regards:
Baron.

On Sat, 06 Feb 2010 19:48:02 -0800, Mycelium
wrote:

[Snip]moronic drivel

Read the OP's recent post dip****.

Gee the self proclaimed mobo and capacitor expert is wrong. Surprise
surprise! Oh I forgot expert solderer too, better then NASA grade
didn't you say. What a ****ing maroon.

Not surprising. What do you do idiot solder other peoples designs and
sit around the cafeteria listening to the designers and only partially
comprehend what they are discussing? Then come here and pretend you're
an expert.

I think I said this before but it's worth repeating YOUR FULL OF ****.

It looks like we should start calling you "Always wrong two". To go
with always wrong 1 who already chimed in here with his useless
insights into nothing.

On Sun, 07 Feb 2010 13:18:45 -0500, Hammy wrote:

On Sat, 06 Feb 2010 19:48:02 -0800, Mycelium
g wrote:

[Snip]moronic drivel

Read the OP's recent post dip****.

Gee the self proclaimed mobo and capacitor expert is wrong. Surprise
surprise! Oh I forgot expert solderer too, better then NASA grade
didn't you say. What a ****ing maroon.

Not surprising. What do you do idiot solder other peoples designs and
sit around the cafeteria listening to the designers and only partially
comprehend what they are discussing? Then come here and pretend you're
an expert.

I think I said this before but it's worth repeating YOUR FULL OF ****.

It looks like we should start calling you "Always wrong two". To go
with always wrong 1 who already chimed in here with his useless
insights into nothing.

If you observe headers carefully, you will see that "Mycelium" is just
another obnoxious nym of the one and only "Always Wrong"... and just
as easily filtered out.

What does one call a person who debates himself... perhaps "Slowman_2"
would be most appropriate ?:-)

And...

John Fields == "Slowman_3"

John Larkin == "Slowman_4"

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, CTO | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

On Sun, 07 Feb 2010 11:43:34 -0700, Jim Thompson
wrote:

On Sun, 07 Feb 2010 13:18:45 -0500, Hammy wrote:

On Sat, 06 Feb 2010 19:48:02 -0800, Mycelium
wrote:

[Snip]moronic drivel

Read the OP's recent post dip****.

Gee the self proclaimed mobo and capacitor expert is wrong. Surprise
surprise! Oh I forgot expert solderer too, better then NASA grade
didn't you say. What a ****ing maroon.

Not surprising. What do you do idiot solder other peoples designs and
sit around the cafeteria listening to the designers and only partially
comprehend what they are discussing? Then come here and pretend you're
an expert.

I think I said this before but it's worth repeating YOUR FULL OF ****.

It looks like we should start calling you "Always wrong two". To go
with always wrong 1 who already chimed in here with his useless
insights into nothing.

If you observe headers carefully, you will see that "Mycelium" is just
another obnoxious nym of the one and only "Always Wrong"... and just
as easily filtered out.

What does one call a person who debates himself... perhaps "Slowman_2"
would be most appropriate ?:-)

And...

John Fields == "Slowman_3"

John Larkin == "Slowman_4"

...Jim Thompson

Your right Jim.

I just added him to my kill filter.

Sorry for being baited into his BS and subjecting the group to all
this bull****.

On Sun, 07 Feb 2010 07:37:42 -0500, Hammy wrote:

Get out of here idiot there are tons of different MOBO and they are
not all made in massive quantity.


ALL models from ALL major brand name MOBOs ARE made in million piece
production runs, idiot.

On Sun, 07 Feb 2010 07:37:42 -0500, Hammy wrote:

Yea it's really hard for some chink to change a reel and put the
substandard parts in for part of a run and pocket 20 bucks. That's a
fortune for them idiot.


You're an idiot. HV caps are NOT cheap, and are NOT going to be laying
around surplus, you ditzy twit.

On Sun, 07 Feb 2010 07:37:42 -0500, Hammy wrote:


You obviously know **** about mass produced made in China ****. I've
seen boards with parts the expensive parts chokes , TVS etc missing,
parts subbed obvious by looking at the silk screen and seeing the way
they had to bend the leads to get it to fit in the footprint.


You're an idiot. The days of cheap turn thru hole TV single side crap
are long gone.

PC parts, particularly motherboards, have specs to meet, you dumb
little farm boy *******.

So
please spare me you're full of **** expertise.

A damn sight better than that of a dope that cannot even keep up with
modern processes.

If you were there they
show you what they want you to see idiot.

You're a goddamned idiot. I can open up ten motherboards from nearly
ANY maker and see perfectly formed solder joints and perfect name brand
parts.

You are the only retarded device in this industry. You and Proteus.
Bwuahahahah!

When your gone if they can
milk another buck they will; guaranteed.

The word is YOU'RE, you ****ing gang boy retard! I can tell a chump
that never listened in school 23,000 miles away, so you can't hide,
dip****.

And NO, they do NOT go 'round changing the parts on a product from one
run to the next where one mistake would cost the price of the whole run
just to do the re-work. Get a clue.

On Sun, 07 Feb 2010 07:46:28 -0500, Hammy wrote:

showed the elaborate methods the Chinese manufacturing
companies would go through to dupe Wal-mart. That's a big boy idiot.


You're an idiot. Wal-Mart does not do ANY electronic manufacturing
ANYWHERE. They own NO brand names of any electronic devices short of a
beeping keychain or greeting card.... maybe.

You really are one clueless ****tard.

On Sun, 07 Feb 2010 13:18:45 -0500, Hammy wrote:

better then NASA grade
didn't you say. What a ****ing maroon.


No, dumb****. I said nothing of the sort, you ****ing liar.

More proof that you are the little bitch that is doing the dancing.

On Sun, 07 Feb 2010 13:18:45 -0500, Hammy wrote:

Not surprising. What do you do idiot solder other peoples designs and
sit around the cafeteria listening to the designers and only partially
comprehend what they are discussing? Then come here and pretend you're
an expert.

The gang boy retard that cannot even write "you're" correctly, AT ANY
TIME EVER IN HIS PATHETIC LIFE, is trying to tell me that I don't know
what I am talking about. Hilarious!

My scalp flakes know more about soldering than your pathetic ass ever
will, boy.

On Sun, 07 Feb 2010 13:18:45 -0500, Hammy wrote:

I think I said this before but it's worth repeating YOUR FULL OF ****.


I think I said this before, but the fact that you are like a horse with
blinders on where the word "you're" is concerned, proves beyond doubt
that you are an uneducated little gang boy retard bitch.

AND it is ****ing funny too! Bwuahahahah!

On Sun, 07 Feb 2010 11:43:34 -0700, Jim Thompson
wrote:

On Sun, 07 Feb 2010 13:18:45 -0500, Hammy wrote:

On Sat, 06 Feb 2010 19:48:02 -0800, Mycelium
wrote:

[Snip]moronic drivel

Read the OP's recent post dip****.

Gee the self proclaimed mobo and capacitor expert is wrong. Surprise
surprise! Oh I forgot expert solderer too, better then NASA grade
didn't you say. What a ****ing maroon.

Not surprising. What do you do idiot solder other peoples designs and
sit around the cafeteria listening to the designers and only partially
comprehend what they are discussing? Then come here and pretend you're
an expert.

I think I said this before but it's worth repeating YOUR FULL OF ****.

It looks like we should start calling you "Always wrong two". To go
with always wrong 1 who already chimed in here with his useless
insights into nothing.

If you observe headers carefully, you will see that "Mycelium" is just
another obnoxious nym of the one and only "Always Wrong"... and just
as easily filtered out.

What does one call a person who debates himself... perhaps "Slowman_2"
would be most appropriate ?:-)

And...

John Fields == "Slowman_3"

John Larkin == "Slowman_4"

...Jim Thompson


Dumb****. There was no incidence of anyone debating themselves, though
your brain cells always appear to be at odds with each other and with
reality as well.

On Sun, 07 Feb 2010 13:49:22 -0500, Hammy wrote:

On Sun, 07 Feb 2010 11:43:34 -0700, Jim Thompson
wrote:

On Sun, 07 Feb 2010 13:18:45 -0500, Hammy wrote:

On Sat, 06 Feb 2010 19:48:02 -0800, Mycelium
g wrote:

[Snip]moronic drivel

Read the OP's recent post dip****.

Gee the self proclaimed mobo and capacitor expert is wrong. Surprise
surprise! Oh I forgot expert solderer too, better then NASA grade
didn't you say. What a ****ing maroon.

Not surprising. What do you do idiot solder other peoples designs and
sit around the cafeteria listening to the designers and only partially
comprehend what they are discussing? Then come here and pretend you're
an expert.

I think I said this before but it's worth repeating YOUR FULL OF ****.

It looks like we should start calling you "Always wrong two". To go
with always wrong 1 who already chimed in here with his useless
insights into nothing.

If you observe headers carefully, you will see that "Mycelium" is just
another obnoxious nym of the one and only "Always Wrong"... and just
as easily filtered out.

What does one call a person who debates himself... perhaps "Slowman_2"
would be most appropriate ?:-)

And...

John Fields == "Slowman_3"

John Larkin == "Slowman_4"

...Jim Thompson

Your right Jim.

I just added him to my kill filter.

Sorry for being baited into his BS and subjecting the group to all
this bull****.


Right. The dumb**** that couldn't even describe the TV manufacturing
era properly wants to claim to have anything to do with assisting in this
thread.

You're an idiot, hammy. Plain and simple.

On Sat, 6 Feb 2010 21:47:51 -0000, "ian field" wrote:


"flipper" wrote in message
.. .
On Sat, 06 Feb 2010 19:54:06 GMT, Bob Quintal
wrote:

Mycelium wrote in
:

On Sat, 06 Feb 2010 14:44:53 GMT, Bob Quintal
wrote:

When I look at the picture labeled chip-cap.gif, i see 2 horrible
looking solder joints. There is insufficient solder. The solder is
crystallized. There is insufficient solder in the meniscus.and it
shows evidence of insufficient heating I do not see any
perceptible bulging out of the cap at either end.

You obviously are unaware of the new solder joint acceptability
spec
for RoHS assemblies.

I know what RoHS compliant solder joints look like, but I deal in
High Reliability products. We cannot use Sn plated parts (because of
the whiskers.

Grainyness is the norm. Also, "modern" motherboard houses have
been
using stencils that are too thin for years, so they have all been
low on solder for a long time.

There is no such thing as a clean, bright, shiny solder joint
any more.
Sure there is. NASA still insists on those criteria for any new
acquisitions.

The days of 63 / 37 perfection are gone.

Thank the capitalist ba*rds who convinced the EU to ban lead so that
product lifecycles would be shortened, enabling more sales.

The same "capitalist ba*rds" that ran lead out of gasoline and paint,
no doubt.

While I think banning lead in solder is a f***ing stupid idea, I recently
heard the figure for the weight of lead put into petrol every year in the US
alone - an unbelievable 200,000 tons, this lead is (was) emitted as
microscopic particulates for everyone to breath and settles on agricultural
land finding many routes into the food chain.

The lead in solder is a stable alloy that's relatively harmless compared to
the lead particulates - they're very toxic!

For real fun, get involved with urban roadway construction. You have to wash
off your boots every time you step from soil to pavement due to aerially
deposited lead. Not to mention visible dust on your pants, that has to be
vacuumed with a HEPA filter vacuum.

On Sat, 06 Feb 2010 21:53:53 GMT, Bob Quintal wrote:

flipper wrote in
:


The days of 63 / 37 perfection are gone.

Thank the capitalist ba*rds who convinced the EU to ban lead so
that product lifecycles would be shortened, enabling more sales.

The same "capitalist ba*rds" that ran lead out of gasoline and
paint, no doubt.


The ba*rds did get the lead out, but for another reason,

Gasoline emissions spewed the stuff into the air we breathed. That was
unhealthy, especially in the quantities used: 375 million gallons a day
(USA 2004) Leaded gas is 0.012% Pb

Besides, the USA would have sunk through to the earth's core under the
weight.

No way, all of it was mined right here in the USA.

On Sat, 06 Feb 2010 20:24:27 -0500, Hammy wrote:

On Sat, 06 Feb 2010 13:08:43 -0800, Mycelium
g wrote:


Sure they are 10 and 22uF MLCC's (X5R) are used all the time in the
output of SMPS's so they do carry large RMS currents. That cap looks
like a large 1206 or bigger package which means it's probably a 10 or
22uf cap.

No, ya dippy dope, that is NOT a 22uF cap! That is more likely a
standard 0.01uF cap.

Now, re-do using the right math.

We were both wrong twit as the OP stated it's a high voltage 20pf cap.

The math involved is beyond your limited abilities. Oh sorry I just
read your other posts. You're an expert solderer yielding better
results then NASA certified machine soldering.

You are attributing storage cap nomenclature and specs with ceramic
caps, which have entirely different purposes and operating spec
declarations.

If your SMPS is switching at 500kHz are faster you don't need large
Aluminum's for hold-up in between such small switching periods.

You are still in the wrong realm.

From just one of the numerous application notes out there on MLCC's as
output caps for SMPS's.

No... as filtration on the outputs, not as the storage itself, and in
the cases where it is "the storage cap", it is usually a high voltage
application, where the output is in mA.

"Because the ESR of ceramic capacitors is low, the capacitor
temperature rise due to ripple current dissipation is usually
negligible.

Oh, boy... you are good at quoting. You are apparently not that good
at interpreting what you are reading.

You're useless at interpreting what you're reading. My comments were
in regard to ceramic output caps on SMPS which is stated several times
in my response. Did you miss that little tidbit you illiterate piece
of ****.

I'm not the one having comprehension problems. You stated that
Ceramics aren't meant to handle large rms currents and I said nicely
yes they are. Now I'll say it not so nicely you're full of **** yes
they are and are used all the time to do just that.

Good design practice dictates that we always confirm this
and verify that the output capacitor RMS current and temperature rise
are within the manufacturer's suggested limit.

That cap in the photo is NOT an output cap in ANY circuit, you dippy
twit!

Given the OP didn't say the application where it is used or anything
other then the cap failed on a mobo an honest mistake. No need to get
belligerent.

The maximum RMS ripple
current seen by the output capacitor occurs at the maximum input
voltage…."

No ****.

Sounds to me like they are working while they carry high rms current.

Sounds to me like you are lost in a lost world as it relates to the
application that cap is being used for, much less its value, idiot.

I don't think you know what the output caps on an SMPS do idiot.What
do you think is supplying the current to the load when the switch is
off? How do you think the cap gets recharged I think they call that
rms ripple current. Or is there some other NASA bullsit term for it.

Hammy, though most of us here can easily match NymNoNutz use of invective
please do not. Just kill file him and his 50+ nyms. It has had nothing
to add for many years. Do not degrade yourself by playing its preteen
naughty word games.