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roof truss repair question



 
 
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  #1  
Old October 7th 07, 12:36 AM posted to rec.woodworking
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Posts: 665
Default roof truss repair question

Hi I am repairing some stained ceiling sheetrock in my garage, and after
removing some sections of it I realized there is more damage.

First the leak in the roof has been found and repair, so there should be no
more water penetration.

Now I can see the water leak has been there for a long time as the end of
the truss were severly damaged. The end of the joist and rafter meet and
they rest on the concrete block wall as shown below:

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w...aragetruss.jpg

Now there is a truss every 24" or so but one of them directly below the leak
is damaged very badly. If you look at the image attached, the section
labeled "C" in green when I pushed it just crumbled. Now the good news is
that the roof is still up and it has been like this for years this truss has
not been supporting it's share of the load for a long time now. The ends
where it is rotted away is about 12" or so in length.

I went up to the attic and tried to see if it's possible to remove "A" and
"B" completely and put new lumbers in but this is going to be near
impossible with all the AC duct work running across, electric conduits
nailed along it, ceiling hi hats and fans etc...and very tight space.

So what I plan to do is to get two 12' 2x4s. I plan to put one adjacent to
the rafter and one adjacent to the joist for almost the entire length. The
question is now should I attach the two?

Should I drill a hole every 18" or so and insert large (1/2") bolts through
both and tie them together?

Or should I use some sort of structural glue/epocy to glue both together?

Or should I use those galvanized steel tie/straps to nail them together?

Or all of the above?

I also plan to insert some vertical wood members between the new sister
rafter and joist.

Or this is all wrong?

Thanks in advance,

MC


Ads
  #2  
Old October 7th 07, 10:50 AM posted to rec.woodworking
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13
Default roof truss repair question

MiamiCuse wrote:

Hi I am repairing some stained ceiling sheetrock in my garage, and
after removing some sections of it I realized there is more damage.

First the leak in the roof has been found and repair, so there should
be no more water penetration.

Now I can see the water leak has been there for a long time as the
end of the truss were severly damaged. The end of the joist and
rafter meet and they rest on the concrete block wall as shown below:

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w...garagetruss.jp
g

Now there is a truss every 24" or so but one of them directly below
the leak is damaged very badly. If you look at the image attached,
the section labeled "C" in green when I pushed it just crumbled. Now
the good news is that the roof is still up and it has been like this
for years this truss has not been supporting it's share of the load
for a long time now. The ends where it is rotted away is about 12"
or so in length.

I went up to the attic and tried to see if it's possible to remove
"A" and "B" completely and put new lumbers in but this is going to be
near impossible with all the AC duct work running across, electric
conduits nailed along it, ceiling hi hats and fans etc...and very
tight space.

So what I plan to do is to get two 12' 2x4s. I plan to put one
adjacent to the rafter and one adjacent to the joist for almost the
entire length. The question is now should I attach the two?

Should I drill a hole every 18" or so and insert large (1/2") bolts
through both and tie them together?

Or should I use some sort of structural glue/epocy to glue both
together?

Or should I use those galvanized steel tie/straps to nail them
together?

Or all of the above?

I also plan to insert some vertical wood members between the new
sister rafter and joist.

Or this is all wrong?

Thanks in advance,

MC


Cut back the rot treat the timber

bolt your timber either side , between the truss and timber insert
spike washers / timber connectors

Fit a 18mm ply gusset over the repair

before you do any of the above check the truss for alignment with the
rest of the system and prop it in place

--

  #3  
Old October 7th 07, 07:14 PM posted to rec.woodworking
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 665
Default roof truss repair question


"steve robinson" wrote in message
...
MiamiCuse wrote:

Hi I am repairing some stained ceiling sheetrock in my garage, and
after removing some sections of it I realized there is more damage.

First the leak in the roof has been found and repair, so there should
be no more water penetration.

Now I can see the water leak has been there for a long time as the
end of the truss were severly damaged. The end of the joist and
rafter meet and they rest on the concrete block wall as shown below:

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w...garagetruss.jp
g

Now there is a truss every 24" or so but one of them directly below
the leak is damaged very badly. If you look at the image attached,
the section labeled "C" in green when I pushed it just crumbled. Now
the good news is that the roof is still up and it has been like this
for years this truss has not been supporting it's share of the load
for a long time now. The ends where it is rotted away is about 12"
or so in length.

I went up to the attic and tried to see if it's possible to remove
"A" and "B" completely and put new lumbers in but this is going to be
near impossible with all the AC duct work running across, electric
conduits nailed along it, ceiling hi hats and fans etc...and very
tight space.

So what I plan to do is to get two 12' 2x4s. I plan to put one
adjacent to the rafter and one adjacent to the joist for almost the
entire length. The question is now should I attach the two?

Should I drill a hole every 18" or so and insert large (1/2") bolts
through both and tie them together?

Or should I use some sort of structural glue/epocy to glue both
together?

Or should I use those galvanized steel tie/straps to nail them
together?

Or all of the above?

I also plan to insert some vertical wood members between the new
sister rafter and joist.

Or this is all wrong?

Thanks in advance,

MC


Cut back the rot treat the timber

bolt your timber either side , between the truss and timber insert
spike washers / timber connectors

Fit a 18mm ply gusset over the repair

before you do any of the above check the truss for alignment with the
rest of the system and prop it in place

--


Got it, except for one part - what is a 18mm ply gusset? Are those the
metal plates with lots of holes in it for framing nails?

Thanks.

MC


  #4  
Old October 7th 07, 07:39 PM posted to rec.woodworking
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,069
Default roof truss repair question

Homemade trusses were and are made with plywood gussets glued and
nailed instead of the gang press plates used at truss factories.
You and I have no way to press those plates into the lumber. The
suggestion was to use plywood gussets that you can glue, nail,
bolt, etc.

____________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)




"MiamiCuse" wrote in message
...

"steve robinson" wrote in
message ...
MiamiCuse wrote:

Hi I am repairing some stained ceiling sheetrock in my garage,
and
after removing some sections of it I realized there is more
damage.

First the leak in the roof has been found and repair, so there
should
be no more water penetration.

Now I can see the water leak has been there for a long time as
the
end of the truss were severly damaged. The end of the joist
and
rafter meet and they rest on the concrete block wall as shown
below:

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w...garagetruss.jp
g

Now there is a truss every 24" or so but one of them directly
below
the leak is damaged very badly. If you look at the image
attached,
the section labeled "C" in green when I pushed it just
crumbled. Now
the good news is that the roof is still up and it has been
like this
for years this truss has not been supporting it's share of the
load
for a long time now. The ends where it is rotted away is
about 12"
or so in length.

I went up to the attic and tried to see if it's possible to
remove
"A" and "B" completely and put new lumbers in but this is
going to be
near impossible with all the AC duct work running across,
electric
conduits nailed along it, ceiling hi hats and fans etc...and
very
tight space.

So what I plan to do is to get two 12' 2x4s. I plan to put
one
adjacent to the rafter and one adjacent to the joist for
almost the
entire length. The question is now should I attach the two?

Should I drill a hole every 18" or so and insert large (1/2")
bolts
through both and tie them together?

Or should I use some sort of structural glue/epocy to glue
both
together?

Or should I use those galvanized steel tie/straps to nail them
together?

Or all of the above?

I also plan to insert some vertical wood members between the
new
sister rafter and joist.

Or this is all wrong?

Thanks in advance,

MC


Cut back the rot treat the timber

bolt your timber either side , between the truss and timber
insert
spike washers / timber connectors

Fit a 18mm ply gusset over the repair

before you do any of the above check the truss for alignment
with the
rest of the system and prop it in place

--


Got it, except for one part - what is a 18mm ply gusset? Are
those the metal plates with lots of holes in it for framing
nails?

Thanks.

MC



  #5  
Old October 7th 07, 07:55 PM posted to rec.woodworking
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,069
Default roof truss repair question

Brace, jack, shim, shore. Do whatever to get everything
straightened out. Check the roof line and the ceiling joist line.
I am a bit surprised if there are no signs of the rotted out
portion.

Remove and replace any wood that has active rot - cut back to good
sound wood.

If you can put in 12 footers, do it. If there are any other truss
members, duplicate them also. Sister the new members on using
plenty of panel adhesive and a generous nail pattern using common
nails alternating a high/low nail pattern. If the existing truss
is old and well seasoned, you may need to use a nail gun or pre
drill a lead hole. Air gun nails are thinner and do not generate
the same sheer numbers that common nails do.

Custom cut a plywood gusset for each side of the damaged truss
that fits fairly well from the bottom of the bottom chord to
rafter top, from outside plate line to whatever 4' plywood would
cover, keep the grain vertical. Use good marine grade 7 ply.
Glue everything. Throughbolt ply to ply with 3/8 bolts with
fender washers. The sandwich will be about 4 1/2" thick.

--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)




"MiamiCuse" wrote in message
...
Hi I am repairing some stained ceiling sheetrock in my garage,
and after removing some sections of it I realized there is more
damage.

First the leak in the roof has been found and repair, so there
should be no more water penetration.

Now I can see the water leak has been there for a long time as
the end of the truss were severly damaged. The end of the joist
and rafter meet and they rest on the concrete block wall as
shown below:

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w...aragetruss.jpg

Now there is a truss every 24" or so but one of them directly
below the leak is damaged very badly. If you look at the image
attached, the section labeled "C" in green when I pushed it just
crumbled. Now the good news is that the roof is still up and it
has been like this for years this truss has not been supporting
it's share of the load for a long time now. The ends where it
is rotted away is about 12" or so in length.

I went up to the attic and tried to see if it's possible to
remove "A" and "B" completely and put new lumbers in but this is
going to be near impossible with all the AC duct work running
across, electric conduits nailed along it, ceiling hi hats and
fans etc...and very tight space.

So what I plan to do is to get two 12' 2x4s. I plan to put one
adjacent to the rafter and one adjacent to the joist for almost
the entire length. The question is now should I attach the two?

Should I drill a hole every 18" or so and insert large (1/2")
bolts through both and tie them together?

Or should I use some sort of structural glue/epocy to glue both
together?

Or should I use those galvanized steel tie/straps to nail them
together?

Or all of the above?

I also plan to insert some vertical wood members between the new
sister rafter and joist.

Or this is all wrong?

Thanks in advance,

MC



  #6  
Old October 8th 07, 08:51 AM posted to rec.woodworking
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 665
Default roof truss repair question

OK. So to create plywood gusset in the end like in this pictu

http://www.sweethaven02.com/BldgCons...02/fig0104.jpg

only make it as big as possible to reach as far back?

Since my sister timber will be right next to the existing one with the last
12" rotted out, how will this help? so instead of a 2x4, with my reinforced
timber it will have a total of 4x4 in size, how would a gusset along the
"side face" help? I must not be visualizing something correctly.

Thanks, MC


"DanG" wrote in message
...
Homemade trusses were and are made with plywood gussets glued and nailed
instead of the gang press plates used at truss factories. You and I have
no way to press those plates into the lumber. The suggestion was to use
plywood gussets that you can glue, nail, bolt, etc.

____________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)




"MiamiCuse" wrote in message
...

"steve robinson" wrote in message
...
MiamiCuse wrote:

Hi I am repairing some stained ceiling sheetrock in my garage, and
after removing some sections of it I realized there is more damage.

First the leak in the roof has been found and repair, so there should
be no more water penetration.

Now I can see the water leak has been there for a long time as the
end of the truss were severly damaged. The end of the joist and
rafter meet and they rest on the concrete block wall as shown below:

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w...garagetruss.jp
g

Now there is a truss every 24" or so but one of them directly below
the leak is damaged very badly. If you look at the image attached,
the section labeled "C" in green when I pushed it just crumbled. Now
the good news is that the roof is still up and it has been like this
for years this truss has not been supporting it's share of the load
for a long time now. The ends where it is rotted away is about 12"
or so in length.

I went up to the attic and tried to see if it's possible to remove
"A" and "B" completely and put new lumbers in but this is going to be
near impossible with all the AC duct work running across, electric
conduits nailed along it, ceiling hi hats and fans etc...and very
tight space.

So what I plan to do is to get two 12' 2x4s. I plan to put one
adjacent to the rafter and one adjacent to the joist for almost the
entire length. The question is now should I attach the two?

Should I drill a hole every 18" or so and insert large (1/2") bolts
through both and tie them together?

Or should I use some sort of structural glue/epocy to glue both
together?

Or should I use those galvanized steel tie/straps to nail them
together?

Or all of the above?

I also plan to insert some vertical wood members between the new
sister rafter and joist.

Or this is all wrong?

Thanks in advance,

MC

Cut back the rot treat the timber

bolt your timber either side , between the truss and timber insert
spike washers / timber connectors

Fit a 18mm ply gusset over the repair

before you do any of the above check the truss for alignment with the
rest of the system and prop it in place

--


Got it, except for one part - what is a 18mm ply gusset? Are those the
metal plates with lots of holes in it for framing nails?

Thanks.

MC





  #7  
Old October 8th 07, 09:02 AM posted to rec.woodworking
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 665
Default roof truss repair question


"DanG" wrote in message
...
Brace, jack, shim, shore. Do whatever to get everything straightened out.
Check the roof line and the ceiling joist line. I am a bit surprised if
there are no signs of the rotted out portion.


Nope. What happened was the water ran down the rotted wood member (since
it's sloped) and at the end there drip into the block wall. The block wall
has furring strips on them, then sheet rock. Then a custom floor to ceiling
book case was mounted on the studs. So most of the staining was on the
sheet rock and furring strips and the book case blocked everything. It was
not until I ripped the book case out then the sheet rock I saw this.


Remove and replace any wood that has active rot - cut back to good sound
wood.


Done that.

If you can put in 12 footers, do it. If there are any other truss
members, duplicate them also. Sister the new members on using plenty of
panel adhesive and a generous nail pattern using common nails alternating
a high/low nail pattern. If the existing truss is old and well seasoned,
you may need to use a nail gun or pre drill a lead hole. Air gun nails
are thinner and do not generate the same sheer numbers that common nails
do.


Yes existing lumber there is 35 years old.


Custom cut a plywood gusset for each side of the damaged truss that fits
fairly well from the bottom of the bottom chord to rafter top, from
outside plate line to whatever 4' plywood would cover, keep the grain
vertical. Use good marine grade 7 ply. Glue everything. Throughbolt ply
to ply with 3/8 bolts with fender washers. The sandwich will be about 4
1/2" thick.


OK you mean to use the gusset on one side which is the damaged wood, the
other side will be over the new sistering wood right? Making the total
width 4 1/2".

What is the reason to use a gusset on the good side which is new?

The other problem I see is I would like to use a piece as large as possible
like up to 4' you suggested. However a big issue is there are AC ducts
running through there, and that would limit how far back I can go. Also
there is no way I can cut a piece this big and get it up through the 24"
hatch access and pass it through other trusses. I would have to cut an
access hole over 6' in length right where this is happening to get it in
there and still the AC duct would be in the way.

Can I use a gusset on either side of the AC duct?

Thanks,

MC


--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)




"MiamiCuse" wrote in message
...
Hi I am repairing some stained ceiling sheetrock in my garage, and after
removing some sections of it I realized there is more damage.

First the leak in the roof has been found and repair, so there should be
no more water penetration.

Now I can see the water leak has been there for a long time as the end of
the truss were severly damaged. The end of the joist and rafter meet and
they rest on the concrete block wall as shown below:

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w...aragetruss.jpg

Now there is a truss every 24" or so but one of them directly below the
leak is damaged very badly. If you look at the image attached, the
section labeled "C" in green when I pushed it just crumbled. Now the
good news is that the roof is still up and it has been like this for
years this truss has not been supporting it's share of the load for a
long time now. The ends where it is rotted away is about 12" or so in
length.

I went up to the attic and tried to see if it's possible to remove "A"
and "B" completely and put new lumbers in but this is going to be near
impossible with all the AC duct work running across, electric conduits
nailed along it, ceiling hi hats and fans etc...and very tight space.

So what I plan to do is to get two 12' 2x4s. I plan to put one adjacent
to the rafter and one adjacent to the joist for almost the entire length.
The question is now should I attach the two?

Should I drill a hole every 18" or so and insert large (1/2") bolts
through both and tie them together?

Or should I use some sort of structural glue/epocy to glue both together?

Or should I use those galvanized steel tie/straps to nail them together?

Or all of the above?

I also plan to insert some vertical wood members between the new sister
rafter and joist.

Or this is all wrong?

Thanks in advance,

MC





 




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