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How to wire in an Ikea ceiling light?



 
 
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  #1  
Old November 6th 04, 12:45 PM
Jonathan Baker-Bates
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How to wire in an Ikea ceiling light?

I feel sure this must be in the FAQ somewhere, or in the archives, but I
can't find the answer...

I have an Ikea light (a LEDING its called) that I need to fit to a cieling
rose. There are two sets of wires in the ceiling: one I assume is the
switch, the other the mains (each have L/N/E wires).

The light fitting has three wires L/N/E, and that's it. No block like you
normally get with friendly labels on.

So, my question is: what wires do I fit where? I assume the earths all go
to the same place, but what about the rest?

I think part of the answer is going to involve finding which cable is the
switch so I can wire the switch return correctly, but after that, I'm stuck

Any help appreciated!

Jonathan
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  #2  
Old November 6th 04, 04:20 PM
Stefek Zaba
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Posts: n/a
Default

Jonathan Baker-Bates wrote:
I feel sure this must be in the FAQ somewhere, or in the archives, but I
can't find the answer...

I have an Ikea light (a LEDING its called) that I need to fit to a cieling
rose. There are two sets of wires in the ceiling: one I assume is the
switch, the other the mains (each have L/N/E wires).

OK. Here's the ugly way to do it - but if you do get tired of the light
and want to switch back to an ordinary pendant later (or grow so
attached you want to take the new fitting to a new house) you'll thank
me for it:
- leave the ceiling rose in place
- mount the IKEA fitting to the ceiling close by
- run the existing pendant cable, or a short length of new cable
(heat-resistant if you can lay your hands on some) to the new fitting.

This way you haven't monkeyed with the fixed wiring at all.

The light fitting has three wires L/N/E, and that's it. No block like you
normally get with friendly labels on.

So, my question is: what wires do I fit where? I assume the earths all go
to the same place, but what about the rest?

OK. If you want to make the new connections "inside" the new fitting,
your job is basically to faithfully replicate the pattern of connections
inside the existing rose. So, label the wires of the existing cables
carefully. There are four, yes four, sets of cable cores which are being
connected together; so to replicate the existing interconnection you
need a 4-way section of "chocolate block" (terminal block) - if we're
talking doing the best job, try to find the sort which has little leaves
of spring metal clamping down the cable groups instead of just the bare
screw.

One way is for all the earths. One is for "all" the neutrals - if you've
just two cables as the moment, there's most likely just one black N to
which the existing pendant cable's blue core is connected, at one of the
outer of the three blocks in the ceiling rose. That's the one you
connect the N wire of the new fitting to, in the second way of the
choccie block. Next way is for all the permanent lives; again with just
two cables there should be just two of these, one in each cable,
currently connected to the middle one of the three long blocks in a line
across the middle of the rose, and each coloured red - though it's
possible that one's black instead, with or without a bit of red sleeving
or tape on it, if the switch wiring is done "the wrong way round". None
of the wires from your new fitting connects here. Final way is for the
"switched live" or "switch return" - should be just one core of one of
the cables, in the best case black with the bit of red tape/sleeving
mentioned above, if wired "the wrong way round" it'd be red instead, but
in either case currently connected to the other outer block of the rose
and where the brown core of the pendant flex is also connected; this way
is where you'll connect the L wire of the new fitting.

If this doesn't make sense, leave the job alone and get someone who does
have a grasp of what they're doing to wire it up!

Cheers, Stefek
  #3  
Old November 6th 04, 05:48 PM
Lobster
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Stefek Zaba" wrote in message
...
Jonathan Baker-Bates wrote:
I feel sure this must be in the FAQ somewhere, or in the archives, but I
can't find the answer...

I have an Ikea light (a LEDING its called) that I need to fit to a

cieling
rose. There are two sets of wires in the ceiling: one I assume is the
switch, the other the mains (each have L/N/E wires).

OK. Here's the ugly way to do it - but if you do get tired of the light
and want to switch back to an ordinary pendant later (or grow so
attached you want to take the new fitting to a new house) you'll thank
me for it:
- leave the ceiling rose in place
- mount the IKEA fitting to the ceiling close by
- run the existing pendant cable, or a short length of new cable
(heat-resistant if you can lay your hands on some) to the new fitting.


Eeew.

This way you haven't monkeyed with the fixed wiring at all.

The light fitting has three wires L/N/E, and that's it. No block like

you
normally get with friendly labels on.

So, my question is: what wires do I fit where? I assume the earths all

go
to the same place, but what about the rest?

OK. If you want to make the new connections "inside" the new fitting,
your job is basically to faithfully replicate the pattern of connections
inside the existing rose. So, label the wires of the existing cables
carefully. There are four, yes four, sets of cable cores which are being
connected together; so to replicate the existing interconnection you
need a 4-way section of "chocolate block" (terminal block) - if we're
talking doing the best job, try to find the sort which has little leaves
of spring metal clamping down the cable groups instead of just the bare
screw.


If the fitting is anything like many I've fitted, you might find it hard to
get all those cables, plus the terminal block, inside the casing of the new
light fitting. So there is a Third Way, and actually you might find this a
bit easier to wire than Stefek's. Lift a floorboard in the room directly
above the light fitting, and having labelled the wires as Stefek described,
disconnect them and pull them up through the ceiling. You then replicate
the existing connections using a 4-way junction box and then have just a
single length of cable poking down through the hole in the ceiling (this
will be the thick, fixed stuff used in the lighting circuits, not the skimpy
multi-strand flex which comes with the light fitting). See
http://tinyurl.com/6xmty or
http://www.diydata.com/planning/elec...ric_lights.htm .

You now need to connect a 3-way section of terminal block to your L/N/E
wires inside the light fitting, and connect the other side of the block to
the L/N/E wires, respectively, of the cable now coming down through the
ceiling.

Whether you use this method or Stefek's, you need to ensure that all bare
earth wires throughout (ie in the junction box and/or light fitting) are
sheathed in yellow/green sleeving (you should see bits of this within your
ceiling rose now - B&Q etc sell it by the metre).

When you do the job, don't forget to turn off the mains electric switch, not
just the light switch!

If this doesn't make sense, leave the job alone and get someone who does
have a grasp of what they're doing to wire it up!


Seconded!

Good luck
David



  #4  
Old November 6th 04, 10:30 PM
Jonathan Baker-Bates
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Sat, 06 Nov 2004 17:48:01 GMT, Lobster wrote:

"Stefek Zaba" wrote in message
...
Jonathan Baker-Bates wrote:
I feel sure this must be in the FAQ somewhere, or in the archives, but I
can't find the answer...

I have an Ikea light (a LEDING its called) that I need to fit to a

cieling
rose. There are two sets of wires in the ceiling: one I assume is the
switch, the other the mains (each have L/N/E wires).

OK. Here's the ugly way to do it - but if you do get tired of the light
and want to switch back to an ordinary pendant later (or grow so
attached you want to take the new fitting to a new house) you'll thank
me for it:
- leave the ceiling rose in place
- mount the IKEA fitting to the ceiling close by
- run the existing pendant cable, or a short length of new cable
(heat-resistant if you can lay your hands on some) to the new fitting.


Eeew.

This way you haven't monkeyed with the fixed wiring at all.

The light fitting has three wires L/N/E, and that's it. No block like

you
normally get with friendly labels on.

So, my question is: what wires do I fit where? I assume the earths all

go
to the same place, but what about the rest?

OK. If you want to make the new connections "inside" the new fitting,
your job is basically to faithfully replicate the pattern of connections
inside the existing rose. So, label the wires of the existing cables
carefully. There are four, yes four, sets of cable cores which are being
connected together; so to replicate the existing interconnection you
need a 4-way section of "chocolate block" (terminal block) - if we're
talking doing the best job, try to find the sort which has little leaves
of spring metal clamping down the cable groups instead of just the bare
screw.


If the fitting is anything like many I've fitted, you might find it hard to
get all those cables, plus the terminal block, inside the casing of the new
light fitting. So there is a Third Way, and actually you might find this a
bit easier to wire than Stefek's. Lift a floorboard in the room directly
above the light fitting, and having labelled the wires as Stefek described,
disconnect them and pull them up through the ceiling. You then replicate
the existing connections using a 4-way junction box and then have just a
single length of cable poking down through the hole in the ceiling (this
will be the thick, fixed stuff used in the lighting circuits, not the skimpy
multi-strand flex which comes with the light fitting). See
http://tinyurl.com/6xmty or
http://www.diydata.com/planning/elec...ric_lights.htm .

You now need to connect a 3-way section of terminal block to your L/N/E
wires inside the light fitting, and connect the other side of the block to
the L/N/E wires, respectively, of the cable now coming down through the
ceiling.

Whether you use this method or Stefek's, you need to ensure that all bare
earth wires throughout (ie in the junction box and/or light fitting) are
sheathed in yellow/green sleeving (you should see bits of this within your
ceiling rose now - B&Q etc sell it by the metre).

When you do the job, don't forget to turn off the mains electric switch, not
just the light switch!

If this doesn't make sense, leave the job alone and get someone who does
have a grasp of what they're doing to wire it up!


Seconded!

Good luck
David


Thanks for the fast and detailed replies! I'll see if I can digest that lot
tomorrow.

Thanks again for all the help!

Jonathan
  #5  
Old November 7th 04, 09:13 AM
ARWadsworth
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

And try
http://www.userview.net/loop2.html
for a pretty picture of the conections.

Adam


  #6  
Old November 7th 04, 12:10 PM
Stefek Zaba
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

ARWadsworth wrote:
And try
http://www.userview.net/loop2.html
for a pretty picture of the conections.

What a pleasantly simple and accurate site! Definitely one of those
cases where a (well-drawn) picture is worth a thousand words...
  #7  
Old November 7th 04, 05:31 PM
Jonathan Baker-Bates
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Sat, 06 Nov 2004 16:20:57 +0000, Stefek Zaba wrote:

snip
OK. If you want to make the new connections "inside" the new fitting,
your job is basically to faithfully replicate the pattern of connections
inside the existing rose. So, label the wires of the existing cables
carefully. There are four, yes four, sets of cable cores which are being
connected together; so to replicate the existing interconnection you
need a 4-way section of "chocolate block" (terminal block) - if we're
talking doing the best job, try to find the sort which has little leaves
of spring metal clamping down the cable groups instead of just the bare
screw.

One way is for all the earths. One is for "all" the neutrals - if you've
just two cables as the moment, there's most likely just one black N to
which the existing pendant cable's blue core is connected, at one of the
outer of the three blocks in the ceiling rose. That's the one you
connect the N wire of the new fitting to, in the second way of the
choccie block. Next way is for all the permanent lives; again with just
two cables there should be just two of these, one in each cable,
currently connected to the middle one of the three long blocks in a line
across the middle of the rose, and each coloured red - though it's
possible that one's black instead, with or without a bit of red sleeving
or tape on it, if the switch wiring is done "the wrong way round". None
of the wires from your new fitting connects here. Final way is for the
"switched live" or "switch return" - should be just one core of one of
the cables, in the best case black with the bit of red tape/sleeving
mentioned above, if wired "the wrong way round" it'd be red instead, but
in either case currently connected to the other outer block of the rose
and where the brown core of the pendant flex is also connected; this way
is where you'll connect the L wire of the new fitting.

If this doesn't make sense, leave the job alone and get someone who does
have a grasp of what they're doing to wire it up!



Hmm. I was all set to go with this, then looked at the wires coming out of
the ceiling. There are *three* neutrals: one each for the mains and the
switch wires, and one emerging between them.

What's that about? Can I ignore it?




  #8  
Old November 7th 04, 05:34 PM
ARWadsworth
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Stefek Zaba" wrote in message
...
ARWadsworth wrote:
And try
http://www.userview.net/loop2.html
for a pretty picture of the conections.

What a pleasantly simple and accurate site!


I have used it before. Andy found plenty of faults on the site then.

Adam


  #9  
Old November 7th 04, 06:00 PM
Lobster
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Jonathan Baker-Bates" wrote in message
.. .
On Sat, 06 Nov 2004 16:20:57 +0000, Stefek Zaba wrote:

snip
OK. If you want to make the new connections "inside" the new fitting,
your job is basically to faithfully replicate the pattern of connections
inside the existing rose. So, label the wires of the existing cables
carefully. There are four, yes four, sets of cable cores which are being
connected together; so to replicate the existing interconnection you
need a 4-way section of "chocolate block" (terminal block) - if we're
talking doing the best job, try to find the sort which has little leaves
of spring metal clamping down the cable groups instead of just the bare
screw.

One way is for all the earths. One is for "all" the neutrals - if you've
just two cables as the moment, there's most likely just one black N to
which the existing pendant cable's blue core is connected, at one of the
outer of the three blocks in the ceiling rose. That's the one you
connect the N wire of the new fitting to, in the second way of the
choccie block. Next way is for all the permanent lives; again with just
two cables there should be just two of these, one in each cable,
currently connected to the middle one of the three long blocks in a line
across the middle of the rose, and each coloured red - though it's
possible that one's black instead, with or without a bit of red sleeving
or tape on it, if the switch wiring is done "the wrong way round". None
of the wires from your new fitting connects here. Final way is for the
"switched live" or "switch return" - should be just one core of one of
the cables, in the best case black with the bit of red tape/sleeving
mentioned above, if wired "the wrong way round" it'd be red instead, but
in either case currently connected to the other outer block of the rose
and where the brown core of the pendant flex is also connected; this way
is where you'll connect the L wire of the new fitting.

If this doesn't make sense, leave the job alone and get someone who does
have a grasp of what they're doing to wire it up!



Hmm. I was all set to go with this, then looked at the wires coming out of
the ceiling. There are *three* neutrals: one each for the mains and the
switch wires, and one emerging between them.

What's that about? Can I ignore it?


No don't do that! What you'll have is *two* mains cables entering the rose;
one providing power to this light, and then taking power away to feed the
next light, ie continuing the circuit. Together with the switch cable and
the one feeding the lightbulb, that makes 4.

I think the confusion has arisen because the link which somebody posted
earlier (http://www.userview.net/loop2.html)
shows the wiring for the last light on the circuit, where there's no 'next'
light to take power on to. There's a different diagram on the site for your
configuration - see http://www.userview.net/loop1.html

HTH
David



  #10  
Old November 7th 04, 06:20 PM
ARWadsworth
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Lobster" wrote in message
...

snip


Hmm. I was all set to go with this, then looked at the wires coming out

of
the ceiling. There are *three* neutrals: one each for the mains and the
switch wires, and one emerging between them.

What's that about? Can I ignore it?


No don't do that! What you'll have is *two* mains cables entering the

rose;
one providing power to this light, and then taking power away to feed the
next light, ie continuing the circuit. Together with the switch cable

and
the one feeding the lightbulb, that makes 4.

I think the confusion has arisen because the link which somebody posted
earlier (http://www.userview.net/loop2.html)


That was me. I deliberately posted that link as the OP said the were two
wires at the ceiling.

shows the wiring for the last light on the circuit, where there's no

'next'
light to take power on to. There's a different diagram on the site for

your
configuration - see http://www.userview.net/loop1.html


It may be the case that there are 3 T&E wires after the OP has had a closer
look, but he says there is just an extra neutral. It may be a black single
that is used for another light (usually an outside or wall light when wired
like this).

Adam


 




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