I have a small glass dome with a wooden base identical to the one shown
he

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...ase/p/80827902

I do entomology as a hobby and placed several butterflies in the dome
over the Summer and then sealed the base to the glass with silicone so
that small bugs could not enter and eat the specimens. I also hid some
moth flakes inside the dome to ward off these pests just in case they
broke through the seal. I didn't think I would have any issues
afterwards, but I am having one--- I can smell the moth balls outside
the dome, which means the wood is allowing the ball gases to escape.
This isn't good as it's a hazard to breathe moth ball gasses. For now,
I've moved the dome to an unoccupied area of the house until I find a
solution. Is it possible to coat the wooden base, up to the point where
it meets the silicone, with something to seal the wood and make it
airtight and, if so, what would it be? In a pinch, I was thinking of
melting wax and then "painting" it on the base, but not sure this would
work or even be effective.

Thanks in advance for any help.

On Tuesday, September 19, 2017 at 8:40:19 AM UTC-5, JBI wrote:
I have a small glass dome with a wooden base identical to the one shown
he

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...ase/p/80827902

I do entomology as a hobby and placed several butterflies in the dome
over the Summer and then sealed the base to the glass with silicone so
that small bugs could not enter and eat the specimens. I also hid some
moth flakes inside the dome to ward off these pests just in case they
broke through the seal. I didn't think I would have any issues
afterwards, but I am having one--- I can smell the moth balls outside
the dome, which means the wood is allowing the ball gases to escape.
This isn't good as it's a hazard to breathe moth ball gasses. For now,
I've moved the dome to an unoccupied area of the house until I find a
solution. Is it possible to coat the wooden base, up to the point where
it meets the silicone, with something to seal the wood and make it
airtight and, if so, what would it be? In a pinch, I was thinking of
melting wax and then "painting" it on the base, but not sure this would
work or even be effective.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Also consider, it may not be the wood that's the problem. Your silicone seal may have been compromised, allowing fumes to escape. If your dome unit was purchased, I would think the wood aspect has been sealed, hence giving credence to the silicone seal breakage.

Otherwise, seal the wood with pretty much any poly, lacquer or shellac. Lightly sand the wood before applying the finish. I would use shellac (Sealcoat, available at most any hardware/paint outlet).

Sonny

On 09/19/2017 09:52 AM, Sonny wrote:
On Tuesday, September 19, 2017 at 8:40:19 AM UTC-5, JBI wrote:
I have a small glass dome with a wooden base identical to the one shown
he

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...ase/p/80827902

I do entomology as a hobby and placed several butterflies in the dome
over the Summer and then sealed the base to the glass with silicone so
that small bugs could not enter and eat the specimens. I also hid some
moth flakes inside the dome to ward off these pests just in case they
broke through the seal. I didn't think I would have any issues
afterwards, but I am having one--- I can smell the moth balls outside
the dome, which means the wood is allowing the ball gases to escape.
This isn't good as it's a hazard to breathe moth ball gasses. For now,
I've moved the dome to an unoccupied area of the house until I find a
solution. Is it possible to coat the wooden base, up to the point where
it meets the silicone, with something to seal the wood and make it
airtight and, if so, what would it be? In a pinch, I was thinking of
melting wax and then "painting" it on the base, but not sure this would
work or even be effective.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Also consider, it may not be the wood that's the problem. Your silicone seal may have been compromised, allowing fumes to escape. If your dome unit was purchased, I would think the wood aspect has been sealed, hence giving credence to the silicone seal breakage.

Otherwise, seal the wood with pretty much any poly, lacquer or shellac. Lightly sand the wood before applying the finish. I would use shellac (Sealcoat, available at most any hardware/paint outlet).

Sonny


Thanks, Sonny. Went with shellac. Just applied it a while ago after
sanding. Waiting for final coat to dry (I used two coats). I can
already notice a decrease in mothball smell.

One additional question if you don't mind. I have two small
shadowboxes, one made from barnyard wood and the other walnut. They are
seen he

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...p/37947-TO0334

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...%22/p/80823342

Although I'm confident I sealed the rear side correctly since I used a
metal backing, I'm wondering how to seal the wooden frames. Could I
paint the frames with shellac? Thanks again!

On Tuesday, September 19, 2017 at 6:15:54 PM UTC-5, JBI wrote:
I have two small shadowboxes, one made from barnyard wood and the other walnut.
Could I paint the frames with shellac?

Yes. Watch for drips if you brush it on. Sealcoat comes in aerosol/spray cans, also.... may be easier to spray projects as these.

Optional:
The barnwood box, my preference.... I like the weathered-wood look, for some things. Consider leaving it raw wood, no sealing. You can always seal it later. Similar examples: Vertical planter boxes I made for the local Master Gardeners' fund raiser. Scroll right for more pics - https://www.flickr.com/photos/438361...in/photostream

Sonny

On 09/19/2017 08:13 PM, Sonny wrote:
On Tuesday, September 19, 2017 at 6:15:54 PM UTC-5, JBI wrote:
I have two small shadowboxes, one made from barnyard wood and the other walnut.
Could I paint the frames with shellac?

Yes. Watch for drips if you brush it on. Sealcoat comes in aerosol/spray cans, also.... may be easier to spray projects as these.

Optional:
The barnwood box, my preference.... I like the weathered-wood look, for some things. Consider leaving it raw wood, no sealing. You can always seal it later. Similar examples: Vertical planter boxes I made for the local Master Gardeners' fund raiser. Scroll right for more pics - https://www.flickr.com/photos/438361...in/photostream

Sonny



The sealing of the shadow boxes went well. I didn't mention it earlier,
but the two aforementioned ones I already had with insects inside plus
the same moth flake/ silica treatment and they were sure smelling.

I am now left with three unused domes that have either bare wood bases
or in one case, stained. I am thinking of going ahead and applying
shellac to the bases now so that they're ready to go for future sealing,
but I'm wondering if I should not apply shellac over the area where the
dome would be coupled to the base with the silicone? In other words, if
I paint the entire base with the shellac, and not avoid the sealing
area, would the silicone still form a seal with the shellac coated wood?

On 9/20/2017 11:51 AM, JBI wrote:


The sealing of the shadow boxes went well.Â* I didn't mention it earlier,
but the two aforementioned ones I already had with insects inside plus
the same moth flake/ silica treatment and they were sure smelling.


Curious, would it be beneficial to give the dome a shot of co2 to get
most of the oxygen out?

On Wednesday, September 20, 2017 at 10:51:34 AM UTC-5, JBI wrote:
if I paint the entire base with the shellac, and not avoid the sealing
area, would the silicone still form a seal with the shellac coated wood?

Yes. The silicone would form a sufficient enough seal with 'most any finish you apply. Even with your periodic breaking of the seal, the/any finish would likely remain intact for resealing, without having to refinish the base.

Sonny

On 09/19/2017 09:52 AM, Sonny wrote:
On Tuesday, September 19, 2017 at 8:40:19 AM UTC-5, JBI wrote:
I have a small glass dome with a wooden base identical to the one shown
he

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...ase/p/80827902

I do entomology as a hobby and placed several butterflies in the dome
over the Summer and then sealed the base to the glass with silicone so
that small bugs could not enter and eat the specimens. I also hid some
moth flakes inside the dome to ward off these pests just in case they
broke through the seal. I didn't think I would have any issues
afterwards, but I am having one--- I can smell the moth balls outside
the dome, which means the wood is allowing the ball gases to escape.
This isn't good as it's a hazard to breathe moth ball gasses. For now,
I've moved the dome to an unoccupied area of the house until I find a
solution. Is it possible to coat the wooden base, up to the point where
it meets the silicone, with something to seal the wood and make it
airtight and, if so, what would it be? In a pinch, I was thinking of
melting wax and then "painting" it on the base, but not sure this would
work or even be effective.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Also consider, it may not be the wood that's the problem. Your silicone seal may have been compromised, allowing fumes to escape. If your dome unit was purchased, I would think the wood aspect has been sealed, hence giving credence to the silicone seal breakage.

Otherwise, seal the wood with pretty much any poly, lacquer or shellac. Lightly sand the wood before applying the finish. I would use shellac (Sealcoat, available at most any hardware/paint outlet).

Sonny


Thanks, Sonny. Went with shellac. Just applied it a while ago after
sanding. Waiting for final coat to dry (I used two coats). I can
already notice a decrease in mothball smell.

One additional question if you don't mind. I have two small
shadowboxes, one made from barnyard wood and the other walnut. They are
seen he

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...p/37947-TO0334

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...%22/p/80823342

Although I'm confident I sealed the rear side correctly since I used a
metal backing, I'm wondering how to seal the wooden frames. Could I
paint the frames with shellac? Thanks again!

JBI writes:
On 09/19/2017 09:52 AM, Sonny wrote:
On Tuesday, September 19, 2017 at 8:40:19 AM UTC-5, JBI wrote:
I have a small glass dome with a wooden base identical to the one shown
he

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...ase/p/80827902

I do entomology as a hobby and placed several butterflies in the dome
over the Summer and then sealed the base to the glass with silicone so
that small bugs could not enter and eat the specimens. I also hid some
moth flakes inside the dome to ward off these pests just in case they
broke through the seal. I didn't think I would have any issues
afterwards, but I am having one--- I can smell the moth balls outside
the dome, which means the wood is allowing the ball gases to escape.
This isn't good as it's a hazard to breathe moth ball gasses. For now,
I've moved the dome to an unoccupied area of the house until I find a
solution. Is it possible to coat the wooden base, up to the point where
it meets the silicone, with something to seal the wood and make it
airtight and, if so, what would it be? In a pinch, I was thinking of
melting wax and then "painting" it on the base, but not sure this would
work or even be effective.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Also consider, it may not be the wood that's the problem. Your silicone seal may have been compromised, allowing fumes to escape. If your dome unit was purchased, I would think the wood aspect has been sealed, hence giving credence to the silicone seal breakage.

Otherwise, seal the wood with pretty much any poly, lacquer or shellac. Lightly sand the wood before applying the finish. I would use shellac (Sealcoat, available at most any hardware/paint outlet).

Sonny


Thanks, Sonny. Went with shellac. Just applied it a while ago after
sanding. Waiting for final coat to dry (I used two coats). I can
already notice a decrease in mothball smell.

One additional question if you don't mind. I have two small
shadowboxes, one made from barnyard wood and the other walnut. They are
seen he

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...p/37947-TO0334

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...%22/p/80823342

That's not walnut. It's MDF. Yet another reason not to patronize
hobby looby.

On Tuesday, September 19, 2017 at 8:40:19 AM UTC-5, JBI wrote:
I have a small glass dome with a wooden base identical to the one shown
he

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...ase/p/80827902

I do entomology as a hobby and placed several butterflies in the dome
over the Summer and then sealed the base to the glass with silicone so
that small bugs could not enter and eat the specimens. I also hid some
moth flakes inside the dome to ward off these pests just in case they
broke through the seal. I didn't think I would have any issues
afterwards, but I am having one--- I can smell the moth balls outside
the dome, which means the wood is allowing the ball gases to escape.
This isn't good as it's a hazard to breathe moth ball gasses. For now,
I've moved the dome to an unoccupied area of the house until I find a
solution. Is it possible to coat the wooden base, up to the point where
it meets the silicone, with something to seal the wood and make it
airtight and, if so, what would it be? In a pinch, I was thinking of
melting wax and then "painting" it on the base, but not sure this would
work or even be effective.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Shellac does a wonderful job of sealing, as you are discovering. The other option for your glass domes (assuming you do not want to open them) is to put a thin coat of epoxy on the rim of the dome and seat it in place.

On 09/20/2017 07:50 AM, Dr. Deb wrote:
On Tuesday, September 19, 2017 at 8:40:19 AM UTC-5, JBI wrote:
I have a small glass dome with a wooden base identical to the one shown
he

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...ase/p/80827902

I do entomology as a hobby and placed several butterflies in the dome
over the Summer and then sealed the base to the glass with silicone so
that small bugs could not enter and eat the specimens. I also hid some
moth flakes inside the dome to ward off these pests just in case they
broke through the seal. I didn't think I would have any issues
afterwards, but I am having one--- I can smell the moth balls outside
the dome, which means the wood is allowing the ball gases to escape.
This isn't good as it's a hazard to breathe moth ball gasses. For now,
I've moved the dome to an unoccupied area of the house until I find a
solution. Is it possible to coat the wooden base, up to the point where
it meets the silicone, with something to seal the wood and make it
airtight and, if so, what would it be? In a pinch, I was thinking of
melting wax and then "painting" it on the base, but not sure this would
work or even be effective.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Shellac does a wonderful job of sealing, as you are discovering. The other option for your glass domes (assuming you do not want to open them) is to put a thin coat of epoxy on the rim of the dome and seat it in place.


Thanks. They probably will have to be opened from time to time if for
no other reason than to check on the silica gel and moth flakes that are
inside. I had to open one once already and simply cutting through the
silicone with a sharp knife did the trick. If I was never going to
reopen them, I would have definitely gone with the epoxy option as you
suggest.

On Tuesday, September 19, 2017 at 8:40:19 AM UTC-5, JBI wrote:

I do entomology as a hobby....

Come to think of it, for years, it's been common to see luna moths in August... they come out at night for about a two week period, often unexpectedly flying in front of your vehicle, while driving, certainly catches one's attention. They're almost as large as your hand. Since childhood, it's been kinna neat catching and observing one or two, then release it. And these days, catch & show the younger folks, giving them this experience.

I don't recall seeing any this year. I hope there hasn't been any pesticide use, or such, to have diminished their population.
https://www.google.com/search?q=luna...w=1920&bih=950

Sonny

On 09/20/2017 04:16 PM, Sonny wrote:
On Tuesday, September 19, 2017 at 8:40:19 AM UTC-5, JBI wrote:

I do entomology as a hobby....

Come to think of it, for years, it's been common to see luna moths in August... they come out at night for about a two week period, often unexpectedly flying in front of your vehicle, while driving, certainly catches one's attention. They're almost as large as your hand. Since childhood, it's been kinna neat catching and observing one or two, then release it. And these days, catch & show the younger folks, giving them this experience.

I don't recall seeing any this year. I hope there hasn't been any pesticide use, or such, to have diminished their population.
https://www.google.com/search?q=luna...w=1920&bih=950

Sonny


I hope to come across one. The last one was one my father brought home
when I was a teen, about 30 years ago. He was a truck driver in the
summer and hauled tomatoes/ beans out of the fields during the summer.
He'd end up bringing home all sorts of critters from the lunas to snakes
and garden spiders. Unfortunately, I didn't know much about drying and
framing in those days, so I must have discarded it. They only live a
week once they emerge from their cocoon, don't eat, and simply spend
their living time to mate. Next summer, I am considering building a
moth trap that uses a mercury lamp in the center to attract them.
Either that, or just order a cocoon and let it come out of that. I have
a butterfly trap that I set up towards the end of summer this season and
it brought in some fairly sizeable moths also during overnight hours.

By the way, thanks for your followup on the shellac. I'm in the process
of sanding and coating the unused bases now.

On 9/19/2017 8:40 AM, JBI wrote:
I have a small glass dome with a wooden base identical to the one shown
he

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...ase/p/80827902


I do entomology as a hobby and placed several butterflies in the dome
over the Summer and then sealed the base to the glass with silicone so
that small bugs could not enter and eat the specimens.Â* I also hid some
moth flakes inside the dome to ward off these pests just in case they
broke through the seal.Â* I didn't think I would have any issues
afterwards, but I am having one--- I can smell the moth balls outside
the dome, which means the wood is allowing the ball gases to escape.
This isn't good as it's a hazard to breathe moth ball gasses. For now,
I've moved the dome to an unoccupied area of the house until I find a
solution.Â* Is it possible to coat the wooden base, up to the point where
it meets the silicone, with something to seal the wood and make it
airtight and, if so, what would it be?Â* In a pinch, I was thinking of
melting wax and then "painting" it on the base, but not sure this would
work or even be effective.

Thanks in advance for any help.


Thoughts after all the ideas.

Some silicone off gasses are pretty nasty smelling as thy cure. IMHO it
might not be a stretch to think that those gasses are inside the dome
too. do you think that would have an adverse effect on the eminences?

Maybe you need an air tight gasket.

On 9/21/2017 5:13 PM, Leon wrote:



Thoughts after all the ideas.

Some silicone off gasses are pretty nasty smelling as thy cure.Â* IMHO it
might not be a stretch to think that those gasses are inside the dome
too.Â* do you think that would have an adverse effect on the


Specimens?


Maybe you need an air tight gasket.

"JBI" wrote in message news
I have a small glass dome with a wooden base identical to the one shown
he

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...ase/p/80827902

Perhaps having plate glass disks cut that loosely fit the inside diameter of
the domes would work... Silicone "glue" them to the domes and place the
domes on the wooden base to press the disk into final position.

I just wanted to update since I sealed all dome bases with the shellac.
Once I had fans no longer running (to either help dry the dome bases or
for other reasons), within a short time, I could start smelling the moth
balls. I didn't think it was too bad until I was out of the house for
much of the past weekend. When I arrived home, upon opening the door
and entering the house, the smell was overwhelming.

I am disappointed. I carefully coated all bases with at least two coats
of shellac. My guess is that the mothball gases still somehow penetrate
the silicone seal of glass dome to wooden base, or because I couldn't
seal with shellac any wood under the glass dome, perhaps the gas gets
through there too, but originally I thought the outer sealing would stop
it. I guess I only have two choices: 1) cut silicone seals to be able
to open the domes and remove the moth ball bags, then reseal without
moth balls, or, 2) place the complete dome as it is now in a larger,
sealable container. My local Walmart has some large acrylic jars with a
lockable seal. Problem is that, for the size I'd need, they're
expensive. I'm probably going to go with the first option above.

Thanks again for all those who tried to help. I guess it's just not
going to work out this way.


On 09/19/2017 09:40 AM, JBI wrote:
I have a small glass dome with a wooden base identical to the one shown
he

http://www.hobbylobby.com/Home-Decor...ase/p/80827902


I do entomology as a hobby and placed several butterflies in the dome
over the Summer and then sealed the base to the glass with silicone so
that small bugs could not enter and eat the specimens.Â* I also hid some
moth flakes inside the dome to ward off these pests just in case they
broke through the seal.Â* I didn't think I would have any issues
afterwards, but I am having one--- I can smell the moth balls outside
the dome, which means the wood is allowing the ball gases to escape.
This isn't good as it's a hazard to breathe moth ball gasses. For now,
I've moved the dome to an unoccupied area of the house until I find a
solution.Â* Is it possible to coat the wooden base, up to the point where
it meets the silicone, with something to seal the wood and make it
airtight and, if so, what would it be?Â* In a pinch, I was thinking of
melting wax and then "painting" it on the base, but not sure this would
work or even be effective.

Thanks in advance for any help.

On Monday, October 2, 2017 at 11:39:51 AM UTC-4, JBI wrote:
I just wanted to update since I sealed all dome bases with the shellac.
Once I had fans no longer running (to either help dry the dome bases or
for other reasons), within a short time, I could start smelling the moth
balls. I didn't think it was too bad until I was out of the house for
much of the past weekend. When I arrived home, upon opening the door
and entering the house, the smell was overwhelming.

I am disappointed. I carefully coated all bases with at least two coats
of shellac. My guess is that the mothball gases still somehow penetrate
the silicone seal of glass dome to wooden base, or because I couldn't
seal with shellac any wood under the glass dome, perhaps the gas gets
through there too, but originally I thought the outer sealing would stop
it. I guess I only have two choices: 1) cut silicone seals to be able
to open the domes and remove the moth ball bags, then reseal without
moth balls, or, 2) place the complete dome as it is now in a larger,
sealable container. My local Walmart has some large acrylic jars with a
lockable seal. Problem is that, for the size I'd need, they're
expensive. I'm probably going to go with the first option above.

Thanks again for all those who tried to help. I guess it's just not
going to work out this way.


Aren't there any forums for folks like yourself, i.e. hobbyist entomologists?

Perhaps the problem isn't the wood, maybe it's the mothballs. Have you checked with
other groups as far as what they do to accomplish their display/preservation needs?

On 10/02/2017 02:17 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Monday, October 2, 2017 at 11:39:51 AM UTC-4, JBI wrote:
I just wanted to update since I sealed all dome bases with the shellac.
Once I had fans no longer running (to either help dry the dome bases or
for other reasons), within a short time, I could start smelling the moth
balls. I didn't think it was too bad until I was out of the house for
much of the past weekend. When I arrived home, upon opening the door
and entering the house, the smell was overwhelming.

I am disappointed. I carefully coated all bases with at least two coats
of shellac. My guess is that the mothball gases still somehow penetrate
the silicone seal of glass dome to wooden base, or because I couldn't
seal with shellac any wood under the glass dome, perhaps the gas gets
through there too, but originally I thought the outer sealing would stop
it. I guess I only have two choices: 1) cut silicone seals to be able
to open the domes and remove the moth ball bags, then reseal without
moth balls, or, 2) place the complete dome as it is now in a larger,
sealable container. My local Walmart has some large acrylic jars with a
lockable seal. Problem is that, for the size I'd need, they're
expensive. I'm probably going to go with the first option above.

Thanks again for all those who tried to help. I guess it's just not
going to work out this way.


Aren't there any forums for folks like yourself, i.e. hobbyist entomologists?

Perhaps the problem isn't the wood, maybe it's the mothballs. Have you checked with
other groups as far as what they do to accomplish their display/preservation needs?


I tried posting the issues in a couple of the entomology forums I belong
to, but most responses were not to even use the dome, but "Riker
mounts", which are like a shadow box frame except the Riker has a good
seal built in, and then to lock them in a drawer somewhere.

People that have domes often just glue the glass to base and place
nothing inside either to deter pests or moisture. They count on the
seal to do the job of keeping the pests out. I'm probably going to have
to go this route except I'm going to keep active silica gel inside to
keep humidity minimal. As for the moth flakes, I'm just going to have
to remove them. The insects were all toaster oven dried for at least a
week, and then placed into a sealed container with a lot of silica gel
for at least a month. I feel quite confident there won't be any mold
issues and there shouldn't be pests either as long as the silicone seal
is intact.

On Mon, 2 Oct 2017 21:05:35 -0400, JBI wrote:

On 10/02/2017 02:17 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Monday, October 2, 2017 at 11:39:51 AM UTC-4, JBI wrote:
I just wanted to update since I sealed all dome bases with the shellac.
Once I had fans no longer running (to either help dry the dome bases or
for other reasons), within a short time, I could start smelling the moth
balls. I didn't think it was too bad until I was out of the house for
much of the past weekend. When I arrived home, upon opening the door
and entering the house, the smell was overwhelming.

I am disappointed. I carefully coated all bases with at least two coats
of shellac. My guess is that the mothball gases still somehow penetrate
the silicone seal of glass dome to wooden base, or because I couldn't
seal with shellac any wood under the glass dome, perhaps the gas gets
through there too, but originally I thought the outer sealing would stop
it. I guess I only have two choices: 1) cut silicone seals to be able
to open the domes and remove the moth ball bags, then reseal without
moth balls, or, 2) place the complete dome as it is now in a larger,
sealable container. My local Walmart has some large acrylic jars with a
lockable seal. Problem is that, for the size I'd need, they're
expensive. I'm probably going to go with the first option above.

Thanks again for all those who tried to help. I guess it's just not
going to work out this way.


Aren't there any forums for folks like yourself, i.e. hobbyist entomologists?

Perhaps the problem isn't the wood, maybe it's the mothballs. Have you checked with
other groups as far as what they do to accomplish their display/preservation needs?


I tried posting the issues in a couple of the entomology forums I belong
to, but most responses were not to even use the dome, but "Riker
mounts", which are like a shadow box frame except the Riker has a good
seal built in, and then to lock them in a drawer somewhere.

People that have domes often just glue the glass to base and place
nothing inside either to deter pests or moisture. They count on the
seal to do the job of keeping the pests out. I'm probably going to have
to go this route except I'm going to keep active silica gel inside to
keep humidity minimal. As for the moth flakes, I'm just going to have
to remove them. The insects were all toaster oven dried for at least a
week, and then placed into a sealed container with a lot of silica gel
for at least a month. I feel quite confident there won't be any mold
issues and there shouldn't be pests either as long as the silicone seal
is intact.

Just a thought but you might want to consider a lacquer seal instead
of silicone.. Glyptal lacquer is used in high vacuum work--very
little gets past it. Probably not what you want to use--the color is
hideous--but you aren't trying to hold a high vacuum either.

On 10/02/2017 11:03 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
On Mon, 2 Oct 2017 21:05:35 -0400, JBI wrote:

On 10/02/2017 02:17 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Monday, October 2, 2017 at 11:39:51 AM UTC-4, JBI wrote:
I just wanted to update since I sealed all dome bases with the shellac.
Once I had fans no longer running (to either help dry the dome bases or
for other reasons), within a short time, I could start smelling the moth
balls. I didn't think it was too bad until I was out of the house for
much of the past weekend. When I arrived home, upon opening the door
and entering the house, the smell was overwhelming.

I am disappointed. I carefully coated all bases with at least two coats
of shellac. My guess is that the mothball gases still somehow penetrate
the silicone seal of glass dome to wooden base, or because I couldn't
seal with shellac any wood under the glass dome, perhaps the gas gets
through there too, but originally I thought the outer sealing would stop
it. I guess I only have two choices: 1) cut silicone seals to be able
to open the domes and remove the moth ball bags, then reseal without
moth balls, or, 2) place the complete dome as it is now in a larger,
sealable container. My local Walmart has some large acrylic jars with a
lockable seal. Problem is that, for the size I'd need, they're
expensive. I'm probably going to go with the first option above.

Thanks again for all those who tried to help. I guess it's just not
going to work out this way.


Aren't there any forums for folks like yourself, i.e. hobbyist entomologists?

Perhaps the problem isn't the wood, maybe it's the mothballs. Have you checked with
other groups as far as what they do to accomplish their display/preservation needs?


I tried posting the issues in a couple of the entomology forums I belong
to, but most responses were not to even use the dome, but "Riker
mounts", which are like a shadow box frame except the Riker has a good
seal built in, and then to lock them in a drawer somewhere.

People that have domes often just glue the glass to base and place
nothing inside either to deter pests or moisture. They count on the
seal to do the job of keeping the pests out. I'm probably going to have
to go this route except I'm going to keep active silica gel inside to
keep humidity minimal. As for the moth flakes, I'm just going to have
to remove them. The insects were all toaster oven dried for at least a
week, and then placed into a sealed container with a lot of silica gel
for at least a month. I feel quite confident there won't be any mold
issues and there shouldn't be pests either as long as the silicone seal
is intact.

Just a thought but you might want to consider a lacquer seal instead
of silicone.. Glyptal lacquer is used in high vacuum work--very
little gets past it. Probably not what you want to use--the color is
hideous--but you aren't trying to hold a high vacuum either.



I'm beginning to think that the problem is in fact that the base inside
of the dome wasn't sealed with shellac. I had removed both the domes
and the shadow boxes from the living room and placed them in one of the
bedrooms and closed the door until I had time to redo them. Today, I
decided to redo the domes. One dome came off easily after a cut the
silicone around the base; the other dome glass cracked while removing
it, luckily I had a spare dome glass. This time, I drilled a 3/4" hole
in the bases so I could either discretely add and remove silica gel or
moth flakes, etc. There is an "observation area" on the top side,
within the dome, but carefully placed (as to not be an eyesore), so that
I can see the condition of the silica gel. If it turn pink, I'll just
peel off the aluminum tape I sealed over the hole on the bottom side,
empty the existing silica and replace with new.

With the domes out of the bedroom where I had them stored, I still had
the shadow boxes in the bedroom. When I had to go into the room later
in the day, I didn't notice any moth ball odor unlike when I had the
domes in there too. Since I completely shellac coated the shadow boxes
(all wooden surfaces), I bet it created a good enough seal to keep the
moth gases contained. Perhaps the suggestions were correct that I
should have completely coated the wood underneath the dome as well, but
the problem is that I would have to remove the carefully placed bark and
branches to clear the base.

Well, I'm pretty happy now. At least I can check on the moisture
content by the silica color and easily change it out if I need to. As
long as the seal is tight, pests shouldn't be an issue and mold can be
prevented by keeping silica gel active.

On 10/2/2017 11:39 AM, JBI wrote:
I just wanted to update since I sealed all dome bases with the shellac.
Once I had fans no longer running (to either help dry the dome bases or
for other reasons), within a short time, I could start smelling the moth
balls.Â* I didn't think it was too bad until I was out of the house for
much of the past weekend.Â* When I arrived home, upon opening the door
and entering the house, the smell was overwhelming.

I am disappointed.Â* I carefully coated all bases with at least two coats
of shellac.Â* My guess is that the mothball gases still somehow penetrate
the silicone seal of glass dome to wooden base, or because I couldn't
seal with shellac any wood under the glass dome, perhaps the gas gets
through there too, but originally I thought the outer sealing would stop
it.Â* I guess I only have two choices: 1) cut silicone seals to be able
to open the domes and remove the moth ball bags, then reseal without
moth balls, or, 2) place the complete dome as it is now in a larger,
sealable container.

I'd have thought the shellac would do the job but it seems you only did
it on the outside. You still have alternatives to consider. I'd try an
epoxy coating on the inside.

On 10/02/2017 03:30 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 10/2/2017 11:39 AM, JBI wrote:
I just wanted to update since I sealed all dome bases with the
shellac. Once I had fans no longer running (to either help dry the
dome bases or for other reasons), within a short time, I could start
smelling the moth balls.Â* I didn't think it was too bad until I was
out of the house for much of the past weekend.Â* When I arrived home,
upon opening the door and entering the house, the smell was overwhelming.

I am disappointed.Â* I carefully coated all bases with at least two
coats of shellac.Â* My guess is that the mothball gases still somehow
penetrate the silicone seal of glass dome to wooden base, or because I
couldn't seal with shellac any wood under the glass dome, perhaps the
gas gets through there too, but originally I thought the outer sealing
would stop it.Â* I guess I only have two choices: 1) cut silicone seals
to be able to open the domes and remove the moth ball bags, then
reseal without moth balls, or, 2) place the complete dome as it is now
in a larger, sealable container.

I'd have thought the shellac would do the job but it seems you only did
it on the outside. You still have alternatives to consider.Â* I'd try an
epoxy coating on the inside.

The problem here is that I have branches, bark, etc along with the
insects already glued to the dome base and all of that would have to be
removed first. If I'm going to open it, I'll just have to remove the
moth ball bags, but keep the silica gel bags, and reseal. Since the
flakes have already been in there for a month anyway, and act as a
fumigant, the residue should remain hopefully for long enough until
resealed and the silica brings the humidity back down to low levels.
The big threat of a preservation like this is mold (from excessive
humidity), and pests that eat the insects (if not well sealed in their
enclosure).

Just wanted to update my initial thread. I decided to go with
hermetically sealed acrylic canisters (the kind used for airtight food
storage). I decided to keep the wooden bases from the original domes
because I already had the butterfly environments glued to them (along
with the butterflies), so removal of all of that would be prohibitive.
The task was then trying to find a suitably sized canister. I couldn't
source them locally, but I was able to get ones close to the size I'd
need online... all I had to do was carefully sand the perimeter of the
wooden bases a bit so they would fit into the canister. To save time, I
used my angle grinder as that part of the base would be hidden by the
canister band anyway (I am using the canisters inverted for display).
The air from the grinder detached two butterflies and I lost antennae on
two others, but a little careful repair work and all back to normal. An
hour later and the new environment is all set up. With the hermetic
seal, I have several moth flakes inside, along with silica gel, and
there was even enough room on the underside to add a humidity meter.
Two hours later and the humidity has dropped significantly and I don't
smell a trace of the moth flakes! And this environment is a lot easier
to service if it ever needs it as there's no gluing that needed done!

Now in all fairness to the original bases with glass, I believe that if
I had sealed the entire base with shellac, I think this would have
worked when used with the silicone sealant. One my two existing unused
domes, the plan will be to file down the bases so that they just fit
into the dome glass; there will then be a round metal base underneath
and the silicone seal will be the glass to the metal base. Someone had
suggested a glass base early on and I may do that if I can find the
right diameter glass, but I'll just use cut out aluminum flashing in a
pinch and no one will see this underneath the original dome base. With
the metal to glass seal with silicone, I'm confident moth gasses won't
get through, but I'll do my first dome just as a test to be sure.

Well, that's the progress that's been made up to now. Really happy with
the acrylic canisters, just don't want to have too many unused glass
domes!

On Tue, 19 Sep 2017 09:40:13 -0400
JBI wrote:


afterwards, but I am having one--- I can smell the moth balls outside
the dome, which means the wood is allowing the ball gases to escape.
This isn't good as it's a hazard to breathe moth ball gasses. For


not sure what mothballs are made of but i think poly coatings are
close to inert once they have cured completely

i always thought they vacuum sealed those kind of displays

On 10/14/2017 10:08 PM, Electric Comet wrote:
On Tue, 19 Sep 2017 09:40:13 -0400
JBI wrote:


afterwards, but I am having one--- I can smell the moth balls outside
the dome, which means the wood is allowing the ball gases to escape.
This isn't good as it's a hazard to breathe moth ball gasses. For


not sure what mothballs are made of but i think poly coatings are
close to inert once they have cured completely

The particular moth crystals I'm using are made of paradichlorobenzene
which, if breathed for too long, can be damaging to anything living
around it. That's why it was essential to have a sealed enough
environment to make the out gassing factor negligible. The problem I
had was that I was unable to seal the base domes completely as the out
gassing issue was discovered only after I had completed the dome
environments. I turned here for suggestions and several coats of
shellac were suggested. While this appeared to work somewhat, I wasn't
able to seal the tops of the wooden bases completely since I already had
the environments glued in place and I believe these still unsealed areas
was where the moth crystal gases escaped.


i always thought they vacuum sealed those kind of displays


I'm not sure how or even if this should be done since the butterflies
inside are already fragile to begin with. My solution turned out to be
using hermetically sealed acrylic canisters. No out gassing issues or
gluing, so the environment inside can easily be changed, updated, or
repaired at any future time.

On Tuesday, October 17, 2017 at 11:23:23 AM UTC-4, JBI wrote:
On 10/14/2017 10:08 PM, Electric Comet wrote:
On Tue, 19 Sep 2017 09:40:13 -0400
JBI wrote:


afterwards, but I am having one--- I can smell the moth balls outside
the dome, which means the wood is allowing the ball gases to escape.
This isn't good as it's a hazard to breathe moth ball gasses. For


not sure what mothballs are made of but i think poly coatings are
close to inert once they have cured completely

The particular moth crystals I'm using are made of paradichlorobenzene
which, if breathed for too long, can be damaging to anything living
around it. That's why it was essential to have a sealed enough
environment to make the out gassing factor negligible. The problem I
had was that I was unable to seal the base domes completely as the out
gassing issue was discovered only after I had completed the dome
environments. I turned here for suggestions and several coats of
shellac were suggested. While this appeared to work somewhat, I wasn't
able to seal the tops of the wooden bases completely since I already had
the environments glued in place and I believe these still unsealed areas
was where the moth crystal gases escaped.


i always thought they vacuum sealed those kind of displays


I'm not sure how or even if this should be done since the butterflies
inside are already fragile to begin with. My solution turned out to be
using hermetically sealed acrylic canisters. No out gassing issues or
gluing, so the environment inside can easily be changed, updated, or
repaired at any future time.

Hermetically sealed? It's too bad that Ed McMahon passed away. He could have helped.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9m_dT0wsrGI

On Tue, 17 Oct 2017 11:23:17 -0400
JBI wrote:

i always thought they vacuum sealed those kind of displays


I'm not sure how or even if this should be done since the butterflies
inside are already fragile to begin with. My solution turned out to
be using hermetically sealed acrylic canisters. No out gassing
issues or gluing, so the environment inside can easily be changed,
updated, or repaired at any future time.

always thought that removing all the air using vacuum was a harmless
process


thought that if there is air still inside that would degrade the
specimen

so keeping air from getting in is good but also have to remove all
the air inside

I use the same domes to display preserved flowers but I am having a different problem. The dome keeps fogging up after a couple of weeks. I am sealing it, and it seems to work, but eventually fogs up again. Any suggestions as to how to fix the problem or knowledge if what is causing the problem? Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated. I am at a total loss...

On Wednesday, May 27, 2020 at 1:58:30 PM UTC-5, wrote:
I use the same domes to display preserved flowers but I am having a different problem. The dome keeps fogging up after a couple of weeks. I am sealing it, and it seems to work, but eventually fogs up again. Any suggestions as to how to fix the problem or knowledge if what is causing the problem? Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated. I am at a total loss...

Well, the plants have a moisture content. I'd suspect that's your source of moisture. This link has a nice video showing two simple techniques for drying flowers and maintaining color.
https://www.google.com/search?q=how+...BO-H_QaHrr1A53

I like the tip of spraying the dried flower with an acrylic sealant, similarly as spraying charcoal sketches with hair spray. It seals the charcoal onto the canvas, paper, or wood.

Charcoal on wood, sealed with hair spray:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/438361...in/photostream

I would suspect you are not drying your plants well enough and/or not sealing them as well as might be. .... unless I'm missing something in your process/processes not revealed in your posting.

Sonny

On 5/27/2020 3:37 PM, Sonny wrote:
On Wednesday, May 27, 2020 at 1:58:30 PM UTC-5, wrote:
I use the same domes to display preserved flowers but I am having a different problem. The dome keeps fogging up after a couple of weeks. I am sealing it, and it seems to work, but eventually fogs up again. Any suggestions as to how to fix the problem or knowledge if what is causing the problem? Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated. I am at a total loss...

Well, the plants have a moisture content. I'd suspect that's your source of moisture. This link has a nice video showing two simple techniques for drying flowers and maintaining color.
https://www.google.com/search?q=how+...BO-H_QaHrr1A53

I like the tip of spraying the dried flower with an acrylic sealant, similarly as spraying charcoal sketches with hair spray. It seals the charcoal onto the canvas, paper, or wood.

Charcoal on wood, sealed with hair spray:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/438361...in/photostream

I would suspect you are not drying your plants well enough and/or not sealing them as well as might be. .... unless I'm missing something in your process/processes not revealed in your posting.

Sonny


As in how is the OP "sealing" the wood base (and I am NOT referring to
the seam of the glass dome and base?

On Wednesday, May 27, 2020 at 3:47:35 PM UTC-5, Unquestionably Confused wrote:
On 5/27/2020 3:37 PM, Sonny wrote:
On Wednesday, May 27, 2020 at 1:58:30 PM UTC-5, wrote:
I use the same domes to display preserved flowers but I am having a different problem. The dome keeps fogging up after a couple of weeks. I am sealing it, and it seems to work, but eventually fogs up again. Any suggestions as to how to fix the problem or knowledge if what is causing the problem? Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated. I am at a total loss...

Well, the plants have a moisture content. I'd suspect that's your source of moisture. This link has a nice video showing two simple techniques for drying flowers and maintaining color.
https://www.google.com/search?q=how+...BO-H_QaHrr1A53

I like the tip of spraying the dried flower with an acrylic sealant, similarly as spraying charcoal sketches with hair spray. It seals the charcoal onto the canvas, paper, or wood.

Charcoal on wood, sealed with hair spray:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/438361...in/photostream

I would suspect you are not drying your plants well enough and/or not sealing them as well as might be. .... unless I'm missing something in your process/processes not revealed in your posting.

Sonny


As in how is the OP "sealing" the wood base (and I am NOT referring to
the seam of the glass dome and base?

The video states/shows how to seal the plant, itself, once dried, with an acrylic sealant. Sealing the plant/flower may disallow additional moisture, if any, from escaping from the plant.

The problem, or part of, may be with the dome-base seal, as well. If the interior is fogging up, I'm thinking that's too much moisture for the main issue to be the dome-base seal. I'm thinking the main moisture source is from the plant/plants, itself/themselves. The more plant mass under the dome, the more potential moisture?

We may need more info from the OP to know if/how the plants are being dried.. He/She states they are preserved, so I'm assuming there is some expertise about drying or preserving. I'm not very knowledgeable about preserving plants.

Sonny

Thank you. We have a machine that freeze dries the flowers, so there is no moisture left in them. We use silicone packets and the flowers are also coated with plasti-dip after being processed.
We also display the same flowers in dome frames of varying sizes and never have this problem with the frames, only the smaller domes.
Thank you for you suggestions.

wrote in
:

Thank you. We have a machine that freeze dries the flowers, so there
is no moisture left in them. We use silicone packets and the flowers
are also coated with plasti-dip after being processed. We also display
the same flowers in dome frames of varying sizes and never have this
problem with the frames, only the smaller domes. Thank you for you
suggestions.


How is your wood finished? Some wood finishes offgas for some time or let
moisture pass through.

Puckdropper

I purchased it already finished. Not sure... maybe I should try coating it with something additional before sealing it.

wrote in
:

I use the same domes to display preserved flowers but I am having a
different problem. The dome keeps fogging up after a couple of weeks.
I am sealing it, and it seems to work, but eventually fogs up again.
Any suggestions as to how to fix the problem or knowledge if what is
causing the problem? Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.
I am at a total loss...


Air sometimes contains a lot of moisture. Besides sealing as Sonny
suggests, it might be worth installing some dessiccant packs/powder
somewhere in the dome.

Sometimes it's better to not seal at all, though. A couple of vent holes
might be just what your flowers and jars need.

Puckdropper

Why not just make your shadow boxes or plinths from camphorwood? Old school cabinetmakers used to line their blanket chests with it to keep moths away.

https://www.exotichardwoods.co.uk/Wo...t/Boxmaker.asp

Cheers,

Frank