DeWALT Focuses on “Made in the USA”

DeWALT’s 1.2-million square foot facility that straddles the
North/South Carolina border is now not only a distribution center, but
also DeWALT’s fully functional Charlotte Manufacturing Operation,
creating more than 350 new jobs.

Craig Zielinski, director of manufacturing, says DeWALT has determined
that it now can make cordless power tools affordably and well here in
America. Plus, end users want American-made tools.

Certain components of the tools are “globally sourced,” because,
Zielinski says, there simply aren’t stateside suppliers with the
expertise for everything these days.

DeWALT currently maintains manufacturing facilities in six states,
with components and accessories coming from three states. Since
opening the Charlotte assembly plant, aka “Project Eagle,” the company
has launched Project Eagle II, to add cordless tool manufacturing in
Greenfield, Indiana. All told, DeWALT employs approximately 1,800
people stateside. — Chris Marsha

*Tools produced at the Charlotte facility include variations of
18-volt tools and 20V MAX* hammer drills, drill/drivers, impact
drivers and recip saws.

**DeWALT’s Charlotte facility has assembled 4 million cordless tools,
built 2 million electric motors and driven around 45 million screws
since kicking off in 2013.

On 8/19/2015 2:10 PM, Casper wrote:
DeWALT Focuses on “Made in the USA”

DeWALT’s 1.2-million square foot facility that straddles the
North/South Carolina border is now not only a distribution center, but
also DeWALT’s fully functional Charlotte Manufacturing Operation,
creating more than 350 new jobs.

Craig Zielinski, director of manufacturing, says DeWALT has determined
that it now can make cordless power tools affordably and well here in
America. Plus, end users want American-made tools.

Certain components of the tools are “globally sourced,” because,
Zielinski says, there simply aren’t stateside suppliers with the
expertise for everything these days.

DeWALT currently maintains manufacturing facilities in six states,
with components and accessories coming from three states. Since
opening the Charlotte assembly plant, aka “Project Eagle,” the company
has launched Project Eagle II, to add cordless tool manufacturing in
Greenfield, Indiana. All told, DeWALT employs approximately 1,800
people stateside. — Chris Marsha

*Tools produced at the Charlotte facility include variations of
18-volt tools and 20V MAX* hammer drills, drill/drivers, impact
drivers and recip saws.

**DeWALT’s Charlotte facility has assembled 4 million cordless tools,
built 2 million electric motors and driven around 45 million screws
since kicking off in 2013.



Good news
Affordable cordless tools. This seems to be a trend or at least they
are becoming less expensive. Several weeks ago Festool dropped the
price of their replacement Li-Ion 5amp 15v battery to less that 1/2 of
what it had been. Actually inexpensive compared to most any other brand.

On 8/19/2015 4:04 PM, Leon wrote:
On 8/19/2015 2:10 PM, Casper wrote:
DeWALT Focuses on “Made in the USA”

DeWALT’s 1.2-million square foot facility that straddles the
North/South Carolina border is now not only a distribution center, but
also DeWALT’s fully functional Charlotte Manufacturing Operation,
creating more than 350 new jobs.

Craig Zielinski, director of manufacturing, says DeWALT has determined
that it now can make cordless power tools affordably and well here in
America. Plus, end users want American-made tools.

Certain components of the tools are “globally sourced,” because,
Zielinski says, there simply aren’t stateside suppliers with the
expertise for everything these days.

DeWALT currently maintains manufacturing facilities in six states,
with components and accessories coming from three states. Since
opening the Charlotte assembly plant, aka “Project Eagle,” the company
has launched Project Eagle II, to add cordless tool manufacturing in
Greenfield, Indiana. All told, DeWALT employs approximately 1,800
people stateside. — Chris Marsha

*Tools produced at the Charlotte facility include variations of
18-volt tools and 20V MAX* hammer drills, drill/drivers, impact
drivers and recip saws.

**DeWALT’s Charlotte facility has assembled 4 million cordless tools,
built 2 million electric motors and driven around 45 million screws
since kicking off in 2013.



Good news
Affordable cordless tools. This seems to be a trend or at least they
are becoming less expensive. Several weeks ago Festool dropped the
price of their replacement Li-Ion 5amp 15v battery to less that 1/2 of
what it had been. Actually inexpensive compared to most any other brand.

I recently looked at the DeWalt tools and was unimpressed. They were
NICAD units, and were not marked on the outside. HD was selling them for
a premium price, made me think they were Lithium. Opened the box and
they were Nicad.. disappointed.

Also recently watched a YouTube video by this guy AVE, he opens the
tools and does reviews. Their 20v unit was only 18volt same as the
Milwakee, same batteries. ... Just a marketting sham.
The Dewalt Hammer drill did not hammer through rock in the test.

So Dewalt is on my Buyer Beware list. You don't always get what you pay
for.

--
Jeff

In article ,
says...

On 8/19/2015 4:04 PM, Leon wrote:
On 8/19/2015 2:10 PM, Casper wrote:
DeWALT Focuses on ?Made in the USA?

DeWALT?s 1.2-million square foot facility that straddles the
North/South Carolina border is now not only a distribution center, but
also DeWALT?s fully functional Charlotte Manufacturing Operation,
creating more than 350 new jobs.

Craig Zielinski, director of manufacturing, says DeWALT has determined
that it now can make cordless power tools affordably and well here in
America. Plus, end users want American-made tools.

Certain components of the tools are ?globally sourced,? because,
Zielinski says, there simply aren?t stateside suppliers with the
expertise for everything these days.

DeWALT currently maintains manufacturing facilities in six states,
with components and accessories coming from three states. Since
opening the Charlotte assembly plant, aka ?Project Eagle,? the company
has launched Project Eagle II, to add cordless tool manufacturing in
Greenfield, Indiana. All told, DeWALT employs approximately 1,800
people stateside. ? Chris Marsha

*Tools produced at the Charlotte facility include variations of
18-volt tools and 20V MAX* hammer drills, drill/drivers, impact
drivers and recip saws.

**DeWALT?s Charlotte facility has assembled 4 million cordless tools,
built 2 million electric motors and driven around 45 million screws
since kicking off in 2013.



Good news
Affordable cordless tools. This seems to be a trend or at least they
are becoming less expensive. Several weeks ago Festool dropped the
price of their replacement Li-Ion 5amp 15v battery to less that 1/2 of
what it had been. Actually inexpensive compared to most any other brand.

I recently looked at the DeWalt tools and was unimpressed. They were
NICAD units, and were not marked on the outside. HD was selling them for
a premium price, made me think they were Lithium. Opened the box and
they were Nicad.. disappointed.

Also recently watched a YouTube video by this guy AVE, he opens the
tools and does reviews. Their 20v unit was only 18volt same as the
Milwakee, same batteries. ... Just a marketting sham.
The Dewalt Hammer drill did not hammer through rock in the test.

So Dewalt is on my Buyer Beware list. You don't always get what you pay
for.

WHICH DeWalt tools. All of the 18v tools run on your choice of NiCd or
Lithium--you can also get NiMH rebuilt packs that the DeWalt charger
will charge.

The 20v MAX tools are lithium-only.

And the 20v is not "a marketing sham", it uses a different pack from the
18v tools and the reason is that that way the battery manager can be in
the tool and charger allowing for much less expensive lithium packs than
for the 18v tools. Calling it "20v" just keeps it from being confused
with the 18v.

On 8/19/2015 4:46 PM, woodchucker wrote:
On 8/19/2015 4:04 PM, Leon wrote:
On 8/19/2015 2:10 PM, Casper wrote:
DeWALT Focuses on “Made in the USA”

DeWALT’s 1.2-million square foot facility that straddles the
North/South Carolina border is now not only a distribution center, but
also DeWALT’s fully functional Charlotte Manufacturing Operation,
creating more than 350 new jobs.

Craig Zielinski, director of manufacturing, says DeWALT has determined
that it now can make cordless power tools affordably and well here in
America. Plus, end users want American-made tools.

Certain components of the tools are “globally sourced,” because,
Zielinski says, there simply aren’t stateside suppliers with the
expertise for everything these days.

DeWALT currently maintains manufacturing facilities in six states,
with components and accessories coming from three states. Since
opening the Charlotte assembly plant, aka “Project Eagle,” the company
has launched Project Eagle II, to add cordless tool manufacturing in
Greenfield, Indiana. All told, DeWALT employs approximately 1,800
people stateside. — Chris Marsha

*Tools produced at the Charlotte facility include variations of
18-volt tools and 20V MAX* hammer drills, drill/drivers, impact
drivers and recip saws.

**DeWALT’s Charlotte facility has assembled 4 million cordless tools,
built 2 million electric motors and driven around 45 million screws
since kicking off in 2013.



Good news
Affordable cordless tools. This seems to be a trend or at least they
are becoming less expensive. Several weeks ago Festool dropped the
price of their replacement Li-Ion 5amp 15v battery to less that 1/2 of
what it had been. Actually inexpensive compared to most any other brand.

I recently looked at the DeWalt tools and was unimpressed. They were
NICAD units, and were not marked on the outside. HD was selling them for
a premium price, made me think they were Lithium. Opened the box and
they were Nicad.. disappointed.

Also recently watched a YouTube video by this guy AVE, he opens the
tools and does reviews. Their 20v unit was only 18volt same as the
Milwakee, same batteries. ... Just a marketting sham.
The Dewalt Hammer drill did not hammer through rock in the test.

So Dewalt is on my Buyer Beware list. You don't always get what you pay
for.


Well they are a little deceptive. Festool IIRC does the same thing.
I noticed on the DeWalt site that the 20V would seem to indicate 20
volts. Oddly they don't say 20 volts. Their other tools do indicate
voltage. So while a person would naturally assume that 20V means 20
volts, that apparently is not so.

Equally odd is that like voltage competitors may or may not last as long
on a full charge doing the same thing as the others.

So when buying a cordless tool you can't really judge its power by it's
assumed voltage. My "15" volt Festool runs circles around my "12"
Makita impact and the impact would probably run circles around most any
20 volt driver drill.

I think the only thing that you can assume is that the larger the
number, within a product line, the better it will perform within that
product line. Not necessarily when compared to the competition with
like assumed voltages.


Given that it appears most Li-Ion cells are 3.7 or 4.2 volts nether
divides into 20 evenly. So they like Festool probably round the number.
Keep in mind also that a normally functioning battery will indicate a
higher voltage right after charging than it will a few minutes after use.

On 8/19/2015 5:13 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
In article ,
says...

On 8/19/2015 4:04 PM, Leon wrote:
On 8/19/2015 2:10 PM, Casper wrote:
DeWALT Focuses on ?Made in the USA?

DeWALT?s 1.2-million square foot facility that straddles the
North/South Carolina border is now not only a distribution center, but
also DeWALT?s fully functional Charlotte Manufacturing Operation,
creating more than 350 new jobs.

Craig Zielinski, director of manufacturing, says DeWALT has determined
that it now can make cordless power tools affordably and well here in
America. Plus, end users want American-made tools.

Certain components of the tools are ?globally sourced,? because,
Zielinski says, there simply aren?t stateside suppliers with the
expertise for everything these days.

DeWALT currently maintains manufacturing facilities in six states,
with components and accessories coming from three states. Since
opening the Charlotte assembly plant, aka ?Project Eagle,? the company
has launched Project Eagle II, to add cordless tool manufacturing in
Greenfield, Indiana. All told, DeWALT employs approximately 1,800
people stateside. ? Chris Marsha

*Tools produced at the Charlotte facility include variations of
18-volt tools and 20V MAX* hammer drills, drill/drivers, impact
drivers and recip saws.

**DeWALT?s Charlotte facility has assembled 4 million cordless tools,
built 2 million electric motors and driven around 45 million screws
since kicking off in 2013.



Good news
Affordable cordless tools. This seems to be a trend or at least they
are becoming less expensive. Several weeks ago Festool dropped the
price of their replacement Li-Ion 5amp 15v battery to less that 1/2 of
what it had been. Actually inexpensive compared to most any other brand.

I recently looked at the DeWalt tools and was unimpressed. They were
NICAD units, and were not marked on the outside. HD was selling them for
a premium price, made me think they were Lithium. Opened the box and
they were Nicad.. disappointed.

Also recently watched a YouTube video by this guy AVE, he opens the
tools and does reviews. Their 20v unit was only 18volt same as the
Milwakee, same batteries. ... Just a marketting sham.
The Dewalt Hammer drill did not hammer through rock in the test.

So Dewalt is on my Buyer Beware list. You don't always get what you pay
for.

WHICH DeWalt tools. All of the 18v tools run on your choice of NiCd or
Lithium--you can also get NiMH rebuilt packs that the DeWalt charger
will charge.

The 20v MAX tools are lithium-only.

And the 20v is not "a marketing sham", it uses a different pack from the
18v tools and the reason is that that way the battery manager can be in
the tool and charger allowing for much less expensive lithium packs than
for the 18v tools. Calling it "20v" just keeps it from being confused
with the 18v.


They could have made it a bit less misleading by calling it 20L MAX.
The "v" apparently does not represent actual voltage.

Leon wrote:
On 8/19/2015 5:13 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
In article ,
says...

On 8/19/2015 4:04 PM, Leon wrote:
On 8/19/2015 2:10 PM, Casper wrote:
DeWALT Focuses on ?Made in the USA?

DeWALT?s 1.2-million square foot facility that straddles the
North/South Carolina border is now not only a distribution center,
but
also DeWALT?s fully functional Charlotte Manufacturing Operation,
creating more than 350 new jobs.

Craig Zielinski, director of manufacturing, says DeWALT has
determined
that it now can make cordless power tools affordably and well here in
America. Plus, end users want American-made tools.

Certain components of the tools are ?globally sourced,? because,
Zielinski says, there simply aren?t stateside suppliers with the
expertise for everything these days.

DeWALT currently maintains manufacturing facilities in six states,
with components and accessories coming from three states. Since
opening the Charlotte assembly plant, aka ?Project Eagle,? the
company
has launched Project Eagle II, to add cordless tool manufacturing in
Greenfield, Indiana. All told, DeWALT employs approximately 1,800
people stateside. ? Chris Marsha

*Tools produced at the Charlotte facility include variations of
18-volt tools and 20V MAX* hammer drills, drill/drivers, impact
drivers and recip saws.

**DeWALT?s Charlotte facility has assembled 4 million cordless tools,
built 2 million electric motors and driven around 45 million screws
since kicking off in 2013.



Good news
Affordable cordless tools. This seems to be a trend or at least they
are becoming less expensive. Several weeks ago Festool dropped the
price of their replacement Li-Ion 5amp 15v battery to less that 1/2 of
what it had been. Actually inexpensive compared to most any other
brand.

I recently looked at the DeWalt tools and was unimpressed. They were
NICAD units, and were not marked on the outside. HD was selling them
for
a premium price, made me think they were Lithium. Opened the box and
they were Nicad.. disappointed.

Also recently watched a YouTube video by this guy AVE, he opens the
tools and does reviews. Their 20v unit was only 18volt same as the
Milwakee, same batteries. ... Just a marketting sham.
The Dewalt Hammer drill did not hammer through rock in the test.

So Dewalt is on my Buyer Beware list. You don't always get what you
pay
for.

WHICH DeWalt tools. All of the 18v tools run on your choice of NiCd or
Lithium--you can also get NiMH rebuilt packs that the DeWalt charger
will charge.

The 20v MAX tools are lithium-only.

And the 20v is not "a marketing sham", it uses a different pack from the
18v tools and the reason is that that way the battery manager can be in
the tool and charger allowing for much less expensive lithium packs than
for the 18v tools. Calling it "20v" just keeps it from being confused
with the 18v.


They could have made it a bit less misleading by calling it 20L MAX.
The "v" apparently does not represent actual voltage.

Yes, I guess we'll have to start relying on specifications rather than
meaningless labels..

On Wed, 19 Aug 2015 17:46:52 -0400, woodchucker
wrote:

On 8/19/2015 4:04 PM, Leon wrote:
On 8/19/2015 2:10 PM, Casper wrote:
DeWALT Focuses on “Made in the USA”

DeWALT’s 1.2-million square foot facility that straddles the
North/South Carolina border is now not only a distribution center, but
also DeWALT’s fully functional Charlotte Manufacturing Operation,
creating more than 350 new jobs.

Craig Zielinski, director of manufacturing, says DeWALT has determined
that it now can make cordless power tools affordably and well here in
America. Plus, end users want American-made tools.

Certain components of the tools are “globally sourced,” because,
Zielinski says, there simply aren’t stateside suppliers with the
expertise for everything these days.

DeWALT currently maintains manufacturing facilities in six states,
with components and accessories coming from three states. Since
opening the Charlotte assembly plant, aka “Project Eagle,” the company
has launched Project Eagle II, to add cordless tool manufacturing in
Greenfield, Indiana. All told, DeWALT employs approximately 1,800
people stateside. — Chris Marsha

*Tools produced at the Charlotte facility include variations of
18-volt tools and 20V MAX* hammer drills, drill/drivers, impact
drivers and recip saws.

**DeWALT’s Charlotte facility has assembled 4 million cordless tools,
built 2 million electric motors and driven around 45 million screws
since kicking off in 2013.



Good news
Affordable cordless tools. This seems to be a trend or at least they
are becoming less expensive. Several weeks ago Festool dropped the
price of their replacement Li-Ion 5amp 15v battery to less that 1/2 of
what it had been. Actually inexpensive compared to most any other brand.

I recently looked at the DeWalt tools and was unimpressed. They were
NICAD units, and were not marked on the outside. HD was selling them for
a premium price, made me think they were Lithium. Opened the box and
they were Nicad.. disappointed.

Also recently watched a YouTube video by this guy AVE, he opens the
tools and does reviews. Their 20v unit was only 18volt same as the
Milwakee, same batteries. ... Just a marketting sham.

That's not unusual. It's a matter of where you measure the voltage on
a battery. During charge, the voltage is a lot higher than a
discharged battery. Since LiIon batteries have a terminal voltage
somewhere in the 3.5V-4.2V range (depending on when you measure), it
would be impossible to have both an 18V battery and a 20V battery. The
same battery will be both, at different points in its charge cycle. I
have Bosch batteries that are marked 10.8V and 12V. They're exactly
the same batteries, for the same tools. The 10.8V batteries are the
older batteries. I suspect that they were losing market share to the
"more powerful" 12V tools, so the marketing department fixed the
problem.


The Dewalt Hammer drill did not hammer through rock in the test.



So Dewalt is on my Buyer Beware list. You don't always get what you pay
for.

krw wrote in
:

That's not unusual. It's a matter of where you measure the voltage on
a battery. During charge, the voltage is a lot higher than a
discharged battery. Since LiIon batteries have a terminal voltage
somewhere in the 3.5V-4.2V range (depending on when you measure), it
would be impossible to have both an 18V battery and a 20V battery. The
same battery will be both, at different points in its charge cycle. I
have Bosch batteries that are marked 10.8V and 12V. They're exactly
the same batteries, for the same tools. The 10.8V batteries are the
older batteries. I suspect that they were losing market share to the
"more powerful" 12V tools, so the marketing department fixed the
problem.

While what you say about charging is true, there is a standard
way to measure battery cells, and by that standard a LiIon cell
is 1.2V. Any rating which is not a multiple of 1.2V is not
measured by the standard (or is a flat out lie), and should be
considered to be false advertising.

John

On 8/19/2015 6:13 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
In article ,
says...

On 8/19/2015 4:04 PM, Leon wrote:
On 8/19/2015 2:10 PM, Casper wrote:
DeWALT Focuses on ?Made in the USA?

DeWALT?s 1.2-million square foot facility that straddles the
North/South Carolina border is now not only a distribution center, but
also DeWALT?s fully functional Charlotte Manufacturing Operation,
creating more than 350 new jobs.

Craig Zielinski, director of manufacturing, says DeWALT has determined
that it now can make cordless power tools affordably and well here in
America. Plus, end users want American-made tools.

Certain components of the tools are ?globally sourced,? because,
Zielinski says, there simply aren?t stateside suppliers with the
expertise for everything these days.

DeWALT currently maintains manufacturing facilities in six states,
with components and accessories coming from three states. Since
opening the Charlotte assembly plant, aka ?Project Eagle,? the company
has launched Project Eagle II, to add cordless tool manufacturing in
Greenfield, Indiana. All told, DeWALT employs approximately 1,800
people stateside. ? Chris Marsha

*Tools produced at the Charlotte facility include variations of
18-volt tools and 20V MAX* hammer drills, drill/drivers, impact
drivers and recip saws.

**DeWALT?s Charlotte facility has assembled 4 million cordless tools,
built 2 million electric motors and driven around 45 million screws
since kicking off in 2013.



Good news
Affordable cordless tools. This seems to be a trend or at least they
are becoming less expensive. Several weeks ago Festool dropped the
price of their replacement Li-Ion 5amp 15v battery to less that 1/2 of
what it had been. Actually inexpensive compared to most any other brand.

I recently looked at the DeWalt tools and was unimpressed. They were
NICAD units, and were not marked on the outside. HD was selling them for
a premium price, made me think they were Lithium. Opened the box and
they were Nicad.. disappointed.

Also recently watched a YouTube video by this guy AVE, he opens the
tools and does reviews. Their 20v unit was only 18volt same as the
Milwakee, same batteries. ... Just a marketting sham.
The Dewalt Hammer drill did not hammer through rock in the test.

So Dewalt is on my Buyer Beware list. You don't always get what you pay
for.

WHICH DeWalt tools. All of the 18v tools run on your choice of NiCd or
Lithium--you can also get NiMH rebuilt packs that the DeWalt charger
will charge.

The 20v MAX tools are lithium-only.

And the 20v is not "a marketing sham", it uses a different pack from the
18v tools and the reason is that that way the battery manager can be in
the tool and charger allowing for much less expensive lithium packs than
for the 18v tools. Calling it "20v" just keeps it from being confused
with the 18v.

So it was a drill.
Yes, but the box was not marked. You would think it would say Nicad or
Lithium on the box. That it would not have to be opened. two guys at HD
could not find a marking. So we opened it.

the 20V is the same as the Milwakee 18v 5 batteries. 8350 I think.See
the video where he take it apart.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHCS7JXfuv0



--
Jeff

In article ,
says...

On 8/19/2015 6:13 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
In article ,
says...

On 8/19/2015 4:04 PM, Leon wrote:
On 8/19/2015 2:10 PM, Casper wrote:
DeWALT Focuses on ?Made in the USA?

DeWALT?s 1.2-million square foot facility that straddles the
North/South Carolina border is now not only a distribution center, but
also DeWALT?s fully functional Charlotte Manufacturing Operation,
creating more than 350 new jobs.

Craig Zielinski, director of manufacturing, says DeWALT has determined
that it now can make cordless power tools affordably and well here in
America. Plus, end users want American-made tools.

Certain components of the tools are ?globally sourced,? because,
Zielinski says, there simply aren?t stateside suppliers with the
expertise for everything these days.

DeWALT currently maintains manufacturing facilities in six states,
with components and accessories coming from three states. Since
opening the Charlotte assembly plant, aka ?Project Eagle,? the company
has launched Project Eagle II, to add cordless tool manufacturing in
Greenfield, Indiana. All told, DeWALT employs approximately 1,800
people stateside. ? Chris Marsha

*Tools produced at the Charlotte facility include variations of
18-volt tools and 20V MAX* hammer drills, drill/drivers, impact
drivers and recip saws.

**DeWALT?s Charlotte facility has assembled 4 million cordless tools,
built 2 million electric motors and driven around 45 million screws
since kicking off in 2013.



Good news
Affordable cordless tools. This seems to be a trend or at least they
are becoming less expensive. Several weeks ago Festool dropped the
price of their replacement Li-Ion 5amp 15v battery to less that 1/2 of
what it had been. Actually inexpensive compared to most any other brand.

I recently looked at the DeWalt tools and was unimpressed. They were
NICAD units, and were not marked on the outside. HD was selling them for
a premium price, made me think they were Lithium. Opened the box and
they were Nicad.. disappointed.

Also recently watched a YouTube video by this guy AVE, he opens the
tools and does reviews. Their 20v unit was only 18volt same as the
Milwakee, same batteries. ... Just a marketting sham.
The Dewalt Hammer drill did not hammer through rock in the test.

So Dewalt is on my Buyer Beware list. You don't always get what you pay
for.

WHICH DeWalt tools. All of the 18v tools run on your choice of NiCd or
Lithium--you can also get NiMH rebuilt packs that the DeWalt charger
will charge.

The 20v MAX tools are lithium-only.

And the 20v is not "a marketing sham", it uses a different pack from the
18v tools and the reason is that that way the battery manager can be in
the tool and charger allowing for much less expensive lithium packs than
for the 18v tools. Calling it "20v" just keeps it from being confused
with the 18v.

So it was a drill.
Yes, but the box was not marked. You would think it would say Nicad or
Lithium on the box. That it would not have to be opened. two guys at HD
could not find a marking. So we opened it.

the 20V is the same as the Milwakee 18v 5 batteries. 8350 I think.See
the video where he take it apart.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHCS7JXfuv0

So sue them.

Why do you care so much?

On Thu, 20 Aug 2015 01:35:55 +0000 (UTC), John McCoy
wrote:

krw wrote in
:

That's not unusual. It's a matter of where you measure the voltage on
a battery. During charge, the voltage is a lot higher than a
discharged battery. Since LiIon batteries have a terminal voltage
somewhere in the 3.5V-4.2V range (depending on when you measure), it
would be impossible to have both an 18V battery and a 20V battery. The
same battery will be both, at different points in its charge cycle. I
have Bosch batteries that are marked 10.8V and 12V. They're exactly
the same batteries, for the same tools. The 10.8V batteries are the
older batteries. I suspect that they were losing market share to the
"more powerful" 12V tools, so the marketing department fixed the
problem.

While what you say about charging is true, there is a standard
way to measure battery cells, and by that standard a LiIon cell
is 1.2V. Any rating which is not a multiple of 1.2V is not
measured by the standard (or is a flat out lie), and should be
considered to be false advertising.

That's completely wrong. NiCd is "accepted" to be 1.2V, but NiCd has
a very flat discharge curve. None of this is true with LiIon. LiIon
will be somewhere between about 3.5V at discharge and 4.2V when
charging (some charge to 4.1V). At a full charge, the terminal
voltage will be about 4V. At "complete" discharge (it varies a little
depending on how many cycles you want the battery to last, the
terminal voltage is 3.5V-3.6V. There is also a little difference
between LiIon varieties (LiIon vs. LiPo, for instance). An 18V or 20V
battery will be five of these cells. 5 x 4V is 20V. 5 x 3.6V is 18V.
Pick your poison. There is no 4.5 cell battery. An 18V LiIon battery
is *exactly* the same as a 20V LiIon battery.

On Wed, 19 Aug 2015 15:10:19 -0400
Casper wrote:

DeWALT Focuses on “Made in the USA”

they should focus on quality control because no one focuses like we used
to on where it is made


it is a good trend but
i have one dewalt tool left
i would say too little too late

their battery charging in their charger almost burned the house down
another hour and it would have succeeded
no longer have that drill

got a makita now and do not know or care where it was made
it is a good drill

This is really old news about the batteries. I don't remember the exculpatory language on their boxes, but they make it plain that the tool could hit a 20V output occasionally.

I had a long talk with the rep that sold DeWalt for about 5 years when I ran into him at HD, and he told me one of the reasons he left DeWalt/BD was that he was tired of being screamed at for phony advertising from not only the people that bought the tools but the vendors as well. He also told me how many people tested the batteries and found that they operated with the same output as their 18V tools, just did it longer.

From 2011:

http://www.coptool.com/dewalt-20v-ma...ay-to-say-18v/

http://www.finehomebuilding.com/item...why-go-20v-max

http://goo.gl/xncWuc

I remember how ****ed off my contractor buddies were because there were actual 20 and 24 volt tools out there, not 18s masquerading as 20V. A great marketing coup for DeWalt as most people never read the packaging or did any research on the new DeWalt schemes, never looked at an article and never used the internet. Since they paid a premium for the tools and the new side by side battery configuration wasn't compatible with the rest of their 18V DeWalt tools, the took them back.

Although I think DW was banking on the "Tim Taylor effect" of more power is good (and it certainly has worked well for them!), they said we as consumers were protected from our own weak minded confusion by their false labels. I was happy to see that they lied for my benefit as I thought they were being intentionally deceptive. I was pleased to hear that corporate America was looking out for me.

I feel that if they will lie about something that simple, they will lie about other things. Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't touch them. My personal experience with them many years ago was great, but has been so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I look at for tool purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else where they have the technology and quality control to make them and ship them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to screw the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

Robert

On Wed, 19 Aug 2015 23:57:20 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't touch them. My personal experience with them many years ago was great, but has been so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I look at for tool purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else where they have the technology and quality control to make them and ship them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to screw the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

Robert

The US has the ability to make a quality tool, but between Marketing
and Accounting, hitting a low price point with high volume is more
important. There was a time that Black & Decker meant quality too,
now they are cheapened for the mass market, not the skilled craftsman.
DeWalt is just a half step above that in yellow.

I do have two DeWalt tools, a sander and miter saw. Both are
serviceable for the price, but there are better out there.

In article ,
says...

This is really old news about the batteries. I don't remember the exculpatory language on their boxes, but they make it plain that the tool could hit a 20V output occasionally.

I had a long talk with the rep that sold DeWalt for about 5 years when I ran into him at HD, and he told me one of the reasons he left DeWalt/BD was that he was tired of being screamed at for phony advertising from not only the people that bought the tools but the vendors as well. He also told me how many people tested the batteries and found that they operated with the same output as their 18V tools, just did it longer.

From 2011:

http://www.coptool.com/dewalt-20v-ma...ay-to-say-18v/

http://www.finehomebuilding.com/item...why-go-20v-max

http://goo.gl/xncWuc

I remember how ****ed off my contractor buddies were because there were actual 20 and 24 volt tools out there, not 18s masquerading as 20V. A great marketing coup for DeWalt as most people never read the packaging or did any research on the new DeWalt schemes, never looked at an article and never used the internet. Since they paid a premium for the tools and the new side by side battery configuration wasn't compatible with the rest of their 18V DeWalt tools, the took
them back.

Although I think DW was banking on the "Tim Taylor effect" of more power is good (and it certainly has worked well for them!), they said we as consumers were protected from our own weak minded confusion by their false labels. I was happy to see that they lied for my benefit as I thought they were being intentionally deceptive. I was pleased to hear that corporate America was looking out for me.

I feel that if they will lie about something that simple, they will lie about other things. Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't touch them. My personal experience with them many years ago was great, but has been so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I look at for tool purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else where they have the technology and quality control to make them and ship them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to screw the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

I've got a question for you. How would YOU write an "honest label" for
a Dewalt power tool that made it absolutely crystal clear that (a) it
was an 18v tool and (b) there was no way to make the tool run in any
useful manner on the batteries made for the previous series of 18v
dewalt tools.

In article ,
says...

On Wed, 19 Aug 2015 23:57:20 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't touch them. My personal experience with them many years ago was great, but has been so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I look at for tool purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else where they have the technology and quality control to make them and ship them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to screw the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

Robert

The US has the ability to make a quality tool, but between Marketing
and Accounting, hitting a low price point with high volume is more
important. There was a time that Black & Decker meant quality too,
now they are cheapened for the mass market, not the skilled craftsman.
DeWalt is just a half step above that in yellow.

I do have two DeWalt tools, a sander and miter saw. Both are
serviceable for the price, but there are better out there.

Most of my deWalt tools have taken 15 years of beating. I do have some
newer ones as I recently had a huge increase in disposable income and
I'm looking to complete my 18v collection before they're discontinued.

"J. Clarke" wrote:
In article ,
says...

This is really old news about the batteries. I don't remember the
exculpatory language on their boxes, but they make it plain that the
tool could hit a 20V output occasionally.

I had a long talk with the rep that sold DeWalt for about 5 years when I
ran into him at HD, and he told me one of the reasons he left DeWalt/BD
was that he was tired of being screamed at for phony advertising from
not only the people that bought the tools but the vendors as well. He
also told me how many people tested the batteries and found that they
operated with the same output as their 18V tools, just did it longer.

From 2011:

http://www.coptool.com/dewalt-20v-ma...ay-to-say-18v/

http://www.finehomebuilding.com/item...why-go-20v-max

http://goo.gl/xncWuc

I remember how ****ed off my contractor buddies were because there were
actual 20 and 24 volt tools out there, not 18s masquerading as 20V. A
great marketing coup for DeWalt as most people never read the packaging
or did any research on the new DeWalt schemes, never looked at an
article and never used the internet. Since they paid a premium for the
tools and the new side by side battery configuration wasn't compatible
with the rest of their 18V DeWalt tools, the took
them back.

Although I think DW was banking on the "Tim Taylor effect" of more power
is good (and it certainly has worked well for them!), they said we as
consumers were protected from our own weak minded confusion by their
false labels. I was happy to see that they lied for my benefit as I
thought they were being intentionally deceptive. I was pleased to hear
that corporate America was looking out for me.

I feel that if they will lie about something that simple, they will lie
about other things. Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't
touch them. My personal experience with them many years ago was great,
but has been so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I
look at for tool purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as
manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the
complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else
where they have the technology and quality control to make them and ship
them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to screw
the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

I've got a question for you. How would YOU write an "honest label" for
a Dewalt power tool that made it absolutely crystal clear that (a) it
was an 18v tool and (b) there was no way to make the tool run in any
useful manner on the batteries made for the previous series of 18v
dewalt tools.

Ummmmm, 18 volt Lithium Ion

"J. Clarke" wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Wed, 19 Aug 2015 23:57:20 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't touch them. My
personal experience with them many years ago was great, but has been
so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I look at for tool
purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as
manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the
complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else
where they have the technology and quality control to make them and
ship them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to
screw the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

Robert

The US has the ability to make a quality tool, but between Marketing
and Accounting, hitting a low price point with high volume is more
important. There was a time that Black & Decker meant quality too,
now they are cheapened for the mass market, not the skilled craftsman.
DeWalt is just a half step above that in yellow.

I do have two DeWalt tools, a sander and miter saw. Both are
serviceable for the price, but there are better out there.

Most of my deWalt tools have taken 15 years of beating. I do have some
newer ones as I recently had a huge increase in disposable income and
I'm looking to complete my 18v collection before they're discontinued.

No wonder you are so defensive. And judging by what you display that you
do with those tools it is no wonder that they have lasted 15 years. I
have a 30 year old B&D belt sander, the belt that is on it is 25 years old.

Leon wrote:
"J. Clarke" wrote:
In article ,
says...

This is really old news about the batteries. I don't remember the
exculpatory language on their boxes, but they make it plain that the
tool could hit a 20V output occasionally.

I had a long talk with the rep that sold DeWalt for about 5 years when I
ran into him at HD, and he told me one of the reasons he left DeWalt/BD
was that he was tired of being screamed at for phony advertising from
not only the people that bought the tools but the vendors as well. He
also told me how many people tested the batteries and found that they
operated with the same output as their 18V tools, just did it longer.

From 2011:

http://www.coptool.com/dewalt-20v-ma...ay-to-say-18v/

http://www.finehomebuilding.com/item...why-go-20v-max

http://goo.gl/xncWuc

I remember how ****ed off my contractor buddies were because there were
actual 20 and 24 volt tools out there, not 18s masquerading as 20V. A
great marketing coup for DeWalt as most people never read the packaging
or did any research on the new DeWalt schemes, never looked at an
article and never used the internet. Since they paid a premium for the
tools and the new side by side battery configuration wasn't compatible
with the rest of their 18V DeWalt tools, the took
them back.

Although I think DW was banking on the "Tim Taylor effect" of more power
is good (and it certainly has worked well for them!), they said we as
consumers were protected from our own weak minded confusion by their
false labels. I was happy to see that they lied for my benefit as I
thought they were being intentionally deceptive. I was pleased to hear
that corporate America was looking out for me.

I feel that if they will lie about something that simple, they will lie
about other things. Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't
touch them. My personal experience with them many years ago was great,
but has been so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I
look at for tool purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as
manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the
complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else
where they have the technology and quality control to make them and ship
them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to screw
the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

I've got a question for you. How would YOU write an "honest label" for
a Dewalt power tool that made it absolutely crystal clear that (a) it
was an 18v tool and (b) there was no way to make the tool run in any
useful manner on the batteries made for the previous series of 18v
dewalt tools.

Ummmmm, 18 volt Lithium Ion

And just one more thing, there is no reason that an 18 volt battery of a
different chemical make up should not work.
Festool allows you to use any same shape battery, equal or lower voltage
battery, or different chemical make up battery in their cordless tools.
Their Li-ion charger will charge any same shape, regardless of chemical
make up, battery.

Leon wrote:
Leon wrote:
"J. Clarke" wrote:
In article ,
says...

This is really old news about the batteries. I don't remember the
exculpatory language on their boxes, but they make it plain that the
tool could hit a 20V output occasionally.

I had a long talk with the rep that sold DeWalt for about 5 years when I
ran into him at HD, and he told me one of the reasons he left DeWalt/BD
was that he was tired of being screamed at for phony advertising from
not only the people that bought the tools but the vendors as well. He
also told me how many people tested the batteries and found that they
operated with the same output as their 18V tools, just did it longer.

From 2011:

http://www.coptool.com/dewalt-20v-ma...ay-to-say-18v/

http://www.finehomebuilding.com/item...why-go-20v-max

http://goo.gl/xncWuc

I remember how ****ed off my contractor buddies were because there were
actual 20 and 24 volt tools out there, not 18s masquerading as 20V. A
great marketing coup for DeWalt as most people never read the packaging
or did any research on the new DeWalt schemes, never looked at an
article and never used the internet. Since they paid a premium for the
tools and the new side by side battery configuration wasn't compatible
with the rest of their 18V DeWalt tools, the took
them back.

Although I think DW was banking on the "Tim Taylor effect" of more power
is good (and it certainly has worked well for them!), they said we as
consumers were protected from our own weak minded confusion by their
false labels. I was happy to see that they lied for my benefit as I
thought they were being intentionally deceptive. I was pleased to hear
that corporate America was looking out for me.

I feel that if they will lie about something that simple, they will lie
about other things. Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't
touch them. My personal experience with them many years ago was great,
but has been so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I
look at for tool purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as
manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the
complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else
where they have the technology and quality control to make them and ship
them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to screw
the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

I've got a question for you. How would YOU write an "honest label" for
a Dewalt power tool that made it absolutely crystal clear that (a) it
was an 18v tool and (b) there was no way to make the tool run in any
useful manner on the batteries made for the previous series of 18v
dewalt tools.

Ummmmm, 18 volt Lithium Ion

And just one more thing, there is no reason that an 18 volt battery of a
different chemical make up should not work.
Festool allows you to use any same shape battery, equal or lower voltage
battery, or different chemical make up battery in their cordless tools.
Their Li-ion charger will charge any same shape, regardless of chemical
make up, battery.

Any same shape battery. Not different shape.

On 8/20/2015 7:13 AM, Leon wrote:
"J. Clarke" wrote:
In article ,
says...

This is really old news about the batteries. I don't remember the
exculpatory language on their boxes, but they make it plain that the
tool could hit a 20V output occasionally.

I had a long talk with the rep that sold DeWalt for about 5 years when I
ran into him at HD, and he told me one of the reasons he left DeWalt/BD
was that he was tired of being screamed at for phony advertising from
not only the people that bought the tools but the vendors as well. He
also told me how many people tested the batteries and found that they
operated with the same output as their 18V tools, just did it longer.

From 2011:

http://www.coptool.com/dewalt-20v-ma...ay-to-say-18v/

http://www.finehomebuilding.com/item...why-go-20v-max

http://goo.gl/xncWuc

I remember how ****ed off my contractor buddies were because there were
actual 20 and 24 volt tools out there, not 18s masquerading as 20V. A
great marketing coup for DeWalt as most people never read the packaging
or did any research on the new DeWalt schemes, never looked at an
article and never used the internet. Since they paid a premium for the
tools and the new side by side battery configuration wasn't compatible
with the rest of their 18V DeWalt tools, the took
them back.

Although I think DW was banking on the "Tim Taylor effect" of more power
is good (and it certainly has worked well for them!), they said we as
consumers were protected from our own weak minded confusion by their
false labels. I was happy to see that they lied for my benefit as I
thought they were being intentionally deceptive. I was pleased to hear
that corporate America was looking out for me.

I feel that if they will lie about something that simple, they will lie
about other things. Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't
touch them. My personal experience with them many years ago was great,
but has been so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I
look at for tool purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as
manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the
complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else
where they have the technology and quality control to make them and ship
them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to screw
the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

I've got a question for you. How would YOU write an "honest label" for
a Dewalt power tool that made it absolutely crystal clear that (a) it
was an 18v tool and (b) there was no way to make the tool run in any
useful manner on the batteries made for the previous series of 18v
dewalt tools.

Ummmmm, 18 volt Lithium Ion

+1 THAT'S NO BULL**** LABELING.

I think the fact that they did not represent NICAD on their 18v was
deceptive too.

--
Jeff

"J. Clarke" wrote in
:


I've got a question for you. How would YOU write an "honest label"
for a Dewalt power tool that made it absolutely crystal clear that (a)
it was an 18v tool and (b) there was no way to make the tool run in
any useful manner on the batteries made for the previous series of 18v
dewalt tools.

I think the bigger problem was the 12V size drill/drivers. 3 3.6V cells
gives you 10.8V and not 12, and that would make a pretty big difference in
the minds of the assuming public. It happens that 5 3.6V cells equals 18V,
so there was no loss there, but the manufacturers are at least being
consistent in their exaggerations.

It's horsepower and CFM all over again.

Puckdropper
--
Make it to fit, don't make it fit.

"Electric Comet" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 19 Aug 2015 15:10:19 -0400
Casper wrote:

DeWALT Focuses on €œMade in the USA€�

they should focus on quality control because no one focuses like we used
to on where it is made


it is a good trend but
i have one dewalt tool left
i would say too little too late

their battery charging in their charger almost burned the house down
another hour and it would have succeeded
no longer have that drill

got a makita now and do not know or care where it was made
it is a good drill

My partner and I quit DeWalt cordless tools years ago account poor
battery performance, primarily that they didn't seem to last more than two
or three years. After which I acquired a Makita 18v kit whose batteries
lasted seven or eight years.
More recently one of two plumbers who did some work for me plugged his
well-used DeWalt charger with battery into a nearby GFI receptacle. Some
time after they left I discovered the GFI had tripped. Didn't surprise me.

Dave in SoTex

On 20 Aug 2015 15:13:29 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

"J. Clarke" wrote in
:


I've got a question for you. How would YOU write an "honest label"
for a Dewalt power tool that made it absolutely crystal clear that (a)
it was an 18v tool and (b) there was no way to make the tool run in
any useful manner on the batteries made for the previous series of 18v
dewalt tools.

I think the bigger problem was the 12V size drill/drivers. 3 3.6V cells
gives you 10.8V and not 12, and that would make a pretty big difference in
the minds of the assuming public. It happens that 5 3.6V cells equals 18V,
so there was no loss there, but the manufacturers are at least being
consistent in their exaggerations.

But three 4V cells *is* 12V. LiIon is somewhere between 3.6V and 4V
(give or take a little), depending on its charge state.


It's horsepower and CFM all over again.

No, Crapsman HP is a damned lie.

DeWALT Focuses on “Made in the USA”

I don't have a cordless DeWalt anything.

Of the few cordless tools I have owned, I have had mixed success.
A life of 2-3 years for a battery pack at current replacement prices
($80+) doesn't cut it for me.

My Ryobi cordless weed trimmer and mower lasted over ten years before
needing a battery replacement. I got 15 years out of the trimmer and
still going with the cordless mower at over 20 years, both with one
battery replacement. My B&D trimmer came with two batteries and is
dying after 4-5 years. BD says to keep the batteries plugged in at all
times but only gives you one charger. My Makita handheld blower/vac
battery died year 2. Got a rebuildt replacement is on year 3 and
showing signs of end of life.

I was gifted a DeWalt corded drill [D21002] to use in a mount for
several projects but this model has no trigger lock-on. So, it is
still sitting new in the box.

I own a DeWalt scrollsaw with DeWalt attachments that is a joy to use.

As far as DeWalt goes, they're corded tools have worked fine for my
uses. I haven't tried their cordless and am a bit cordless-shy from
the trouble I have had and seen from friends and family with any brand
of cordless. The only successful cordless tool I have and still have,
is a Milwaukee cordless screw driver still going strong after 20 years
with only one battery replacement.

Just my 2 cents on DeWalt and cordless.

In article 1832125228461762060.310363lcb11211-
, says...

"J. Clarke" wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Wed, 19 Aug 2015 23:57:20 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't touch them. My
personal experience with them many years ago was great, but has been
so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I look at for tool
purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as
manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the
complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else
where they have the technology and quality control to make them and
ship them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to
screw the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

Robert

The US has the ability to make a quality tool, but between Marketing
and Accounting, hitting a low price point with high volume is more
important. There was a time that Black & Decker meant quality too,
now they are cheapened for the mass market, not the skilled craftsman.
DeWalt is just a half step above that in yellow.

I do have two DeWalt tools, a sander and miter saw. Both are
serviceable for the price, but there are better out there.

Most of my deWalt tools have taken 15 years of beating. I do have some
newer ones as I recently had a huge increase in disposable income and
I'm looking to complete my 18v collection before they're discontinued.

No wonder you are so defensive. And judging by what you display that you
do with those tools it is no wonder that they have lasted 15 years. I
have a 30 year old B&D belt sander, the belt that is on it is 25 years old.

I thought I killfiled you.

plonk you, all Leons, and the domain your rode in on

In article 174200608461761953.378665lcb11211-
, says...

"J. Clarke" wrote:
In article ,
says...

This is really old news about the batteries. I don't remember the
exculpatory language on their boxes, but they make it plain that the
tool could hit a 20V output occasionally.

I had a long talk with the rep that sold DeWalt for about 5 years when I
ran into him at HD, and he told me one of the reasons he left DeWalt/BD
was that he was tired of being screamed at for phony advertising from
not only the people that bought the tools but the vendors as well. He
also told me how many people tested the batteries and found that they
operated with the same output as their 18V tools, just did it longer.

From 2011:

http://www.coptool.com/dewalt-20v-ma...ay-to-say-18v/

http://www.finehomebuilding.com/item...why-go-20v-max

http://goo.gl/xncWuc

I remember how ****ed off my contractor buddies were because there were
actual 20 and 24 volt tools out there, not 18s masquerading as 20V. A
great marketing coup for DeWalt as most people never read the packaging
or did any research on the new DeWalt schemes, never looked at an
article and never used the internet. Since they paid a premium for the
tools and the new side by side battery configuration wasn't compatible
with the rest of their 18V DeWalt tools, the took
them back.

Although I think DW was banking on the "Tim Taylor effect" of more power
is good (and it certainly has worked well for them!), they said we as
consumers were protected from our own weak minded confusion by their
false labels. I was happy to see that they lied for my benefit as I
thought they were being intentionally deceptive. I was pleased to hear
that corporate America was looking out for me.

I feel that if they will lie about something that simple, they will lie
about other things. Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't
touch them. My personal experience with them many years ago was great,
but has been so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I
look at for tool purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as
manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the
complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else
where they have the technology and quality control to make them and ship
them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to screw
the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

I've got a question for you. How would YOU write an "honest label" for
a Dewalt power tool that made it absolutely crystal clear that (a) it
was an 18v tool and (b) there was no way to make the tool run in any
useful manner on the batteries made for the previous series of 18v
dewalt tools.

Ummmmm, 18 volt Lithium Ion

And how does that distinguish from the 18v lithium ion DeWalt tools that
do not take the same battery?

In article ,
says...

On 8/20/2015 7:13 AM, Leon wrote:
"J. Clarke" wrote:
In article ,
says...

This is really old news about the batteries. I don't remember the
exculpatory language on their boxes, but they make it plain that the
tool could hit a 20V output occasionally.

I had a long talk with the rep that sold DeWalt for about 5 years when I
ran into him at HD, and he told me one of the reasons he left DeWalt/BD
was that he was tired of being screamed at for phony advertising from
not only the people that bought the tools but the vendors as well. He
also told me how many people tested the batteries and found that they
operated with the same output as their 18V tools, just did it longer.

From 2011:

http://www.coptool.com/dewalt-20v-ma...ay-to-say-18v/

http://www.finehomebuilding.com/item...why-go-20v-max

http://goo.gl/xncWuc

I remember how ****ed off my contractor buddies were because there were
actual 20 and 24 volt tools out there, not 18s masquerading as 20V. A
great marketing coup for DeWalt as most people never read the packaging
or did any research on the new DeWalt schemes, never looked at an
article and never used the internet. Since they paid a premium for the
tools and the new side by side battery configuration wasn't compatible
with the rest of their 18V DeWalt tools, the took
them back.

Although I think DW was banking on the "Tim Taylor effect" of more power
is good (and it certainly has worked well for them!), they said we as
consumers were protected from our own weak minded confusion by their
false labels. I was happy to see that they lied for my benefit as I
thought they were being intentionally deceptive. I was pleased to hear
that corporate America was looking out for me.

I feel that if they will lie about something that simple, they will lie
about other things. Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't
touch them. My personal experience with them many years ago was great,
but has been so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I
look at for tool purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as
manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the
complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else
where they have the technology and quality control to make them and ship
them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to screw
the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

I've got a question for you. How would YOU write an "honest label" for
a Dewalt power tool that made it absolutely crystal clear that (a) it
was an 18v tool and (b) there was no way to make the tool run in any
useful manner on the batteries made for the previous series of 18v
dewalt tools.

Ummmmm, 18 volt Lithium Ion

+1 THAT'S NO BULL**** LABELING.

I think the fact that they did not represent NICAD on their 18v was
deceptive too.

OK, what do you put on the box so that even the most retarded moron can
figure out that what is in it works with THIS battery
http://www.amazon.com/DEWALT-DCB203-Compact-Li-Ion-
Battery/dp/B00BYKVMES and not THIS battery
http://www.amazon.com/DEWALT-DC9182-18V-Lithium-Battery/dp/B00OKK87FG

On 8/20/2015 4:44 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
In article 174200608461761953.378665lcb11211-
, says...

"J. Clarke" wrote:
In article ,
says...

This is really old news about the batteries. I don't remember the
exculpatory language on their boxes, but they make it plain that the
tool could hit a 20V output occasionally.

I had a long talk with the rep that sold DeWalt for about 5 years when I
ran into him at HD, and he told me one of the reasons he left DeWalt/BD
was that he was tired of being screamed at for phony advertising from
not only the people that bought the tools but the vendors as well. He
also told me how many people tested the batteries and found that they
operated with the same output as their 18V tools, just did it longer.

From 2011:

http://www.coptool.com/dewalt-20v-ma...ay-to-say-18v/

http://www.finehomebuilding.com/item...why-go-20v-max

http://goo.gl/xncWuc

I remember how ****ed off my contractor buddies were because there were
actual 20 and 24 volt tools out there, not 18s masquerading as 20V. A
great marketing coup for DeWalt as most people never read the packaging
or did any research on the new DeWalt schemes, never looked at an
article and never used the internet. Since they paid a premium for the
tools and the new side by side battery configuration wasn't compatible
with the rest of their 18V DeWalt tools, the took
them back.

Although I think DW was banking on the "Tim Taylor effect" of more power
is good (and it certainly has worked well for them!), they said we as
consumers were protected from our own weak minded confusion by their
false labels. I was happy to see that they lied for my benefit as I
thought they were being intentionally deceptive. I was pleased to hear
that corporate America was looking out for me.

I feel that if they will lie about something that simple, they will lie
about other things. Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't
touch them. My personal experience with them many years ago was great,
but has been so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I
look at for tool purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as
manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the
complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else
where they have the technology and quality control to make them and ship
them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to screw
the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

I've got a question for you. How would YOU write an "honest label" for
a Dewalt power tool that made it absolutely crystal clear that (a) it
was an 18v tool and (b) there was no way to make the tool run in any
useful manner on the batteries made for the previous series of 18v
dewalt tools.

Ummmmm, 18 volt Lithium Ion

And how does that distinguish from the 18v lithium ion DeWalt tools that
do not take the same battery?


What should it matter? You tool does not know what chemical make up of
the battery is nor does it matter.

And if the voltage is slightly different that does not matter either.

At this is all true with well designed tools.

On 8/20/2015 4:43 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
In article 1832125228461762060.310363lcb11211-
, says...

"J. Clarke" wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Wed, 19 Aug 2015 23:57:20 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't touch them. My
personal experience with them many years ago was great, but has been
so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I look at for tool
purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as
manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the
complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else
where they have the technology and quality control to make them and
ship them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to
screw the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

Robert

The US has the ability to make a quality tool, but between Marketing
and Accounting, hitting a low price point with high volume is more
important. There was a time that Black & Decker meant quality too,
now they are cheapened for the mass market, not the skilled craftsman.
DeWalt is just a half step above that in yellow.

I do have two DeWalt tools, a sander and miter saw. Both are
serviceable for the price, but there are better out there.

Most of my deWalt tools have taken 15 years of beating. I do have some
newer ones as I recently had a huge increase in disposable income and
I'm looking to complete my 18v collection before they're discontinued.

No wonder you are so defensive. And judging by what you display that you
do with those tools it is no wonder that they have lasted 15 years. I
have a 30 year old B&D belt sander, the belt that is on it is 25 years old.

I thought I killfiled you.

plonk you, all Leons, and the domain your rode in on


Thought, there is only one way I get here.

ROTFLMAO

On 8/20/2015 5:01 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
In article ,
says...

On 8/20/2015 7:13 AM, Leon wrote:
"J. Clarke" wrote:
In article ,
says...

This is really old news about the batteries. I don't remember the
exculpatory language on their boxes, but they make it plain that the
tool could hit a 20V output occasionally.

I had a long talk with the rep that sold DeWalt for about 5 years when I
ran into him at HD, and he told me one of the reasons he left DeWalt/BD
was that he was tired of being screamed at for phony advertising from
not only the people that bought the tools but the vendors as well. He
also told me how many people tested the batteries and found that they
operated with the same output as their 18V tools, just did it longer.

From 2011:

http://www.coptool.com/dewalt-20v-ma...ay-to-say-18v/

http://www.finehomebuilding.com/item...why-go-20v-max

http://goo.gl/xncWuc

I remember how ****ed off my contractor buddies were because there were
actual 20 and 24 volt tools out there, not 18s masquerading as 20V. A
great marketing coup for DeWalt as most people never read the packaging
or did any research on the new DeWalt schemes, never looked at an
article and never used the internet. Since they paid a premium for the
tools and the new side by side battery configuration wasn't compatible
with the rest of their 18V DeWalt tools, the took
them back.

Although I think DW was banking on the "Tim Taylor effect" of more power
is good (and it certainly has worked well for them!), they said we as
consumers were protected from our own weak minded confusion by their
false labels. I was happy to see that they lied for my benefit as I
thought they were being intentionally deceptive. I was pleased to hear
that corporate America was looking out for me.

I feel that if they will lie about something that simple, they will lie
about other things. Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't
touch them. My personal experience with them many years ago was great,
but has been so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I
look at for tool purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as
manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the
complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else
where they have the technology and quality control to make them and ship
them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to screw
the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

I've got a question for you. How would YOU write an "honest label" for
a Dewalt power tool that made it absolutely crystal clear that (a) it
was an 18v tool and (b) there was no way to make the tool run in any
useful manner on the batteries made for the previous series of 18v
dewalt tools.

Ummmmm, 18 volt Lithium Ion

+1 THAT'S NO BULL**** LABELING.

I think the fact that they did not represent NICAD on their 18v was
deceptive too.

OK, what do you put on the box so that even the most retarded moron can
figure out that what is in it works with THIS battery
http://www.amazon.com/DEWALT-DCB203-Compact-Li-Ion-
Battery/dp/B00BYKVMES and not THIS battery
http://www.amazon.com/DEWALT-DC9182-18V-Lithium-Battery/dp/B00OKK87FG

Maybe you should be the one answering that question.

Smart motor controller not a dumb one. One that provides 2 or 3
voltages for the circuits and a master branch for the motor.

New designs require new batteries.

Martin

On 8/20/2015 6:13 AM, Leon wrote:
"J. Clarke" wrote:
In article ,
says...

This is really old news about the batteries. I don't remember the
exculpatory language on their boxes, but they make it plain that the
tool could hit a 20V output occasionally.

I had a long talk with the rep that sold DeWalt for about 5 years when I
ran into him at HD, and he told me one of the reasons he left DeWalt/BD
was that he was tired of being screamed at for phony advertising from
not only the people that bought the tools but the vendors as well. He
also told me how many people tested the batteries and found that they
operated with the same output as their 18V tools, just did it longer.

From 2011:

http://www.coptool.com/dewalt-20v-ma...ay-to-say-18v/

http://www.finehomebuilding.com/item...why-go-20v-max

http://goo.gl/xncWuc

I remember how ****ed off my contractor buddies were because there were
actual 20 and 24 volt tools out there, not 18s masquerading as 20V. A
great marketing coup for DeWalt as most people never read the packaging
or did any research on the new DeWalt schemes, never looked at an
article and never used the internet. Since they paid a premium for the
tools and the new side by side battery configuration wasn't compatible
with the rest of their 18V DeWalt tools, the took
them back.

Although I think DW was banking on the "Tim Taylor effect" of more power
is good (and it certainly has worked well for them!), they said we as
consumers were protected from our own weak minded confusion by their
false labels. I was happy to see that they lied for my benefit as I
thought they were being intentionally deceptive. I was pleased to hear
that corporate America was looking out for me.

I feel that if they will lie about something that simple, they will lie
about other things. Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't
touch them. My personal experience with them many years ago was great,
but has been so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I
look at for tool purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as
manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the
complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else
where they have the technology and quality control to make them and ship
them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to screw
the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

I've got a question for you. How would YOU write an "honest label" for
a Dewalt power tool that made it absolutely crystal clear that (a) it
was an 18v tool and (b) there was no way to make the tool run in any
useful manner on the batteries made for the previous series of 18v
dewalt tools.

Ummmmm, 18 volt Lithium Ion

On 8/20/2015 9:21 PM, Martin Eastburn wrote:
Smart motor controller not a dumb one. One that provides 2 or 3
voltages for the circuits and a master branch for the motor.

New designs require new batteries.

Maybe, voltage to the motor is not as touchy as one might expect.
Although I am sure the "smart" part is how the charger deals with
different voltages and types of batteries. The Festool charger
basically will charge any battery that will fit, regardless of voltage
or chemical make up.


Many Many years ago ,1979ish, I worked for a GM dealership and for
specific reasons did my best to burn out a "defective" 12 volt window
regulator motor, the motor that raises and lowers the window.

I hooded it up to two brand new 12 volt batteries and the result was
that the motor ran faster. Long story short I had the voltage up to 72
volts, 5 batteries, and the motor screamed for 1 minute and I gave up.
I was unable to burn the motor up to that point

I seriously doubt if any power tool would reject being powered by as
much as double voltage. I could be wrong, there could actually be, as
you said, smart circuitry, that would prevent a consumer from doing
this. Again referring to Festool, their drills will work with any
battery that will fit regardless of chemical make up, there are two
extremely different styles and there is no mistaking one for the other,
as long as the voltage is equal to or less than the stated rating for
the tool. This is my charger,

http://festoolusa.com/power-tools/co...r-tcl-3-499412







Martin

On 8/20/2015 6:13 AM, Leon wrote:
"J. Clarke" wrote:
In article ,
says...

This is really old news about the batteries. I don't remember the
exculpatory language on their boxes, but they make it plain that the
tool could hit a 20V output occasionally.

I had a long talk with the rep that sold DeWalt for about 5 years
when I
ran into him at HD, and he told me one of the reasons he left DeWalt/BD
was that he was tired of being screamed at for phony advertising from
not only the people that bought the tools but the vendors as well. He
also told me how many people tested the batteries and found that they
operated with the same output as their 18V tools, just did it longer.

From 2011:

http://www.coptool.com/dewalt-20v-ma...ay-to-say-18v/


http://www.finehomebuilding.com/item...why-go-20v-max


http://goo.gl/xncWuc

I remember how ****ed off my contractor buddies were because there were
actual 20 and 24 volt tools out there, not 18s masquerading as 20V. A
great marketing coup for DeWalt as most people never read the packaging
or did any research on the new DeWalt schemes, never looked at an
article and never used the internet. Since they paid a premium for the
tools and the new side by side battery configuration wasn't compatible
with the rest of their 18V DeWalt tools, the took
them back.

Although I think DW was banking on the "Tim Taylor effect" of more
power
is good (and it certainly has worked well for them!), they said we as
consumers were protected from our own weak minded confusion by their
false labels. I was happy to see that they lied for my benefit as I
thought they were being intentionally deceptive. I was pleased to hear
that corporate America was looking out for me.

I feel that if they will lie about something that simple, they will lie
about other things. Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't
touch them. My personal experience with them many years ago was great,
but has been so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I
look at for tool purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as
manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the
complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else
where they have the technology and quality control to make them and
ship
them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to screw
the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

I've got a question for you. How would YOU write an "honest label" for
a Dewalt power tool that made it absolutely crystal clear that (a) it
was an 18v tool and (b) there was no way to make the tool run in any
useful manner on the batteries made for the previous series of 18v
dewalt tools.

Ummmmm, 18 volt Lithium Ion

In article ,
says...

Smart motor controller not a dumb one. One that provides 2 or 3
voltages for the circuits and a master branch for the motor.

New designs require new batteries.

It's my understanding that in deWalt's case the change was mostly driven
by a desire to move the protective circuits from the battery to the tool
and charger to allow a cheaper battery. They took the opportunity to
redesign the battery to a more convenient shape in the process. And
apparently they've standardized it across deWalt, Black and Decker, and
Porter-Cable.


Martin

On 8/20/2015 6:13 AM, Leon wrote:
"J. Clarke" wrote:
In article ,
says...

This is really old news about the batteries. I don't remember the
exculpatory language on their boxes, but they make it plain that the
tool could hit a 20V output occasionally.

I had a long talk with the rep that sold DeWalt for about 5 years when I
ran into him at HD, and he told me one of the reasons he left DeWalt/BD
was that he was tired of being screamed at for phony advertising from
not only the people that bought the tools but the vendors as well. He
also told me how many people tested the batteries and found that they
operated with the same output as their 18V tools, just did it longer.

From 2011:

http://www.coptool.com/dewalt-20v-ma...ay-to-say-18v/

http://www.finehomebuilding.com/item...why-go-20v-max

http://goo.gl/xncWuc

I remember how ****ed off my contractor buddies were because there were
actual 20 and 24 volt tools out there, not 18s masquerading as 20V. A
great marketing coup for DeWalt as most people never read the packaging
or did any research on the new DeWalt schemes, never looked at an
article and never used the internet. Since they paid a premium for the
tools and the new side by side battery configuration wasn't compatible
with the rest of their 18V DeWalt tools, the took
them back.

Although I think DW was banking on the "Tim Taylor effect" of more power
is good (and it certainly has worked well for them!), they said we as
consumers were protected from our own weak minded confusion by their
false labels. I was happy to see that they lied for my benefit as I
thought they were being intentionally deceptive. I was pleased to hear
that corporate America was looking out for me.

I feel that if they will lie about something that simple, they will lie
about other things. Unless I got a steal on a DeWalt tool, I wouldn't
touch them. My personal experience with them many years ago was great,
but has been so/so over the past few years, so they aren't anything I
look at for tool purchase/replacement.

I doubt that "American made" will mean much as far as quality goes as
manufacturing skills have left us long ago. The hope would be that the
complicated pieces and parts for the tools would be made somewhere else
where they have the technology and quality control to make them and ship
them here for use. Then maybe, maybe they could train people to screw
the pieces together.

Guess we'll see.

I've got a question for you. How would YOU write an "honest label" for
a Dewalt power tool that made it absolutely crystal clear that (a) it
was an 18v tool and (b) there was no way to make the tool run in any
useful manner on the batteries made for the previous series of 18v
dewalt tools.

Ummmmm, 18 volt Lithium Ion

On Thu, 20 Aug 2015 21:21:27 -0500, Martin Eastburn
wrote:

Smart motor controller not a dumb one. One that provides 2 or 3
voltages for the circuits and a master branch for the motor.

New designs require new batteries.

I would agree about the chargers but unless the protection circuits
are in the tool (rather than the battery pack) there is no reason a
the packs couldn't be made interchangeable. It would be a simple
matter to make the form factor enough different that people wouldn't
be tempted to use the wrong one anyway.

On 8/20/2015 9:47 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
In article ,
says...

Smart motor controller not a dumb one. One that provides 2 or 3
voltages for the circuits and a master branch for the motor.

New designs require new batteries.

It's my understanding that in deWalt's case the change was mostly driven
by a desire to move the protective circuits from the battery to the tool
and charger to allow a cheaper battery. They took the opportunity to
redesign the battery to a more convenient shape in the process. And
apparently they've standardized it across deWalt, Black and Decker, and
Porter-Cable.


Well you understand the way they want you to understand...

But lets compare a fixed price Festool 15V Li-Ion 5.2 amp $55.00

http://www.shopfestool.com/festool-b...7GpBoCl6rw_wcB


to a

DeWalt 12V 2 amp XR Li-Ion compatible with MAX $46.00
http://www.amazon.com/DEWALT-DCB127-...battery+2+pack

or


DeWalt 20V 2 Amp XR Li-Ion compatible with MAX $89.00
http://www.amazon.com/DEWALT-DCB203-...battery+2+pack

I'll stick with Festool for less expensive, considering what you are
getting.

Assuming you are still talking about Li_ion...

FWIW Li-Ion battery packs have the special built in circuitry to prevent
damage to the battery. This circuitry normally is custom for the
particular set of cells that go into a battery pack. Taking the
battery circuitry out of the battery means you are using a generic, one
size fits all, circuit that is not going to be the most efficient for
any particular Li-ion battery. This special internal matched circuitry
in Li-ion batteries is the number one reason that no reputable battery
rebuilder will rebuild Li-Ion batteries. It is way too complicated or
time consuming to measure every cell and match that group to that custom
circuitry. This circuitry in the battery communicates with the smart
Li-ion charger. It would be interesting to hear DeWalt's actual
explanation.

On 8/20/2015 9:49 PM, krw wrote:
On Thu, 20 Aug 2015 21:21:27 -0500, Martin Eastburn
wrote:

Smart motor controller not a dumb one. One that provides 2 or 3
voltages for the circuits and a master branch for the motor.

New designs require new batteries.

I would agree about the chargers but unless the protection circuits
are in the tool (rather than the battery pack) there is no reason a
the packs couldn't be made interchangeable. It would be a simple
matter to make the form factor enough different that people wouldn't
be tempted to use the wrong one anyway.



I doubt that Li-Ion batteries will come with out protection circuitry.
This circuitry communicates with the smart charger during recharge so
that the charger does not damage the Li-Ion charger.

"Leon" wrote:



Many Many years ago ,1979ish, I worked for a GM dealership and for
specific reasons did my best to burn out a "defective" 12 volt
window regulator motor, the motor that raises and lowers the window.

I hooded it up to two brand new 12 volt batteries and the result was
that the motor ran faster. Long story short I had the voltage up to
72 volts, 5 batteries, and the motor screamed for 1 minute and I
gave up. I was unable to burn the motor up to that point
-------------------------------------------
During the mid sixties, I worked for a company that manufacturied
electric
motors for antennas, windows, etc.

We referred to these motors as powered guiltiness.

Part of the spec from the OEM was that the battery fail before the
battery.

Fires were another part of the spec. Didn't the door panel catching on
fire
if the motor locked up.

Lew

In article ,
says...

On Thu, 20 Aug 2015 21:21:27 -0500, Martin Eastburn
wrote:

Smart motor controller not a dumb one. One that provides 2 or 3
voltages for the circuits and a master branch for the motor.

New designs require new batteries.

I would agree about the chargers but unless the protection circuits
are in the tool (rather than the battery pack) there is no reason a
the packs couldn't be made interchangeable. It would be a simple
matter to make the form factor enough different that people wouldn't
be tempted to use the wrong one anyway.


I really wish you people would learn something about the products you
are criticizing before you criticize.

DeWalt makea a line of 18v tools. For those tools they have NiCd packs
and LiIon packs. The packs are interchangeable in the tools and the
most recent chargers will charge either and NiMH as well.

But the packs fit tools that were not designed for lithium ion and
there's a possibility that someone will try to charge one in an older
charger that was not designed for lithium ion, so the packs have to have
the protective circuits that are necessary to keep them from blowing
somebody's ass to Hell. That adds to the cost of the packs.

The 20v tools have a differently SHAPED battery pack that is different
so that nobody can put one in a tool that was not designed for lithium
ion or in a charger that was not designed for lithium ion, and so the
packs don't need to have the protective circuits and can thus be made
and sold at significantly lower cost.

Saying "therei's no reason the packs couldn't be made interchangeable"
just displays ignorance of the the fact that deWalt makes packe that ARE
interchangeable.