I need some help figuring out how to size the shaker style doors for my kitchen. I think that I also need to decide on which hinges I will be using so that I can size the doors correctly. I'm counting on you guys to point me in the right direction. As you'll see from the questions below, this is all brand new to me.

Let's start with this picture, which is the look I am going for.

http://i440.photobucket.com/albums/q...psb8f29715.jpg

The kitchen currently has a number of single doors and 2 sets of double doors, one set in the upper cabinets and one set below the sink.

Examples:

http://i440.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps4d5deedc.jpg

I don't know the correct term, but the doors are a hybrid between inset and overlay. Here's a shot of the inside of one of the doors:

http://i440.photobucket.com/albums/q...psd31cc8ea.jpg

OK, so the plan is to make the doors from 3/4" poplar and 1/4" MDF panels. They will be full overlay. (Right?) I think I would like to use self closing European style hinges, unless you guys point me in a different direction (like you did with the under-mount drawer slides). I spoke to a rep at Cornerstone Hardware who suggested some hinges for me to consider:

http://www.cabinethardware.com/Salic...ges-p/1286.htm

I have no idea if these will work for me. I'm not even sure if I should be choosing 1/2", 3/8" or 3/4" overlay, but I think my only choice is 1/2". Here is what I do know:

For the single doors...

The current single doors are no more than 1/2" wider than the cabinet opening, so they only overlay about 1/4" on each side. I assume that would be called a 1/4" overlay. There is a 1.5" gap between each door. If I decide on a 1/2" overlay, does that mean that each door will need to be built 1/2" wider than the door it is replacing? That would of course mean that the gap between each door would be reduced to 1". That seems kind of narrow. Can the doors be built to be 1/2" overlay on the hinge side and 1/4" on the opening side? Wouldn't that allow for a 1.25" gap between the doors?

For the double doors...

As you can see from the picture of the existing doors, they close tight together. In the picture of the shaker doors, there is a gap. On my cabinets, there is no stile between the doors so I'm not sure if it is OK to have a gap and if so, how big it can/should be.

So, any advice you guys care to offer regarding both door sizes and hinges, I'm open to it. I'd like to start making the doors this weekend. Thanks!

On 1/27/2015 5:13 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
I need some help figuring out how to size the shaker style doors for my kitchen. I think that I also need to decide on which hinges I will be using so that I can size the doors correctly. I'm counting on you guys to point me in the right direction. As you'll see from the questions below, this is all brand new to me.

Let's start with this picture, which is the look I am going for.

http://i440.photobucket.com/albums/q...psb8f29715.jpg

The kitchen currently has a number of single doors and 2 sets of double doors, one set in the upper cabinets and one set below the sink.

Examples:

http://i440.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps4d5deedc.jpg

I don't know the correct term, but the doors are a hybrid between inset and overlay. Here's a shot of the inside of one of the doors:

http://i440.photobucket.com/albums/q...psd31cc8ea.jpg

OK, so the plan is to make the doors from 3/4" poplar and 1/4" MDF panels. They will be full overlay. (Right?) I think I would like to use self closing European style hinges, unless you guys point me in a different direction (like you did with the under-mount drawer slides). I spoke to a rep at Cornerstone Hardware who suggested some hinges for me to consider:

http://www.cabinethardware.com/Salic...ges-p/1286.htm

I have no idea if these will work for me. I'm not even sure if I should be choosing 1/2", 3/8" or 3/4" overlay, but I think my only choice is 1/2". Here is what I do know:

For the single doors...

The current single doors are no more than 1/2" wider than the cabinet opening, so they only overlay about 1/4" on each side. I assume that would be called a 1/4" overlay. There is a 1.5" gap between each door. If I decide on a 1/2" overlay, does that mean that each door will need to be built 1/2" wider than the door it is replacing? That would of course mean that the gap between each door would be reduced to 1". That seems kind of narrow. Can the doors be built to be 1/2" overlay on the hinge side and 1/4" on the opening side? Wouldn't that allow for a 1.25" gap between the doors?

For the double doors...

As you can see from the picture of the existing doors, they close tight together. In the picture of the shaker doors, there is a gap. On my cabinets, there is no stile between the doors so I'm not sure if it is OK to have a gap and if so, how big it can/should be.

So, any advice you guys care to offer regarding both door sizes and hinges, I'm open to it. I'd like to start making the doors this weekend. Thanks!



I'm working on a cabinet that will have doors almost identical to what
you seem to be planning. I will also have two doors that close
"together". My plan for that will be to glue a strip of same material on
the inner edge of one of the doors so that when they close there won't
be a gap. I will have 1/2" overlay on *both* sides of the doors. (The
doors will be 1" larger in height and width than the opening)
I'm using these hinges:

http://www.myknobs.com/hr3396000.html (cheap but adequate)

(this cabinet is to go on our patio to store an assortment of flower
gardening tools for the Mrs.) They will be painted. (Behr exterior
semi-gloss)

On Tuesday, January 27, 2015 at 8:36:10 PM UTC-5, Max wrote:
On 1/27/2015 5:13 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
I need some help figuring out how to size the shaker style doors for my kitchen. I think that I also need to decide on which hinges I will be using so that I can size the doors correctly. I'm counting on you guys to point me in the right direction. As you'll see from the questions below, this is all brand new to me.

Let's start with this picture, which is the look I am going for.

http://i440.photobucket.com/albums/q...psb8f29715.jpg

The kitchen currently has a number of single doors and 2 sets of double doors, one set in the upper cabinets and one set below the sink.

Examples:

http://i440.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps4d5deedc.jpg

I don't know the correct term, but the doors are a hybrid between inset and overlay. Here's a shot of the inside of one of the doors:

http://i440.photobucket.com/albums/q...psd31cc8ea.jpg

OK, so the plan is to make the doors from 3/4" poplar and 1/4" MDF panels. They will be full overlay. (Right?) I think I would like to use self closing European style hinges, unless you guys point me in a different direction (like you did with the under-mount drawer slides). I spoke to a rep at Cornerstone Hardware who suggested some hinges for me to consider:

http://www.cabinethardware.com/Salic...ges-p/1286.htm

I have no idea if these will work for me. I'm not even sure if I should be choosing 1/2", 3/8" or 3/4" overlay, but I think my only choice is 1/2".. Here is what I do know:

For the single doors...

The current single doors are no more than 1/2" wider than the cabinet opening, so they only overlay about 1/4" on each side. I assume that would be called a 1/4" overlay. There is a 1.5" gap between each door. If I decide on a 1/2" overlay, does that mean that each door will need to be built 1/2" wider than the door it is replacing? That would of course mean that the gap between each door would be reduced to 1". That seems kind of narrow. Can the doors be built to be 1/2" overlay on the hinge side and 1/4" on the opening side? Wouldn't that allow for a 1.25" gap between the doors?

For the double doors...

As you can see from the picture of the existing doors, they close tight together. In the picture of the shaker doors, there is a gap. On my cabinets, there is no stile between the doors so I'm not sure if it is OK to have a gap and if so, how big it can/should be.

So, any advice you guys care to offer regarding both door sizes and hinges, I'm open to it. I'd like to start making the doors this weekend. Thanks!



I'm working on a cabinet that will have doors almost identical to what
you seem to be planning. I will also have two doors that close
"together". My plan for that will be to glue a strip of same material on
the inner edge of one of the doors so that when they close there won't
be a gap.

Will that force you to open the door without the strip first so that you can open the other door? If I'm picturing it correctly, my shed door is made like that.

I'm not sure that would want to see the strip every time I open the door.

I will have 1/2" overlay on *both* sides of the doors. (The
doors will be 1" larger in height and width than the opening)
I'm using these hinges:

http://www.myknobs.com/hr3396000.html (cheap but adequate)

Only time will tell. 0.88 seems too cheap to be long lasting.



(this cabinet is to go on our patio to store an assortment of flower
gardening tools for the Mrs.) They will be painted. (Behr exterior
semi-gloss)

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
...

I need some help figuring out how to size the shaker style doors for my
kitchen. I think that I also need to decide on which hinges I will be using
so that I can size the doors correctly. I'm counting on you guys to point
me in the right direction. As you'll see from the questions below, this is
all brand new to me.

Let's start with this picture, which is the look I am going for.

http://i440.photobucket.com/albums/q...psb8f29715.jpg

When you wrote "shaker style" I envisioned inset paneled doors with standard
butt hinges... not overlay doors!

For example: http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/...-wall-cupboard

As such I'll have to defer on a hinge suggestion as I haven't built any
overlay doors like that.

On 1/27/2015 7:45 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Tuesday, January 27, 2015 at 8:36:10 PM UTC-5, Max wrote:

I'm working on a cabinet that will have doors almost identical to what
you seem to be planning. I will also have two doors that close
"together". My plan for that will be to glue a strip of same material on
the inner edge of one of the doors so that when they close there won't
be a gap.

Will that force you to open the door without the strip first so that you can open the other door? If I'm picturing it correctly, my shed door is made like that.

Here's what it looks like:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/100373064@N03/?details=1


I'm not sure that would want to see the strip every time I open the door.

I will have 1/2" overlay on *both* sides of the doors. (The
doors will be 1" larger in height and width than the opening)
I'm using these hinges:

http://www.myknobs.com/hr3396000.html (cheap but adequate)

Only time will tell. 0.88 seems too cheap to be long lasting.

On 1/27/2015 7:50 PM, John Grossbohlin wrote:
"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
...

I need some help figuring out how to size the shaker style doors for
my kitchen. I think that I also need to decide on which hinges I will
be using so that I can size the doors correctly. I'm counting on you
guys to point me in the right direction. As you'll see from the
questions below, this is all brand new to me.

Let's start with this picture, which is the look I am going for.

http://i440.photobucket.com/albums/q...psb8f29715.jpg


When you wrote "shaker style" I envisioned inset paneled doors with
standard butt hinges... not overlay doors!

For example: http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/...-wall-cupboard

As such I'll have to defer on a hinge suggestion as I haven't built any
overlay doors like that.

That's more like my idea of "Shaker" too. Inset.

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message

I need some help figuring out how to size the shaker style doors for my
kitchen. I think that I also need to decide on which hinges I will be
using so that I can size the doors correctly. I'm counting on you guys
to
point me in the right direction. As you'll see from the questions below,
this is all brand new to me.

Let's start with this picture, which is the look I am going for.

http://i440.photobucket.com/albums/q...psb8f29715.jpg

The kitchen currently has a number of single doors and 2 sets of double
doors, one set in the upper cabinets and one set below the sink.

Examples:

http://i440.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps4d5deedc.jpg

I don't know the correct term, but the doors are a hybrid between inset
and overlay. Here's a shot of the inside of one of the doors:

http://i440.photobucket.com/albums/q...psd31cc8ea.jpg

OK, so the plan is to make the doors from 3/4" poplar and 1/4" MDF
panels. They will be full overlay. (Right?) I think I would like to use
self closing European style hinges, unless you guys point me in a
different direction (like you did with the under-mount drawer slides).
I
spoke to a rep at Cornerstone Hardware who suggested some hinges for me
to consider:

http://www.cabinethardware.com/Salic...ges-p/1286.htm

I have no idea if these will work for me. I'm not even sure if I should
be choosing 1/2", 3/8" or 3/4" overlay, but I think my only choice is
1/2". Here is what I do know:

For the single doors...

The current single doors are no more than 1/2" wider than the cabinet
opening, so they only overlay about 1/4" on each side. I assume that
would be called a 1/4" overlay. There is a 1.5" gap between each door.
If
I decide on a 1/2" overlay, does that mean that each door will need to
be
built 1/2" wider than the door it is replacing? That would of course
mean
that the gap between each door would be reduced to 1". That seems kind
of
narrow. Can the doors be built to be 1/2" overlay on the hinge side and
1/4" on the opening side? Wouldn't that allow for a 1.25" gap between
the
doors?

For the double doors...

As you can see from the picture of the existing doors, they close tight
together. In the picture of the shaker doors, there is a gap. On my
cabinets, there is no stile between the doors so I'm not sure if it is
OK
to have a gap and if so, how big it can/should be.

So, any advice you guys care to offer regarding both door sizes and
hinges, I'm open to it. I'd like to start making the doors this weekend.
Thanks!

There are three ways you can position doors on a cabinet:

1. Inset. The front of the door is flush with the front of the face frame
and the door is just slightly smaller than the opening. These are good
looking, also the hardest to do.

2. Overlay. The door overlays the face frame. It can overlay it by
various amounts but the hinge has to accomodate the overlay. A 1/2"
overlay is (IME) the most common and - normally - that means the door is
1" bigger than the opening in both directions (consider double doors as
one). As I said, the overlay has to match the hinge on the hinge edge but
it *could* be different on the other three sides. Personally, I like
overlay doors for a kitchen, helps to keep dust out of the cabinets.

3. Half overlay (or maybe half inset?). Basically, overlay doors with a
rabbet all around the inside so that the door projects less. That's what
you have.

You need to decide which you want, then choose hinges to accomodate. If
you don't want any part of the hbige to show you'll have to use sonething
similar to the one you linked.

Regarding the face frame reveal, yes, if you make 1/2" overlay doors the
reveal of your face frame will be reduced. A 1" reveal is not too little
IMO, in fact, that is what I use.

There is NP in not having a stile in the center of your double doors. As
someone suggested, you could inset a srip into the back of one of the
doors. In fact, my kitchen cabinets are that way...but they are solid
wood and I wanted to leave a bit of a gap for expansion/contraction. You
don't need that with frame and panel doors, build them so there is barely
any gap - paper thin - but bevel the edges toward the back by about 3
degrees.

My suggestion would be to make the doors oversize, hang them where they
will be then mark and trim them. Have a sharp plane handy

--

dadiOH
____________________________

Winters getting colder? Tired of the rat race?
Taxes out of hand? Maybe just ready for a change?
Check it out... http://www.floridaloghouse.net

On 1/27/2015 6:13 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

So, any advice you guys care to offer regarding both door sizes and hinges, I'm open to it. I'd like to start making the doors this weekend. Thanks!

The Salice hinges at Cornerstone will work ... I use mostly Salice, or
Grass, these days.

Make it easy on yourself.

TIP: Easiest/quickest way, on existing cabinets, is to measure by
"burying" the first 1" (for 1/2" overlay; 1 1/2" for 3/4" overlay,etc)
on the tape measure, and using the resulting reading on the tape as the
desired door dimension.

~ Single door: for 1/2" overlay (which is fairly standard) for single
door, simply add/bury 1" to both the cabinet opening height and width
for your door width and height.

~ Double door: and you want 1/2" overlay in an opening with no center
stile:

1. Height - measure for door height as above

2. Width - add/bury 1" to full cabinet opening width; divide that number
by 2; subtract from that number, half the desired middle gap (subtract
1/16" if you want 1/8" gap between doors), for each door width dimension

Note: for an overlay double door cabinet with no center stile, a planned
1/8" gap usually works quite well as it leaves you enough lateral room
for adjustment, which most concealed Euro hinges will give you.

CAVEAT: missing in your information was the CABINET rail and stile width
of the cabinets. ALWAYS take stile and rail width of the cabinets into
account when deciding upon the size of your overlay.

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://www.google.com/+eWoodShop
https://plus.google.com/+KarlCaillouet/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On 1/27/2015 6:13 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

So, any advice you guys care to offer regarding both door sizes and hinges, I'm open to it. I'd like to start making the doors this weekend. Thanks!

Forgot to mention.

I routinely use a large variety door hinges due to the number of
situations I run across daily when retrofitting/remodeling existing
cabinets.

When in doubt, or using new hinge styles, I routinely buy ONE pair and:

Using some plywood scraps and ten minutes of time, make yourself a dummy
face frame or frameless cabinet "side", which can be used repeatedly for
testing various hinges and overlays, how much adjustment you need, and
for precise measurement when drilling the concealed hinge holes:

https://picasaweb.google.com/1113554...7 17974020466

I use this contraption on almost every job, particularly when using new
hinges. Takes all the guesswork out dealing with the confusing myriad of
hinge types, and makes it a piece o cake to be safe than sorry.

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://www.google.com/+eWoodShop
https://plus.google.com/+KarlCaillouet/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On Wednesday, January 28, 2015 at 9:27:18 AM UTC-5, Swingman wrote:
On 1/27/2015 6:13 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

So, any advice you guys care to offer regarding both door sizes and hinges, I'm open to it. I'd like to start making the doors this weekend. Thanks!

The Salice hinges at Cornerstone will work ... I use mostly Salice, or
Grass, these days.

Make it easy on yourself.

TIP: Easiest/quickest way, on existing cabinets, is to measure by
"burying" the first 1" (for 1/2" overlay; 1 1/2" for 3/4" overlay,etc)
on the tape measure, and using the resulting reading on the tape as the
desired door dimension.

~ Single door: for 1/2" overlay (which is fairly standard) for single
door, simply add/bury 1" to both the cabinet opening height and width
for your door width and height.

~ Double door: and you want 1/2" overlay in an opening with no center
stile:

1. Height - measure for door height as above

2. Width - add/bury 1" to full cabinet opening width; divide that number
by 2; subtract from that number, half the desired middle gap (subtract
1/16" if you want 1/8" gap between doors), for each door width dimension

Note: for an overlay double door cabinet with no center stile, a planned
1/8" gap usually works quite well as it leaves you enough lateral room
for adjustment, which most concealed Euro hinges will give you.

CAVEAT: missing in your information was the CABINET rail and stile width
of the cabinets. ALWAYS take stile and rail width of the cabinets into
account when deciding upon the size of your overlay.


If I understand your caveat, I think the information you say was missing was buried within my post. We just have to do some math.

I posted these two pieces of information:

1 - The current door overlay is 1/4".
2 - There is a 1.5" gap between each single door.

Therefore stile width is (should be..I'm not home to measure) 1/4" on hinge of door 1 + 1/4" on opening side of door 2 + 1.5" reveal = 2" stile.

If I increase the the overlay to 1/2", I will reduce the gap to 1" which dadiOH says is fine. Am I on the right track?

As far as the height, I may opt to retain the 1/4" overlay, at least on the uppers, based on the fact that there is a minimal reveal at the bottom of the upper cabinets and the tops of the doors are level with the trim around the wooden window valance that hides the sink light.

On 1/28/2015 9:44 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
I posted these two pieces of information:

1 - The current door overlay is 1/4".
2 - There is a 1.5" gap between each single door.

Therefore stile width is (should be..I'm not home to measure) 1/4" on hinge of door 1 + 1/4" on opening side of door 2 + 1.5" reveal = 2" stile.

If I increase the the overlay to 1/2", I will reduce the gap to 1" which dadiOH says is fine. Am I on the right track?

We usually try to get all the reveals/spaces between adjacent doors and
drawer fronts to match throughout the cabinetry.

Thus the rails and stiles are almost always sized to make a blanket
overlay (1/2, 5/8, 3/4, etc.) work throughout the cabinet installation.

However, this can be strictly aesthetics in some cases, and speaks to
the look of the cabinetry, so if changing your overlay on top, bottom
and side opposite the hinge looks good in your kitchen, go for it.

The overlay however is usually critical on the hinge side.

As far as the height, I may opt to retain the 1/4" overlay, at least on the uppers, based on the fact that there is a minimal reveal at the bottom of the upper cabinets and the tops of the doors are level with the trim around the wooden window valance that hides the sink light.

The overlay on the height is optional, can be adjusted to suit your
taste and style of the cabinetry.

Again, the overlay is usually critical on the hinge side.

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://www.google.com/+eWoodShop
https://plus.google.com/+KarlCaillouet/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

"dadiOH" wrote in :

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message

I need some help figuring out how to size the shaker style doors for

The kitchen currently has a number of single doors and 2 sets of
double doors, one set in the upper cabinets and one set below the
sink.

There is NP in not having a stile in the center of your double doors.

If you put a stile between the double doors below the sink,
make it removable (screw it to the face frame, don't glue
or mortice & tenon it). If you ever need to work on the
plumbing under the sink, and you will, you'll want to remove
that stile and have a full width opening.

John

On 1/28/2015 3:27 PM, John McCoy wrote:
"dadiOH" wrote in :

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message

I need some help figuring out how to size the shaker style doors for

The kitchen currently has a number of single doors and 2 sets of
double doors, one set in the upper cabinets and one set below the
sink.

There is NP in not having a stile in the center of your double doors.

If you put a stile between the double doors below the sink,
make it removable (screw it to the face frame, don't glue
or mortice & tenon it). If you ever need to work on the
plumbing under the sink, and you will, you'll want to remove
that stile and have a full width opening.

John


*Now* you tell me. ;-)

On 1/28/2015 7:23 PM, Max wrote:
On 1/28/2015 3:27 PM, John McCoy wrote:

If you put a stile between the double doors below the sink,
make it removable (screw it to the face frame, don't glue
or mortice & tenon it). If you ever need to work on the
plumbing under the sink, and you will, you'll want to remove
that stile and have a full width opening.

John


*Now* you tell me. ;-)

In a word: Pocket hole jig...

Easy to clamp flush with existing, and easy to remove.

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://www.google.com/+eWoodShop
https://plus.google.com/+KarlCaillouet/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

Swingman wrote:


In a word: Pocket hole jig...


I love it every time I hear that phrase! I'm going out to the garage and
pet my Kreg, just for the heck of it...

--

-Mike-

On 1/28/2015 6:27 PM, Swingman wrote:
On 1/28/2015 7:23 PM, Max wrote:
On 1/28/2015 3:27 PM, John McCoy wrote:

If you put a stile between the double doors below the sink,
make it removable (screw it to the face frame, don't glue
or mortice & tenon it). If you ever need to work on the
plumbing under the sink, and you will, you'll want to remove
that stile and have a full width opening.

John


*Now* you tell me. ;-)

In a word: Pocket hole jig...

Easy to clamp flush with existing, and easy to remove.


I can do that!

"Mike Marlow" wrote in
:

Swingman wrote:


In a word: Pocket hole jig...


I love it every time I hear that phrase! I'm going out to the garage
and pet my Kreg, just for the heck of it...


Be careful, though, as those metal edges are sharp!

Just pet the blue plastic, ok?

Puckdropper
--
Make it to fit, don't make it fit.

Puckdropper wrote:
"Mike Marlow" wrote in
:

Swingman wrote:


In a word: Pocket hole jig...


I love it every time I hear that phrase! I'm going out to the garage
and pet my Kreg, just for the heck of it...


Be careful, though, as those metal edges are sharp!

Just pet the blue plastic, ok?


No problem - I happen to have a blue plastic fetish anyway...

--

-Mike-

Puckdropper wrote:
"Mike Marlow" wrote in
:

Swingman wrote:


In a word: Pocket hole jig...


I love it every time I hear that phrase! I'm going out to the garage
and pet my Kreg, just for the heck of it...


Be careful, though, as those metal edges are sharp!

Just pet the blue plastic, ok?


Ok - went out and petted it. All I can say is "Pheeeew!", or maybe
"Ahhhhhhh". Could not resist caressing that scrap walnut that I used to
make the fixtures out of - words cannot describe it.

This is the bench fixture for those who may not have seen it before...

http://s1259.photobucket.com/user/mi...ort=3&pa ge=1

--

-Mike-

On 1/28/15, 8:42 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Puckdropper wrote:
"Mike Marlow" wrote in
:

Swingman wrote:


In a word: Pocket hole jig...


I love it every time I hear that phrase! I'm going out to the garage
and pet my Kreg, just for the heck of it...



Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things....


Be careful, though, as those metal edges are sharp!

Just pet the blue plastic, ok?


Ok - went out and petted it. All I can say is "Pheeeew!", or maybe
"Ahhhhhhh". Could not resist caressing that scrap walnut that I used to
make the fixtures out of - words cannot describe it.

This is the bench fixture for those who may not have seen it before...

http://s1259.photobucket.com/user/mi...ort=3&pa ge=1



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