I have two of the Ryobi 4AH batteries. I charged them in December, but
not again since - until yesterday.

I had 256 3/8" holes to drill in oak. I would normally use a corded
drill for something like that, but I was curious about the batteries, so
I used a cordless.

After perhaps a hundred holes the drill stopped working, all at once. In
other words, I noticed no obvious slowing down of the drill; it worked
at (or near) full power, then stopped. I looked at the "meter" on the
battery (you press a button to see it) and it showed 1 LED (out of 4 or
5). I switched to the other battery, which did most of the rest of the
job before stopping in the same fashion. I switched back to the first
battery, which was now charged and it worked fine.

While it's possible that the batteries stopped because of a thermal
cutoff (I hear the LI batteries have that feature), I think this was
simply a low-charge cutoff. Interesting.

I'm pretty pleased that these batteries, charged six months ago and used
a number of times in the interim, drilled 100+ holes apiece before
running out.

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On 5/25/2014 11:14 AM, Greg Guarino wrote:
I have two of the Ryobi 4AH batteries. I charged them in December, but
not again since - until yesterday.

I had 256 3/8" holes to drill in oak. I would normally use a corded
drill for something like that, but I was curious about the batteries, so
I used a cordless.

After perhaps a hundred holes the drill stopped working, all at once. In
other words, I noticed no obvious slowing down of the drill; it worked
at (or near) full power, then stopped. I looked at the "meter" on the
battery (you press a button to see it) and it showed 1 LED (out of 4 or
5). I switched to the other battery, which did most of the rest of the
job before stopping in the same fashion. I switched back to the first
battery, which was now charged and it worked fine.

While it's possible that the batteries stopped because of a thermal
cutoff (I hear the LI batteries have that feature), I think this was
simply a low-charge cutoff. Interesting.

I'm pretty pleased that these batteries, charged six months ago and used
a number of times in the interim, drilled 100+ holes apiece before
running out.

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For the most part Li-Ion batteries require a special charger and the
built in circuitry in the battery pack typically will not let you run
the battery down to dead. This is not good for these type batteries. So
these type batteries do tend to go strong and will quit when they reach
a predetermined point of discharge.

On Sun, 25 May 2014 11:24:53 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 5/25/2014 11:14 AM, Greg Guarino wrote:
I have two of the Ryobi 4AH batteries. I charged them in December, but
not again since - until yesterday.

I had 256 3/8" holes to drill in oak. I would normally use a corded
drill for something like that, but I was curious about the batteries, so
I used a cordless.

After perhaps a hundred holes the drill stopped working, all at once. In
other words, I noticed no obvious slowing down of the drill; it worked
at (or near) full power, then stopped. I looked at the "meter" on the
battery (you press a button to see it) and it showed 1 LED (out of 4 or
5). I switched to the other battery, which did most of the rest of the
job before stopping in the same fashion. I switched back to the first
battery, which was now charged and it worked fine.

While it's possible that the batteries stopped because of a thermal
cutoff (I hear the LI batteries have that feature), I think this was
simply a low-charge cutoff. Interesting.

I'm pretty pleased that these batteries, charged six months ago and used
a number of times in the interim, drilled 100+ holes apiece before
running out.

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For the most part Li-Ion batteries require a special charger and the
built in circuitry in the battery pack typically will not let you run
the battery down to dead. This is not good for these type batteries. So
these type batteries do tend to go strong and will quit when they reach
a predetermined point of discharge.

I think you're correct. better to have the battery shut down than
have it damaged.

The lithium batteries in electric/hybrid cars typically run between
20% and 80% charge.

On 5/25/14, 11:24 AM, Leon wrote:
On 5/25/2014 11:14 AM, Greg Guarino wrote:
I have two of the Ryobi 4AH batteries. I charged them in December, but
not again since - until yesterday.

I had 256 3/8" holes to drill in oak. I would normally use a corded
drill for something like that, but I was curious about the batteries, so
I used a cordless.

After perhaps a hundred holes the drill stopped working, all at once. In
other words, I noticed no obvious slowing down of the drill; it worked
at (or near) full power, then stopped. I looked at the "meter" on the
battery (you press a button to see it) and it showed 1 LED (out of 4 or
5). I switched to the other battery, which did most of the rest of the
job before stopping in the same fashion. I switched back to the first
battery, which was now charged and it worked fine.

While it's possible that the batteries stopped because of a thermal
cutoff (I hear the LI batteries have that feature), I think this was
simply a low-charge cutoff. Interesting.

I'm pretty pleased that these batteries, charged six months ago and used
a number of times in the interim, drilled 100+ holes apiece before
running out.

---
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protection is active.
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For the most part Li-Ion batteries require a special charger and the
built in circuitry in the battery pack typically will not let you run
the battery down to dead. This is not good for these type batteries. So
these type batteries do tend to go strong and will quit when they reach
a predetermined point of discharge.


It can takes getting used to the fact that you get no warning of a
depleting battery.
However, once you go back to a NiCad and have to deal with the decreased
power for half the battery cycle, you realize it's a welcome change.

I've had my Ridgid Li-Ion batteries for a couple years and they still
operate like new.



--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

Greg Guarino wrote:
I have two of the Ryobi 4AH batteries. I charged them in December, but
not again since - until yesterday.

I had 256 3/8" holes to drill in oak. I would normally use a corded
drill for something like that, but I was curious about the batteries,
so I used a cordless.

After perhaps a hundred holes the drill stopped working, all at once.
In other words, I noticed no obvious slowing down of the drill; it worked
at (or near) full power, then stopped. I looked at the "meter" on the
battery (you press a button to see it) and it showed 1 LED (out of 4
or 5). I switched to the other battery, which did most of the rest of
the job before stopping in the same fashion. I switched back to the first
battery, which was now charged and it worked fine.

While it's possible that the batteries stopped because of a thermal
cutoff (I hear the LI batteries have that feature), I think this was
simply a low-charge cutoff. Interesting.

I'm pretty pleased that these batteries, charged six months ago and
used a number of times in the interim, drilled 100+ holes apiece before
running out.


That's how LiOn batteries discharge Greg. They run a (near) full power and
then almost instantly stop when they hit low charge. They don't wind down
like other batteries. It is a pretty good testimony to your batteries to
have gotten what you did out of them.

--

-Mike-

On 5/25/2014 11:59 AM, -MIKE- wrote:
On 5/25/14, 11:24 AM, Leon wrote:
On 5/25/2014 11:14 AM, Greg Guarino wrote:
I have two of the Ryobi 4AH batteries. I charged them in December, but
not again since - until yesterday.

I had 256 3/8" holes to drill in oak. I would normally use a corded
drill for something like that, but I was curious about the batteries, so
I used a cordless.

After perhaps a hundred holes the drill stopped working, all at once. In
other words, I noticed no obvious slowing down of the drill; it worked
at (or near) full power, then stopped. I looked at the "meter" on the
battery (you press a button to see it) and it showed 1 LED (out of 4 or
5). I switched to the other battery, which did most of the rest of the
job before stopping in the same fashion. I switched back to the first
battery, which was now charged and it worked fine.

While it's possible that the batteries stopped because of a thermal
cutoff (I hear the LI batteries have that feature), I think this was
simply a low-charge cutoff. Interesting.

I'm pretty pleased that these batteries, charged six months ago and used
a number of times in the interim, drilled 100+ holes apiece before
running out.

---
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protection is active.
http://www.avast.com



For the most part Li-Ion batteries require a special charger and the
built in circuitry in the battery pack typically will not let you run
the battery down to dead. This is not good for these type batteries. So
these type batteries do tend to go strong and will quit when they reach
a predetermined point of discharge.


It can takes getting used to the fact that you get no warning of a
depleting battery.
However, once you go back to a NiCad and have to deal with the decreased
power for half the battery cycle, you realize it's a welcome change.

Some of the Li-Ion battery packs have a fuel gauge/state of charge
indicator. Some have to be checked as an extra step, some like the
Festool shows the state of charge every time you pull the trigger.

From what I understand also, because of the smart chargers required for
the Li-Ion battery packs and the circuitry in the packs you can leave
the battery in the charger with out fear of damaging or overcharging.
I, out of habit, remove the battery with in a couple of hours if I can
remember. ;~)




I've had my Ridgid Li-Ion batteries for a couple years and they still
operate like new.

And the nice thing about those particular batteries is that they have a
life time warranty.

On Sun, 25 May 2014 12:14:55 -0400, Greg Guarino
wrote:

I have two of the Ryobi 4AH batteries. I charged them in December, but
not again since - until yesterday.

I had 256 3/8" holes to drill in oak. I would normally use a corded
drill for something like that, but I was curious about the batteries, so
I used a cordless.

After perhaps a hundred holes the drill stopped working, all at once. In
other words, I noticed no obvious slowing down of the drill; it worked
at (or near) full power, then stopped. I looked at the "meter" on the
battery (you press a button to see it) and it showed 1 LED (out of 4 or
5). I switched to the other battery, which did most of the rest of the
job before stopping in the same fashion. I switched back to the first
battery, which was now charged and it worked fine.

While it's possible that the batteries stopped because of a thermal
cutoff (I hear the LI batteries have that feature), I think this was
simply a low-charge cutoff. Interesting.

That's typical of LiIon batteries. They have a rather flat discharge
curve until the last 10%, or so. Then the cell voltage drops like a
rock. The battery controllers often cut out at this point to save the
battery. There isn't much energy left after that point so it's
generally not worth risking the cells.

I'm pretty pleased that these batteries, charged six months ago and used
a number of times in the interim, drilled 100+ holes apiece before
running out.


LiIons also have a rather low self-discharge, so it's not surprising
to have them still be close to "full" after six months. They have a
comparatively (WRT other secondary cells) long shelf life, too, so are
good for seldom-used tools. At my previous job, we had some that were
purchased, for one of our products, four years before and they still
had well more than 80% capacity.

Baxter wrote:
Greg Guarino wrote in
:

I have two of the Ryobi 4AH batteries. I charged them in December,
but not again since - until yesterday.

I had 256 3/8" holes to drill in oak. I would normally use a corded
drill for something like that, but I was curious about the batteries,
so I used a cordless.

After perhaps a hundred holes the drill stopped working, all at once.
In other words, I noticed no obvious slowing down of the drill; it
worked at (or near) full power, then stopped. I looked at the "meter"
on the battery (you press a button to see it) and it showed 1 LED
(out of 4 or 5). I switched to the other battery, which did most of
the rest of the job before stopping in the same fashion. I switched
back to the first battery, which was now charged and it worked fine.

While it's possible that the batteries stopped because of a thermal
cutoff (I hear the LI batteries have that feature), I think this was
simply a low-charge cutoff. Interesting.

I'm pretty pleased that these batteries, charged six months ago and
used a number of times in the interim, drilled 100+ holes apiece
before running out.

Rapid drop-off is a characteristic of Lithium batteries. And they
hold their charge - I have cordess shears that I charged last spring
then set on the shelf - still going strong this spring. Just don't
let them freeze.

My Milwaukee and Makita Lithiums reside in my work truck year round and that
includes all winter long. They take a little warmup time but so far (2
Makitas are 9 years old) all are going strong,

--
PV

Words from the Doctor
"Sorry PV but the Police will jail you if you dare approach me."
"If it gets any colder, your whole church congregation would be to
flame." "Calgary is viewed is a non-intellectual city from Edmotnon
Alberta Canada". "He is a slef deluded maniac.

On Sun, 25 May 2014 14:03:47 -0600, "PV" not4utono@ spamzone.org
wrote:

Baxter wrote:
Greg Guarino wrote in
:

I have two of the Ryobi 4AH batteries. I charged them in December,
but not again since - until yesterday.

I had 256 3/8" holes to drill in oak. I would normally use a corded
drill for something like that, but I was curious about the batteries,
so I used a cordless.

After perhaps a hundred holes the drill stopped working, all at once.
In other words, I noticed no obvious slowing down of the drill; it
worked at (or near) full power, then stopped. I looked at the "meter"
on the battery (you press a button to see it) and it showed 1 LED
(out of 4 or 5). I switched to the other battery, which did most of
the rest of the job before stopping in the same fashion. I switched
back to the first battery, which was now charged and it worked fine.

While it's possible that the batteries stopped because of a thermal
cutoff (I hear the LI batteries have that feature), I think this was
simply a low-charge cutoff. Interesting.

I'm pretty pleased that these batteries, charged six months ago and
used a number of times in the interim, drilled 100+ holes apiece
before running out.

Rapid drop-off is a characteristic of Lithium batteries. And they
hold their charge - I have cordess shears that I charged last spring
then set on the shelf - still going strong this spring. Just don't
let them freeze.

My Milwaukee and Makita Lithiums reside in my work truck year round and that
includes all winter long. They take a little warmup time but so far (2
Makitas are 9 years old) all are going strong,

I wouldn't worry about the cold affecting the batteries much, but heat
will kill any battery. Contrary to popular opinion, car batteries die
in the summer, not winter. It's just that the full capacity isn't
needed until Winter so the degradation isn't noticed until then. It's
not a good idea to store them in the vehicle (not much choice for your
starting battery). I make sure all of my batteries are in the house
(or better, the basement) during the summer months.

On 5/25/2014 12:14 PM, Greg Guarino wrote:
I have two of the Ryobi 4AH batteries. I charged them in December, but
not again since - until yesterday.

I had 256 3/8" holes to drill in oak. I would normally use a corded
drill for something like that, but I was curious about the batteries, so
I used a cordless.

After perhaps a hundred holes the drill stopped working, all at once. In
other words, I noticed no obvious slowing down of the drill; it worked
at (or near) full power, then stopped. I looked at the "meter" on the
battery (you press a button to see it) and it showed 1 LED (out of 4 or
5). I switched to the other battery, which did most of the rest of the
job before stopping in the same fashion. I switched back to the first
battery, which was now charged and it worked fine.

While it's possible that the batteries stopped because of a thermal
cutoff (I hear the LI batteries have that feature), I think this was
simply a low-charge cutoff. Interesting.

I'm pretty pleased that these batteries, charged six months ago and used
a number of times in the interim, drilled 100+ holes apiece before
running out.

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Needed. LION, and LIPO's are destroyed by pulling the volts down.

My hitachi's do not have that for the 10 volt units. Wish they did. I
monitor them.



--
Jeff

Greg Guarino wrote in
:

*snip*
While it's possible that the batteries stopped because of a thermal
cutoff (I hear the LI batteries have that feature), I think this was
simply a low-charge cutoff. Interesting.

*snip*

I get just a tiny bit of warning before my batteries cut off. The signs
are subtle, like the impact driver starting to impact sooner. When I
notice that, I usually get 2-3 more screws before the battery dies.

There's no need to run the battery to low-voltage cut out. If you notice
the driver slowing down, don't feel bad about charging it immediately.
You're not going to get all that much more out of it anyway.

Puckdropper
--
Make it to fit, don't make it fit.

On 05/25/2014 04:32 PM, wrote:

I wouldn't worry about the cold affecting the batteries much, but heat
will kill any battery. Contrary to popular opinion, car batteries die
in the summer, not winter. It's just that the full capacity isn't
needed until Winter so the degradation isn't noticed until then. It's
not a good idea to store them in the vehicle (not much choice for your
starting battery). I make sure all of my batteries are in the house
(or better, the basement) during the summer months.

True. In the Arizona (Phoenix and surrounds) desert, auto lead-acid
batteries that live in the desert full time have an average life span of
2 years, no matter the guarantee/warantee. Apparently, the heat can
cause the plates to warp and short out.

When I lived in Seattle, a car battery could last 8 years.

Doug Winterburn wrote in news:53827e4a$0$22486$c3e8da3
:

On 05/25/2014 04:32 PM, wrote:

True. In the Arizona (Phoenix and surrounds) desert, auto lead-acid
batteries that live in the desert full time have an average life span of
2 years, no matter the guarantee/warantee. Apparently, the heat can
cause the plates to warp and short out.

When I lived in Seattle, a car battery could last 8 years.

I bought a used 1984 LeSabre in the fall of 1991. In the summer of 1997, the battery needed to
be replaced. The factory original battery. (Date code showed it was manufactured November
1983.) This was in central Indiana.

On Mon, 26 May 2014 16:03:41 +0000 (UTC), (Edward A.
Falk) wrote:

In article ,
Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:

I've had my Ridgid Li-Ion batteries for a couple years and they still
operate like new.

And the nice thing about those particular batteries is that they have a
life time warranty.

Well, damn. Can I get them for my DeWalt? Will they charge on the standard
charger?


Life time warranty only if you registered them when you purchased
them. And if you happen to exchange them make sure you register the
new ones. No registry, no warranty. read all the fine print.

Vic

"Leon" lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote

I've had my Ridgid Li-Ion batteries for a couple years and they still
operate like new.

And the nice thing about those particular batteries is that they have a
life time warranty.

I went as far as to buy some Li-Ion battery packs and a charger, and take
them apart and stuff them in an old B&D NiCad battery case, so I could have
the benefits of the better battery. Works great.

I will never own or buy another NiCad tool, again.
--
Jim in NC


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On Mon, 26 May 2014 20:03:04 -0400, "Morgans"
wrote:



"Leon" lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote

I've had my Ridgid Li-Ion batteries for a couple years and they still
operate like new.

And the nice thing about those particular batteries is that they have a
life time warranty.

I went as far as to buy some Li-Ion battery packs and a charger, and take
them apart and stuff them in an old B&D NiCad battery case, so I could have
the benefits of the better battery. Works great.

I will never own or buy another NiCad tool, again.
Ditto. NiMh, possibly, but NEVER Ni-Cad ANYTHING.

On 5/26/2014 11:03 AM, Edward A. Falk wrote:
In article ,
Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:

I've had my Ridgid Li-Ion batteries for a couple years and they still
operate like new.

And the nice thing about those particular batteries is that they have a
life time warranty.

Well, damn. Can I get them for my DeWalt? Will they charge on the standard
charger?



Probably not. Li-Ion batteries typically have terminals in different
locations on the battery, to prevent putting in in a charger not
designed to charge a Li=Ion battery.

Li-ion batteries are very sensitive to how they are actually built and
charged. I don't know of any battery rebuild places that actually
rebuild Li_ion batteries.