When you're a novice you have these little Eureka! moments. These are
most often followed by the news that 1. Everyone Else Already Knows How
To Do It, or 2. Your "discovery" is an ass-backward way of doing
something that Everyone Else Has An Easier Way of Doing.

Here's a recent one of mine. I have a small bench vise, which is a
marked improvement over No Bench Vise, but it was too short to hold even
a 26" piece of 1x3 steady so I could plane the edge a little. Here's my
solution, so far:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/gdguari...ream/lightbox/

.... a piece of 2x4 screwed into the bottom of the workbench overhang, to
support the other end of the board. For thinner stock I put a spacer of
scrap wood on top of the 2x4 piece.

I have a couple of friends who find no end of amusement in my
"discoveries", so I figure I could provide the same service here.

But seriously, whatever sort of vise I might have, there would be some
length of stock that would be too long. Is there a better solution,
maybe something that could easily be removed, or hinged? I was thinking
about using a metal plate, possibly with those machine thread/wood
thread bolts and wing nuts for easy removal.

On Nov 9, 11:07 am, Greg Guarino wrote:

When you're a novice you have these little Eureka! moments. These are
most often followed by the news that 1. Everyone Else Already Knows How
To Do It, or 2. Your "discovery" is an ass-backward way of doing
something that Everyone Else Has An Easier Way of Doing.

Here's a recent one of mine. I have a small bench vise, which is a
marked improvement over No Bench Vise, but it was too short to hold even
a 26" piece of 1x3 steady so I could plane the edge a little. Here's my
solution, so far:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/gdguari...otostream/ligh...

... a piece of 2x4 screwed into the bottom of the workbench overhang, to
support the other end of the board. For thinner stock I put a spacer of
scrap wood on top of the 2x4 piece.

I have a couple of friends who find no end of amusement in my
"discoveries", so I figure I could provide the same service here.

But seriously, whatever sort of vise I might have, there would be some
length of stock that would be too long. Is there a better solution,
maybe something that could easily be removed, or hinged? I was thinking
about using a metal plate, possibly with those machine thread/wood
thread bolts and wing nuts for easy removal.

That's a perfectly adequate solution. Instead of using a metal plate
(wood is good), use a vertical piece of stuff with holes drilled in it
that accept wood pegs to support the nether end of your workpiece.
Such as:
http://www.workbenchdesign.net/images/roubobench.jpg
In that incarnation the vertical piece slides along the bottom rail so
you can position it horizontally and the holes let you adjust the pegs
vertically.

You should check out Taunton Press' The Workbench Book.
http://www.amazon.com/Workbench-Book.../dp/1561582700
Your local library will have one, and while you're at it check out the
rest of Taunton's books on woodworking. Good stuff.

R

On 11/9/2011 10:07 AM, Greg Guarino wrote:
When you're a novice you have these little Eureka! moments. These are
most often followed by the news that 1. Everyone Else Already Knows How
To Do It, or 2. Your "discovery" is an ass-backward way of doing
something that Everyone Else Has An Easier Way of Doing.

Here's a recent one of mine. I have a small bench vise, which is a
marked improvement over No Bench Vise, but it was too short to hold even
a 26" piece of 1x3 steady so I could plane the edge a little. Here's my
solution, so far:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/gdguari...ream/lightbox/

... a piece of 2x4 screwed into the bottom of the workbench overhang, to
support the other end of the board. For thinner stock I put a spacer of
scrap wood on top of the 2x4 piece.

I have a couple of friends who find no end of amusement in my
"discoveries", so I figure I could provide the same service here.

But seriously, whatever sort of vise I might have, there would be some
length of stock that would be too long. Is there a better solution,
maybe something that could easily be removed, or hinged? I was thinking
about using a metal plate, possibly with those machine thread/wood
thread bolts and wing nuts for easy removal.

You might find satisfaction in knowing that your idea is not new but you
mostly only find a refined version on well thought out work benches.
Good for you Greg!

RicodJour wrote in
:

You should check out Taunton Press' The Workbench Book.
http://www.amazon.com/Workbench-Book...es-Woodworking
/dp/1561582700


Thanks for the reference!!
Got the Kindle edition for $9.99.

--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid

On Nov 9, 12:03*pm, RicodJour wrote:

Such as: http://www.workbenchdesign.net/images/roubobench.jpg

R

On the near corner of that workbench, what is/are the names of those
things (vises?) and what do they do?

Thanx

On Thu, 10 Nov 2011 09:35:19 -0800 (PST), kimosabe
wrote:

On Nov 9, 12:03*pm, RicodJour wrote:

Such as: http://www.workbenchdesign.net/images/roubobench.jpg

R

On the near corner of that workbench, what is/are the names of those
things (vises?) and what do they do?

The part on the left front of the benchtop is a wedge, to keep wood
from shifting as you plane it from the right. (It's a right handed
bench, y'know.)

The vertical vise is a leg vise. The bottom portion has holes on the
horizontal portion which allow you to open the vise, peg the bottom,
and obtain a vertical jaw so it grips properly.

The hourglass shaped holed board in the center is a placeholder. You
put holddowns through it to hold the planed board horizontal and
level.

These parts, when used together, hold a board quite securely for
planing or drilling operations.

--
Resolve to be thyself: and know, that he who finds himself, loses his misery.
-- Matthew Arnold

On 11/9/2011 12:03 PM, RicodJour wrote:
use a vertical piece of stuff with holes drilled in it
that accept wood pegs to support the nether end of your workpiece.

Given the sophistication of the bench in the photo, this is a stupid
question, but a peg in a hole is adequate to support the pressure it
will get? Wouldn't they tend to loosen up after a while? How thick does
the support block need to be? Can I assume we'd need some pretty hard
wood, and a pretty tight fit?

I ask this because, low-tech as my bench is, a peg system could be
fitted to it pretty easily. Geez, I'm even having ideas about how to
make it slide.

I've gotta stop reading this group...

On Nov 11, 8:37*am, Greg Guarino wrote:
On 11/9/2011 12:03 PM, RicodJour wrote:

use a vertical piece of stuff with holes drilled in it
that accept wood pegs to support the nether end of your workpiece.

Given the sophistication of the bench in the photo, this is a stupid
question, but a peg in a hole is adequate to support the pressure it
will get? Wouldn't they tend to loosen up after a while? How thick does
the support block need to be? Can I assume we'd need some pretty hard
wood, and a pretty tight fit?

I ask this because, low-tech as my bench is, a peg system could be
fitted to it pretty easily. Geez, I'm even having ideas about how to
make it slide.

I've gotta stop reading this group...



Sure. Why wouldn't a peg in a hole work? You're not standing on it,
and even if you were, what's a wood ladder but a peg in a hole?

R

On Nov 11, 8:37*am, Greg Guarino wrote:
On 11/9/2011 12:03 PM, RicodJour wrote:

use a vertical piece of stuff with holes drilled in it
that accept wood pegs to support the nether end of your workpiece.

Given the sophistication of the bench in the photo, this is a stupid
question, but a peg in a hole is adequate to support the pressure it
will get? Wouldn't they tend to loosen up after a while? How thick does
the support block need to be? Can I assume we'd need some pretty hard
wood, and a pretty tight fit?

I ask this because, low-tech as my bench is, a peg system could be
fitted to it pretty easily. Geez, I'm even having ideas about how to
make it slide.

You should definitely check out that book I mentioned.

Here are some other flavors of supports. The vertical one I know as a
deadman. They always have colorful names - feel free to make up one
of your own.

http://www.wkfinetools.com/tMaking/a...talled-wk..jpg

and at the bottom of the next page is a very clear how-to
http://carlswoodworking.wordpress.com/

http://www.chestofbooks.com/home-imp...-tool-rack.jpg

http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-co...dog-boards.jpg

R

On Fri, 11 Nov 2011 08:37:56 -0500, Greg Guarino
wrote:

On 11/9/2011 12:03 PM, RicodJour wrote:
use a vertical piece of stuff with holes drilled in it
that accept wood pegs to support the nether end of your workpiece.

Given the sophistication of the bench in the photo, this is a stupid
question, but a peg in a hole is adequate to support the pressure it
will get?

Um, when's the last time you sheared off a 3/4" dowel, let alone a
3/4" rod of ductile iron holdfasts? Smart people use hardwood for
both the bench and the pegs.


Wouldn't they tend to loosen up after a while? How thick does
the support block need to be? Can I assume we'd need some pretty hard
wood, and a pretty tight fit?

Most are 2" thick, but you can glue or screw on additions behind it to
increase the tension.


I ask this because, low-tech as my bench is, a peg system could be
fitted to it pretty easily. Geez, I'm even having ideas about how to
make it slide.

Buy a #45 (from me, of course and plane your own dadoes in the
underside of the benchtop and top of the lower shelf. Or, if the
bottom shelf is inset from the front, add on a strip with a dado in
it.


I've gotta stop reading this group...

Getting expensive on this slippery slope, is it? Yeah, but we knew
that when we started.

Thanks for bringing me back to the Neander side of the Force, Greg.
I need to use Normite stuff for clients most of the time.

--
That's the thing about needs. Sometimes, when you get them met,
you don't need them anymore. -- Michael Patrick King

On 11/11/2011 12:50 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Fri, 11 Nov 2011 08:37:56 -0500, Greg
wrote:

On 11/9/2011 12:03 PM, RicodJour wrote:
use a vertical piece of stuff with holes drilled in it
that accept wood pegs to support the nether end of your workpiece.

Given the sophistication of the bench in the photo, this is a stupid
question, but a peg in a hole is adequate to support the pressure it
will get?

Um, when's the last time you sheared off a 3/4" dowel, let alone a
3/4" rod of ductile iron holdfasts? Smart people use hardwood for
both the bench and the pegs.

I wasn't thinking that the peg would break; I was wondering if it might
wiggle in the hole after a while. The couple of photos I have seen so
far make it look like the wood with the holes in it was only 3/4" or so.


Wouldn't they tend to loosen up after a while? How thick does
the support block need to be? Can I assume we'd need some pretty hard
wood, and a pretty tight fit?

Most are 2" thick, but you can glue or screw on additions behind it to
increase the tension.


I ask this because, low-tech as my bench is, a peg system could be
fitted to it pretty easily. Geez, I'm even having ideas about how to
make it slide.

Buy a #45 (from me, of course and plane your own dadoes in the
underside of the benchtop and top of the lower shelf. Or, if the
bottom shelf is inset from the front, add on a strip with a dado in
it.

The lower shelf of my bench is set back a bit; extra clearance to avoid
denting my license plate. But I'm hatching an idea for mounting a
support unit on the horizontal bench support. (It's a 2x8). Maybe two
aluminum U-channels screwed into the 2x8, open sides facing each other
but 6" apart. Then I could make a board (or more likely a sandwich) with
grooves on top and bottom that would ride inside the aluminum "rails". A
few offset holes and voila!

I've gotta stop reading this group...

Getting expensive on this slippery slope, is it? Yeah, but we knew
that when we started.

Thanks for bringing me back to the Neander side of the Force, Greg.
I need to use Normite stuff for clients most of the time.

--
That's the thing about needs. Sometimes, when you get them met,
you don't need them anymore. -- Michael Patrick King

On Nov 11, 1:19*pm, Greg Guarino wrote:

The lower shelf of my bench is set back a bit; extra clearance to avoid
denting my license plate. But I'm hatching an idea for mounting a
support unit on the horizontal bench support. (It's a 2x8). Maybe two
aluminum U-channels screwed into the 2x8, open sides facing each other
but 6" apart. Then I could make a board (or more likely a sandwich) with
grooves on top and bottom that would ride inside the aluminum "rails". A
few offset holes and voila!

You're a woodworker now - do it in wood. You don't need metal. The
traditional way, young Jedi, is to cut a notch in the bottom of the
deadman (two passes from opposite directions on a table saw with the
blade tilted), and to saw and plane the top of the rail to mate. As
an alternative you could rip a triangular piece and attach that to the
top of the rail.

R

On 11/11/2011 12:50 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
I've gotta stop reading this group...

Speaking of reading this group, Flickr (the photo hosting site) tells me
that the block of 2x4 screwed into my bench has been viewed 129 times.
There must be a lot of lurkers here. Either that, or some of you must
be coming back to that "masterpiece" over and over again.
129 views puts it in 33rd place among my 1400 photos (another hobby),
comfortably ahead of some much nicer compositions.

Getting expensive on this slippery slope, is it? Yeah, but we knew
that when we started.

Well, expensive is the one thing I need to prevent. I've got an almost
college-age offspring and am coming off a pretty expensive year, for
reasons I won't elaborate on online.

But with some advice and a bit of home-grown cleverness, I find I can
still have some fun and get decent results. If I make some sort of peg
board support, you can bet it will largely involve scrap wood, with
which I am plentifully supplied. The "gotta stop reading this group"
sentiment is about having more ideas than I have time to implement.

Thanks for bringing me back to the Neander side of the Force, Greg.
I need to use Normite stuff for clients most of the time.

I'm at the Homo Erectus stage at best, which seems oddly appropriate.

On 11/11/2011 8:31 PM, RicodJour wrote:
On Nov 11, 1:19 pm, Greg wrote:

The lower shelf of my bench is set back a bit; extra clearance to avoid
denting my license plate. But I'm hatching an idea for mounting a
support unit on the horizontal bench support. (It's a 2x8). Maybe two
aluminum U-channels screwed into the 2x8, open sides facing each other
but 6" apart. Then I could make a board (or more likely a sandwich) with
grooves on top and bottom that would ride inside the aluminum "rails". A
few offset holes and voila!

You're a woodworker now

Opinions vary, including mine.

- do it in wood. You don't need metal. The
traditional way, young Jedi, is to cut a notch in the bottom of the
deadman (two passes from opposite directions on a table saw with the
blade tilted), and to saw and plane the top of the rail to mate. As
an alternative you could rip a triangular piece and attach that to the
top of the rail.

I suspect that tradition sometimes yields a better result. My crude
"support" was made in order to allow me to plane the edges of my boards
rather than sand out the saw marks from the lumber yard, for instance.
But in this case, utility is what I'm after, along with efficiency, as
my time is limited. I'm still in the "pondering" phase, but metal
"tracks" seem like a good solution. I don't own a table saw, by the way,
so a triangular track would probably involve a router, I guess.

On Nov 12, 11:21 am, Greg Guarino wrote:
On 11/11/2011 8:31 PM, RicodJour wrote:
On Nov 11, 1:19 pm, Greg wrote:

The lower shelf of my bench is set back a bit; extra clearance to avoid
denting my license plate. But I'm hatching an idea for mounting a
support unit on the horizontal bench support. (It's a 2x8). Maybe two
aluminum U-channels screwed into the 2x8, open sides facing each other
but 6" apart. Then I could make a board (or more likely a sandwich) with
grooves on top and bottom that would ride inside the aluminum "rails". A
few offset holes and voila!

You're a woodworker now

Opinions vary, including mine.

- do it in wood. You don't need metal. The

traditional way, young Jedi, is to cut a notch in the bottom of the
deadman (two passes from opposite directions on a table saw with the
blade tilted), and to saw and plane the top of the rail to mate. As
an alternative you could rip a triangular piece and attach that to the
top of the rail.

I suspect that tradition sometimes yields a better result. My crude
"support" was made in order to allow me to plane the edges of my boards
rather than sand out the saw marks from the lumber yard, for instance.
But in this case, utility is what I'm after, along with efficiency, as
my time is limited. I'm still in the "pondering" phase, but metal
"tracks" seem like a good solution. I don't own a table saw, by the way,
so a triangular track would probably involve a router, I guess.

A router is not necessary. Try a saw and a plane. You could also cut
the groove in the bottom of the deadman with a handsaw. Or you could
build up the assembly from thinner/smaller pieces to create a slot or
track. Like this:
http://tamingofthegrain.com/taming_s...DoorTrack2.jpg
but made up of several pieces.

The triangular track is superior for a number of reasons - simplicity
in operation, self-centering, and little play. Cut a 45 running along
the bottom edge (endgrain) of two boards with a hand saw, clean up the
45 with your newly sharpened plane, and sandwich the two boards
together so the long points are on the outside. The mating track is
made with two rip cuts along the bottom rail (or separate piece if you
want to attach it later), and cleaned up with a plane.

Don't fall back on the "I need a new tool to do that", as you almost
never do. And I'm a tool whore saying that. You'll learn far more
from being creative and looking to the past, and you'll save money to
boot.

R

On Sat, 12 Nov 2011 11:11:59 -0500, Greg Guarino
wrote:

On 11/11/2011 12:50 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
I've gotta stop reading this group...

Speaking of reading this group, Flickr (the photo hosting site) tells me
that the block of 2x4 screwed into my bench has been viewed 129 times.
There must be a lot of lurkers here. Either that, or some of you must
be coming back to that "masterpiece" over and over again.
129 views puts it in 33rd place among my 1400 photos (another hobby),
comfortably ahead of some much nicer compositions.

You've entered cue music The YouTube Zone.


Getting expensive on this slippery slope, is it? Yeah, but we knew
that when we started.

Well, expensive is the one thing I need to prevent. I've got an almost
college-age offspring and am coming off a pretty expensive year, for
reasons I won't elaborate on online.

Well, don't skimp on wood. Buy hardwood, not soft. Pineywood's for
pussies. nomex=ON


But with some advice and a bit of home-grown cleverness, I find I can
still have some fun and get decent results. If I make some sort of peg
board support, you can bet it will largely involve scrap wood, with
which I am plentifully supplied. The "gotta stop reading this group"
sentiment is about having more ideas than I have time to implement.

BTDT, GTTS.


Thanks for bringing me back to the Neander side of the Force, Greg.
I need to use Normite stuff for clients most of the time.

I'm at the Homo Erectus stage at best, which seems oddly appropriate.

Wood gives you a woodie?

--
That's the thing about needs. Sometimes, when you get them met,
you don't need them anymore. -- Michael Patrick King

On 11/12/2011 2:07 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Sat, 12 Nov 2011 11:11:59 -0500, Greg
wrote:

On 11/11/2011 12:50 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
I've gotta stop reading this group...

Speaking of reading this group, Flickr (the photo hosting site) tells me
that the block of 2x4 screwed into my bench has been viewed 129 times.
There must be a lot of lurkers here. Either that, or some of you must
be coming back to that "masterpiece" over and over again.
129 views puts it in 33rd place among my 1400 photos (another hobby),
comfortably ahead of some much nicer compositions.

You've enteredcue music The YouTube Zone.

Nah, I'm a stills guy.

Getting expensive on this slippery slope, is it? Yeah, but we knew
that when we started.

Well, expensive is the one thing I need to prevent. I've got an almost
college-age offspring and am coming off a pretty expensive year, for
reasons I won't elaborate on online.

Well, don't skimp on wood. Buy hardwood, not soft.

I have seen the effects of skimping, but it's not enough to just get
"hardwood". "Decent" hardwood is the key.

Pineywood's for
pussies.nomex=ON

You've gone flameproof against whom? Women? Men who like pine? Women who
like pine?

My Dad always used Oak. I figured softwoods were sort of useless for
making nice things too. But it has come to my attention that this may
not be so.

But with some advice and a bit of home-grown cleverness, I find I can
still have some fun and get decent results. If I make some sort of peg
board support, you can bet it will largely involve scrap wood, with
which I am plentifully supplied. The "gotta stop reading this group"
sentiment is about having more ideas than I have time to implement.

BTDT, GTTS.


Thanks for bringing me back to the Neander side of the Force, Greg.
I need to use Normite stuff for clients most of the time.

I'm at the Homo Erectus stage at best, which seems oddly appropriate.

Wood gives you a woodie?

Effects of creeping age, I guess. I meant to write "Homo Habilis".