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#1
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Case of the overgrown insert?
Anyone have a clue why a zero-clearance insert would suddenly grow too big to fit in the table? The insert I use for dadoing no longer fits the saw opening. I grabbed an unused, though otherwise identical insert, and it fits just like it was meant to. I ended up making another dado insert, wasting a $20 blank. :-( These blanks were from Woodcraft, BTW. |
#2
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Case of the overgrown insert?
"krw" wrote: Anyone have a clue why a zero-clearance insert would suddenly grow too big to fit in the table? The insert I use for dadoing no longer fits the saw opening. I grabbed an unused, though otherwise identical insert, and it fits just like it was meant to. I ended up making another dado insert, wasting a $20 blank. :-( These blanks were from Woodcraft, BTW. Don't have a clue, but why not spend a little time with a file or some sandpaper and rework till it fits? BTW, cold day in hell when I'd spend $5, much less $20 for a T/S insert. At least not as along as I had 1/4 hardboard scraps, double back tape, a router and some C-Clamps. Lew |
#3
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Sun, 1 Nov 2009 17:28:08 -0800, "Lew Hodgett"
wrote: "krw" wrote: Anyone have a clue why a zero-clearance insert would suddenly grow too big to fit in the table? The insert I use for dadoing no longer fits the saw opening. I grabbed an unused, though otherwise identical insert, and it fits just like it was meant to. I ended up making another dado insert, wasting a $20 blank. :-( These blanks were from Woodcraft, BTW. Don't have a clue, but why not spend a little time with a file or some sandpaper and rework till it fits? The edge isn't just MDF. Not sure what it is but it's sorta rubbery, I guess to keep it in the table. It seems like it's now at least a 1/16th too long. BTW, cold day in hell when I'd spend $5, much less $20 for a T/S insert. They were on sale. They're now $24.95 in their catalog. ;-) At least not as along as I had 1/4 hardboard scraps, double back tape, a router and some C-Clamps. When I get time in the shop I'd rather make something more interesting than a table saw insert. Getting them to fit well takes time I'd rather spend doing something else. |
#4
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Nov 1, 8:39*pm, krw wrote:
"Lew Hodgett" wrote: BTW, cold day in hell when I'd spend $5, much less $20 for a T/S insert. They were on sale. *They're now $24.95 in their catalog. *;-) At least not as along as I had 1/4 hardboard scraps, double back tape, a router and some C-Clamps. When I get time in the shop I'd rather make something more interesting than a table saw insert. *Getting them to fit well takes time I'd rather spend doing something else. * Like fiddling with a store bought insert that doesn't fit? R |
#5
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Nov 1, 8:49*pm, RicodJour wrote:
On Nov 1, 8:39*pm, krw wrote: "Lew Hodgett" wrote: BTW, cold day in hell when I'd spend $5, much less $20 for a T/S insert. They were on sale. *They're now $24.95 in their catalog. *;-) At least not as along as I had 1/4 hardboard scraps, double back tape, a router and some C-Clamps. When I get time in the shop I'd rather make something more interesting than a table saw insert. *Getting them to fit well takes time I'd rather spend doing something else. * Like fiddling with a store bought insert that doesn't fit? R *wiping monitor* |
#6
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Sun, 1 Nov 2009 17:49:13 -0800 (PST), RicodJour
wrote: On Nov 1, 8:39*pm, krw wrote: "Lew Hodgett" wrote: BTW, cold day in hell when I'd spend $5, much less $20 for a T/S insert. They were on sale. *They're now $24.95 in their catalog. *;-) At least not as along as I had 1/4 hardboard scraps, double back tape, a router and some C-Clamps. When I get time in the shop I'd rather make something more interesting than a table saw insert. *Getting them to fit well takes time I'd rather spend doing something else. * Like fiddling with a store bought insert that doesn't fit? It certainly *DID* fit. It wouldn't have had the dado silhouette in it if it hadn't. It's brother still fit. |
#7
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Nov 1, 9:17*pm, krw wrote:
On Sun, 1 Nov 2009 17:49:13 -0800 (PST), RicodJour wrote: On Nov 1, 8:39*pm, krw wrote: "Lew Hodgett" wrote: BTW, cold day in hell when I'd spend $5, much less $20 for a T/S insert. They were on sale. *They're now $24.95 in their catalog. *;-) At least not as along as I had 1/4 hardboard scraps, double back tape, a router and some C-Clamps. When I get time in the shop I'd rather make something more interesting than a table saw insert. *Getting them to fit well takes time I'd rather spend doing something else. * Like fiddling with a store bought insert that doesn't fit? It certainly *DID* fit. *It wouldn't have had the dado silhouette in it if it hadn't. *It's brother still fit. * I don't understand. Making inserts is not a big deal and it doesn't take a lot of time. A router, a template, zip zip zip. And there wouldn't be any question of the thing growing or shrinking. Like Lew said, the double stick tape makes knocking them out trivial. Five or six at a time. What's that in store bought dollars? In any event I have no idea what happened to your insert unless you got it wet. Contact Woodgraft...errr, Woodcraft and express your disappointment. They'll probably send you a new one. R |
#8
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Sun, 1 Nov 2009 18:48:40 -0800 (PST), RicodJour
wrote: On Nov 1, 9:17*pm, krw wrote: On Sun, 1 Nov 2009 17:49:13 -0800 (PST), RicodJour wrote: On Nov 1, 8:39*pm, krw wrote: "Lew Hodgett" wrote: BTW, cold day in hell when I'd spend $5, much less $20 for a T/S insert. They were on sale. *They're now $24.95 in their catalog. *;-) At least not as along as I had 1/4 hardboard scraps, double back tape, a router and some C-Clamps. When I get time in the shop I'd rather make something more interesting than a table saw insert. *Getting them to fit well takes time I'd rather spend doing something else. * Like fiddling with a store bought insert that doesn't fit? It certainly *DID* fit. *It wouldn't have had the dado silhouette in it if it hadn't. *It's brother still fit. * I don't understand. Making inserts is not a big deal and it doesn't take a lot of time. A router, a template, zip zip zip. And there wouldn't be any question of the thing growing or shrinking. Like Lew said, the double stick tape makes knocking them out trivial. Five or six at a time. What's that in store bought dollars? Does the router template add the thickness adjustment screws? What's an hour of my free time worth? In any event I have no idea what happened to your insert unless you got it wet. Contact Woodgraft...errr, Woodcraft and express your disappointment. They'll probably send you a new one. It is in the garage but hasn't been near any water. Good suggestion, though. I'll send Woodcraft a note. I looked at it again this evening (thought I might have gotten the tab hung up underneath, or something) and yep, it's abut 1/16" long. The other fits in there like it was supposed to. They've been sitting on the same shelf next to each other since I last used the dado insert. |
#9
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Sun, 01 Nov 2009 19:16:25 -0600, krw wrote:
Anyone have a clue why a zero-clearance insert would suddenly grow too big to fit in the table? The insert I use for dadoing no longer fits the saw opening. I'm guessing your tablesaw shrunk. That's what happens when you wash it in hot water. Next time, use the cold setting. |
#10
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Sun, 1 Nov 2009 18:48:40 -0800 (PST), RicodJour
wrote: said, the double stick tape makes knocking them out trivial. Five or six at a time. What's that in store bought dollars? Just out of interest's sake, what's the popular method for getting those inserts to sit level with the tablesaw top? My danged tablesaw insert cavity has a certain depth that defies my finding some wood or other material making insert construction easy. |
#11
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Case of the overgrown insert?
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#12
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Mon, 02 Nov 2009 03:51:22 -0500, Greg wrote:
I use 1/2" ply and thread 4 allen head set-screws into it over each saw table leveling boss. Just slightly undersized holes and the allen screws create their own thread as they're inserted? My table saw leveling bosses are about 3/8" in depth. I suppose that would be enough thread for allen screws to grab. |
#13
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Case of the overgrown insert?
"Greg G." wrote in message ... said: I use 1/2" ply and thread 4 allen head set-screws into it over each saw table leveling boss. A 3/8" brass rod out the rear hooks the sawtop lip to prevent the blade from lifting the insert and throwing it through the wall. Inexpensive saws may not have leveling bosses (i.e. Delta 32-600 and some Craftsman). Greg G. I simply used 4, 3/8" long #6 flat head screws. They will screw flush on the bottom side if needed. and no pre drilling needed. Because they never needed to be readjusted being on the bottom side is not really a draw back. |
#14
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Nov 2, 7:31*am, "Leon" wrote:
"Greg G." wrote in message said: I use 1/2" ply and thread 4 allen head set-screws into it over each saw table leveling boss. A 3/8" brass rod out the rear hooks the sawtop lip to prevent the blade from lifting the insert and throwing it through the wall. Inexpensive saws may not have leveling bosses (i.e. Delta 32-600 and some Craftsman). I simply used 4, 3/8" long #6 flat head screws. *They will screw flush on the bottom side if needed. and no pre drilling needed. *Because they never needed to be readjusted being on the bottom side is not really a draw back. I don't use anything but a zero clearance insert I made and don't find this to be a problem. I epoxied washers in place. There's no stress on 'em - just trying to keep them from sliding. After that the inserts are all uniform. R |
#16
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Case of the overgrown insert?
Lew Hodgett wrote:
"krw" wrote: Anyone have a clue why a zero-clearance insert would suddenly grow too big to fit in the table? The insert I use for dadoing no longer fits the saw opening. I grabbed an unused, though otherwise identical insert, and it fits just like it was meant to. I ended up making another dado insert, wasting a $20 blank. :-( These blanks were from Woodcraft, BTW. Don't have a clue, but why not spend a little time with a file or some sandpaper and rework till it fits? BTW, cold day in hell when I'd spend $5, much less $20 for a T/S insert. At least not as along as I had 1/4 hardboard scraps, double back tape, a router and some C-Clamps. Lew I'm with you. I browse through the wood working catalogs and am amazed by the number of things for sale - and which, apparently, are frequently purchased - which anyone could easily make for themselves. -- dadiOH ____________________________ dadiOH's dandies v3.06... ....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that. Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico |
#17
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Case of the overgrown insert?
krw wrote:
Anyone have a clue why a zero-clearance insert would suddenly grow too big to fit in the table? Did your saw get really, really, *REALLY* cold? -- dadiOH ____________________________ dadiOH's dandies v3.06... ....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that. Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico |
#18
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Nov 2, 12:51*am, Greg wrote:
said: On Sun, 1 Nov 2009 18:48:40 -0800 (PST), RicodJour wrote: said, the double stick tape makes knocking them out trivial. *Five or six at a time. *What's that in store bought dollars? Just out of interest's sake, what's the popular method for getting those inserts to sit level with the tablesaw top? My danged tablesaw insert cavity has a certain depth that defies my finding some wood or other material making insert construction easy. I use 1/2" ply and thread 4 allen head set-screws into it over each saw table leveling boss. A 3/8" brass rod out the rear hooks the sawtop lip to prevent the blade from lifting the insert and throwing it through the wall. Inexpensive saws may not have leveling bosses (i.e. Delta 32-600 and some Craftsman). I do the same except with 1/2" Lexan. Luigi |
#19
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Nov 2, 9:22*am, "dadiOH" wrote:
krw wrote: Anyone have a clue why a zero-clearance insert would suddenly grow too big to fit in the table? Did your saw get really, really, *REALLY* cold? * Wouldn't the insert hole get bigger if the saw got cold? R |
#20
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Mon, 2 Nov 2009 08:57:29 -0800 (PST), RicodJour
wrote: Did your saw get really, really, *REALLY* cold? ? Wouldn't the insert hole get bigger if the saw got cold? Think "pucker" as most holes do when it gets cold. |
#21
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Nov 2, 11:57*am, RicodJour wrote:
On Nov 2, 9:22*am, "dadiOH" wrote: krw wrote: Anyone have a clue why a zero-clearance insert would suddenly grow too big to fit in the table? Did your saw get really, really, *REALLY* cold? * Wouldn't the insert hole get bigger if the saw got cold? R nope |
#22
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Case of the overgrown insert?
dadiOH wrote:
I'm with you. I browse through the wood working catalogs and am amazed by the number of things for sale - and which, apparently, are frequently purchased - which anyone could easily make for themselves. I'm with both of you. I wonder of there's a correlation between the skill level/experience of a woodworker and how many shop-made (as opposed to store bought) jigs they have. I can find arguments for both sides, but I still wonder. -- -MIKE- "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life" --Elvin Jones (1927-2004) -- http://mikedrums.com ---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply |
#23
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Case of the overgrown insert?
-MIKE- wrote:
I wonder of there's a correlation between the skill level/experience of a woodworker and how many shop-made (as opposed to store bought) jigs they have. I think there might be a stronger correlation between number of shop-made jigs and size of the tool budget. -- Morris Dovey DeSoto Solar DeSoto, Iowa USA http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/ |
#24
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Case of the overgrown insert?
Morris Dovey wrote:
-MIKE- wrote: I wonder of there's a correlation between the skill level/experience of a woodworker and how many shop-made (as opposed to store bought) jigs they have. I think there might be a stronger correlation between number of shop-made jigs and size of the tool budget. That's probably much more accurate. :-) Personally, if time isn't the first motivator (as in, I don't have even ten minutes to go buy this thing), price is. Just about every jig I see in the shop was built because I looked on-line or in a catalog, and my first reaction was, "HOW much!? Geez, I can *make* that." -- -MIKE- "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life" --Elvin Jones (1927-2004) -- http://mikedrums.com ---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply |
#25
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Case of the overgrown insert?
"-MIKE-" wrote in message ... Morris Dovey wrote: -MIKE- wrote: I wonder of there's a correlation between the skill level/experience of a woodworker and how many shop-made (as opposed to store bought) jigs they have. I think there might be a stronger correlation between number of shop-made jigs and size of the tool budget. That's probably much more accurate. :-) Personally, if time isn't the first motivator (as in, I don't have even ten minutes to go buy this thing), price is. Just about every jig I see in the shop was built because I looked on-line or in a catalog, and my first reaction was, "HOW much!? Geez, I can *make* that." -- -MIKE- "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life" --Elvin Jones (1927-2004) -- http://mikedrums.com ---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply I never tossed out a jig, unless it was just cobbled together for a single use and then taken back apart and tossed back in the bucket with other pieces. If the jig was something I would reuse, such as one I built for over the table sander to bevel the edges of coasters, then it was stored on a shelf for reuse. Those are the ones that built up over the years. -- Nonny Have you ever wondered if the bills in your wallet were ever in a stripper's butt crack? Have a nice day .. |
#26
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Nov 2, 9:57*am, -MIKE- wrote:
dadiOH wrote: I browse through the wood working catalogs and am amazed by the number of things for sale - and which, apparently, are frequently purchased - which anyone could easily make for themselves. I wonder of there's a correlation between the skill level/experience of a woodworker and how many shop-made (as opposed to store bought) jigs they have. It's the custom-kitchen effect! When a task intimidates (like, cooking for a critical audience), it's easy to put it off by claiming one needs a six-burner gas stove, or marble countertops, or somesuch. So, the building trades grow a tumor that caters to high-end kitchen afficianados. The customers don't have to perform in the cookroom until the renovations are "complete" ... and completion, magically, doesn't happen quickly. The custom-kitchen builder caters to his audience by working slowly and avoiding completion (but the check-cashing part has to be quick and final, of course). If woodwork isn't intimidating, you get a knife and a block of wood, and have at it. Then you add chisels and a bench, and saws are too useful to do without. The unintimidated woodworker always has a knife nearby. He's comfortable watching Roy Underhill, but could learn a lot from Norm Abram. The intimidated woodworker needs an extra horsepower and deeper bandsaw throat, and often treats the wood as if it was homogeneous (he didn't do a lot of knife work, so doesn't completely understand grain). He's comfortable watching Norm, but could learn a lot from Roy. |
#27
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Case of the overgrown insert?
whit3rd wrote:
If woodwork isn't intimidating, you get a knife and a block of wood, and have at it. Then you add chisels and a bench, and saws are too useful to do without. The unintimidated woodworker always has a knife nearby. He's comfortable watching Roy Underhill, but could learn a lot from Norm Abram. The intimidated woodworker needs an extra horsepower and deeper bandsaw throat, and often treats the wood as if it was homogeneous (he didn't do a lot of knife work, so doesn't completely understand grain). He's comfortable watching Norm, but could learn a lot from Roy. Good stuff. When I look back on the stuff I've made using inferior and fewer tools, I feel some pride and accomplishment for having done such a good job manually and using some ingenuity instead of technology. But I also like the sense of "being there" I get from having and using a great tool. One appreciates having nice tools and what they do for you much more, when one has had to do it with less. -- -MIKE- "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life" --Elvin Jones (1927-2004) -- http://mikedrums.com ---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply |
#28
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Nov 2, 2:48*pm, -MIKE- wrote:
But I also like the sense of "being there" I get from having and using a great tool. One appreciates having nice tools and what they do for you much more, when one has had to do it with less. I like a tool that dims the lights at turn-on....of the whole town. |
#29
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Case of the overgrown insert?
Robatoy wrote:
On Nov 2, 2:48 pm, -MIKE- wrote: But I also like the sense of "being there" I get from having and using a great tool. One appreciates having nice tools and what they do for you much more, when one has had to do it with less. I like a tool that dims the lights at turn-on....of the whole town. Nice. "Clark Griswold Woodworking" -- -MIKE- "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life" --Elvin Jones (1927-2004) -- http://mikedrums.com ---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply |
#30
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Nov 2, 12:51*pm, Robatoy wrote:
On Nov 2, 11:57*am, RicodJour wrote: On Nov 2, 9:22*am, "dadiOH" wrote: krw wrote: Anyone have a clue why a zero-clearance insert would suddenly grow too big to fit in the table? Did your saw get really, really, *REALLY* cold? * Wouldn't the insert hole get bigger if the saw got cold? nope You mean the air within the insert perimeter is shrinking with the cold, and the metal around it is expanding to make up the difference? R |
#31
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Case of the overgrown insert?
"whit3rd" wrote in message ... On Nov 2, 9:57 am, -MIKE- wrote: dadiOH wrote: I browse through the wood working catalogs and am amazed by the number of things for sale - and which, apparently, are frequently purchased - which anyone could easily make for themselves. I wonder of there's a correlation between the skill level/experience of a woodworker and how many shop-made (as opposed to store bought) jigs they have. That's reminds me of a pretty big mallet that I have that was made from a wooden hammer handle and a branch of a tree (directly). The unidentifiable person who made it probably did not have a Rochler nearby, but clearly knew what they were doing. It looks like a museum piece to me. When my shop is finished I may hang it on the wall for inspiration. If anyone would care to see it, I'll take and post a pic. Bill |
#32
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Case of the overgrown insert?
Nonny wrote:
"-MIKE-" wrote in message Just about every jig I see in the shop was built because I looked on-line or in a catalog, and my first reaction was, "HOW much!? Geez, I can *make* that." I never tossed out a jig, unless it was just cobbled together for a single use and then taken back apart and tossed back in the bucket with other pieces. If the jig was something I would reuse, such as one I built for over the table sander to bevel the edges of coasters, then it was stored on a shelf for reuse. Those are the ones that built up over the years. Yes, but did you think to *write* on the jig a description of why the hell you built it in the first place? I can't think of how many times I've pulled some old jig out of storage and have no earthly clue what I used it for... :-) -- See Nad. See Nad go. Go Nad! To reply, eat the taco. http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/ |
#33
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Case of the overgrown insert?
Steve Turner wrote:
Yes, but did you think to *write* on the jig a description of why the hell you built it in the first place? I can't think of how many times I've pulled some old jig out of storage and have no earthly clue what I used it for... :-) LMAO!! I started laughing before I finished reading your first sentence! Bought the t-shirt. :-) -- -MIKE- "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life" --Elvin Jones (1927-2004) -- http://mikedrums.com ---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply |
#34
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Case of the overgrown insert?
If anyone would care to see it, I'll take and post a pic.
Bill Do you have to even ask? sheesh. :-p -- -MIKE- "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life" --Elvin Jones (1927-2004) -- http://mikedrums.com ---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply |
#35
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Nov 2, 3:23*pm, RicodJour wrote:
On Nov 2, 12:51*pm, Robatoy wrote: On Nov 2, 11:57*am, RicodJour wrote: On Nov 2, 9:22*am, "dadiOH" wrote: krw wrote: Anyone have a clue why a zero-clearance insert would suddenly grow too big to fit in the table? Did your saw get really, really, *REALLY* cold? * Wouldn't the insert hole get bigger if the saw got cold? nope You mean the air within the insert perimeter is shrinking with the cold, and the metal around it is expanding to make up the difference? R The metal wouldn't be expanding. |
#36
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Case of the overgrown insert?
On Nov 2, 3:40*pm, Robatoy wrote:
On Nov 2, 3:23*pm, RicodJour wrote: On Nov 2, 12:51*pm, Robatoy wrote: On Nov 2, 11:57*am, RicodJour wrote: On Nov 2, 9:22*am, "dadiOH" wrote: krw wrote: Anyone have a clue why a zero-clearance insert would suddenly grow too big to fit in the table? Did your saw get really, really, *REALLY* cold? * Wouldn't the insert hole get bigger if the saw got cold? nope You mean the air within the insert perimeter is shrinking with the cold, and the metal around it is expanding to make up the difference? The metal wouldn't be expanding. Exactly my point. So if all of the metal around the hole is shrinking, why is the hole getting smaller? The shrinkage takes place in the cast iron, right? R |
#37
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Case of the overgrown insert?
RicodJour wrote:
Exactly my point. So if all of the metal around the hole is shrinking, why is the hole getting smaller? The shrinkage takes place in the cast iron, right? Yup. As the cast iron shrinks, every atom gets a little closer to every other atom - and that includes the atoms around (and on opposite sides of) the hole. -- Morris Dovey DeSoto Solar DeSoto, Iowa USA http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/ |
#38
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Case of the overgrown insert?
Steve Turner wrote:
Nonny wrote: "-MIKE-" wrote in message Just about every jig I see in the shop was built because I looked on-line or in a catalog, and my first reaction was, "HOW much!? Geez, I can *make* that." I never tossed out a jig, unless it was just cobbled together for a single use and then taken back apart and tossed back in the bucket with other pieces. If the jig was something I would reuse, such as one I built for over the table sander to bevel the edges of coasters, then it was stored on a shelf for reuse. Those are the ones that built up over the years. Yes, but did you think to *write* on the jig a description of why the hell you built it in the first place? Me, me...I do -- dadiOH ____________________________ dadiOH's dandies v3.06... ....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that. Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico |
#39
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Case of the overgrown insert?
RicodJour wrote:
On Nov 2, 9:22 am, "dadiOH" wrote: krw wrote: Anyone have a clue why a zero-clearance insert would suddenly grow too big to fit in the table? Did your saw get really, really, *REALLY* cold? Wouldn't the insert hole get bigger if the saw got cold? Like so you mean we should be cooling those bearings to help get them off a shaft like getting bigger, like... -- |
#40
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Case of the overgrown insert?
RicodJour wrote:
On Nov 2, 9:22 am, "dadiOH" wrote: krw wrote: Anyone have a clue why a zero-clearance insert would suddenly grow too big to fit in the table? Did your saw get really, really, *REALLY* cold? Wouldn't the insert hole get bigger if the saw got cold? R Beats me. I had a brass ring that got smaller when I heated it. Or did it get bigger? No, smaller...I wanted it bigger and it wouldn't do what I wanted. My brass and OP's saw are in the twilight zone -- dadiOH ____________________________ dadiOH's dandies v3.06... ....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that. Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico |
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