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#1
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Flooring
Any flooring people on this list?
A local TV channel ran a consumer segment of flooring citing recent Consumer Reports tests. Winner was Bamboo. Not only did it have better wear characteristics but also lower cost than Oak. Anybody with first hand experience? Lew |
#2
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Flooring
"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message ... Any flooring people on this list? A local TV channel ran a consumer segment of flooring citing recent Consumer Reports tests. Winner was Bamboo. Not only did it have better wear characteristics but also lower cost than Oak. Anybody with first hand experience? The only experience I have with bamboo is this gardening freak next door planted huge amounts of it on hos property. Hundreds of bamboo plants of several species now occupy every square inch of his property. Now I spend time almost every weekend cutting it down and trying to beat it back to the fence. It is insidious. It just takes over. Definitely an invasive species. It does not stay on his property. It wants to take over the neighborhood. |
#3
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Flooring
In , Lee Michaels dropped this bit of wisdom: "Lew Hodgett" wrote in message ... Any flooring people on this list? A local TV channel ran a consumer segment of flooring citing recent Consumer Reports tests. Winner was Bamboo. Not only did it have better wear characteristics but also lower cost than Oak. Anybody with first hand experience? The only experience I have with bamboo is this gardening freak next door planted huge amounts of it on hos property. Hundreds of bamboo plants of several species now occupy every square inch of his property. Now I spend time almost every weekend cutting it down and trying to beat it back to the fence. It is insidious. It just takes over. Definitely an invasive species. It does not stay on his property. It wants to take over the neighborhood. Lee, you must remember that bamboo is really grass. When it gets the chance it will spread out. If you get lucky he will have planted the "Giant" form and pretty soon you will have a fine Panda habitat. LOL P D Q |
#4
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Flooring
"Lee Michaels" wrote:
The only experience I have with bamboo is this gardening freak next door planted huge amounts of it on hos property. Hundreds of bamboo plants of several species now occupy every square inch of his property. Now I spend time almost every weekend cutting it down and trying to beat it back to the fence. Should be able to get a couple of cane poles for fishing. If he has a compost pile, you got worms. Lew |
#5
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Flooring
In , Lew Hodgett dropped this bit of wisdom: Any flooring people on this list? A local TV channel ran a consumer segment of flooring citing recent Consumer Reports tests. Winner was Bamboo. Not only did it have better wear characteristics but also lower cost than Oak. Anybody with first hand experience? Lew Not too sure how it is over your way but --- Oak is about $5-8 a square foot and Bamboo is about $3 in Canuckistan. I have plans to do my hidey-hole in grass for about $400. I think the grass will last longer in my basement that oak would. With any luck I'll get back about 15% come tax-time. Don't know about wear and tear yet, but it will have to go some to beat my oak floors. 12 years and still no discernable wear. P D Q |
#6
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Flooring
"PDQ" wrote:
Not too sure how it is over your way but --- Oak is about $5-8 a square foot and Bamboo is about $3 in Canuckistan. Sounds about right for oak, based on the piece, bamboo was about $4-$5 SQF I have plans to do my hidey-hole in grass for about $400. I think the grass will last longer in my basement that oak would. With any luck I'll get back about 15% come tax-time. You might want to look at it. Don't know about wear and tear yet, but it will have to go some to beat my oak floors. 12 years and still no discernable wear. Had oak flooring in living room and dining room for the 25 years I lived in the place, but never saw it. Wall to wall carpeting you know. Lew |
#7
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Flooring
Lew Hodgett wrote:
Any flooring people on this list? A local TV channel ran a consumer segment of flooring citing recent Consumer Reports tests. Winner was Bamboo. Not only did it have better wear characteristics but also lower cost than Oak. Anybody with first hand experience? "Winner?" What were the tests? Compared to bamboo-looking laminate, laminate is: * Cheaper * Won't dent * Wears better * Is impervious to UV rays * Virtually waterproof * Never needs "refinishing" |
#8
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Flooring
Cut a trench!
The roots are shallow and won't go deep. Use a grass killer. It is a grass. The shoots are used in Asian foods. But you don't have to eat it. Good luck. I wanted the Giant bamboo - 4-8" in diameter but alas, I might not be able to control it. Martin Lee Michaels wrote: "Lew Hodgett" wrote in message ... Any flooring people on this list? A local TV channel ran a consumer segment of flooring citing recent Consumer Reports tests. Winner was Bamboo. Not only did it have better wear characteristics but also lower cost than Oak. Anybody with first hand experience? The only experience I have with bamboo is this gardening freak next door planted huge amounts of it on hos property. Hundreds of bamboo plants of several species now occupy every square inch of his property. Now I spend time almost every weekend cutting it down and trying to beat it back to the fence. It is insidious. It just takes over. Definitely an invasive species. It does not stay on his property. It wants to take over the neighborhood. |
#9
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Flooring
"HeyBub" wrote: "Winner?" What were the tests? Check with Consumer Reports. They ran the tests. Lew |
#10
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Flooring
On Wed, 01 Jul 2009 01:01:29 GMT, "Lew Hodgett"
wrote: Any flooring people on this list? A local TV channel ran a consumer segment of flooring citing recent Consumer Reports tests. Winner was Bamboo. Not only did it have better wear characteristics but also lower cost than Oak. Anybody with first hand experience? Sure. I put it down in my last house, in the kitchen, dining room, and hallways. I used the vertical stacked medium carbonized version. I liked it a lot, except it looked "too perfect". Kinda like a bowling alley. It seemed to wear well, though it does dent. We also have it in this house, though in a horizontal light carbonized, in the great room, hall, and dining room. This stuff is clearly different than what we used in the previous house. It scratches badly (it's a new house and was badly scratched before we moved in) and has faded a lot. It's clear looking at the line under the door to a closet. Bottom line - I liked it a lot in our previous house. I don't like this stuff at all. Why the difference? - no clue, but I'd probably rip this stuff out and do wood if it weren't glued down (slab construction). |
#11
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Flooring
"krw" wrote: Sure. I put it down in my last house, in the kitchen, dining room, and hallways. I used the vertical stacked medium carbonized version. I liked it a lot, except it looked "too perfect". Kinda like a bowling alley. It seemed to wear well, though it does dent. We also have it in this house, though in a horizontal light carbonized, in the great room, hall, and dining room. This stuff is clearly different than what we used in the previous house. It scratches badly (it's a new house and was badly scratched before we moved in) and has faded a lot. It's clear looking at the line under the door to a closet. Bottom line - I liked it a lot in our previous house. I don't like this stuff at all. Why the difference? - no clue, but I'd probably rip this stuff out and do wood if it weren't glued down (slab construction). Thank you for the input. The stuff C/R tested didn't dent or scratch. There must be several grades of bamboo flooring. Lew |
#12
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Flooring
Lew Hodgett wrote:
"krw" wrote: Sure. I put it down in my last house, in the kitchen, dining room, and hallways. I used the vertical stacked medium carbonized version. I liked it a lot, except it looked "too perfect". Kinda like a bowling alley. It seemed to wear well, though it does dent. We also have it in this house, though in a horizontal light carbonized, in the great room, hall, and dining room. This stuff is clearly different than what we used in the previous house. It scratches badly (it's a new house and was badly scratched before we moved in) and has faded a lot. It's clear looking at the line under the door to a closet. Bottom line - I liked it a lot in our previous house. I don't like this stuff at all. Why the difference? - no clue, but I'd probably rip this stuff out and do wood if it weren't glued down (slab construction). Thank you for the input. The stuff C/R tested didn't dent or scratch. There must be several grades of bamboo flooring. Or Consumer Reports was trying to dent it with a wet noodle and scratch it with a pencil eraser, which would be par for the course for them. |
#13
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Flooring
Lew Hodgett wrote:
"HeyBub" wrote: "Winner?" What were the tests? Check with Consumer Reports. They ran the tests. Good idea? Got their number handy? |
#14
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Flooring
On Jun 30, 9:08*pm, "Lee Michaels"
wrote: The only experience I have with bamboo is this gardening freak next door planted huge amounts of it on hos property. *Hundreds of bamboo plants of several species now occupy every square inch of his property. Now I spend time almost every weekend cutting it down and trying to beat it back to the fence. *It is insidious. It just takes over. Definitely an invasive species. It does not stay on his property. It wants to take over the neighborhood. The stuff is insidious. People saying to use grass killer apparently have never tried to kill the stuff off. You'd have to make your property a Superfund cleanup site if you used enough chemicals to kill it. You basically have to scorch the earth, kill every living thing off - good plants and bad, good lifeforms and bad - and then hope it doesn't come back when you try to repopulate the parcel. I'm in the northeast and the growing season is shorter than some places - I can't imagine what it would be like growing in a 4 season growing climate. Someone mentioned digging a trench - that's how to start containing it. Then you have to install an impervious barrier about 18" to 24" deep. The runners will go down and around or even up and over a barrier, so it has to go deep, and the top of the barrier should be a couple of inches above grade so you can see if the runners are trying to clamber over the barrier. Like I said, the stuff is insidious. R |
#15
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Flooring
RicodJour wrote:
On Jun 30, 9:08 pm, "Lee Michaels" wrote: The only experience I have with bamboo is ... ... I spend time almost every weekend cutting it down and trying to beat it back to the fence. It is insidious. It just takes over. Definitely an invasive species. It does not stay on his property. It wants to take over the neighborhood. The stuff is insidious. People saying to use grass killer apparently have never tried to kill the stuff off. ... I'm in the northeast and the growing season is shorter than some places - I can't imagine what it would be like growing in a 4 season growing climate. .... Reminds me of an incident from years gone by... The "scourge of the south" is, of course, kudzu (a Japanese import brought in during the 30s in an (ill-conceived) attempt to reclaim some of the worst of the old continuous cotton-planting erosion problems). Anyway, while in E TN where it is a problem but not nearly as much as farther south since the winters do kill it back where we were, had a job for DOE in conjunction w/ another company. Their representative was from Pittsburgh and a _REAL_ pita to deal with both in and out of the office. One day as the the job was _finally_ coming to an end we, as good southern hosts, took this fella' and his visiting boss out to a nice lunch at a local eatery on the lake. He asked what that pretty ground cover was going down the banks to the lake saying he had an area in his back yard that needed something that would hold on a hill. We sent him home w/ enough plantings to bury the house in a couple of years... If one day Pittsburgh is swallowed up by kudzu, you'll know "the rest of the story" -- |
#16
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Flooring
"RicodJour" wrote in message ... On Jun 30, 9:08 pm, "Lee Michaels" wrote: The only experience I have with bamboo is this gardening freak next door planted huge amounts of it on hos property. Hundreds of bamboo plants of several species now occupy every square inch of his property. Now I spend time almost every weekend cutting it down and trying to beat it back to the fence. It is insidious. It just takes over. Definitely an invasive species. It does not stay on his property. It wants to take over the neighborhood. The stuff is insidious. People saying to use grass killer apparently have never tried to kill the stuff off. You'd have to make your property a Superfund cleanup site if you used enough chemicals to kill it. You basically have to scorch the earth, kill every living thing off - good plants and bad, good lifeforms and bad - and then hope it doesn't come back when you try to repopulate the parcel. I'm in the northeast and the growing season is shorter than some places - I can't imagine what it would be like growing in a 4 season growing climate. Someone mentioned digging a trench - that's how to start containing it. Then you have to install an impervious barrier about 18" to 24" deep. The runners will go down and around or even up and over a barrier, so it has to go deep, and the top of the barrier should be a couple of inches above grade so you can see if the runners are trying to clamber over the barrier. Like I said, the stuff is insidious. R -- doesn't the stuff die out after it blooms, and it all blooms at once? just wait for that to occur, or import a bunch of pandas on h1b visas. maybe the zoo will take your cuttings. |
#17
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Flooring
"dpb" wrote Reminds me of an incident from years gone by... The "scourge of the south" is, of course, kudzu (a Japanese import brought in during the 30s in an (ill-conceived) attempt to reclaim some of the worst of the old continuous cotton-planting erosion problems). Anyway, while in E TN where it is a problem but not nearly as much as farther south since the winters do kill it back where we were, had a job for DOE in conjunction w/ another company. Their representative was from Pittsburgh and a _REAL_ pita to deal with both in and out of the office. One day as the the job was _finally_ coming to an end we, as good southern hosts, took this fella' and his visiting boss out to a nice lunch at a local eatery on the lake. He asked what that pretty ground cover was going down the banks to the lake saying he had an area in his back yard that needed something that would hold on a hill. We sent him home w/ enough plantings to bury the house in a couple of years... If one day Pittsburgh is swallowed up by kudzu, you'll know "the rest of the story" -- Good one. Nothing like pulling a fast one on somebody obnoxious. Remind me to never **** you off. |
#18
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Flooring
Lew Hodgett wrote:
"krw" wrote: Sure. I put it down in my last house, in the kitchen, dining room, and hallways. I used the vertical stacked medium carbonized version. I liked it a lot, except it looked "too perfect". Kinda like a bowling alley. It seemed to wear well, though it does dent. We also have it in this house, though in a horizontal light carbonized, in the great room, hall, and dining room. This stuff is clearly different than what we used in the previous house. It scratches badly (it's a new house and was badly scratched before we moved in) and has faded a lot. It's clear looking at the line under the door to a closet. Bottom line - I liked it a lot in our previous house. I don't like this stuff at all. Why the difference? - no clue, but I'd probably rip this stuff out and do wood if it weren't glued down (slab construction). Thank you for the input. The stuff C/R tested didn't dent or scratch. There must be several grades of bamboo flooring. Like everything sold in this world, there are many brands, different manufacturers and different processes and finishes. The cheap crap doesn't last nor wear as well as the quality stuff. You cannot just consider that it is bamboo and not look at the many other factors involved. Some people want bamboo because they consider it a "green" product using renewable resources. These people haven't considered that bamboo flooring is made up of little strips of the material that takes considerable work to machine then is all glued together with "who knows what ingredients" unknown glue that may outgass toxic chemicals. Most are made in China where quality control varies greatly and the finishes they use can be as bad as the glues they use. Buyer beware. |
#19
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Flooring
Lew Hodgett wrote:
"krw" wrote: .... Bottom line - I liked it a lot in our previous house. I don't like this stuff at all. Why the difference? - no clue, but I'd probably rip this stuff out and do wood if it weren't glued down (slab construction). Thank you for the input. The stuff C/R tested didn't dent or scratch. There must be several grades of bamboo flooring. .... I, personally, wouldn't put much faith in any CR testing... There are, indeed, a multitude of grades and the hardness of bamboo in actual testing varies from softer than some pine to harder than hard maple (nominal values, of course, all woods have inherent variability in properties within the same species far more than most other materials). There have been quite a number of articles in both FHB and FWW over the last several years on bamboo; most (but not all iirc) of the flooring applications in FHB as one would expect while the FWW concentrated more on its use as cabinetwood, counters, etc. Anyway, the upshot of the evaluations I recall ottomh include that how the flooring is manufactured from either end or side grain and very importantly, the actual species used makes a big difference. As well, the caramelizing process used to impart color has a large negative impact on the hardness of all types, again affecting some more pronouncedly than others. The darker the coloring, the more susceptible the end product to denting, etc. There is a pretty good manufacturers' association and other web sites with more information; if you're really interested/serious I'd recommend them and doing a search on the Taunton FHB site for some more in-depth looking at the variables involved and particularly there for a couple of articles that discuss bamboo itself from the wood characteristics in a fair amount of detail. It ain't much at all like other woods in some important ways; similar in others. -- |
#20
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Flooring
On Wed, 01 Jul 2009 03:59:45 GMT, "Lew Hodgett"
wrote: "krw" wrote: Sure. I put it down in my last house, in the kitchen, dining room, and hallways. I used the vertical stacked medium carbonized version. I liked it a lot, except it looked "too perfect". Kinda like a bowling alley. It seemed to wear well, though it does dent. We also have it in this house, though in a horizontal light carbonized, in the great room, hall, and dining room. This stuff is clearly different than what we used in the previous house. It scratches badly (it's a new house and was badly scratched before we moved in) and has faded a lot. It's clear looking at the line under the door to a closet. Bottom line - I liked it a lot in our previous house. I don't like this stuff at all. Why the difference? - no clue, but I'd probably rip this stuff out and do wood if it weren't glued down (slab construction). Thank you for the input. The stuff C/R tested didn't dent or scratch. It *does* dent, like anything else. It may be harder than maple, but it certainly *does* dent. Whack it with a hammer... ;-) There must be several grades of bamboo flooring. I think there are. The stuff I put down in my previous house was pretty cheap ($2.50/sq.ft. IIRC). I bought it over the Internet and had it shipped (pretty cheap, amazingly). Of course, the crap they put in this house may have even been cheaper. If you go with bamboo, I'd make sure to look at the vertical laminated version before you buy. I like it a *lot* better than the more common horizontal lamination. |
#21
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Flooring
krw" wrote: If you go with bamboo, I'd make sure to look at the vertical laminated version before you buy. These days I' let others make those decisions, I just send in the check on the 1st of the month. Lew |
#22
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Flooring
Jack Stein wrote:
dpb wrote: Reminds me of an incident from years gone by... The "scourge of the south" is, of course, kudzu ... Anyway, while in E TN where it is a problem ... .... My BIL lives in Knoxville and about 10 years ago we visited and that crap was covering everything. Visited again a month ago and hardly any was seen. Go back end of August and down towards Loudan... It winter kills so takes a little while in the spring/early summer to get its act together...w/ the rains this spring and early summer it'll be back out in full force when has a little hot weather... Their representative was from Pittsburgh and a _REAL_ pita to deal with both in and out of the office. He must have been an import. Pittsburghers are all nice. .... LOL... If one day Pittsburgh is swallowed up by kudzu, you'll know "the rest of the story" Saved the story in case we need to blame someone for another blob like attack.:-) I doubt Kudzu or Bamboo will grow around here however, winters are a bit too harsh for the little wusses . .... Always wondered whether any of it did survive or not. I'd guess if it once got established it could manage to hang on but wouldn't be nearly so invasive because warm seasons are so much shorter. It can get to 0F and below in K-town and it doesn't actually kill it entirely; simply freezes back. I don't know what it's overwinter limits actually are though... -- |
#23
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Flooring
dpb wrote:
Reminds me of an incident from years gone by... The "scourge of the south" is, of course, kudzu (a Japanese import brought in during the 30s in an (ill-conceived) attempt to reclaim some of the worst of the old continuous cotton-planting erosion problems). Anyway, while in E TN where it is a problem but not nearly as much as farther south since the winters do kill it back where we were, had a job for DOE in conjunction w/ another company. My BIL lives in Knoxville and about 10 years ago we visited and that crap was covering everything. Visited again a month ago and hardly any was seen. Their representative was from Pittsburgh and a _REAL_ pita to deal with both in and out of the office. He must have been an import. Pittsburghers are all nice. We sent him home w/ enough plantings to bury the house in a couple of years... If one day Pittsburgh is swallowed up by kudzu, you'll know "the rest of the story" Saved the story in case we need to blame someone for another blob like attack.:-) I doubt Kudzu or Bamboo will grow around here however, winters are a bit too harsh for the little wusses . -- Jack Using FREE News Server: http://www.eternal-september.org/ http://jbstein.com |
#24
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Flooring
dpb wrote:
: Lew Hodgett wrote: : : The stuff C/R tested didn't dent or scratch. : : There must be several grades of bamboo flooring. : ... : I, personally, wouldn't put much faith in any CR testing... : There are, indeed, a multitude of grades and the hardness of bamboo in : actual testing varies from softer than some pine to harder than hard : maple (nominal values, of course, all woods have inherent variability in : properties within the same species far more than most other materials). : There have been quite a number of articles in both FHB and FWW over the : last several years on bamboo; most (but not all iirc) of the flooring : applications in FHB as one would expect while the FWW concentrated more : on its use as cabinetwood, counters, etc. Anyway, the upshot of the : evaluations I recall ottomh include that how the flooring is : manufactured from either end or side grain and very importantly, the : actual species used makes a big difference. As well, the caramelizing : process used to impart color has a large negative impact on the hardness : of all types, again affecting some more pronouncedly than others. The : darker the coloring, the more susceptible the end product to denting, etc. To add to this excellent post, I planned to use bamboo flooring in my home office, but was dissuaded when I fond that every sample I could lay my hands on dented very easily, and it's not recommended for a dry climate. I have gone with bamboo-look laminate, which is cheaper, harder, and very nice looking. -- Andy Barss |
#25
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Flooring
dpb wrote:
.... Always wondered whether any of it did survive or not. I'd guess if it once got established it could manage to hang on but wouldn't be nearly so invasive because warm seasons are so much shorter. It can get to 0F and below in K-town and it doesn't actually kill it entirely; simply freezes back. I don't know what it's overwinter limits actually are though... .... I didn't find any detailed horticultural works in a quick search but did find there's been a recent outbreak in Oregon along a roadside and reports it's as far north as "the northeast" in some other accounts. W/ it's ability to root to 3-ft deep or more, I can imagine if it did get a start that while it would take longer in the spring for it to finally get going again it could manage to survive. That was something we observed in TN; after very cold winters it would be later in the spring before it greened up--seems to come back from the roots where it freezes hard over winter. Kinda' like the wisteria; it may _look_ dead until late spring but when it finally pops you'll be digging out from under the rest of the summer until frost. -- |
#26
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Flooring
On Mon, 6 Jul 2009 18:22:18 +0000 (UTC), Andrew Barss
wrote: dpb wrote: : Lew Hodgett wrote: : : The stuff C/R tested didn't dent or scratch. : : There must be several grades of bamboo flooring. : ... : I, personally, wouldn't put much faith in any CR testing... : There are, indeed, a multitude of grades and the hardness of bamboo in : actual testing varies from softer than some pine to harder than hard : maple (nominal values, of course, all woods have inherent variability in : properties within the same species far more than most other materials). : There have been quite a number of articles in both FHB and FWW over the : last several years on bamboo; most (but not all iirc) of the flooring : applications in FHB as one would expect while the FWW concentrated more : on its use as cabinetwood, counters, etc. Anyway, the upshot of the : evaluations I recall ottomh include that how the flooring is : manufactured from either end or side grain and very importantly, the : actual species used makes a big difference. As well, the caramelizing : process used to impart color has a large negative impact on the hardness : of all types, again affecting some more pronouncedly than others. The : darker the coloring, the more susceptible the end product to denting, etc. Again, my sample size is two but I've found the opposite. The "medium caramelized" I installed in VT was much harder than the "light caramelized" I have here. Maybe the vertical laminations are harder than the horizontal. Dunno. I'd do the stuff I did on my last house again. This stuff, not so much. To add to this excellent post, I planned to use bamboo flooring in my home office, but was dissuaded when I fond that every sample I could lay my hands on dented very easily, and it's not recommended for a dry climate. I had no problems with it in VT. I would have loved to put it in the bedrooms, but was moving so just threw down some new carpeting. I have gone with bamboo-look laminate, which is cheaper, harder, and very nice looking. More information? |
#27
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Flooring
krw wrote:
On Mon, 6 Jul 2009 18:22:18 +0000 (UTC), Andrew Barss wrote: dpb wrote: .... : ... very importantly, the : actual species used makes a big difference. As well, the caramelizing : process used to impart color has a large negative impact on the hardness : of all types, again affecting some more pronouncedly than others. The : darker the coloring, the more susceptible the end product to denting, etc. Again, my sample size is two but I've found the opposite. The "medium caramelized" I installed in VT was much harder than the "light caramelized" I have here. Maybe the vertical laminations are harder than the horizontal. Dunno. I'd do the stuff I did on my last house again. This stuff, not so much. I wondered how long it would take...and surprised it took this long! The key in the above on caramelization and hardness that was implied but not specifically stated is that the effect is within the same species and grain orientation, not strictly monotonic across all species/grades/manufacturing. -- |
#28
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Flooring
On Mon, 06 Jul 2009 21:53:12 -0500, dpb wrote:
krw wrote: On Mon, 6 Jul 2009 18:22:18 +0000 (UTC), Andrew Barss wrote: dpb wrote: ... : ... very importantly, the : actual species used makes a big difference. As well, the caramelizing : process used to impart color has a large negative impact on the hardness : of all types, again affecting some more pronouncedly than others. The : darker the coloring, the more susceptible the end product to denting, etc. Again, my sample size is two but I've found the opposite. The "medium caramelized" I installed in VT was much harder than the "light caramelized" I have here. Maybe the vertical laminations are harder than the horizontal. Dunno. I'd do the stuff I did on my last house again. This stuff, not so much. I wondered how long it would take...and surprised it took this long! Long? The key in the above on caramelization and hardness that was implied but not specifically stated is that the effect is within the same species and grain orientation, not strictly monotonic across all species/grades/manufacturing. So it's a crap shoot? I bought pretty cheap bamboo, since I was planning on selling the house in a couple of years. I went with bamboo mainly because it looked good and was cheaper than replacing the vinyl. It worked. I managed to sell the house at the end of '07. |
#29
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Flooring
krw wrote:
On Mon, 06 Jul 2009 21:53:12 -0500, dpb wrote: .... I wondered how long it would take...and surprised it took this long! Long? It was five (5) days since I posted the comments on bamboo that included the caramelization issue remarked upon... I had expected after I reread the post it would be about 5 minutes, tops... The key in the above on caramelization and hardness that was implied but not specifically stated is that the effect is within the same species and grain orientation, not strictly monotonic across all species/grades/manufacturing. So it's a crap shoot? I bought pretty cheap bamboo, since I was planning on selling the house in a couple of years. I went with bamboo mainly because it looked good and was cheaper than replacing the vinyl. It worked. I managed to sell the house at the end of '07. Pretty much...the summary articles in FWW and FHB (and the data on manufacturers' organization website confirm) there's such a wide variation in basic properties between the various species and manufacturing processes used it's only looking at specific test data for a specific product that makes any sense. Price isn't necessarily that much of a guide to the hardness in particular; it seems w/ bamboo flooring products more in other areas such as the orientation, finish durability, variability within product, etc., ... -- -- |
#30
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Flooring
On Tue, 07 Jul 2009 08:42:55 -0500, dpb wrote:
krw wrote: On Mon, 06 Jul 2009 21:53:12 -0500, dpb wrote: ... I wondered how long it would take...and surprised it took this long! Long? It was five (5) days since I posted the comments on bamboo that included the caramelization issue remarked upon... Oh, I was replying thru Andrew (hadn't seen your post earlier). I had expected after I reread the post it would be about 5 minutes, tops... The key in the above on caramelization and hardness that was implied but not specifically stated is that the effect is within the same species and grain orientation, not strictly monotonic across all species/grades/manufacturing. So it's a crap shoot? I bought pretty cheap bamboo, since I was planning on selling the house in a couple of years. I went with bamboo mainly because it looked good and was cheaper than replacing the vinyl. It worked. I managed to sell the house at the end of '07. Pretty much...the summary articles in FWW and FHB (and the data on manufacturers' organization website confirm) there's such a wide variation in basic properties between the various species and manufacturing processes used it's only looking at specific test data for a specific product that makes any sense. If you can trust any tests the manufacturer or retailer post. Price isn't necessarily that much of a guide to the hardness in particular; it seems w/ bamboo flooring products more in other areas such as the orientation, finish durability, variability within product, etc., ... The finish quality is an obvious place for differences. The difference in the substrate is a bit surprising, though. I guess wood isn't much different. |
#31
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Flooring
krw wrote:
.... If you can trust any tests the manufacturer or retailer post. The bulk of the data in the FHB/FWW articles on bamboo characteristics itself came from USFS or similar sources...otoh, if the product manufacturers' trade associations are fronting bogus data, then there's little one can find to use on any product w/o testing it oneself. Price isn't necessarily that much of a guide to the hardness in particular; it seems w/ bamboo flooring products more in other areas such as the orientation, finish durability, variability within product, etc., ... The finish quality is an obvious place for differences. The difference in the substrate is a bit surprising, though. I guess wood isn't much different. That's the whole point -- wood and bamboo are nothing alike--their structures and properties are vastly different. Add to that there are a "veritable plethora" of species of bamboo which have properties that range from softer than some pines to harder than sugar maple, to consider that just because a flooring material is made from _some_ species of bamboo is essentially meaningless. -- |
#32
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Flooring
On Tue, 07 Jul 2009 19:43:05 -0500, dpb wrote:
krw wrote: ... If you can trust any tests the manufacturer or retailer post. The bulk of the data in the FHB/FWW articles on bamboo characteristics itself came from USFS or similar sources...otoh, if the product manufacturers' trade associations are fronting bogus data, then there's little one can find to use on any product w/o testing it oneself. If it varies so much, how can you know what you're buying? Price isn't necessarily that much of a guide to the hardness in particular; it seems w/ bamboo flooring products more in other areas such as the orientation, finish durability, variability within product, etc., ... The finish quality is an obvious place for differences. The difference in the substrate is a bit surprising, though. I guess wood isn't much different. That's the whole point -- wood and bamboo are nothing alike--their structures and properties are vastly different. Add to that there are a "veritable plethora" of species of bamboo which have properties that range from softer than some pines to harder than sugar maple, to consider that just because a flooring material is made from _some_ species of bamboo is essentially meaningless. I don't see any species of bamboo listed in catalogs. I guess bamboo isn't a useful product any more than "wood" is. |
#33
Posted to rec.woodworking
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Flooring
dpb wrote:
dpb wrote: ... Always wondered whether any of it did survive or not. I'd guess if it once got established it could manage to hang on but wouldn't be nearly so invasive because warm seasons are so much shorter. It can get to 0F and below in K-town and it doesn't actually kill it entirely; simply freezes back. I don't know what it's overwinter limits actually are though... ... I didn't find any detailed horticultural works in a quick search but did find there's been a recent outbreak in Oregon along a roadside and reports it's as far north as "the northeast" in some other accounts. W/ it's ability to root to 3-ft deep or more, I can imagine if it did get a start that while it would take longer in the spring for it to finally get going again it could manage to survive. The frost line in Pittsburgh is 3-ft. I doubt it gets down that far very often, but still, that stuff wouldn't likely make it through for long or it would already be here, considering you were nice enough to provide us with a sample:-) As far as the north is concerned, there is a fairly large difference in coastal north vs inland north. The ocean has a pretty good moderating effect I think. That was something we observed in TN; after very cold winters it would be later in the spring before it greened up--seems to come back from the roots where it freezes hard over winter. Kinda' like the wisteria; it may _look_ dead until late spring but when it finally pops you'll be digging out from under the rest of the summer until frost. I think we have wisteria, not sure, I'm no plant guy... Plenty of Oak, Maple, Cherry and Walnut however, and thats what its all about:-) -- Jack Using FREE News Server: http://www.eternal-september.org/ http://jbstein.com |
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