(Slow night, too tired to work in the shop, so I'm mulling this over
in public)
What's in a name? Do you folks recall the lawsuit brought on by Sony
Corporation against a woman named Sony who wanted to call her food
shop by her same name? It makes me wonder about some of the names
used in our circle here. "Delta" for example; There is Delta
Airlines, Delta faucets, Delta truck bed tool boxes, and probably at
least another half dozen I have never heard about. (And no, I have
not taken any time to do any internet searches).
Then there is Gorilla; Gorilla Glue and tape, Gorilla laders, Gorilla
Dust collectors (from Oneida), and probably another bunch I don't know
about.
I'm not trying to get a discussion going against Sony but I do not
recall any lawsuits brought against woodworking tool manufacturers
because of name infringement.
Any comments? Anybody else having a slow night?

Marc

On Sep 12, 9:38*pm, marc rosen wrote:

Anybody else having a slow night?

..
..
..
..
..
Yes.

"Robatoy" wrote in message
...
On Sep 12, 9:38 pm, marc rosen wrote:

Anybody else having a slow night?

.
.
.
.
.
Yes.

No!!




--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 8/18/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Sep 12, 10:07*pm, "Swingman" wrote:
"Robatoy" wrote in message

...

On Sep 12, 9:38 pm, marc rosen wrote:

*Anybody else having a slow night?

.
.
.
.
.
Yes.

No!!



I guess at 100MPH, it would be a fast night...=o)

"marc rosen" wrote:

Anybody else having a slow night?

Not with a major train wreck between a freight and a passenger train
about 3-4 hours ago here in SoCal.

May be as many as 350 people on the train.

Of that, estimated as many as 250 injured.

There have been several deaths, the mayor is indicating 10-15 after a
briefing.

It is a slow process getting people out of the train(s).

Stay tuned......................

Lew

On Sep 12, 9:38*pm, marc rosen wrote:
[snipped as brevitization method]


Then there is Gorilla; *Gorilla Glue and tape, Gorilla laders, Gorilla
Dust collectors (from Oneida), and probably another bunch I don't know
about.

Meet my new friends:

http://www.gorillacnc.com/

Talk about a bunch of enthusiastic people. They actually had me
working on my own machine. That was very helpful for a CNC greenhorn
like me. I have the software side pretty much handled to the point
where I am no longer intimidated by it.
Got to set my proximity switches, tested the feed-back positioning,
got know the VFD a bit more and found out that I am really tempted to
go for a tool changer... but, one step at the time (That was a CNC
pun..)
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o...oy/RIMSHOT.jpg

This whole business feels like the days when I was 5 years old, just
before my birthday or Christmas... very exciting.

r

"Robatoy" wrote in message

This whole business feels like the days when I was 5 years old, just
before my birthday or Christmas... very exciting.

I'm excited just reading about it ... you and Morris keep this place
interesting with new technology.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 8/18/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

Robatoy wrote:

Meet my new friends:

http://www.gorillacnc.com/

Talk about a bunch of enthusiastic people. They actually had me
working on my own machine. That was very helpful for a CNC greenhorn
like me. I have the software side pretty much handled to the point
where I am no longer intimidated by it.
Got to set my proximity switches, tested the feed-back positioning,
got know the VFD a bit more and found out that I am really tempted to
go for a tool changer... but, one step at the time (That was a CNC
pun..)
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o...oy/RIMSHOT.jpg

This whole business feels like the days when I was 5 years old, just
before my birthday or Christmas... very exciting.

Exactly the way it should feel - congratulations!

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

On Fri, 12 Sep 2008 18:38:58 -0700, marc rosen wrote:

(Slow night, too tired to work in the shop, so I'm mulling this over in
public)
What's in a name? Do you folks recall the lawsuit brought on by Sony
Corporation against a woman named Sony who wanted to call her food shop
by her same name? It makes me wonder about some of the names used in
our circle here. "Delta" for example; There is Delta Airlines, Delta
faucets, Delta truck bed tool boxes, and probably at least another half
dozen I have never heard about. (And no, I have not taken any time to
do any internet searches). Then there is Gorilla; Gorilla Glue and
tape, Gorilla laders, Gorilla Dust collectors (from Oneida), and
probably another bunch I don't know about.
I'm not trying to get a discussion going against Sony but I do not
recall any lawsuits brought against woodworking tool manufacturers
because of name infringement.
Any comments? Anybody else having a slow night?

Marc

As I recall, you cannot trademark a common word, name, or phrase for
commercial use: Sunny or Sonny, Delta (Engineering books use the inverted
triangle, called delta from the Greek alphabet, as a mathematical
symbol,) and so on. Sonya's foods can be used, but remove the 'a' and
you are in trouble; same with Son-Yee's. Sony is not spoken in USA as
anything but the electronics's company, it has no other meaning. Malibu
has a meaning for a city in California, Toyota not.

A trademark name must be unique: not part of spoken language, and have
unique spelling and pronunciation.

Once, about 25 years ago, I wanted to start a part-time business on the
side. Talked to a lawyer, the thing is, he told me, was getting
customer's to write a check to you, and only you can deposit the check in
a bank. Pick a business name that identifies you and your business plus
is unique to your local market. You can file for a tradename registration
to insure your business name is unique within your State, but trust me
registering a business name only lets the state business tax collectors
find you. Many just stick with just first or last name and the type of
business.

A person with the name of Sony, pronounced as the electronics company, is
not usual (common) in USA. From you posting, I suspect the electronics's
company has been granted a trademark for the trade-name of Sony, as we
normally pronounce the word. If her name is pronounced as "sunny", she
could change the spelling for the business trade-name. The electronics
company cannot force her to change her birth certificate, nor her
driver's license; personal information not part of a business.

On Fri, 12 Sep 2008 18:38:58 -0700 (PDT), marc rosen
wrote:

(Slow night, too tired to work in the shop, so I'm mulling this over
in public)
What's in a name? Do you folks recall the lawsuit brought on by Sony
Corporation against a woman named Sony who wanted to call her food
shop by her same name? It makes me wonder about some of the names
used in our circle here. "Delta" for example; There is Delta
Airlines, Delta faucets, Delta truck bed tool boxes, and probably at
least another half dozen I have never heard about. (And no, I have
not taken any time to do any internet searches).
Then there is Gorilla; Gorilla Glue and tape, Gorilla laders, Gorilla
Dust collectors (from Oneida), and probably another bunch I don't know
about.
I'm not trying to get a discussion going against Sony but I do not
recall any lawsuits brought against woodworking tool manufacturers
because of name infringement.
Any comments? Anybody else having a slow night?

Marc


I think it has to do with whether the name is already in the public
domain, if so, it cannot be exclusively trademarked. You can add to
it and use it as your company name and protect that (Delta Machinery,
Delta Airlines, Delta Faucet), but Delta remains available in the
public domain.

IIRC there is a Delta Machinery in California, non competing. Delta,
prior to the B & D purchase, was actually Delta International
Machinery.

Frank

On Fri, 12 Sep 2008 18:38:58 -0700 (PDT), marc rosen wrote:

(Slow night, too tired to work in the shop, so I'm mulling this over
in public)
What's in a name? Do you folks recall the lawsuit brought on by Sony
Corporation against a woman named Sony who wanted to call her food
shop by her same name? It makes me wonder about some of the names
used in our circle here. "Delta" for example; There is Delta
Airlines, Delta faucets, Delta truck bed tool boxes, and probably at
least another half dozen I have never heard about. (And no, I have
not taken any time to do any internet searches).
Then there is Gorilla; Gorilla Glue and tape, Gorilla laders, Gorilla
Dust collectors (from Oneida), and probably another bunch I don't know
about.
I'm not trying to get a discussion going against Sony but I do not
recall any lawsuits brought against woodworking tool manufacturers
because of name infringement.
Any comments? Anybody else having a slow night?

Marc

3 that come to mind:

A small flower shop in the mid-west named "This bud's for you", sued by
Budweiser..

A friend that had a jeep related web site and domain name that was threatened
with a suit by Cry-co is he didn't stop using it and the word jeep (Jeep)
I think his domain name is "7 slot grill" or something now..

The MTV DJ that registered MTV.com and sat on it until MTV made him an off that
he couldn't refuse..

OH! Just remembered another one that ****ed me off... Someone got the domain
name of ABC.com in the early 90's and American Broadcasting Company sued to get
it themselves..and I think they won..
It seemed weird at the time, as I was a minor official in the American Bowling
Congress.. lol

Unfortunately, macdavis.com was taken long ago.. sigh


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

On Sat, 13 Sep 2008 02:37:38 GMT, "Lew Hodgett" wrote:


"marc rosen" wrote:

Anybody else having a slow night?

Not with a major train wreck between a freight and a passenger train
about 3-4 hours ago here in SoCal.

May be as many as 350 people on the train.

Of that, estimated as many as 250 injured.

There have been several deaths, the mayor is indicating 10-15 after a
briefing.

It is a slow process getting people out of the train(s).

Stay tuned......................

Lew

Ahhh.... I was wondering about that!
We were doing our karaoke gig last night and I kept seeing pictures of flashing
lights and emergency vehicles on the TV in the bar and something about
Chatsworth, but we couldn't tell what was up...
What we thought was a picture of a semi trailer on it's side must have been a
railroad car..


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

Phil Again wrote:
On Fri, 12 Sep 2008 18:38:58 -0700, marc rosen wrote:

(Slow night, too tired to work in the shop, so I'm mulling this over in
public)
What's in a name? Do you folks recall the lawsuit brought on by Sony
Corporation against a woman named Sony who wanted to call her food shop
by her same name? It makes me wonder about some of the names used in
our circle here. "Delta" for example; There is Delta Airlines, Delta
faucets, Delta truck bed tool boxes, and probably at least another half
dozen I have never heard about. (And no, I have not taken any time to
do any internet searches). Then there is Gorilla; Gorilla Glue and
tape, Gorilla laders, Gorilla Dust collectors (from Oneida), and
probably another bunch I don't know about.
I'm not trying to get a discussion going against Sony but I do not
recall any lawsuits brought against woodworking tool manufacturers
because of name infringement.
Any comments? Anybody else having a slow night?

Marc

As I recall, you cannot trademark a common word, name, or phrase for
commercial use: Sunny or Sonny, Delta (Engineering books use the inverted
triangle, called delta from the Greek alphabet, as a mathematical
symbol,) and so on. Sonya's foods can be used, but remove the 'a' and
you are in trouble; same with Son-Yee's. Sony is not spoken in USA as
anything but the electronics's company, it has no other meaning. Malibu
has a meaning for a city in California, Toyota not.

A trademark name must be unique: not part of spoken language, and have
unique spelling and pronunciation.

Once, about 25 years ago, I wanted to start a part-time business on the
side. Talked to a lawyer, the thing is, he told me, was getting
customer's to write a check to you, and only you can deposit the check in
a bank. Pick a business name that identifies you and your business plus
is unique to your local market. You can file for a tradename registration
to insure your business name is unique within your State, but trust me
registering a business name only lets the state business tax collectors
find you. Many just stick with just first or last name and the type of
business.

A person with the name of Sony, pronounced as the electronics company, is
not usual (common) in USA. From you posting, I suspect the electronics's
company has been granted a trademark for the trade-name of Sony, as we
normally pronounce the word. If her name is pronounced as "sunny", she
could change the spelling for the business trade-name. The electronics
company cannot force her to change her birth certificate, nor her
driver's license; personal information not part of a business.



Years ago Sears Roebuck and Co. sued a drycleaner for name infringement.
The drycleaner was operating under the name SEARS Drycleaners. SR felt
that this was going to be confusing to their customers and might lead
them to think that SR was in the laundry business. Well the Court
listened to the arguments and ruled that there was no possibility of
confusion between SR and SD. Besides as one of the drycleaner lawyers
later said: "We still have a Sears working for the business!".

Dave N

"mac davis" wrote

Unfortunately, macdavis.com was taken long ago.. sigh

There is more than one of you?

That is a scary thought. ;-)

"mac davis" wrote:

We were doing our karaoke gig last night and I kept seeing pictures
of flashing
lights and emergency vehicles on the TV in the bar and something
about
Chatsworth, but we couldn't tell what was up...
What we thought was a picture of a semi trailer on it's side must
have been a
railroad car..

It happened near the Chatsworth station.

What you saw were Metrolink passenger cars that were on their sides.

Last night they brought in the search and rescue dogs to make sure
they found everybody who was still alive.

Lew

On Sep 12, 11:00*pm, "Swingman" wrote:
"Robatoy" wrote in message
This whole business feels like the days when I was 5 years old, just
before my birthday or Christmas... very exciting.

I'm excited just reading about it ... you and Morris keep this place
interesting with new technology.

--www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 8/18/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

Rick M and Steve Knight are pretty serious about this stuff too.
Morris writes code at machine level..I'll never go there. I feel dumb
enough as it is, without knowing things like 24352525fsf multiplied by
dgd65476bgd64 makes a decattrahydonomaleous quadrant... if you know
what I mean.. *smirks*

May all our days be f22

Robatoy wrote:

*smirks*

May all our days be f22

Smartass. Never say never.

:-D

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

On Sat, 13 Sep 2008 13:22:27 -0400, "Lee Michaels"
wrote:


"mac davis" wrote

Unfortunately, macdavis.com was taken long ago.. sigh

There is more than one of you?

That is a scary thought. ;-)


Be VERY frightened.. lol

Yeah, some obscure country singer got the domain name first..


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

marc rosen wrote:
I'm not trying to get a discussion going against Sony but I do not
recall any lawsuits brought against woodworking tool manufacturers
because of name infringement.

Trademark law, like all civil/case law, includes a lot of gray areas.
Trademarks can be very strong, particularly when they are fanciful,
coined words such as Kodak, Xerox, Sawzall, Skil, or unusual words, such
as Sony or Ryobi. Other, more generic and common words, such as Apple,
Delta, Gorilla, or even Craftsman, have lesser protection that is
restricted to a narrow category of goods. The purpose of a trademark is
to identify a particular seller of goods or services, and the central
question in any dispute is always whether the buying public is likely to
be confused into thinking that, say, Delta faucets come from Delta Air
Lines. In recent years, the doctrine of "dilution" has been added by
state statutes, muddying the waters, so that trademark owners can claim
that noncompeting, and even noncommercial uses, injure the value of
their trademarks.

There has long been tension between trademark restrictions and use of
personal names, but I'm sure you realize that a fellow named Tom
McDonald is not really free to open up a "McDonald's Restaurant" in his
home town. One of my law school professors wrote several law review
articles on the right to use one's own surname in commerce.

On Sun, 14 Sep 2008 12:50:10 -0500, Mr Downtown "Mr Downtown" wrote:

There has long been tension between trademark restrictions and use of
personal names, but I'm sure you realize that a fellow named Tom
McDonald is not really free to open up a "McDonald's Restaurant" in his
home town. One of my law school professors wrote several law review
articles on the right to use one's own surname in commerce.

But isn't it some kind of crime or misrepresentation to call McDonald's a
restaurant?


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

On Sep 15, 11:07*am, mac davis wrote:
On Sun, 14 Sep 2008 12:50:10 -0500, Mr Downtown "Mr Downtown" wrote:

There has long been tension between trademark restrictions and use of
personal names, but I'm sure you realize that a fellow named Tom
McDonald is not really free to open up a "McDonald's Restaurant" in his
home town. *One of my law school professors wrote several law review
articles on the right to use one's own surname in commerce.

But isn't it some kind of crime or misrepresentation to call McDonald's a
restaurant?

I can't eat that **** anymore. Just can't. The least offensive would
be the egg mcmuffin, but I can't even handle the so-called hash-browns
which WILL give me instant acid reflux. I can't think of anything else
that gives me heartburn like that.

Angela runs a heart & stroke prevention clinic at the local hospital,
and she brought home some stats on fat/calorific contents of fast
foods.
ONE BK Double Whopper (which I used to like) has enough calories for a
day, enough fat for a week, and enough sodium for a month.
UN-flippin-believable. Soon they'll be trying to sell salt-licks to
consumers.

"Robatoy" wrote

Soon they'll be trying to sell salt-licks to consumers.

Well..., one common use for salt blocks where I come from was to put them in
the forest prior to deer hunting season. When the season opened up, the
hunters would be waiting to ambush Bambi.

Out of that context, the fast food folks are already selling salt blocks to
the public.

"Robatoy" wrote:


ONE BK Double Whopper (which I used to like) has enough calories for
a
day, enough fat for a week, and enough sodium for a month.
UN-flippin-believable. Soon they'll be trying to sell salt-licks to
consumers.

I live in a neighborhood which has a fairly large Mexican-American
population.

The grocery store stocks lard which is used in several Mexican dishes.

Ya pays ya money, ya takes ya pick.

Lew

On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 19:22:11 GMT, "Lew Hodgett"
wrote:

The grocery store stocks lard which is used in several Mexican dishes.

Growing up in the piney woods of North Louisiana in the '40s and '50s,
lard and salt cured pork were considered staples. If the food on the
table didn't contain lard, it was fried in it. It's been several
years, but the last time I saw the data, that area of Louisiana,
specifically, Natchitoches, had the highest rate of cardio-vascular
disease in the nation. It was always somewhat assumed, that if a
person's death wasn't accidental, it was from a heart attack or
stroke.

Tom Veatch
Wichita, KS
USA

"Tom Veatch" wrote
On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 19:22:11 GMT, "Lew Hodgett"
wrote:

The grocery store stocks lard which is used in several Mexican dishes.

Growing up in the piney woods of North Louisiana in the '40s and '50s,
lard and salt cured pork were considered staples. If the food on the
table didn't contain lard, it was fried in it. It's been several
years, but the last time I saw the data, that area of Louisiana,
specifically, Natchitoches, had the highest rate of cardio-vascular
disease in the nation. It was always somewhat assumed, that if a
person's death wasn't accidental, it was from a heart attack or
stroke.

Then again, there are worse ways to go than from a lifetime, however short,
of good tasting food! Right now I'm seeing too many old folks living in
misery basically because they're lived too long. Might sound cold, but it's
something to take into consideration if you're not disposed in that
direction.

IOW, pass some more of that fried chicken and gravy, cher!

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 8/18/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

"Swingman" wrote:


IOW, pass some more of that fried chicken and gravy, cher!


SFWIW

My mother worked a horse her entire life.

IOW, hard physical labor, something you learn if you grew up on a farm
in the early 20th century.

She loved pork, especially fatty pork.

When mom entered the nursing home @101, they wanted to feed mom a
balanced diet which included oatmeal for breakfast.

My mother hated oatmeal.

Had to negotiate a special deal so that mom got fried potatoes and
fried sausage for breakfast EVERY morning.

Balanced diet be damned, it was fried potatoes and sausage till the
end @103.

Other than that, she ate a very healthy diet.

Lots of fresh veggies, no sugar water, no alcohol, etc.

As the nursing home admitted, whose to argue?

Lew

Lew Hodgett wrote:

Balanced diet be damned, it was fried potatoes and sausage till the
end @103.

Bad stuff - it always gets ya sooner 'r later.

(I'm glad it was later. g)

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 15:45:34 -0500, "Swingman" wrote:


Then again, there are worse ways to go than from a lifetime, however short,
of good tasting food! Right now I'm seeing too many old folks living in
misery basically because they're lived too long. Might sound cold, but it's
something to take into consideration if you're not disposed in that
direction.

IOW, pass some more of that fried chicken and gravy, cher!

Absolutely have to agree. Good to have both quality and quantity, but
IMO, higher quality and lower quantity is better than the reverse.
Lying around in a ole' folks warehouse is not my idea of the "Golden
Age".

Sorry 'bout that,, but there ain't no more chicken. Finished off the
last piece a minute ago..

Tom Veatch
Wichita, KS
USA

mac davis wrote:

On Sun, 14 Sep 2008 12:50:10 -0500, Mr Downtown "Mr Downtown" wrote:

There has long been tension between trademark restrictions and use of
personal names, but I'm sure you realize that a fellow named Tom
McDonald is not really free to open up a "McDonald's Restaurant" in his
home town. One of my law school professors wrote several law review
articles on the right to use one's own surname in commerce.

But isn't it some kind of crime or misrepresentation to call McDonald's a
restaurant?


Well, it's certainly close to that to call one of their products a
hamburger.


mac


You've got nerves of steel to post the above and then sign off with their
trade-marked name. ;-)


Please remove splinters before emailing

--
If you're going to be dumb, you better be tough

On Sep 15, 11:56*pm, Mark & Juanita wrote:
mac davis wrote:
On Sun, 14 Sep 2008 12:50:10 -0500, Mr Downtown "Mr Downtown" wrote:

There has long been tension between trademark restrictions and use of
personal names, but I'm sure you realize that a fellow named Tom
McDonald is not really free to open up a "McDonald's Restaurant" in his
home town. *One of my law school professors wrote several law review
articles on the right to use one's own surname in commerce.

But isn't it some kind of crime or misrepresentation to call McDonald's a
restaurant?

* Well, it's certainly close to that to call one of their products a
hamburger.



mac

* *You've got nerves of steel to post the above and then sign off with their
trade-marked name. *;-)

Please remove splinters before emailing


If you're going to be dumb, you better be tough

You are not being tough... just dumb.