I am wanting to build a day bed for someone cheaply. But I do want it
to look nice and hold up. It needs to be painted white. Will using
regular 2x4 and other building lumber be ok? Around here, I think it
is southern yellow pine. I plan on planeing it and everything.

Other wood around here is just so expensive. I have some oak at home,
but hate to use it and paint over it.

"stryped" wrote in message
...
I am wanting to build a day bed for someone cheaply. But I do want it
to look nice and hold up. It needs to be painted white. Will using
regular 2x4 and other building lumber be ok? Around here, I think it
is southern yellow pine. I plan on planeing it and everything.

Other wood around here is just so expensive. I have some oak at home,
but hate to use it and paint over it.


It will work just fine and especially since you will be painting it, that is
what I did for many years, many years ago. I would advise using the same
brand primer for a base coat and lightly sanding that coat before applying
the top coat.

"stryped" wrote in message
I am wanting to build a day bed for someone cheaply. But I do want it
to look nice and hold up. It needs to be painted white. Will using
regular 2x4 and other building lumber be ok? Around here, I think it
is southern yellow pine. I plan on planeing it and everything.

Other wood around here is just so expensive. I have some oak at home,
but hate to use it and paint over it.

Use poplar ... much cheaper, and still a hardwood, with hardwood properties,
and you won't feel bad painting it.

I would not build anything I'd want to be proud of out of today's plantation
grown construction lumber, except maybe temporary shop fixtures.

Trust me ... if it's worth spending your time on it, it's worth using the
best material you can afford.


--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 5/14/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

"Leon" wrote

It will work just fine and especially since you will be painting it, that
is
what I did for many years, many years ago. I would advise using the same
brand primer for a base coat and lightly sanding that coat before applying
the top coat.

LOL! We disagree on something ... at last!

I was beginning to wonder ... (don't tell the girls, they still think we're
long lost twins).

--
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Last update: 5/14/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

"Swingman" wrote in message
...

"stryped" wrote in message
I am wanting to build a day bed for someone cheaply. But I do want it
to look nice and hold up. It needs to be painted white. Will using
regular 2x4 and other building lumber be ok? Around here, I think it
is southern yellow pine. I plan on planeing it and everything.

Other wood around here is just so expensive. I have some oak at home,
but hate to use it and paint over it.

Use poplar ... much cheaper, and still a hardwood, with hardwood
properties,
and you won't feel bad painting it.

I would not build anything I'd want to be proud of out of today's
plantation
grown construction lumber, except maybe temporary shop fixtures.

Trust me ... if it's worth spending your time on it, it's worth using the
best material you can afford.


--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 5/14/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)


I agree with swingman that poplar and maybe some oak would be the first
choice for a project of that kind. However construction lumber will work
quite well if you spend some time going through the lumber before you buy.
I often find that lumber in the reject pile is better then the "good" stuff
and usually 1/2 price, look at it closely though and make sure that you can
use it in spite of warps, twists and splits.

stryped wrote:

I am wanting to build a day bed for someone cheaply. But I do want it
to look nice and hold up. It needs to be painted white. Will using
regular 2x4 and other building lumber be ok? Around here, I think it
is southern yellow pine. I plan on planeing it and everything.

Other wood around here is just so expensive. I have some oak at home,
but hate to use it and paint over it.

SYP should work fine, with proper care. It certainly is strong enough.
And it should be stabile once properly seasoned. Some cautions:
1) Allow plenty of time for it to air dry and stabilize to an
environment similar to its ultimate home--as it comes from the BORG,
it is likely pretty wet.
2) Allow for at least double the waste you would anticipate with other
wood, even if you have picked carefully from the stock at the BORG.
When you dress it, you are likely to find reaction wood, case
hardening, and other problems that make the final planed size much
smaller than you wanted.
3)Make sure to seal and prime well. Knots and sap pockets tend to
bleed through and show up as stains on your paint. I like to use a
shellac-based AND an oil-based primer, on the theory that what one
doesn't block, the other may. No scientific basis for that, though,
and I may be kidding myself.

You might want to price out poplar. Takes paint very well, and is
"better behaved" as a furniture wood than SYP (meaning less waste and
less frustration in working it), and somewhat lighter, which you may
appreciate when picking up the bed.

--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.

stryped wrote:
I am wanting to build a day bed for someone cheaply. But I do want it
to look nice and hold up. It needs to be painted white. Will using
regular 2x4 and other building lumber be ok? Around here, I think it
is southern yellow pine. I plan on planeing it and everything.

Other wood around here is just so expensive. I have some oak at home,
but hate to use it and paint over it.
Tons of good advice here so I won't repeat it. I have built several
beds (including bunks) out of SPF (aka Jummywood) bought at the Borg.
My preferred method of finishing is a 2# cut of shellac (sealer) plus a
second with Transtint or similar dye to get the color of your choice.
This takes a fair amount of experimentation so when you get what you
like, be sure to make up enough to cover the piece in one sitting. Then
add a top coat of your choice: oil, oil/poly mix, oil/poly/spirits mix,
etc. That should give you a good looking piece that will stand up to
life's little problems.

mahalo,
jo4hn

jo4hn wrote:

stryped wrote:

It needs to be painted white.

Tons of good advice here so I won't repeat it. I have built several
beds (including bunks) out of SPF (aka Jummywood) bought at the Borg.
My preferred method of finishing is a 2# cut of shellac (sealer) plus a
second with Transtint or similar dye to get the color of your choice.
This takes a fair amount of experimentation so when you get what you
like, be sure to make up enough to cover the piece in one sitting. Then
add a top coat of your choice: oil, oil/poly mix, oil/poly/spirits mix,
etc. That should give you a good looking piece that will stand up to
life's little problems.

I think you might have missed part of the original post? g

PS, I totally agree with your approach on stained pieces -- exactly
what I do.
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.

"Swingman" wrote in message
...

"Leon" wrote

It will work just fine and especially since you will be painting it, that
is
what I did for many years, many years ago. I would advise using the same
brand primer for a base coat and lightly sanding that coat before
applying
the top coat.

LOL! We disagree on something ... at last!

I was focused on "CHEAP" and the fact that he would be milling it.

I was beginning to wonder ... (don't tell the girls, they still think
we're
long lost twins).

LOL

"Swingman" wrote in message
...

"stryped" wrote in message
I am wanting to build a day bed for someone cheaply. But I do want it
to look nice and hold up. It needs to be painted white. Will using
regular 2x4 and other building lumber be ok? Around here, I think it
is southern yellow pine. I plan on planeing it and everything.

Other wood around here is just so expensive. I have some oak at home,
but hate to use it and paint over it.

Use poplar ... much cheaper, and still a hardwood, with hardwood
properties,
and you won't feel bad painting it.

Whare r u findin poplar cheaper than 2x4's? ;~)

"Leon" wrote in message
...

"Swingman" wrote in message
...

"stryped" wrote in message
I am wanting to build a day bed for someone cheaply. But I do want it
to look nice and hold up. It needs to be painted white. Will using
regular 2x4 and other building lumber be ok? Around here, I think it
is southern yellow pine. I plan on planeing it and everything.

Other wood around here is just so expensive. I have some oak at home,
but hate to use it and paint over it.

Use poplar ... much cheaper, and still a hardwood, with hardwood
properties,
and you won't feel bad painting it.

Whare r u findin poplar cheaper than 2x4's? ;~)

Local lumber dealer $1 bd foot kiln dried and $0.50 air dried 3 months or
better.

Oak white or red $2 bd ft
Cherry or Walnut $3bd ft Kiln dried
Maple Good Luck
Hickory $1bd ft Kiln dried

all in random widths and lengths rough,

On Aug 8, 11:36*am, jo4hn wrote:
stryped wrote:
I am wanting to build a day bed for someone cheaply. But I do want it
to look nice and hold up. It needs to be painted white. Will using
regular 2x4 and other building lumber be ok? Around here, I think it
is southern yellow pine. I plan on planeing it and everything.

Other wood around here is just so expensive. I have some oak at home,
but hate to use it and paint over it.

Tons of good advice here so I won't repeat it. *I have built several
beds (including bunks) out of SPF (aka Jummywood) bought at the Borg.
My preferred method of finishing is a 2# cut of shellac (sealer) plus a
second with Transtint or similar dye to get the color of your choice.
This takes a fair amount of experimentation so when you get what you
like, be sure to make up enough to cover the piece in one sitting. *Then
add a top coat of your choice: oil, oil/poly mix, oil/poly/spirits mix,
* etc. *That should give you a good looking piece that will stand up to
life's little problems.

* * * * mahalo,
* * * * jo4hn

Did your beds turn out well? I am really struggeling with what
everyone is saying here. I need it to be lower cost but I dont want
the thing "splitting apart" in a few months either. I dont have the
time or place either to store the wood for several months before using
it.

Curran Copeland wrote:

Local lumber dealer $1 bd foot kiln dried and $0.50 air dried 3 months or
better.

Oak white or red $2 bd ft
Cherry or Walnut $3bd ft Kiln dried
Maple Good Luck
Hickory $1bd ft Kiln dried

I hate you. I'm paying 3-4x those prices.

Chris

"stryped" wrote

Did your beds turn out well? I am really struggeling with what
everyone is saying here. I need it to be lower cost but I dont want
the thing "splitting apart" in a few months either. I dont have the
time or place either to store the wood for several months before using
it.

The things you want to watch for with construction grade lumber is going to
be twist, warp, cup and bow ... and some, or all, of these things may not
show up until you actually start cutting your stock to project dimensions.

Much of this will be due to the wood being "wide grained" from fast growth,
compounded by not being properly dry for furniture work at the time of
purchase.

Most construction grade lumber at the BORG is kiln dried to around 15 - 18%
(regardless of what they say), and, IME, this is way too "wet" to be making
furniture with.

If you can find well dried lumber at a lumber yard, say below 10% moisture
content, you'll be much safer from the problems described above.

(HINT: while not always the case, a rule of thumb is that heavier the lumber
is, the higher the moisture content, and vice versa, so look for straight
grained, light boards, if you must go this route ... still no guarantee, but
every little bit helps)

You may want to consider springing for a wood moisture meter ... but now
you're approaching, in cost, buying a cheaper hardwood, like poplar, to
begin with.

Additionally, and IME, you will certainly want to overbuy by at least 30 to
50%.

Once again, that puts you square in the price range of a cheaper hardwood,
with which you should have fewer chances of problems ... but only if the
poplar is below that 10% moisture content reading.

I'm not saying that it can't be done (AAMOF, there was indeed a time when
this could be done on sheer luck alone, but that time is long past ), but I
will adamantly state that it takes a good bit of experience to look at wood,
and particularly construction grade lumber, and make a judgment as to the
likelihood of problems and suitability for even the least important bit of
furniture.

If you don't have this experience, IMO you're treading on thin ice. What it
then boils down to is whether you have more time than money.

If that's the case, then by all means, go for it! You now know what the up
and down sides are.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 5/14/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

Subject

Have you tried getting a price on Poplar?

Stable, great paint wood, etc.

Lew

sweet sawdust wrote:

I agree with swingman that poplar and maybe some oak would be the first
choice for a project of that kind. However construction lumber will work
quite well if you spend some time going through the lumber before you buy.
I often find that lumber in the reject pile is better then the "good" stuff
and usually 1/2 price, look at it closely though and make sure that you can
use it in spite of warps, twists and splits.



Buy kiln dried 2x12's that look from the end to be a full width tree.
Rip out and and toss the center 3" of the board. Cut them to rough
length and let them dry for a few weeks. You're left with mostly
vertical grain that's quite usable for cheap work.

B A R R Y writes:
sweet sawdust wrote:

I agree with swingman that poplar and maybe some oak would be the first
choice for a project of that kind. However construction lumber will work
quite well if you spend some time going through the lumber before you buy.
I often find that lumber in the reject pile is better then the "good" stuff
and usually 1/2 price, look at it closely though and make sure that you can
use it in spite of warps, twists and splits.



Buy kiln dried 2x12's that look from the end to be a full width tree.
Rip out and and toss the center 3" of the board. Cut them to rough
length and let them dry for a few weeks. You're left with mostly
vertical grain that's quite usable for cheap work.

The 2x[6,8,10,12] here are all green. The only thing we get KD
is 2x4 (at the local home depot/lowes in n. cal.).

I usually have 3 or 4 2x6 and 2x8 8-footers stashed away in the shed
air drying for when I need some doug fir for a project. Whenever
I'm at HD and see a nice tight-grained 2x6 or 2x8 I'll add it to
the stash.

scott

"Scott Lurndal" wrote

I usually have 3 or 4 2x6 and 2x8 8-footers stashed away in the shed
air drying for when I need some doug fir for a project.

Vertical grain Douglas Fir ... expen$ive around here, but a great wood to
work with.

Whenever
I'm at HD and see a nice tight-grained 2x6 or 2x8 I'll add it to
the stash.

Do the same when I see quarter sawn red oak in the bin at one of the BORG's.


--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 5/14/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

Hi,

I have used standard construction lumber on occasion. I have found
that running a 2X4 through a surface planer on all four sides can dress
it up a bit. But choose your material carefully.

Sincerely,
Roger Haar


stryped wrote:
I am wanting to build a day bed for someone cheaply. But I do want it
to look nice and hold up. It needs to be painted white. Will using
regular 2x4 and other building lumber be ok? Around here, I think it
is southern yellow pine. I plan on planeing it and everything.

Other wood around here is just so expensive. I have some oak at home,
but hate to use it and paint over it.

stryped wrote:
On Aug 8, 11:36 am, jo4hn wrote:
stryped wrote:
I am wanting to build a day bed for someone cheaply. But I do want it
to look nice and hold up. It needs to be painted white. Will using
regular 2x4 and other building lumber be ok? Around here, I think it
is southern yellow pine. I plan on planeing it and everything.
Other wood around here is just so expensive. I have some oak at home,
but hate to use it and paint over it.
Tons of good advice here so I won't repeat it. I have built several
beds (including bunks) out of SPF (aka Jummywood) bought at the Borg.
My preferred method of finishing is a 2# cut of shellac (sealer) plus a
second with Transtint or similar dye to get the color of your choice.
This takes a fair amount of experimentation so when you get what you
like, be sure to make up enough to cover the piece in one sitting. Then
add a top coat of your choice: oil, oil/poly mix, oil/poly/spirits mix,
etc. That should give you a good looking piece that will stand up to
life's little problems.

mahalo,
jo4hn

Did your beds turn out well? I am really struggeling with what
everyone is saying here. I need it to be lower cost but I dont want
the thing "splitting apart" in a few months either. I dont have the
time or place either to store the wood for several months before using
it.

The beds turned out fine. One is a bunk with a desk underneath and a
bed on top, built for my first grandson. He is now 6'3" and 200+ pounds
so the bed is now in one of my guest rooms. Outside of the expected
dents and dings, it is in good shape. Another twin bed was damaged in a
move but repairable and sleeps another grandchild. Another double was
again damaged in a move (neither bed was done in by professional
movers), repaired and is in a daughters guest room. Another (painted
several times) is in my storage room and awaits something... anything...
please take it away.

I found that as somebody said not only looking for straightness but
lightness (low water content) is important. You will still need to
acclimate the boards to the local environment for as long as you can
manage (week to weeks, if possible). Joint and plane the boards. A 2x6
can stand a bit taken off and still be usable as a side rail for
example. Jummy would be proud. (That's so when he googles, he will see
some new references to his name. :-) )

mahalo,
jo4hn

jo4hn wrote:

I found that as somebody said not only looking for straightness but
lightness (low water content) is important.

Not necesserily true IME. Around here, the home improvement stores sell
"white wood" which is #2 common hemlock/fir/pine...can be any of those. The
ones that are fir are heavier. And better IMO.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

stryped wrote:
I am wanting to build a day bed for someone cheaply. But I do want it
to look nice and hold up. It needs to be painted white. Will using
regular 2x4 and other building lumber be ok? Around here, I think it
is southern yellow pine. I plan on planeing it and everything.

Since weathering would not be a concern, how well the result would hold up
depends almost entirely on how well you construct it.

SYP is hard and heavy. It is also "fat" which means there is a lot of resin
in it which means it is a PITA to sand because the abrasive loads quickly.
Here in central Florida, SYP is commonly used but usually only in load
bearing applications such as headers. The more normal construction wood is
"white wood" which can be fir, hemlock, spruce or pine.

Construction lumber here is #2 common. (If there were such a thing as #5
common, I'm sure that would be the grade of choice ; #2 common has lots of
knots and other imperfections. If you want your project to look good when
finished you have to get all the surfaces that are to be painted smooth and
flat. Here is what I would suggest to do that...

1. Cut your boards to size trying to minimize lumber imperfections.

2. Use Bondo or other auto body filler to fill major dings, knots and other
deficiencies. Those fillers are a mixture of talc and polyester resin. To
use them, one scoops out some filler then adds a few drops of catalyst
(which comes with the filler). Mix the two - THOROUGHLY - and apply with a
putty knife, overfilling slightly. It will set up quickly but takes 20-30
minutes to get totally hard. Once it is set up but still rubbery, use a
sharp chisel to cut off any excess. Never get catalyst or catalyzed resin
into the can of un-catalyzed else it will set up and be ruined.

3. Sand everything well with #120 paper and dust them off. Examine each
piece well - a glancing light helps - for surface imperfections. When you
find them (you will) fill them with automotive glazing compound. You can
get it at NAPA or other such store. It is talc in lacquer, comes in a
sizeable tube for $10-$15. It is meant only for minor deficiencies, not
deep ones. If you still have deep ones, use Bondo again; use the glazing
compound on minor ones. It doesn't set up like Bondo, it dries by
evaporation.

4. Sand again with #120 to get all repairs smooth and flat. Then sand
again with #150 or #180.

5. At this point, you are ready to prime and paint. If you can do so
before assembling - priming especially - do so; if not, assemble.

6. Use an oil primer. Brush it on in the direction of the board's length;
i.e., don't leave cross grain brush marks. Let it dry for a couple of days
and sand with #180 or better. Most primers don't sand real well nowadays
and yet it is necessary to get it smooth as top coat paint will look no
better than the surface to which it is applied. If the paper loads too
much, try hand wet sanding with a rubber block sander and silicone carbide
paper.

7. Apply two coats of your finish paint; again, avoid cross grain brush
marks. I'd suggest you NOT use glossy as it will show imperfections very
readily. Eggshell or - at most - semi-gloss is better. If you are able to
spray primer and finish, you should have an excellent job; if not, you
should have a good one.


--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

dadiOH wrote:
jo4hn wrote:

I found that as somebody said not only looking for straightness but
lightness (low water content) is important.

Not necesserily true IME. Around here, the home improvement stores
sell "white wood" which is #2 common hemlock/fir/pine...can be any
of
those. The ones that are fir are heavier. And better IMO.

What's the grade stamp on it? The codes in the US have four general
classifications, "Spruce/Pine/Fir", "Douglas fir-larch", "hem-fir",
and "Southern Pine" with different allowables for each grade of each,
from Select Structural down to #3. The highest allowables are for
Douglas Fir-Larch. It should be stamped for one of those categories.

..

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)