In my continuing saga to try to use my rail and stile set to create a groove
that 1/4" plywood these days will fit snugly into, I'm strongly considering
getting the carbide ground from about .220" to about .195". If I'm not nuts
to consider this, where might I send the bit to be modified?

todd

wrote in message
oups.com...

todd wrote:
In my continuing saga to try to use my rail and stile set to create a
groove
that 1/4" plywood these days will fit snugly into, I'm strongly
considering
getting the carbide ground from about .220" to about .195". If I'm not
nuts
to consider this, where might I send the bit to be modified?


If the groove is cut by a slot cutter that is a separatre part of the
bit,
can you buy another slot cutter that is narrower?

It is separate. I've looked high and low for another slot cutter that would
work. If anyone knows of a cutter that goes on an 8mm arbor, cuts a 3/16"
slot, and has a 1.75" diameter, please let me know.

An alternative might be to iron on some veneer edge banding
around the inside edge of the plywoodpanel to make it fit a bit tighter
in the standard slot.

There's all kinds of ways to "make it work" after the fact. I've got a lot
of doors to make, and I'd like to save myself a lot of retrofitting, if
possible. Thanks for the suggestions.

todd

"todd" wrote in message
...
In my continuing saga to try to use my rail and stile set to create a
groove that 1/4" plywood these days will fit snugly into, I'm strongly
considering getting the carbide ground from about .220" to about .195".
If I'm not nuts to consider this, where might I send the bit to be
modified?

todd

Todd,

If this groove is for panels to slide into on the rails and stiles of
doors - as I think you're doing, leave the groove as is and use "Space
Balls". Place two in each groove and they keep the panel centered and keep
it from rattling. You can make your own spacers from silicon but using the
space balls is a lot easier and they work as advertised.
http://www.spaceballs.com/

Bob S.

"todd" wrote in message
...
In my continuing saga to try to use my rail and stile set to create a
groove that 1/4" plywood these days will fit snugly into, I'm strongly
considering getting the carbide ground from about .220" to about .195".
If I'm not nuts to consider this, where might I send the bit to be
modified?


If this 1/4" grove is cut by the rail and stile bit. DON'T DO IT. If you
make the slot smaller you will have to make the mating side of the rail bit
cut a narrower tennon to fit the stile grove. That is basically impossible
as you will have to add carbide.

Just shim the back side of the panel if it fits too loosely in the slot.

"Leon" wrote in message
. com...

"todd" wrote in message
...
In my continuing saga to try to use my rail and stile set to create a
groove that 1/4" plywood these days will fit snugly into, I'm strongly
considering getting the carbide ground from about .220" to about .195".
If I'm not nuts to consider this, where might I send the bit to be
modified?


If this 1/4" grove is cut by the rail and stile bit. DON'T DO IT. If
you make the slot smaller you will have to make the mating side of the
rail bit cut a narrower tennon to fit the stile grove. That is basically
impossible as you will have to add carbide.

Just shim the back side of the panel if it fits too loosely in the slot.

I don't think it's impossible. The mating bit is also in two pieces
currently separated by a bearing and about 0.025" of shims. My plan was to
remove enough of the shims to get the proper fit.

todd

"BobS" wrote in message
...

"todd" wrote in message
...
In my continuing saga to try to use my rail and stile set to create a
groove that 1/4" plywood these days will fit snugly into, I'm strongly
considering getting the carbide ground from about .220" to about .195".
If I'm not nuts to consider this, where might I send the bit to be
modified?

todd

Todd,

If this groove is for panels to slide into on the rails and stiles of
doors - as I think you're doing, leave the groove as is and use "Space
Balls". Place two in each groove and they keep the panel centered and
keep it from rattling. You can make your own spacers from silicon but
using the space balls is a lot easier and they work as advertised.
http://www.spaceballs.com/

Bob S.

I'm familiar with Spaceballs. I see how they would work to keep the panel
from rattling "up and down" and "side to side". But since they don't take
up any of the space in the direction perpendicular to the face of the panel,
I wonder if they would still allow the panel to move "in and out".

todd

On Fri, 17 Mar 2006 13:52:11 GMT, "BobS" wrote:

Todd,

If this groove is for panels to slide into on the rails and stiles of
doors - as I think you're doing, leave the groove as is and use "Space
Balls". Place two in each groove and they keep the panel centered and keep
it from rattling. You can make your own spacers from silicon but using the
space balls is a lot easier and they work as advertised.
http://www.spaceballs.com/

Bob S.

Bob.. those are really cool...
A great idea that I never would/wood of known about without this NG...
Mac

https://home.comcast.net/~mac.davis
https://home.comcast.net/~mac.davis/wood_stuff.htm

todd wrote:
In my continuing saga to try to use my rail and stile set to create a
groove that 1/4" plywood these days will fit snugly into, I'm
strongly considering getting the carbide ground from about .220" to
about .195". If I'm not nuts to consider this, where might I send
the bit to be modified?

Just about any shop that sharpens bits, saw blades and the like. Check
your yellow pages.

Don't try to make the fit too snug or you'll play hell trying to get the
ply into the groove. Even with a sloppy fit is is sometimes difficult
(depending on size of panel). Easing the ply edges helps a lot...I use
a 4 in hand (shoemaker's) rasp.

--
dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

"brianlanning" wrote in message
oups.com...
There's all kinds of ways to "make it work" after the fact. I've got a
lot
of doors to make, and I'd like to save myself a lot of retrofitting, if
possible. Thanks for the suggestions.

If it were me, and a cursory search for a new slot cutter failed, I
would so one of these things:

Believe me...it's been more than cursory. ;-)

Remove the slot cutter from the set and make two passes, one with the
modified bit sans slot cutter, then a second pass with something like
that new amana adjustable slot cutter.

Or, more likely, I would step up to 3/8" ply for the panels and rebate
the edges to exactly 1/4". That would be real fast with a stacked dado
set in a table saw.

brian

I've read suggestions on the 3/8" ply. No one around here carries it,
though it could possibly be special ordered.

todd

"todd" wrote in message
...
In my continuing saga to try to use my rail and stile set to create a
groove that 1/4" plywood these days will fit snugly into, I'm strongly
considering getting the carbide ground from about .220" to about .195".
If I'm not nuts to consider this, where might I send the bit to be
modified?

todd

Todd, It's only a few bucks to have a local saw sharpener grind the slot
cutter a few thou smaller. As you said, the opposing bit is adjustable as
well. OTOH, making a shim for the back of the slot is pretty easy as well.

Dave

good bits are supposed to be kept, and resharpened aren't they. This way
too, you can fit everything the way you want.



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"todd" wrote in message
...
I don't think it's impossible. The mating bit is also in two pieces
currently separated by a bearing and about 0.025" of shims. My plan was
to remove enough of the shims to get the proper fit.

You may be right but opening up a bucket of worms IMHO.

I've read suggestions on the 3/8" ply. No one around here carries it,
though it could possibly be special ordered.

Half inch would probably work too.

brian

todd wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...
todd wrote:
In my continuing saga to try to use my rail and stile set to create a
groove
that 1/4" plywood these days will fit snugly into, I'm strongly
considering
getting the carbide ground from about .220" to about .195". If I'm not
nuts
to consider this, where might I send the bit to be modified?

If the groove is cut by a slot cutter that is a separatre part of the
bit,
can you buy another slot cutter that is narrower?

It is separate. I've looked high and low for another slot cutter that would
work. If anyone knows of a cutter that goes on an 8mm arbor, cuts a 3/16"
slot, and has a 1.75" diameter, please let me know.

An alternative might be to iron on some veneer edge banding
around the inside edge of the plywoodpanel to make it fit a bit tighter
in the standard slot.

There's all kinds of ways to "make it work" after the fact. I've got a lot
of doors to make, and I'd like to save myself a lot of retrofitting, if
possible. Thanks for the suggestions.

todd


Todd, check out the Whiteside Router Bit link below for a possible
solution that will fit your needs
http://www.whitesiderouterbits.com/c.../StileRail.pdf.

Martie

"todd" wrote in message
...
"BobS" wrote in message
...

"todd" wrote in message
...
In my continuing saga to try to use my rail and stile set to create a
groove that 1/4" plywood these days will fit snugly into, I'm strongly
considering getting the carbide ground from about .220" to about .195".
If I'm not nuts to consider this, where might I send the bit to be
modified?

todd

Todd,

If this groove is for panels to slide into on the rails and stiles of
doors - as I think you're doing, leave the groove as is and use "Space
Balls". Place two in each groove and they keep the panel centered and
keep it from rattling. You can make your own spacers from silicon but
using the space balls is a lot easier and they work as advertised.
http://www.spaceballs.com/

Bob S.

I'm familiar with Spaceballs. I see how they would work to keep the panel
from rattling "up and down" and "side to side". But since they don't take
up any of the space in the direction perpendicular to the face of the
panel, I wonder if they would still allow the panel to move "in and out".

todd

They are under compression when installed - the panel is not going to move.
You're only talking of .025" difference, not the Grand Canyon. You'll loose
some of that difference when you apply finish also.

Bob S.

"Martie in MO" wrote in message
...
todd wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...
todd wrote:
In my continuing saga to try to use my rail and stile set to create a
groove
that 1/4" plywood these days will fit snugly into, I'm strongly
considering
getting the carbide ground from about .220" to about .195". If I'm not
nuts
to consider this, where might I send the bit to be modified?

If the groove is cut by a slot cutter that is a separatre part of the
bit,
can you buy another slot cutter that is narrower?

It is separate. I've looked high and low for another slot cutter that
would work. If anyone knows of a cutter that goes on an 8mm arbor, cuts
a 3/16" slot, and has a 1.75" diameter, please let me know.

An alternative might be to iron on some veneer edge banding
around the inside edge of the plywoodpanel to make it fit a bit tighter
in the standard slot.

There's all kinds of ways to "make it work" after the fact. I've got a
lot of doors to make, and I'd like to save myself a lot of retrofitting,
if possible. Thanks for the suggestions.

todd
Todd, check out the Whiteside Router Bit link below for a possible
solution that will fit your needs
http://www.whitesiderouterbits.com/c.../StileRail.pdf.

Martie

Thanks for the link, Martie. Unfortunately, Whiteside is operating under
the same delusion as all the other router bit makers...that 1/4" plywood is
7/32".

todd

"BobS" wrote in message
...

"todd" wrote in message
...
"BobS" wrote in message
...

"todd" wrote in message
...
In my continuing saga to try to use my rail and stile set to create a
groove that 1/4" plywood these days will fit snugly into, I'm strongly
considering getting the carbide ground from about .220" to about .195".
If I'm not nuts to consider this, where might I send the bit to be
modified?

todd

Todd,

If this groove is for panels to slide into on the rails and stiles of
doors - as I think you're doing, leave the groove as is and use "Space
Balls". Place two in each groove and they keep the panel centered and
keep it from rattling. You can make your own spacers from silicon but
using the space balls is a lot easier and they work as advertised.
http://www.spaceballs.com/

Bob S.

I'm familiar with Spaceballs. I see how they would work to keep the
panel from rattling "up and down" and "side to side". But since they
don't take up any of the space in the direction perpendicular to the face
of the panel, I wonder if they would still allow the panel to move "in
and out".

todd

They are under compression when installed - the panel is not going to
move. You're only talking of .025" difference, not the Grand Canyon.
You'll loose some of that difference when you apply finish also.

Bob S.

I picked up some Spaceballs today since I had planned to use them anyway.
Maybe I just need to see a door with everything installed and see how it
performs.

todd

I've been using the Freud adjustable tongue and grove set for this. It
makes a nice snug fit by adding removing shims to both bits.

http://www.freud-tools.com/freud99adton.html

Carl

"todd" wrote in message
...
In my continuing saga to try to use my rail and stile set to create a
groove that 1/4" plywood these days will fit snugly into, I'm strongly
considering getting the carbide ground from about .220" to about .195".
If I'm not nuts to consider this, where might I send the bit to be
modified?

todd

I don't see how (at least for 1/4" ply). According to the info on the set,
the smallest groove it will cut is 7/32, which is already the size I have
(which is too big). It's too bad, because they're the only ones I've seen
that have the correct diameter (1.75").

todd

"Carl" wrote in message
news:CsWSf.725$PE.200@fed1read05...
I've been using the Freud adjustable tongue and grove set for this. It
makes a nice snug fit by adding removing shims to both bits.

http://www.freud-tools.com/freud99adton.html

Carl

"todd" wrote in message
...
In my continuing saga to try to use my rail and stile set to create a
groove that 1/4" plywood these days will fit snugly into, I'm strongly
considering getting the carbide ground from about .220" to about .195".
If I'm not nuts to consider this, where might I send the bit to be
modified?

todd

todd wrote:
In my continuing saga to try to use my rail and stile set to create a groove
that 1/4" plywood these days will fit snugly into, I'm strongly considering
getting the carbide ground from about .220" to about .195". If I'm not nuts
to consider this, where might I send the bit to be modified?

It's pretty easy to grind a carbide bit down if you have a
diamond sharpening stone and a digital vernier or mic. I
ground a 6.3mm one down to 5.5 to make a cutter to fit a
guitar truss rod (roughly your sizes!). If you haven't got
a diamond stone yet, you don't know what you're missing!

Work out how much you have to take off each side, then
grind down one side all the way, checking for *parallel*
as you go with the vernier/mike (the other edge is your
datum). Then flip the tool over and grind the other side,
also checking for parallel. Takes no more than ten minutes.

Clifford Heath.