Looking for some advice for the cold northern woodworks in the group.

Fall is just around the corner and after that winter. I've spent all summer
outfitting my shop and am looking forward to spending all winter freezing
out there! I'm currently in one half of an attached garage, a car will be
in the other half. The winters here in Calgary are semi-mild, we get huge
temperature fluctuations for our chinook winds (say 20 C in the course of a
day). The garage is insulated, but does not have a heater. From the past
year (when I insulated), I found that the garage can be somewhat comfortable
even on the very cold days of the year.

Whithout spending the big bucks to get a gas heater installed what other
options do I have?

Buster wrote:


Whithout spending the big bucks to get a gas heater installed what other
options do I have?


Do they still sell kerosene heaters in your area?

I used one when i was back in Cleveland.

Lew

Buster wrote:
Looking for some advice for the cold northern woodworks in the group.

Fall is just around the corner and after that winter. I've spent all summer
outfitting my shop and am looking forward to spending all winter freezing
out there! I'm currently in one half of an attached garage, a car will be
in the other half. The winters here in Calgary are semi-mild, we get huge
temperature fluctuations for our chinook winds (say 20 C in the course of a
day). The garage is insulated, but does not have a heater. From the past
year (when I insulated), I found that the garage can be somewhat comfortable
even on the very cold days of the year.

Whithout spending the big bucks to get a gas heater installed what other
options do I have?


Drive that car around on your errands, then park it inside the garage while you
do your woodworking. It'll radiate heat for quite a while.




--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN

VE

I don't recall where I read about this, but I think it might have been an
issue of "Fine Woodworking".

I live in Sanoran Desert of Arizona, so "heat" is not something about which
we have a lot of concern. The opposite is true. "How do we keep from
burning up?"

The system used fueled by sawdust, shavings, small wood scraps from the wood
shop. If you can imagine a large cannister, with a six inch hole cut and
centered in both the top and bottom. My recollection was that the
"cannister" was approximately two feet in diameter, perhaps five feet tall.
The top was removable, so one could load the fuel. In the center a pipe was
inserted into the bottom hole, then fuel was loaded and packed around it.
The pipe could be anything from stove pipe to PVC, just something which
would not collapse from the fuel and the packing pressure.

When the cannister was full, the "PVC" pipe was removed. This left a
perfect hole right through the middle. The top was secured. A stove pipe
attached to the top vented through the ceiling, (the longer the better to
allow heat transfer). The "cannister" sat on legs which allowed air to
flow. Then the fire was lit from the hole in the bottom, and it burned from
the inside, and of course, the combustion was the heat source.

My recollection is that the thing burned for about three or four days. You
would want to put in all kinds of safty precautions, to prevent fire.., like
making sure that there were no "open ports" from which sparks could escape
into the shop. Two or three cannisters were used, so that while one was
buring the others could be loaded.

I don't know if this helps, but I was impressed with the idea. If this
would stand up with today's rigid regulations, I have no idea. But if it
was me who needed heat for my shop.., I think I could devise a system which
would be both safe and dispose of my waste, while warming my shop.




"Buster" wrote in message
news:Z9UMe.36357$vj.7288@pd7tw1no...
Looking for some advice for the cold northern woodworks in the group.

Fall is just around the corner and after that winter. I've spent all
summer outfitting my shop and am looking forward to spending all winter
freezing out there! I'm currently in one half of an attached garage, a
car will be in the other half. The winters here in Calgary are semi-mild,
we get huge temperature fluctuations for our chinook winds (say 20 C in
the course of a day). The garage is insulated, but does not have a
heater. From the past year (when I insulated), I found that the garage
can be somewhat comfortable even on the very cold days of the year.

Whithout spending the big bucks to get a gas heater installed what other
options do I have?

Whithout spending the big bucks to get a gas heater installed what other
options do I have?


When I was in my 12x26 garage stall I walled it in and insulated it and had
intentions of going the Modine Hotdawg route, While we were drywalling and
painting I confiscated the oil filled radiator space heater from the
basenment rec room as evening were already getting chilly. Never found a
reason to replace it. In our WI winters it would keep that shop toasty warm
and it was a safe method of heat around sawdust. All told $38 US and the
electric bill went up about $15 keeping at at 55 all the time.

Knothead

Buster (in Z9UMe.36357$vj.7288@pd7tw1no) said:

| Whithout spending the big bucks to get a gas heater installed what
| other options do I have?

If one of the walls faces south, build vertical solar heating panels.
I'm not familiar with your Calgary weather, but it worked well for me
in Minnesota where the coldest weather was accompanied by clear skies.

You'll like the operating cost :-)

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/solar.html

I agree with "Knothead". I have a well insulated loft with no central
heat for a workshop. I use one oil filled radiant electric heater to
bring it up to about 55 deg. After I turn on the lights, dust
collector and any tools its fine. I'm sure you have weather sealed
your garage door well to keep the heat in. Don't underestimate the
heat produced by all those lights and motors. In the end its the same
as an electric heater of the same wattage, all that power ends up as
heat.

Howard

I have used a kerosene heater with quite a bit of success. I also
supplement it, or replace it on milder days with a small electric cube
heater (pretty effective). However, I suspect the price of kero is going up
too.

At a previous address I installed a recycled forced air furnance that cost
very little. I purchased it second-hand from a fellow that had just done a
remodel ($25). It was a down-draft heater and a neighbor welded a stand
that raised it above the floor about 1 foot. Flue installation was easy in
the open-ceiling shed. The biggest challenge was plumbing in gas. The
whole system was very economical to install and use - and VERY effective in
the small shop.

By comparison, I live in south central Kansas. Our lowest winter
temperatures are usually above zero. Occasionally lower. However, we get a
lot of wind.

RonB

Pounding the pulpit in
nk.net,
Robert Lee did expound thusly:

I don't recall where I read about this, but I think it might have been an
issue of "Fine Woodworking".

I live in Sanoran Desert of Arizona, so "heat" is not something about
which we have a lot of concern. The opposite is true. "How do we keep
from burning up?"

The system used fueled by sawdust, shavings, small wood scraps from the
wood shop. If you can imagine a large cannister, with a six inch hole
cut and centered in both the top and bottom. My recollection was that
the "cannister" was approximately two feet in diameter, perhaps five
feet tall. The top was removable, so one could load the fuel. In the
center a pipe was inserted into the bottom hole, then fuel was loaded
and packed around it. The pipe could be anything from stove pipe to PVC,
just something which would not collapse from the fuel and the packing
pressure.

When the cannister was full, the "PVC" pipe was removed. This left a
perfect hole right through the middle. The top was secured. A stove pipe
attached to the top vented through the ceiling, (the longer the better to
allow heat transfer). The "cannister" sat on legs which allowed air to
flow. Then the fire was lit from the hole in the bottom, and it burned
from the inside, and of course, the combustion was the heat source.

My recollection is that the thing burned for about three or four days.
You would want to put in all kinds of safty precautions, to prevent
fire.., like making sure that there were no "open ports" from which
sparks could escape into the shop. Two or three cannisters were used,
so that while one was buring the others could be loaded.

I don't know if this helps, but I was impressed with the idea. If this
would stand up with today's rigid regulations, I have no idea. But if it
was me who needed heat for my shop.., I think I could devise a system
which would be both safe and dispose of my waste, while warming my shop.

I've built one of these; they're a great li'l system, IMHO. I've
forgotten where I obtained the plans
so I've posted 'em at:
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~amca...dust_Stove.htm

With apologies (and thanks) to whoever or wherever I got 'em from, of
course.

--
- Andy
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Diagonally parked in a parallel universe.

Woodstove comes to mind first.

HTH,
J

Solar heat from south facing windows can help a bunch and a woodstove
can work well also. Here's a group that's well worth joining if you are
thinking of wood heat.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WoodGas/
Go to message # search and put in #1 or #2 for the 'How to' stuff. Sam

Buster wrote:
Looking for some advice for the cold northern woodworks in the group.

Fall is just around the corner and after that winter. I've spent all summer
outfitting my shop and am looking forward to spending all winter freezing
out there! I'm currently in one half of an attached garage, a car will be
in the other half. The winters here in Calgary are semi-mild, we get huge
temperature fluctuations for our chinook winds (say 20 C in the course of a
day). The garage is insulated, but does not have a heater. From the past
year (when I insulated), I found that the garage can be somewhat comfortable
even on the very cold days of the year.

Whithout spending the big bucks to get a gas heater installed what other
options do I have?




http://shop.store.yahoo.com/air-n-wa...424shgahe.html

Home depot sells a similar unit approx $60 to $80 Cdn.
240 v, 20 amp ?, 4000 Watt ? don't remember exactly.
About a foot cubed in size.
Just called construction heaters around here.

I use one to heat a 12 x 20 shed in Manitoba.
I'm building a house at the lake, weekends/holidays.
Summer and Winter.
Lived and slept in the shed at -40 Deg temps.

http://www.mts.net/~lmlod/Cabinfront6.jpg

Solar heat.
You know those guys have spent a lot of quality time
in the bush during the winter.
Ever hear the expression "Freeze the nuts off a bridge"

I know it's not the cheapest way to go.. but, I'm planning on running tubing
thru the floor and using solar heated water to heat, or partially heat, the
shop.. and house. The collectors are the only real expense.. and, some
places offer rebates to upgrade. Don't remember what the payback was on the
one I installed about 25 years ago.. but, it sure worked well..even on
cloudy/overcast days.

Buster wrote:
Looking for some advice for the cold northern woodworks in the group.
=20
Fall is just around the corner and after that winter. I've spent all s=
ummer=20
outfitting my shop and am looking forward to spending all winter freezi=
ng=20
out there! I'm currently in one half of an attached garage, a car will=
be=20
in the other half. The winters here in Calgary are semi-mild, we get h=
uge=20
temperature fluctuations for our chinook winds (say 20 C in the course =
of a=20
day). The garage is insulated, but does not have a heater. From the p=
ast=20
year (when I insulated), I found that the garage can be somewhat comfor=
table=20
even on the very cold days of the year.
=20
Whithout spending the big bucks to get a gas heater installed what othe=
r=20
options do I have?
=20
=20
=20

I used a 56" baseboard heater -- added a thermostat. Works fine till=20
about 30 below.

The it's a little cool to finish things.


--=20
Will R.
Jewel Boxes and Wood Art
http://woodwork.pmccl.com
The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those=20
who have not got it.=94 George Bernard Shaw

In article Z9UMe.36357$vj.7288@pd7tw1no, Buster wrote:
Looking for some advice for the cold northern woodworks in the group.

Fall is just around the corner and after that winter. I've spent all summer
outfitting my shop and am looking forward to spending all winter freezing
out there! I'm currently in one half of an attached garage, a car will be
in the other half. The winters here in Calgary are semi-mild, we get huge
temperature fluctuations for our chinook winds (say 20 C in the course of a
day). The garage is insulated, but does not have a heater. From the past
year (when I insulated), I found that the garage can be somewhat comfortable
even on the very cold days of the year.

Whithout spending the big bucks to get a gas heater installed what other
options do I have?

Several:
1) a "little bucks" gas heater
2) a "non-gas" heater
3) "live with it" as is.

*GRIN*


Seriously ---
solar
electric
self-contained -- combustion or "catalytic"
kerosene
propane
fuel oil

Primary issue is 'how much' heat energy you need to provide.
Question 1 is how much it takes to keep things at the desired temperature.
(this is a measure of how good the insulation "isn't"
Question 2 is how fast you want to be able to warm the place up, from
whatever temperature you let it get down to, inside the garage.
3 hours of 'warm up' time calls for a smaller heater than a 30-minute
requirement.

There are heating/air-conditioning guides/worksheets available on the Internet
that will help you figure out sizing -- in terms of BTU/hr requirements.
then you select the type of unit that delivers that qty of heat at a price
you can afford.

"Robert Bonomi" wrote in message
...
In article Z9UMe.36357$vj.7288@pd7tw1no, Buster
wrote:
Looking for some advice for the cold northern woodworks in the group.

Fall is just around the corner and after that winter. I've spent all
summer
outfitting my shop and am looking forward to spending all winter freezing
out there! I'm currently in one half of an attached garage, a car will be
in the other half. The winters here in Calgary are semi-mild, we get huge
temperature fluctuations for our chinook winds (say 20 C in the course of
a
day). The garage is insulated, but does not have a heater. From the past
year (when I insulated), I found that the garage can be somewhat
comfortable
even on the very cold days of the year.

Whithout spending the big bucks to get a gas heater installed what other
options do I have?

Several:
1) a "little bucks" gas heater
2) a "non-gas" heater
3) "live with it" as is.

*GRIN*


Seriously ---
solar
electric
self-contained -- combustion or "catalytic"
kerosene
propane
fuel oil

Primary issue is 'how much' heat energy you need to provide.
Question 1 is how much it takes to keep things at the desired
temperature.
(this is a measure of how good the insulation "isn't"
Question 2 is how fast you want to be able to warm the place up, from
whatever temperature you let it get down to, inside the garage.
3 hours of 'warm up' time calls for a smaller heater than a 30-minute
requirement.

There are heating/air-conditioning guides/worksheets available on the
Internet
that will help you figure out sizing -- in terms of BTU/hr requirements.
then you select the type of unit that delivers that qty of heat at a price
you can afford.

I have found that

1. My "mistakes"

2. A wood stove


Are all the equipment necessary to provide an endless supply of heat here in
New England. An experienced woodworker further North might not be able to
cope, however.

"BFoelsch" wrote in message

I'm currently in one half of an attached garage, a car will be
in the other half.

I have found that

1. My "mistakes"

2. A wood stove


Are all the equipment necessary to provide an endless supply of heat here
in New England.

The OP is in Canada and the regulations may be different. Here, you cannot
have a solid fuel burning stove or heat in an attached garage.

Robert Bonomi wrote:

In article Z9UMe.36357$vj.7288@pd7tw1no, Buster wrote:

Looking for some advice for the cold northern woodworks in the group.

Fall is just around the corner and after that winter. I've spent all summer
outfitting my shop and am looking forward to spending all winter freezing
out there! I'm currently in one half of an attached garage, a car will be
in the other half. The winters here in Calgary are semi-mild, we get huge
temperature fluctuations for our chinook winds (say 20 C in the course of a
day). The garage is insulated, but does not have a heater. From the past
year (when I insulated), I found that the garage can be somewhat comfortable
even on the very cold days of the year.

Whithout spending the big bucks to get a gas heater installed what other
options do I have?


Several:
1) a "little bucks" gas heater
2) a "non-gas" heater
3) "live with it" as is.

[snip]
I can remember (only a year and a half ago) doing a glue up on a
smallish project and having an electric heater sitting on the workbench
doing its best to keep the glue and my fingers from freezing. Epiphany
time folks. WTF am I doing? Went for a 40K BTU Reznor (gas). Made the
hobby doable again. Worth 300 bucks? Ayup.
mahalo,
jo4hn

On Fri, 19 Aug 2005 13:48:02 -0400, WillR wrote:

Buster wrote:
Looking for some advice for the cold northern woodworks in the group.

Fall is just around the corner and after that winter. I've spent all summer
outfitting my shop and am looking forward to spending all winter freezing
out there! I'm currently in one half of an attached garage, a car will be
in the other half. The winters here in Calgary are semi-mild, we get huge
temperature fluctuations for our chinook winds (say 20 C in the course of a
day). The garage is insulated, but does not have a heater. From the past
year (when I insulated), I found that the garage can be somewhat comfortable
even on the very cold days of the year.

Whithout spending the big bucks to get a gas heater installed what other
options do I have?




I used a 56" baseboard heater -- added a thermostat. Works fine till
about 30 below.

Then it's a little cool to finish things.

no ****... except that glass of brandy..

Cold in California is when you have to put long pants on to pick lemons in your
yard..


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

mac davis wrote:
On Fri, 19 Aug 2005 13:48:02 -0400, WillR =
wrote:
=20
=20
Buster wrote:

Looking for some advice for the cold northern woodworks in the group.

Fall is just around the corner and after that winter. I've spent all =
summer=20
outfitting my shop and am looking forward to spending all winter freez=
ing=20
out there! I'm currently in one half of an attached garage, a car wil=
l be=20
in the other half. The winters here in Calgary are semi-mild, we get =
huge=20
temperature fluctuations for our chinook winds (say 20 C in the course=
of a=20
day). The garage is insulated, but does not have a heater. From the =
past=20
year (when I insulated), I found that the garage can be somewhat comfo=
rtable=20
even on the very cold days of the year.

Whithout spending the big bucks to get a gas heater installed what oth=
er=20
options do I have?




I used a 56" baseboard heater -- added a thermostat. Works fine till=20
about 30 below.

Then it's a little cool to finish things.
=20
=20
no ****... except that glass of brandy..
=20

Hic! huh? :-)

Cold in California is when you have to put long pants on to pick lemons=
in your
yard..

Saying rude things like that could get you in real trouble with a=20
"northerner". :-)


Send me your address and expect a load of tundra brewed ice cubes lichen =

and snow. That'll fix that d**n lemon tree.

lol



=20
=20
mac
=20
Please remove splinters before emailing


--=20
Will R.
Jewel Boxes and Wood Art
http://woodwork.pmccl.com
The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those=20
who have not got it.=94 George Bernard Shaw

On 24/08/2005 1:27 PM, mac davis wrote:

Cold in California is when you have to put long pants on to pick lemons in your
yard..

50° Fahrenheit (10°C) --- Californians shiver uncontrollably, Canadians
plant gardens.

35° Fahrenheit (1.6°C) --- Italian cars won't start, Canadians drive
with the windows down.

32° Fahrenheit (0°C) --- American water freezes, Canadian water gets
thicker.

0° Fahrenheit (-17.9°C) --- New York City landlords finally turn on the
heat, Canadians have the last barbecue of the season.

-60° Fahrenheit (-51°C) --- Mt. St. Helens freezes, Canadians Girl
Guides sell cookies door to door.

-100° Fahrenheit (-73°C) --- Santa Claus abandons the North Pole, Ottawa
opens the Rideau canal for skating.

-173° Fahrenheit (-114°C) --- Ethyl alcohol freezes, Canadians get
frustrated when they can't thaw the keg.

-460° Fahrenheit (-273°C) --- Absolute zero; all atomic motion stops,
Canadians start saying "cold, eh?"

-500° Fahrenheit (-295°C) --- Hell freezes over, Toronto Maple Leafs win
the Stanley Cup.

On 18/08/2005 12:30 AM, Buster wrote:

Whithout spending the big bucks to get a gas heater installed what other
options do I have?

Ceiling-mount electric radiant heater. Clean, quiet, reasonably efficient.

Wife got one from Lee Valley for So. Calif coast and it is appreciated
on winter mornings.

On Wed, 24 Aug 2005 14:47:56 -0400, Doug Payne
wrote:

On 18/08/2005 12:30 AM, Buster wrote:

Whithout spending the big bucks to get a gas heater installed what other
options do I have?

Ceiling-mount electric radiant heater. Clean, quiet, reasonably efficient.