Over on Olympus there is a thread on roughing gouges, their design and use.
It is a thread which has come up here amongst the Hoi Polloi as well, and
the same old positions are being restated. Might as well restate mine.

A roughing gouge is designed to remove a large shaving in a single pass, and
in spite of a long history of service to turners, its detractors seem to
feel that it is poorly designed for the task. I am not one of them, as I
regularly use and teach the use of the "Big Kahuna" 1 1/4 U-shaped Sorby and
the 1 3/8 shallow Sorby to 6 - 12th grade youngsters. The problem as
stated is the weakness of the tang, which should be no problem at all if the
gouge is properly applied to the task.

First, the gouge is not designed for great reach over the toolrest. That's
what bowl gouges are for. I'm sure I don't need to do the "Four Simple
Machines" demonstration which I give in 6th grade Physical Science labs to
remind turners that we are dealing with a fulcrum and lever, and the
mechanical advantage is heavily in favor of the operator when the overhang
is less than an inch. Keep it that way or chose another tool.

Second, bringing the wood to the gouge rather than the gouge to the wood, as
in scraping, relieves much of the force on the gouge, transferring it along
the tool instead. Keep the toolrest low, the handle of the tool lower, and
don't push into the wood, but allow the wood to contact it, peeling back
what you don't want. You can use the gouge anywhere along its edge, either
perpendicular to the piece or askew, bringing it in tangent to the turning,
then moving it in the downhill direction, allowing the wood to peel as you
move laterally, where the vector force is now along the tool. The sides of
the "U" can be used as an extremely stable skew on spindle turnings or on
flat or convex surfaces of faceplate (bowl) work, as long as you keep the
corner in trail and out of contact with the surface. The curvature of the
gouge is actually a help in taking larger bites, as it takes a progressively
deeper shaving when the curve is at the first point of contact with the
wood.

Third, you can use the "U" gouge as a _very_ wide parting tool or Bedan when
cutting tenons by laying it on its side on the rest and allowing the bevel
to ride the surface. This works even when the piece still has corners, but
it demands a gentle hand to present slowly initially, waiting until the
bevel rides tangent to the new surface to begin removing heavier shavings.

Now for that big shallow fingernail 1 3/8 gouge, which has most of the
benefits available to the "U" without the danger of catching a corner. It
can even be used inside shallow turnings with little danger as long as, of
course, the overhang is minimal, the handle is low, so as to transfer the
force longitudinally, and there's space to swing the handle laterally as you
approach the bottom. Deeper work, of course, favors the bowl gouge, with
its shorter bevel at the bottom.

If there's a proper mindset to turning, it has to be what old Frank Pain
said - cut the wood as it wants to be cut. When you do that, there's very
little force required on the handle, therefore the tang. And there are
_shavings_ coming off the tool, not dust.

In article ,
says...
.... snip
Keep the toolrest low, the handle of the tool lower, and
don't push into the wood, but allow the wood to contact it, peeling back
what you don't want.
.... snip

The tool rest low and the handle lower is right, I think. It also has
the advantage of allowing you to pin your lower hand against your hip
and move the tool with your lower body rather than your arms or hands.

But...

I've noticed that there are several machines out there whose tool rests
almost do not allow you to turn that way. The top surface is too
horizontal so that as you lower the handle the fulcrum moves from the
front edge of the tool rest to the back edge of the top surface of the
tool rest. The worst-shaped rest is, I think, on the new 16" Jet -- the
top surface is something like an inch wide so that with the handle down
and the rest 1/2" away from the work, the fulcrum is something over 1
1/2" away from the work. I don't understand how they did this.

Another machine with much the same problem is the Powermatic -- I think
that the top surface of the rest is narrower than the Jet (from memory)
but still a problem. Oneway, Woodfast, Stubby,..., have it right.

Bill

George wrote in message
...
If there's a proper mindset to turning, it has to be what old Frank Pain
said - cut the wood as it wants to be cut. When you do that, there's very
little force required on the handle, therefore the tang. And there are
_shavings_ coming off the tool, not dust.


I believe he also said, "Failing that, try to cut it in a way it doesn't
mind very much" :-)

You give a good description of tool use.

John Jordan

Hi George,

Might I ask what site this "Olympus" is on? It sounds
as if it would be intersting to explore.

TIA


"George" wrote in message ...
Over on Olympus there is a thread on roughing gouges, their design and use.

http://www.woodcentral.com/cgi-bin/turning.pl?index

It's a members only place to answer, ok for casual reading.

Personally, I'm with Groucho - don't care to belong to a club that would
accept people like me as members.

"Adrien" wrote in message
m...
Hi George,

Might I ask what site this "Olympus" is on? It sounds
as if it would be intersting to explore.

TIA


"George" wrote in message
...
Over on Olympus there is a thread on roughing gouges, their design and
use.

Hey George, I guess you wouldn't accept, but if there's a possibility,
I'd like to submit your name to Kevin Miller for C.O.C., Younger Coots
Division.
************
Forgive my stepping out of character and I know it will infuriate you,
but I must say yours was a very good post on how to use a roughing
gouge. Arch, COC,1st.

Fortiter,

You must be thinking of some other guy. I'm really very classy and
even-tempered.

Even when I go to steady the rim on a bowl today and rip my index and middle
finger on a sharp edge for the #%#@ hundredth time. And I even own a Oneway
steadyrest. Good thing they've got those fingertip bandaids.

"Arch" wrote in message
...
Hey George, I guess you wouldn't accept, but if there's a possibility,
I'd like to submit your name to Kevin Miller for C.O.C., Younger Coots
Division.
************
Forgive my stepping out of character and I know it will infuriate you,
but I must say yours was a very good post on how to use a roughing
gouge. Arch, COC,1st.

Fortiter,