Hi All,
I have just stripped the wallpaper from my dining room and have
discovered some problems with the plasterwork. My house is a victorian
house and the problem wall has a chimney breast and has also been damp
proofed. The damp proofing area is fine (and not damp), the plaster is
strong and smooth, but my problems are mostly with the chimney breast
and the old plaster above the damp course.
The old plaster seems to be a browny colour (as opposed to the pink of
the newer stuff over the damp course), and seems very soft and
crumbly. When removing a couple of screws from the wall, big holes
formed. I can tell that the plaster is not well attached - it crumbles
away quite easily, and I suspect quite large sections could be easily
removed.

So, what should I do? Fill the holes, and then skim the wall, or pull
off all the loose plaster and replaster the wall? How much would I
expect to pay a plasterer to patch this up and skim? The wall is about
3 metres by 2 metres (up to the picture rail which I'm not currently
planning to remove - or would I need to remove this?).
Any advice very much appreciated.

Secondly, under the wallpaper on the outside wall was a thin layer of
polystyrene. Would this have been attached to the wallpaper
originally? What is it for? Insulation maybe, or is it related to the
damp course?

Thanks
Matthew

"Matt Durkin" wrote in message
om...
Hi All,
Secondly, under the wallpaper on the outside wall was a thin layer of
polystyrene. Would this have been attached to the wallpaper
originally? What is it for? Insulation maybe, or is it related to the
damp course?

Thanks
Matthew

I can't help with the plaster questions but the polystyrene could well be
what was fashionable back in the 60s and 70s on older houses where the
walls, even the plaster, was pretty rough and uneven. You could buy
polystyrene 'wallpaper' which you put on the walls first to give an even
surface over which to place 'proper' wallpaper.

John.

In article ,
(Matt Durkin) writes:
Hi All,
I have just stripped the wallpaper from my dining room and have
discovered some problems with the plasterwork. My house is a victorian
house and the problem wall has a chimney breast and has also been damp
proofed. The damp proofing area is fine (and not damp), the plaster is
strong and smooth, but my problems are mostly with the chimney breast
and the old plaster above the damp course.
The old plaster seems to be a browny colour (as opposed to the pink of
the newer stuff over the damp course), and seems very soft and
crumbly. When removing a couple of screws from the wall, big holes
formed. I can tell that the plaster is not well attached - it crumbles
away quite easily, and I suspect quite large sections could be easily
removed.

This sounds like new plaster which has been damp for a long time.
Where is it located, on the chimney breast?
Is the fireplace closed up, and if so, is it ventilated bottom
and top of the flue?

So, what should I do? Fill the holes, and then skim the wall, or pull
off all the loose plaster and replaster the wall? How much would I

You need to work out why it's damp and fix that, and then
pull it off, let it dry if it's soaking wet and replaster.

expect to pay a plasterer to patch this up and skim? The wall is about
3 metres by 2 metres (up to the picture rail which I'm not currently
planning to remove - or would I need to remove this?).

I would guess that scratch and finish coat will take it
over half a day's work (and I doubt you'll get a plasterer
to turn up for just half a day anyway). If you're paying
for a day's work, then you might want to search out any
other bits of reskimming you want doing. Price depends on
location, but you are probably looking at £200/day plus
materials (which don't cost much).

--
Andrew Gabriel

"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message
...

I would guess that scratch and finish coat will take it
over half a day's work (and I doubt you'll get a plasterer
to turn up for just half a day anyway). If you're paying
for a day's work, then you might want to search out any
other bits of reskimming you want doing. Price depends on
location, but you are probably looking at £200/day plus
materials (which don't cost much).

--
Andrew Gabriel

Do plasterers make about 50K a year then?

(Andrew Gabriel) wrote in message ...
In article ,
(Matt Durkin) writes:
Hi All,
I have just stripped the wallpaper from my dining room and have
discovered some problems with the plasterwork. My house is a victorian
house and the problem wall has a chimney breast and has also been damp
proofed. The damp proofing area is fine (and not damp), the plaster is
strong and smooth, but my problems are mostly with the chimney breast
and the old plaster above the damp course.
The old plaster seems to be a browny colour (as opposed to the pink of
the newer stuff over the damp course), and seems very soft and
crumbly. When removing a couple of screws from the wall, big holes
formed. I can tell that the plaster is not well attached - it crumbles
away quite easily, and I suspect quite large sections could be easily
removed.

This sounds like new plaster which has been damp for a long time.
Where is it located, on the chimney breast?
Is the fireplace closed up, and if so, is it ventilated bottom
and top of the flue?

The new (pink) plaster is very solid and doesn't feel damp or cold.
The fireplace isn't closed up, it has an old wrought iron fireplace.
We don't ever use the fire though = I suspect I'd have to have the
chimney swept. I'm guessing the fire will have been used extensively
during the life of the plaster. Most of the loose plaster is on the
front of the chimney breast above the fire.

So, what should I do? Fill the holes, and then skim the wall, or pull
off all the loose plaster and replaster the wall? How much would I

You need to work out why it's damp and fix that, and then
pull it off, let it dry if it's soaking wet and replaster.


The old plaster isn't damp - or at least when it crumbles away it is
very dry and the brickwork behind is not wet in any way. I think the
plaster is just very old! I have been reading a few other threads
about victorian houses and it seems this is quite common. The plaster
in my lounge above the radiator was just the same - I guess the heat
dries out the plaster and it looses cohesion with the wall. From what
people have said on other threads (about trying to fix anything to
these victorian plastered walls), I think it's normal to patch up the
holes and skim. What do you think?

expect to pay a plasterer to patch this up and skim? The wall is about
3 metres by 2 metres (up to the picture rail which I'm not currently
planning to remove - or would I need to remove this?).

I would guess that scratch and finish coat will take it
over half a day's work (and I doubt you'll get a plasterer
to turn up for just half a day anyway). If you're paying
for a day's work, then you might want to search out any
other bits of reskimming you want doing. Price depends on
location, but you are probably looking at £200/day plus
materials (which don't cost much).

This is good news. I was expecting it might be much more. If I can get
a plasterer in for 200 quid, I'll probably do that. I'll pull of
anything loose and then he can apply new. This way it will make it a
nice day's job and I'll have nice smooth walls at the end of it. Would
I need to remove the skirting boards and picture rails or could he
plaster the section inbetween. Both have been there a long time and
might be a challenge to remove...

Thanks for the advice!

In article , John Smith says...

"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message
...

I would guess that scratch and finish coat will take it
over half a day's work (and I doubt you'll get a plasterer
to turn up for just half a day anyway). If you're paying
for a day's work, then you might want to search out any
other bits of reskimming you want doing. Price depends on
location, but you are probably looking at £200/day plus
materials (which don't cost much).

--
Andrew Gabriel

Do plasterers make about 50K a year then?

Only if they work 5 days a week for 50 weeks.

--
Hywel

Big Brother Petition - Better TV Wanted!
http://www.petitiononline.com/BBFlood/

In article ,
"John Smith" writes:

"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message
...

I would guess that scratch and finish coat will take it
over half a day's work (and I doubt you'll get a plasterer
to turn up for just half a day anyway). If you're paying
for a day's work, then you might want to search out any
other bits of reskimming you want doing. Price depends on
location, but you are probably looking at £200/day plus
materials (which don't cost much).

Do plasterers make about 50K a year then?

Most of them won't touch half or one day jobs at all IME.
For a longer job, I would expect the price to be lower.
Take home pay != labour price charged for work.

--
Andrew Gabriel

(Andrew Gabriel) wrote in message ...
In article ,
(Matt Durkin) writes:
Hi All,
I have just stripped the wallpaper from my dining room and have
discovered some problems with the plasterwork. My house is a victorian
house and the problem wall has a chimney breast and has also been damp
proofed. The damp proofing area is fine (and not damp), the plaster is
strong and smooth, but my problems are mostly with the chimney breast
and the old plaster above the damp course.
The old plaster seems to be a browny colour (as opposed to the pink of
the newer stuff over the damp course), and seems very soft and
crumbly. When removing a couple of screws from the wall, big holes
formed. I can tell that the plaster is not well attached - it crumbles
away quite easily, and I suspect quite large sections could be easily
removed.

This sounds like new plaster which has been damp for a long time.
Where is it located, on the chimney breast?
Is the fireplace closed up, and if so, is it ventilated bottom
and top of the flue?

So, what should I do? Fill the holes, and then skim the wall, or pull
off all the loose plaster and replaster the wall? How much would I

You need to work out why it's damp and fix that, and then
pull it off, let it dry if it's soaking wet and replaster.

expect to pay a plasterer to patch this up and skim? The wall is about
3 metres by 2 metres (up to the picture rail which I'm not currently
planning to remove - or would I need to remove this?).

I would guess that scratch and finish coat will take it
over half a day's work (and I doubt you'll get a plasterer
to turn up for just half a day anyway). If you're paying
for a day's work, then you might want to search out any
other bits of reskimming you want doing. Price depends on
location, but you are probably looking at £200/day plus
materials (which don't cost much).


more like 100+ materials - and let the plasterer tell you where to get
the plaster and what kind. There are always folks you can get in for
nearer 40 a day... Why not diy?


Regards, NT

(N. Thornton) wrote in message . com...
(Andrew Gabriel) wrote in message ...
In article ,
(Matt Durkin) writes:
Hi All,
I have just stripped the wallpaper from my dining room and have
discovered some problems with the plasterwork. My house is a victorian
house and the problem wall has a chimney breast and has also been damp
proofed. The damp proofing area is fine (and not damp), the plaster is
strong and smooth, but my problems are mostly with the chimney breast
and the old plaster above the damp course.
The old plaster seems to be a browny colour (as opposed to the pink of
the newer stuff over the damp course), and seems very soft and
crumbly. When removing a couple of screws from the wall, big holes
formed. I can tell that the plaster is not well attached - it crumbles
away quite easily, and I suspect quite large sections could be easily
removed.

This sounds like new plaster which has been damp for a long time.
Where is it located, on the chimney breast?
Is the fireplace closed up, and if so, is it ventilated bottom
and top of the flue?

So, what should I do? Fill the holes, and then skim the wall, or pull
off all the loose plaster and replaster the wall? How much would I

You need to work out why it's damp and fix that, and then
pull it off, let it dry if it's soaking wet and replaster.

expect to pay a plasterer to patch this up and skim? The wall is about
3 metres by 2 metres (up to the picture rail which I'm not currently
planning to remove - or would I need to remove this?).

I would guess that scratch and finish coat will take it
over half a day's work (and I doubt you'll get a plasterer
to turn up for just half a day anyway). If you're paying
for a day's work, then you might want to search out any
other bits of reskimming you want doing. Price depends on
location, but you are probably looking at £200/day plus
materials (which don't cost much).


more like 100+ materials - and let the plasterer tell you where to get
the plaster and what kind. There are always folks you can get in for
nearer 40 a day... Why not diy?


Regards, NT

Thanks! I may yet DIY, but at the moment I'm just a little concerned
about pulling the plaster and the whole wall coming down. I'm not sure
I'd be able to do a whole wall - the biggest area I've plastered was
about 3'x1' after I had to rebuild the wall under my bay window (long
story - removed window to get sofa in and wall came away with
windowsill. uPVC guys had literally glued the sill to the bricks and
the glue was stronger than the 100 year old cement!)

Anyway - I digress! If I am going to DIY, what kind of plaster do I
need to apply straight to the brick face (this is now visible in a few
small places and if I continue will be what I am plastering to
mostly)? I used wicks multi-purpose stuff last time but that would be
pricey for a large area. Will the plaster just stick to the brick, or
will I need something else there for it to stick to?

Thanks
Matthew

In article ,
(Matt Durkin) writes:

Thanks! I may yet DIY, but at the moment I'm just a little concerned
about pulling the plaster and the whole wall coming down. I'm not sure
I'd be able to do a whole wall - the biggest area I've plastered was

If you can avoid taking the plaster off the corners of the
chimney breast, it will make replastering the frount much
easier. Obviously, you can't avoid it if that plaster is
damaged too, but if it's OK, then don't get too carried
away with the plaster removal. When you remove a piece of
plaster, the next bit will always have come away from the
wall slightly -- if you don't stop somewhere, you will end
up stripping the whole room.

about 3'x1' after I had to rebuild the wall under my bay window (long
story - removed window to get sofa in and wall came away with
windowsill. uPVC guys had literally glued the sill to the bricks and
the glue was stronger than the 100 year old cement!)

Anyway - I digress! If I am going to DIY, what kind of plaster do I
need to apply straight to the brick face (this is now visible in a few
small places and if I continue will be what I am plastering to
mostly)?

I use bonding coat for the scratch coat if the wall's dry, and
multifinish for the finish coat.

I used wicks multi-purpose stuff last time but that would be
pricey for a large area. Will the plaster just stick to the brick, or
will I need something else there for it to stick to?

You paint the brick with diluted PVA glue before plastering.
You will probably need to do two coats unless your chimney
breast is built with engineering bricks (most unlikely;-).
Get plenty of PVA solution into the edge of the ajoining
plaster too, and down any tiny crack where it may have come
away from the wall when the neighbouring piece was removed.
Ideally, you start plastering just before the last PVA coat
has completely dried.

--
Andrew Gabriel

(Matt Durkin) wrote in message . com...
(N. Thornton) wrote in message . com...

more like 100+ materials - and let the plasterer tell you where to get
the plaster and what kind. There are always folks you can get in for
nearer 40 a day... Why not diy?


Regards, NT

Thanks! I may yet DIY, but at the moment I'm just a little concerned
about pulling the plaster and the whole wall coming down. I'm not sure
I'd be able to do a whole wall - the biggest area I've plastered was
about 3'x1' after I had to rebuild the wall under my bay window (long
story - removed window to get sofa in and wall came away with
windowsill. uPVC guys had literally glued the sill to the bricks and
the glue was stronger than the 100 year old cement!)

Anyway - I digress! If I am going to DIY, what kind of plaster do I
need to apply straight to the brick face (this is now visible in a few
small places and if I continue will be what I am plastering to
mostly)? I used wicks multi-purpose stuff last time but that would be
pricey for a large area. Will the plaster just stick to the brick, or
will I need something else there for it to stick to?

Thanks
Matthew

Common method: 1:1:6 render onto the brickwork, and just the last 3 mm
is plaster. I'm sure there are other ways to do it too!

Regards, NT

"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message
...

away from the wall when the neighbouring piece was removed.
Ideally, you start plastering just before the last PVA coat
has completely dried.

--
Andrew Gabriel

Don't you need a long piece of wood as a straight edge to use at the end to
smooth things out?

In article ,
"John Smith" writes:

"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message
...

away from the wall when the neighbouring piece was removed.
Ideally, you start plastering just before the last PVA coat
has completely dried.

Don't you need a long piece of wood as a straight edge to use at the end to
smooth things out?

Yes, to create a flat scratch coat.
You use the trowel to smooth out the finish coat though.

--
Andrew Gabriel

Ah, thanks for that. I always thought that the wood was used to level the
final surface. Has anyone used these seemingly extra big flat trowels for
plastering sold in places like B&Q? Are they ideal or too big?

J.


"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"John Smith" writes:

"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message
...

away from the wall when the neighbouring piece was removed.
Ideally, you start plastering just before the last PVA coat
has completely dried.

Don't you need a long piece of wood as a straight edge to use at the end
to
smooth things out?

Yes, to create a flat scratch coat.
You use the trowel to smooth out the finish coat though.

--
Andrew Gabriel

"N. Thornton" wrote in message
om...

Matthew

Common method: 1:1:6 render onto the brickwork, and just the last 3 mm
is plaster. I'm sure there are other ways to do it too!

Regards, NT

Excuse my dummies question... but what is render? Isn't that plaster?

J.

In article ,
"John Smith" writes:

Excuse my dummies question... but what is render? Isn't that plaster?

I don't know the strict definition.
My guess would be that _render_ covers any type of solid surface
finishing applied after a wall is built (maybe including plaster),
but _plaster_ is limited to a surface finished with plaster.

--
Andrew Gabriel

"John Smith" wrote in message ...
"N. Thornton" wrote in message
om...

Common method: 1:1:6 render onto the brickwork, and just the last 3 mm
is plaster. I'm sure there are other ways to do it too!

Excuse my dummies question... but what is render? Isn't that plaster?

no, its cement mortar, 1 part by volume cement, 1 part lime and 6
parts sand. But as youve seen, there are various ways to do it.


Regards, NT

John Smith wrote:

"N. Thornton" wrote in message
om...


no, its cement mortar, 1 part by volume cement, 1 part lime and 6
parts sand. But as youve seen, there are various ways to do it.


Regards, NT


That to me, as a newbie to all this, would make sense as it would seem to be
more solid as an 'undercoat' to a finished plaster than using plaster for
both undercoat and finish.


It is, and as often used as such, but it takes longer to go off and is
more expensive.

'loaded' plaster - bonding plaster - is more often used.


John.

In article ,
"John Smith" writes:
"N. Thornton" wrote in message
om...

no, its cement mortar, 1 part by volume cement, 1 part lime and 6
parts sand. But as youve seen, there are various ways to do it.

That to me, as a newbie to all this, would make sense as it would seem to be
more solid as an 'undercoat' to a finished plaster than using plaster for
both undercoat and finish.

You need to wait at least 24 hours before you can apply finish
coat plaster to sand and cement scratch coat. Mixing up sand
and cement (and lime if you like it) is also much more work than
mixing up plaster (it's heavy, and you'll need a cement mixer
for any reasonable wall area to be covered -- I do it with a
shovel in a wheelbarrow, but that's not recommended unless you
are built like Arnie, which I'm not). For these reasons, it
isn't preferred unless you are looking for some particular
property property of it, such as working on damp walls.
Also, a harder scratch coat is not necessarily a good thing.

--
Andrew Gabriel

"N. Thornton" wrote in message
om...

no, its cement mortar, 1 part by volume cement, 1 part lime and 6
parts sand. But as youve seen, there are various ways to do it.


Regards, NT

That to me, as a newbie to all this, would make sense as it would seem to be
more solid as an 'undercoat' to a finished plaster than using plaster for
both undercoat and finish.

John.