Hi,

I am a student and may some day take up something in the broadcast
industry, anyway my question(s) aren't about that. I live at home
with my parents and I have been trying to figure out how the
electrics in the house work. I have a few questions though...

1. The incoming supply is from an underground cable which comes into
one of those white boxes mounted on the wall of the 20 year old
extension. The incoming power goes into the 100A electricity company
fuse and the meter, two tails and an earth lead then go through wall
into (I presume) a MEM box with a switch on it. Is this just a switch
or some sort of protection device (ELCD?)? It seems to knock the entire
electrics out for the house when flicked.

2. From the MEM switch (I presume at least -- cables in the wall) there
is a long piece of big (16mm) twin and earth which goes up into the
extension loft and then through it (clipped to a joist) and then
goes down under the stairs where the three CUs are. The wire's outer
insulation has been stripped away and the red and black wires go into
what I believe is a Henley box... However the earth conductor of the
twin and earth has simply been left clipped where the outer insulation
has been taken off. So where's my earth gone... I can see one piece
of earth linking the two smaller CUs and a piece going to a pipe stub
coming out of the floor (presumably for equi bonding?), but assuming
the mains is coming solely into the Henley box (which has three sets
of tails of various diameters going to the CUs) then where is the
primary CU getting earth from... surely not from the copper pipe stud
it is linked to?

________________ __________
| || |
| [][][][][][] T || [][][] T |
| || |
---------------- ----------
# || || #
========)#(===={HENLEY} #
# || #
# _||___#
# | |
# | [] T |
# |______|
#
/I\

Hopefully that will render with a fixed width font... # is earth
wiring, === is the T+E and the || is single tails. Some of the wiring
comes out of the wall and then into the bottom of the consumer unit,
most of this is for the extension, presumably wires for the rest of
the house come through the back (as could another earth I guess).
After looking in the extension loft there is a single piece of earth
wire coming from the CU (I think) presumably going towards the bathroom
but again this is presumably for bonding.

So primarily I am want to know how else we could get an earth? Is having
a great big piece of T+E of about 20M carrying all the hoses power to
the CU bad? What kind of earthing is in use - TN-S or TN-C-S (there was
some marking in the white box but it's faded... I'll look in the light
tomorrow)?

3. We want to re-run power to the garage (used to be a piece of T+E
clipped to the wall(!)) and are likely to use SWA cable, the garage
currently shares a feed with the ring main in the extension (I think,
need to recheck this maybe) and assuming we simply replaced the
existing cable run (currently terminated in an IP rated switch for
the water feature) and added a CU in the garage... Does the garage
need it's own earth spike or can we use three core SWA cable and take
a feed from the house's earth?

4. Would running power to the garage be do-able under the new part P
regs, also out of interest would replacing the CU be do-able with part
P... As I understand it, it costs more to have it inspected that it
would to get a contractor in?

Thanks in advance, I don't really have a point in this post, we are
not planning any major work and although my dad and I are competent
we'd prolly get a sparky in to do major rewiring anyways. I am just
curious thats all.

--
Regards,
Aaron.

Aaron wrote:

Hi,

I am a student and may some day take up something in the broadcast
industry, anyway my question(s) aren't about that. I live at home
with my parents and I have been trying to figure out how the
electrics in the house work. I have a few questions though...

1. The incoming supply is from an underground cable which comes into
one of those white boxes mounted on the wall of the 20 year old
extension. The incoming power goes into the 100A electricity company
fuse and the meter, two tails and an earth lead then go through wall
into (I presume) a MEM box with a switch on it. Is this just a switch
or some sort of protection device (ELCD?)? It seems to knock the entire
electrics out for the house when flicked.

Its the master breaker for the house. If it has a test button in it ists
likely also an RCD.

Its use is to isolate all teh non-transco type bits of wire so that yiu
can fifddle with your part P without kiling yourself ;-)

2. From the MEM switch (I presume at least -- cables in the wall) there
is a long piece of big (16mm) twin and earth which goes up into the
extension loft and then through it (clipped to a joist) and then
goes down under the stairs where the three CUs are. The wire's outer
insulation has been stripped away and the red and black wires go into
what I believe is a Henley box... However the earth conductor of the
twin and earth has simply been left clipped where the outer insulation
has been taken off. So where's my earth gone... I can see one piece
of earth linking the two smaller CUs and a piece going to a pipe stub
coming out of the floor (presumably for equi bonding?), but assuming
the mains is coming solely into the Henley box (which has three sets
of tails of various diameters going to the CUs) then where is the
primary CU getting earth from... surely not from the copper pipe stud
it is linked to?

________________ __________
| || |
| [][][][][][] T || [][][] T |
| || |
---------------- ----------
# || || #
========)#(===={HENLEY} #
# || #
# _||___#
# | |
# | [] T |
# |______|
#
/I\

Hopefully that will render with a fixed width font... # is earth
wiring, === is the T+E and the || is single tails. Some of the wiring
comes out of the wall and then into the bottom of the consumer unit,
most of this is for the extension, presumably wires for the rest of
the house come through the back (as could another earth I guess).
After looking in the extension loft there is a single piece of earth
wire coming from the CU (I think) presumably going towards the bathroom
but again this is presumably for bonding.

So primarily I am want to know how else we could get an earth? Is having
a great big piece of T+E of about 20M carrying all the hoses power to
the CU bad? What kind of earthing is in use - TN-S or TN-C-S (there was
some marking in the white box but it's faded... I'll look in the light
tomorrow)?

3. We want to re-run power to the garage (used to be a piece of T+E
clipped to the wall(!)) and are likely to use SWA cable, the garage
currently shares a feed with the ring main in the extension (I think,
need to recheck this maybe) and assuming we simply replaced the
existing cable run (currently terminated in an IP rated switch for
the water feature) and added a CU in the garage... Does the garage
need it's own earth spike or can we use three core SWA cable and take
a feed from the house's earth?


I'd do both frankly.

4. Would running power to the garage be do-able under the new part P
regs, also out of interest would replacing the CU be do-able with part
P... As I understand it, it costs more to have it inspected that it
would to get a contractor in?


Sure. Just do not tell them you are doing it or have done it.

Thanks in advance, I don't really have a point in this post, we are
not planning any major work and although my dad and I are competent
we'd prolly get a sparky in to do major rewiring anyways. I am just
curious thats all.


Take time to thoroughly understand what you have - this seems to be the
first step - pay heed to sesnible safety advice and ignore the
regulation junkies, and just get on with it.

Most electricians are 97% gibbon, genetically speakiung, which is
silghtly less than the average 'shed junkie' DIY makeover tosser, for
whom most regulations are intended.

Reedmber rulse are made ffor teh 1% who need proteting from themselves,
and enforced by those of below average intelligence, ino rder to give
them gainful employment.

I spent about 6 weeks trying to get a bloody FENSA certificate on a
window in the house I was selling: I wish I had lied and said 'it was
installed with the others pre 1985' or whatever.

What the BCO don't see, he can't get upset over.

Aaron wrote:

1. The incoming supply is from an underground cable which comes into
one of those white boxes mounted on the wall of the 20 year old
extension. The incoming power goes into the 100A electricity company
fuse and the meter, two tails and an earth lead then go through wall
into (I presume) a MEM box with a switch on it. Is this just a switch
or some sort of protection device (ELCD?)? It seems to knock the
entire
electrics out for the house when flicked.

Might be ELCB, firemans switch, RCD, switchfuse, I dont know, havent
seen it.


2. From the MEM switch (I presume at least -- cables in the wall)
there
is a long piece of big (16mm) twin and earth which goes up into the
extension loft and then through it (clipped to a joist) and then
goes down under the stairs where the three CUs are. The wire's outer
insulation has been stripped away and the red and black wires go into
what I believe is a Henley box... However the earth conductor of the
twin and earth has simply been left clipped where the outer
insulation
has been taken off.

what does that mean, do you mean its not connected?


So where's my earth gone... I can see one piece
of earth linking the two smaller CUs and a piece going to a pipe stub
coming out of the floor (presumably for equi bonding?),

that'll be yer earth rod.


but assuming
the mains is coming solely into the Henley box (which has three sets
of tails of various diameters going to the CUs) then where is the
primary CU getting earth from... surely not from the copper pipe stud
it is linked to?

yup


________________ __________
| || |
| [][][][][][] T || [][][] T |
| || |
---------------- ----------
# || || #
========)#(===={HENLEY} #
# || #
# _||___#
# | |
# | [] T |
# |______|
#
/I\

Hopefully that will render with a fixed width font... # is earth
wiring, === is the T+E and the || is single tails. Some of the wiring
comes out of the wall and then into the bottom of the consumer unit,
most of this is for the extension, presumably wires for the rest of
the house come through the back (as could another earth I guess).
After looking in the extension loft there is a single piece of earth
wire coming from the CU (I think) presumably going towards the
bathroom
but again this is presumably for bonding.

So primarily I am want to know how else we could get an earth?

whats wrong with the present earth?


Is having
a great big piece of T+E of about 20M carrying all the hoses power to
the CU bad?

why would it be? What do you think is carrying the power from your
naerest town on wooden poles? Since you have appear to have TT I'm
guessing youre out in the country.


What kind of earthing is in use - TN-S or TN-C-S (there was
some marking in the white box but it's faded... I'll look in the
light
tomorrow)?

TT


3. We want to re-run power to the garage (used to be a piece of T+E
clipped to the wall(!))

why the (!)?


and are likely to use SWA cable, the garage
currently shares a feed with the ring main in the extension (I think,
need to recheck this maybe) and assuming we simply replaced the
existing cable run (currently terminated in an IP rated switch for
the water feature) and added a CU in the garage... Does the garage
need it's own earth spike or can we use three core SWA cable and take
a feed from the house's earth?

im not even going there, expect nonsense over that one.


not planning any major work and although my dad and I are competent

he is? Are you? I dont know.


NT

Aaron wrote:
Hi,

I am a student and may some day take up something in the broadcast
industry,

If it's technical don't bother, there won't be such a thing as
'Broadcast Engineering' before long, it's rapidly getting consumed into
'IT'.

anyway my question(s) aren't about that. I live at home
with my parents and I have been trying to figure out how the
electrics in the house work. I have a few questions though...

Have a read of this:-

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Book/1.1.htm

It gives quite a good overview (IMHO) of electrical practice, though I'm
sure someone will be along here soon with a better on-line reference.

--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply

In article ,
Mark Carver wrote:
I am a student and may some day take up something in the broadcast
industry,

If it's technical don't bother, there won't be such a thing as
'Broadcast Engineering' before long, it's rapidly getting consumed into
'IT'.

Some of it might be. But installation/ maintenance will always be required.
You can't make the actual programmes using 'IT' - apart from cartoons and
special FX, possibly.

--
*I yell because I care

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Mark Carver wrote:

I am a student and may some day take up something in the broadcast
industry,


If it's technical don't bother, there won't be such a thing as
'Broadcast Engineering' before long, it's rapidly getting consumed into
'IT'.


Some of it might be. But installation/ maintenance will always be required.

It will, but I come from the installation/equip supply side of the
business, and technical knowledge (as you and I might know it) is hard
to find these days. I remember turning up at the 'South Bank' with a Tek
VM-700 test set a couple of years ago, all the engineers (but one)
glazed over at the sight of it.

You can't make the actual programmes using 'IT' - apart from cartoons and
special FX, possibly.

Very true, but that's operational. That not withstanding, technically
qualified staff are still needed to make proper quality productions, how
many 'apprentices' are there in your craft ?

--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.

In article ,
Mark Carver wrote:
If it's technical don't bother, there won't be such a thing as
'Broadcast Engineering' before long, it's rapidly getting consumed
into 'IT'.

Some of it might be. But installation/ maintenance will always be
required.

It will, but I come from the installation/equip supply side of the
business, and technical knowledge (as you and I might know it) is hard
to find these days.

That's true. One company I freelance for were having real problems to find
general purpose engineers. Who would have to work shifts.

I remember turning up at the 'South Bank' with a Tek
VM-700 test set a couple of years ago, all the engineers (but one)
glazed over at the sight of it.

If you mean LWT, are you saying they don't own all the necessary test gear
these days? Nothing surprises me anymore...

You can't make the actual programmes using 'IT' - apart from cartoons
and special FX, possibly.

Very true, but that's operational.

In terms of production as I know it, IT is restricted to post. And is so
specialised that it still needs dedicated personnel. After all, knowing
how to 'drive' something isn't the same as knowing the road it needs to go
down. ;-)

An editor still needs an eye for editing - regardless of the mechanics -
as does a dubbing mixer.

That not withstanding, technically qualified staff are still needed to
make proper quality productions, how many 'apprentices' are there in
your craft ?

Ones who had a decent broad based training I got from the BBC? And as
Thames did?

None.

--
*It is wrong to ever split an infinitive *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Mark Carver wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
You can't make the actual programmes using 'IT' - apart from cartoons and
special FX, possibly.
Very true, but that's operational. That not withstanding, technically
qualified staff are still needed to make proper quality productions, how
many 'apprentices' are there in your craft ?

Remote-control cameras in studio, very high bandwidth links to India or
China.

You'd need a dog (to make sure no-one touched the cameras) and a man (to
feed the dog) but that's about it.

Owain

In article ,
Owain wrote:
You can't make the actual programmes using 'IT' - apart from cartoons
and special FX, possibly.

Very true, but that's operational. That not withstanding, technically
qualified staff are still needed to make proper quality productions,
how many 'apprentices' are there in your craft ?

Remote-control cameras in studio, very high bandwidth links to India or
China.

Although hot head cameras do, of course, exist, and have been used in
simple stuff like news where the cameras are stationary, or on the end of
a manned jib, the idea of completely remote controlled pedestals of the
type used on studio drama like bits of Coronation Street, Eastenders, etc
is rather far fetched. And it's not even as if TV cameramen are that well
paid these days.

And a remote control camera would be pointless on location drama - it
would need more people to move it and set it up on location than is needed
to operate it. Then there's the problem of communication between talent,
director and cameraman. They need a pretty intimate relationship to
produce satisfactory stuff.

I'm also trying to envisage all those remote controlled lights getting
themselves out of the van and setting up. And plugging themselves in. ;-)

You'd need a dog (to make sure no-one touched the cameras) and a man (to
feed the dog) but that's about it.

The dog handler would probably cost more. ;-)

--
*I'm not being rude. You're just insignificant

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Owain wrote:

Remote-control cameras in studio, very high bandwidth links to India or
China.

You'd need a dog (to make sure no-one touched the cameras) and a man (to
feed the dog) but that's about it.

Apply to ITV for a job on their management team :-)

As Dave P says that's impractical for drama or sports production.

What is threatened these days is original production, it's all too easy
to put 30 remote cameras in a building or location and hey-presto you've
got Big Brother, Fame Academy, or I'm a Non Entity Get me Out, hours and
hours of telly (on digital channels 24/7) for bugger all cost.
(I should know, I was involved in setting up the original Dutch Big
Brother house)

Proper telly costs, unfortunately there is not a proportionate increase
in available revenue with the current expansion of channels, because the
advertising cake (and licence fee) are more or less static.

Don't expect things to improve !
--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply

What is threatened these days is original production, it's all too easy
to put 30 remote cameras in a building or location and hey-presto you've
got Big Brother, Fame Academy, or I'm a Non Entity Get me Out, hours and
hours of telly (on digital channels 24/7) for bugger all cost.
(I should know, I was involved in setting up the original Dutch Big
Brother house)
If you put 30 cameras down a sewer people would watch it. More interesting
than the above anyway.

Stuart Noble wrote:
What is threatened these days is original production, it's all too easy
to put 30 remote cameras in a building or location and hey-presto you've
got Big Brother, Fame Academy, or I'm a Non Entity Get me Out, hours and
hours of telly (on digital channels 24/7) for bugger all cost.
(I should know, I was involved in setting up the original Dutch Big
Brother house)

If you put 30 cameras down a sewer people would watch it. More interesting
than the above anyway.

Funnily enough, Joseph Bazalgette the designer and engineer who built
London's sewers,

http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/histori...e_joseph.shtml

Is the great-great-grandfather of Peter Bazalgette

http://www.endemoluk.com/about/peopl...20030909135927

Big Brother (and many other reality show) executive producer.

--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.

wrote:
snip
Might be ELCB, firemans switch, RCD, switchfuse, I dont know, havent
seen it.

Looking at it now, it seems to be a big switch, I guess I could
find pictures but I can't be bothered since I don't want to play
with it anyway.

snip
what does that mean, do you mean its not connected?

Yes sorry that's what I ment, the T+E is double insulated, the
outer insulation has been cut off leaving about 10cm of red, black
and uninsulated earth cable. While the red and black wires goto the
Henley box, the earth wire has been cut back by 10cm, leaving just
bare wire stubs where the outer cover has been removed.

snip
that'll be yer earth rod.

Having no clue what an earth rod looks like you may well be right,
but to me it just looks like a standard water pipe with a cap soldered
onto it, the earth wire connects with one of those metal bands with
a do-not remove tab on it.

snip
whats wrong with the present earth?

Nothing as such, of course I have no way of testing.. Nothing I can
recall has ever broken in a way to blow a fuse.

snip
why would it be? What do you think is carrying the power from your
naerest town on wooden poles? Since you have appear to have TT I'm
guessing youre out in the country.

I just thought there were limits and sizes defining how much length
you can have in the way of tails before the CU. I'm in a reasonably
new development (30-40 maybe) in a largish 'new town'... Not in the
country.. AFAIK not many houses in my area have power from poles,
on this estate at least it all comes in underground. I have reasons
to doubt that I have TT, mainly because on the outside white box,
I can see the two tails and earth wire going into the house. By time
it gets to the CU I can only see a the tails, but no earth apart from
the 'earth rod'

snip
why the (!)?

Well the T+E has only been installed for maybe 20 years but it crumbled
on the exposed wall to such an extend we took it out of service, further
more it was loosely clipped to the wall which was structurally unsound
anyway (part was rebuilt). It had no RCD protection, and was on a high
ring main fuse circuit, even though the cable looked underated.

snip
he is? Are you? I dont know.

Competent enough to know what wires go where and replace and install new
fittings but also competent enough to know that this job is beyond our
technical knowledge... The whole point of my post was simply to
understand a few things, purely because I am interested.


NT


--
Regards,
Aaron.

Aaron wrote:
wrote:

why would it be? What do you think is carrying the power from your
naerest town on wooden poles? Since you have appear to have TT I'm
guessing youre out in the country.

I just thought there were limits and sizes defining how much length
you can have in the way of tails before the CU.

So what.

On a 20 yr old install you cant expect it to be compliant.


I'm in a reasonably
new development (30-40 maybe) in a largish 'new town'... Not in the
country.. AFAIK not many houses in my area have power from poles,
on this estate at least it all comes in underground. I have reasons
to doubt that I have TT, mainly because on the outside white box,
I can see the two tails and earth wire going into the house. By time
it gets to the CU I can only see a the tails, but no earth apart from
the 'earth rod'

odd that youd have TT in town. I havent seen it or tested anything, but
it does sound like TT. It may just be a non compliant install though.


snip
why the (!)?

Well the T+E has only been installed for maybe 20 years but it
crumbled
on the exposed wall to such an extend we took it out of service,
further
more it was loosely clipped to the wall which was structurally
unsound
anyway (part was rebuilt). It had no RCD protection, and was on a
high
ring main fuse circuit, even though the cable looked underated.

normal for 20-30 yr old wiring. The potential for dterioration from uv
is one reason its not done now, though that can be stopped by painting
it.


snip
he is? Are you? I dont know.

Competent enough to know what wires go where and replace and install
new
fittings but also competent enough to know that this job is beyond
our
technical knowledge... The whole point of my post was simply to
understand a few things, purely because I am interested.

Well, I reckon a lot more detail and precision would be needed to
ascertain your earth situaiton. It sounds like TT, but who knows, its
all a bit vague, either that or I am.


NT

In article .com,
wrote:
I just thought there were limits and sizes defining how much length
you can have in the way of tails before the CU.

So what.

On a 20 yr old install you cant expect it to be compliant.

Rather more than 20 years ago there were restrictions on the length of
'tails' between meter and CU. If you wished to exceed them, the LEB would
insist on MICC or similar.

--
*Friends help you move. Real friends help you move bodies.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Remote-control cameras in studio, very high bandwidth links to India or
China.
Although hot head cameras do, of course, exist, and have been used in
simple stuff like news where the cameras are stationary, or on the end of
a manned jib, the idea of completely remote controlled pedestals of the
type used on studio drama like bits of Coronation Street, Eastenders, etc
is rather far fetched. And it's not even as if TV cameramen are that well
paid these days.

But as we enter the 'exciting digital vision for everybody'[1] of
television, drama will be a increasingly decreasing part of the output.
Aren't the 'reality' television programmes already predominantly filmed
with fixed, remote control cameras? The talk-to-camera shows selling
saucepans, sex or salvation could probably be done fully remote-control.

And a remote control camera would be pointless on location drama - it
would need more people to move it and set it up on location than is needed
to operate it. Then there's the problem of communication between talent,
director and cameraman. They need a pretty intimate relationship to
produce satisfactory stuff.

Ah, talent, location drama and satisfactory stuff ... well, there'll
still be Dads Army repeats on The Dads Army Repeats Channel, The Dads
Army +1 Repeats Channel, The Sitcoms Channel, The Let's Laugh About The
War Channel, The Highlights Of 2D-Television Channel, ...

I'm also trying to envisage all those remote controlled lights getting
themselves out of the van and setting up. And plugging themselves in. ;-)

Give the Koreans another five years ... Until then, plenty of media
studies graduates can do an MA in Television Illumination Unpacking And
Positioning.

You'd need a dog (to make sure no-one touched the cameras) and a man (to
feed the dog) but that's about it.
The dog handler would probably cost more. ;-)

Put the dog in front of the camera and save a presenter's fee.

Owain


[1] Unless you're in a flat on the wrong side of a conservation area
building, like me.

Mark Carver wrote:
Stuart Noble wrote:
What is threatened these days is original production, it's all too easy
to put 30 remote cameras in a building or location and hey-presto you've
got Big Brother, Fame Academy, or I'm a Non Entity Get me Out, hours and
hours of telly (on digital channels 24/7) for bugger all cost.
(I should know, I was involved in setting up the original Dutch Big
Brother house)

Exactly.

If you put 30 cameras down a sewer people would watch it. More
interesting than the above anyway.
Funnily enough, Joseph Bazalgette the designer and engineer who built
London's sewers,
http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/histori...e_joseph.shtml
Is the great-great-grandfather of Peter Bazalgette
http://www.endemoluk.com/about/peopl...20030909135927
Big Brother (and many other reality show) executive producer.

I knew that, but your mentioning it and sewers gave me an idea. Instead
of cameras down sewers (but using the same technology) why not put
cameras in coffins before they're buries. Then Bazalgette could give us
Decomposing Relatives The Authentic After Death Experience.

Owain

In article , Dave Plowman (News)
writes
In article ,
Mark Carver wrote:
I am a student and may some day take up something in the broadcast
industry,

If it's technical don't bother, there won't be such a thing as
'Broadcast Engineering' before long, it's rapidly getting consumed into
'IT'.

Some of it might be. But installation/ maintenance will always be required.
You can't make the actual programmes using 'IT' - apart from cartoons and
special FX, possibly.

One day Dave the accountants and other bull****ters that run the
broadcast industry will come to realise the real value of engineers, but
by then they'll be extinct, as a species......
--
Tony Sayer

On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 21:11:06 UTC, Owain
wrote:

I knew that, but your mentioning it and sewers gave me an idea. Instead
of cameras down sewers (but using the same technology) why not put
cameras in coffins before they're buries. Then Bazalgette could give us
Decomposing Relatives The Authentic After Death Experience.

If heredity means anything, Bazalgette would do better with the
sewers...!

--
Bob Eager
begin a new life...dump Windows!

"tony sayer" wrote in message
...

One day Dave the accountants and other bull****ters that run the
broadcast industry will come to realise the real value of engineers, but
by then they'll be extinct, as a species......


Engineers are becoming extinct in all UK industries. Apparently China turns
out more engineers per annum than there are of all ages in actual employment
as engineers in Europe. We are becoming the ultimate service (sic) economy.

In article ,
Owain wrote:
But as we enter the 'exciting digital vision for everybody'[1] of
television, drama will be a increasingly decreasing part of the output.

Not so sure. ITV's profits are up, and they major on drama - although some
would prefer something more adventurous than police type series.

Aren't the 'reality' television programmes already predominantly filmed
with fixed, remote control cameras?

Depends. Fly on the wall stuff, yes. Others will use wobbly cam. ;-)

The talk-to-camera shows selling
saucepans, sex or salvation could probably be done fully remote-control.

Only one I had anything to do with before 'they' found it out was Auction
World, and that used operated cameras. 3. With very bored operators.

--
*When the going gets tough, the tough take a coffee break *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Bob Eager wrote:
I knew that, but your mentioning it and sewers gave me an idea.
Instead of cameras down sewers (but using the same technology) why
not put cameras in coffins before they're buries. Then Bazalgette
could give us Decomposing Relatives The Authentic After Death
Experience.

If heredity means anything, Bazalgette would do better with the
sewers...!

I prefer to remember him as the floor assistant (call boy) on Panorama,
etc, when it came from Lime Grove. With CPS Emitron b&w cameras.
And he was a very pleasant person.

--
*Experience is something you don't get until just after you need it.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 00:03:46 UTC, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
Bob Eager wrote:
I knew that, but your mentioning it and sewers gave me an idea.
Instead of cameras down sewers (but using the same technology) why
not put cameras in coffins before they're buries. Then Bazalgette
could give us Decomposing Relatives The Authentic After Death
Experience.

If heredity means anything, Bazalgette would do better with the
sewers...!

I prefer to remember him as the floor assistant (call boy) on Panorama,
etc, when it came from Lime Grove. With CPS Emitron b&w cameras.
And he was a very pleasant person.

Interesting. Do you know if Joseph was his grandfather,
great-grandfather or what?

--
Bob Eager
begin a new life...dump Windows!

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article .com,
wrote:

I just thought there were limits and sizes defining how much
length
you can have in the way of tails before the CU.

So what.

On a 20 yr old install you cant expect it to be compliant.

Rather more than 20 years ago there were restrictions on the length
of
'tails' between meter and CU. If you wished to exceed them, the LEB
would
insist on MICC or similar.


Ok I'll rephrase it. You cant expect 20 year old installs to comply
with 20 year old regs (15th edn).


NT

In article ,
Bob Eager wrote:
I prefer to remember him as the floor assistant (call boy) on Panorama,
etc, when it came from Lime Grove. With CPS Emitron b&w cameras.
And he was a very pleasant person.

Interesting. Do you know if Joseph was his grandfather,
great-grandfather or what?

Dunno, although they were the same family. He was on R4 some months ago
and the subject came up. I'd say he'd be in his mid 50s, if this helps.

--
*A journey of a thousand sites begins with a single click *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 09:43:20 UTC, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

Dunno, although they were the same family.

I realised that, hence the comment that he might be good at sewers!

He was on R4 some months ago
and the subject came up. I'd say he'd be in his mid 50s, if this helps.

Thanks. Will have to check the sewer books I have!

--
Bob Eager
begin a new life...dump Windows!

Bob Eager wrote:
On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 00:03:46 UTC, "Dave Plowman (News)"

I prefer to remember him as the floor assistant (call boy) on Panorama,
etc, when it came from Lime Grove. With CPS Emitron b&w cameras.
And he was a very pleasant person.

I've met him too (in his guise as Mr Big Brother), yes he is very nice
chap.

Interesting. Do you know if Joseph was his grandfather,
great-grandfather or what?

He made a programme about Joseph.

--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.

On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 13:29:54 UTC, Mark Carver
wrote:

Bob Eager wrote:
On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 00:03:46 UTC, "Dave Plowman (News)"

I prefer to remember him as the floor assistant (call boy) on Panorama,
etc, when it came from Lime Grove. With CPS Emitron b&w cameras.
And he was a very pleasant person.

I've met him too (in his guise as Mr Big Brother), yes he is very nice
chap.

Interesting. Do you know if Joseph was his grandfather,
great-grandfather or what?

He made a programme about Joseph.

Yes, saw that. I just don't remember the exact family connection.

--
Bob Eager
begin a new life...dump Windows!

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Not so sure. ITV's profits are up, and they major on drama -

Someone has to.

although some would prefer something more adventurous than
police type series.

More adventurous?? The producers of The Bill have blown up that police
station more times than Fred Dibnah did factory chimneys. What could be
more adventurous than that. Oh, you meant programme genre not plotline ...

Owain

In article ,
Owain wrote:
Not so sure. ITV's profits are up, and they major on drama -

Someone has to.

although some would prefer something more adventurous than
police type series.

More adventurous?? The producers of The Bill have blown up that police
station more times than Fred Dibnah did factory chimneys. What could be
more adventurous than that.

And strangely coincides with when the 'set' needs routine refurbishing...

Rumour has it that they contacted the Met about some aspect of procedure
after a car bomb had hit a police station. They replied they didn't know
since it had never happened.

Oh, you meant programme genre not plotline ...

:-)

--
*Some days you're the dog, some days the hydrant.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.