Home |
Search |
Today's Posts |
|
UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
Reply |
|
LinkBack | Thread Tools | Display Modes |
|
#1
|
|||
|
|||
RCB PROBLEMS
Hello
I have just installed a bathroom fan which is on a timer... Problem is... fixed 240 V is from a 3A spur of the a socket ring on the RCB. the light feed is not on the RCB. So when connected up the neutrals are now common and the RCB is tripping.. I take it I now have to connect the lighting ring to the RCB?? |
#2
|
|||
|
|||
"PhilÅ" wrote:
Hello I have just installed a bathroom fan which is on a timer... Problem is... fixed 240 V is from a 3A spur of the a socket ring on the RCB. the light feed is not on the RCB. So when connected up the neutrals are now common and the RCB is tripping.. I take it I now have to connect the lighting ring to the RCB?? You should have taken all the feeds to the bathroom fan from a single circuit, I'm pretty sure your wiring contravenes the IEE regs and, as you've discovered, it doesn't work either! -- Chris Green |
#3
|
|||
|
|||
wrote in message ... "PhilÅ" wrote: Hello I have just installed a bathroom fan which is on a timer... Problem is... fixed 240 V is from a 3A spur of the a socket ring on the RCB. the light feed is not on the RCB. So when connected up the neutrals are now common and the RCB is tripping.. I take it I now have to connect the lighting ring to the RCB?? You should have taken all the feeds to the bathroom fan from a single circuit, I'm pretty sure your wiring contravenes the IEE regs and, as you've discovered, it doesn't work either! -- Chris Green Chris If I take them from the mains ring (common) then this contravenes IEE is dangerous, as the lighting ring could be switched off and the light live, so I am to take it all from the lighting ring... |
#4
|
|||
|
|||
"PhilÅ" wrote in message ... wrote in message ... "PhilÅ" wrote: Hello I have just installed a bathroom fan which is on a timer... Problem is... fixed 240 V is from a 3A spur of the a socket ring on the RCB. the light feed is not on the RCB. So when connected up the neutrals are now common and the RCB is tripping.. I take it I now have to connect the lighting ring to the RCB?? You should have taken all the feeds to the bathroom fan from a single circuit, I'm pretty sure your wiring contravenes the IEE regs and, as you've discovered, it doesn't work either! -- Chris Green Chris If I take them from the mains ring (common) then this contravenes IEE is dangerous, as the lighting ring could be switched off and the light live, so I am to take it all from the lighting ring... I don't want to sound offensive I would suggest you get professional help in. You should never take a live feed of one circuit and a effectively a neutral of another. If your case there is no longer a neutral current so there'll immediately be an imbalance of current in the live and neutral flowing through the RCD. It will trip as soon as you put any load on any circuit. |
#5
|
|||
|
|||
"Fred" wrote in message ... "PhilÅ" wrote in message ... wrote in message ... "PhilÅ" wrote: Hello I have just installed a bathroom fan which is on a timer... Problem is... fixed 240 V is from a 3A spur of the a socket ring on the RCB. the light feed is not on the RCB. So when connected up the neutrals are now common and the RCB is tripping.. I take it I now have to connect the lighting ring to the RCB?? You should have taken all the feeds to the bathroom fan from a single circuit, I'm pretty sure your wiring contravenes the IEE regs and, as you've discovered, it doesn't work either! -- Chris Green Chris If I take them from the mains ring (common) then this contravenes IEE is dangerous, as the lighting ring could be switched off and the light live, so I am to take it all from the lighting ring... I don't want to sound offensive I would suggest you get professional help in. You should never take a live feed of one circuit and a effectively a neutral of another. If your case there is no longer a neutral current so there'll immediately be an imbalance of current in the live and neutral flowing through the RCD. It will trip as soon as you put any load on any circuit. fairy muff, I will forget the timer option, and just connect the fan up to the lighting thingy.. Cheers |
#6
|
|||
|
|||
fairy muff, I will forget the timer option, and just connect the fan up to
the lighting thingy.. Er, you can run the timer off the lighting circuit. The whole thing should be entirely off the lighting circuit. You need to take the live, switched live and neutral from the ceiling rose/junction box. Then pass each of these through a 3 pole isolator switch and into the fan. Christian. |
#7
|
|||
|
|||
PhilÅ wrote:
"Fred" wrote in message ... "PhilÅ" wrote in message ... wrote in message ... "PhilÅ" wrote: Hello I have just installed a bathroom fan which is on a timer... Problem is... fixed 240 V is from a 3A spur of the a socket ring on the RCB. the light feed is not on the RCB. So when connected up the neutrals are now common and the RCB is tripping.. I take it I now have to connect the lighting ring to the RCB?? You should have taken all the feeds to the bathroom fan from a single circuit, I'm pretty sure your wiring contravenes the IEE regs and, as you've discovered, it doesn't work either! -- Chris Green Chris If I take them from the mains ring (common) then this contravenes IEE is dangerous, as the lighting ring could be switched off and the light live, so I am to take it all from the lighting ring... I don't want to sound offensive I would suggest you get professional help in. You should never take a live feed of one circuit and a effectively a neutral of another. If your case there is no longer a neutral current so there'll immediately be an imbalance of current in the live and neutral flowing through the RCD. It will trip as soon as you put any load on any circuit. fairy muff, I will forget the timer option, and just connect the fan up to the lighting thingy.. Cheers Can you run a 3 core and earth to the fan? One core switched with the bulb, an other to provide power for the timed run with the third as neutral. This is how they are intended to work, but with the changes to bathroom regs, I'm not sure what would be required any more. Andrew |
#8
|
|||
|
|||
PhilÅ wrote:
You should never take a live feed of one circuit and a effectively a neutral of another. Dead right. From Phil's description he's in fact got live feeds from two different circuits - a perm-live wrongly taken from the ring, and a switched-live ("trigger" for the fan's run-on timer) from the lighting circuit (specifically, I'd guess, from the bathroom lamholder's (switched) live terminal). Fixing this to be Right is not so hard. You don't need to .... forget the timer option, and just connect the fan up to the lighting thingy.. Rather, you need to forget the ring circuit altogether as your source of perm-live. Run a triple-and-earth cable from the Appropriate Place on your lighting circuit. That T&E wants to carry the (lighting circuit) Permanent Live, the bathroom light's Switched Live, the (lighting circuit) Neutral, and the (lighting circuit) Earth. It wants to go via a 3-pole fan isolator (made for the job, switching all three non-earth conductors, you see) and on to the relevant terminals of the fan. OK, but what's this Appropriate Place? That depends on how your bathroom light is wired. If it's the loop-in system, all four connections are already present at the ceiling rose - N (black wires at one edge), perm-L (in the middle), switched-L (at the other edge) and an E terminal. Though the loop-in arrangement is the most common system on newer properties, ceiling roses are not usual in new-build bathrooms (usually an fitting is used which is flush to the ceiling). In this case it's most likely that there's a junction box in the loft above the bathroom, which becomes the Appropriate Place, as it'll bring together the N, perm-L, switched-L, and E in one neat place. There's a third 'standard' possibility where all wiring is done at the switches and lighting points, with the extra way or two sometimes needed being made using bits of 'chocolate block'; in this case you may not end up with one Appropriate Place, but would have to use two T&E runs to your 3-way isolator to get all 4 connections. In summary: DON'T mix 'final' circuits: make all your connections ONLY into the lighting circuit. DO use a bathroom fan isolator (and position it out of reach of anyone using, incl. standing in, the bath/shower). IF you're sure you can safely bring both switched-L and perm-L to the isolator, do that; if not, go for your 'forget the timer, just use the lighting point' simplification. IF you're in any doubt, get a sparks in: no point frying yourself or your Lurved Ones (or even a visitor!) for the sake of 80 notes... Stefek |
#9
|
|||
|
|||
"PhilÅ" wrote:
I take it I now have to connect the lighting ring to the RCB?? You should have taken all the feeds to the bathroom fan from a single circuit, I'm pretty sure your wiring contravenes the IEE regs and, as you've discovered, it doesn't work either! -- Chris Green Chris If I take them from the mains ring (common) then this contravenes IEE is dangerous, as the lighting ring could be switched off and the light live, so I am to take it all from the lighting ring... Yes, I think that's the normal way of doing things, all from the lighting circuit. -- Chris Green |
#10
|
|||
|
|||
In article ,
PhilÅ wrote: fixed 240 V is from a 3A spur of the a socket ring on the RCB. the light feed is not on the RCB. So when connected up the neutrals are now common and the RCB is tripping.. Yup. They're good at showing up stupid things. ;-) -- *One nice thing about egotists: they don't talk about other people. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Reply |
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Forum | |||
Carrier Heat Pump Control Problems | Home Repair | |||
Fixing Problems on Minolta EP 8015 Copier | Electronics Repair | |||
tig welding problems | Metalworking | |||
Magnavox rear projection TV RK8530AK02 - startup problems | Electronics Repair | |||
Zenith TV problems | Electronics Repair |