There have been lots of threads recently about problems with RCCBs tripping
out. The advice has been to isolate different parts of the house circuitry
to find out where the fault is. Where a fault is intermittent, but frequent
enough to be a nuisance, this is not really practicable.

How would a trade electrician find the fault? Presumably there is test
equipment? What is this, how much does it cost and where could I get it?

Peter Scott

"Peter Scott" wrote in message
...
There have been lots of threads recently about problems with RCCBs tripping
out. The advice has been to isolate different parts of the house circuitry
to find out where the fault is. Where a fault is intermittent, but frequent
enough to be a nuisance, this is not really practicable.

How would a trade electrician find the fault? Presumably there is test
equipment? What is this, how much does it cost and where could I get it?

Peter Scott



Do a web search for PAT testing equipment, and also Meger test gear. These
should give you a rough idea what's needed.

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 12:46:03 -0000, "Peter Scott"
strung together this:

How would a trade electrician find the fault?

Depends where it is.

Presumably there is test equipment?

Yep.

What is this, how much does it cost and where could I get it?

Insulation tester, earth loop tester and RCD tester would be the
complete test kit. The insulation tester would be the most useful if
you only had one of them.

Cost, however much you want to spend.

Where, http://www.isswww.co.uk

You will also need to attend the C&G 2391 testing and inspection
course to be able to fully understand the corect operation procedures
of the equipment mentioned.

Probably better just getting an electrician in.
--

SJW
Please reply to group or use 'usenet' in email subject

Peter Scott wrote:

There have been lots of threads recently about problems with RCCBs tripping
out. The advice has been to isolate different parts of the house circuitry
to find out where the fault is. Where a fault is intermittent, but frequent
enough to be a nuisance, this is not really practicable.

How would a trade electrician find the fault? Presumably there is test
equipment? What is this, how much does it cost and where could I get it?

In these cases the most useful bit of kit would be a insulation
resistance tester. These perform a resistance measurement but using a
high voltage (500V or more). The voltage should help measure fault
current paths that would normally be invisible at low voltage (i.e. if
you performed the same measurement with a DMM).

An RCD tester may be of use in some situations to prove it is not the
RCD (or RCBO) that is as fault.

You can often pick this stuff up on ebay.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

In these cases the most useful bit of kit would be a insulation
resistance tester. These perform a resistance measurement but using a
high voltage (500V or more).

However, the majority of the testing uses the same test gear in a low
voltage/high current mode. This ensures the correct connections and
impedences around the entire circuit. It can soon locate a break in a ring
circuit that would not be apparent by functional testing. It can sometimes
even locate a poorly terminated screw terminal, if the impedences are not in
the correct ratio.

The high voltage insulation test is usually done at the end as a single test
covering the entire installation (or at least circuit). You only isolate
various parts and test further if it failed.

Christian.

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 14:45:10 +0000, Lurch
wrote:

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 12:46:03 -0000, "Peter Scott"
strung together this:

How would a trade electrician find the fault?

Depends where it is.

Presumably there is test equipment?

Yep.

What is this, how much does it cost and where could I get it?

Insulation tester, earth loop tester and RCD tester would be the
complete test kit. The insulation tester would be the most useful if
you only had one of them.

Cost, however much you want to spend.

Where, http://www.isswww.co.uk

You will also need to attend the C&G 2391 testing and inspection
course to be able to fully understand the corect operation procedures
of the equipment mentioned.

Probably better just getting an electrician in.

Interesting to note that this outfit offers multifunction testers on
rental for typically £8/day.






--

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

In article ,
Peter Scott wrote:
How would a trade electrician find the fault? Presumably there is test
equipment? What is this, how much does it cost and where could I get it?

There is, but it's pricey. For 99% of the sort of faults you get which
trip a RCD, an ordinary cheap DVM (5 quid or so) will suffice.

--
*Change is inevitable ... except from vending machines *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 18:09:54 +0000, Andy Hall
strung together this:

Interesting to note that this outfit offers multifunction testers on
rental for typically £8/day.

By the time you've added on delivery for both egs, insurance and some
other stuff it turns out at nearer £75 per day, I tried it once with a
PAT tester.

I see your point though.
--

SJW
Please reply to group or use 'usenet' in email subject

How would a trade electrician find the fault? Presumably there is test
equipment? What is this, how much does it cost and where could I get it?

The site http://www.isswww.co.uk/ proved very useful. I've ordered a megger
and hope that this will enable me to find the fault. Thanks to all who
responded so quickly and usefully.

Peter Scott

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 18:40:14 +0000, Lurch
wrote:

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 18:09:54 +0000, Andy Hall
strung together this:

Interesting to note that this outfit offers multifunction testers on
rental for typically £8/day.

By the time you've added on delivery for both egs, insurance and some
other stuff it turns out at nearer £75 per day, I tried it once with a
PAT tester.

I see your point though.

It seems that the starting point to buy a complete set of testers
(unless I've missed something) is around £650 net, a bit more for a
multifunction single tester.

One would need to do quite a bit of testing on a DIY basis to justify
this cost. I guess that on Ebay or something they would be a little
less.

I invested in a combustion analyser (cost about £200 offer from BES
about a year ago), which enables me to check and service my boiler.
The payback on that will be in two years, so worth doing.

I wonder what would happen if one were to run the complete electrical
tests on an installation and send a signed certificate to the BCO as
part of a building notice........






--

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 18:40:14 +0000, Lurch
wrote:

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 18:09:54 +0000, Andy Hall
strung together this:

Interesting to note that this outfit offers multifunction testers on

snipped

I wonder what would happen if one were to run the complete electrical
tests on an installation and send a signed certificate to the BCO as
part of a building notice........

.andy


Not Part P again.........Please !!!!

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 19:27:22 +0000, Andy Hall
wrote:

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 18:40:14 +0000, Lurch
wrote:

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 18:09:54 +0000, Andy Hall
strung together this:

Interesting to note that this outfit offers multifunction testers on
rental for typically £8/day.

By the time you've added on delivery for both egs, insurance and some
other stuff it turns out at nearer £75 per day, I tried it once with a
PAT tester.

I see your point though.

It seems that the starting point to buy a complete set of testers
(unless I've missed something) is around £650 net, a bit more for a
multifunction single tester.

One would need to do quite a bit of testing on a DIY basis to justify
this cost. I guess that on Ebay or something they would be a little
less.

The initial outlay is only the start. Stuff like this needs to be
periodically calibrated, and that isn't exactly cheap, although you
can do certain confidence checks yourself.

--
Frank Erskine

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 19:27:22 +0000, Andy Hall
strung together this:

It seems that the starting point to buy a complete set of testers
(unless I've missed something) is around £650 net, a bit more for a
multifunction single tester.

Something like that. It's not cheap.

One would need to do quite a bit of testing on a DIY basis to justify
this cost. I guess that on Ebay or something they would be a little
less.

Yep, eBay would be the best place for a DIY set of testers. If you're
using them for checks only, as opposed to actual testing for the
filling out of certificates, then self calibration works well, if you
know how.

I invested in a combustion analyser (cost about £200 offer from BES
about a year ago), which enables me to check and service my boiler.
The payback on that will be in two years, so worth doing.

I wonder what would happen if one were to run the complete electrical
tests on an installation and send a signed certificate to the BCO as
part of a building notice........

If you were going to do that you may as well just fill in a cert. with
some random results. If you know what you're doing you can generally
tell what the results should roughly be.
--

SJW
Please reply to group or use 'usenet' in email subject

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 19:32:36 GMT, "BigWallop"
wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 18:40:14 +0000, Lurch
wrote:

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 18:09:54 +0000, Andy Hall
strung together this:

Interesting to note that this outfit offers multifunction testers on

snipped

I wonder what would happen if one were to run the complete electrical
tests on an installation and send a signed certificate to the BCO as
part of a building notice........

.andy


Not Part P again.........Please !!!!



You mean you don't want to talk about it? ;-)



--

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 21:10:28 +0000, Lurch
wrote:

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 19:27:22 +0000, Andy Hall
strung together this:

It seems that the starting point to buy a complete set of testers
(unless I've missed something) is around £650 net, a bit more for a
multifunction single tester.

Something like that. It's not cheap.

One would need to do quite a bit of testing on a DIY basis to justify
this cost. I guess that on Ebay or something they would be a little
less.

Yep, eBay would be the best place for a DIY set of testers. If you're
using them for checks only, as opposed to actual testing for the
filling out of certificates, then self calibration works well, if you
know how.

That was mainly what I was thinking about. Do you happen to know a
suitable Ebay section reference?


I invested in a combustion analyser (cost about £200 offer from BES
about a year ago), which enables me to check and service my boiler.
The payback on that will be in two years, so worth doing.

I wonder what would happen if one were to run the complete electrical
tests on an installation and send a signed certificate to the BCO as
part of a building notice........

If you were going to do that you may as well just fill in a cert. with
some random results. If you know what you're doing you can generally
tell what the results should roughly be.

I was thinking more in terms of what their reaction would be. I
suppose to ignore it.....



--

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 19:32:36 GMT, "BigWallop"
wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 18:40:14 +0000, Lurch
wrote:

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 18:09:54 +0000, Andy Hall
strung together this:

Interesting to note that this outfit offers multifunction testers on

snipped

I wonder what would happen if one were to run the complete electrical
tests on an installation and send a signed certificate to the BCO as
part of a building notice........

.andy


Not Part P again.........Please !!!!



You mean you don't want to talk about it? ;-)

.andy


No !!!! Please !!!! No more Part P discussions !!!!! Ahhhhhh !!!!! :-)

Andy Hall wrote:


That was mainly what I was thinking about. Do you happen to know a
suitable Ebay section reference?

Search for "megger", that will find you loads of kit. Cost me about 190
for a full set (insulation, loop impeadance, and RCD testers).


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

I wonder what would happen if one were to run the complete electrical
tests on an installation and send a signed certificate to the BCO as
part of a building notice........

It is what I would do if I was submitting a building notice.

Christian.

On Tue, 11 Jan 2005 09:34:28 -0000, "Christian McArdle"
wrote:

I wonder what would happen if one were to run the complete electrical
tests on an installation and send a signed certificate to the BCO as
part of a building notice........

It is what I would do if I was submitting a building notice.

Christian.



This was my point, really - i.e. what would they do from the
bureaucratic perspective with a certificate? Simply accept it, take
your money and rubber stamp the paperwork or get somebody else to come
and inspect?



--

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

This was my point, really - i.e. what would they do from the
bureaucratic perspective with a certificate? Simply accept it, take
your money and rubber stamp the paperwork or get somebody else to come
and inspect?

They'd probably get hopelessly confused.

A switched on, but naughty, BCO might add you to his list of possible
timesavers and stop inspecting in detail after the 2nd or 3rd acceptable
inspection.

Christian.

On Tue, 11 Jan 2005 10:18:05 -0000, "Christian McArdle"
wrote:

This was my point, really - i.e. what would they do from the
bureaucratic perspective with a certificate? Simply accept it, take
your money and rubber stamp the paperwork or get somebody else to come
and inspect?

They'd probably get hopelessly confused.

A switched on, but naughty, BCO might add you to his list of possible
timesavers and stop inspecting in detail after the 2nd or 3rd acceptable
inspection.

Christian.



I suppose that either way, they are going to charge their fee...



--

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

In article ,
Andy Hall wrote:
That was mainly what I was thinking about. Do you happen to know a
suitable Ebay section reference?



http://business.listings.ebay.co.uk:80/Test-Measurement-Equipment_Other-Test-Equipment_W0QQfromZR4QQsacategoryZ40004QQsocmdZLis tingItemListQQsocolumnlayoutZ3QQsocustoverrideZ1

--
*If at first you don't succeed, try management *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 23:54:46 +0000, Andy Hall
strung together this:

Do you happen to know a
suitable Ebay section reference?

I normally just search for testers using various search strings, then
see what categories come up in the results and browse those.
--

SJW
Please reply to group or use 'usenet' in email subject