I have been trying to bleed my radiators tonight and the top floor (a
3 story house) is just about as full of air as it could be. I have
bled loads out but after running downstairs 3 or 4 times to top up
the pressure in the system I have given up for the night. It occurs
to me that I am probably getting this because I don't have enough (if
any) treatment in the system. the house is 18 months old and I would
bet the developer didn't put anything in....................the water
is nice and clear what is coming out.

I would like some advice as to what I need to put in - I have to
replace one of the bleed valves (if that's not what they are called I
would appreciate knowing what it is called so I don't look silly when
asking for one!) as it doesn't tighten properly and I understand you
can put it in to the system that way - perfect as I have so much air
space in there!!

Any tips gratefully received

Angela

"AK" wrote in message
...
I have been trying to bleed my radiators tonight and the top floor (a
3 story house) is just about as full of air as it could be. I have
bled loads out but after running downstairs 3 or 4 times to top up
the pressure in the system I have given up for the night. It occurs
to me that I am probably getting this because I don't have enough (if
any) treatment in the system. the house is 18 months old and I would
bet the developer didn't put anything in....................the water
is nice and clear what is coming out.

I would like some advice as to what I need to put in - I have to
replace one of the bleed valves (if that's not what they are called I
would appreciate knowing what it is called so I don't look silly when
asking for one!) as it doesn't tighten properly and I understand you
can put it in to the system that way - perfect as I have so much air
space in there!!

Any tips gratefully received

Angela

Most new houses have a 12 month guarantee on all fittings. Check this out.
If you suspect you have no inhibitor Sentinel X-100 for instance, then
partially drain, install X-400 sludge remover, and then after removing after
a few weeks in the heating season flush out twice and fill with X-100. Best
do it now before corrosion takes hold.

"IMM" wrote in message
...


Most new houses have a 12 month guarantee on all fittings. Check
this out.
If you suspect you have no inhibitor Sentinel X-100 for instance,
then
partially drain, install X-400 sludge remover, and then after
removing after
a few weeks in the heating season flush out twice and fill with
X-100. Best
do it now before corrosion takes hold.

that's a bit more extreme than I intended! The water that comes out
is completely clear so is it likely there is any sludge to remove?
it's only had 1 winters use.

In message , AK
writes

"IMM" wrote in message
...


Most new houses have a 12 month guarantee on all fittings. Check
this out.
If you suspect you have no inhibitor Sentinel X-100 for instance,
then
partially drain, install X-400 sludge remover, and then after
removing after
a few weeks in the heating season flush out twice and fill with
X-100. Best
do it now before corrosion takes hold.

that's a bit more extreme than I intended!

Good old IMM

The water that comes out
is completely clear so is it likely there is any sludge to remove?
it's only had 1 winters use.

If the water is clear then it indicates that there almost certainly was
some inhibitor in there (the stuff I have had is clear IIRC) I'd have
thought as IME you can get some coloration at least quite quickly -
certainly after a year. You get a black coloration in the water from the
corrosion products.

Anyway, no I wouldn't think sludge remover is worthwhile here. But it
will be worthwhile adding some inhibitor anyway, then at least you know
that has been done properly.

Add some Fernox or Sentinel inhibitor from your local DIY shed or
Plumbers Merchants.

If you have an open system with a header tank you can just add it to
there.

Fernox do one in syringe that you can use to inject it into a rad. I
fitted a suitable threaded fitting to a piece of Hep2O pipe (flexible
plastic pipe), threaded that into the threaded hole at the top of the
rad, funnel in the end and then pour it in.

If you have a column type rad in the bathroom with the bleed valve on
top you can just stick the funnel in the top of that.
--
Chris French, Leeds

"AK" wrote in message
...

"IMM" wrote in message
...


Most new houses have a 12 month guarantee on all fittings. Check
this out.
If you suspect you have no inhibitor Sentinel X-100 for instance,
then
partially drain, install X-400 sludge remover, and then after
removing after
a few weeks in the heating season flush out twice and fill with
X-100. Best
do it now before corrosion takes hold.

that's a bit more extreme than I intended! The water that comes out
is completely clear so is it likely there is any sludge to remove?
it's only had 1 winters use.

Corrosion could have taken hold in that time, and almost certainly seems
that way. When corrosion is occurring hydrogen is produced. many think it
is just air.

"chris French" wrote in message
...
In message , AK
writes

"IMM" wrote in message
...


Most new houses have a 12 month guarantee on all fittings. Check
this out.
If you suspect you have no inhibitor Sentinel X-100 for instance,
then
partially drain, install X-400 sludge remover, and then after
removing after
a few weeks in the heating season flush out twice and fill with
X-100. Best
do it now before corrosion takes hold.

that's a bit more extreme than I intended!

Good old IMM

L O L



The water that comes out
is completely clear so is it likely there is any sludge to remove?
it's only had 1 winters use.

If the water is clear then it indicates that there almost certainly was
some inhibitor in there (the stuff I have had is clear IIRC) I'd have
thought as IME you can get some coloration at least quite quickly -
certainly after a year. You get a black coloration in the water from the
corrosion products.

Anyway, no I wouldn't think sludge remover is worthwhile here. But it
will be worthwhile adding some inhibitor anyway, then at least you know
that has been done properly.

Add some Fernox or Sentinel inhibitor from your local DIY shed or
Plumbers Merchants.

If you have an open system with a header tank you can just add it to
there.

Fernox do one in syringe that you can use to inject it into a rad. I
fitted a suitable threaded fitting to a piece of Hep2O pipe (flexible
plastic pipe), threaded that into the threaded hole at the top of the
rad, funnel in the end and then pour it in.

Why didn't you use the bleed valve adapter and short length of flexible tube
which comes with the tube of Fernox inhibitor? The instructions are on the
tube and all that is required extra to the Fernox kit is a skeleton mastic
gun to "work" the tube of inhibitor.

SNIP

In article ,
AK wrote:
I have been trying to bleed my radiators tonight and the top floor (a
3 story house) is just about as full of air as it could be. I have
bled loads out but after running downstairs 3 or 4 times to top up
the pressure in the system I have given up for the night. It occurs
to me that I am probably getting this because I don't have enough (if
any) treatment in the system. the house is 18 months old and I would
bet the developer didn't put anything in....................the water
is nice and clear what is coming out.

If you've got that amount of air - or gas - in a sealed system that's only
18 months old, you've got a large leak somewhere. Unless some work has
been recently done on it?

--
*The sooner you fall behind, the more time you'll have to catch up *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"John" wrote in message
...

"chris French" wrote in message
...
In message , AK
writes

"IMM" wrote in message
...


Most new houses have a 12 month guarantee on all fittings. Check
this out.
If you suspect you have no inhibitor Sentinel X-100 for instance,
then
partially drain, install X-400 sludge remover, and then after
removing after
a few weeks in the heating season flush out twice and fill with
X-100. Best
do it now before corrosion takes hold.

that's a bit more extreme than I intended!

Good old IMM

L O L

Our resident unqualified Corgi man laughed at that? He is making this up, or
needs attention.

"AK" wrote in message ...
I have been trying to bleed my radiators tonight and the top floor (a
3 story house) is just about as full of air as it could be. I have
bled loads out but after running downstairs 3 or 4 times to top up
the pressure in the system I have given up for the night. It occurs
to me that I am probably getting this because I don't have enough (if
any) treatment in the system. the house is 18 months old and I would
bet the developer didn't put anything in....................the water
is nice and clear what is coming out.


What pressure do you run the system at? It would seem to me that the
rpessure reading at the bottom of the hosue would be mroe than the one
at the top so maybe air is being drawn in through your leaky bleed
vave?

In message , John
writes

"chris French" wrote in message
...
Fernox do one in syringe that you can use to inject it into a rad. I
fitted a suitable threaded fitting to a piece of Hep2O pipe (flexible
plastic pipe), threaded that into the threaded hole at the top of the
rad, funnel in the end and then pour it in.

Why didn't you use the bleed valve adapter and short length of flexible tube
which comes with the tube of Fernox inhibitor?

Ahh re-reading that I did give the wrong impression.

I didn't actually use the Fernox syringe stuff, I just used normal in a
bottle stuff.

--
Chris French, Leeds

"adder" wrote in message
om...
What pressure do you run the system at? It would seem to me that the
rpessure reading at the bottom of the hosue would be mroe than the one
at the top so maybe air is being drawn in through your leaky bleed
vave?

I have replaced the leaky bleed valve now (I was quite impressed with myself
that I tackled that one!), so we'll find out if that cures the air problem
The guy at the plumbers merchant said he didn't believe in inhibitor, but If
I wanted to put it in I should use the same brand - but I don't know what
might be in there already!!!. so it looks like a system drain down may be in
order. I have to get the boiler serviced - I might find how much it would
cost to get the whole system sorted - anybody know any good plumbers in or
around Eastbourne????

Angela

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 17:27:59 +0100, "AK" wrote:


"adder" wrote in message
. com...
What pressure do you run the system at? It would seem to me that the
rpessure reading at the bottom of the hosue would be mroe than the one
at the top so maybe air is being drawn in through your leaky bleed
vave?

I have replaced the leaky bleed valve now (I was quite impressed with myself
that I tackled that one!), so we'll find out if that cures the air problem
The guy at the plumbers merchant said he didn't believe in inhibitor, but If
I wanted to put it in I should use the same brand - but I don't know what
might be in there already!!!. so it looks like a system drain down may be in
order.

Plumber's merchants are full of old wives and their tales - on both
sides of the counter. It is always a good idea to use inhibitor.

If I were unaware of what is in the system, I would be inclined to
drain it down and start again. It doesn't matter within reason if
you overdose, though.


I have to get the boiler serviced - I might find how much it would
cost to get the whole system sorted - anybody know any good plumbers in or
around Eastbourne????

Angela

Do be careful if somebody offers you a powerflush. Typically, prices
north of £500 are charged. You can rent the equipment and DIY it for
a lot less.

Avoid BG unless you are feeling rich.


..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 09:23:30 +0100, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
AK wrote:
I have been trying to bleed my radiators tonight and the top floor (a
3 story house) is just about as full of air as it could be. I have
bled loads out but after running downstairs 3 or 4 times to top up
the pressure in the system I have given up for the night. It occurs
to me that I am probably getting this because I don't have enough (if
any) treatment in the system. the house is 18 months old and I would
bet the developer didn't put anything in....................the water
is nice and clear what is coming out.

If you've got that amount of air - or gas - in a sealed system that's only
18 months old, you've got a large leak somewhere. Unless some work has
been recently done on it?

On a sealed system it is not likely that corrosion from oxygen could have
gone very far in only 18 months, even if there was a mechanism for air
ingress.
The 'air' might indeed be hydrogen from anaerobic corrosion caued by acid
flux residues.

On a brand new system it is quite conceivable that not only was inhibitor
left out but also that flux residues have been left in.

To be absolutely sure that all was well, I would
drain, add a 'new' system cleanser like Sentinel X300, run for
few hours, drain, fill with inhibitor (Fernox, Sentinel or whatever).

See my FAQ on Sealed CH and especially on getting the air out.

--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html

AK wrote:
I have been trying to bleed my radiators tonight and the top floor (a
3 story house) is just about as full of air as it could be. I have
bled loads out but after running downstairs 3 or 4 times to top up
the pressure in the system I have given up for the night. It occurs
to me that I am probably getting this because I don't have enough (if
any) treatment in the system. the house is 18 months old and I would
bet the developer didn't put anything in....................the water
is nice and clear what is coming out.

I would like some advice as to what I need to put in - I have to
replace one of the bleed valves (if that's not what they are called I
would appreciate knowing what it is called so I don't look silly when
asking for one!) as it doesn't tighten properly and I understand you
can put it in to the system that way - perfect as I have so much air
space in there!!

The bleed valves are the ones at the tops of the radiators which you
open to let air out. I've never seen one fail though. They're not all
the same size: some have just the little pointed-ended screw going into
a threaded hole in the steel of the rad itself, on others the ponty
screw goes into a brass (or chromed) bush which screws into a bigger
hole in the rad. Usually these bushes are the same size as the screw
threads of the rad valves, and there's a blanking plug at the other end
of the top of the rad (so the rad has four same-sized threaded holes, at
each end, top and bottom). Best to take the radiator along to the
plumbers' merchants ;-)

The stuff you get to squirt in through the bleed hole costs an arm and a
leg: better to get ordinary liquid inhibitor. If you have a partly empty
radiator (you can turn off both valves and loosen one valve-to-rad
connecting nut to let out water) and the sort of bleed valve in a bush
that's the same size as the valve threads then you can unscrew the bush
and pour in your inhibitor using a tube and funnel or squeezy liquid
bottle etc. Otherwise a pump-up garden sprayer adapted to fit the
filling hose for the system can be used to squirt in liquid inhibitor
(assuming you have a filling hose rather than special filling key).

Use Fernox MB1 or Sentinel X100 not Purimachos Protex.