I thought I should finally make an effort to change from an EDF standard
variable dual-fuel tariff to a fixed EDF one. I assumed it would not be
simple (as far as I could see the tariffs I was interested in weren't
available through a Switch website, and they appeared to be identical on
the EDF website but had different names).

First stage was to set up an online account ("MyAccount") with EDF.
Pretty straightforward. Then I asked for a new tariff. There were a few
filters to get through - I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by
cash/cheque. I was offered only *one* tariff, and that one included a
servicing agreement - and it appeared to be a direct debit one! I wasn't
interested in it. No matter what I tried I could not get to the tariff I
was interested in. So I tried clicking on "live chat" and found it
wasn't available!

I then tried several different routes on the edfenergy pages, but they
all ended up at the same place with that one tariff. Next was the 0333
number on the letter I'd been sent warning me of a price rise on 1
April. After umpteen selections of "Press 1" etc, I was told they were
very busy and I would have to wait at least 10 minutes. After 12 minutes
the muzak just stopped and the phone went silent. I held on for another
5 minutes then gave up. I next tried a different 0333 number, apparently
specifically for changing tariffs, but that ended up the same as the
first one.

I then tried edfenergy.com/livechat, expecting it to have the same
unavailability as the previous live chat attempt, but no, I got through.
I find live chat rather slow, but eventually found the agent didn't know
why the two tariffs were the same, and why I'd only been offered one
different one. I was told I'd be sent an email with the explanation.

Before I started this whole process I was convinced it would be an
exercise in insanity, and I wasn't disappointed! According to
"Trustpilot" (who I've previously had issues with and reported to the
Information Commissioner's Office) EDF are rated "excellent" with 4.5
stars. I can only wonder what the other energy companies are like...

--

Jeff

Jeff Layman wrote:

I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by cash/cheque.

Doubt you'll find one on offer.

On 25/03/2021 16:25, Andy Burns wrote:
Jeff Layman wrote:

I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by cash/cheque.

Doubt you'll find one on offer.

https://my.edfenergy.com/gas-electricity/tariff-information-labels/

Enter any valid postcode. Select cash/cheque as payment method, then
click on "Apply filters", Then Cash/cheque Whole Amount (Quarterly).

Quite a few tariffs will appear (eventually - it's a slow website).

--

Jeff

On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 18:28:57 +0000, Jeff Layman
wrote:

On 25/03/2021 16:25, Andy Burns wrote:
Jeff Layman wrote:

I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by cash/cheque.

Doubt you'll find one on offer.

https://my.edfenergy.com/gas-electricity/tariff-information-labels/

Enter any valid postcode. Select cash/cheque as payment method, then
click on "Apply filters", Then Cash/cheque Whole Amount (Quarterly).

Quite a few tariffs will appear (eventually - it's a slow website).

Why would anyone want to use cash or cheque? If you have a bank
account - as you obviously do - paying by direct debit is more
convenient, may give you a better tariff and is protected by the
direct debit guarantee if anything goes wrong..

On 25/03/2021 18:41, Scott wrote:
On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 18:28:57 +0000, Jeff Layman
wrote:

On 25/03/2021 16:25, Andy Burns wrote:
Jeff Layman wrote:

I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by cash/cheque.

Doubt you'll find one on offer.

https://my.edfenergy.com/gas-electricity/tariff-information-labels/

Enter any valid postcode. Select cash/cheque as payment method, then
click on "Apply filters", Then Cash/cheque Whole Amount (Quarterly).

Quite a few tariffs will appear (eventually - it's a slow website).

Why would anyone want to use cash or cheque? If you have a bank
account - as you obviously do - paying by direct debit is more
convenient, may give you a better tariff and is protected by the
direct debit guarantee if anything goes wrong..

The "direct debit guarantee" doesn't guarantee that they won't
overcharge you and use the surplus to maintain their cash flow. I prefer
quarterly in arrears, so I'm only paying for what I use. Of course, I
don't actually pay by cash or cheque, I pay by bank transfer online.
They don't give you the option of paying the quarterly charge by direct
debit (after telling you how much). (Credit card companies and BT manage
to do that.)

--
Max Demian

On 25/03/2021 22:29, Max Demian wrote:
On 25/03/2021 18:41, Scott wrote:
On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 18:28:57 +0000, Jeff Layman
wrote:

On 25/03/2021 16:25, Andy Burns wrote:
Jeff Layman wrote:

I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by cash/cheque.

Doubt you'll find one on offer.

https://my.edfenergy.com/gas-electricity/tariff-information-labels/

Enter any valid postcode. Select cash/cheque as payment method, then
click on "Apply filters", Then Cash/cheque Whole Amount (Quarterly).

Quite a few tariffs will appear (eventually - it's a slow website).

Why would anyone want to use cash or cheque? If you have a bank
account - as you obviously do - paying by direct debit is more
convenient, may give you a better tariff and is protected by the
direct debit guarantee if anything goes wrong..

The "direct debit guarantee" doesn't guarantee that they won't
overcharge you and use the surplus to maintain their cash flow. I prefer
quarterly in arrears, so I'm only paying for what I use. Of course, I
don't actually pay by cash or cheque, I pay by bank transfer online.
They don't give you the option of paying the quarterly charge by direct
debit (after telling you how much). (Credit card companies and BT manage
to do that.)

So do the water companies. The energy suppliers seem to be unique
amongst utility suppliers in almost demanding payment this way, and
heavily overcharging those who don't/won't use it (and ripping off those
who do - a win-win for them).

I pay all my bills by BACS immediately upon receipt. It's just taken me
a couple of minutes to set up a BACS Standing Order for my Council Tax
bill for 2021-22. The first payment is slightly higher than the
remaining nine. The council gets paid a few days early; I know exactly
when and what gets paid. I don't even have to check if a DD payment has
been made - it's between my bank and the council to sort out any problem
(although I've never known one to occur).

From what i understand, the energy companies' "DD guarantee" far from
saying that they won't overcharge you almost guarantees they will! If
not, why have Ofgem made a very-obvious public statement about the
overcharging?

--

Jeff

On 25/03/2021 22:29, Max Demian wrote:
On 25/03/2021 18:41, Scott wrote:
On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 18:28:57 +0000, Jeff Layman
wrote:

On 25/03/2021 16:25, Andy Burns wrote:
Jeff Layman wrote:

I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by cash/cheque.

Doubt you'll find one on offer.

https://my.edfenergy.com/gas-electricity/tariff-information-labels/

Enter any valid postcode. Select cash/cheque as payment method, then
click on "Apply filters", Then Cash/cheque Whole Amount (Quarterly).

Quite a few tariffs will appear (eventually - it's a slow website).

Why would anyone want to use cash or cheque?Â* If you have a bank
account - as you obviously do - paying by direct debit is more
convenient, may give you a better tariff and is protected by the
direct debit guarantee if anything goes wrong..

The "direct debit guarantee" doesn't guarantee that they won't
overcharge you and use the surplus to maintain their cash flow. I prefer
quarterly in arrears, so I'm only paying for what I use. Of course, I
don't actually pay by cash or cheque, I pay by bank transfer online.
They don't give you the option of paying the quarterly charge by direct
debit (after telling you how much). (Credit card companies and BT manage
to do that.)


+1, though I think BT have stopped offering quarterly variable DD's.

On 25/03/2021 18:28, Jeff Layman wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:25, Andy Burns wrote:
Jeff Layman wrote:

I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by cash/cheque.

Doubt you'll find one on offer.

https://my.edfenergy.com/gas-electricity/tariff-information-labels/

Enter any valid postcode. Select cash/cheque as payment method, then
click on "Apply filters", Then Cash/cheque Whole Amount (Quarterly).

Quite a few tariffs will appear (eventually - it's a slow website).


But by paying by cheque the cost per unit (kWh) is 10% to 11% higher
compared with paying by monthly DD. This is for both electricity and gas.

The daily standing charge is around 20p whereas I'm paying around 15p
per day with my supplier. I'm also paying less per unit with my supplier
than the EDF monthly DD fixed plan.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

In article , Tim Streater
writes
On 25 Mar 2021 at 18:50:52 GMT, alan_m wrote:

On 25/03/2021 18:28, Jeff Layman wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:25, Andy Burns wrote:
Jeff Layman wrote:

I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by cash/cheque.

Doubt you'll find one on offer.

https://my.edfenergy.com/gas-electricity/tariff-information-labels/

Enter any valid postcode. Select cash/cheque as payment method, then
click on "Apply filters", Then Cash/cheque Whole Amount (Quarterly).

Quite a few tariffs will appear (eventually - it's a slow website).


But by paying by cheque the cost per unit (kWh) is 10% to 11% higher
compared with paying by monthly DD. This is for both electricity and gas.

The daily standing charge is around 20p whereas I'm paying around 15p
per day with my supplier. I'm also paying less per unit with my supplier
than the EDF monthly DD fixed plan.

Less per unit is better if you have to choose, The SO is much the smaller
component of overall cost for most people.
I have spread sheet calculator. Just put in the tariffs and it works out
he bill. I can vary current usage by any %age to see what difference it
makes. Usually very little and not enough to sway the decision.
--
bert

Jeff Layman wrote:

https://my.edfenergy.com/gas-electricity/tariff-information-labels/

Enter any valid postcode. Select cash/cheque as payment method, then
click on "Apply filters", Then Cash/cheque Whole Amount (Quarterly).

Quite a few tariffs will appear (eventually - it's a slow website).

So slow I'd have given-up and gone elsewhere

only a 1.5p/kWh 'sting' for quarterly cheque vs monthly direct debit.

In article , Andy Burns
writes
Jeff Layman wrote:

https://my.edfenergy.com/gas-electricity/tariff-information-labels/
Enter any valid postcode. Select cash/cheque as payment method, then
click on "Apply filters", Then Cash/cheque Whole Amount (Quarterly).
Quite a few tariffs will appear (eventually - it's a slow website).

So slow I'd have given-up and gone elsewhere

only a 1.5p/kWh 'sting' for quarterly cheque vs monthly direct debit.

The cost per transaction for DD to the company is a fraction of the cost
of processing a cheque. Plus the payment arrives on time and is correct.
You have no idea how many errors there are in hand written cheques.
--
bert

On 26/03/2021 20:33, bert wrote:
In article , Andy Burns
writes
Jeff Layman wrote:

https://my.edfenergy.com/gas-electricity/tariff-information-labels/
Enter any valid postcode. Select cash/cheque as payment method, then
click on "Apply filters", Then Cash/cheque Whole Amount (Quarterly).
Quite a few tariffs will appear (eventually - it's a slow website).

So slow I'd have given-up and gone elsewhere

only a 1.5p/kWh 'sting' for quarterly cheque vs monthly direct debit.

The cost per transaction for DD to the company is a fraction of the cost
of processing a cheque. Plus the payment arrives on time and is correct.
You have no idea how many errors there are in hand written cheques.

As I said, I use BACS, not a cheque - it's just the term EDF uses. It
costs the company almost nothing to process that, and it arrives on time
and is correct. The reason they want DD is to use someone else's money
at no cost to them. In fact, even the tiny interest rate they get on
that money adds up when you have millions in the bank. I wonder in what
form that appears on their annual accounts?

--

Jeff

On 25/03/2021 18:28, Jeff Layman wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:25, Andy Burns wrote:
Jeff Layman wrote:

I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by cash/cheque.

Doubt you'll find one on offer.

https://my.edfenergy.com/gas-electricity/tariff-information-labels/

Enter any valid postcode. Select cash/cheque as payment method, then
click on "Apply filters", Then Cash/cheque Whole Amount (Quarterly).

Quite a few tariffs will appear (eventually - it's a slow website).

They might appear but they are mirages.

The only tariffs with decent prices are dual fuel deals for some fixed
period with billing online only and paid by monthly direct debit. It
helps to know your exact annual usage to get to the optimum deal.

I find it incredibly frustrating that you cannot just download a table
of numbers showing the various fixed charges and rates.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On 26/03/2021 14:41, Martin Brown wrote:
On 25/03/2021 18:28, Jeff Layman wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:25, Andy Burns wrote:
Jeff Layman wrote:

I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by cash/cheque.

Doubt you'll find one on offer.

https://my.edfenergy.com/gas-electricity/tariff-information-labels/

Enter any valid postcode. Select cash/cheque as payment method, then
click on "Apply filters", Then Cash/cheque Whole Amount (Quarterly).

Quite a few tariffs will appear (eventually - it's a slow website).

They might appear but they are mirages.

I'm waiting for EDF to get back to me and email the relevant
information. Hmm - do I see hell freezing over?...

The only tariffs with decent prices are dual fuel deals for some fixed
period with billing online only and paid by monthly direct debit. It
helps to know your exact annual usage to get to the optimum deal.

I know my exact usage, and have fed both annual kWh figures into the
calculators at EDF and comparison websites.

I find it incredibly frustrating that you cannot just download a table
of numbers showing the various fixed charges and rates.

The whole system is designed to be as opaque and impenetrable as
possible. Why else do we need all those switch sites to do what should
be a fairly simple calculation? I didn't actually check the total number
(including those no longer available), but when I looked at the EDF
tariff list, it seemed there were approaching 100 different tariffs
there. I have no doubt the other big players have a similar number.

One other thing which really annoys me is that nearly all websites
require your actual address as well as your postcode. Why? How many
places are there where the houses on either side will be on completely
different tariff offers? Some comparison sites don't need the full
address. If they don't, why do the others insist on it? It's just to get
you on yet another database somewhere.

--

Jeff

On 26/03/2021 15:20, Jeff Layman wrote:
On 26/03/2021 14:41, Martin Brown wrote:
On 25/03/2021 18:28, Jeff Layman wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:25, Andy Burns wrote:
Jeff Layman wrote:

I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by cash/cheque.

Doubt you'll find one on offer.

https://my.edfenergy.com/gas-electricity/tariff-information-labels/

Enter any valid postcode. Select cash/cheque as payment method, then
click on "Apply filters", Then Cash/cheque Whole Amount (Quarterly).

Quite a few tariffs will appear (eventually - it's a slow website).

They might appear but they are mirages.

I'm waiting for EDF to get back to me and email the relevant
information. Hmm - do I see hell freezing over?...

The only tariffs with decent prices are dual fuel deals for some fixed
period with billing online only and paid by monthly direct debit. It
helps to know your exact annual usage to get to the optimum deal.

I know my exact usage, and have fed both annual kWh figures into the
calculators at EDF and comparison websites.

I find it incredibly frustrating that you cannot just download a table
of numbers showing the various fixed charges and rates.

The whole system is designed to be as opaque and impenetrable as
possible. Why else do we need all those switch sites to do what should
be a fairly simple calculation? I didn't actually check the total number
(including those no longer available), but when I looked at the EDF
tariff list, it seemed there were approaching 100 different tariffs
there. I have no doubt the other big players have a similar number.

One other thing which really annoys me is that nearly all websites
require your actual address as well as your postcode. Why? How many
places are there where the houses on either side will be on completely
different tariff offers? Some comparison sites don't need the full
address. If they don't, why do the others insist on it? It's just to get
you on yet another database somewhere.

Its also so they check you are not an existing customer and then offer
you a better deal!

(you can always use a neighbours address to get a quote!)


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 25/03/2021 16:25, Andy Burns wrote:
Jeff Layman wrote:

I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by cash/cheque.

Doubt you'll find one on offer.

Do any suppliers have quarterly billing combined with quarterly
variable direct debits ?. BT used to offer this but I think they
have removed such a payment option.

On 25/03/2021 16:20, Jeff Layman wrote:

First stage was to set up an online account ("MyAccount") with EDF.
Pretty straightforward. Then I asked for a new tariff. There were a few
filters to get through - I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by
cash/cheque.

That's probably your main problem. Most of the best deals are monthly DD
only.


--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On 25/03/2021 16:55, alan_m wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:20, Jeff Layman wrote:

First stage was to set up an online account ("MyAccount") with EDF.
Pretty straightforward. Then I asked for a new tariff. There were a
few filters to get through - I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay
quarterly by cash/cheque.

That's probably your main problem. Most of the best deals are monthly DD
only.




I've just changed my preference on the cheap energy club from monthly DD
to cash/cheque and all I was offered was fixed price deals 33% to 40%
more than I'm currently paying for a fixed price deal that started
around 30 days ago.


--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

In article ,
alan_m wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:20, Jeff Layman wrote:

First stage was to set up an online account ("MyAccount") with EDF.
Pretty straightforward. Then I asked for a new tariff. There were a
few filters to get through - I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay
quarterly by cash/cheque.

That's probably your main problem. Most of the best deals are monthly DD
only.

Yes. No real point for the consumer with quarterly given the very low
interest rates. But cash flow matters to the companies.

Most of the best deals seem to be variable monthly DD.

--
*Does fuzzy logic tickle? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 25/03/2021 16:20, Jeff Layman wrote:
I thought I should finally make an effort to change from an EDF standard
variable dual-fuel tariff to a fixed EDF one. I assumed it would not be
simple (as far as I could see the tariffs I was interested in weren't
available through a Switch website, and they appeared to be identical on
the EDF website but had different names).

First stage was to set up an online account ("MyAccount") with EDF.
Pretty straightforward. Then I asked for a new tariff. There were a few
filters to get through - I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by
cash/cheque. I was offered only *one* tariff, and that one included a
servicing agreement - and it appeared to be a direct debit one! I wasn't
interested in it. No matter what I tried I could not get to the tariff I
was interested in. So I tried clicking on "live chat" and found it
wasn't available!


It is a long time since I paid a utility bill at a bank using a cheque.

These days nearly all suppliers want paid monthly by direct debit. One
difference is how often they change the amount that they want to take.
It is poaaible to ring your bank and ask them to reclaim a direct debit.
I did once do this. The bank were a little reluntant but they did do as
asked.

I only use electricity and have been using Symbio since learning about
them on Newsnet.


--
Michael Chare

On 25/03/2021 16:57, Michael Chare wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:20, Jeff Layman wrote:
I thought I should finally make an effort to change from an EDF standard
variable dual-fuel tariff to a fixed EDF one. I assumed it would not be
simple (as far as I could see the tariffs I was interested in weren't
available through a Switch website, and they appeared to be identical on
the EDF website but had different names).

First stage was to set up an online account ("MyAccount") with EDF.
Pretty straightforward. Then I asked for a new tariff. There were a few
filters to get through - I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by
cash/cheque. I was offered only *one* tariff, and that one included a
servicing agreement - and it appeared to be a direct debit one! I wasn't
interested in it. No matter what I tried I could not get to the tariff I
was interested in. So I tried clicking on "live chat" and found it
wasn't available!


It is a long time since I paid a utility bill at a bank using a cheque.

Nor do I. For some reason the energy companies still call it "paying by
cheque or cash", but I've been paying by BACS for years.

These days nearly all suppliers want paid monthly by direct debit. One
difference is how often they change the amount that they want to take.
It is poaaible to ring your bank and ask them to reclaim a direct debit.
I did once do this. The bank were a little reluntant but they did do as
asked.

Of course - it's damned if you do and damned if you don't:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-56413991:

"Customers who pay too much to their energy supplier through their
monthly direct debit payment should receive automatic annual refunds,
Ofgem says.

For years, customers have complained that energy firms can hoard
thousands of pounds of overpayments and would only return it on request.

Now the regulator has proposed balances are cleared once a year,
claiming suppliers held a surplus of £1.4bn.

It said some were using the money for "unsustainable business practices".

It's a fiddle:
"On behalf of suppliers, Energy UK said: "Paying by direct debit helps
customers budget by ensuring they pay a regular amount each month even
though their actual energy usage varies significantly over the year."

I'll happily do that by Standing Order, so I remain in control - not the
fat cats running the energy companies. Or they can fit a smart meter and
bill me for what I've actually used, not an unrealistically high fixed
amount.

I only use electricity and have been using Symbio since learning about
them on Newsnet.

Most of my energy expense is gas for central heating.

--

Jeff

On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 18:06:31 +0000, Jeff Layman
wrote:

On 25/03/2021 16:57, Michael Chare wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:20, Jeff Layman wrote:
I thought I should finally make an effort to change from an EDF standard
variable dual-fuel tariff to a fixed EDF one. I assumed it would not be
simple (as far as I could see the tariffs I was interested in weren't
available through a Switch website, and they appeared to be identical on
the EDF website but had different names).

First stage was to set up an online account ("MyAccount") with EDF.
Pretty straightforward. Then I asked for a new tariff. There were a few
filters to get through - I wanted a fixed tariff and to pay quarterly by
cash/cheque. I was offered only *one* tariff, and that one included a
servicing agreement - and it appeared to be a direct debit one! I wasn't
interested in it. No matter what I tried I could not get to the tariff I
was interested in. So I tried clicking on "live chat" and found it
wasn't available!

It is a long time since I paid a utility bill at a bank using a cheque.

Nor do I. For some reason the energy companies still call it "paying by
cheque or cash", but I've been paying by BACS for years.

These days nearly all suppliers want paid monthly by direct debit. One
difference is how often they change the amount that they want to take.
It is poaaible to ring your bank and ask them to reclaim a direct debit.
I did once do this. The bank were a little reluntant but they did do as
asked.

Why a monthly direct debit? Mine produces a bill every three months
and collects the sum due by direct debit.

On 25/03/2021 18:44, Scott wrote:
On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 18:06:31 +0000, Jeff Layman
wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:57, Michael Chare wrote:

These days nearly all suppliers want paid monthly by direct debit. One
difference is how often they change the amount that they want to take.
It is poaaible to ring your bank and ask them to reclaim a direct debit.
I did once do this. The bank were a little reluntant but they did do as
asked.

Why a monthly direct debit? Mine produces a bill every three months
and collects the sum due by direct debit.

Who does that? Did they offer that method or did you have to find out
for yourself? EDF and British Gas don't seem to offer that.

--
Max Demian

On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 22:34:13 +0000, Max Demian
wrote:

On 25/03/2021 18:44, Scott wrote:
On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 18:06:31 +0000, Jeff Layman
wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:57, Michael Chare wrote:

These days nearly all suppliers want paid monthly by direct debit. One
difference is how often they change the amount that they want to take.
It is poaaible to ring your bank and ask them to reclaim a direct debit.
I did once do this. The bank were a little reluntant but they did do as
asked.

Why a monthly direct debit? Mine produces a bill every three months
and collects the sum due by direct debit.

Who does that? Did they offer that method or did you have to find out
for yourself? EDF and British Gas don't seem to offer that.

nPower used to do that. That's how I set up my nPower account. But
then they were taken over by e-on next and mysteriously it appears I
have now "chosen" to be billed and pay monthly. I'm still paying for
what I've used, in arrears, so it doesn't make that much difference.

Nick

On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 22:34:13 +0000, Max Demian
wrote:

On 25/03/2021 18:44, Scott wrote:
On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 18:06:31 +0000, Jeff Layman
wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:57, Michael Chare wrote:

These days nearly all suppliers want paid monthly by direct debit. One
difference is how often they change the amount that they want to take.
It is poaaible to ring your bank and ask them to reclaim a direct debit.
I did once do this. The bank were a little reluntant but they did do as
asked.

Why a monthly direct debit? Mine produces a bill every three months
and collects the sum due by direct debit.

Who does that? Did they offer that method or did you have to find out
for yourself? EDF and British Gas don't seem to offer that.

This is getting interesting. I am now with British Gas after an
enforced switch from Ebico / Robin Hood Energy when the latter went
into administration. I was told existing terms would continue. The
account is described as a monthly direct debit but the bill (which I
cannot find on the website) seems to cover three months. There are
various adjustments (miscellaneous documents) so the position is
difficult to track. They also seem to have put me on a fixed price
tariff. I would have liked to check if that is what I was on before
but the Ebico website has been taken down.

On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 22:34:13 +0000, Max Demian
wrote:

On 25/03/2021 18:44, Scott wrote:
On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 18:06:31 +0000, Jeff Layman
wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:57, Michael Chare wrote:

These days nearly all suppliers want paid monthly by direct debit. One
difference is how often they change the amount that they want to take.
It is poaaible to ring your bank and ask them to reclaim a direct debit.
I did once do this. The bank were a little reluntant but they did do as
asked.

Why a monthly direct debit? Mine produces a bill every three months
and collects the sum due by direct debit.

Who does that? Did they offer that method or did you have to find out
for yourself? EDF and British Gas don't seem to offer that.

*Update* British Gas offers variable direct debit. I think it's
monthly payments but at least it's based on usage. I would never
allow the supplier to invent the amount.

In article ,
Scott wrote:
Why a monthly direct debit? Mine produces a bill every three months
and collects the sum due by direct debit.

They are effectively giving you credit for more time than monthly. Which
is going to cost you more. I don't think any of the best deals do
quarterly.

--
*It IS as bad as you think, and they ARE out to get you.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Fri, 26 Mar 2021 11:19:06 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
Scott wrote:
Why a monthly direct debit? Mine produces a bill every three months
and collects the sum due by direct debit.

They are effectively giving you credit for more time than monthly. Which
is going to cost you more. I don't think any of the best deals do
quarterly.

I think the counter-argument is that you are paying the correct amount
instead of allowing the supplier to pick a higher amount then refund
you - or not - at the end of the year.

On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 16:20:48 +0000, Jeff Layman wrote:

snip tale of unsurprising woe

That's what happens when everyone is intent on getting the lowest possible
price.

On 25/03/2021 17:15, Scion wrote:
On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 16:20:48 +0000, Jeff Layman wrote:

snip tale of unsurprising woe

That's what happens when everyone is intent on getting the lowest possible
price.



Changing supplier is easy and it appears that the worst customer service
is often from the large suppliers that change the most. This tale of woe
possibly has more to do with the method of payment that is not available
on the better tariffs. Industry wide, the energy companies really don't
want customers who pay by cheque or cash and it is more likely they
don't want customers who are unwilling to manage their account on-line.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

alan_m wrote:
On 25/03/2021 17:15, Scion wrote:
On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 16:20:48 +0000, Jeff Layman wrote:

snip tale of unsurprising woe

That's what happens when everyone is intent on getting the lowest possible
price.



Changing supplier is easy and it appears that the worst customer service
is often from the large suppliers that change the most. This tale of woe
possibly has more to do with the method of payment that is not available
on the better tariffs. Industry wide, the energy companies really don't
want customers who pay by cheque or cash and it is more likely they
don't want customers who are unwilling to manage their account on-line.

.... and they're not "energy companies" they're just manipulators of
paperwork between us (the consumers) and the actual businesses which
generate the electricity. Wholly pointless except as a money making
exercise for them.

--
Chris Green
·

Tim Streater wrote:
On 25 Mar 2021 at 17:55:32 GMT, Chris Green wrote:

alan_m wrote:
On 25/03/2021 17:15, Scion wrote:
On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 16:20:48 +0000, Jeff Layman wrote:

snip tale of unsurprising woe

That's what happens when everyone is intent on getting the lowest possible
price.



Changing supplier is easy and it appears that the worst customer service
is often from the large suppliers that change the most. This tale of woe
possibly has more to do with the method of payment that is not available
on the better tariffs. Industry wide, the energy companies really don't
want customers who pay by cheque or cash and it is more likely they
don't want customers who are unwilling to manage their account on-line.

... and they're not "energy companies" they're just manipulators of
paperwork between us (the consumers) and the actual businesses which
generate the electricity. Wholly pointless except as a money making
exercise for them.

Not really pointless. Agreed that for the most part they are just billing
organisations. The volts are actually supplied by the likes of UK Power
Networks, not by such as npower etc.

But the billing side is a largish chunk of the cost. Why shouldn't there be a
mechanism to reduce the cost of that part? It's no different to no longer
queuing up in a shop to wait your turn for some klod to take a tin of cocoa
off the shelf behind him and hand it to you. You may as well do that yourself
while you wait. And so the self-service idea takes off: cheaper for you,
quicker, and thus better for the environment.

And we no longer sit in the car while some geezer fills up our tank. What did
your last servant die of anyway?

Supply of volts and stinking gas is no different: cost reduced by automated
payments. It's also why they're after us to put smart meters in.

None of which argument tells me why there's a pointless 'middleman'
making a profit for no gain to anyone except themselves.

I quite agree that paying efficiently by DD makes sense but that isn't
a reason for the extra 'layer' of paper pushers (or DD pushers)
between me and the actual producers of electricity.

--
Chris Green
·

It happens that Chris Green formulated :
I quite agree that paying efficiently by DD makes sense but that isn't
a reason for the extra 'layer' of paper pushers (or DD pushers)
between me and the actual producers of electricity.

I know you can, but would you expect to always go to the farm for your
milk, for your fruit and your veg? Would you go to the refinery for
your petrol and diesel? To the weaver for your clothes? To the printer
for your books? To the manufacturer for you car. There have always been
middlemen and always will be, because there is a very obvious need to
separate production from distribution and retailing.

Tim Streater wrote:

I quite agree that paying efficiently by DD makes sense but that isn't
a reason for the extra 'layer' of paper pushers (or DD pushers)
between me and the actual producers of electricity.

Don't be silly. If these middlemen didn't do it, then the actual power
companies would have to do it. As it is, they just sell a few large chunks of
power to the middlemen, who set up tarriffs which they offer to us. The
middlemen also insulate us from risk due to changes in the price *they* have
to pay to get power. It's a form of forward buying, similar to forward selling
by coffee growers or other such producers, but I imagine you don't approve of
that either.

So how did it work before it was all done this way? It's not been
like this for all that long has it?

.... and anyway, why can't the suppliers do what the 'middlemen' do and
cut out their profit margin?

--
Chris Green
·

On 25/03/2021 18:56, Tim Streater wrote:


Don't be silly. If these middlemen didn't do it, then the actual power
companies would have to do it. As it is, they just sell a few large chunks of
power to the middlemen, who set up tarriffs which they offer to us. The
middlemen also insulate us from risk due to changes in the price *they* have
to pay to get power. It's a form of forward buying, similar to forward selling
by coffee growers or other such producers, but I imagine you don't approve of
that either.


There used to be a company called Enron who did that, and more recently
Greensill.

Tim Streater brought next idea :
Not really pointless. Agreed that for the most part they are just billing
organisations. The volts are actually supplied by the likes of UK Power
Networks, not by such as npower etc.

They are the retailers, between us and the wholesalers. They seek out
the best deal they can from the wholesalers, it is then up to us to get
the best deal we can from those retailers. I have no complaints, it
works very well indeed for me. My costs have never been so cheap,
relatively.


But the billing side is a largish chunk of the cost. Why shouldn't there be a
mechanism to reduce the cost of that part? It's no different to no longer
queuing up in a shop to wait your turn for some klod to take a tin of cocoa
off the shelf behind him and hand it to you. You may as well do that yourself
while you wait. And so the self-service idea takes off: cheaper for you,
quicker, and thus better for the environment.

And we no longer sit in the car while some geezer fills up our tank. What did
your last servant die of anyway?

Supply of volts and stinking gas is no different: cost reduced by automated
payments. It's also why they're after us to put smart meters in.

Exactly right - work with them, to minimise their costs and due to the
mass of energy supply competition, it brings the overall cost down for
you as a customer.

On 25/03/2021 16:20, Jeff Layman wrote:
I assumed it would not be simple

So you were proved correct. d-i-y, for sure.

Move on - and the less restrictions you apply, the better the deal
you'll find on any of the numerous energy-switching sites.

PA

On 25/03/2021 18:45, Peter Able wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:20, Jeff Layman wrote:
I assumed it would not be simple

So you were proved correct.Â* d-i-y, for sure.

Move on - and the less restrictions you apply, the better the deal
you'll find on any of the numerous energy-switching sites.

PA

Time I switched again too. I've always used the Which? service because I
(more or less) trust them and think they are a useful campaigning
organisation, but does anyone have other thoughts?

On 25/03/2021 21:44, newshound wrote:
On 25/03/2021 18:45, Peter Able wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:20, Jeff Layman wrote:
I assumed it would not be simple

So you were proved correct.Â* d-i-y, for sure.

Move on - and the less restrictions you apply, the better the deal
you'll find on any of the numerous energy-switching sites.

PA

Time I switched again too. I've always used the Which? service because I
(more or less) trust them and think they are a useful campaigning
organisation, but does anyone have other thoughts?

Surely Which? recommends Octopus (according to the adverts) - much more
expensive when I checked their tariffs this year.




--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On 25/03/2021 22:38, alan_m wrote:
On 25/03/2021 21:44, newshound wrote:
On 25/03/2021 18:45, Peter Able wrote:
On 25/03/2021 16:20, Jeff Layman wrote:
I assumed it would not be simple

So you were proved correct.Â* d-i-y, for sure.

Move on - and the less restrictions you apply, the better the deal
you'll find on any of the numerous energy-switching sites.

PA

Time I switched again too. I've always used the Which? service because
I (more or less) trust them and think they are a useful campaigning
organisation, but does anyone have other thoughts?

Surely Which? recommends Octopus (according to the adverts) - much more
expensive when I checked their tariffs this year.




https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/co...ricity-prices/

Seems to be pretty comprehensive.

And, OP, there is an option called "pay on receipt of bill" - if you
insist on not using Direct Debit. Seems to cost about £200 extra per
annum if you do so. Your choice.

PA