Ethanol
 

Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol - coming
here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it the usual
press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some time, and is
known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which don't last
forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

--
*It sounds like English, but I can't understand a word you're saying.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Ethanol
 

On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 00:32:54 +0000, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol -
coming here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it
the usual press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some
time, and is known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which
don't last forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific
was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

I used an ethanol added (~10%) petrol in the fifties, sixties and
seventies in my Triumph T100 motorbike and in my Ford RS1600 car. It was
called Cleverland Discol and proved to be an excellent fuel with a
perceived extra zip.

Ethanol
 

On 04/03/2021 00:32, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol - coming
here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it the usual
press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some time, and is
known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which don't last
forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

Nope, but if I had a classic car:
https://www.hagerty.co.uk/articles/e...r-classic-car/

Ethanol
 

On 04/03/2021 06:18, Richard wrote:
On 04/03/2021 00:32, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol - coming
here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it the usual
press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some time, and is
known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which don't last
forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific was
mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

Nope, but if I had a classic car:

Or petrol lawn mower.

https://www.briggsandstratton.com/eu.../fuel-fit.html


--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

Ethanol
 

Well seems a little odd. I have used ethanol as cleaners for all sorts of
things with no strange effects.
Of course it has to depend on the solder. The current lead free stuff is
crap in and of itself.
Brian

--

This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol - coming
here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it the usual
press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some time, and is
known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which don't last
forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

--
*It sounds like English, but I can't understand a word you're saying.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Ethanol
 

Can you explain though why there is a different smell to the exhaust on
Ethanol powered cars. Its like its sweet and almost sugary on the tip of
ones tongue, or is this just me and my peculiar sense organs!

Brian

--

This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"jon" wrote in message ...
On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 00:32:54 +0000, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol -
coming here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it
the usual press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some
time, and is known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which
don't last forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific
was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

I used an ethanol added (~10%) petrol in the fifties, sixties and
seventies in my Triumph T100 motorbike and in my Ford RS1600 car. It was
called Cleverland Discol and proved to be an excellent fuel with a
perceived extra zip.

Ethanol
 

"jon" wrote in message ...
On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 00:32:54 +0000, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol -
coming here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it
the usual press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some
time, and is known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which
don't last forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific
was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

I used an ethanol added (~10%) petrol in the fifties, sixties and
seventies in my Triumph T100 motorbike and in my Ford RS1600 car. It was
called Cleverland Discol and proved to be an excellent fuel with a
perceived extra zip.

Its actually got reduced zip.

Ethanol
 

Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote

Can you explain though why there is a different smell to the exhaust
on Ethanol powered cars. Its like its sweet and almost sugary on the
tip of ones tongue, or is this just me and my peculiar sense organs!

Probably. We have always had E10 here and I have used
it to see if its better value and havent found that it is.

"jon" wrote in message ...
On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 00:32:54 +0000, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol -
coming here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it
the usual press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some
time, and is known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which
don't last forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific
was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

I used an ethanol added (~10%) petrol in the fifties, sixties and
seventies in my Triumph T100 motorbike and in my Ford RS1600 car. It was
called Cleverland Discol and proved to be an excellent fuel with a
perceived extra zip.

Lonely Obnoxious Cantankerous Auto-contradicting Senile Ozzie Troll Alert!
 

On Thu, 4 Mar 2021 19:37:46 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the trolling senile cretin's latest troll**** unread

--
Richard addressing senile Rodent Speed:
"**** you're thick/pathetic excuse for a troll."
MID:

Ethanol
 

On 04/03/2021 00:32, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol - coming
here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it the usual
press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some time, and is
known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which don't last
forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?


I'm not a chemist, but as far as I know, Ethanol doesn't attack solder.
However, Acetic Acid (Ethanoic Acid - oxydised Ethanol - vinegar) does
react with Lead and maybe there's some of that present.

The reaction product is Lead Acetate which used to be called 'Sugar of
Lead' because of its sweet taste, and maybe that explains the sweet
smell referred to by Brian Gaff later.

[Lead used to be hung in beer which has gone off to remove the vinegar
and replace it with Sugar of Lead. This is no longer done. Health and
safety gone mad, I say.]

--
Cheers
Clive

Ethanol
 

alan_m posted
On 04/03/2021 06:18, Richard wrote:
On 04/03/2021 00:32, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol - coming
here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it the usual
press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some time, and is
known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which don't last
forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific was
mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?
Nope, but if I had a classic car:

Or petrol lawn mower.

https://www.briggsandstratton.com/eu.../fuel-fit.html

This doesn't answer the question of whether E10 fuel will damage petrol
lawn mowers, though.

--
Algernon

Ethanol
 

Chris Hogg wrote:

I always thought the smell of the exhaust of high-performance engines
such as in sports and racing cars at hill climb meetings etc was due
to the use of 'Castrol' somewhere in the fuel mix (whatever Castrol
was)

"Castrol R" based on castor oil.

Ethanol
 

On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 20:21:23 +1100, Rod Speed wrote:

Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote

Can you explain though why there is a different smell to the exhaust on
Ethanol powered cars. Its like its sweet and almost sugary on the tip
of ones tongue, or is this just me and my peculiar sense organs!

Probably. We have always had E10 here and I have used it to see if its
better value and havent found that it is.

"jon" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 00:32:54 +0000, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol -
coming here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it
the usual press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some
time, and is known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes.
Which don't last forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one
specific was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of
brass).
Any comments?

I used an ethanol added (~10%) petrol in the fifties, sixties and
seventies in my Triumph T100 motorbike and in my Ford RS1600 car. It
was called Cleverland Discol and proved to be an excellent fuel with a
perceived extra zip.



Of course most petrol had lead in it up to the nineties.

Ethanol
 

Chris Hogg wrote:

I always thought the smell of the exhaust of high-performance engines
such as in sports and racing cars at hill climb meetings etc was due
to the use of 'Castrol' somewhere in the fuel mix (whatever Castrol
was), but I'm probably wrong.

"Castrol R", it was the classic engine oil used in early racing
engines, do a web search and you can read all about it.

--
Chris Green
·

Ethanol
 

Chris Hogg wrote:

I always thought the smell of the exhaust of high-performance engines
such as in sports and racing cars at hill climb meetings etc was due
to the use of 'Castrol' somewhere in the fuel mix (whatever Castrol
was), but I'm probably wrong.

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/archive/article/july-2000/55/castrol-r

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK
@ChrisJDixon1

Plant amazing Acers.

Ethanol
 

On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 09:54:20 +0000, Chris Hogg wrote:

On Thu, 4 Mar 2021 09:41:01 +0000, Clive Arthur
wrote:

On 04/03/2021 00:32, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol -
coming here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it
the usual press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some
time, and is known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which
don't last forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific
was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of
brass). Any comments?


I'm not a chemist, but as far as I know, Ethanol doesn't attack solder.
However, Acetic Acid (Ethanoic Acid - oxydised Ethanol - vinegar) does
react with Lead and maybe there's some of that present.

The reaction product is Lead Acetate which used to be called 'Sugar of
Lead' because of its sweet taste, and maybe that explains the sweet
smell referred to by Brian Gaff later.

[Lead used to be hung in beer which has gone off to remove the vinegar
and replace it with Sugar of Lead. This is no longer done. Health and
safety gone mad, I say.]

The Romans used 'sugar of lead' to sweeten their wines. Said to be the
underlying cause of the fall of the Roman Empire as they all slowly went
mad and lost their powers of reason.

I always thought the smell of the exhaust of high-performance engines
such as in sports and racing cars at hill climb meetings etc was due to
the use of 'Castrol' somewhere in the fuel mix (whatever Castrol was),
but I'm probably wrong.

Lead in the petrol caused the sweetnes, Castrol was a vegetable oil used
in racing and left a very distinctive smell when burnt.

Ethanol
 

Possibly, though unlikely. Bioethanol is made from fermentation of sugar
(from cane). Sucrose is said to be slightly soluble in ethanol (about 1
in 170), so I wonder if any could be carried over in the final stage
distillation process. If it was, and that was burnt, it could account
for a caramel odour. I would very much doubt it, though, and it would
need a very sensitive nose to detect it.

--

Jeff

On 04/03/2021 08:21, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
Can you explain though why there is a different smell to the exhaust on
Ethanol powered cars. Its like its sweet and almost sugary on the tip of
ones tongue, or is this just me and my peculiar sense organs!

Brian

Ethanol
 

On Thu, 4 Mar 2021 09:58:54 +0000, Andy Burns
wrote:

Chris Hogg wrote:

I always thought the smell of the exhaust of high-performance engines
such as in sports and racing cars at hill climb meetings etc was due
to the use of 'Castrol' somewhere in the fuel mix (whatever Castrol
was)

"Castrol R" based on castor oil.

Don't think it was the same the and the resultant smell was nice but
weren't you able to apply a shot (or shots) of 'Redex' (an Upper
Cylinder Lubricant) in with your fuel?

I'm pretty sure all those lads running 'racing' bikes / cars of the
day would use it, as did my Dad in his Austin A40 a few times (as he
would let me add it). You just told them how many shots you applied
(if it was self service). ;-)

Those were the days when you could have loads of things out on the
forecourt and they wouldn't generally get stolen ... including the
tyre inflator (that would be on a quick connector).

Watering cans, Redex shot dispenser, buckets with water and a sponge
and squeegee in, small oil display racks etc.

Now it's just firewood, disposable BBQ's and bags of charcoal, flowers
and bottled water?

Cheers, T i m

Ethanol
 

I was under the impression that all cars running on unleaded were burning
10% ethanol. Or are you talking about the difference between diesel and
petrol? I doubt there are any ethanol fuelled cars outside of a race track
or drag strip.

Tim


Brian Gaff \(Sofa\) wrote:
Can you explain though why there is a different smell to the exhaust on
Ethanol powered cars. Its like its sweet and almost sugary on the tip of
ones tongue, or is this just me and my peculiar sense organs!

Brian




--
Please don't feed the trolls

Ethanol
 

On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 00:32:54 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol - coming
here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it the usual
press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some time, and is
known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which don't last
forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

There is an E10 compatibility checker:
https://www.gov.uk/check-vehicle-e10-petrol

Says E10 petrol is cleared for use in all models with petrol engines
from 1st January 2000 (Nissan).

Ethanol
 

On 4 Mar 2021 11:29:21 GMT, Tim+ wrote:

I was under the impression that all cars running on unleaded were burning
10% ethanol. Or are you talking about the difference between diesel and
petrol? I doubt there are any ethanol fuelled cars outside of a race track
or drag strip.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/e10-petrol-explained

E10 means petrol contains up to 10% renewable ethanol. To date, petrol
in the UK has contained up to 5% renewable ethanol (known as E5).

E10 petrol is already widely used around the world, including across
Europe, the US and Australia. It has also been the reference fuel
against which new cars are tested for emissions and performance since
2016.

Ethanol
 

On 04/03/2021 06:18, Richard wrote:
On 04/03/2021 00:32, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol - coming
here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it the usual
press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some time, and is
known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which don't last
forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific was
mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

Nope, but if I had a classic car:
https://www.hagerty.co.uk/articles/e...r-classic-car/



Only applies to 95 octane petrol. The super grade will remain
at 5%

Ethanol
 

On 04/03/2021 11:36, Scott wrote:
On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 00:32:54 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol - coming
here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it the usual
press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some time, and is
known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which don't last
forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

There is an E10 compatibility checker:
https://www.gov.uk/check-vehicle-e10-petrol

Says E10 petrol is cleared for use in all models with petrol engines
from 1st January 2000 (Nissan).


Some versions of the Avensis between 2004 and 2008?
cannot use it though, but they can still use the super grade
of petrol.

Ethanol
 

In article ,
Andy Burns wrote:
Chris Hogg wrote:

I always thought the smell of the exhaust of high-performance engines
such as in sports and racing cars at hill climb meetings etc was due
to the use of 'Castrol' somewhere in the fuel mix (whatever Castrol
was)

"Castrol R" based on castor oil.

which explains the name.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

Ethanol
 

On 04/03/2021 00:32, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol - coming
here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it the usual
press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some time, and is
known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which don't last
forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?


You're probably already using E5 petrol, E10 is just more of the same.

The biggest concern is that ethanol is hygroscopic, it absorbs water,
and you don't want a watery fuel stagnating in your fuel tank.
Especially if you only use your car once in a while.

You can get ethanol corrosion inhibitor to slow/stop these effects.

I'm surprised the equivalent of diesel bug isn't an issue?

As long as the fuel is dry or has corrosion inhibitor then it shouldn't
attack either lead (in old solder) or zinc (in brass).

Ethanol
 

In article ,
Jethro_uk wrote:
On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 00:32:54 +0000, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol -
coming here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it
the usual press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some
time, and is known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which
don't last forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific
was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

I can remember when unleaded petrol was being phased in, and some
cockwombling fire chief scored weeks of publicity saying it was a bad
thing as it was more flammable that real petrol.

Which suggests (as always) the 80:20 law still applies, and 80% of
reportage is utter ********.

My feeling too. Or the articles I've read try to simplify things for us
peasants and invent 'science' that doesn't exist.

One said the ethanol absorbs moisture from air. And that 'condensation'
will attack lead, zinc, brass, copper and of course steel. As well as
rubber and some plastics.

--
*The problem with the gene pool is that there is no lifeguard *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Ethanol
 

In article
,
Tim+ wrote:
I was under the impression that all cars running on unleaded were burning
10% ethanol. Or are you talking about the difference between diesel and
petrol? I doubt there are any ethanol fuelled cars outside of a race track
or drag strip.

Tim


Brian Gaff \(Sofa\) wrote:
Can you explain though why there is a different smell to the exhaust on
Ethanol powered cars. Its like its sweet and almost sugary on the tip of
ones tongue, or is this just me and my peculiar sense organs!

Brian


Current 95 octane is E5 - 5% alcohol. The proposed new E10, so 10%. Some
countries have E85. And if a poorer country, likely a larger proportion of
old cars?

--
*I finally got my head together, now my body is falling apart.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Ethanol
 

In article ,
Scott wrote:
On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 00:32:54 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol - coming
here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it the usual
press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some time, and is
known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which don't last
forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

There is an E10 compatibility checker:
https://www.gov.uk/check-vehicle-e10-petrol

Says E10 petrol is cleared for use in all models with petrol engines
from 1st January 2000 (Nissan).

BL said none of their vehicles pre 1992 (or whatever) could be run on
unleaded without modification or the use of an additive. Which was
nonsense. But did apply to some of their old engine designs, like the
Mini. So I'd not take what a maker says as gospel. They have no legal
responsibility for 20 year old cars, but a vested interest in selling new
ones.

--
*A person who smiles in the face of adversity probably has a scapegoat *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Ethanol
 

On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 14:12:27 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
Scott wrote:
On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 00:32:54 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol - coming
here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it the usual
press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some time, and is
known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which don't last
forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

There is an E10 compatibility checker:
https://www.gov.uk/check-vehicle-e10-petrol

Says E10 petrol is cleared for use in all models with petrol engines
from 1st January 2000 (Nissan).

BL said none of their vehicles pre 1992 (or whatever) could be run on
unleaded without modification or the use of an additive. Which was
nonsense. But did apply to some of their old engine designs, like the
Mini. So I'd not take what a maker says as gospel. They have no legal
responsibility for 20 year old cars, but a vested interest in selling new
ones.

Wasn't it the case that the ones with the Honda engines were okay?

Ethanol
 

Dave Plowman wrote:

Current 95 octane is E5 - 5% alcohol.

That's up to 5%, though apparently it is 0% from Esso in a handful of
areas (Devon, Cornwall, Teesside, Scotland, NW England).

Ethanol
 

On 04/03/2021 09:54, Chris Hogg wrote:
On Thu, 4 Mar 2021 09:41:01 +0000, Clive Arthur
wrote:


The Romans used 'sugar of lead' to sweeten their wines. Said to be the
underlying cause of the fall of the Roman Empire as they all slowly
went mad and lost their powers of reason.


I don't know about the Romans but it's currently thought to be the cause
of Beethoven's deafness, irascibility and early demise.

Another Dave

--
Change nospam to techie

Ethanol
 

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article
,
Tim+ wrote:
I was under the impression that all cars running on unleaded were burning
10% ethanol. Or are you talking about the difference between diesel and
petrol? I doubt there are any ethanol fuelled cars outside of a race track
or drag strip.

Tim


Brian Gaff \(Sofa\) wrote:
Can you explain though why there is a different smell to the exhaust on
Ethanol powered cars. Its like its sweet and almost sugary on the tip of
ones tongue, or is this just me and my peculiar sense organs!

Brian


Current 95 octane is E5 - 5% alcohol.

My mistake. Quite right.

The proposed new E10, so 10%. Some
countries have E85. And if a poorer country, likely a larger proportion of
old cars?


Tim


--
Please don't feed the trolls

Ethanol
 

In article ,
Scott wrote:
On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 14:12:27 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
Scott wrote:
On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 00:32:54 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol - coming
here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it the usual
press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some time, and is
known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which don't last
forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

There is an E10 compatibility checker:
https://www.gov.uk/check-vehicle-e10-petrol

Says E10 petrol is cleared for use in all models with petrol engines
from 1st January 2000 (Nissan).

BL said none of their vehicles pre 1992 (or whatever) could be run on
unleaded without modification or the use of an additive. Which was
nonsense. But did apply to some of their old engine designs, like the
Mini. So I'd not take what a maker says as gospel. They have no legal
responsibility for 20 year old cars, but a vested interest in selling new
ones.

Wasn't it the case that the ones with the Honda engines were okay?

All their models with alluminimum cylinder heads - so valve seat inserts -
were OK. Including all those with the Rover V8. And others too. It was
only those with cast iron heads which suffered.

--
*A computer once beat me at chess, but it was no match for me at kickboxing.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Ethanol
 

Jeff Layman wrote

Possibly, though unlikely. Bioethanol is made from fermentation of sugar
(from cane). Sucrose is said to be slightly soluble in ethanol (about 1 in
170), so I wonder if any could be carried over in the final stage
distillation process.

Nope, not with a proper reflux still and thats what all industrial
processes use.

If it was, and that was burnt, it could account for a caramel odour. I
would very much doubt it, though, and it would need a very sensitive nose
to detect it.

He gets that from the dog genes that are
the result of his more unspeakable ancestors
doing unspeakable things with dogs.

Beats the NZers tho, they just get funny voices and weird hair.

Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote

Can you explain though why there is a different smell to the exhaust on
Ethanol powered cars. Its like its sweet and almost sugary on the tip of
ones tongue, or is this just me and my peculiar sense organs!

Ethanol
 

Tim+ wrote

I was under the impression that all cars running
on unleaded were burning 10% ethanol.

Nope. We have a choice of two grades of unleaded here
and E10 as well. The E10 is the only one that contains
ethanol and is a bit cheaper but doesnt give as good a mpg.

Or are you talking about the difference between diesel and petrol?

Nope.

I doubt there are any ethanol fuelled
cars outside of a race track or drag strip.

There are actually in some countrys like Brazil.

Engines designed to run fine on pure ethanol or unleaded petrol.


Brian Gaff \(Sofa\) wrote:
Can you explain though why there is a different smell to the exhaust on
Ethanol powered cars. Its like its sweet and almost sugary on the tip of
ones tongue, or is this just me and my peculiar sense organs!

Brian




--
Please don't feed the trolls

Ethanol
 

"Fredxx" wrote in message
...
On 04/03/2021 00:32, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol - coming
here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it the usual
press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some time, and is
known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which don't last
forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific was
mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?


You're probably already using E5 petrol, E10 is just more of the same.

The biggest concern is that ethanol is hygroscopic, it absorbs water, and
you don't want a watery fuel stagnating in your fuel tank. Especially if
you only use your car once in a while.

You can get ethanol corrosion inhibitor to slow/stop these effects.

I'm surprised the equivalent of diesel bug isn't an issue?

No bugs like an ethanol water mix.

As long as the fuel is dry or has corrosion inhibitor then it shouldn't
attack either lead (in old solder) or zinc (in brass).

Ethanol
 

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Jethro_uk wrote:
On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 00:32:54 +0000, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol -
coming here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it
the usual press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some
time, and is known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which
don't last forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific
was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

I can remember when unleaded petrol was being phased in, and some
cockwombling fire chief scored weeks of publicity saying it was a bad
thing as it was more flammable that real petrol.

Which suggests (as always) the 80:20 law still applies, and 80% of
reportage is utter ********.

My feeling too. Or the articles I've read try to simplify things for us
peasants and invent 'science' that doesn't exist.

One said the ethanol absorbs moisture from air.

It does and its quite hard to get absolute ethanol
with no water in it at all. Distillation doesn’t do it.

And that 'condensation' will attack lead, zinc,
brass, copper and of course steel. As well as
rubber and some plastics.

More Heavy Trolling by Senile Nym-Shifting Rodent Speed!
 

On Fri, 5 Mar 2021 05:49:07 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest troll**** unread

--
JimK addressing senile Rodent Speed:
"I really feel the quality of your trolling has dropped in the last few
months..."
MID:

Lonely Obnoxious Cantankerous Auto-contradicting Senile Ozzie Troll Alert!
 

On Fri, 5 Mar 2021 06:11:12 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest troll**** unread

--
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"Rod speed is not a Brexiteer. He is an Australian troll and arsehole."
Message-ID:

Ethanol
 

On 04/03/2021 09:57, Jethro_uk wrote:
On Thu, 04 Mar 2021 00:32:54 +0000, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Been quite a few scare stories in the press about how E10 petrol -
coming here later this year - will damage many older cars. Much of it
the usual press ********, after all E5 has been around for quite some
time, and is known to attack older 'rubber' flexible fuel pipes. Which
don't last forever anyway. Much of it generalization, but one specific
was mentioned.
It attacks the solder used on carburetter floats (those made of brass).
Any comments?

I can remember when unleaded petrol was being phased in, and some
cockwombling fire chief scored weeks of publicity saying it was a bad
thing as it was more flammable that real petrol.

Which suggests (as always) the 80:20 law still applies, and 80% of
reportage is utter ********.

Now if he said it was more carcinogenic he would have been right, from
the increased levels of benzene and other aromatic compounds.