https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I bought one of these to monitor the electric consumption of the electric car I recently purchased. The car isn't seeing much use so it only goes on charge about once week.
I keep a note of the distance covered and record it against the kWhs used to recharge the batteries.

The strange thing is the meter records usage when the car isn't being charged.(i.e.) last week after recharging the meter read 73.65kWh. This morning when going to recharge the car again the meter read 74.16kWh so where did the 0.51kW go ?
Gremlins
Is my neighbour plugging in extension lead ?

It just questions my faith in the meter.

On 28/11/2020 12:57, fred wrote:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I bought one of these to monitor the electric consumption of the electric car I recently purchased. The car isn't seeing much use so it only goes on charge about once week.
I keep a note of the distance covered and record it against the kWhs used to recharge the batteries.

The strange thing is the meter records usage when the car isn't being charged.(i.e.) last week after recharging the meter read 73.65kWh. This morning when going to recharge the car again the meter read 74.16kWh so where did the 0.51kW go ?
Gremlins
Is my neighbour plugging in extension lead ?

It just questions my faith in the meter.

Is it measuring its own consumption? A week to use 0.51kWh would suggest
about 3W being used by its own circuitry. If it is measuring that, it
could be the sort of figure you could expect from such a device.

Have you tried it on other sockets to see if it shows the same thing?

--

Jeff

On 28/11/2020 13:16, Jeff Layman wrote:
Is it measuring its own consumption? A week to use 0.51kWh would suggest
about 3W being used by its own circuitry.Â* If it is measuring that, it
could be the sort of figure you could expect from such a device.
+1

--
Canada is all right really, though not for the whole weekend.

"Saki"

fred wrote:

where did the 0.51kW go ?

keeping the charger warm

On Sat, 28 Nov 2020 04:57:04 -0800 (PST), fred wrote:

The strange thing is the meter records usage when the car isn't being
charged.(i.e.) last week after recharging the meter read 73.65kWh. This
morning when going to recharge the car again the meter read 74.16kWh so
where did the 0.51kW go ?

Was the car charger plugged into the meter? Does said charger have a
physical on/off switch, that breaks the circut? Was that in the on or
off position? Or does it have a "soft" power switch that just
electronically switches the device "off". Or no power switch at all?

3W could easyly be the "standby" power consumption of the charger, in
anything other than phyiscally switched off.

I've recently got one of those type of power meters. With it plugged
in and powered up but nothing plugged into it it shows zero power.
What does yours show? What does it show with the chrager in and "on"?

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 28/11/2020 12:57, fred wrote:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I bought one of these to monitor the electric consumption of the electric car I recently purchased. The car isn't seeing much use so it only goes on charge about once week.
I keep a note of the distance covered and record it against the kWhs used to recharge the batteries.

The strange thing is the meter records usage when the car isn't being charged.(i.e.) last week after recharging the meter read 73.65kWh. This morning when going to recharge the car again the meter read 74.16kWh so where did the 0.51kW go ?
Gremlins
Is my neighbour plugging in extension lead ?

It just questions my faith in the meter.


Have you tried fully charging it, leaving it standing for a
week without use, and then charging again to see how much battery
capacity has 'gone' without use ?.

"Andrew" wrote in message
...
On 28/11/2020 12:57, fred wrote:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I bought one of these to monitor the electric consumption of the electric
car I recently purchased. The car isn't seeing much use so it only goes
on charge about once week.
I keep a note of the distance covered and record it against the kWhs used
to recharge the batteries.

The strange thing is the meter records usage when the car isn't being
charged.(i.e.) last week after recharging the meter read 73.65kWh. This
morning when going to recharge the car again the meter read 74.16kWh so
where did the 0.51kW go ?
Gremlins
Is my neighbour plugging in extension lead ?

It just questions my faith in the meter.


Have you tried fully charging it, leaving it standing for a
week without use, and then charging again to see how much battery
capacity has 'gone' without use ?.

I think he's talking about the meter for the house, rather than a "fuel
gauge" meter in the car, showing how much energy the batteries have stored.




Fred, having recharged the car last week to "full", was it plugged into the
meter for the week that it was not being used? Or does "when going to
recharge the car again" imply that it nothing was plugged into the meter
until you started to charge the car this morning?

Does the meter *only* measure electricity fed to the charger, or could it be
including some other usage within the house? Is it a separate meter to the
electricity company meter by which your bills are calculated? Could there be
a small leakage current flowing even when the charger isn't supplying power
to charge the car? Can you turn the charger off at its input when you know
that you won't need to charge the car? 0.51 kWhr in several days is not
much. To put it into perspective, my computer and monitor uses about 1.1
kWhr per day for the 12-14 hours that it is turned on (they are on standby
overnight, and the monitor is on standby during the day when I'm not
actually sat in front of it).

On Saturday, November 28, 2020 at 10:07:35 PM UTC, NY wrote:
"Andrew" wrote in message
...
On 28/11/2020 12:57, fred wrote:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I bought one of these to monitor the electric consumption of the electric
car I recently purchased. The car isn't seeing much use so it only goes
on charge about once week.
I keep a note of the distance covered and record it against the kWhs used
to recharge the batteries.

The strange thing is the meter records usage when the car isn't being
charged.(i.e.) last week after recharging the meter read 73.65kWh. This
morning when going to recharge the car again the meter read 74.16kWh so
where did the 0.51kW go ?
Gremlins
Is my neighbour plugging in extension lead ?

It just questions my faith in the meter.


Have you tried fully charging it, leaving it standing for a
week without use, and then charging again to see how much battery
capacity has 'gone' without use ?.
I think he's talking about the meter for the house, rather than a "fuel
gauge" meter in the car, showing how much energy the batteries have stored.




Fred, having recharged the car last week to "full", was it plugged into the
meter for the week that it was not being used? Or does "when going to
recharge the car again" imply that it nothing was plugged into the meter
until you started to charge the car this morning?

Does the meter *only* measure electricity fed to the charger, or could it be
including some other usage within the house? Is it a separate meter to the
electricity company meter by which your bills are calculated? Could there be
a small leakage current flowing even when the charger isn't supplying power
to charge the car? Can you turn the charger off at its input when you know
that you won't need to charge the car? 0.51 kWhr in several days is not
much. To put it into perspective, my computer and monitor uses about 1.1
kWhr per day for the 12-14 hours that it is turned on (they are on standby
overnight, and the monitor is on standby during the day when I'm not
actually sat in front of it).

The car charger is mounted on a wall of the garage and the supply is to a dedicated socket via the meter . I now understand the small stray usage I observe is down to the unit itself. Its obviously of no consequence. The unit maintains a running total which I find useful as it allows me to calculate the actual cost and stop SWMBO whinging about me getting free fuel for my small car while she has to buy diesel for hers. I've offered her the use of the i3 but she thinks it beneath her.

On Sun, 29 Nov 2020 03:43:03 -0800 (PST), fred wrote:

I now understand the small stray usage I observe is down to the unit
itself. Its obviously of no consequence.

Except you are paying for it. OK 1 W is only about £1/year but all
those "little watts" soon add up. Just after I got a similar meter I
counted how many devices where routinely plugged in and on, came to
48 (and I missed a few).

Just adding a remote switch to my office desk and switching off
everything that doesn't need to be "on" (ie plugged in switched on,
standby) over night has dropped the overnight base load by at least
30 W.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Sunday, November 29, 2020 at 12:54:30 PM UTC, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sun, 29 Nov 2020 03:43:03 -0800 (PST), fred wrote:

I now understand the small stray usage I observe is down to the unit
itself. Its obviously of no consequence.
Except you are paying for it. OK 1 W is only about £1/year but all
those "little watts" soon add up. Just after I got a similar meter I
counted how many devices where routinely plugged in and on, came to
48 (and I missed a few).

Just adding a remote switch to my office desk and switching off
everything that doesn't need to be "on" (ie plugged in switched on,
standby) over night has dropped the overnight base load by at least
30 W.

--
Cheers
Dave.

Its worth it to me for the convenience

On Saturday, November 28, 2020 at 7:45:54 PM UTC, Andrew wrote:
On 28/11/2020 12:57, fred wrote:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I bought one of these to monitor the electric consumption of the electric car I recently purchased. The car isn't seeing much use so it only goes on charge about once week.
I keep a note of the distance covered and record it against the kWhs used to recharge the batteries.

The strange thing is the meter records usage when the car isn't being charged.(i.e.) last week after recharging the meter read 73.65kWh. This morning when going to recharge the car again the meter read 74.16kWh so where did the 0.51kW go ?
Gremlins
Is my neighbour plugging in extension lead ?

It just questions my faith in the meter.

Have you tried fully charging it, leaving it standing for a
week without use, and then charging again to see how much battery
capacity has 'gone' without use ?.

Thats my normal modus operandi.

On 28/11/2020 12:57, fred wrote:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I bought one of these to monitor the electric consumption of the electric car I recently purchased. The car isn't seeing much use so it only goes on charge about once week.
I keep a note of the distance covered and record it against the kWhs used to recharge the batteries.

The strange thing is the meter records usage when the car isn't being charged.(i.e.) last week after recharging the meter read 73.65kWh. This morning when going to recharge the car again the meter read 74.16kWh so where did the 0.51kW go ?
Gremlins
Is my neighbour plugging in extension lead ?

It just questions my faith in the meter.


According to the blurb, it switches itself off at above 1650watts, so I
would have thought it was totally unsuitable for measuring car charging
consumption, anyway.
--
Cheers,
Roger

"Roger Mills" wrote in message
...
On 28/11/2020 12:57, fred wrote:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I bought one of these to monitor the electric consumption of the electric
car I recently purchased. The car isn't seeing much use so it only goes
on charge about once week.
I keep a note of the distance covered and record it against the kWhs used
to recharge the batteries.

The strange thing is the meter records usage when the car isn't being
charged.(i.e.) last week after recharging the meter read 73.65kWh. This
morning when going to recharge the car again the meter read 74.16kWh so
where did the 0.51kW go ?
Gremlins
Is my neighbour plugging in extension lead ?

It just questions my faith in the meter.


According to the blurb, it switches itself off at above 1650watts, so I
would have thought it was totally unsuitable for measuring car charging
consumption, anyway.

Hadn't spotted that little gem. Having an overload cutout above 1650W makes
it about as much use as a chocolate teapot for many appliances - oh, and you
wouldn't be able to use a kettle to heat the water in the chocolate teapot
;-)

You'd expect the cutout to be set at slightly more than 3 kW, to allow for
the maximum 13A current draw (plus a bit of headroom) from one 3-pin socket.

NY wrote:

Roger Mills wrote:

According to the blurb, it switches itself off at above 1650watts, so
I would have thought it was totally unsuitable for measuring car
charging consumption, anyway.

Hadn't spotted that little gem. Having an overload cutout above 1650W
makes it about as much use as a chocolate teapot for many appliances -
oh, and you wouldn't be able to use a kettle to heat the water in the
chocolate teapot ;-)

You'd expect the cutout to be set at slightly more than 3 kW, to allow
for the maximum 13A current draw (plus a bit of headroom) from one 3-pin
socket.

Maybe the 1650W is a copy/paste error from a 110V spec version?
Elsewhere it says

- Operating current: max 13A
· Wide voltage range: 200V-250V
· Wattage display(Watts): 0W-2900W
· Current display(Amps): 0.0A---13.0A

On Sun, 29 Nov 2020 02:12:12 +0000, Andy Burns wrote:

Maybe the 1650W is a copy/paste error from a 110V spec version?
Elsewhere it says

- Operating current: max 13A
· Wide voltage range: 200V-250V
· Wattage display(Watts): 0W-2900W
· Current display(Amps): 0.0A---13.0A

Just boiled a kettle full of cold water (8 "cups", nominal 3kW
kettle) through my very similar looking power meter:

Took: 4'14"
0.196 kWHr

When heating:
2800 ish W (wandered about by 5 W or so)
1.00 PF
233 V (min, 236 max ish)
12.02 A (steady so presumably the wandering power reading is down to
the wandering supply voltage the variations in current that causes
being outside the resolution of the current measurement when at 12 A)

Sat on base, hot (it has a still hot LED indicator):
0.4 W
0.05 A

Removed from base:
0.0 W
0.0 A

Overall I'm quite impressed by this gadget considering it was only
£12 or so. It seems accurate and capble of measuring very low loads.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Saturday, November 28, 2020 at 10:23:25 PM UTC, Roger Mills wrote:
On 28/11/2020 12:57, fred wrote:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I bought one of these to monitor the electric consumption of the electric car I recently purchased. The car isn't seeing much use so it only goes on charge about once week.
I keep a note of the distance covered and record it against the kWhs used to recharge the batteries.

The strange thing is the meter records usage when the car isn't being charged.(i.e.) last week after recharging the meter read 73.65kWh. This morning when going to recharge the car again the meter read 74.16kWh so where did the 0.51kW go ?
Gremlins
Is my neighbour plugging in extension lead ?

It just questions my faith in the meter.

According to the blurb, it switches itself off at above 1650watts, so I
would have thought it was totally unsuitable for measuring car charging
consumption, anyway.
--
Cheers,
Roger


Very strange as I've been using it with no problem for some time now

fred wrote:
On Saturday, November 28, 2020 at 10:23:25 PM UTC, Roger Mills wrote:
On 28/11/2020 12:57, fred wrote:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I bought one of these to monitor the electric consumption of the electric car I recently purchased. The car isn't seeing much use so it only goes on charge about once week.
I keep a note of the distance covered and record it against the kWhs used to recharge the batteries.

The strange thing is the meter records usage when the car isn't being charged.(i.e.) last week after recharging the meter read 73.65kWh. This morning when going to recharge the car again the meter read 74.16kWh so where did the 0.51kW go ?
Gremlins
Is my neighbour plugging in extension lead ?

It just questions my faith in the meter.

According to the blurb, it switches itself off at above 1650watts, so I
would have thought it was totally unsuitable for measuring car charging
consumption, anyway.
--
Cheers,
Roger


Very strange as I've been using it with no problem for some time now

I hope when you're charging the car, you're not filling the
battery 100% full. When storing lithium devices (non-use situation),
it's better to keep the battery fractionally full. Maybe 50% to 70%
or so.

Only when you're taking a really long trip and plan to discharge
the battery almost immediately, would you charge to 100%. Also,
charging to precisely 100%, prevents regenerative braking from
working for the first five to ten minutes. The car should switch
modes on its own, because it knows the battery hasn't room to
store regenerated charge at the moment.

Fractional filling will add some life to the battery pack.

It's the same with laptops. Laptops in the past charged to 100%,
and some people left their laptop plugged in all the time. Even though
the charger is smart, this tends to wear on the pack. More modern
laptops have a "stage 1 only" charging option, which charges the
pack to 80%, and then if you leave the adapter plugged in, the
smart charger will never put more than 80% in. Which reduces the
terminal voltage so it spends less time at 4.2V and more time
at 3.7V (LiCo).

I'm sure this is explained in the documentation somewhere. Although
manufacturers want you to think everything they make is an "appliance",
BEV still isn't really at that point yet. We're still at the "pointy bits"
stage and the "don't do that" stage. Some day the vehicles really
will be don't care technology, and the biggest worry will be the
manufacturer making shoddy body panels or the like. Or like the
cars I drive, where everything is "blown alternators" :-) Before
I take a car to the junkyard, the last thing to fail is the
alternator. I saw a flicker the other day when I was out in
the car... and I know what comes next. Some day electric cars
will have a favored failure mode too. Maybe the bumper will fall
off or something :-)

Paul

On 29/11/2020 20:35, Paul wrote:
Fractional filling will add some life to the battery pack.

It's the same with laptops. Laptops in the past charged to 100%,
and some people left their laptop plugged in all the time. Even though
the charger is smart, this tends to wear on the pack. More modern
laptops have a "stage 1 only" charging option, which charges the
pack to 80%, and then if you leave the adapter plugged in, the
smart charger will never put more than 80% in. Which reduces the
terminal voltage so it spends less time at 4.2V and more time
at 3.7V (LiCo).

I'm sure this is explained in the documentation somewhere.

https://accubattery.zendesk.com/hc/e...nd-methodology

I should however point out that the above link is part of the
documentation for the Android Accubattery charge monitoring app so may
be biased.