I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

Tim W

In article ,
TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

Tim W

Some years ago, my BiL wanted to put battens on his cellar wall. He went
out in the morning and bought a B&D hammer drill which lasted him till
lunchtime. He returned it to the shop saying "It just stopped working" nad
got a replacement which failed just as he was drilling the last hole. That
went back next morning, so he ended up with a new drill & the job done.

That was about 40 years ago, they might make them better these days.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

Tim W
Once you've used an SDS (even a cheap one) you will not bother with
old-style percussion drills again

On 11/07/2020 11:17, wrote:
On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

Tim W
Once you've used an SDS (even a cheap one) you will not bother with
old-style percussion drills again

I see they are from about £50 for toolstation own brand. I may never use
it again, and I am trying to clear junk, not accumulate it, but ...
TW

In article ,
TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

My view of hammer drills is they make a lot of noise to not much effect.
And the harder the stone, the less effective they are.

An SDS, on the other hand, just works.

--
*When it rains, why don't sheep shrink? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Saturday, 11 July 2020 11:22:21 UTC+1, charles wrote:
In article ,
TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

Tim W

Some years ago, my BiL wanted to put battens on his cellar wall. He went
out in the morning and bought a B&D hammer drill which lasted him till
lunchtime. He returned it to the shop saying "It just stopped working" nad
got a replacement which failed just as he was drilling the last hole. That
went back next morning, so he ended up with a new drill & the job done.

That was about 40 years ago, they might make them better these days.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle


Our last house and next doors were a one off and the builder back in 1957 used a lot of reclaimed materials such timber he also built the house form overbaked engineering bricks bought from a local specialist brick manufacturer. These bricks were like iron so my standard drill at the time would not even touch them, borrowed a B&D hammer drill off a mate to put some shelves up had to give up after making no impression and grease was leaking out of the gearbox. Eventually got an SDS drill and never looked back still using it even to core drill out 117mm holes.

Richard

On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?


IMLE concrete floors come in different guises. Is it too late to do a
test drill?


--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:
In article ,
TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

My view of hammer drills is they make a lot of noise to not much effect.
And the harder the stone, the less effective they are.

An SDS, on the other hand, just works.

I have an old Stayer SDS which I bought from Screwfix many, many moons
ago for (if I rmeember right) £24. It's still going strong and I just
take it everywhere with me if there's any chance of needing holes in
walls. It has also quite happily managed big holes for waste pipes
and one for a tumble dryer vent. I have drills with 'hammer action'
but never use them now.

--
Chris Green
·

On 11/07/2020 12:01, Robin wrote:
On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?


IMLE concrete floors come in different guises.Â* Is it too late to do a
test drill?



+1

If it's a screed the percussion drill will probably work.

--
Adam

On 11/07/2020 11:17, wrote:
On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

Tim W
Once you've used an SDS (even a cheap one) you will not bother with
old-style percussion drills again

I only use my SDS for core drilling and not more routine stuff as it's a
lump and an effort to heft about, but it was all I had with me the other
day and I needed to drill a couple of holes to fix a sink.

I'll be using it more frequently in the future.

on 11/07/2020, TimW supposed :
Is it going to be up to the task?

Probably not and it will be slowhard work anyway.

I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly.
Are cheap SDS drills much better?

Chalk and cheese. SDS+ will fly through anything, with zero effort.

charles wrote on 11/07/2020 :
Some years ago, my BiL wanted to put battens on his cellar wall. He went
out in the morning and bought a B&D hammer drill which lasted him till
lunchtime. He returned it to the shop saying "It just stopped working" nad
got a replacement which failed just as he was drilling the last hole. That
went back next morning, so he ended up with a new drill & the job done.

That was about 40 years ago, they might make them better these days.

No, hammer drills wear out the hammer mechanism very quickly.

In article ,
Tricky Dicky wrote:
On Saturday, 11 July 2020 11:22:21 UTC+1, charles wrote:
In article ,
TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

Tim W

Some years ago, my BiL wanted to put battens on his cellar wall. He
went out in the morning and bought a B&D hammer drill which lasted him
till lunchtime. He returned it to the shop saying "It just stopped
working" nad got a replacement which failed just as he was drilling the
last hole. That went back next morning, so he ended up with a new drill
& the job done.

That was about 40 years ago, they might make them better these days.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle


Our last house and next doors were a one off aNd the builder back in 1957
used a lot of reclaimed materials such timber he also built the house
form overbaked engineering bricks bought from a local specialist brick
manufacturer. These bricks were like iron so my standard drill at the
time would not even touch them, borrowed a B&D hammer drill off a mate to
put some shelves up had to give up after making no impression and grease
was leaking out of the gearbox. Eventually got an SDS drill and never
looked back still using it even to core drill out 117mm holes.

When I started DIY, I had to use a Rawltool to make any impression in
brickwork. We've come a long way in the past 55 years.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On 11/07/2020 12:05, ARW wrote:
On 11/07/2020 12:01, Robin wrote:
On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be
up to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap
SDS drills much better?


IMLE concrete floors come in different guises.Â* Is it too late to do a
test drill?



+1

If it's a screed the percussion drill will probably work.


Most of the screed in my hosue could be 'drilled' with a screwdriver
:-(, so I just dug it out and fitted 3x2 battens on a 2nd dpc
(long side up) and filled the 250mm gap with 70mm quinntherm and
topped with a hardwood floor.

Green bosch sds drill made short work of drilling the slab and I
used those self-tapping concrete screws to fix the battens down.

On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

Tim W

SDS every time for me. Even a cheap one should be fine.

It does depend on the concrete, of course. Test drill as a check. I've
got away with an ordinary hammer drill offsite with only a 750W genny,
and didn't think that would run the 4kg SDS.

On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:

I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task?

Chances are it will be fine.

I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly.

That's the sort of task more likely to knacker you IME!

There is a huge variation in concrete, and hence how hard it is to drill
- especially with a normal percussion drill. If you are lucky and the
floor is relatively weak then the percussion drill will make a hole it
in. (drilling down is somewhat harder since you can't clear the dust as
easily). However you may take a fair amount of time per hole. If the
concrete is hard, then you may find it very difficult and time consuming
per hole. (and good quality drill bit like a Bosch multi material one
will help)

Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

*any* SDS drill is massively better at drilling holes in hard stuff.

I think with a task like you describe, I would either go get a SDS and
not even bother trying the percussion drill, or, drill a couple of test
holes with what you have and then go get the SDS.

For floor drilling, it sometimes pays to get a *long* bit, so you can do
it standing and not on your knees. (1m SDS bits are readily available in
some diameters, and 450mm ones in most sizes down to 8mm)


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 11/07/2020 12:01, Robin wrote:
On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. ...


....Â* Is it too late to do a
test drill?



Of course! why haven't I just done that? Not always the practical man.

TW

In article ,
says...

On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:

I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task?

Chances are it will be fine.

I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly.

That's the sort of task more likely to knacker you IME!

There is a huge variation in concrete, and hence how hard it is to drill
- especially with a normal percussion drill. If you are lucky and the
floor is relatively weak then the percussion drill will make a hole it
in. (drilling down is somewhat harder since you can't clear the dust as
easily). However you may take a fair amount of time per hole. If the
concrete is hard, then you may find it very difficult and time consuming
per hole. (and good quality drill bit like a Bosch multi material one
will help)

Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

*any* SDS drill is massively better at drilling holes in hard stuff.

I think with a task like you describe, I would either go get a SDS and
not even bother trying the percussion drill, or, drill a couple of test
holes with what you have and then go get the SDS.

For floor drilling, it sometimes pays to get a *long* bit, so you can do
it standing and not on your knees. (1m SDS bits are readily available in
some diameters, and 450mm ones in most sizes down to 8mm)

Fully endorse the SDS comments, but,
Still sounds like a lot of work. Thought about hiring a Spit/Hilti gun?

In message , at 11:17:17 on Sat, 11
Jul 2020, charles remarked:

I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

Some years ago, my BiL wanted to put battens on his cellar wall. He went
out in the morning and bought a B&D hammer drill which lasted him till
lunchtime. He returned it to the shop saying "It just stopped working" nad
got a replacement which failed just as he was drilling the last hole. That
went back next morning, so he ended up with a new drill & the job done.

I broke down and bought an own-brand SDS drill at Screwfix last week.

It's gone on my list of things I should have had years ago. (Although
it's surprising big and heavy - about three times the size and weight of
a regular DIY hammer drill).

Today where was a contractor needing to dig up some of my concrete floor
a different contractor had laid a fortnight ago (Flanders and Swann have
a song about this sort of thing) and he only had a puny cordless, so
lent him mine.
--
Roland Perry

On Saturday, 11 July 2020 15:44:28 UTC+1, Roland Perry wrote:
Today where was a contractor needing to dig up some of my concrete floor
a different contractor had laid a fortnight ago (Flanders and Swann have
a song about this sort of thing) and he only had a puny cordless, so
lent him mine.

Likewise, only the contractor (satellite dish, I don't do satellite dishes up ladders) had a beefy Hilti SDS.

Not much good without a charged battery though :-)

Owain

On 11/07/2020 14:10, John Rumm wrote:
On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:

I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task?

Chances are it will be fine.

I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly.

That's the sort of task more likely to knacker you IME!

There is a huge variation in concrete, and hence how hard it is to drill
- especially with a normal percussion drill. If you are lucky and the
floor is relatively weak then the percussion drill will make a hole it
in. (drilling down is somewhat harder since you can't clear the dust as
easily). However you may take a fair amount of time per hole. If the
concrete is hard, then you may find it very difficult and time consuming
per hole. (and good quality drill bit like a Bosch multi material one
will help)

Are cheap SDS drills much better?

*any* SDS drill is massively better at drilling holes in hard stuff.


snip

Of course, but the heffalump in the room is the fact that you also have
to buy all new drill bits too, because you can't use your ordinary
ones !

In message , at 19:43:12 on Sat, 11 Jul
2020, Andrew remarked:

Are cheap SDS drills much better?

*any* SDS drill is massively better at drilling holes in hard stuff.

Of course, but the heffalump in the room is the fact that you also have
to buy all new drill bits too, because you can't use your ordinary
ones !

The Screwfix one comes with a selection of SDS bits (and two chisels),
also a regular bit to be able to use your others - although they don't
recommend hammering.

As it happens, about half the butch drill bits I've bought the last
20years were actually SDS ones, used in a regular hammer drill.
--
Roland Perry

On Saturday, 11 July 2020 19:43:16 UTC+1, Andrew wrote:
On 11/07/2020 14:10, John Rumm wrote:
On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:

I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task?

Chances are it will be fine.

I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly.

That's the sort of task more likely to knacker you IME!

There is a huge variation in concrete, and hence how hard it is to drill
- especially with a normal percussion drill. If you are lucky and the
floor is relatively weak then the percussion drill will make a hole it
in. (drilling down is somewhat harder since you can't clear the dust as
easily). However you may take a fair amount of time per hole. If the
concrete is hard, then you may find it very difficult and time consuming
per hole. (and good quality drill bit like a Bosch multi material one
will help)

Are cheap SDS drills much better?

*any* SDS drill is massively better at drilling holes in hard stuff.


snip

Of course, but the heffalump in the room is the fact that you also have
to buy all new drill bits too, because you can't use your ordinary
ones !

But you can buy a set of 5 for under a tenner - which would do if they are the sizes you need. Twenty and you get a choice of sets!

I'd be happy to sell an older Lidl SDS with a random selection of bits. It worked well but I decided to get a Makita which really is much nicer to use.

Dave Plowman (News) formulated the question :
My view of hammer drills is they make a lot of noise to not much effect.
And the harder the stone, the less effective they are.

An SDS, on the other hand, just works.

Very true...

I bought my first SDS around 15 years ago from Aldi when they were on
special, no clutch, fixed speed and rather heavy, but it worked and
still works as designed. I bought a lighter, variable

In article ,
Andrew wrote:
On 11/07/2020 14:10, John Rumm wrote:
On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:

I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task?

Chances are it will be fine.

I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly.

That's the sort of task more likely to knacker you IME!

There is a huge variation in concrete, and hence how hard it is to drill
- especially with a normal percussion drill. If you are lucky and the
floor is relatively weak then the percussion drill will make a hole it
in. (drilling down is somewhat harder since you can't clear the dust as
easily). However you may take a fair amount of time per hole. If the
concrete is hard, then you may find it very difficult and time consuming
per hole. (and good quality drill bit like a Bosch multi material one
will help)

Are cheap SDS drills much better?

*any* SDS drill is massively better at drilling holes in hard stuff.


snip

Of course, but the heffalump in the room is the fact that you also have
to buy all new drill bits too, because you can't use your ordinary
ones !

I have a conventional chuck which fits into my SDS drill. So, I can use
ordinary bits without having to bring asecond drill with me.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

It happens that charles formulated :
When I started DIY, I had to use a Rawltool to make any impression in
brickwork. We've come a long way in the past 55 years.

Don't forget the torture of using a star-drill, for the larger fixings.

On 11/07/2020 15:06, TimW wrote:
On 11/07/2020 12:01, Robin wrote:
On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:

I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. ...

....Â* Is it too late to do a test drill?

Of course! why haven't I just done that? Not always the practical man.


And the answer is - yes the bosch pro 240v hammer drill will do the job
fine. No new tools to clutter up my nice new workshop!
TW

On Saturday, 11 July 2020 19:43:16 UTC+1, Andrew wrote:
On 11/07/2020 14:10, John Rumm wrote:
On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:

I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task?

Chances are it will be fine.

I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly.

That's the sort of task more likely to knacker you IME!

There is a huge variation in concrete, and hence how hard it is to drill
- especially with a normal percussion drill. If you are lucky and the
floor is relatively weak then the percussion drill will make a hole it
in. (drilling down is somewhat harder since you can't clear the dust as
easily). However you may take a fair amount of time per hole. If the
concrete is hard, then you may find it very difficult and time consuming
per hole. (and good quality drill bit like a Bosch multi material one
will help)

Are cheap SDS drills much better?

*any* SDS drill is massively better at drilling holes in hard stuff.


snip

Of course, but the heffalump in the room is the fact that you also have
to buy all new drill bits too, because you can't use your ordinary
ones !

Any power tool needs bits/consumables of some sort, it's part of the cost.

Yes you can get adaptor chucks to use old drill bits in SDS machines, but NEVER engage hammer mode with one. If you do you get an instantly destructuve demonstration of the hammering energy difference between a bent washer and an SDS hammer.


NT

On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

Tim W

There's no comparison. Many times I had a customer watching as I
prepared to drill through a wall using a decent SDS.
[Fairly brief noise from drilling]
"Err... is that it?"
"Yes!"
"Bugger me!"
They've often tried to drill little holes for shelves etc so are
expecting a mammoth struggle for me to drill right through the wall.

Although you mention 'cheap'. I wouldn't know, but a good quality mains
SDS is only about £120 anyway. Non-SDS drills are ****e. In fact they
won't even drill through ****e, once it's been left out in the sun.

Bill

On Sat, 11 Jul 2020 11:17:24 +0100, wrote:

On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

Tim W
Once you've used an SDS (even a cheap one) you will not bother with
old-style percussion drills again

Powercraft (Lidl) SDS is very good but too big and heavy for general use.
I've a mains Bosch percussion drill from '97, OK for loads of holes but it's
so bloody loud! A good combi does almost everything nowadays - even about 8
years ago the Makita put 50-off 8mm holes in rustic bricks (vine eyes for
next door's wisteria) on about 1.5 charges of a 1.2Ah NiCad.
--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

On Sat, 11 Jul 2020 12:24:17 +0100, charles wrote:

In article ,
Tricky Dicky wrote:
On Saturday, 11 July 2020 11:22:21 UTC+1, charles wrote:
In article ,
TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

Tim W

Some years ago, my BiL wanted to put battens on his cellar wall. He
went out in the morning and bought a B&D hammer drill which lasted him
till lunchtime. He returned it to the shop saying "It just stopped
working" nad got a replacement which failed just as he was drilling the
last hole. That went back next morning, so he ended up with a new drill
& the job done.

That was about 40 years ago, they might make them better these days.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

Our last house and next doors were a one off aNd the builder back in 1957
used a lot of reclaimed materials such timber he also built the house
form overbaked engineering bricks bought from a local specialist brick
manufacturer. These bricks were like iron so my standard drill at the
time would not even touch them, borrowed a B&D hammer drill off a mate to
put some shelves up had to give up after making no impression and grease
was leaking out of the gearbox. Eventually got an SDS drill and never
looked back still using it even to core drill out 117mm holes.

When I started DIY, I had to use a Rawltool to make any impression in
brickwork. We've come a long way in the past 55 years.

Ah yes, Rawltool for curtain rails onto concrete lintels. I might have been
a forerunner of the SDS - my father was of the 'belt it hard with a big
hammer' brigade; I discovered that very fast hits did the job better. Still
took hours to do all of the holes.
--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

On 11/07/2020 11:17, wrote:
On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

Tim W
Once you've used an SDS (even a cheap one) you will not bother with
old-style percussion drills again
+1 Old JCB one from Argos decades ago weighs a ton but no comparison for
concrete or hard brick.

Ah yes, Rawltool for curtain rails onto concrete lintels. I might have been
a forerunner of the SDS - my father was of the 'belt it hard with a big
hammer' brigade; I discovered that very fast hits did the job better. Still
took hours to do all of the holes.

There was definitely a knack to using a Rawltool and belting as hard as possible was not it. Surprising how many people continued to use them despite available power tools, I once watched a bloke fitting a downspout using one for the screw holes nearly offered him my SDS as it was painful to watch. Mind you at least he did not need a power supply and this was in the days before battery drills came into their own. With the over baked engineering bricks our last house was built from although The SDS did a god job it was still hard work if you had lots to drill. When I replaced all the skirtings and internal door casings I soon learned how to make twisted wooden wedges using the existing mortar gaps the original builder used only needing to make a few new ones.

Richard

On 12/07/2020 10:33, Tricky Dicky wrote:
Ah yes, Rawltool for curtain rails onto concrete lintels. I might have been
a forerunner of the SDS - my father was of the 'belt it hard with a big
hammer' brigade; I discovered that very fast hits did the job better. Still
took hours to do all of the holes.

There was definitely a knack to using a Rawltool ...

Richard


They were perfect for making a conical crater in a lintel.

--
Reentrant

On Sunday, 12 July 2020 03:51:50 UTC+1, williamwright wrote:
On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be up
to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap SDS
drills much better?

Tim W

There's no comparison. Many times I had a customer watching as I
prepared to drill through a wall using a decent SDS.
[Fairly brief noise from drilling]
"Err... is that it?"
"Yes!"
"Bugger me!"
They've often tried to drill little holes for shelves etc so are
expecting a mammoth struggle for me to drill right through the wall.

Although you mention 'cheap'. I wouldn't know, but a good quality mains
SDS is only about £120 anyway. Non-SDS drills are ****e. In fact they
won't even drill through ****e, once it's been left out in the sun.

Bill

You can even get a Bosch or DeWalt for £99.99. Obviously not the tops of their respective ranges. And if willing to go to Titan or Erbauer, drop twenty.

On 11/07/2020 11:29, TimW wrote:
I see they are from about £50 for toolstation own brand. I may never use
it again,

Thats what I thought but since buying it (SDS+) I have demolished a
small wall and broke up a concrete slab that a shed was sitting on.
Also used for lifting floor tiles.
I dont use it often but its a cheapy and still going after 7 years.

In article ,
charles wrote:
When I started DIY, I had to use a Rawltool to make any impression in
brickwork. We've come a long way in the past 55 years.

The other thing is those universal drill bits. Which drill softer masonry
with no need for a hammer action.

--
*Shin: a device for finding furniture in the dark *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Roland Perry wrote:
I broke down and bought an own-brand SDS drill at Screwfix last week.

It's gone on my list of things I should have had years ago. (Although
it's surprising big and heavy - about three times the size and weight of
a regular DIY hammer drill).

My SDS is one of the original affordable ones - DeWalt - and pretty old
now. But very little heavier than a normal mains drill. Low price SDS do
seem to be rather heavier than needed. And the light DeWalt less tiring
when used to chase things.

--
*Honk if you love peace and quiet*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
polygonum_on_google wrote:
On Sunday, 12 July 2020 03:51:50 UTC+1, williamwright wrote:
On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be
up to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap
SDS drills much better?

Tim W

There's no comparison. Many times I had a customer watching as I
prepared to drill through a wall using a decent SDS. [Fairly brief
noise from drilling] "Err... is that it?" "Yes!" "Bugger me!" They've
often tried to drill little holes for shelves etc so are expecting a
mammoth struggle for me to drill right through the wall.

Although you mention 'cheap'. I wouldn't know, but a good quality mains
SDS is only about £120 anyway. Non-SDS drills are ****e. In fact they
won't even drill through ****e, once it's been left out in the sun.

Bill

You can even get a Bosch or DeWalt for £99.99. Obviously not the tops of
their respective ranges. And if willing to go to Titan or Erbauer, drop
twenty.

I paid about £25 for a green Bosch some 12 years ago. I think the, now
defunct, DIY store had mispriced it.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On Sunday, 12 July 2020 11:54:03 UTC+1, charles wrote:
In article ,
polygonum_on_google wrote:
On Sunday, 12 July 2020 03:51:50 UTC+1, williamwright wrote:
On 11/07/2020 10:49, TimW wrote:
I am going to fix 2x1 battens to a concrete floor next week. Using
hammer-in sleeved nail type fixings, about 60-80 of them in total. I
have a good quality medium duty percussion drill. Is it going to be
up to the task? I wouldn't want to knacker it needlessly. Are cheap
SDS drills much better?

Tim W

There's no comparison. Many times I had a customer watching as I
prepared to drill through a wall using a decent SDS. [Fairly brief
noise from drilling] "Err... is that it?" "Yes!" "Bugger me!" They've
often tried to drill little holes for shelves etc so are expecting a
mammoth struggle for me to drill right through the wall.

Although you mention 'cheap'. I wouldn't know, but a good quality mains
SDS is only about �120 anyway. Non-SDS drills are ****e. In fact they
won't even drill through ****e, once it's been left out in the sun.

Bill

You can even get a Bosch or DeWalt for �99.99. Obviously not the tops of
their respective ranges. And if willing to go to Titan or Erbauer, drop
twenty.

I paid about �25 for a green Bosch some 12 years ago. I think the, now
defunct, DIY store had mispriced it.

My Makita was very close to £100 - and I see it is now quite a bit more, £150 or more. That is in about three years.