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| UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
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Single Brick House Questions
HI, I've been reading about single brick House difficulties. I'm thinking about buying an old cottage which is single brick. Nobody can get a mortgage on it- and the price hs obviously been reduced because of this.
I would be cash buying. Questions are would professional good quality external wall insulation make it mortgageable in the future(I'm not planning on flipping, I'd like to live there for years) or does it always remain unmortgageable unless a second layer of brick and cavity is built? I think the cost would be about £15,000 for externally insulating a small 3-bed bungalow/cottage? I haven't found information about building a second brick layer on an existing house-Is this never done/is it too prohibitively expensive, or too complex because of the problems of building around an existing house? Thanks |
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Single Brick House Questions
On Tuesday, 30 July 2019 09:40:41 UTC+1, wrote:
I think the cost would be about £15,000 for externally insulating a small 3-bed bungalow/cottage? It might be "free" if you can get a grant for it, although most of the grants only offer partial funding. https://www.energysavingtrust.org.uk...ion/solid-wall External wall insulation: around £13,000 Internal wall insulation: around £7,400 Annual energy saving: £260 Payback time external: 50 years. https://www.yesenergysolutions.co.uk...all-insulation Owain |
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#7
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Single Brick House Questions
On Tuesday, 30 July 2019 09:40:41 UTC+1, wrote:
HI, I've been reading about single brick House difficulties. I'm thinking about buying an old cottage which is single brick. Nobody can get a mortgage on it- and the price hs obviously been reduced because of this. I would be cash buying. Questions are would professional good quality external wall insulation make it mortgageable in the future(I'm not planning on flipping, I'd like to live there for years) or does it always remain unmortgageable unless a second layer of brick and cavity is built? I think the cost would be about £15,000 for externally insulating a small 3-bed bungalow/cottage? I haven't found information about building a second brick layer on an existing house-Is this never done/is it too prohibitively expensive, or too complex because of the problems of building around an existing house? Thanks There are all sorts of problems with external insulation. How is it secured to the wall? How is it made weather proof? What about interstitial condensation? What happens round windows and doors. Will you need new windows and doors? What happens to external drain pipes? (Foul and rainwater.) What happens under the eves? What happens at ground level? What happens if it spans the DPC? There have been some real crap systems about, you need to talk to someone who's had it fitted some time ago. |
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#9
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Single Brick House Questions
On 30/07/2019 15:44, harry wrote:
On Tuesday, 30 July 2019 09:40:41 UTC+1, wrote: HI, I've been reading about single brick House difficulties. I'm thinking about buying an old cottage which is single brick. Nobody can get a mortgage on it- and the price hs obviously been reduced because of this. I would be cash buying. Questions are would professional good quality external wall insulation make it mortgageable in the future(I'm not planning on flipping, I'd like to live there for years) or does it always remain unmortgageable unless a second layer of brick and cavity is built? I think the cost would be about £15,000 for externally insulating a small 3-bed bungalow/cottage? I haven't found information about building a second brick layer on an existing house-Is this never done/is it too prohibitively expensive, or too complex because of the problems of building around an existing house? Thanks There are all sorts of problems with external insulation. How is it secured to the wall? How is it made weather proof? What about interstitial condensation? What happens round windows and doors. Will you need new windows and doors? What happens to external drain pipes? (Foul and rainwater.) What happens under the eves? What happens at ground level? What happens if it spans the DPC? There have been some real crap systems about, you need to talk to someone who's had it fitted some time ago. Surprised you didn't mention Grenfall. While everything you say is true, it is technically possible to engineer something effective in most cases. The devil is in the detail. If, for example, you were stripping out all the inside leaving the brick shell then internal insulation might be another option. Although, given the amount of penetrating damp I have seen on the upper back walls of Victorian terrraces, that's one place where external cladding makes good sense. Depending on where it is, an unmortgageable cottage might actually be quite an opportunity. |
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#10
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Single Brick House Questions
On Tuesday, 30 July 2019 09:40:41 UTC+1, wrote:
HI, I've been reading about single brick House difficulties. I'm thinking about buying an old cottage which is single brick. Nobody can get a mortgage on it- and the price hs obviously been reduced because of this. I would be cash buying. Questions are would professional good quality external wall insulation make it mortgageable in the future(I'm not planning on flipping, I'd like to live there for years) or does it always remain unmortgageable unless a second layer of brick and cavity is built? I think the cost would be about £15,000 for externally insulating a small 3-bed bungalow/cottage? I haven't found information about building a second brick layer on an existing house-Is this never done/is it too prohibitively expensive, or too complex because of the problems of building around an existing house? Thanks Thanks for all your input everyone. Certainly, some things to think about, Cheers |
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#11
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Single Brick House Questions
Hang on my road is full of single brick terraces, and I'm sure you can get
mortgages on them. They are not that bad. Some of the end terrace houses may well be worse of course. Is this just a ploy to suggest all such houses get demolished and then huge blocks of flats built instead? Bah humbug. Brian -- ----- -- This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from... The Sofa of Brian Gaff... Blind user, so no pictures please Note this Signature is meaningless.! wrote in message ... On Tuesday, 30 July 2019 09:40:41 UTC+1, wrote: HI, I've been reading about single brick House difficulties. I'm thinking about buying an old cottage which is single brick. Nobody can get a mortgage on it- and the price hs obviously been reduced because of this. I would be cash buying. Questions are would professional good quality external wall insulation make it mortgageable in the future(I'm not planning on flipping, I'd like to live there for years) or does it always remain unmortgageable unless a second layer of brick and cavity is built? I think the cost would be about 15,000 for externally insulating a small 3-bed bungalow/cottage? I haven't found information about building a second brick layer on an existing house-Is this never done/is it too prohibitively expensive, or too complex because of the problems of building around an existing house? Thanks Thanks for all your input everyone. Certainly, some things to think about, Cheers |
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#12
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#13
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Single Brick House Questions
In article , newshound
wrote: On 31/07/2019 08:33, wrote: On Tuesday, 30 July 2019 09:40:41 UTC+1, wrote: HI, I've been reading about single brick House difficulties. I'm thinking about buying an old cottage which is single brick. Nobody can get a mortgage on it- and the price hs obviously been reduced because of this. I would be cash buying. Questions are would professional good quality external wall insulation make it mortgageable in the future(I'm not planning on flipping, I'd like to live there for years) or does it always remain unmortgageable unless a second layer of brick and cavity is built? I think the cost would be about 15,000 for externally insulating a small 3-bed bungalow/cottage? I haven't found information about building a second brick layer on an existing house-Is this never done/is it too prohibitively expensive, or too complex because of the problems of building around an existing house? Thanks Thanks for all your input everyone. Certainly, some things to think about, Cheers I suppose for the sake of clarity we should really have confirmed that it was single brick, and not half brick. IIRC some Victorian terraces at the bottom of the market were originally built with a single story, half brick extension right at the back, sometimes an outside loo, sometimes a coal store. I used to stay in one such (with outside loo) on holiday in the 50's/60's. This detatched house was built in 1911 without a cavity wall, ie 'single brick'. I don't believe it was built for the bottom of the market - but it was built by a spec buider : 3 on this site and 4 on another site 100 yards away. My BiL's fires house was a 1930s terrace in Rugby - again no cavity and my late boss' one in Harrow, buit between the wars also had no cavity. -- from KT24 in Surrey, England "I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle |
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#14
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Single Brick House Questions
charles formulated on Wednesday :
This detatched house was built in 1911 without a cavity wall, ie 'single brick'. This is a semi, the main part built with cavity, except for an extra single storey part at the rear corner. That part was built as a coal store with an extremely large toilet room next to it plus a pantry in the main part of the house footprint. Downstairs toilet was moved to what had been the pantry, then toilet became a utility, with the coal store remaining as a long narrow garden store with a separate door to the one for the utility. Its narrowness made it useless as a store, so bricked its door up and cut through from the utility - making it far more useful, with lots of shelves to the left and right, as a pantry again. |
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#15
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Single Brick House Questions
Harry Bloomfield, Esq. was thinking very hard :
This is a semi, the main part built with cavity, except for an extra single storey part at the rear corner. That part was built as a coal store with an extremely large toilet room next to it plus a pantry in the main part of the house footprint. I intended to say, despite the utility room being supplied with a rad, the cold in there compared to the main house, is very noticeable. |
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#16
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Single Brick House Questions
On 31/07/2019 17:46, newshound wrote:
On 31/07/2019 08:33, wrote: On Tuesday, 30 July 2019 09:40:41 UTC+1, * wrote: HI, I've been reading about single brick House difficulties. I'm thinking about buying an old cottage which is single brick. Nobody can get a mortgage on it- and the price hs obviously been reduced because of this. * I would be cash buying. Questions are would professional good quality external wall insulation make it mortgageable in the future(I'm not planning on flipping, I'd like to live there for years) or does it always remain unmortgageable unless a second layer of brick and cavity is built? I think the cost would be about £15,000 for externally insulating a small 3-bed bungalow/cottage? I haven't found information about building a second brick layer on an existing house-Is this never done/is it too prohibitively expensive, or too complex because of the problems of building around an existing house? Thanks Thanks for all your input everyone. Certainly, some things to think about, Cheers I suppose for the sake of clarity we should really have confirmed that it was single brick, and not half brick. IIRC some Victorian terraces at the bottom of the market were originally built with a single story, half brick extension right at the back, sometimes an outside loo, sometimes a coal store. I used to stay in one such (with outside loo) on holiday in the 50's/60's. It's just within the bounds of possibility that small single story half-brick structures might be found in remoter regions, perhaps originally built as animal shelters. I wondered about that, as clearly a whole house with 4.5" thick walls wouldn't stay up very long. (I'm not familiar with the terminology.) Surely most brick houses build before cavity walls became common (about 100 years ago) would have been "single brick" unless they were big enough to need an extra thickness. How did they bond a solid brick wall that was more than 9" thick? -- Max Demian |
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#17
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Single Brick House Questions
On 31/07/2019 20:30, Max Demian wrote:
On 31/07/2019 17:46, newshound wrote: I suppose for the sake of clarity we should really have confirmed that it was single brick, and not half brick. IIRC some Victorian terraces at the bottom of the market were originally built with a single story, half brick extension right at the back, sometimes an outside loo, sometimes a coal store. I used to stay in one such (with outside loo) on holiday in the 50's/60's. It's just within the bounds of possibility that small single story half-brick structures might be found in remoter regions, perhaps originally built as animal shelters. I wondered about that, as clearly a whole house with 4.5" thick walls wouldn't stay up very long. (I'm not familiar with the terminology.) You can build a garden wall 4.5 inches thick but 6 feet high so long as it has piers every 6 feet or so (and reasonable foundations). If you build something (say) the size of a single garage then the end walls help to brace the side walls. I'm not saying it is desirable but that it is theoretically possible to build a small cottage at least partly with 4.5 inch walls. Surely most brick houses build before cavity walls became common (about 100 years ago) would have been "single brick" Agreed unless they were big enough to need an extra thickness. How did they bond a solid brick wall that was more than 9" thick? Lots of ways. As a simple example, imagine two "separate" 9 inch walls of conventional construction built next to each other with a pair of stretchers lined up on the adjacent faces of each wall. Now spin that pair 90 degrees. Another way is based on a "herringbone" layout. |
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#18
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Single Brick House Questions
Max Demian laid this down on his screen :
How did they bond a solid brick wall that was more than 9" thick? Bricks turned 90 deg, so they went through two leaves of bricks. for the bricks, same idea, but staggered - in through both side of outer, to the middle layer. |
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#19
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Single Brick House Questions
On Tue, 30 Jul 2019 12:36:10 +0100, "dennis@home"
wrote: snip check that you are allowed to do external work. When I was looking to build an extension on the front of ours (single story porch and lounge bay thing) and as an aside we spoke to planning and they required permission for stone cladding (because that had 'thickness'), but not rendering or pebble-dashing because that apparently didn't? Things might have changed since ... like the requirement to provide a parking space for every bedroom, even if there were none for the existing bedrooms previously? One house locally (another EOT) has had the external cladding applied whilst keeping all the other bits (windows, roof etc) existing. I think the foam was about 100mm thick and then rendered with some sort of synthetic self coloured stuff. The flank wall is South facing so it might help keep the place cool in the summer. Cheers, T i m |
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#20
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Single Brick House Questions
On Wed, 31 Jul 2019 17:46:53 +0100, newshound
wrote: snip IIRC some Victorian terraces at the bottom of the market were originally built with a single story, half brick extension right at the back, sometimes an outside loo, sometimes a coal store. That was ours when I first bought it. The small extension to the 'rear addition' was a full single brick though with 3/3rds of it an inside bathroom (off the rear extension / kitchen) and the remaining 1/3rd the outside (and only) loo. Now the 'new' ss extension is the only bit of the house with cavity walls. I did re-render the main flank wall (internally, pre plastering) with a thermal render of some sort (that was supposed to help). It was quite 'aerated' so I can see how it might. We have since considered lining that with some Celotex but never got round to it. But what if you have a single brick built house that is designed to 'breathe' through the brickwork to some degree and then you seal it up with (especially) external cladding? I used to stay in one such (with outside loo) on holiday in the 50's/60's. Sometimes it's the right place to have them ... and I don't only mean when you are working in the garage / garden. ;-) Cheers, T i m |
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Single Brick House Questions
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#22
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Single Brick House Questions
On 31/07/2019 20:30, Max Demian wrote:
On 31/07/2019 17:46, newshound wrote: On 31/07/2019 08:33, wrote: On Tuesday, 30 July 2019 09:40:41 UTC+1, * wrote: HI, I've been reading about single brick House difficulties. I'm thinking about buying an old cottage which is single brick. Nobody can get a mortgage on it- and the price hs obviously been reduced because of this. * I would be cash buying. Questions are would professional good quality external wall insulation make it mortgageable in the future(I'm not planning on flipping, I'd like to live there for years) or does it always remain unmortgageable unless a second layer of brick and cavity is built? I think the cost would be about £15,000 for externally insulating a small 3-bed bungalow/cottage? I haven't found information about building a second brick layer on an existing house-Is this never done/is it too prohibitively expensive, or too complex because of the problems of building around an existing house? Thanks Thanks for all your input everyone. Certainly, some things to think about, Cheers I suppose for the sake of clarity we should really have confirmed that it was single brick, and not half brick. IIRC some Victorian terraces at the bottom of the market were originally built with a single story, half brick extension right at the back, sometimes an outside loo, sometimes a coal store. I used to stay in one such (with outside loo) on holiday in the 50's/60's. It's just within the bounds of possibility that small single story half-brick structures might be found in remoter regions, perhaps originally built as animal shelters. I wondered about that, as clearly a whole house with 4.5" thick walls wouldn't stay up very long. Utter ******** (I'm not familiar with the terminology.) Surely most brick houses build before cavity walls became common (about 100 years ago) would have been "single brick" No. That was luxury. Rows of terraces, and in the country, cottages, were built half brick. unless they were big enough to need an extra thickness. How did they bond a solid brick wall that was more than 9" thick? -- Of what good are dead warriors? Warriors are those who desire battle more than peace. Those who seek battle despite peace. Those who thump their spears on the ground and talk of honor. Those who leap high the battle dance and dream of glory The good of dead warriors, Mother, is that they are dead. Sheri S Tepper: The Awakeners. |
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#23
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Single Brick House Questions
On 01/08/2019 09:20, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/07/2019 17:46, newshound wrote: On 31/07/2019 08:33, wrote: On Tuesday, 30 July 2019 09:40:41 UTC+1, * wrote: HI, I've been reading about single brick House difficulties. I'm thinking about buying an old cottage which is single brick. Nobody can get a mortgage on it- and the price hs obviously been reduced because of this. * I would be cash buying. Questions are would professional good quality external wall insulation make it mortgageable in the future(I'm not planning on flipping, I'd like to live there for years) or does it always remain unmortgageable unless a second layer of brick and cavity is built? I think the cost would be about £15,000 for externally insulating a small 3-bed bungalow/cottage? I haven't found information about building a second brick layer on an existing house-Is this never done/is it too prohibitively expensive, or too complex because of the problems of building around an existing house? Thanks Thanks for all your input everyone. Certainly, some things to think about, Cheers I suppose for the sake of clarity we should really have confirmed that it was single brick, and not half brick. IIRC some Victorian terraces at the bottom of the market were originally built with a single story, half brick extension right at the back, sometimes an outside loo, sometimes a coal store. I used to stay in one such (with outside loo) on holiday in the 50's/60's. It's just within the bounds of possibility that small single story half-brick structures might be found in remoter regions, perhaps originally built as animal shelters. I lived in onr of them fir 10 years - labourers cottage Would you agree that these days, many mortgage companies would probably not consider financing that sort of construction? |
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#24
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Single Brick House Questions
On 01/08/2019 10:33, newshound wrote:
On 01/08/2019 09:20, The Natural Philosopher wrote: On 31/07/2019 17:46, newshound wrote: On 31/07/2019 08:33, wrote: On Tuesday, 30 July 2019 09:40:41 UTC+1, * wrote: HI, I've been reading about single brick House difficulties. I'm thinking about buying an old cottage which is single brick. Nobody can get a mortgage on it- and the price hs obviously been reduced because of this. * I would be cash buying. Questions are would professional good quality external wall insulation make it mortgageable in the future(I'm not planning on flipping, I'd like to live there for years) or does it always remain unmortgageable unless a second layer of brick and cavity is built? I think the cost would be about £15,000 for externally insulating a small 3-bed bungalow/cottage? I haven't found information about building a second brick layer on an existing house-Is this never done/is it too prohibitively expensive, or too complex because of the problems of building around an existing house? Thanks Thanks for all your input everyone. Certainly, some things to think about, Cheers I suppose for the sake of clarity we should really have confirmed that it was single brick, and not half brick. IIRC some Victorian terraces at the bottom of the market were originally built with a single story, half brick extension right at the back, sometimes an outside loo, sometimes a coal store. I used to stay in one such (with outside loo) on holiday in the 50's/60's. It's just within the bounds of possibility that small single story half-brick structures might be found in remoter regions, perhaps originally built as animal shelters. I lived in onr of them fir 10 years - labourers cottage Would you agree that these days, many mortgage companies would probably not consider financing that sort of construction? Dunno. If nothing else, the land on which it sits is worth more than the house. -- "When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him." Jonathan Swift. |
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