I am finding search engines less and less useful. I am looking for a
timer for my gas fired central heating that has a battery back-up, as we
have fairly frequent power failures here. any suggestions please? The
simpler to set up the better.

In article ,
Broadback wrote:
I am finding search engines less and less useful. I am looking for a
timer for my gas fired central heating that has a battery back-up, as we
have fairly frequent power failures here. any suggestions please? The
simpler to set up the better.

I have a Horstmann Channel Plus which has an internal battery

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

On Sat, 3 Mar 2018 11:27:34 +0000, Broadback
wrote:

I am finding search engines less and less useful. I am looking for a
timer for my gas fired central heating that has a battery back-up, as we
have fairly frequent power failures here. any suggestions please? The
simpler to set up the better.

Honeywell ST699

Been on the market for over 30 years

https://www.plumbworld.co.uk/honeywe...24hr-760-16645

--

On 03/03/2018 11:27, Broadback wrote:
I am finding search engines less and less useful. I am looking for a
timer for my gas fired central heating that has a battery back-up, as we
have fairly frequent power failures here. any suggestions please? The
simpler to set up the better.

Does it need to time hot water as well?

If not, then doing away with the programmer and using a prog stat is
probably easier.

For a simple programmer with battery backup, then the classic honeywell
models are quite simple:

https://www.honeywelluk.com/products...rammers/ST699/



--
Cheers,

John.

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\================================================= ================/

On Sat, 03 Mar 2018 12:06:36 +0000, Chris Hogg wrote:

On Sat, 03 Mar 2018 11:42:05 +0000, The Other Mike
wrote:

On Sat, 3 Mar 2018 11:27:34 +0000, Broadback
wrote:

I am finding search engines less and less useful. I am looking for a
timer for my gas fired central heating that has a battery back-up, as we
have fairly frequent power failures here. any suggestions please? The
simpler to set up the better.

Honeywell ST699

Been on the market for over 30 years

https://www.plumbworld.co.uk/honeywe...24hr-760-16645

Yes, we have one, and very happy with it. Unsophisticated: two on-off
periods per day, or one on.....off covering both times, or continuous.
CH and DHW both follow the same time settings. No individual day sets,
nor week day / weekend stuff. Battery back-up, although ours failed a
year or so ago and had to be reset every time we had a power failure,
so I got a replacement. Just slotted it into the original base unit;
no rewiring.

There are cheaper programmers, but whether they have battery back-up,
I don't know, although I'd have thought it pretty standard these days
as it can't be that difficult to implement.

The nicad on the PCB can be replaced (with a near identical NiMh)

It *might* be this one

http://uk.farnell.com/varta/55711602...-4v/dp/3907211

There are two or three types that look very similar in the photos but are
significantly larger (mainly in height)

Such as this

http://uk.farnell.com/varta/55615603...0mah/dp/279353

More recent timers from Honeywell (and others?) might have battery backup but
they carry their own set of problems with poor LCD glass to flexible PCB
bonding.

--

The Other Mike presented the following explanation :
Honeywell ST699

Been on the market for over 30 years

https://www.plumbworld.co.uk/honeywe...24hr-760-16645


--

We had one of those, which soon had the display fail and the battery
backup didn't often work..

We got this about 5 years ago..

CP715 Si
- Service interval function
- 7 day, 5/2 day or 24 hour programming
- Permanent back lit display
- AM/PM or 24 hour display
- Built-in programmes
- Automatic BST/GMT time change
- Convenient user overrides
- Holiday function
- Industry standard wallplate
- Factory set clock

It is rather more sophisticated than we absolutely needed, but the
display remains good and it has a neat 1 hour program override for
heating and hot water. It has twice given problems though...

It twice crashed, where the display went blank, plus both heat and HW
were turned permanently on. It was easy to spot, both LED's on, when
they shouldn't be and the display blank - Cycling the power, restored
normal operation.

When you say less useful are you just getting too much commercial
advertising up front? You hopefully have an ad blocker and also you need to
mask out things like graphic results and sponsored links if possible by the
terms you look for.
Its the classic needle in a haystack issue, the haystack is now getting so
large that finding the needle is a lot harder.
You also need to realise that to stay free, internet services see the user
as the product, so they need to be able to track you and also advertise to
you as well. Of course in the future Foresee a paid account for freedom from
all of the above as being the only affordable way for sites to continue.
We are still living in the honeymoon period when commercial interests can
actually still pay for data and as we all get better at denying them the
data so their revenue dries up.
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Broadback" wrote in message
news
I am finding search engines less and less useful. I am looking for a timer
for my gas fired central heating that has a battery back-up, as we have
fairly frequent power failures here. any suggestions please? The simpler to
set up the better.

On 03/03/2018 11:27, Broadback wrote:
I am finding search engines less and less useful. I am looking for a
timer for my gas fired central heating that has a battery back-up, as we
have fairly frequent power failures here. any suggestions please? The
simpler to set up the better.

Many modern ones have a built in back up battery including

http://www.salus-tech.com/products/d...rs-and-timers/

(Water only or heating and hot water)
Just click on one of the pictures to get the description and a link to
the manual.

http://www.admac.myzen.co.uk/Timer/

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On 03/03/2018 16:22, alan_m wrote:
On 03/03/2018 11:27, Broadback wrote:
I am finding search engines less and less useful. I am looking for a
timer for my gas fired central heating that has a battery back-up, as
we have fairly frequent power failures here. any suggestions please?
The simpler to set up the better.

Many modern ones have a built in back up battery including

http://www.salus-tech.com/products/d...rs-and-timers/

(Water only or heating and hot water)
Just click on one of the pictures to get the description and a link to
the manual.

http://www.admac.myzen.co.uk/Timer/

Thank you for all your replies, I now just have to decide which is most
suitable for me.

On 03/03/2018 12:09, John Rumm wrote:
On 03/03/2018 11:27, Broadback wrote:
I am finding search engines less and less useful. I am looking for a
timer for my gas fired central heating that has a battery back-up, as we
have fairly frequent power failures here. any suggestions please? The
simpler to set up the better.

Does it need to time hot water as well?

If not, then doing away with the programmer and using a prog stat is
probably easier.

For a simple programmer with battery backup, then the classic honeywell
models are quite simple:

https://www.honeywelluk.com/products...rammers/ST699/


My Danfoss TP9 does not lose time or its settings in a power cut.

I think my Heatmiser Smartstat must get its time from the Internet. It
has not lost its settings when the power has been switched off.


--
Michael Chare

On 03/03/2018 16:42, Broadback wrote:
Thank you for all your replies, I now just have to decide which is most
suitable for m

Do you want to run your heating during the power fail? If so you'll need
to power the pump too, which might point to a UPS.

Andy

On 04/03/2018 21:59, Vir Campestris wrote:
On 03/03/2018 16:42, Broadback wrote:
Thank you for all your replies, I now just have to decide which is
most suitable for m

Do you want to run your heating during the power fail? If so you'll need
to power the pump too, which might point to a UPS.

Andy
No, I just do not wish to reset the timer every time we get, a not
infrequent, power cut here.

On 03/03/2018 16:42, Broadback wrote:
On 03/03/2018 16:22, alan_m wrote:
On 03/03/2018 11:27, Broadback wrote:
I am finding search engines less and less useful. I am looking for a
timer for my gas fired central heating that has a battery back-up, as
we have fairly frequent power failures here. any suggestions please?
The simpler to set up the better.

Many modern ones have a built in back up battery including

http://www.salus-tech.com/products/d...rs-and-timers/

(Water only or heating and hot water)
Just click on one of the pictures to get the description and a link to
the manual.

http://www.admac.myzen.co.uk/Timer/

Thank you for all your replies, I now just have to decide which is most
suitable for me.

As a broader question to the group, bearing mind that these devices are
often fitted for 10, 15 possibly 20 years or more how long (I mean in
years not hours of a power cut) would the backup battery typically last?

Rechargeable batteries used in radios, drills and laptop computers don't
seem to last anything like this long.

--
Chris B (News)

On 05/03/18 09:54, Chris B wrote:
On 03/03/2018 16:42, Broadback wrote:
On 03/03/2018 16:22, alan_m wrote:
On 03/03/2018 11:27, Broadback wrote:
I am finding search engines less and less useful. I am looking for a
timer for my gas fired central heating that has a battery back-up,
as we have fairly frequent power failures here. any suggestions
please? The simpler to set up the better.

Many modern ones have a built in back up battery including

http://www.salus-tech.com/products/d...rs-and-timers/

(Water only or heating and hot water)
Just click on one of the pictures to get the description and a link
to the manual.

http://www.admac.myzen.co.uk/Timer/

Thank you for all your replies, I now just have to decide which is
most suitable for me.

As a broader question to the group, bearing mind that these devices are
often fitted for 10, 15 possibly 20 years or more how long (I mean in
years not hours of a power cut) would the backup battery typically last?

Rechargeable batteries used in radios, drills and laptop computers don't
seem to last anything like this long.

You should more think about light duty backup batteries used in e.g.,
computer motherboards like Apple Macs of the power PC era which usually
needed replacing after 10 years or so.

In fact a supercapcacitor might be te way to go rather than a
battery..not sure how long they last tho.

Primary cells MIGHT last longer.







--
"When one man dies it's a tragedy. When thousands die it's statistics."

Josef Stalin

On Sat, 03 Mar 2018 12:53:32 GMT, Harry Bloomfield
wrote:

We got this about 5 years ago..

CP715 Si

That looks somewhat similar to the timer a neighbour had a few years ago when I
was called to assist after a power cut maybe around 2010 ish.

Even with the user guide scanned, enlarged and printed out on A4 it was almost
impossible to understand how you ever programmed it up. One of the switches
under the cover used a word or phrase, I can't recall what, it was quite clearly
from the english language but of such obscure relevance to any intended
functionality as to make the labelling pointless.

I came to the conclusion you had to be off your head on class A drugs to
properly understand the instructions. What the design brief was I shudder to
think.
--

On Mon, 5 Mar 2018 09:54:39 +0000, Chris B wrote:

As a broader question to the group, bearing mind that these devices are
often fitted for 10, 15 possibly 20 years or more how long (I mean in
years not hours of a power cut) would the backup battery typically last?

Rechargeable batteries used in radios, drills and laptop computers don't
seem to last anything like this long.

Unlike those radios drills and laptops you are not cycling them through a full
charge discharge cycle, all you are doing during a mains power supply failure is
keeping the processor supply in sleep mode together with the timer setting and a
real time clock. It could amount to no more than a few micro amps of current
draw. A low capacity trickle charged Nicad or in more recent times NiMh or
Lithium cell could easily cover power failure of several days or longer.

The AA duracells in our standalone Honeywell programmable RF thermostats (CM61 &
CM67 series) last at least two and maybe three years essentially doing the same
thing plus permanently driving a time display and squirting out a coded 868MHz
RF message several times an hour to the base unit during the heating period.
2000mAh battery capacity, maybe 20000 hours of operation - 100 microamps for a
design dating from about 16 years ago.

Of course if APC did the charging circuitry for heating timers then the thing
would be massively overcharged and then expand to twice its size and fall off
the wall every 6 months requiring a crowbar to remove the battery.
--

The Other Mike formulated on Monday :
Even with the user guide scanned, enlarged and printed out on A4 it was
almost
impossible to understand how you ever programmed it up. One of the switches
under the cover used a word or phrase, I can't recall what, it was quite
clearly
from the english language but of such obscure relevance to any intended
functionality as to make the labelling pointless.

I came to the conclusion you had to be off your head on class A drugs to
properly understand the instructions. What the design brief was I shudder
to
think.

I agree, but with a bit of effort reading the instructions, I can get a
handle on it. Trouble is, it needs so little attention and each time I
might need to adjust anything, I have then spend time re-reading it
all.

Chris B was thinking very hard :
As a broader question to the group, bearing mind that these devices are often
fitted for 10, 15 possibly 20 years or more how long (I mean in years not
hours of a power cut) would the backup battery typically last?

That working life varies a lot, depending on the quality of the
charging circuit. In my case, when we go away for a while, I just
isolate the power until we get back, which isolates the timer. It
maintains itself happily for 14 days and works as normal as soon as
powered back up.

I have seen the same oval PCB mount NiCads survive 20 years or more.

On 05/03/2018 11:29, The Other Mike wrote:


Of course if APC did the charging circuitry for heating timers then the thing
would be massively overcharged and then expand to twice its size and fall off
the wall every 6 months requiring a crowbar to remove the battery.


*applause*

On 05/03/2018 09:54, Chris B wrote:

As a broader question to the group, bearing mind that these devices are
often fitted for 10, 15 possibly 20 years or more how long (I mean in
years not hours of a power cut) would the backup battery typically last?

Rechargeable batteries used in radios, drills and laptop computers don't
seem to last anything like this long.


The timer settings are often stored in non-volitile memory these days
and don't require power to maintain them. The back-up battery/capacitor
possibly only has to maintain the clock on a power down.

When my kitchen was recently refurbished the mains power to the timer
was removed for two days. On re-applying the power the timer had the
correct time all of the previous settings and continued to work.


--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On 05/03/2018 13:39, Chris Bartram wrote:
On 05/03/2018 11:29, The Other Mike wrote:


Of course if APC did the charging circuitry for heating timers then
the thing
would be massively overcharged and then expand to twice its size and
fall off
the wall every 6 months requiring a crowbar to remove the battery.

That should be on a tee shirt!

*applause*

+1

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
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