Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed, it's stiff stuff.
http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?


NT

On Fri, 9 Feb 2018 15:00:39 -0800 (PST)
wrote:

Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get
the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says
use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no
way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer
it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed,
it's stiff stuff. http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?

Corkscrew?

On 10/02/2018 04:55, Rob Morley wrote:
On Fri, 9 Feb 2018 15:00:39 -0800 (PST)
wrote:

Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get
the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says
use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no
way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer
it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed,
it's stiff stuff. http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?

Corkscrew?


Straightened out fish hook = using the barb to try and skewer the ring
and pull it out forwards?

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

brought next idea :
Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get the rear
o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says use a crochet
hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no way to get anything
behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer it, but my skewering items
all failed to get far into the rubbed, it's stiff stuff.
http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?


NT

For £1 the pound shops sell a set of various small pointy objects, one
of these is bound to work.

On 09/02/2018 23:00, wrote:
Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get
the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says
use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no
way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer
it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed,
it's stiff stuff. http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Which bit is actually the O ring in that photo? Is is the whiteish bit
at the periphery of the rear "hole"?

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?

Some needle nose pliers...


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

In message , John
Rumm writes
On 09/02/2018 23:00, wrote:
Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get
the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says
use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no
way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer
it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed,
it's stiff stuff. http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Which bit is actually the O ring in that photo? Is is the whiteish bit
at the periphery of the rear "hole"?

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?

Some needle nose pliers...

One of the side benefits of a rural occupation is finding the discards
of petty theft in crops or gateways.

One such find was a set of tools possibly connected to the manufacture
of false teeth/dentistry. Double ended with a centre hexagonal finger
grip and choice of tiny knife blades, hooks, points etc.

It is some time since I changed our Aqualisa thermostat but I think the
pointy knife loosened the ring in its slot and one with an angled flat
tip hooked it out.

--
Tim Lamb

On 09/02/2018 23:00, wrote:
Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed, it's stiff stuff.
http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?


NT



Is it covered by limescale? It's hard to tell from the photo. If so,
some descaler might make it easier to remove.

Apart from that, can you cut it into bits and then tease those out?

On Saturday, 10 February 2018 04:55:04 UTC, Rob Morley wrote:
On Fri, 9 Feb 2018 15:00:39 -0800 (PST)
tabbypurr wrote:

Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get
the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says
use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no
way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer
it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed,
it's stiff stuff. http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?

Corkscrew?

hey, i'm liking that.


NT

On Saturday, 10 February 2018 09:10:54 UTC, John Rumm wrote:
On 09/02/2018 23:00, tabbypurr wrote:

Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get
the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says
use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no
way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer
it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed,
it's stiff stuff. http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Which bit is actually the O ring in that photo? Is is the whiteish bit
at the periphery of the rear "hole"?

the o-ring is black. Not much of it is visible, it's hemmed in on all sides except the inner edge.


Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?

Some needle nose pliers...

if it were that easy... It's at the back of the mixer housing, so any pliers would need nearly 90 degree bent bits. And there's just no way to get anything in either side of it, I've tried with bent pins, a metal stabby thing, a ground jeweller's screwdriver etc.


NT

On Saturday, 10 February 2018 10:08:45 UTC, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message , John
Rumm writes
On 09/02/2018 23:00, tabbypurr wrote:

Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get
the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says
use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no
way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer
it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed,
it's stiff stuff. http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Which bit is actually the O ring in that photo? Is is the whiteish bit
at the periphery of the rear "hole"?

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?

Some needle nose pliers...

One of the side benefits of a rural occupation is finding the discards
of petty theft in crops or gateways.

One such find was a set of tools possibly connected to the manufacture
of false teeth/dentistry. Double ended with a centre hexagonal finger
grip and choice of tiny knife blades, hooks, points etc.

It is some time since I changed our Aqualisa thermostat but I think the
pointy knife loosened the ring in its slot and one with an angled flat
tip hooked it out.

Ah... a dental descaler thing. Not sure if it'd be string enough but will try it.

Thanks everyone. Round 2 is afoot.


NT

On 10/02/2018 11:08, wrote:

if it were that easy... It's at the back of the mixer housing, so any pliers would need nearly 90 degree bent bits. And there's just no way to get anything in either side of it, I've tried with bent pins, a metal stabby thing, a ground jeweller's screwdriver etc.

Is it leaking?

On Saturday, 10 February 2018 10:21:31 UTC, GB wrote:
On 09/02/2018 23:00, tabbypurr wrote:

Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed, it's stiff stuff.
http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?


NT



Is it covered by limescale? It's hard to tell from the photo. If so,
some descaler might make it easier to remove.

Apart from that, can you cut it into bits and then tease those out?

It may well be that scale is making it harder, will try that if the other ideas don't work. Cut it up with what though? It's barely accessible.


NT

On Saturday, 10 February 2018 11:16:23 UTC, GB wrote:
On 10/02/2018 11:08, tabbypurr wrote:

if it were that easy... It's at the back of the mixer housing, so any pliers would need nearly 90 degree bent bits. And there's just no way to get anything in either side of it, I've tried with bent pins, a metal stabby thing, a ground jeweller's screwdriver etc.

Is it leaking?

It has to go, it's letting water through. Having stabbed it repeatedly it's now worse.


NT

On 09/02/2018 23:00, wrote:
Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed, it's stiff stuff.
http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?


NT

I had exactly this problem a few weeks ago. I heated a piece of thin
steel rod (about 3mm diameter, at a guess) so I could bend the end at 90
degrees. I then ground the end of the bent section to make a sort of
chisel and used this to cut the O ring into about 3 pieces and then fish
them out of the groove. I faffed about for days with many other methods
before trying this - it probably took 5 minutes with my gizzmo.

On 10/02/18 11:17, wrote:
On Saturday, 10 February 2018 10:21:31 UTC, GB wrote:
On 09/02/2018 23:00, tabbypurr wrote:

Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed, it's stiff stuff.
http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?


NT



Is it covered by limescale? It's hard to tell from the photo. If so,
some descaler might make it easier to remove.

Apart from that, can you cut it into bits and then tease those out?

It may well be that scale is making it harder, will try that if the other ideas don't work. Cut it up with what though? It's barely accessible.

when took apart a shower head soaking in descaler for several days
finally sorted it out



NT



--
"If you dont read the news paper, you are un-informed. If you read the
news paper, you are mis-informed."

Mark Twain

On 10/02/2018 12:40, wrote:


I had exactly this problem a few weeks ago. I heated a piece of thin
steel rod (about 3mm diameter, at a guess) so I could bend the end at 90
degrees. I then ground the end of the bent section to make a sort of
chisel and used this to cut the O ring into about 3 pieces and then fish
them out of the groove. I faffed about for days with many other methods
before trying this - it probably took 5 minutes with my gizzmo.


An allen key may be a good starting point for this

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On Saturday, 10 February 2018 12:40:13 UTC, wrote:
On 09/02/2018 23:00, tabbypurr wrote:

Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed, it's stiff stuff.
http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?


NT

I had exactly this problem a few weeks ago. I heated a piece of thin
steel rod (about 3mm diameter, at a guess) so I could bend the end at 90
degrees. I then ground the end of the bent section to make a sort of
chisel and used this to cut the O ring into about 3 pieces and then fish
them out of the groove. I faffed about for days with many other methods
before trying this - it probably took 5 minutes with my gizzmo.

Well, I've been doing just this and no joy. The sharpened 2mm allen key can dig into the rubber to some extent, but that's it. The most it achieves is to move the ring round & round and maybe chip off a miniscule bit. I've seen rubber go hard but never seen anything this bad. It's like rock.

If I had endless time I'd attack it next with glacial acetic, HCl and conc sulphuric, but I don't. If I could work out how to plug a large hole in the rear I'd drill one and get much better access, but again I've got no real solution. :/


NT

On 10/02/2018 18:50, wrote:
On Saturday, 10 February 2018 12:40:13 UTC, wrote:
On 09/02/2018 23:00, tabbypurr wrote:

Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed, it's stiff stuff.
http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?


NT

I had exactly this problem a few weeks ago. I heated a piece of thin
steel rod (about 3mm diameter, at a guess) so I could bend the end at 90
degrees. I then ground the end of the bent section to make a sort of
chisel and used this to cut the O ring into about 3 pieces and then fish
them out of the groove. I faffed about for days with many other methods
before trying this - it probably took 5 minutes with my gizzmo.

Well, I've been doing just this and no joy. The sharpened 2mm allen key can dig into the rubber to some extent, but that's it. The most it achieves is to move the ring round & round and maybe chip off a miniscule bit. I've seen rubber go hard but never seen anything this bad. It's like rock.

If I had endless time I'd attack it next with glacial acetic, HCl and conc sulphuric, but I don't. If I could work out how to plug a large hole in the rear I'd drill one and get much better access, but again I've got no real solution. :/


NT


I can only say that it worked for me in the same shower. Make your
chisel edge sharper. Once you've cut the ring into 3 roughly equal
segments it *will* come out.

wrote:
On Saturday, 10 February 2018 12:40:13 UTC, wrote:
On 09/02/2018 23:00, tabbypurr wrote:

Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get the
rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says use a
crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no way to
get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer it, but
my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed, it's stiff stuff.
http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?


NT

I had exactly this problem a few weeks ago. I heated a piece of thin
steel rod (about 3mm diameter, at a guess) so I could bend the end at 90
degrees. I then ground the end of the bent section to make a sort of
chisel and used this to cut the O ring into about 3 pieces and then fish
them out of the groove. I faffed about for days with many other methods
before trying this - it probably took 5 minutes with my gizzmo.

Well, I've been doing just this and no joy. The sharpened 2mm allen key
can dig into the rubber to some extent, but that's it. The most it
achieves is to move the ring round & round and maybe chip off a miniscule
bit. I've seen rubber go hard but never seen anything this bad. It's like rock.

If I had endless time I'd attack it next with glacial acetic, HCl and
conc sulphuric, but I don't. If I could work out how to plug a large hole
in the rear I'd drill one and get much better access, but again I've got
no real solution. :/


A cheap set of dental picks from ebay or amazon will do the job Im sure.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

On Saturday, 10 February 2018 20:21:40 UTC, Tim+ wrote:
tabbypurr wrote:
On Saturday, 10 February 2018 12:40:13 UTC, wrote:
On 09/02/2018 23:00, tabbypurr wrote:

Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get the
rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says use a
crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no way to
get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer it, but
my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed, it's stiff stuff.
http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?


NT

I had exactly this problem a few weeks ago. I heated a piece of thin
steel rod (about 3mm diameter, at a guess) so I could bend the end at 90
degrees. I then ground the end of the bent section to make a sort of
chisel and used this to cut the O ring into about 3 pieces and then fish
them out of the groove. I faffed about for days with many other methods
before trying this - it probably took 5 minutes with my gizzmo.

Well, I've been doing just this and no joy. The sharpened 2mm allen key
can dig into the rubber to some extent, but that's it. The most it
achieves is to move the ring round & round and maybe chip off a miniscule
bit. I've seen rubber go hard but never seen anything this bad. It's like rock.

If I had endless time I'd attack it next with glacial acetic, HCl and
conc sulphuric, but I don't. If I could work out how to plug a large hole
in the rear I'd drill one and get much better access, but again I've got
no real solution. :/


A cheap set of dental picks from ebay or amazon will do the job Im sure.

Tim

tried that early on. Way too weak.


NT

On Saturday, 10 February 2018 19:20:58 UTC, wrote:
On 10/02/2018 18:50, tabbypurr wrote:
On Saturday, 10 February 2018 12:40:13 UTC, wrote:
On 09/02/2018 23:00, tabbypurr wrote:

Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed, it's stiff stuff.
http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?


NT

I had exactly this problem a few weeks ago. I heated a piece of thin
steel rod (about 3mm diameter, at a guess) so I could bend the end at 90
degrees. I then ground the end of the bent section to make a sort of
chisel and used this to cut the O ring into about 3 pieces and then fish
them out of the groove. I faffed about for days with many other methods
before trying this - it probably took 5 minutes with my gizzmo.

Well, I've been doing just this and no joy. The sharpened 2mm allen key can dig into the rubber to some extent, but that's it. The most it achieves is to move the ring round & round and maybe chip off a miniscule bit. I've seen rubber go hard but never seen anything this bad. It's like rock.

If I had endless time I'd attack it next with glacial acetic, HCl and conc sulphuric, but I don't. If I could work out how to plug a large hole in the rear I'd drill one and get much better access, but again I've got no real solution. :/


NT


I can only say that it worked for me in the same shower. Make your
chisel edge sharper. Once you've cut the ring into 3 roughly equal
segments it *will* come out.

Oh I made it sharp as a barb, and applied as much force as tools & allen key could take. It digs in but is not chopping it up. It just ain't 'apnin. New shower will get fitted. I don't like defeat, would rather keep things going a century, but this one just is not happening and it needs sorting without delay. Sadly a minor thumbs down for Aqualisa, it only lasted 35 years.

If I had all the time in the world I'd attack it with conc acids, drill some small holes for better access, maybe attack it with red hot wire etc, and refit it once done. But I don't.

Thank you to everyone. Sadly not everything is practical to fix.


NT

On 10/02/2018 08:23, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
brought next idea :
Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get
the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says
use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no
way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer
it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed, it's
stiff stuff. http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?


NT

For £1 the pound shops sell a set of various small pointy objects, one
of these is bound to work.

I have a "craft knife" set which includes points, and narrow pointy
blades. Usually destructive of course, but works both on rubber and PTFE
seals.

On Sunday, 11 February 2018 20:38:35 UTC, newshound wrote:
On 10/02/2018 08:23, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
tabbypurr brought next idea :

Replacing the cartridge in an early Aqualisa 200, but could not get
the rear o-ring out. Showerdoc is hopelessly optimistic when he says
use a crochet hook. Maybe the design changed a bit later, there's no
way to get anything behind it. The only option I can see is to skewer
it, but my skewering items all failed to get far into the rubbed, it's
stiff stuff. http://i68.tinypic.com/2j31ct0.jpg

Any ideas to get this thing out? Ie what tool could I make?


NT

For £1 the pound shops sell a set of various small pointy objects, one
of these is bound to work.

I have a "craft knife" set which includes points, and narrow pointy
blades. Usually destructive of course, but works both on rubber and PTFE
seals.

so have I. It's useless because
a) access to the rock-rubber with a straight pointy object is approx zero.
b) all I've ever managed to achieve by skewering the once accessible edge of the hard rubber with such things is to chip off the tiniest fragment.
c) more or less no rubber now remains accessible due to this

I took it off the wall to see whether getting in through any of the ports could improve access. Not enough to do anything else was the answer to that.

I could drill a 1/2 - 3/4" hole in the back right by the rubber ring, but can't see how to reseal the plastic moulding against DHW. I don't have tap & die that large.

If I were excessively persistent I might get it all out in a month. But the force required is so great that I'm sure the surrounding plastic would be far too knackered to ever seal again.

I've wondered whether the cartridge could be put in then it sealed in place with silicone applied through a hole made in the rear, bypassing the o-ring issue entirely. I've checked the part to seal to doesn't move at any time.. It probably could, but resealing the housing remains a problem.

If I had endless time I'd probably get there somehow eventually. Maybe a plate mounted on the rear sealed to the shower housing with silicone... I just don't have endless time. I don't want to admit defeat and spend money, but I'm fairly defeated really.


NT

On Sat, 10 Feb 2018 03:13:31 -0800 (PST)
wrote:

Ah... a dental descaler thing. Not sure if it'd be string enough but
will try it.

My cheap-on-eBay hooked dental probes seem remarkably sharp and rigid,
although they may turn out to be brittle. ITYF descalers are the ones
with square or chisel forms on the business end, rather than pointed
bits.

On Sunday, 11 February 2018 21:48:20 UTC, Rob Morley wrote:
On Sat, 10 Feb 2018 03:13:31 -0800 (PST)
tabbypurr wrote:

Ah... a dental descaler thing. Not sure if it'd be string enough but
will try it.

My cheap-on-eBay hooked dental probes seem remarkably sharp and rigid,
although they may turn out to be brittle. ITYF descalers are the ones
with square or chisel forms on the business end, rather than pointed
bits.

a sharpened corkscrew was just about strong enough to attack the petrified rubber. A dental pick entirely hopeless. I can't imagine any dental tool having anything like the strength required.


NT