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#1
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Combi/shower problem update 2
BG came around to my Mums to look at her combi which wouldnt supply hot
water when the CH wasnt calling for heat. Apparently some crud in the valve which they sorted and to their credit, they *didnt* try and sell her a new boiler. Instead they are pushing a system power flush for £600 which sounds a lot to me. Assuming Im prepared to spend a day messing around looking for drain cocks and bits of hosepipe, is there any reason I cant do this myself? Is there a recommended flushing substance to treat the system with prior to a full flush? Tim -- Please don't feed the trolls |
#2
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On 22/01/2018 18:35, Tim+ wrote:
Apparently some crud in the valve which they sorted and to their credit, they *didnt* try and sell her a new boiler. Instead they are pushing a system power flush for £600 which sounds a lot to me. I'm pleased they didn't let me down entirely! Did they offer her a MagnaClean for £300? Assuming Im prepared to spend a day messing around looking for drain cocks and bits of hosepipe, is there any reason I cant do this myself? Is there a recommended flushing substance to treat the system with prior to a full flush? Tim |
#3
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Combi/shower problem update 2
Tim+ wrote:
BG came around to my Mum's to look at her combi which wouldn't supply hot water when the CH wasn't calling for heat. Apparently some crud in the valve which they sorted and to their credit, they *didn't* try and sell her a new boiler. Instead they are pushing a system "power flush" for 600 which sounds a lot to me. Assuming I'm prepared to spend a day messing around looking for drain cocks and bits of hosepipe, is there any reason I can't do this myself? Is there a recommended flushing substance to treat the system with prior to a full flush? Tim I've read that a power flush finds leaks in rads which if left alone would not be leaking. I'd leave well alone. |
#4
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On 22/01/2018 18:59, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
Tim+ wrote: BG came around to my Mum's to look at her combi which wouldn't supply hot water when the CH wasn't calling for heat. Apparently some crud in the valve which they sorted and to their credit, they *didn't* try and sell her a new boiler. Instead they are pushing a system "power flush" for 600 which sounds a lot to me. Assuming I'm prepared to spend a day messing around looking for drain cocks and bits of hosepipe, is there any reason I can't do this myself? Is there a recommended flushing substance to treat the system with prior to a full flush? Tim I've read that a power flush finds leaks in rads which if left alone would not be leaking. If they are that knackered, they soon will be - power flush or not. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#5
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On 22/01/2018 18:35, Tim+ wrote:
BG came around to my Mums to look at her combi which wouldnt supply hot water when the CH wasnt calling for heat. Apparently some crud in the valve which they sorted and to their credit, they *didnt* try and sell her a new boiler. Instead they are pushing a system power flush for £600 which sounds a lot to me. Assuming Im prepared to spend a day messing around looking for drain cocks and bits of hosepipe, is there any reason I cant do this myself? No, its quite doable. You can even hire the power flush kit if you fancy doing it that way. Mains water flush works quite well IME. I did not bother taking each rad out of circuit, but did arrange it so that each rad got full mains flow all to itself for several mins by closing off flow to all rads bar the one being flushed. would start it going wait til it ran clear, and then give it a couple more mins (some suggest bumping it with a rubber hammer as well to dislodge more crud). Then move through them one by one - open flow through the next, close off the previous etc (i.e. making sure not to cut off a water path altogether). When All are done, reverse the flow direction and do it again: http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...ating_flushing Is there a recommended flushing substance to treat the system with prior to a full flush? Sentinel et al do system cleaners that you can lob in upto a couple of weeks prior to flushing. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#6
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Combi/shower problem update 2
John Rumm wrote:
On 22/01/2018 18:35, Tim+ wrote: BG came around to my Mums to look at her combi which wouldnt supply hot water when the CH wasnt calling for heat. Apparently some crud in the valve which they sorted and to their credit, they *didnt* try and sell her a new boiler. Instead they are pushing a system power flush for £600 which sounds a lot to me. Assuming Im prepared to spend a day messing around looking for drain cocks and bits of hosepipe, is there any reason I cant do this myself? No, its quite doable. You can even hire the power flush kit if you fancy doing it that way. Mains water flush works quite well IME. I did not bother taking each rad out of circuit, but did arrange it so that each rad got full mains flow all to itself for several mins by closing off flow to all rads bar the one being flushed. would start it going wait til it ran clear, and then give it a couple more mins (some suggest bumping it with a rubber hammer as well to dislodge more crud). Then move through them one by one - open flow through the next, close off the previous etc (i.e. making sure not to cut off a water path altogether). When All are done, reverse the flow direction and do it again: http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...ating_flushing Cheers. Is there a recommended flushing substance to treat the system with prior to a full flush? Sentinel et al do system cleaners that you can lob in upto a couple of weeks prior to flushing. Is there any danger of them loosening crud that might then cause boiler problems again? Tim -- Please don't feed the trolls |
#7
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Combi/shower problem update 2
John Rumm wrote:
On 22/01/2018 18:59, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote: Tim+ wrote: BG came around to my Mum's to look at her combi which wouldn't supply hot water when the CH wasn't calling for heat. Apparently some crud in the valve which they sorted and to their credit, they *didn't* try and sell her a new boiler. Instead they are pushing a system "power flush" for 600 which sounds a lot to me. Assuming I'm prepared to spend a day messing around looking for drain cocks and bits of hosepipe, is there any reason I can't do this myself? Is there a recommended flushing substance to treat the system with prior to a full flush? Tim I've read that a power flush finds leaks in rads which if left alone would not be leaking. If they are that knackered, they soon will be - power flush or not. My rads are old as am I. My rads get Very hot. If it's not broken ........................ /================================================== ===============\ Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | -----------------------------------------------------------------| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#8
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On 22/01/2018 20:58, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
John Rumm wrote: On 22/01/2018 18:59, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote: Tim+ wrote: BG came around to my Mum's to look at her combi which wouldn't supply hot water when the CH wasn't calling for heat. Apparently some crud in the valve which they sorted and to their credit, they *didn't* try and sell her a new boiler. Instead they are pushing a system "power flush" for 600 which sounds a lot to me. Assuming I'm prepared to spend a day messing around looking for drain cocks and bits of hosepipe, is there any reason I can't do this myself? Is there a recommended flushing substance to treat the system with prior to a full flush? Tim I've read that a power flush finds leaks in rads which if left alone would not be leaking. If they are that knackered, they soon will be - power flush or not. My rads are old as am I. My rads get Very hot. If it's not broken And? If there is no need to flush, then there is no point in doing it. However there are times when it is wise to flush a system: when newly installed, or when significant work is done on it. When it no longer working well due to accumulated sludge, or prior to installing a modern boiler. Not doing a flush in any of those circumstances just because you fear a rad may spring a leak is daft. The cost of shagging a new boiler in short order far exceeds the cost of a new rad. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#9
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On Monday, 22 January 2018 20:47:05 UTC, John Rumm wrote:
On 22/01/2018 18:35, Tim+ wrote: BG came around to my Mums to look at her combi which wouldnt supply hot water when the CH wasnt calling for heat. Apparently some crud in the valve which they sorted and to their credit, they *didnt* try and sell her a new boiler. Instead they are pushing a system power flush for £600 which sounds a lot to me. Assuming Im prepared to spend a day messing around looking for drain cocks and bits of hosepipe, is there any reason I cant do this myself? No, its quite doable. You can even hire the power flush kit if you fancy doing it that way. Mains water flush works quite well IME. I did not bother taking each rad out of circuit, but did arrange it so that each rad got full mains flow all to itself for several mins by closing off flow to all rads bar the one being flushed. would start it going wait til it ran clear, and then give it a couple more mins (some suggest bumping it with a rubber hammer as well to dislodge more crud). Then move through them one by one - open flow through the next, close off the previous etc (i.e. making sure not to cut off a water path altogether). When All are done, reverse the flow direction and do it again: http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...ating_flushing Is there a recommended flushing substance to treat the system with prior to a full flush? Sentinel et al do system cleaners that you can lob in upto a couple of weeks prior to flushing. I'd fit a magnetic filter and let it do all the work. Much easier. CH cleaner chemical is wonderful for loosening up the junk. Sentinel of Fernox, I forget which, can be left in as long as you want. NT |
#10
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On 22/01/2018 20:54, Tim+ wrote:
John Rumm wrote: On 22/01/2018 18:35, Tim+ wrote: BG came around to my Mums to look at her combi which wouldnt supply hot water when the CH wasnt calling for heat. Apparently some crud in the valve which they sorted and to their credit, they *didnt* try and sell her a new boiler. Instead they are pushing a system power flush for £600 which sounds a lot to me. Assuming Im prepared to spend a day messing around looking for drain cocks and bits of hosepipe, is there any reason I cant do this myself? No, its quite doable. You can even hire the power flush kit if you fancy doing it that way. Mains water flush works quite well IME. I did not bother taking each rad out of circuit, but did arrange it so that each rad got full mains flow all to itself for several mins by closing off flow to all rads bar the one being flushed. would start it going wait til it ran clear, and then give it a couple more mins (some suggest bumping it with a rubber hammer as well to dislodge more crud). Then move through them one by one - open flow through the next, close off the previous etc (i.e. making sure not to cut off a water path altogether). When All are done, reverse the flow direction and do it again: http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...ating_flushing Cheers. Is there a recommended flushing substance to treat the system with prior to a full flush? Sentinel et al do system cleaners that you can lob in upto a couple of weeks prior to flushing. Is there any danger of them loosening crud that might then cause boiler problems again? You are better off taking the boiler out of circuit[1] so that you don't flush any crud through it. Especially if its a modern boiler (the high efficiency HX have lots of small water pathways and heatsink fins that intrude into the flow - they are easy to block or erode with particulate contaminated flow). [1] either temporary re-pipig, or just turning off the flow and return service valve. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#11
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On 22/01/18 18:35, Tim+ wrote:
BG came around to my Mums to look at her combi which wouldnt supply hot water when the CH wasnt calling for heat. [..]] Tim Not only the same name but i have the same problem! a plumber spent half last week cursing and head scratching and driving into town for parts. It's worse than ever now. New heat exchanger tomorrow. TW |
#12
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Combi/shower problem update 2
TimW wrote:
On 22/01/18 18:35, Tim+ wrote: BG came around to my Mums to look at her combi which wouldnt supply hot water when the CH wasnt calling for heat. [..]] Tim Not only the same name but i have the same problem! a plumber spent half last week cursing and head scratching and driving into town for parts. It's worse than ever now. New heat exchanger tomorrow. TW As was pointed out earlier, many plumbers are poorly qualified to do repairs on boilers. If its a decent make like Vaillant, the manufacturer will have their own service/repair crews who carry spares etc. Tim -- Please don't feed the trolls |
#13
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On 22/01/2018 21:14, John Rumm wrote:
On 22/01/2018 20:54, Tim+ wrote: John Rumm wrote: On 22/01/2018 18:35, Tim+ wrote: BG came around to my Mums to look at her combi which wouldnt supply hot water when the CH wasnt calling for heat. Apparently some crud in the valve which they sorted and to their credit, they *didnt* try and sell her a new boiler. Instead they are pushing a system power flush for £600 which sounds a lot to me. Assuming Im prepared to spend a day messing around looking for drain cocks and bits of hosepipe, is there any reason I cant do this myself? No, its quite doable. You can even hire the power flush kit if you fancy doing it that way. Mains water flush works quite well IME. I did not bother taking each rad out of circuit, but did arrange it so that each rad got full mains flow all to itself for several mins by closing off flow to all rads bar the one being flushed.* would start it going wait til it ran clear, and then give it a couple more mins (some suggest bumping it with a rubber hammer as well to dislodge more crud). Then move through them one by one - open flow through the next, close off the previous etc (i.e. making sure not to cut off a water path altogether). When All are done, reverse the flow direction and do it again: http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...ating_flushing Cheers. Is there a recommended flushing substance to treat the system with prior to a full flush? Sentinel et al do system cleaners that you can lob in upto a couple of weeks prior to flushing. Is there any danger of them loosening crud that might then cause boiler problems again? You are better off taking the boiler out of circuit[1] so that you don't flush any crud through it. Especially if its a modern boiler (the high efficiency HX have lots of small water pathways and heatsink fins that intrude into the flow - they are easy to block or erode with particulate contaminated flow). [1] either temporary re-pipig, or just turning off the flow and return service valve. I reckon a Magnaclean is not a bad investment. Apart from collecting magnetite, they provide a quick and easy way to add inhibitor. |
#14
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On 22/01/2018 23:26, Tim+ wrote:
TimW wrote: On 22/01/18 18:35, Tim+ wrote: BG came around to my Mums to look at her combi which wouldnt supply hot water when the CH wasnt calling for heat. [..]] Tim Not only the same name but i have the same problem! a plumber spent half last week cursing and head scratching and driving into town for parts. It's worse than ever now. New heat exchanger tomorrow. TW As was pointed out earlier, many plumbers are poorly qualified to do repairs on boilers. If its a decent make like Vaillant, the manufacturer will have their own service/repair crews who carry spares etc. Tim But at a price, I guess? Anyone got experience of them. Currently do my own maintenance, but one day.... |
#15
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Combi/shower problem update 2
"newshound" wrote in message o.uk... As was pointed out earlier, many plumbers are poorly qualified to do repairs on boilers. If its a decent make like Vaillant, the manufacturer will have their own service/repair crews who carry spares etc. Tim But at a price, I guess? Anyone got experience of them. Currently do my own maintenance, but one day.... always worth trying perhaps one of my bar staff had a Baxi start leaking and blew it fuse over Christmas tried a few local plumbers but nobody could turn out till the after new year so she rung Baxi guy turned up next day and replaced the plastic diverter valve free of charge said it was a known problem, boiler was well out of warranty - |
#16
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On 23/01/2018 15:26, newshound wrote:
On 22/01/2018 21:14, John Rumm wrote: On 22/01/2018 20:54, Tim+ wrote: John Rumm wrote: On 22/01/2018 18:35, Tim+ wrote: BG came around to my Mums to look at her combi which wouldnt supply hot water when the CH wasnt calling for heat. Apparently some crud in the valve which they sorted and to their credit, they *didnt* try and sell her a new boiler. Instead they are pushing a system power flush for £600 which sounds a lot to me. Assuming Im prepared to spend a day messing around looking for drain cocks and bits of hosepipe, is there any reason I cant do this myself? No, its quite doable. You can even hire the power flush kit if you fancy doing it that way. Mains water flush works quite well IME. I did not bother taking each rad out of circuit, but did arrange it so that each rad got full mains flow all to itself for several mins by closing off flow to all rads bar the one being flushed. would start it going wait til it ran clear, and then give it a couple more mins (some suggest bumping it with a rubber hammer as well to dislodge more crud). Then move through them one by one - open flow through the next, close off the previous etc (i.e. making sure not to cut off a water path altogether). When All are done, reverse the flow direction and do it again: http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...ating_flushing Cheers. Is there a recommended flushing substance to treat the system with prior to a full flush? Sentinel et al do system cleaners that you can lob in upto a couple of weeks prior to flushing. Is there any danger of them loosening crud that might then cause boiler problems again? You are better off taking the boiler out of circuit[1] so that you don't flush any crud through it. Especially if its a modern boiler (the high efficiency HX have lots of small water pathways and heatsink fins that intrude into the flow - they are easy to block or erode with particulate contaminated flow). [1] either temporary re-pipig, or just turning off the flow and return service valve. I reckon a Magnaclean is not a bad investment. Apart from collecting magnetite, they provide a quick and easy way to add inhibitor. In principle yup. I prefer the Fernox TF1, since it appears to have a better cyclonic action for catching the non magnetic particulates in addition to the magnet for the magnetite. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#17
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On Tuesday, 23 January 2018 17:53:56 UTC, John Rumm wrote:
On 23/01/2018 15:26, newshound wrote: I reckon a Magnaclean is not a bad investment. Apart from collecting magnetite, they provide a quick and easy way to add inhibitor. In principle yup. I prefer the Fernox TF1, since it appears to have a better cyclonic action for catching the non magnetic particulates in addition to the magnet for the magnetite. The magnet is useful, but get one with a filter, that bit catches far more than the magnet NT |
#19
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On Wednesday, 24 January 2018 11:09:55 UTC, John Rumm wrote:
On 23/01/2018 18:27, tabbypurr wrote: On Tuesday, 23 January 2018 17:53:56 UTC, John Rumm wrote: On 23/01/2018 15:26, newshound wrote: I reckon a Magnaclean is not a bad investment. Apart from collecting magnetite, they provide a quick and easy way to add inhibitor. In principle yup. I prefer the Fernox TF1, since it appears to have a better cyclonic action for catching the non magnetic particulates in addition to the magnet for the magnetite. The magnet is useful, but get one with a filter, that bit catches far more than the magnet I have not seen any with a traditional filter as such - only magnetic and cyclonic collection. Which one were you thinking of? Zeetec NT |
#20
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On 24/01/2018 14:14, wrote:
On Wednesday, 24 January 2018 11:09:55 UTC, John Rumm wrote: On 23/01/2018 18:27, tabbypurr wrote: On Tuesday, 23 January 2018 17:53:56 UTC, John Rumm wrote: On 23/01/2018 15:26, newshound wrote: I reckon a Magnaclean is not a bad investment. Apart from collecting magnetite, they provide a quick and easy way to add inhibitor. In principle yup. I prefer the Fernox TF1, since it appears to have a better cyclonic action for catching the non magnetic particulates in addition to the magnet for the magnetite. The magnet is useful, but get one with a filter, that bit catches far more than the magnet I have not seen any with a traditional filter as such - only magnetic and cyclonic collection. Which one were you thinking of? Zeetec As in: http://www.zeetec.org/boiler-filter/ Looks interesting - would be interesting to know how it compares in performance from say: https://www.fernox.com/filters/tf1-total-filter (Which uses a cyclonic action to collect the non mag particles but has no mesh filter). -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#21
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On Wednesday, 24 January 2018 14:42:33 UTC, John Rumm wrote:
On 24/01/2018 14:14, tabbypurr wrote: On Wednesday, 24 January 2018 11:09:55 UTC, John Rumm wrote: On 23/01/2018 18:27, tabbypurr wrote: On Tuesday, 23 January 2018 17:53:56 UTC, John Rumm wrote: On 23/01/2018 15:26, newshound wrote: I reckon a Magnaclean is not a bad investment. Apart from collecting magnetite, they provide a quick and easy way to add inhibitor. In principle yup. I prefer the Fernox TF1, since it appears to have a better cyclonic action for catching the non magnetic particulates in addition to the magnet for the magnetite. The magnet is useful, but get one with a filter, that bit catches far more than the magnet I have not seen any with a traditional filter as such - only magnetic and cyclonic collection. Which one were you thinking of? Zeetec As in: http://www.zeetec.org/boiler-filter/ Looks interesting - would be interesting to know how it compares in performance from say: https://www.fernox.com/filters/tf1-total-filter (Which uses a cyclonic action to collect the non mag particles but has no mesh filter). I've got a Zeetec & it works well. The great majority of crud is stopped by the mesh filter. It's easy to clean out. The body is very thick plastic. It's not cyclonic. I don't know how one would compare it to non-filter ones. And they're under £50 iirc. NT |
#22
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On Wed, 24 Jan 2018 14:42:36 +0000, John Rumm wrote:
On 24/01/2018 14:14, wrote: On Wednesday, 24 January 2018 11:09:55 UTC, John Rumm wrote: On 23/01/2018 18:27, tabbypurr wrote: On Tuesday, 23 January 2018 17:53:56 UTC, John Rumm wrote: On 23/01/2018 15:26, newshound wrote: I reckon a Magnaclean is not a bad investment. Apart from collecting magnetite, they provide a quick and easy way to add inhibitor. In principle yup. I prefer the Fernox TF1, since it appears to have a better cyclonic action for catching the non magnetic particulates in addition to the magnet for the magnetite. The magnet is useful, but get one with a filter, that bit catches far more than the magnet I have not seen any with a traditional filter as such - only magnetic and cyclonic collection. Which one were you thinking of? Zeetec As in: http://www.zeetec.org/boiler-filter/ Looks interesting - would be interesting to know how it compares in performance from say: https://www.fernox.com/filters/tf1-total-filter (Which uses a cyclonic action to collect the non mag particles but has no mesh filter). The Fernox is for a vertical pipe with /upward/ flow - surely it would be better in the Return pipe, so as to cut the crud before the boiler. Most of the prticles are from the rads. and not wanted in the boiler. I couln't fit one of these on my system as the only upward flow in the Return is a short run under the boiler. -- Peter. The gods will stay away whilst religions hold sway |
#23
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Combi/shower problem update 2
On 25/01/2018 08:29, PeterC wrote:
On Wed, 24 Jan 2018 14:42:36 +0000, John Rumm wrote: On 24/01/2018 14:14, wrote: On Wednesday, 24 January 2018 11:09:55 UTC, John Rumm wrote: On 23/01/2018 18:27, tabbypurr wrote: On Tuesday, 23 January 2018 17:53:56 UTC, John Rumm wrote: On 23/01/2018 15:26, newshound wrote: I reckon a Magnaclean is not a bad investment. Apart from collecting magnetite, they provide a quick and easy way to add inhibitor. In principle yup. I prefer the Fernox TF1, since it appears to have a better cyclonic action for catching the non magnetic particulates in addition to the magnet for the magnetite. The magnet is useful, but get one with a filter, that bit catches far more than the magnet I have not seen any with a traditional filter as such - only magnetic and cyclonic collection. Which one were you thinking of? Zeetec As in: http://www.zeetec.org/boiler-filter/ Looks interesting - would be interesting to know how it compares in performance from say: https://www.fernox.com/filters/tf1-total-filter (Which uses a cyclonic action to collect the non mag particles but has no mesh filter). The Fernox is for a vertical pipe with /upward/ flow No, it can be used in either horizontal or vertical and with flow in either direction. However it comes set for upward flow by default, but you can change it by rotating the collar prior to fixing. - surely it would be better in the Return pipe, so as to cut the crud before the boiler. Since most boilers are wall mounted and piped from below, the return probably will be flowing up in more cases than the other alternatives. Most of the prticles are from the rads. and not wanted in the boiler. I couln't fit one of these on my system Yes you could. See the instructions on the bottom of page 2: https://www.fernox.com/sites/default...lter_v.002.pdf -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
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