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A mate of mine just did a DIY aircon install, so I talked him into
writing it up for the wiki. Seems like a good result:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ir_Conditioner


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An interesting read, thanks John.

A query, if you wouldn't mind asking your friend:-

Did the units have the connection points to support purging and leak testing with a vacuum pump?

Thanks

Mike
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John Rumm Wrote in message:
A mate of mine just did a DIY aircon install, so I talked him into
writing it up for the wiki. Seems like a good result:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ir_Conditioner



Nicely done - both of you :-)

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On 01/08/2017 23:15, John Rumm wrote:
A mate of mine just did a DIY aircon install, so I talked him into
writing it up for the wiki. Seems like a good result:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ir_Conditioner


Thanks (to both of you).

One small, tangential, thought: would it be worth adding a _brief_ point
on planning permission? Cock-shy:

Planning permission

You currently don't need it in England and Wales if:

it's reversible (so it's a heat pump)
in residential property which is not listed
the outdoor unit is less than 0.6m3 and at least 1m from the boundary.

It's permitted development.
Scotland is similar but different.

Of course that's no guarantee neighbours won't complain about the noise.

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On 02/08/2017 11:42, Robin wrote:
On 01/08/2017 23:15, John Rumm wrote:
A mate of mine just did a DIY aircon install, so I talked him into
writing it up for the wiki. Seems like a good result:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ir_Conditioner


Thanks (to both of you).

One small, tangential, thought: would it be worth adding a _brief_ point
on planning permission? Cock-shy:

Planning permission

You currently don't need it in England and Wales if:

it's reversible (so it's a heat pump)
in residential property which is not listed
the outdoor unit is less than 0.6m3 and at least 1m from the boundary.

It's permitted development.
Scotland is similar but different.


I had a look on the planning portal site, and that seems to be a subset
of the requirements for installation of a air source heat pump under
permitted development - but that does specify one *only* used for
heating. It does not seem to mention much on AC/Heat Pump installs.

Of course that's no guarantee neighbours won't complain about the noise.


Richard said: "The planning permission and the sensibility of discussing
plans with the neighbours are good points, but I'd prefer to describe
how the regulations apply to me and what I discussed with the
neighbours. I had an alternative location for the outdoor unit but they
actually preferred the location for the outdoor unit which I felt would
be more noisy to them."

(having heard it myself - its almost silent anyway, so probably non
issue for small units like this)



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John.

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On 02/08/2017 12:55, John Rumm wrote:

I had a look on the planning portal site, and that seems to be a subset
of the requirements for installation of a air source heat pump under
permitted development - but that does specify one *only* used for
heating. It does not seem to mention much on AC/Heat Pump installs.


Yep, I cocked it up. I saw the regs. were silent on a/c so asked my
council's planning helpline. They said the air sourced heat pumps could
be run in reverse - as they had to be for defrosting. So I left it at
that and started talking to neighbours, found one lot *not* happy and
gave up until they come around.

Of course that's no guarantee neighbours won't complain about the noise.


Richard said: "The planning permission and the sensibility of discussing
plans with the neighbours are good points, but I'd prefer to describe
how the regulations apply to me and what I discussed with the
neighbours. I had an alternative location for the outdoor unit but they
actually preferred the location for the outdoor unit which I felt would
be more noisy to them."


Very fair, and wd be helpful.

(having heard it myself - its almost silent anyway, so probably non
issue for small units like this)

..

When it's a Victorian terrace I fear "almost" is not a convincing point
I'm hoping things will get better over time if they hear modern
split systems to displace their memories of US-style boxes-in-a-window.

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On Wednesday, 2 August 2017 14:51:56 UTC+1, Robin wrote:

When it's a Victorian terrace I fear "almost" is not a convincing point
I'm hoping things will get better over time if they hear modern
split systems to displace their memories of US-style boxes-in-a-window.


I've added some details of noise from the system into the write-up. I think it's worthwhile directing the sound along the barrier not across it.

It occurs to me - it might be possible to reduce the sound levels further by accepting a more intrusive footprint and installing the outdoor unit at a right angle to the wall of the building, and also away from other reflecting surfaces. Another approach might be to put the outdoor unit further away from the wall and place a sound-absorbing (and weatherproof) material behind it.

When the weather gets a bit more extreme (hot or cold) and the system needs to do more work, maybe it will get louder.

Hope this helps.

- Richard.
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wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, 2 August 2017 14:51:56 UTC+1, Robin wrote:

When it's a Victorian terrace I fear "almost" is not a convincing point
I'm hoping things will get better over time if they hear modern
split systems to displace their memories of US-style boxes-in-a-window.


I've added some details of noise from the system into the write-up. I think
it's worthwhile directing the sound along the barrier not across it.

It occurs to me - it might be possible to reduce the sound levels further by
accepting a more intrusive footprint and installing the outdoor unit at a
right angle to the wall of the building, and also away from other reflecting
surfaces. Another approach might be to put the outdoor unit further away
from the wall and place a sound-absorbing (and weatherproof) material behind
it.

When the weather gets a bit more extreme (hot or cold) and the system needs
to do more work, maybe it will get louder.

Hope this helps.

Noise (etc) can definitely be a problem. We live next to the Major and Mrs
Major who enjoy complaining. We had to buy a condensing tumble drier because
they didn't want our exhaust to protrude from our own wall towards their
property. Same with the WB central heating boiler, we had to exhaust through
the roof. Maybe not HAD to but i'm a kindly fellow.






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In article ,
John Rumm writes:
Richard said: "The planning permission and the sensibility of discussing
plans with the neighbours are good points, but I'd prefer to describe
how the regulations apply to me and what I discussed with the
neighbours. I had an alternative location for the outdoor unit but they
actually preferred the location for the outdoor unit which I felt would
be more noisy to them."

(having heard it myself - its almost silent anyway, so probably non
issue for small units like this)


I have a split unit I fitted 12 years ago.
I was chatting to a new neighbour over the fence, when he
noticed the unit. He asked,
"How noisy is that when it's on?"
to which I responded,
"It is on."

You can hear it if you are standing next to it, but not if
you are halfway across the garden.

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On Wednesday, 2 August 2017 11:42:15 UTC+1, Robin wrote:
On 01/08/2017 23:15, John Rumm wrote:
A mate of mine just did a DIY aircon install, so I talked him into
writing it up for the wiki. Seems like a good result:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ir_Conditioner


Thanks (to both of you).

One small, tangential, thought: would it be worth adding a _brief_ point
on planning permission? Cock-shy:

Planning permission

You currently don't need it in England and Wales if:

it's reversible (so it's a heat pump)
in residential property which is not listed
the outdoor unit is less than 0.6m3 and at least 1m from the boundary.

It's permitted development.
Scotland is similar but different.

Of course that's no guarantee neighbours won't complain about the noise.

--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid


I've added a section on planning permission - the legislation for England and the section and clauses in it which apply to me. It would all rather snowball if I try to deal with other locations and scenarios, but I would hope anyone planning their own system would realise they need to find out which rules apply to them.

I think, I am so lucky to have such nice neighbours.

- Richard.
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On Tuesday, 1 August 2017 23:15:22 UTC+1, John Rumm wrote:
A mate of mine just did a DIY aircon install, so I talked him into
writing it up for the wiki. Seems like a good result:


"the flanges for hanging the equipment are simply too weak to stop them sagging under the weight of the unit"

is it safe to leave it in that condition? Might it not fall off completely eventually?

Also, is an electrical isolator required at the outside unit, or a lockable isolator inside?

Owain

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In article . com,
"dennis@home" writes:
On 02/08/2017 13:02, John Rumm wrote:
On 02/08/2017 12:08, wrote:
On Tuesday, 1 August 2017 23:15:22 UTC+1, John Rumm wrote:
A mate of mine just did a DIY aircon install, so I talked him into
writing it up for the wiki. Seems like a good result:

"the flanges for hanging the equipment are simply too weak to stop
them sagging under the weight of the unit"

is it safe to leave it in that condition? Might it not fall off
completely eventually?


I guess time will tell. I presume its unlikely since they are probably
sold a fair few of these over time.

Also, is an electrical isolator required at the outside unit, or a
lockable isolator inside?


That would be a good argument for dedicated circuit from the CU (so it
could be locked off there) - although that is not strictly isolation.

For a domestic install running from a plug it seems like a non issue.


Mine wanted a 20A feed. Its only 1600W but I suppose they think it might
trip a smaller circuit.


Compressor motor can pull a large switch-on surge.
That was also another reason to have it on a different circuit,
to reduce impact on other appliances of the momentary voltage sag
(used to be particularly noticable with filament lamps).
The surge can be quite long too if the motor doesn't start (which
is quite common if the system still has residual dynamic pressure
in it from the previous run).

Mine is also around 1500W, but the locked rotor power is 4500W,
and it tries for around 5 seconds before giving up and waiting a
bit longer for the dynamic pressure to equalise out in the system.

I also did the easy option and bolted the outside unit to a couple of
3x2 paving slabs.


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On Wednesday, 2 August 2017 12:08:13 UTC+1, wrote:
On Tuesday, 1 August 2017 23:15:22 UTC+1, John Rumm wrote:
A mate of mine just did a DIY aircon install, so I talked him into
writing it up for the wiki. Seems like a good result:


"the flanges for hanging the equipment are simply too weak to stop them sagging under the weight of the unit"

is it safe to leave it in that condition? Might it not fall off completely eventually?

Also, is an electrical isolator required at the outside unit, or a lockable isolator inside?

Owain


I've rewritten the description of the wall bracket (a poor choice of wording) and plumped up the electrical section ... hope this is better.

- Richard.
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On 8/1/2017 11:15 PM, John Rumm wrote:
A mate of mine just did a DIY aircon install, so I talked him into
writing it up for the wiki. Seems like a good result:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ir_Conditioner


As I was sweltering in my main bedroom a few weeks ago I thought I
really ought to get on and do this. Would want a reversible one for the
winter.
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On 02/08/17 16:08, newshound wrote:
On 8/1/2017 11:15 PM, John Rumm wrote:
A mate of mine just did a DIY aircon install, so I talked him into
writing it up for the wiki. Seems like a good result:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ir_Conditioner


As I was sweltering in my main bedroom a few weeks ago I thought I
really ought to get on and do this. Would want a reversible one for the
winter.


I'd have to say - I'd be tempted to fit one at some point as it's
straightforward (the hole through the double brick cavity wall would be
the biggest PITA).

I have really hated some of the recent sweltering nights.

John's point on planning is a good one though...
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On 8/2/2017 6:00 PM, Tim Watts wrote:
On 02/08/17 16:08, newshound wrote:
On 8/1/2017 11:15 PM, John Rumm wrote:
A mate of mine just did a DIY aircon install, so I talked him into
writing it up for the wiki. Seems like a good result:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ir_Conditioner


As I was sweltering in my main bedroom a few weeks ago I thought I
really ought to get on and do this. Would want a reversible one for
the winter.


I'd have to say - I'd be tempted to fit one at some point as it's
straightforward (the hole through the double brick cavity wall would be
the biggest PITA).

I have really hated some of the recent sweltering nights.

John's point on planning is a good one though...


I already have a "hole" in my obvious location from when I moved a boiler.

I think in my location I can get away without troubling "planning"
(especially if I get it done before the commercial site next door is
sold for housing, for which they have PP).

I'm also hampered by being Grade 2 listed, not that there is any good
aesthetic reason not to put a heat exchanger on the outside (or inside,
for that matter).


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In article ,
Tim Watts writes:
On 02/08/17 16:08, newshound wrote:
On 8/1/2017 11:15 PM, John Rumm wrote:
A mate of mine just did a DIY aircon install, so I talked him into
writing it up for the wiki. Seems like a good result:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ir_Conditioner


As I was sweltering in my main bedroom a few weeks ago I thought I
really ought to get on and do this. Would want a reversible one for the
winter.


I'd have to say - I'd be tempted to fit one at some point as it's
straightforward (the hole through the double brick cavity wall would be
the biggest PITA).


Having previously cored a hole through the outer wall
(bloody hard bricks - took best part of an hour), I
knew I wasn't going to do that again. I took out half
a brick instead by drilling out the mortar around
half of it, and then stitch drilling down the middle.

Inner skin is thermal blocks which you can cut through
with a finger nail.

I have really hated some of the recent sweltering nights.


Unless it's a gigantic bedroom, you might struggle to
find one small enough that it doesn't crash the
temperature too low before it notices and reacts.
Have you tried a simple fan to stir the air?

John's point on planning is a good one though...


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On 05/08/17 09:15, Andrew Gabriel wrote:

Unless it's a gigantic bedroom, you might struggle to
find one small enough that it doesn't crash the
temperature too low before it notices and reacts.
Have you tried a simple fan to stir the air?


Good point - perhaps the "right way" for me at least would be to air
condition the hall - then people could leave their bedroom doors open
(or not) as required to benefit. 1 unit would serve all 3 rooms that way.
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Tim Watts wrote:
On 05/08/17 09:15, Andrew Gabriel wrote:

Unless it's a gigantic bedroom, you might struggle to
find one small enough that it doesn't crash the
temperature too low before it notices and reacts.
Have you tried a simple fan to stir the air?


Good point - perhaps the "right way" for me at least would be to air
condition the hall - then people could leave their bedroom doors open
(or not) as required to benefit. 1 unit would serve all 3 rooms that way.


Cold air falls!
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On Saturday, 5 August 2017 09:48:58 UTC+1, Tim Watts wrote:
On 05/08/17 09:15, Andrew Gabriel wrote:

Unless it's a gigantic bedroom, you might struggle to
find one small enough that it doesn't crash the
temperature too low before it notices and reacts.
Have you tried a simple fan to stir the air?


Good point - perhaps the "right way" for me at least would be to air
condition the hall - then people could leave their bedroom doors open
(or not) as required to benefit. 1 unit would serve all 3 rooms that way.


This system is very much a "room" air conditioner. If you put the indoor unit in a hallway or landing, it will sense the environment around it rather than in the rooms nearby, and it may shut down too soon unless the arrangement is fairly open plan.

My room is 2.5 x 3.5 metres, say 10 x 12 feet. I would be happy to put the same system in a bedroom this size, but preferably a bit larger and certainly not any smaller. But really, walking around from an air-conditioned room to an untreated room and back again is not terribly pleasant, and I'd look for a system to deal with every room, or at least every room on a floor. To my mind, these small systems are ideal for an outbuilding or possibly an open plan living area, but a house (divided into rooms and floors) needs something more sophisticated.

- Richard.
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On 02/08/17 18:17, Huge wrote:

We have a monobloc one. Pretty old, very, very noisy, and not as effective
as a split unit, but it blows cold air! I drilled a 110mm hole through
the wall for the exhaust.



How long did the core drilling actually take, out of interest? I need to
put a boiler flue in of similar size...


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On 02/08/2017 19:57, Tim Watts wrote:
On 02/08/17 18:17, Huge wrote:

We have a monobloc one. Pretty old, very, very noisy, and not as
effective
as a split unit, but it blows cold air! I drilled a 110mm hole through
the wall for the exhaust.



How long did the core drilling actually take, out of interest? I need to
put a boiler flue in of similar size...



IME it varies a bit depending on what the wall is like. Worst case is
perhaps 20 - 25 mins through hard solid wall with a 110mm core.
(probably extended a bit because my core drill tends to "let go" on its
clutch too easily - so if you get a wall where it keeps snagging it
takes longer).

Smaller cores and softer walls can be just a few mins.

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On 02/08/17 22:10, Huge wrote:

I discovered quite quickly that it's essential to hold the cutter straight
in the hole once it gets more than a few cm in, else it binds and trips
the clutch.

BTW, Tim, it's essential to have a drill with an over-torque clutch, else
you'll break something, likely your wrist. I don't own an SDS drill, so
I rent that, also.


Thanks for the warning - I plan to rent a suitable setup

I watched a couple of videos on Youtube before attempting my first one,
although they cheated and drilled through "breeze" block. I was cutting
through a solid brick wall, two bricks thick (150 y/o cow barn).

But it literally takes less time to drill the hole than to drive into town
(about 3 miles) and rent the drill.



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On 02/08/17 22:13, Huge wrote:
On 2017-08-02, Huge wrote:

[28 lines snipped]

I watched a couple of videos on Youtube before attempting my first one,
although they cheated and drilled through "breeze" block. I was cutting
through a solid brick wall, two bricks thick (150 y/o cow barn).


One other thing I remembered - you can drill from both sides, which is
much easier (less cutter in the wall) by drilling an initial hole all
the way through and then replacing the drill bit in the axis of the
cutter with a, er, name forgotten, rod thingy that just follows the hole.
That way the inside and outside holes line up.



Yes - I've done that with my TCT cutter on earlier holes.

The TCT is great for soft block, but takes an age on brick - unless you
engage hammer, in which case it lacks finess - and the wall tends to
lack some of the plaster!
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On 02/08/2017 22:13, Huge wrote:
On 2017-08-02, Huge wrote:

[28 lines snipped]

I watched a couple of videos on Youtube before attempting my first one,
although they cheated and drilled through "breeze" block. I was cutting
through a solid brick wall, two bricks thick (150 y/o cow barn).


One other thing I remembered - you can drill from both sides, which is
much easier (less cutter in the wall) by drilling an initial hole all
the way through and then replacing the drill bit in the axis of the
cutter with a, er, name forgotten, rod thingy


Pilot drill or follower...

that just follows the hole.
That way the inside and outside holes line up.


Also worth noting, when starting with a pilot bit, take it out once the
core is started since it does not cut that fast without hammer action,
and makes slower progress than the diamond core.


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John.

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On 02/08/17 20:14, Huge wrote:
On 2017-08-02, Tim Watts wrote:
On 02/08/17 18:17, Huge wrote:

We have a monobloc one. Pretty old, very, very noisy, and not as effective
as a split unit, but it blows cold air! I drilled a 110mm hole through
the wall for the exhaust.



How long did the core drilling actually take, out of interest? I need to
put a boiler flue in of similar size...


10 minutes, maybe? Through a double thickness brick wall (no cavity -
what's that, 9") + the Kingspan & dry lining ...



Blimey. I'll get one of those. If they do 25mm cutters, I have a number
of pipe holes to do for radiators too - prefer something with some
finess rather than bashing half the plaster off.


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On Tuesday, 1 August 2017 23:15:22 UTC+1, John Rumm wrote:
A mate of mine just did a DIY aircon install, so I talked him into
writing it up for the wiki. Seems like a good result:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ir_Conditioner


--
Cheers,

John.

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Thank you everyone for your kind and thoughtful comments. This write-up is my first contribution to any Wiki, and this is my first post to the associated forum. I am Richard, I read Electrical and Electronic Engineering more than 30 years ago and I currently work with the certification of medical electrical equipment for a living. I do DIY from time to time when I feel a real need and benefit, but not frequently. I wrote this article because there seems to be a bit of a dearth on this subject (and John suggested it) - plenty of videos on YouTube but relatively few written articles. Well, I can't find them.

I can see a need to add a few new sections to my write-up including planning regulations, and electrical supply options, and also explain this building is in the garden of a house under single occupancy.

My use of the word "sagging" is a poor choice. I would like to have a bracket made out of sturdier material which I can press firmly into place and slide the indoor unit down into, but the nature of the job, with pipes sticking out of the back means the indoor unit has to be manipulated into place, not simply dropped down onto its bracket especially at the right-hand end. It is safe (honest!), it won't fall off (and if did fall, it would be dangling on its pipes ...) but a better choice of words would and will help.

I'd like to wait and see if more comments arrive in the next few days, and then write up the new things and re-work the poorer / misleading parts in one hit e.g. at the weekend.

I do think it is best to concentrate on the regulations for planning and electrics as they apply to me and my system, and also "now" i.e. July 2017. This should keeps things focussed. For example, a larger system might well benefit from a lockable isolator (e.g. to shut off one unit out of several) or need one (if the wiring regulations say so) but for such a simple system, isolation is obtained by pulling out the 13A plug and locking out (if needed) could be achieved by locking the door to the room. I prefer to write about what I done, and if useful or important why I have done it, rather than tell other people what they might or ought do themselves. This would probably justify an article on its own "wiring an ac" a bit like "wiring a fan", but I don't have the knowledge or experience to attempt this.

I'll try for my updates at the weekend.

Richard.
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On Tuesday, 1 August 2017 23:15:22 UTC+1, John Rumm wrote:
A mate of mine just did a DIY aircon install, so I talked him into
writing it up for the wiki. Seems like a good result:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ir_Conditioner


--
Cheers,

John.

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Thank you everyone for your kind and thoughtful comments. This write-up is my first contribution to any Wiki, and this is my first post to the associated forum. I am Richard, I read Electrical and Electronic Engineering more than 30 years ago and I currently work with the certification of medical electrical equipment for a living. I do DIY from time to time when I feel a real need and benefit, but not frequently. I wrote this article because there seems to be a bit of a dearth on this subject (and John suggested it) - plenty of videos on YouTube but relatively few written articles. Well, I can't find them.

I can see a need to add a few new sections to my write-up including planning regulations, and electrical supply options, and also explain this building is in the garden of a house under single occupancy.

My use of the word "sagging" is a poor choice. I would like to have a bracket made out of sturdier material which I can press firmly into place and slide the indoor unit down into, but the nature of the job, with pipes sticking out of the back means the indoor unit has to be manipulated into place, not simply dropped down onto its bracket especially at the right-hand end. It is safe (honest!), it won't fall off (and if did fall, it would be dangling on its pipes ...) but a better choice of words would and will help.

I'd like to wait and see if more comments arrive in the next few days, and then write up the new things and re-work the poorer / misleading parts in one hit e.g. at the weekend.

I do think it is best to concentrate on the regulations for planning and electrics as they apply to me and my system, and also "now" i.e. July 2017. This should keeps things focussed. For example, a larger system might well benefit from a lockable isolator (e.g. to shut off one unit out of several) or need one (if the wiring regulations say so) but for such a simple system, isolation is obtained by pulling out the 13A plug and locking out (if needed) could be achieved by locking the door to the room. I prefer to write about what I done, and if useful or important why I have done it, rather than tell other people what they might or ought do themselves. This would probably justify an article on its own "wiring an ac" a bit like "wiring a fan", but I don't have the knowledge or experience to attempt this.

I'll try for my updates at the weekend.

Richard.


Welcome Richard!

Wish more people joined in with that kind of start!

Cheers
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Jim K


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Default DIY Aircon

On 02/08/17 22:14, jim wrote:

Welcome Richard!

Wish more people joined in with that kind of start!

Cheers


+1 awesomness
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