Maybe not strictly DIY as it will probably turn out to be a job for
the professionals.

Situation is that my downstairs neighbour has become a bit noisy -
nowhere near the threshold for intervention by the council. My only
concern is the bedroom (one room). I am wondering about a technical
solution. I have only just started looking.

The building is 100 years old with lath and plaster ceilings, wooden
floor boards and presumably something in between (ash?). My thoughts
so far:

- To replace the ash with some form of modern sound deadening material
- To replace the floor boards with acoustically designed material
- To add something on top of the floorboards (I have some room to play
with as there is hardboard in the hall but not the bedroom)
- To celebrate to the full the lifetime achievement of Black Sabbath
as a tribute to musical excellence

There is a reasonable budget as I plan on staying and any improvements
would be cheaper than a house move (and add value?). Could anyone out
there point me in the right direction?

In message , Scott
writes
Maybe not strictly DIY as it will probably turn out to be a job for
the professionals.

Situation is that my downstairs neighbour has become a bit noisy -
nowhere near the threshold for intervention by the council. My only
concern is the bedroom (one room). I am wondering about a technical
solution. I have only just started looking.

The building is 100 years old with lath and plaster ceilings, wooden
floor boards and presumably something in between (ash?). My thoughts
so far:

- To replace the ash with some form of modern sound deadening material
- To replace the floor boards with acoustically designed material
- To add something on top of the floorboards (I have some room to play
with as there is hardboard in the hall but not the bedroom)
- To celebrate to the full the lifetime achievement of Black Sabbath
as a tribute to musical excellence

There is a reasonable budget as I plan on staying and any improvements
would be cheaper than a house move (and add value?). Could anyone out
there point me in the right direction?

You could have a look at Rockwool acoustic. No direct experience but
plenty on the web.

Previous chat in here indicates you need to determine if the noise is
airborne or travelling through the building fabric. Not my expertise but
I guess TV sound would be airborne, tapping a pool cue on the floor..
fabric.

The best solution is to add mass (concrete) but I doubt you could do
that in a shared building.

--
Tim Lamb

Scott wrote:

Situation is that my downstairs neighbour has become a bit noisy -
My thoughts so far:

option 5 - jump up and down in your bedroom wearing hobnail boots
whenever there's too much noise ...

On Tue, 14 Feb 2017 20:53:14 +0000, Tim Lamb
wrote:

In message , Scott
writes
Maybe not strictly DIY as it will probably turn out to be a job for
the professionals.

Situation is that my downstairs neighbour has become a bit noisy -
nowhere near the threshold for intervention by the council. My only
concern is the bedroom (one room). I am wondering about a technical
solution. I have only just started looking.

The building is 100 years old with lath and plaster ceilings, wooden
floor boards and presumably something in between (ash?). My thoughts
so far:

- To replace the ash with some form of modern sound deadening material
- To replace the floor boards with acoustically designed material
- To add something on top of the floorboards (I have some room to play
with as there is hardboard in the hall but not the bedroom)
- To celebrate to the full the lifetime achievement of Black Sabbath
as a tribute to musical excellence

There is a reasonable budget as I plan on staying and any improvements
would be cheaper than a house move (and add value?). Could anyone out
there point me in the right direction?

You could have a look at Rockwool acoustic. No direct experience but
plenty on the web.

Previous chat in here indicates you need to determine if the noise is
airborne or travelling through the building fabric. Not my expertise but
I guess TV sound would be airborne, tapping a pool cue on the floor..
fabric.

I'm convinced it's airborne. It's her radio. I could hear 'Sailing
by'.

The best solution is to add mass (concrete) but I doubt you could do
that in a shared building.

That is a point. I thought sand could be used but would require
support as the ceiling would not support it.

In message , Andy Burns
writes
Scott wrote:

Situation is that my downstairs neighbour has become a bit noisy -
My thoughts so far:

option 5 - jump up and down in your bedroom wearing hobnail boots
whenever there's too much noise ...

Phase shift the same programme and re-broadcast to null:-)



--
Tim Lamb

On Tuesday, 14 February 2017 20:08:14 UTC, Scott wrote:
Maybe not strictly DIY as it will probably turn out to be a job for
the professionals.

Situation is that my downstairs neighbour has become a bit noisy -
nowhere near the threshold for intervention by the council. My only
concern is the bedroom (one room). I am wondering about a technical
solution. I have only just started looking.

The building is 100 years old with lath and plaster ceilings, wooden
floor boards and presumably something in between (ash?). My thoughts
so far:

- To replace the ash with some form of modern sound deadening material
- To replace the floor boards with acoustically designed material
- To add something on top of the floorboards (I have some room to play
with as there is hardboard in the hall but not the bedroom)
- To celebrate to the full the lifetime achievement of Black Sabbath
as a tribute to musical excellence

There is a reasonable budget as I plan on staying and any improvements
would be cheaper than a house move (and add value?). Could anyone out
there point me in the right direction?

Start by blocking all the gaps. Stiffen the floor if you can with X noggings. Chip, OSB or ply over the boards will help.

Loose sand on the ceiling helps, but the amount you could put on it is limited, and it loves finding cracks. Better to put wet plaster on to make it thicker & stiffer, PVAing first to stick through the layer of dirt. Then rockwool.

Don't forget gaps round doors, and check for gaps under the floor where your flat stops - it may be wide open in some places.

Expanding foam can block tricky gaps, but be wary of its tendency to expand hugely with destructive force.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...oise_reduction


NT

On Tuesday, 14 February 2017 22:27:51 UTC, wrote:
On Tuesday, 14 February 2017 20:08:14 UTC, Scott wrote:
Maybe not strictly DIY as it will probably turn out to be a job for
the professionals.

Situation is that my downstairs neighbour has become a bit noisy -
nowhere near the threshold for intervention by the council. My only
concern is the bedroom (one room). I am wondering about a technical
solution. I have only just started looking.

The building is 100 years old with lath and plaster ceilings, wooden
floor boards and presumably something in between (ash?). My thoughts
so far:

- To replace the ash with some form of modern sound deadening material
- To replace the floor boards with acoustically designed material
- To add something on top of the floorboards (I have some room to play
with as there is hardboard in the hall but not the bedroom)
- To celebrate to the full the lifetime achievement of Black Sabbath
as a tribute to musical excellence

There is a reasonable budget as I plan on staying and any improvements
would be cheaper than a house move (and add value?). Could anyone out
there point me in the right direction?

Start by blocking all the gaps. Stiffen the floor if you can with X noggings. Chip, OSB or ply over the boards will help.

Loose sand on the ceiling helps, but the amount you could put on it is limited, and it loves finding cracks. Better to put wet plaster on to make it thicker & stiffer, PVAing first to stick through the layer of dirt. Then rockwool.

Don't forget gaps round doors, and check for gaps under the floor where your flat stops - it may be wide open in some places.

Expanding foam can block tricky gaps, but be wary of its tendency to expand hugely with destructive force.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...oise_reduction


NT

You can also get soundproofing mats for floors.


NT

On 14/02/17 20:53, Andy Burns wrote:
Scott wrote:

Situation is that my downstairs neighbour has become a bit noisy -
My thoughts so far:

option 5 - jump up and down in your bedroom wearing hobnail boots
whenever there's too much noise ...


Two things known to have worked.

1/. Acquire an ex-police band VHF radio of at least 100W. When music is
too loud, first detune it badly, the add a noise generator or some other
audio input, and use it. In general it breaks through into any audio.
And will wreck any digital system while its on. Proved to work on social
security scrounging drug dealers in social housing

2/. At 3 a.am. grab the left over airbombs from last years Guy Fawkes,
and stagger downstairs into the garden bollock naked, point at
neighbours house light blue touch paper and retire immediately. Highly
amusing on soldiers just returned from action in the Gulf War. Recommended.

--
"If you dont read the news paper, you are un-informed. If you read the
news paper, you are mis-informed."

Mark Twain

It also depends on the actual frequency of the noise. LF is harder to stop
than hf. The lf is more likely to be structural.
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Tim Lamb" wrote in message
...
In message , Scott
writes
Maybe not strictly DIY as it will probably turn out to be a job for
the professionals.

Situation is that my downstairs neighbour has become a bit noisy -
nowhere near the threshold for intervention by the council. My only
concern is the bedroom (one room). I am wondering about a technical
solution. I have only just started looking.

The building is 100 years old with lath and plaster ceilings, wooden
floor boards and presumably something in between (ash?). My thoughts
so far:

- To replace the ash with some form of modern sound deadening material
- To replace the floor boards with acoustically designed material
- To add something on top of the floorboards (I have some room to play
with as there is hardboard in the hall but not the bedroom)
- To celebrate to the full the lifetime achievement of Black Sabbath
as a tribute to musical excellence

There is a reasonable budget as I plan on staying and any improvements
would be cheaper than a house move (and add value?). Could anyone out
there point me in the right direction?

You could have a look at Rockwool acoustic. No direct experience but
plenty on the web.

Previous chat in here indicates you need to determine if the noise is
airborne or travelling through the building fabric. Not my expertise but I
guess TV sound would be airborne, tapping a pool cue on the floor..
fabric.

The best solution is to add mass (concrete) but I doubt you could do that
in a shared building.

--
Tim Lamb

On 14-Feb-17 8:08 PM, Scott wrote:
Maybe not strictly DIY as it will probably turn out to be a job for
the professionals.

Situation is that my downstairs neighbour has become a bit noisy -
nowhere near the threshold for intervention by the council. My only
concern is the bedroom (one room). I am wondering about a technical
solution. I have only just started looking.

The building is 100 years old with lath and plaster ceilings, wooden
floor boards and presumably something in between (ash?). My thoughts
so far:

- To replace the ash with some form of modern sound deadening material
- To replace the floor boards with acoustically designed material
- To add something on top of the floorboards (I have some room to play
with as there is hardboard in the hall but not the bedroom)
- To celebrate to the full the lifetime achievement of Black Sabbath
as a tribute to musical excellence

There is a reasonable budget as I plan on staying and any improvements
would be cheaper than a house move (and add value?). Could anyone out
there point me in the right direction?


Simply replacing the floorboards with 22mm T&G cement filled particle
board will go a long way to cutting down the noise. Make sure that the
joints are all glued and put acoustic foam between the edges and the
walls, to close off any air gaps there. However, while you have the
floorboards up, you may as well fit acoustic mineral wool under the
floor as well.

A heavy fitted carpet with thick underlay and, if necessary, acoustic
mat under it, will help to reduce noise even further.

--
--

Colin Bignell

In message , Scott
writes

The building is 100 years old with lath and plaster ceilings, wooden
floor boards and presumably something in between (ash?).

Assuming there is ash, or what looks like ash between floor and ceiling,
you may be in Scotland? Anyway, our house in Aberdeenshire has that
arrangement, and it was an excellent killer of sound until we had
central heating installed. We were warned, before the work started.
The answer is to plug every little hole that was created for pipe runs,
and replace any other 'ash' that was removed. We didn't bother, as it
is only the three of us in the house.

Sounds as though your building could be a house that was converted to
flats? Any insulation between floor and ceiling would almost certainly
have been disturbed during conversion.

--
Graeme

On Wed, 15 Feb 2017 10:54:12 +0000, Graeme
wrote:

In message , Scott
writes

The building is 100 years old with lath and plaster ceilings, wooden
floor boards and presumably something in between (ash?).

Assuming there is ash, or what looks like ash between floor and ceiling,
you may be in Scotland? Anyway, our house in Aberdeenshire has that
arrangement, and it was an excellent killer of sound until we had
central heating installed. We were warned, before the work started.
The answer is to plug every little hole that was created for pipe runs,
and replace any other 'ash' that was removed. We didn't bother, as it
is only the three of us in the house.

Yes, Scotland. What is the problem with central heating? Does it dry
out the ash or are you suggesting the installers may have removed it?
If the former, my downstairs neighbour did have heating installed
about two years ago.

Sounds as though your building could be a house that was converted to
flats? Any insulation between floor and ceiling would almost certainly
have been disturbed during conversion.

No traditional tenement building.

In message , Scott
writes
On Wed, 15 Feb 2017 10:54:12 +0000, Graeme
wrote:

Yes, Scotland. What is the problem with central heating? Does it dry
out the ash or are you suggesting the installers may have removed it?
If the former, my downstairs neighbour did have heating installed
about two years ago.

When the property is built, the void between ceiling and floor is
filled, but that is disturbed when any sub floor work is undertaken. I
can only speak directly about this house, but floorboards upstairs were
lifted and ash removed to allow pipe runs, both horizontal and vertical,
and 'tails' for various radiators. The guy who installed told me that
however careful he is, the noise insulation is never quite the same
again. I would imagine rewiring or any other sub floor work would have
the same result.

Sounds as though your building could be a house that was converted to
flats?

No traditional tenement building.

I suppose it depends how much upheaval you are prepared to endure, but,
if you are contemplating emptying to room to lay new flooring, it may be
worth lifting a floor board or three, to try and see just how much the
ash has been disturbed over the years. I would stuff any gaps with
ordinary fibre loft insulation, particularly around the edges and any
pipe holes. We did that below the radiator, although more for draught
proofing.

--
Graeme

On 15/02/2017 10:54, Graeme wrote:
In message , Scott
writes

The building is 100 years old with lath and plaster ceilings, wooden
floor boards and presumably something in between (ash?).

Assuming there is ash, or what looks like ash between floor and ceiling,
you may be in Scotland?

Would you have heard it called clinker?


--
Adam

In message , Scott
writes
On Wed, 15 Feb 2017 10:54:12 +0000, Graeme
wrote:

In message , Scott
writes

The building is 100 years old with lath and plaster ceilings, wooden
floor boards and presumably something in between (ash?).

Assuming there is ash, or what looks like ash between floor and ceiling,
you may be in Scotland? Anyway, our house in Aberdeenshire has that
arrangement, and it was an excellent killer of sound until we had
central heating installed. We were warned, before the work started.
The answer is to plug every little hole that was created for pipe runs,
and replace any other 'ash' that was removed. We didn't bother, as it
is only the three of us in the house.

Yes, Scotland. What is the problem with central heating? Does it dry
out the ash or are you suggesting the installers may have removed it?
If the former, my downstairs neighbour did have heating installed
about two years ago.

Sounds as though your building could be a house that was converted to
flats? Any insulation between floor and ceiling would almost certainly
have been disturbed during conversion.

No traditional tenement building.

About as far away from you as you can get but poking around this site
earlier there seemed to be several products for floor noise reduction.

http://www.insulationshop.co/

--
Tim Lamb

On Thu, 16 Feb 2017 20:42:57 +0000, ARW
wrote:

On 15/02/2017 10:54, Graeme wrote:
In message , Scott
writes

The building is 100 years old with lath and plaster ceilings, wooden
floor boards and presumably something in between (ash?).

Assuming there is ash, or what looks like ash between floor and ceiling,
you may be in Scotland?

Would you have heard it called clinker?

Yes, I can remember that term from the fireplace in my childhood.

In message , ARW
writes
On 15/02/2017 10:54, Graeme wrote:

Assuming there is ash, or what looks like ash between floor and ceiling,
you may be in Scotland?

Would you have heard it called clinker?

Yes. I think that was the term the plumber used, although that was
nearly 15 years ago.
--
Graeme

On 14/02/2017 20:53, Tim Lamb wrote:

The best solution is to add mass (concrete) but I doubt you could do
that in a shared building.


Years ago when doctors had a surgery in the ground floor rooms of older
buildings, where the upper rooms were rented out, the standard way
of soundproofing the floor+ceiling void was using crushed gypsum
plaster on top of the lath and plaster.

Probably good enough to prvent confidential conversation leaking
through but for a better result, why not take a look at building
regs Part E and search for something called 'robust design' or
similar. This is the standard way to make a house to flat
conversion comply with Part E (noise abatement).

Be prepared to rip up all your floorboards and reposition skirting
as a minimum effort, either that or overlay your entire floor with
acoustic deadening material and construct another floating floor
on top.

In article ,
Scott wrote:
Previous chat in here indicates you need to determine if the noise is
airborne or travelling through the building fabric. Not my expertise but
I guess TV sound would be airborne, tapping a pool cue on the floor..
fabric.

I'm convinced it's airborne. It's her radio. I could hear 'Sailing
by'.

The best solution is to add mass (concrete) but I doubt you could do
that in a shared building.

That is a point. I thought sand could be used but would require
support as the ceiling would not support it.

Think in Auld Reekie they use what are known as coffins. Wooden boxes
fitted between the joists and filled with sand.

You can attenuate higher frequencies quite easily, but lower ones require
mass. Think of hearing voices through a wall.

--
*He who laughs last has just realised the joke.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Fri, 17 Feb 2017 14:45:32 +0000, Andrew
wrote:

On 14/02/2017 20:53, Tim Lamb wrote:

The best solution is to add mass (concrete) but I doubt you could do
that in a shared building.


Years ago when doctors had a surgery in the ground floor rooms of older
buildings, where the upper rooms were rented out, the standard way
of soundproofing the floor+ceiling void was using crushed gypsum
plaster on top of the lath and plaster.

Probably good enough to prvent confidential conversation leaking
through but for a better result, why not take a look at building
regs Part E and search for something called 'robust design' or
similar. This is the standard way to make a house to flat
conversion comply with Part E (noise abatement).

Be prepared to rip up all your floorboards and reposition skirting
as a minimum effort, either that or overlay your entire floor with
acoustic deadening material and construct another floating floor
on top.

Thanks. I was coming to that conclusion :-(