I've got a 1000 litre water tank for the garden. It's a plastic tank bit
more than a metre in each dimension with a metal frame all around. It's
sitting on a brick at each corner. It's started to tilt as the bricks at
2 of the corners are sinking into the ground which is heavy clay. The
full tank weighs about a ton so that's 250Kg at each corner.

What should I do? Do I have to build proper foundations for it or would
it be OK to sit it on 4 paving stones instead of 4 bricks to help spread
the load? Is there somewhere on the web that gives recommended maximum
loading for different soil types?

On Sunday, 22 January 2017 05:32:44 UTC, Kit Jackson wrote:
I've got a 1000 litre water tank for the garden. It's a plastic tank bit
more than a metre in each dimension with a metal frame all around. It's
sitting on a brick at each corner. It's started to tilt as the bricks at
2 of the corners are sinking into the ground which is heavy clay. The
full tank weighs about a ton so that's 250Kg at each corner.

What should I do? Do I have to build proper foundations for it or would
it be OK to sit it on 4 paving stones instead of 4 bricks to help spread
the load? Is there somewhere on the web that gives recommended maximum
loading for different soil types?

It needs a flat platform so the whole base is continuously supported.
Remove all the topsoil.
Get a pile of aggregate in and construct a platform tamping down well. You cam economise by putting rubble in the bottom of the hole if you have any.
Finish off with a couple of inches of sand.
Put the tank in place and slide it around a bit so the sand conforms to the base of the tank.

Yes water is bloody heavy stuff, and really unless a tank is made
deliberately to sustain the weight only at the corners, it will eventually
crack as it moves.

Good job its only water!
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"harry" wrote in message
...
On Sunday, 22 January 2017 05:32:44 UTC, Kit Jackson wrote:
I've got a 1000 litre water tank for the garden. It's a plastic tank bit
more than a metre in each dimension with a metal frame all around. It's
sitting on a brick at each corner. It's started to tilt as the bricks at
2 of the corners are sinking into the ground which is heavy clay. The
full tank weighs about a ton so that's 250Kg at each corner.

What should I do? Do I have to build proper foundations for it or would
it be OK to sit it on 4 paving stones instead of 4 bricks to help spread
the load? Is there somewhere on the web that gives recommended maximum
loading for different soil types?

It needs a flat platform so the whole base is continuously supported.
Remove all the topsoil.
Get a pile of aggregate in and construct a platform tamping down well. You
cam economise by putting rubble in the bottom of the hole if you have any.
Finish off with a couple of inches of sand.
Put the tank in place and slide it around a bit so the sand conforms to
the base of the tank.

On 22/01/2017 08:12, Brian Gaff wrote:
Yes water is bloody heavy stuff, and really unless a tank is made
deliberately to sustain the weight only at the corners, it will eventually
crack as it moves.

Good job its only water!
Brian


Think I might use lintels for the edges

On 22/01/17 05:32, Kit Jackson wrote:
I've got a 1000 litre water tank for the garden. It's a plastic tank bit
more than a metre in each dimension with a metal frame all around. It's
sitting on a brick at each corner. It's started to tilt as the bricks at
2 of the corners are sinking into the ground which is heavy clay. The
full tank weighs about a ton so that's 250Kg at each corner.

What should I do? Do I have to build proper foundations for it or would
it be OK to sit it on 4 paving stones instead of 4 bricks to help spread
the load? Is there somewhere on the web that gives recommended maximum
loading for different soil types?

I have 4 x 200 litre water butts resting on four 600 x 600 mm paving
stones - so a bit less weight (800kg) than yours, but they are fine on
those. I'm also on clay. You can do as Harry suggests, but to me it's
overkill.

The problem with the 4 bricks you have is not so much the 250 kg at each
corner, but the surface area it is spread over. A brick has a surface
area of 200 sq cm, so you have 1.25 kg per sq cm. That's a fair amount
over a period of time if you remember that as clay dries out and gets
wet again it moves as it subsides and heaves. Now consider your 1000kg
spread over a sq metre - that's only 0.1kg per sq cm. If you use 600 x
600mm paving stones, it's even less.

I would just level the ground - rake and close walk to compress as
though you are preparing it for a lawn, then lay four paving stones in a
square.

--

Jeff

On 22 Jan 2017 05:32:42 GMT, Kit Jackson wrote:

I've got a 1000 litre water tank for the garden. It's a plastic tank bit
more than a metre in each dimension with a metal frame all around. It's
sitting on a brick at each corner. It's started to tilt as the bricks at
2 of the corners are sinking into the ground which is heavy clay. The
full tank weighs about a ton so that's 250Kg at each corner.

What should I do? Do I have to build proper foundations for it or would
it be OK to sit it on 4 paving stones instead of 4 bricks to help spread
the load? Is there somewhere on the web that gives recommended maximum
loading for different soil types?

Donate it to Sellafield :-)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_water

On 22/01/17 05:32, Kit Jackson wrote:
I've got a 1000 litre water tank for the garden. It's a plastic tank bit
more than a metre in each dimension with a metal frame all around. It's
sitting on a brick at each corner. It's started to tilt as the bricks at
2 of the corners are sinking into the ground which is heavy clay. The
full tank weighs about a ton so that's 250Kg at each corner.

What should I do? Do I have to build proper foundations for it or would
it be OK to sit it on 4 paving stones instead of 4 bricks to help spread
the load? Is there somewhere on the web that gives recommended maximum
loading for different soil types?

4 paving stones

On 22/01/2017 09:00, Jeff Layman wrote:

I would just level the ground - rake and close walk to compress as
though you are preparing it for a lawn, then lay four paving stones in a
square.


Being a mean sod, can I ask why you would bother with the paving slabs?
Why not level and tamp the clay and put the water tank on top?

"Kit Jackson" wrote in message
eb.com...
I've got a 1000 litre water tank for the garden. It's a plastic tank bit
more than a metre in each dimension with a metal frame all around. It's
sitting on a brick at each corner. It's started to tilt as the bricks at
2 of the corners are sinking into the ground which is heavy clay. The
full tank weighs about a ton so that's 250Kg at each corner.

What should I do? Do I have to build proper foundations for it or would
it be OK to sit it on 4 paving stones instead of 4 bricks to help spread
the load? Is there somewhere on the web that gives recommended maximum
loading for different soil types?

Is that a tank containing a large mass of H2O, or a tank containing D2O?

(D is Deuterium: Hydrogen with a neutron as well as a proton and electron)

On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 08:12:45 -0000, "Brian Gaff"
wrote:

Yes water is bloody heavy stuff, and really unless a tank is made
deliberately to sustain the weight only at the corners, it will
eventually
crack as it moves.

I've never seen it, but, apparently, near Birmingham, there is a set
of pillars that were supposed to support a swimming pool, but the
architect failed to allow for the weight of the water. And there's a
university library somewhere that failed to account fully for the
weight of the books. (I don't suppose they bother with physical books
in universities any more.)

--
Max Demian

On 22/01/2017 08:12, Brian Gaff wrote:
Yes water is bloody heavy stuff, and really unless a tank is made
deliberately to sustain the weight only at the corners, it will eventually
crack as it moves.

Good job its only water!
Brian

If its in a metal frame then suggests it is designed to be supported
just on the frame , I've seen them used as bowsers for temporary water
supplies moved round on a trailer and then offloaded.
As suggested using paving slabs to spread the load may solve the problem
- depends on why you are concerned by it sinking a bit ?

On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 11:27:55 -0000, "NY" wrote:

"Kit Jackson" wrote in message
web.com...
I've got a 1000 litre water tank for the garden. It's a plastic tank bit
more than a metre in each dimension with a metal frame all around. It's
sitting on a brick at each corner. It's started to tilt as the bricks at
2 of the corners are sinking into the ground which is heavy clay. The
full tank weighs about a ton so that's 250Kg at each corner.

What should I do? Do I have to build proper foundations for it or would
it be OK to sit it on 4 paving stones instead of 4 bricks to help spread
the load? Is there somewhere on the web that gives recommended maximum
loading for different soil types?

Is that a tank containing a large mass of H2O, or a tank containing D2O?

(D is Deuterium: Hydrogen with a neutron as well as a proton and electron)

There's an echo on this group :-)

On 22/01/17 11:24, GB wrote:
On 22/01/2017 09:00, Jeff Layman wrote:

I would just level the ground - rake and close walk to compress as
though you are preparing it for a lawn, then lay four paving stones in a
square.


Being a mean sod, can I ask why you would bother with the paving slabs?
Why not level and tamp the clay and put the water tank on top?

Good point. Providing the tank is more-or-less flat, they aren't really
necessary.

In my case I was using water butts with the tap almost at the bottom. It
wasn't possible to get a watering can under the tap at that height, so I
actually used a paving stone base, three bricks at each corner to get
height, and another paving stone above for the water butt to rest on.
Only then was the tap was high enough. The paving stones and bricks were
"freebies" left in the garden by the previous owner.

--

Jeff

On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 12:06:04 +0000, Scott
wrote:

On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 11:27:55 -0000, "NY" wrote:

"Kit Jackson" wrote in message
aweb.com...
I've got a 1000 litre water tank for the garden. It's a plastic tank bit
more than a metre in each dimension with a metal frame all around. It's
sitting on a brick at each corner. It's started to tilt as the bricks at
2 of the corners are sinking into the ground which is heavy clay. The
full tank weighs about a ton so that's 250Kg at each corner.

What should I do? Do I have to build proper foundations for it or would
it be OK to sit it on 4 paving stones instead of 4 bricks to help spread
the load? Is there somewhere on the web that gives recommended maximum
loading for different soil types?

Is that a tank containing a large mass of H2O, or a tank containing D2O?

(D is Deuterium: Hydrogen with a neutron as well as a proton and electron)

There's an echo on this group :-)


Dammit. I was going to do a heavy water gag too.



--

Graham.

%Profound_observation%

On 22/01/2017 13:16, Graham. wrote:

Dammit. I was going to do a heavy water gag too.




I was to but I decided it was just to water some heavy plant that you
see crossing signs for.

In article 5884b316$0$9691$c3e8da3$f6d5ad96
@news.astraweb.com, dennis@home says...

On 22/01/2017 13:16, Graham. wrote:

Dammit. I was going to do a heavy water gag too.




I was to but I decided it was just to water some heavy plant that you
see crossing signs for.

Ah, yes - Triffids!

--

Terry

In article ,
Jeff Layman wrote:
On 22/01/17 11:24, GB wrote:
On 22/01/2017 09:00, Jeff Layman wrote:

I would just level the ground - rake and close walk to compress as
though you are preparing it for a lawn, then lay four paving stones in a
square.


Being a mean sod, can I ask why you would bother with the paving slabs?
Why not level and tamp the clay and put the water tank on top?

Good point. Providing the tank is more-or-less flat, they aren't really
necessary.

In my case I was using water butts with the tap almost at the bottom. It
wasn't possible to get a watering can under the tap at that height, so I
actually used a paving stone base, three bricks at each corner to get
height, and another paving stone above for the water butt to rest on.
Only then was the tap was high enough. The paving stones and bricks were
"freebies" left in the garden by the previous owner.

I've fixed about 2ft of hose to the water butt tap. That gets over the
height of the waTering can problem.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

In article ,
Scott writes:
On 22 Jan 2017 05:32:42 GMT, Kit Jackson wrote:

I've got a 1000 litre water tank for the garden. It's a plastic tank bit
more than a metre in each dimension with a metal frame all around. It's
sitting on a brick at each corner. It's started to tilt as the bricks at
2 of the corners are sinking into the ground which is heavy clay. The
full tank weighs about a ton so that's 250Kg at each corner.

What should I do? Do I have to build proper foundations for it or would
it be OK to sit it on 4 paving stones instead of 4 bricks to help spread
the load? Is there somewhere on the web that gives recommended maximum
loading for different soil types?

Donate it to Sellafield :-)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_water

I read it that way too, initially ;-)

The film of the WWII Norway heavy water plant was on the TV a few weeks ago.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norweg...water_sabotage

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 13:16:06 +0000, Graham. wrote:

On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 12:06:04 +0000, Scott
wrote:

On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 11:27:55 -0000, "NY" wrote:

"Kit Jackson" wrote in message
raweb.com...
I've got a 1000 litre water tank for the garden. It's a plastic tank
bit more than a metre in each dimension with a metal frame all
around. It's sitting on a brick at each corner. It's started to
tilt as the bricks at 2 of the corners are sinking into the ground
which is heavy clay. The full tank weighs about a ton so that's
250Kg at each corner.

What should I do? Do I have to build proper foundations for it or
would it be OK to sit it on 4 paving stones instead of 4 bricks to
help spread the load? Is there somewhere on the web that gives
recommended maximum loading for different soil types?

Is that a tank containing a large mass of H2O, or a tank containing
D2O?

(D is Deuterium: Hydrogen with a neutron as well as a proton and
electron)

There's an echo on this group :-)


Dammit. I was going to do a heavy water gag too.

https://youtu.be/CEqKVMwU4no?t=14m24s

--
My posts are my copyright and if @diy_forums or Home Owners' Hub
wish to copy them they can pay me £1 a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
*lightning surge protection* - a w_tom conductor

http://harpers.org/archive/1998/11/t...ive-boy-scout/

Max Demian wrote:
On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 08:12:45 -0000, "Brian Gaff"
wrote:

Yes water is bloody heavy stuff, and really unless a tank is made
deliberately to sustain the weight only at the corners, it will
eventually crack as it moves.

I've never seen it, but, apparently, near Birmingham, there is a set
of pillars that were supposed to support a swimming pool, but the
architect failed to allow for the weight of the water. And there's a
university library somewhere that failed to account fully for the
weight of the books. (I don't suppose they bother with physical books
in universities any more.)

There was a joke on animated series Futurama a few years ago, 'this library
holds the worlds largest collection of literature'....inside, perched on a
stand, were two disks labelled, 'fiction' and 'non-fiction'

On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 08:42:47 -0800 (PST), DICEGEORGE
wrote:

http://harpers.org/archive/1998/11/t...ive-boy-scout/

David Hahn died a few months ago aged 39. The last photo I saw of him
was about ten years ago when he was arrested for stealing smoke
detectors (it seems to have been a bit of an obsession). He wasn't
looking too good then:

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/...58_306x423.jpg

He ended up being hospitalized for bipolar disorder and paranoid
schizophrenia.

On 1/22/2017 12:00 PM, Robert wrote:
On 22/01/2017 08:12, Brian Gaff wrote:
Yes water is bloody heavy stuff, and really unless a tank is made
deliberately to sustain the weight only at the corners, it will
eventually
crack as it moves.

Good job its only water!
Brian

If its in a metal frame then suggests it is designed to be supported
just on the frame , I've seen them used as bowsers for temporary water
supplies moved round on a trailer and then offloaded.

Exactly, it sounds like a standard IBC container

As suggested using paving slabs to spread the load may solve the problem
- depends on why you are concerned by it sinking a bit ?

Or you could support it on two wooden bearers. I have a couple of them
mounted on a frame made of 6 x 4 which stands on some small stacks of
blocks so that the taps are about 2 feet off the ground.

A pair of railway sleepers straight on the ground should be OK. The
trouble with slabs is that they may crack if the ground is really soft.
Or pressure treated 6x6 fence posts. You might get away with 4x4.

In message ,
newshound writes
On 1/22/2017 12:00 PM, Robert wrote:
On 22/01/2017 08:12, Brian Gaff wrote:
Yes water is bloody heavy stuff, and really unless a tank is made
deliberately to sustain the weight only at the corners, it will
eventually
crack as it moves.

Good job its only water!
Brian

If its in a metal frame then suggests it is designed to be supported
just on the frame , I've seen them used as bowsers for temporary water
supplies moved round on a trailer and then offloaded.

Exactly, it sounds like a standard IBC container

As suggested using paving slabs to spread the load may solve the problem
- depends on why you are concerned by it sinking a bit ?

Or you could support it on two wooden bearers. I have a couple of them
mounted on a frame made of 6 x 4 which stands on some small stacks of
blocks so that the taps are about 2 feet off the ground.

A pair of railway sleepers straight on the ground should be OK. The
trouble with slabs is that they may crack if the ground is really soft.
Or pressure treated 6x6 fence posts. You might get away with 4x4.

IBC containers of 20 years back were fitted on wooden pallets which rot
over time.
Things may have moved on for the OP.


--
Tim Lamb

I've got a 1000 litre water tank for the garden. It's a plastic tank
bit more than a metre in each dimension with a metal frame all around.
It's sitting on a brick at each corner. It's started to tilt as the
bricks at 2 of the corners are sinking into the ground which is heavy
clay. The full tank weighs about a ton so that's 250Kg at each corner.

What should I do? Do I have to build proper foundations for it or would
it be OK to sit it on 4 paving stones instead of 4 bricks to help spread
the load? Is there somewhere on the web that gives recommended maximum
loading for different soil types?

Thanks to everyone who replied. The tank came with the metal frame and
it's supposed to stand on its 4 corners. I think it used to contain some
sort of oil as a releasing agent for concrete shuttering. Anyway I'll
try just using paving stones to spread the load and see what happens. I
might add some wooden bearers too as I'd like to get it a bit higher off
the ground to make it easier to get the watering can under it.

I found a bit of info about soil bearing capacity on
geotechnicalinfo.com. Does anybody know of anywhere else to get simple
info?

On Sunday, January 22, 2017 at 11:59:53 AM UTC, Max Demian wrote:
On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 08:12:45 -0000, "Brian Gaff"
wrote:

Yes water is bloody heavy stuff, and really unless a tank is made
deliberately to sustain the weight only at the corners, it will
eventually
crack as it moves.

I've never seen it, but, apparently, near Birmingham, there is a set
of pillars that were supposed to support a swimming pool, but the
architect failed to allow for the weight of the water. And there's a
university library somewhere that failed to account fully for the
weight of the books. (I don't suppose they bother with physical books
in universities any more.)


You underestimate the amount of money to be made from selling the lecturers favourite tomes at £150 a pop. For example: http://www.johnsmith.co.uk/product/9...ms-engineering

--
Max Demian

In article om,
Kit Jackson writes:
I've got a 1000 litre water tank for the garden. It's a plastic tank
bit more than a metre in each dimension with a metal frame all around.
It's sitting on a brick at each corner. It's started to tilt as the
bricks at 2 of the corners are sinking into the ground which is heavy
clay. The full tank weighs about a ton so that's 250Kg at each corner.

What should I do? Do I have to build proper foundations for it or would
it be OK to sit it on 4 paving stones instead of 4 bricks to help spread
the load? Is there somewhere on the web that gives recommended maximum
loading for different soil types?

Thanks to everyone who replied. The tank came with the metal frame and
it's supposed to stand on its 4 corners. I think it used to contain some
sort of oil as a releasing agent for concrete shuttering. Anyway I'll
try just using paving stones to spread the load and see what happens. I
might add some wooden bearers too as I'd like to get it a bit higher off
the ground to make it easier to get the watering can under it.

I found a bit of info about soil bearing capacity on
geotechnicalinfo.com. Does anybody know of anywhere else to get simple
info?

Paving stones would need to be well supported to take weight,
they aren't really any good at spreading out force - they just
crack as they have no reinforcing.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On 1/23/2017 10:28 AM, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message ,
newshound writes
On 1/22/2017 12:00 PM, Robert wrote:
On 22/01/2017 08:12, Brian Gaff wrote:
Yes water is bloody heavy stuff, and really unless a tank is made
deliberately to sustain the weight only at the corners, it will
eventually
crack as it moves.

Good job its only water!
Brian

If its in a metal frame then suggests it is designed to be supported
just on the frame , I've seen them used as bowsers for temporary water
supplies moved round on a trailer and then offloaded.

Exactly, it sounds like a standard IBC container

As suggested using paving slabs to spread the load may solve the problem
- depends on why you are concerned by it sinking a bit ?

Or you could support it on two wooden bearers. I have a couple of them
mounted on a frame made of 6 x 4 which stands on some small stacks of
blocks so that the taps are about 2 feet off the ground.

A pair of railway sleepers straight on the ground should be OK. The
trouble with slabs is that they may crack if the ground is really
soft. Or pressure treated 6x6 fence posts. You might get away with 4x4.

IBC containers of 20 years back were fitted on wooden pallets which rot
over time.
Things may have moved on for the OP.


The modern ones have a zinc plated steel frame with suitable slots for
use with a stacker truck.