Can't connect at the moment; has it been shut down to conserve power?



--
AMD FX-6300 in GA-990X-Gaming SLI-CF running Windows 7 Pro x64

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David submitted this idea :
Can't connect at the moment; has it been shut down to conserve power?

Down here too!

On Sat, 21 Jan 2017 15:12:07 GMT, Harry Bloomfield
wrote:

David submitted this idea :
Can't connect at the moment; has it been shut down to conserve power?

Down here too!

That reminds me of the old joke about the two farmers discussing the
eclipse. One said to the other: 'How could I see an eclipse in Forfar
when I was in Glamis* at the time?'

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glamis

It happens that Scott formulated :
On Sat, 21 Jan 2017 15:12:07 GMT, Harry Bloomfield
wrote:

David submitted this idea :
Can't connect at the moment; has it been shut down to conserve power?

Down here too!

That reminds me of the old joke about the two farmers discussing the
eclipse. One said to the other: 'How could I see an eclipse in Forfar
when I was in Glamis* at the time?'

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glamis

Sometimes issues are local to a PC, local to an area, or limited to a
particular ISP - so it is useful confirm when others are able to issue.

It is still off-air BTW..

On 21/01/17 18:00, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
It happens that Scott formulated :
On Sat, 21 Jan 2017 15:12:07 GMT, Harry Bloomfield
wrote:

David submitted this idea :
Can't connect at the moment; has it been shut down to conserve power?

Down here too!

That reminds me of the old joke about the two farmers discussing the
eclipse. One said to the other: 'How could I see an eclipse in Forfar
when I was in Glamis* at the time?'
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glamis

Sometimes issues are local to a PC, local to an area, or limited to a
particular ISP - so it is useful confirm when others are able to issue.

It is still off-air BTW..
yeah. the server hosting it crashed due to a power failure at the
datacentre apparently.

I rebooted it as soon as possible

After serious thinking The Natural Philosopher wrote :
yeah. the server hosting it crashed due to a power failure at the datacentre
apparently.

I rebooted it as soon as possible

Thanks.

Looks like everything is flat out, to make up for lack of much wind
generation..

On 21/01/2017 18:47, The Natural Philosopher wrote:


I rebooted it as soon as possible


Damn linux machines, always needing unscheduled reboots.

You don't run the Screwfix payment data link through your machine as well do
you? :-)
I thought your comment was more used for Windoze.

I blame dirty power myself.
Brian

--
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This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"dennis@home" wrote in message
web.com...
On 21/01/2017 18:47, The Natural Philosopher wrote:


I rebooted it as soon as possible


Damn linux machines, always needing unscheduled reboots.

On Sat, 21 Jan 2017 18:47:16 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

yeah. the server hosting it crashed due to a power failure at the
datacentre apparently.

Hot, doubly redundant, dual power supplies? Both fed from the same
230V feed?

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 21/01/17 19:49, dennis@home wrote:
On 21/01/2017 18:47, The Natural Philosopher wrote:


I rebooted it as soon as possible


Damn linux machines, always needing unscheduled reboots.
??? sorry. I should have said I booted it.

It needed it due to the lack of electrons flowing through the parent
hardware.

On 22/01/17 00:49, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sat, 21 Jan 2017 18:47:16 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

yeah. the server hosting it crashed due to a power failure at the
datacentre apparently.

Hot, doubly redundant, dual power supplies? Both fed from the same
230V feed?

well yes. I am a bit p***ed off that no ups was in play.

On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 11:03:34 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

yeah. the server hosting it crashed due to a power failure at the
datacentre apparently.

Hot, doubly redundant, dual power supplies? Both fed from the same
230V feed?

well yes. I am a bit p***ed off that no ups was in play.

No UPS full stop or no UPS beacuse it was "on maintenance". I'd
*expect* any half decent datacenter to have dual redundant UPS's,
feeds and PSU's. But that costs money and I guess you can "get what
you pay for". What do the T&C's have to say about power?

Mind you even then people do the oddest things Was it in here that
someone said they had installed dual, independendent, diversly
routed, backed up supplies to each rack but the equipment installers
connected the two inputs of the dual PSU's to the same supply
"beacuse it was neater".

Nothing like the sound of equipment fans running down when the
lighting switches to emergency mode to turn the trousrers of
datacenter manager brown. B-)

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 22/01/2017 12:36, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 11:03:34 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

yeah. the server hosting it crashed due to a power failure at the
datacentre apparently.

Hot, doubly redundant, dual power supplies? Both fed from the same
230V feed?

well yes. I am a bit p***ed off that no ups was in play.

No UPS full stop or no UPS beacuse it was "on maintenance". I'd
*expect* any half decent datacenter to have dual redundant UPS's,
feeds and PSU's. But that costs money and I guess you can "get what
you pay for". What do the T&C's have to say about power?

I'd be more interested in why it didn't restart and why TNP had to
reboot it?

On 22/01/17 13:21, dennis@home wrote:
On 22/01/2017 12:36, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 11:03:34 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

yeah. the server hosting it crashed due to a power failure at the
datacentre apparently.

Hot, doubly redundant, dual power supplies? Both fed from the same
230V feed?

well yes. I am a bit p***ed off that no ups was in play.

No UPS full stop or no UPS beacuse it was "on maintenance". I'd
*expect* any half decent datacenter to have dual redundant UPS's,
feeds and PSU's. But that costs money and I guess you can "get what
you pay for". What do the T&C's have to say about power?

I'd be more interested in why it didn't restart and why TNP had to
reboot it?


it didn't restart because the people who run the hardware hadn't gotten
round to booting all the virtual machines before I noticed it had gone down
it isn't set to boot on power on automagically.

En el artículo om,
dennis@home.? escribió:

I'd be more interested in why it didn't restart and why TNP had to
reboot it?

Probably the blip in power changing over from utility to generator was
enough to hang the machine. This is exactly why UPSes are also
required.

TNP's using an el-cheapo VPN host which probably doesn't provide
anything like remote management or iLO.

--
(\_/)
(='.'=) systemd: the Linux version of Windows 10
(")_(")

On 22/01/2017 17:53, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
En el artículo om,
dennis@home.? escribió:

I'd be more interested in why it didn't restart and why TNP had to
reboot it?

Probably the blip in power changing over from utility to generator was
enough to hang the machine. This is exactly why UPSes are also
required.

TNP's using an el-cheapo VPN host which probably doesn't provide
anything like remote management or iLO.


I would rather he did so than switch to a more expensive host paid for
by ads.

And I can live without Gridwatch if it does go down - though I respect
the views of any who feel differently; and suggest they make a note to
call 116 123
--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

En el artículo , Robin
escribió:

And I can live without Gridwatch if it does go down

http://www.gridwatch.co.uk/

is an alternative

--
(\_/)
(='.'=) systemd: the Linux version of Windows 10
(")_(")

On 22/01/17 18:43, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
En el artÃ*culo , Robin
escribió:

And I can live without Gridwatch if it does go down

http://www.gridwatch.co.uk/

is an alternative

is a copy

On 22/01/17 19:24, pamela wrote:
On 15:09 21 Jan 2017, David wrote:

Can't connect at the moment; has it been shut down to conserve
power?


I can't say I take much interest in electric power generation but
I have to ask what's the attraction of observing those dials?

Genuine question.

I see power genration discussed here and sometimes there are
fierce debates but why the very keen interest ion the first place and
why here?


It's interesting to see if the lights are going out soon...

It's also great to show the kids how erratic wind power is, so they go
and aks their teacher "why don't we build more reliable nuclear power
stations, Miss?"

Seriously, the latter - it's educational

On 22/01/2017 18:46, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 22/01/17 18:43, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
En el artÃ*culo , Robin
escribió:

And I can live without Gridwatch if it does go down

http://www.gridwatch.co.uk/

is an alternative

is a copy

....which requires scripts enabled and has an (admittedly modest) ad


--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

In article ,
pamela wrote:
On 20:16 22 Jan 2017, Chris Hogg wrote:

On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 19:41:33 GMT, pamela
wrote:

On 19:31 22 Jan 2017, Tim Watts wrote:

On 22/01/17 19:24, pamela wrote:
On 15:09 21 Jan 2017, David wrote:

Can't connect at the moment; has it been shut down to
conserve power?


I can't say I take much interest in electric power generation
but I have to ask what's the attraction of observing those
dials?

Genuine question.

I see power genration discussed here and sometimes there are
fierce debates but why the very keen interest ion the first
place and why here?


It's interesting to see if the lights are going out soon...

It's also great to show the kids how erratic wind power is, so
they go and aks their teacher "why don't we build more
reliable nuclear power stations, Miss?"

Seriously, the latter - it's educational


Is observing electric power output & consumption connected with
the global warming debates which goes on here (which I don't
read)?

Of course. Global warming / climate change is claimed to be due
to rising CO2 levels in the atmosphere, caused by burning fossil
fuels (coal, oil, gas) to generate power, both electrical and
mechanical. The remedy proposed by environmentalists is to
generate more electricity from renewable sources such as wind,
sunshine and tides, rather than from nuclear reactors which they
abhor, mainly because of the problems that they insist exist in
handling the waste, AIUI.

Gridwatch shows the scale of the problem in terms of the amount
of electrical power the country uses throughout the day and
throughout the year, and how small is the proportion contributed
by renewable energy, getting close to zero at times, thus
emphasising the importance of a consistent, uninterruptible
supply that only nuclear can provide if targets for CO2
reduction are to be met.

Unfortunately most environmentalists turn a blind eye to such
problems, arguing that all we need is more wind turbines, more
solar panels, more tidal barrages, more tidal stream turbines
and more interconnects to the Continent, Norway, Iceland, North
Africa, etc.

As somebody here said recently, environmentalists don't do sums.


Thanks for the explanation. I take it the majority of contibutors
to the debates about this in uk.d-i-y are climate sceptics or is
there strong environmentalist representation?

Climate Sceptics is a strange expression. Do you mean people who are
sceptical about whether the climate is changing because of human
intervention or just naturally?

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

pamela wrote
David wrote

Can't connect at the moment; has it been shut down to conserve power?

I can't say I take much interest in electric power generation but
I have to ask what's the attraction of observing those dials?

It allows you to see how well the generating capacity is keeping
up with the consumption, particularly in situations of higher than
normal demand due to the weather etc and to see what is supplied
by what type of power generation capacity and how poorly the
'renewables' do when the **** hits the fan.

Genuine question.

I see power genration discussed here and sometimes there are
fierce debates but why the very keen interest ion the first place

Because some have been expecting that supply will not
be able to keep up with demand in the worst situations.

and why here?

Because this is where those who are interested in that stuff happen to be.

Same with you and BRexit etc.

"pamela" wrote in message
...
On 19:31 22 Jan 2017, Tim Watts wrote:

On 22/01/17 19:24, pamela wrote:
On 15:09 21 Jan 2017, David wrote:

Can't connect at the moment; has it been shut down to conserve
power?


I can't say I take much interest in electric power generation
but I have to ask what's the attraction of observing those
dials?

Genuine question.

I see power genration discussed here and sometimes there are
fierce debates but why the very keen interest ion the first
place and why here?


It's interesting to see if the lights are going out soon...

It's also great to show the kids how erratic wind power is, so
they go and aks their teacher "why don't we build more reliable
nuclear power stations, Miss?"

Seriously, the latter - it's educational


Is observing electric power output & consumption connected with the
global warming debates which goes on here (which I don't read)?

Only to the extent that the 'renewables' are mostly there because
of a perception that there is a global warming problem.

That why so much of the older coal fired power generation has been shut
down.

"pamela" wrote in message
...
On 20:16 22 Jan 2017, Chris Hogg wrote:

On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 19:41:33 GMT, pamela
wrote:

On 19:31 22 Jan 2017, Tim Watts wrote:

On 22/01/17 19:24, pamela wrote:
On 15:09 21 Jan 2017, David wrote:

Can't connect at the moment; has it been shut down to
conserve power?


I can't say I take much interest in electric power generation
but I have to ask what's the attraction of observing those
dials?

Genuine question.

I see power genration discussed here and sometimes there are
fierce debates but why the very keen interest ion the first
place and why here?


It's interesting to see if the lights are going out soon...

It's also great to show the kids how erratic wind power is, so
they go and aks their teacher "why don't we build more
reliable nuclear power stations, Miss?"

Seriously, the latter - it's educational


Is observing electric power output & consumption connected with
the global warming debates which goes on here (which I don't
read)?

Of course. Global warming / climate change is claimed to be due
to rising CO2 levels in the atmosphere, caused by burning fossil
fuels (coal, oil, gas) to generate power, both electrical and
mechanical. The remedy proposed by environmentalists is to
generate more electricity from renewable sources such as wind,
sunshine and tides, rather than from nuclear reactors which they
abhor, mainly because of the problems that they insist exist in
handling the waste, AIUI.

Gridwatch shows the scale of the problem in terms of the amount
of electrical power the country uses throughout the day and
throughout the year, and how small is the proportion contributed
by renewable energy, getting close to zero at times, thus
emphasising the importance of a consistent, uninterruptible
supply that only nuclear can provide if targets for CO2
reduction are to be met.

Unfortunately most environmentalists turn a blind eye to such
problems, arguing that all we need is more wind turbines, more
solar panels, more tidal barrages, more tidal stream turbines
and more interconnects to the Continent, Norway, Iceland, North
Africa, etc.

As somebody here said recently, environmentalists don't do sums.


Thanks for the explanation. I take it the majority of contibutors
to the debates about this in uk.d-i-y are climate sceptics

More sceptical that the 'renewables' are any real use at all for
doing anything about CO2 levels, if it turns out that that matters.

or is there strong environmentalist representation?

There are a couple who do believe it matters.

(I know it's important topic for our times but I don't
really hold a view on this, so I'm neutral and don't
bother to work through these threads.)

pamela wrote:

On 19:31 22 Jan 2017, Tim Watts wrote:

On 22/01/17 19:24, pamela wrote:
On 15:09 21 Jan 2017, David wrote:

Can't connect at the moment; has it been shut down to conserve
power?


I can't say I take much interest in electric power generation
but I have to ask what's the attraction of observing those
dials?

Genuine question.

I see power genration discussed here and sometimes there are
fierce debates but why the very keen interest ion the first
place and why here?


It's interesting to see if the lights are going out soon...

It's also great to show the kids how erratic wind power is, so
they go and aks their teacher "why don't we build more reliable
nuclear power stations, Miss?"

Seriously, the latter - it's educational


Is observing electric power output & consumption connected with the
global warming debates which goes on here (which I don't read)?

I suspect it is more the "Why haven't successive governments arranged
for us to have a reliable public electricity supply during the next
couple of decades?" debate. Historically the climate change issue
may have affected decision making, but is no excuse for us to be in our
present state. Dereliction of duty by governments over several decades
comes to mind. That's just a personal view, I don't know what the
proponents of gridwatch think.

--

Roger Hayter

On 22/01/2017 20:26, pamela wrote:
Thanks for the explanation. I take it the majority of contibutors
to the debates about this in uk.d-i-y are climate sceptics or is
there strong environmentalist representation?

I think opinion is split.

But I think there is a substantial majority who think that solar power
won't keep the lights on, and wind won't help when there isn't any.

Andy

Chris Hogg wrote:

On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 19:41:33 GMT, pamela wrote:

On 19:31 22 Jan 2017, Tim Watts wrote:

On 22/01/17 19:24, pamela wrote:
On 15:09 21 Jan 2017, David wrote:

Can't connect at the moment; has it been shut down to conserve
power?


I can't say I take much interest in electric power generation
but I have to ask what's the attraction of observing those
dials?

Genuine question.

I see power genration discussed here and sometimes there are
fierce debates but why the very keen interest ion the first
place and why here?


It's interesting to see if the lights are going out soon...

It's also great to show the kids how erratic wind power is, so
they go and aks their teacher "why don't we build more reliable
nuclear power stations, Miss?"

Seriously, the latter - it's educational


Is observing electric power output & consumption connected with the
global warming debates which goes on here (which I don't read)?

Of course. Global warming / climate change is claimed to be due to
rising CO2 levels in the atmosphere, caused by burning fossil fuels
(coal, oil, gas) to generate power, both electrical and mechanical.
The remedy proposed by environmentalists is to generate more
electricity from renewable sources such as wind, sunshine and tides,
rather than from nuclear reactors which they abhor, mainly because of
the problems that they insist exist in handling the waste, AIUI.

Gridwatch shows the scale of the problem in terms of the amount of
electrical power the country uses throughout the day and throughout
the year, and how small is the proportion contributed by renewable
energy, getting close to zero at times, thus emphasising the
importance of a consistent, uninterruptible supply that only nuclear
can provide if targets for CO2 reduction are to be met.

Unfortunately most environmentalists turn a blind eye to such
problems, arguing that all we need is more wind turbines, more solar
panels, more tidal barrages, more tidal stream turbines and more
interconnects to the Continent, Norway, Iceland, North Africa, etc.

As somebody here said recently, environmentalists don't do sums.

One can be broadly in favour of reducing CO2 production but still rather
keen on a reliable public electricity supply. Unfortunately if one also
chooses to dislke nuclear power one has an uphill struggle to afford
sufficient gas powered overprovision and several-fold renewable
over-provision so that both preferences are met.

My personal view is that we need nuclear power, even though it is really
not as foolproof as some might claim. If one doubts that the production
of fools is getting ever more sophisticated one only has to look at
Brexit and Trump.




--

Roger Hayter

On 22/01/17 19:41, pamela wrote:

Is observing electric power output & consumption connected with the
global warming debates which goes on here (which I don't read)?



Yes. In particular the hopeless shift to attempt to use wind generation,
which a quick look at the graphs will tell you is uselessly unpredictable.

"pamela" wrote in message
...
On 20:48 22 Jan 2017, charles wrote:

In article ,
pamela wrote:
On 20:16 22 Jan 2017, Chris Hogg wrote:

On Sun, 22 Jan 2017 19:41:33 GMT, pamela
wrote:

On 19:31 22 Jan 2017, Tim Watts wrote:

On 22/01/17 19:24, pamela wrote:
On 15:09 21 Jan 2017, David wrote:

Can't connect at the moment; has it been shut down to
conserve power?


I can't say I take much interest in electric power
generation but I have to ask what's the attraction of
observing those dials?

Genuine question.

I see power genration discussed here and sometimes there
are fierce debates but why the very keen interest ion the
first place and why here?


It's interesting to see if the lights are going out soon...

It's also great to show the kids how erratic wind power is,
so they go and aks their teacher "why don't we build more
reliable nuclear power stations, Miss?"

Seriously, the latter - it's educational


Is observing electric power output & consumption connected
with the global warming debates which goes on here (which I
don't read)?

Of course. Global warming / climate change is claimed to be
due to rising CO2 levels in the atmosphere, caused by burning
fossil fuels (coal, oil, gas) to generate power, both
electrical and mechanical. The remedy proposed by
environmentalists is to generate more electricity from
renewable sources such as wind, sunshine and tides, rather
than from nuclear reactors which they abhor, mainly because
of the problems that they insist exist in handling the waste,
AIUI.

Gridwatch shows the scale of the problem in terms of the
amount of electrical power the country uses throughout the
day and throughout the year, and how small is the proportion
contributed by renewable energy, getting close to zero at
times, thus emphasising the importance of a consistent,
uninterruptible supply that only nuclear can provide if
targets for CO2 reduction are to be met.

Unfortunately most environmentalists turn a blind eye to such
problems, arguing that all we need is more wind turbines,
more solar panels, more tidal barrages, more tidal stream
turbines and more interconnects to the Continent, Norway,
Iceland, North Africa, etc.

As somebody here said recently, environmentalists don't do
sums.


Thanks for the explanation. I take it the majority of
contibutors to the debates about this in uk.d-i-y are climate
sceptics or is there strong environmentalist representation?

Climate Sceptics is a strange expression. Do you mean people
who are sceptical about whether the climate is changing because
of human intervention or just naturally?


Isn't "climate sceptic" used to describe was someone who doesn't
believe man is mostly responsible for global warming?

Only a fool believes that mostly bit. The real question
is how much of what we see is man responsible for.

In article ,
pamela writes:
Thanks for the explanation. I take it the majority of contibutors
to the debates about this in uk.d-i-y are climate sceptics or is
there strong environmentalist representation?

A lot of the people here have science/engineering backgrounds.
That doesn't map to agreement or disagreement on made-made global
warming (there are different views), but it does map to significant
agreement that most environmentalists are clueless about viable
renewable energy generation. Some of this is obvious if you look
at gridwatch.

If there was an environmental organisation that based its
policies on sound science and economics, I'd join it like a shot.

Unfortunately, these organisations attract people who don't
understand either science or economics. That's not just benign -
it results in real harm in the form of unnecessary costs, fuel
poverty deaths, and exporting businesses which were essential for
the economic success of the country and providing jobs. It will
in all probably also result in the lights going out in the next
few years (and that has enormous implications for industry's
economic viability, and peoples' safety). Much of this is directly
due to the misguided activities of environmental organisations
pushing the wrong policies. If they understood the science and
economics, they could actually push for environmental policies
which worked.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

Tim Streater wrote:

In article , pamela
wrote:


snip


I don't follow it closely but the whole climate debate in recent
decades has provided outsiders with a fascinating insight into the
reality of modern scientific method.

What I'm most sceptical about is the extent to which it is science at
all. Last year the global temperature rise was supposed to be 0.01C,
but with an error or plus/minus 0.1C. Which renders the rise figure
meaningless.

That is certainly inconclusive, it doesn't tell us anything on its own.
But it is *not* meaningless, it is a data point that can be added to
others to reduce the uncertainty until the actual change (in whatever
direction it may be) is significant, or until there is evidence that no
change greater than a certain small amount has occurred.



The wrong headed self-assuredness, the falsification of data, the
internecine struggles, behind the scenes manoeuvring, the
duplicity, the false logic, the hidden agendas, etc are all worthy
of Machiavelli. No doubt, just like Machiavelli, the participants
in this genuinely feel they do what they do for the common good.

Ha, nicely put.


--

Roger Hayter

En el artículo , Robin
escribió:

has an (admittedly modest) ad

Never seen any. But then I have an ad blocker installed

--
(\_/)
(='.'=) systemd: the Linux version of Windows 10
(")_(")

En el artículo , pamela
escribió:

I can't say I take much interest in electric power generation but
I have to ask what's the attraction of observing those dials?

Genuine question.

The UK is operating with a very narrow margin (available generated
capacity vs demand) and people are interested in how the grid and market
are coping and whether the lights will go out.

There's interest in how well intermittent so-called "green" power like
solar and wind integrate into the mix and how that intermittency can be
planned for.

why the very keen interest ion the first place

if the lights go out, your angle grinder stops working...

and
why here?

see above There's also some posters with relevant background in the
industry posting, which is input that's nice to have, and some are very
good at crunching the numbers.

I'm unaware of a suitable alternative group. Surely it's not as off
topic as asking about transfer times between bank accounts?

--
(\_/)
(='.'=) systemd: the Linux version of Windows 10
(")_(")

En el artículo , Roger Hayter
escribió:

Historically the climate change issue
may have affected decision making, but is no excuse for us to be in our
present state. Dereliction of duty by governments over several decades
comes to mind.

I think few in here would disagree with that.

--
(\_/)
(='.'=) systemd: the Linux version of Windows 10
(")_(")

On 23/01/2017 01:59, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
En el artículo , Robin
escribió:

has an (admittedly modest) ad

Never seen any. But then I have an ad blocker installed

Perhaps not all ad blockers are created equal since AdBlock Plus allows
for me an ad for energy helpline.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/zekwkibwhk...%20ad.PNG?dl=0





--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

In article ,
(Andrew Gabriel) writes:
In article ,
pamela writes:
Thanks for the explanation. I take it the majority of contibutors
to the debates about this in uk.d-i-y are climate sceptics or is
there strong environmentalist representation?

A lot of the people here have science/engineering backgrounds.
That doesn't map to agreement or disagreement on made-made global
warming (there are different views), but it does map to significant
agreement that most environmentalists are clueless about viable
renewable energy generation. Some of this is obvious if you look
at gridwatch.

If there was an environmental organisation that based its
policies on sound science and economics, I'd join it like a shot.

Unfortunately, these organisations attract people who don't
understand either science or economics. That's not just benign -
it results in real harm in the form of unnecessary costs, fuel
poverty deaths, and exporting businesses which were essential for
the economic success of the country and providing jobs. It will
in all probably also result in the lights going out in the next
few years (and that has enormous implications for industry's
economic viability, and peoples' safety).

A Dutch colleague has just told me a 3-hour power cut in
Amsterdam a week ago is now known to have resulted in 3 deaths.
(The power cut was due to a fault, not electricity shortage,
but it demonstrates the effects.)

The extra polution in London last week which resulted in the
warnings being issued not to exercise and those with breating
difficulties not to go outside, drifted across from Germany due
to the weather patterns causing it to drift across without
dispersing. Germany's polution output has massively incresed
due to their Greens shutting down their nuclear power stations
in last few years.

Much of this is directly
due to the misguided activities of environmental organisations
pushing the wrong policies. If they understood the science and
economics, they could actually push for environmental policies
which worked.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

In article ,
(Roger Hayter) writes:
I suspect it is more the "Why haven't successive governments arranged
for us to have a reliable public electricity supply during the next
couple of decades?" debate. Historically the climate change issue
may have affected decision making, but is no excuse for us to be in our
present state. Dereliction of duty by governments over several decades
comes to mind. That's just a personal view, I don't know what the
proponents of gridwatch think.

This is true, but it's all too easy to do when you have a Green
movement pushing you hard not to build power stations, but instead
to put money into schemes which have failed to produce viable
electricity (thoroughly predictable at the outset by science), and
made what would have been viable schemes uneconomic too.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On 22/01/17 19:41, pamela wrote:


Is observing electric power output & consumption connected with the
global warming debates which goes on here (which I don't read)?

probably, but dont bother your pretty little head about it.

Alls well and God is in his place, reading the Guardian..

On 22/01/17 21:16, pamela wrote:
Isn't "climate sceptic" used to describe was someone who doesn't
believe man is mostly responsible for global warming?

Only by climate deniers, who maintain a belief in a science fiction
horror story in denial of the actual data.

En el artículo , Robin
escribió:

Perhaps not all ad blockers are created equal

agreed.

AdBlock Plus

uBlock Origin plus Ghostery, plus the hosts file from:

http://www.someonewhocares.org/

Ads? What ads?

plus websites load in a fraction of the time without all the flashing,
jumping, in-yer-face, pop-over, pop-under, auto-video-playing-at-max-
volume, malware-spreading, screen-obscuring **** sucking up your
bandwidth.

When ad-flingers start behaving reasonably and responsibly, I'll switch
blocking off. But not until then.

http://theoatmeal.com/comics/mobile_website

allows
for me an ad for energy helpline.

You may have the "allow some acceptable content" box ticked in the
Adblock Plus settings.

--
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(='.'=) systemd: the Linux version of Windows 10
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