Background: BT Infinity with Home Bub 5 installed on 25/02/2016 - speed now
16 plus Mb sec - we are rural and 1.8 miles of copper to the cabinet. This
is over double what we were getting - the speed is not the issue.

Connection going up and down like a yo-yo - Hub disconnects then succeeds in
re-connecting. Happens frequently - 4 or 5 times at least that day. Report
fault to BT and 'Somveer' on the Help Desk has great difficulty
understanding the issue, but does a few tests, gets me to isolate my
internal wiring at the demarcation point, does more tests and assures me
that the fault is with my wiring.

Well I've left my internal wiring disconnected and the problem persists, so
obviously it's NOT my wiring. Engineer attending on Monday (01/03/2016),
Somveer issuing dire threats that they'll charge me £130 if it's my wiring
!!!!

So it occurs to me what tests can I (a fairly well equipped chappy) do to
prove my wiring. It's extremely simple in that after the ADSL filter in the
BT master socket, all it goes to is my Panasonic DBS Internal Exchange, all
phones come off the Panasonic so literally one 'REN' on the line, and it's
just a single twisted pair, no ringing circuits to confuse the issue.

The only complication is that the Master Socket is in the house, and the
Panasonic Exchange in my office some 50 metres away, and the cable passes
through three underground ducts via two buildings on the way and has four
Krone Blocks making the joints. (Pucka BT blocks in proper housings) Final
Krone block has BT lightning protection arrestors installed.

Is it possible to do a bandwidth test on it? Or maybe a 'loop resistance'
test or something along those lines. What would a BT Engineer do to prove
someone's internal wiring was out of kilter?

Andrew

On Sat, 27 Feb 2016 16:24:46 +0000, Andrew Mawson wrote:

Background: BT Infinity with Home Bub 5 installed on 25/02/2016 - speed
now 16 plus Mb sec - we are rural and 1.8 miles of copper to the
cabinet. This is over double what we were getting - the speed is not the
issue.

Connection going up and down like a yo-yo - Hub disconnects then
succeeds in re-connecting. Happens frequently - 4 or 5 times at least
that day. Report fault to BT and 'Somveer' on the Help Desk has great
difficulty understanding the issue, but does a few tests, gets me to
isolate my internal wiring at the demarcation point, does more tests and
assures me that the fault is with my wiring.

Well I've left my internal wiring disconnected and the problem persists,
so obviously it's NOT my wiring. Engineer attending on Monday
(01/03/2016), Somveer issuing dire threats that they'll charge me £130
if it's my wiring !!!!

So it occurs to me what tests can I (a fairly well equipped chappy) do
to prove my wiring. It's extremely simple in that after the ADSL filter
in the BT master socket, all it goes to is my Panasonic DBS Internal
Exchange, all phones come off the Panasonic so literally one 'REN' on
the line, and it's just a single twisted pair, no ringing circuits to
confuse the issue.

The only complication is that the Master Socket is in the house, and the
Panasonic Exchange in my office some 50 metres away, and the cable
passes through three underground ducts via two buildings on the way and
has four Krone Blocks making the joints. (Pucka BT blocks in proper
housings) Final Krone block has BT lightning protection arrestors
installed.

Is it possible to do a bandwidth test on it? Or maybe a 'loop
resistance' test or something along those lines. What would a BT
Engineer do to prove someone's internal wiring was out of kilter?

Andrew


I think all that is moot in the short term.

I think that if at all possible you will have to live without the exchange
for a few days and just run the Home Hub off the master socket, and have
it set up that way when the engineer calls.

If it is failing in that mode then the main problem is not linked to your
wiring.

If the fault clears, then suspect your wiring, but from your post I think
you have already shown the fault with the exchange disconnected.

I guess you can/already have put a dumb phone in your office to eliminate
the exchange.

Cup of tea and biscuits for the engineer and ask if he can check your
(disconnected) wiring? He may well enjoy a look at your setup (assuming he
is a proper old style engineer if there are any left).

Oh, the engineer will not be interested in proving that your internal
wiring is out of kilter. S/he will test from the master socket with
everything else disconnected and if a fault cannot be shown the assumption
will be made that it is your wiring at fault.

The best you can do is be set up working directly from the master socket
and confirm that the fault shows with that configuration.

Now it is a long time since I had ADSL (Virgin cable here) but I used to
use my own ADSL router which had a CLI interface. It recorded loads of
statistics on line performance, error rates etc. and these could be used
to help diagnose any problems. I don't know if the Home Hub has this
capability.

Cheers

Dave R


--
Windows 8.1 on PCSpecialist box

On 27/02/2016 16:45, David wrote:
On Sat, 27 Feb 2016 16:24:46 +0000, Andrew Mawson wrote:

Background: BT Infinity with Home Bub 5 installed on 25/02/2016 - speed
now 16 plus Mb sec - we are rural and 1.8 miles of copper to the
cabinet. This is over double what we were getting - the speed is not the
issue.

Connection going up and down like a yo-yo - Hub disconnects then
succeeds in re-connecting. Happens frequently - 4 or 5 times at least
that day. Report fault to BT and 'Somveer' on the Help Desk has great
difficulty understanding the issue, but does a few tests, gets me to
isolate my internal wiring at the demarcation point, does more tests and
assures me that the fault is with my wiring.

Well I've left my internal wiring disconnected and the problem persists,
so obviously it's NOT my wiring. Engineer attending on Monday
(01/03/2016), Somveer issuing dire threats that they'll charge me £130
if it's my wiring !!!!

So it occurs to me what tests can I (a fairly well equipped chappy) do
to prove my wiring. It's extremely simple in that after the ADSL filter
in the BT master socket, all it goes to is my Panasonic DBS Internal
Exchange, all phones come off the Panasonic so literally one 'REN' on
the line, and it's just a single twisted pair, no ringing circuits to
confuse the issue.

The only complication is that the Master Socket is in the house, and the
Panasonic Exchange in my office some 50 metres away, and the cable
passes through three underground ducts via two buildings on the way and
has four Krone Blocks making the joints. (Pucka BT blocks in proper
housings) Final Krone block has BT lightning protection arrestors
installed.

Is it possible to do a bandwidth test on it? Or maybe a 'loop
resistance' test or something along those lines. What would a BT
Engineer do to prove someone's internal wiring was out of kilter?

Andrew


I think all that is moot in the short term.

I think that if at all possible you will have to live without the exchange
for a few days and just run the Home Hub off the master socket, and have
it set up that way when the engineer calls.

If it is failing in that mode then the main problem is not linked to your
wiring.

If the fault clears, then suspect your wiring, but from your post I think
you have already shown the fault with the exchange disconnected.

I guess you can/already have put a dumb phone in your office to eliminate
the exchange.

Cup of tea and biscuits for the engineer and ask if he can check your
(disconnected) wiring? He may well enjoy a look at your setup (assuming he
is a proper old style engineer if there are any left).

Oh, the engineer will not be interested in proving that your internal
wiring is out of kilter. S/he will test from the master socket with
everything else disconnected and if a fault cannot be shown the assumption
will be made that it is your wiring at fault.

The best you can do is be set up working directly from the master socket
and confirm that the fault shows with that configuration.

Now it is a long time since I had ADSL (Virgin cable here) but I used to
use my own ADSL router which had a CLI interface. It recorded loads of
statistics on line performance, error rates etc. and these could be used
to help diagnose any problems. I don't know if the Home Hub has this
capability.

Cheers

Dave R


There is a line test that you can request possibly by dialing 150. I
have done this in the past, but as I no longer have a BT phone I can't
try it for you.

--
Michael Chare

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

In article ,
Andrew Mawson wrote:
Is it possible to do a bandwidth test on it? Or maybe a 'loop
resistance' test or something along those lines. What would a BT
Engineer do to prove someone's internal wiring was out of kilter?

Have you looked at the router's log? Any clues there about why it drops
out?

--
*Therapy is expensive, poppin' bubble wrap is cheap! You choose.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...

In article ,
Andrew Mawson wrote:
Is it possible to do a bandwidth test on it? Or maybe a 'loop
resistance' test or something along those lines. What would a BT
Engineer do to prove someone's internal wiring was out of kilter?

Have you looked at the router's log? Any clues there about why it drops
out?


These are the last two drop outs - they all look similar to me who doesn't
know what they mean:


15:14:30, 27 Feb. (278733.380000) CWMP: session completed successfully
15:14:29, 27 Feb. (278733.150000) CWMP: HTTP authentication success from
https://pbthdm.bt.mo
15:14:22, 27 Feb. (278725.970000) CWMP: Server URL: https://pbthdm.bt.mo;
Connecting as user: ACS username
15:14:22, 27 Feb. (278725.960000) CWMP: Session start now. Event code(s): '4
VALUE CHANGE'
15:13:59, 27 Feb. (278703.180000) CWMP: session closed due to error: No
response
15:13:57, 27 Feb. (278700.980000) CWMP: Server URL: https://pbthdm.bt.mo;
Connecting as user: ACS username
15:13:57, 27 Feb. (278700.970000) CWMP: Session start now. Event code(s): '4
VALUE CHANGE'
15:13:57, 27 Feb. (278700.720000) CWMP: Initializing transaction for event
code 4 VALUE CHANGE
13:14:02, 27 Feb. (271506.270000) CWMP: session completed successfully
13:14:02, 27 Feb. (271505.850000) CWMP: HTTP authentication success from
https://pbthdm.bt.mo
13:13:58, 27 Feb. (271501.990000) CWMP: Server URL: https://pbthdm.bt.mo;
Connecting as user: ACS username
13:13:58, 27 Feb. (271501.980000) CWMP: Session start now. Event code(s): '4
VALUE CHANGE'
13:13:53, 27 Feb. (271497.220000) CWMP: session closed due to error: No
response
13:13:53, 27 Feb. (271496.780000) CWMP: Initializing transaction for event
code 4 VALUE CHANGE
13:13:41, 27 Feb. (271484.730000) CWMP: Server URL: https://pbthdm.bt.mo;
Connecting as user: ACS username
13:13:41, 27 Feb. (271484.730000) CWMP: Session start now. Event code(s): '4
VALUE CHANGE'
13:13:21, 27 Feb. (271464.780000) CWMP: session closed due to error: No
response
13:13:19, 27 Feb. (271462.570000) CWMP: Server URL: https://pbthdm.bt.mo;
Connecting as user: ACS username
13:13:19, 27 Feb. (271462.560000) CWMP: Session start now. Event code(s): '4
VALUE CHANGE'
13:13:18, 27 Feb. (271462.310000) CWMP: Initializing transaction for event
code 4 VALUE CHANGE


Andrew

On 27/02/2016 17:51, Andrew Mawson wrote:
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...

In article ,
Andrew Mawson wrote:
Is it possible to do a bandwidth test on it? Or maybe a 'loop
resistance' test or something along those lines. What would a BT
Engineer do to prove someone's internal wiring was out of kilter?

Have you looked at the router's log? Any clues there about why it drops
out?


These are the last two drop outs - they all look similar to me who
doesn't know what they mean:


15:14:30, 27 Feb. (278733.380000) CWMP: session completed successfully
15:14:29, 27 Feb. (278733.150000) CWMP: HTTP authentication success from
https://pbthdm.bt.mo
15:14:22, 27 Feb. (278725.970000) CWMP: Server URL:
https://pbthdm.bt.mo; Connecting as user: ACS username
15:14:22, 27 Feb. (278725.960000) CWMP: Session start now. Event
code(s): '4 VALUE CHANGE'
15:13:59, 27 Feb. (278703.180000) CWMP: session closed due to error: No
response
15:13:57, 27 Feb. (278700.980000) CWMP: Server URL:
https://pbthdm.bt.mo; Connecting as user: ACS username
15:13:57, 27 Feb. (278700.970000) CWMP: Session start now. Event
code(s): '4 VALUE CHANGE'
15:13:57, 27 Feb. (278700.720000) CWMP: Initializing transaction for
event code 4 VALUE CHANGE
13:14:02, 27 Feb. (271506.270000) CWMP: session completed successfully
13:14:02, 27 Feb. (271505.850000) CWMP: HTTP authentication success from
https://pbthdm.bt.mo
13:13:58, 27 Feb. (271501.990000) CWMP: Server URL:
https://pbthdm.bt.mo; Connecting as user: ACS username
13:13:58, 27 Feb. (271501.980000) CWMP: Session start now. Event
code(s): '4 VALUE CHANGE'
13:13:53, 27 Feb. (271497.220000) CWMP: session closed due to error: No
response
13:13:53, 27 Feb. (271496.780000) CWMP: Initializing transaction for
event code 4 VALUE CHANGE
13:13:41, 27 Feb. (271484.730000) CWMP: Server URL:
https://pbthdm.bt.mo; Connecting as user: ACS username
13:13:41, 27 Feb. (271484.730000) CWMP: Session start now. Event
code(s): '4 VALUE CHANGE'
13:13:21, 27 Feb. (271464.780000) CWMP: session closed due to error: No
response
13:13:19, 27 Feb. (271462.570000) CWMP: Server URL:
https://pbthdm.bt.mo; Connecting as user: ACS username
13:13:19, 27 Feb. (271462.560000) CWMP: Session start now. Event
code(s): '4 VALUE CHANGE'
13:13:18, 27 Feb. (271462.310000) CWMP: Initializing transaction for
event code 4 VALUE CHANGE


Andrew


I'm not an expert on logs, but those look to me as if your internet
session is dropping rather than the line losing sync. In other words, I
suspect that ADSL is staying up, and it's just the internet session
which is dropping.

Can you log on to the hub and interrogate it about its connection status.

When I had ADSL (I'm now on fibre) my router would tell me what my sync
speeds were, and how long the connection had been up.

In another part, it would tell me my WAN IP address, and how long the
internet session had been up.

If you can find equivalent items, it will help you to understand what is
actually failing.

In addition to using the router's own menus, I had used to run a program
called router stats which provided all sorts of useful information -
including graphs of what was happening over a period of time. I've just
noticed that there's a version for the BT HH5
http://www.vwlowen.co.uk/RouterStats...erstatshub.htm

It's well worth a look. It provided me with some invaluable information
with which to beat my ISP over the head when my line kept going up and
down like a yo-yo.
--
Cheers,
Roger
____________
Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
checked.

"Roger Mills" wrote in message ...

On 27/02/2016 17:51, Andrew Mawson wrote:
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...

In article ,
Andrew Mawson wrote:
Is it possible to do a bandwidth test on it? Or maybe a 'loop
resistance' test or something along those lines. What would a BT
Engineer do to prove someone's internal wiring was out of kilter?

Have you looked at the router's log? Any clues there about why it drops
out?


These are the last two drop outs - they all look similar to me who
doesn't know what they mean:


15:14:30, 27 Feb. (278733.380000) CWMP: session completed successfully
15:14:29, 27 Feb. (278733.150000) CWMP: HTTP authentication success from
https://pbthdm.bt.mo
15:14:22, 27 Feb. (278725.970000) CWMP: Server URL:
https://pbthdm.bt.mo; Connecting as user: ACS username
15:14:22, 27 Feb. (278725.960000) CWMP: Session start now. Event
code(s): '4 VALUE CHANGE'
15:13:59, 27 Feb. (278703.180000) CWMP: session closed due to error: No
response
15:13:57, 27 Feb. (278700.980000) CWMP: Server URL:
https://pbthdm.bt.mo; Connecting as user: ACS username
15:13:57, 27 Feb. (278700.970000) CWMP: Session start now. Event
code(s): '4 VALUE CHANGE'
15:13:57, 27 Feb. (278700.720000) CWMP: Initializing transaction for
event code 4 VALUE CHANGE
13:14:02, 27 Feb. (271506.270000) CWMP: session completed successfully
13:14:02, 27 Feb. (271505.850000) CWMP: HTTP authentication success from
https://pbthdm.bt.mo
13:13:58, 27 Feb. (271501.990000) CWMP: Server URL:
https://pbthdm.bt.mo; Connecting as user: ACS username
13:13:58, 27 Feb. (271501.980000) CWMP: Session start now. Event
code(s): '4 VALUE CHANGE'
13:13:53, 27 Feb. (271497.220000) CWMP: session closed due to error: No
response
13:13:53, 27 Feb. (271496.780000) CWMP: Initializing transaction for
event code 4 VALUE CHANGE
13:13:41, 27 Feb. (271484.730000) CWMP: Server URL:
https://pbthdm.bt.mo; Connecting as user: ACS username
13:13:41, 27 Feb. (271484.730000) CWMP: Session start now. Event
code(s): '4 VALUE CHANGE'
13:13:21, 27 Feb. (271464.780000) CWMP: session closed due to error: No
response
13:13:19, 27 Feb. (271462.570000) CWMP: Server URL:
https://pbthdm.bt.mo; Connecting as user: ACS username
13:13:19, 27 Feb. (271462.560000) CWMP: Session start now. Event
code(s): '4 VALUE CHANGE'
13:13:18, 27 Feb. (271462.310000) CWMP: Initializing transaction for
event code 4 VALUE CHANGE


Andrew


I'm not an expert on logs, but those look to me as if your internet session
is dropping rather than the line losing sync. In other words, I suspect
that ADSL is staying up, and it's just the internet session which is
dropping.

Can you log on to the hub and interrogate it about its connection status.

When I had ADSL (I'm now on fibre) my router would tell me what my sync
speeds were, and how long the connection had been up.

In another part, it would tell me my WAN IP address, and how long the
internet session had been up.

If you can find equivalent items, it will help you to understand what is
actually failing.

In addition to using the router's own menus, I had used to run a program
called router stats which provided all sorts of useful information -
including graphs of what was happening over a period of time. I've just
noticed that there's a version for the BT HH5
http://www.vwlowen.co.uk/RouterStats...erstatshub.htm

It's well worth a look. It provided me with some invaluable information
with which to beat my ISP over the head when my line kept going up and down
like a yo-yo.


Roger thanks for that - I've downloaded it and it's capturing data as I
type.

The Home Hub does actually say that's it's not connected when the fault
arises, then it reconnects after a minute or so.

Andrew

On 27/02/2016 21:57, Andrew Mawson wrote:
"Roger Mills" wrote in message ...

In addition to using the router's own menus, I had used to run a
program called router stats which provided all sorts of useful
information - including graphs of what was happening over a period of
time. I've just noticed that there's a version for the BT HH5
http://www.vwlowen.co.uk/RouterStats...erstatshub.htm

It's well worth a look. It provided me with some invaluable
information with which to beat my ISP over the head when my line kept
going up and down like a yo-yo.


Roger thanks for that - I've downloaded it and it's capturing data as I
type.

The Home Hub does actually say that's it's not connected when the fault
arises, then it reconnects after a minute or so.


If you can get it to produce a graph of sync speed vs time, it's obvious
when the connection drops because the sync speed falls to zero.

I don't know whether the HH version of router stats supports this, but
one thing I found incredibly useful was Bitloading. This shows the whole
spectrum broken into narrow frequency bands, with the signal to noise
ratio of each band - both downstream and upstream. When my line fell
over, it was almost always accompanied by a massive loss of SNR in the
frequency bands carrying the upstream signal. This forced it to drop the
line and re-train, usually re-synching at a snail's pace in the upstream
direction. Then it would later recover and decide that it could support
a higher speed - causing it to disconnect and re-train again. This could
happen umpteen times a day. I printed out loads of graphs in readiness
for the OR engineer's visit in case he - or she in my case - couldn't
find anything wrong. In the event, she decided that the line between my
house and the nearest cabinet was ok but that the line from the cabinet
to the exchange was suspect. She swapped this with a spare pair, and the
problem went away.
--
Cheers,
Roger
____________
Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
checked.

En el artículo , Andrew Mawson andrew@pleas
e_remove_me.mawson.org.uk escribió:

What would a BT Engineer do to prove
someone's internal wiring was out of kilter?

He won't touch it. Keep it simple, just show him that the problem
persists when you disconnect your extension wiring at the master socket
(demaraction point), with the HH5 connected to the test socket behind
the master socket faceplate. You've then shown that it's an issue to do
with their side of things.

Hopefully the fault occurs often enough, or you have some way to provoke
it into happening, so you can demonstrate it to him.

ps. you /are/ connecting your Panasonic exchange via a filter, yes?

--
(\_/)
(='.'=) Bunny says: Windows 10? Nein danke!
(")_(")

"Mike Tomlinson" wrote in message ...

En el artículo , Andrew Mawson andrew@pleas
e_remove_me.mawson.org.uk escribió:

What would a BT Engineer do to prove
someone's internal wiring was out of kilter?

He won't touch it. Keep it simple, just show him that the problem
persists when you disconnect your extension wiring at the master socket
(demaraction point), with the HH5 connected to the test socket behind
the master socket faceplate. You've then shown that it's an issue to do
with their side of things.

Hopefully the fault occurs often enough, or you have some way to provoke
it into happening, so you can demonstrate it to him.
ps. you /are/ connecting your Panasonic exchange via a filter, yes?


I'm assuming that the phone output of the new "SSFP Infinity" socket IS
filtered - am I wrong ????

Andrew

En el artículo , Andrew Mawson andrew@pleas
e_remove_me.mawson.org.uk escribió:

I'm assuming that the phone output of the new "SSFP Infinity" socket IS
filtered - am I wrong ????

No, that's fine. As you were

The log output you quoted isn't very helpful. "Event 4 value change"
doesn't tell me much (someone familiar with the HH5 may know more - a
google shows many people having the same issue).

Does the router have a 'sync' light that goes out when the line drops?

--
(\_/)
(='.'=) Bunny says: Windows 10? Nein danke!
(")_(")

"Mike Tomlinson" wrote in message ...

En el artículo , Andrew Mawson andrew@pleas
e_remove_me.mawson.org.uk escribió:

I'm assuming that the phone output of the new "SSFP Infinity" socket IS
filtered - am I wrong ????

No, that's fine. As you were

The log output you quoted isn't very helpful. "Event 4 value change"
doesn't tell me much (someone familiar with the HH5 may know more - a
google shows many people having the same issue).

Does the router have a 'sync' light that goes out when the line drops?

Blue light goes out red light comes on until it restarts itself. During this
time if you connect to it over the local network it admits to being
disconnected, but after a minute or so it sorts itself out and you are back
on line.

.... 'suppose it's better than the last BT router I had, that had to be
'power cycled' in similar circumstances

Andrew

"Andrew Mawson" wrote in message
...
Background: BT Infinity with Home Bub 5 installed on 25/02/2016 - speed
now 16 plus Mb sec - we are rural and 1.8 miles of copper to the cabinet.
This is over double what we were getting - the speed is not the issue.

Connection going up and down like a yo-yo - Hub disconnects then succeeds
in re-connecting. Happens frequently - 4 or 5 times at least that day.
Report fault to BT and 'Somveer' on the Help Desk has great difficulty
understanding the issue, but does a few tests, gets me to isolate my
internal wiring at the demarcation point, does more tests and assures me
that the fault is with my wiring.

Well I've left my internal wiring disconnected and the problem persists,
so obviously it's NOT my wiring. Engineer attending on Monday
(01/03/2016), Somveer issuing dire threats that they'll charge me £130 if
it's my wiring !!!!

So it occurs to me what tests can I (a fairly well equipped chappy) do to
prove my wiring. It's extremely simple in that after the ADSL filter in
the BT master socket, all it goes to is my Panasonic DBS Internal
Exchange, all phones come off the Panasonic so literally one 'REN' on the
line, and it's just a single twisted pair, no ringing circuits to confuse
the issue.

The only complication is that the Master Socket is in the house, and the
Panasonic Exchange in my office some 50 metres away, and the cable passes
through three underground ducts via two buildings on the way and has four
Krone Blocks making the joints. (Pucka BT blocks in proper housings) Final
Krone block has BT lightning protection arrestors installed.

Is it possible to do a bandwidth test on it? Or maybe a 'loop resistance'
test or something along those lines. What would a BT Engineer do to prove
someone's internal wiring was out of kilter?

You do it the other way, show that it drops out 4-5 times a day with
none of your internal wiring connected. So the fault must be with
their wiring past the demarc or with the hardware they supplied.

"Alexis" wrote in message ...



"Andrew Mawson" wrote in message
...
Background: BT Infinity with Home Bub 5 installed on 25/02/2016 - speed
now 16 plus Mb sec - we are rural and 1.8 miles of copper to the cabinet.
This is over double what we were getting - the speed is not the issue.

Connection going up and down like a yo-yo - Hub disconnects then succeeds
in re-connecting. Happens frequently - 4 or 5 times at least that day.
Report fault to BT and 'Somveer' on the Help Desk has great difficulty
understanding the issue, but does a few tests, gets me to isolate my
internal wiring at the demarcation point, does more tests and assures me
that the fault is with my wiring.

Well I've left my internal wiring disconnected and the problem persists,
so obviously it's NOT my wiring. Engineer attending on Monday
(01/03/2016), Somveer issuing dire threats that they'll charge me £130 if
it's my wiring !!!!

So it occurs to me what tests can I (a fairly well equipped chappy) do to
prove my wiring. It's extremely simple in that after the ADSL filter in
the BT master socket, all it goes to is my Panasonic DBS Internal
Exchange, all phones come off the Panasonic so literally one 'REN' on the
line, and it's just a single twisted pair, no ringing circuits to confuse
the issue.

The only complication is that the Master Socket is in the house, and the
Panasonic Exchange in my office some 50 metres away, and the cable passes
through three underground ducts via two buildings on the way and has
four Krone Blocks making the joints. (Pucka BT blocks in proper housings)
Final Krone block has BT lightning protection arrestors installed.

Is it possible to do a bandwidth test on it? Or maybe a 'loop resistance'
test or something along those lines. What would a BT Engineer do to prove
someone's internal wiring was out of kilter?

You do it the other way, show that it drops out 4-5 times a day with
none of your internal wiring connected. So the fault must be with
their wiring past the demarc or with the hardware they supplied.

Yes, that I'll do, but for my own satisfaction I wanted to profile the
internal wiring somehow. I may hook up my Time Domain Reflectometer and see
if the various junctions show up in the trace as reflections.

Really need to do a sweep frequency response trace somehow and compare it to
a similar length of plain twisted pair 'phone cable - I suppose I could jury
rig something with my oscilloscope and a variable oscillator ?

Andrew

"Andrew Mawson" wrote in message
...
"Alexis" wrote in message ...



"Andrew Mawson" wrote in message
...
Background: BT Infinity with Home Bub 5 installed on 25/02/2016 - speed
now 16 plus Mb sec - we are rural and 1.8 miles of copper to the
cabinet. This is over double what we were getting - the speed is not the
issue.

Connection going up and down like a yo-yo - Hub disconnects then
succeeds in re-connecting. Happens frequently - 4 or 5 times at least
that day. Report fault to BT and 'Somveer' on the Help Desk has great
difficulty understanding the issue, but does a few tests, gets me to
isolate my internal wiring at the demarcation point, does more tests and
assures me that the fault is with my wiring.

Well I've left my internal wiring disconnected and the problem persists,
so obviously it's NOT my wiring. Engineer attending on Monday
(01/03/2016), Somveer issuing dire threats that they'll charge me £130
if it's my wiring !!!!

So it occurs to me what tests can I (a fairly well equipped chappy) do
to prove my wiring. It's extremely simple in that after the ADSL filter
in the BT master socket, all it goes to is my Panasonic DBS Internal
Exchange, all phones come off the Panasonic so literally one 'REN' on
the line, and it's just a single twisted pair, no ringing circuits to
confuse the issue.

The only complication is that the Master Socket is in the house, and the
Panasonic Exchange in my office some 50 metres away, and the cable
passes through three underground ducts via two buildings on the way and
has four Krone Blocks making the joints. (Pucka BT blocks in proper
housings) Final Krone block has BT lightning protection arrestors
installed.

Is it possible to do a bandwidth test on it? Or maybe a 'loop
resistance' test or something along those lines. What would a BT
Engineer do to prove someone's internal wiring was out of kilter?

You do it the other way, show that it drops out 4-5 times a day with
none of your internal wiring connected. So the fault must be with
their wiring past the demarc or with the hardware they supplied.

Yes, that I'll do, but for my own satisfaction I wanted to profile the
internal wiring somehow. I may hook up my Time Domain Reflectometer and
see if the various junctions show up in the trace as reflections.

That isn't necessarily a problem tho, what's on the internal wiring can
handle it.

It's not like say TV distribution.

Really need to do a sweep frequency response trace somehow and compare it
to a similar length of plain twisted pair 'phone cable - I suppose I could
jury rig something with my oscilloscope and a variable oscillator ?

You can certainly hire stuff that does that. How useful it is tho is another
matter.

Surely you need a connection on where it comes in and see if its still all
over the place with and without your wiring connected. If it is, then its
not your wiring surely?
I think this is what you have already done, so just have it ready to show
the person when they arrive.
Brian

"Andrew Mawson" wrote in message
...
Background: BT Infinity with Home Bub 5 installed on 25/02/2016 - speed
now 16 plus Mb sec - we are rural and 1.8 miles of copper to the cabinet.
This is over double what we were getting - the speed is not the issue.

Connection going up and down like a yo-yo - Hub disconnects then succeeds
in re-connecting. Happens frequently - 4 or 5 times at least that day.
Report fault to BT and 'Somveer' on the Help Desk has great difficulty
understanding the issue, but does a few tests, gets me to isolate my
internal wiring at the demarcation point, does more tests and assures me
that the fault is with my wiring.

Well I've left my internal wiring disconnected and the problem persists,
so obviously it's NOT my wiring. Engineer attending on Monday
(01/03/2016), Somveer issuing dire threats that they'll charge me £130 if
it's my wiring !!!!

So it occurs to me what tests can I (a fairly well equipped chappy) do to
prove my wiring. It's extremely simple in that after the ADSL filter in
the BT master socket, all it goes to is my Panasonic DBS Internal
Exchange, all phones come off the Panasonic so literally one 'REN' on the
line, and it's just a single twisted pair, no ringing circuits to confuse
the issue.

The only complication is that the Master Socket is in the house, and the
Panasonic Exchange in my office some 50 metres away, and the cable passes
through three underground ducts via two buildings on the way and has four
Krone Blocks making the joints. (Pucka BT blocks in proper housings) Final
Krone block has BT lightning protection arrestors installed.

Is it possible to do a bandwidth test on it? Or maybe a 'loop resistance'
test or something along those lines. What would a BT Engineer do to prove
someone's internal wiring was out of kilter?

Andrew

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!

"Brian Gaff" wrote in message ...

"Andrew Mawson" wrote in message
...
Background: BT Infinity with Home Bub 5 installed on 25/02/2016 - speed
now 16 plus Mb sec - we are rural and 1.8 miles of copper to the cabinet.
This is over double what we were getting - the speed is not the issue.

Connection going up and down like a yo-yo - Hub disconnects then succeeds
in re-connecting. Happens frequently - 4 or 5 times at least that day.
Report fault to BT and 'Somveer' on the Help Desk has great difficulty
understanding the issue, but does a few tests, gets me to isolate my
internal wiring at the demarcation point, does more tests and assures me
that the fault is with my wiring.

Well I've left my internal wiring disconnected and the problem persists,
so obviously it's NOT my wiring. Engineer attending on Monday
(01/03/2016), Somveer issuing dire threats that they'll charge me £130 if
it's my wiring !!!!

So it occurs to me what tests can I (a fairly well equipped chappy) do to
prove my wiring. It's extremely simple in that after the ADSL filter in
the BT master socket, all it goes to is my Panasonic DBS Internal
Exchange, all phones come off the Panasonic so literally one 'REN' on the
line, and it's just a single twisted pair, no ringing circuits to confuse
the issue.

The only complication is that the Master Socket is in the house, and the
Panasonic Exchange in my office some 50 metres away, and the cable passes
through three underground ducts via two buildings on the way and has
four Krone Blocks making the joints. (Pucka BT blocks in proper housings)
Final Krone block has BT lightning protection arrestors installed.

Is it possible to do a bandwidth test on it? Or maybe a 'loop resistance'
test or something along those lines. What would a BT Engineer do to prove
someone's internal wiring was out of kilter?

Andrew


Surely you need a connection on where it comes in and see if its still all
over the place with and without your wiring connected. If it is, then its
not your wiring surely?
I think this is what you have already done, so just have it ready to show
the person when they arrive.
Brian

Yes that's the plan Brian.

Just out of interest I did put my (ex BT !) Tektronix Time Domain
Reflectometer on my internal wiring this morning. Proved total cable length
to be 67 metres, and 26 metres to the first Krone block, which oddly gave
more reflection than the others further down the line, and still did after I
re-terminated the pair, and another 10 metres to the next Krone Block. Ties
in with my pacing out !

Only had 2 disconnections so far today

Andrew