Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a larger uninsulated workshop.

Top option seems to be spray foam interior with studs to take dry lining and insulate floor. it fills all the voids in the corrugations but it costs.

A U.S. outfit was offering a container lining kit , that appeared to be some sort of Structural Insulated Panels, pre cut they simpy loaded rear and side walls in , ceiling lining sat on top of walls and floor was layed insulation, very fast to do. Concerned that leaving the corrugation voids unfilled creating a moisture or damp trap.

Another vid appeared to be using polystyrene bats bonded to the interior before lning with ply, again concerned creating a load of sealed voids in the corrugations.

Seen a few online where they have studded the interior and then filled with rockwool, before ply lining over.It`s lowest cost but can`t help but feel may get condenstaion on inside of corrugations soaking the rockwool over time.

Any words from the wise, including just wear the cost and buy an actual Potacabin?

On Sunday, 22 November 2015 13:12:50 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a larger uninsulated workshop.

Top option seems to be spray foam interior with studs to take dry lining and insulate floor. it fills all the voids in the corrugations but it costs..

A U.S. outfit was offering a container lining kit , that appeared to be some sort of Structural Insulated Panels, pre cut they simpy loaded rear and side walls in , ceiling lining sat on top of walls and floor was layed insulation, very fast to do. Concerned that leaving the corrugation voids unfilled creating a moisture or damp trap.

Another vid appeared to be using polystyrene bats bonded to the interior before lning with ply, again concerned creating a load of sealed voids in the corrugations.

Seen a few online where they have studded the interior and then filled with rockwool, before ply lining over.It`s lowest cost but can`t help but feel may get condenstaion on inside of corrugations soaking the rockwool over time.

Any words from the wise, including just wear the cost and buy an actual Potacabin?

I concur with your concern, and point out that it applies to spray foam too.. Put foam (batts) on the outside & Robert's your relative.


NT

On 22/11/2015 13:12, Adam Aglionby wrote:
Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a
larger uninsulated workshop.

Top option seems to be spray foam interior with studs to take dry
lining and insulate floor. it fills all the voids in the corrugations
but it costs.

A U.S. outfit was offering a container lining kit , that appeared to
be some sort of Structural Insulated Panels, pre cut they simpy
loaded rear and side walls in , ceiling lining sat on top of walls
and floor was layed insulation, very fast to do. Concerned that
leaving the corrugation voids unfilled creating a moisture or damp
trap.

Another vid appeared to be using polystyrene bats bonded to the
interior before lning with ply, again concerned creating a load of
sealed voids in the corrugations.

Seen a few online where they have studded the interior and then
filled with rockwool, before ply lining over.It`s lowest cost but
can`t help but feel may get condenstaion on inside of corrugations
soaking the rockwool over time.

Any words from the wise, including just wear the cost and buy an
actual Potacabin?

You would need an effective vapour barrier on the inside of the
insulation to prevent any moist warm air making it to the cold side -
that is what will cause interstitial condensation. (assuming the outer
skin of the container is water tight)


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Sunday, 22 November 2015 16:35:34 UTC, John Rumm wrote:
On 22/11/2015 13:12, Adam Aglionby wrote:
Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a
larger uninsulated workshop.

Top option seems to be spray foam interior with studs to take dry
lining and insulate floor. it fills all the voids in the corrugations
but it costs.

A U.S. outfit was offering a container lining kit , that appeared to
be some sort of Structural Insulated Panels, pre cut they simpy
loaded rear and side walls in , ceiling lining sat on top of walls
and floor was layed insulation, very fast to do. Concerned that
leaving the corrugation voids unfilled creating a moisture or damp
trap.

Another vid appeared to be using polystyrene bats bonded to the
interior before lning with ply, again concerned creating a load of
sealed voids in the corrugations.

Seen a few online where they have studded the interior and then
filled with rockwool, before ply lining over.It`s lowest cost but
can`t help but feel may get condenstaion on inside of corrugations
soaking the rockwool over time.

Any words from the wise, including just wear the cost and buy an
actual Potacabin?

You would need an effective vapour barrier on the inside of the
insulation to prevent any moist warm air making it to the cold side -
that is what will cause interstitial condensation. (assuming the outer
skin of the container is water tight)




Whether you need a vapour barrier or not depends on whether the insulation has open or closed cell structure.
If it's closed cell structure, you don't need it.

On 22/11/2015 17:07, harry wrote:
On Sunday, 22 November 2015 16:35:34 UTC, John Rumm wrote:
On 22/11/2015 13:12, Adam Aglionby wrote:
Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a
larger uninsulated workshop.

Top option seems to be spray foam interior with studs to take
dry lining and insulate floor. it fills all the voids in the
corrugations but it costs.

A U.S. outfit was offering a container lining kit , that appeared
to be some sort of Structural Insulated Panels, pre cut they
simpy loaded rear and side walls in , ceiling lining sat on top
of walls and floor was layed insulation, very fast to do.
Concerned that leaving the corrugation voids unfilled creating a
moisture or damp trap.

Another vid appeared to be using polystyrene bats bonded to the
interior before lning with ply, again concerned creating a load
of sealed voids in the corrugations.

Seen a few online where they have studded the interior and then
filled with rockwool, before ply lining over.It`s lowest cost
but can`t help but feel may get condenstaion on inside of
corrugations soaking the rockwool over time.

Any words from the wise, including just wear the cost and buy an
actual Potacabin?

You would need an effective vapour barrier on the inside of the
insulation to prevent any moist warm air making it to the cold side
- that is what will cause interstitial condensation. (assuming the
outer skin of the container is water tight)




Whether you need a vapour barrier or not depends on whether the
insulation has open or closed cell structure. If it's closed cell
structure, you don't need it.

Only true when all the gaps and joins between insulating boards are also
airtight.

So for example, using foil faced PIR foam would be ok without an
additional vapour barrier if all the joints were foil taped.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Sunday, 22 November 2015 19:44:08 UTC, John Rumm wrote:
On 22/11/2015 17:07, harry wrote:

Whether you need a vapour barrier or not depends on whether the
insulation has open or closed cell structure. If it's closed cell
structure, you don't need it.

Only true when all the gaps and joins between insulating boards are also
airtight.

So for example, using foil faced PIR foam would be ok without an
additional vapour barrier if all the joints were foil taped.

Plastics have a small degree of vapour permeability, and with a steel container there is zero evaporation outward of water vapour. So to work long term in this case would require a very thorough vapour barrier. Masonry breathes vapour outward, steel doesn't.


NT

On 22/11/2015 16:35, John Rumm wrote:
On 22/11/2015 13:12, Adam Aglionby wrote:
Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a
larger uninsulated workshop.

Top option seems to be spray foam interior with studs to take dry
lining and insulate floor. it fills all the voids in the corrugations
but it costs.

A U.S. outfit was offering a container lining kit , that appeared to
be some sort of Structural Insulated Panels, pre cut they simpy
loaded rear and side walls in , ceiling lining sat on top of walls
and floor was layed insulation, very fast to do. Concerned that
leaving the corrugation voids unfilled creating a moisture or damp
trap.

Another vid appeared to be using polystyrene bats bonded to the
interior before lning with ply, again concerned creating a load of
sealed voids in the corrugations.

Seen a few online where they have studded the interior and then
filled with rockwool, before ply lining over.It`s lowest cost but
can`t help but feel may get condenstaion on inside of corrugations
soaking the rockwool over time.

Any words from the wise, including just wear the cost and buy an
actual Potacabin?

You would need an effective vapour barrier on the inside of the
insulation to prevent any moist warm air making it to the cold side -
that is what will cause interstitial condensation. (assuming the outer
skin of the container is water tight)

Without the container being able to breathe, some water vapour is
certain to condense on the container steel walls. In the OP's case I
assume this water will run down the container sides. As long as this can
run out, and the OP doesn't care about rusting issues then I don't see
any problem.

The better the vapour barrier the less interstitial condensation.

Adam Aglionby Wrote in message:
Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a larger uninsulated workshop.

Top option seems to be spray foam interior with studs to take dry lining and insulate floor. it fills all the voids in the corrugations but it costs.

A U.S. outfit was offering a container lining kit , that appeared to be some sort of Structural Insulated Panels, pre cut they simpy loaded rear and side walls in , ceiling lining sat on top of walls and floor was layed insulation, very fast to do. Concerned that leaving the corrugation voids unfilled creating a moisture or damp trap.

Another vid appeared to be using polystyrene bats bonded to the interior before lning with ply, again concerned creating a load of sealed voids in the corrugations.

Seen a few online where they have studded the interior and then filled with rockwool, before ply lining over.It`s lowest cost but can`t help but feel may get condenstaion on inside of corrugations soaking the rockwool over time.

Any words from the wise, including just wear the cost and buy an actual Potacabin?




Normal containers already have small vents but probly not enough
for these purposes.

As it's inside could you buy a cheaper knacker with extra (rusty)
vent holes? Add some more holes to vent as necessary?


Or modify the wall/ floor junction to vent/drain the potential
trap points?

Install an extractor fan to deal with vapour before it gets chance
to get to the steel?

Will it have a window in this office?

--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

On Sunday, 22 November 2015 13:12:50 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a larger uninsulated workshop.

Top option seems to be spray foam interior with studs to take dry lining and insulate floor. it fills all the voids in the corrugations but it costs..

A U.S. outfit was offering a container lining kit , that appeared to be some sort of Structural Insulated Panels, pre cut they simpy loaded rear and side walls in , ceiling lining sat on top of walls and floor was layed insulation, very fast to do. Concerned that leaving the corrugation voids unfilled creating a moisture or damp trap.

Another vid appeared to be using polystyrene bats bonded to the interior before lning with ply, again concerned creating a load of sealed voids in the corrugations.

Seen a few online where they have studded the interior and then filled with rockwool, before ply lining over.It`s lowest cost but can`t help but feel may get condenstaion on inside of corrugations soaking the rockwool over time.

Any words from the wise, including just wear the cost and buy an actual Potacabin?

As its a building within a building, how about teaming u with the poster in the other thread and building the office out of polystyrene boxes!


NT

On Sunday, November 22, 2015 at 11:07:50 PM UTC, jim wrote:
Adam Aglionby Wrote in message:
Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a larger uninsulated workshop.

Top option seems to be spray foam interior with studs to take dry lining and insulate floor. it fills all the voids in the corrugations but it costs.

A U.S. outfit was offering a container lining kit , that appeared to be some sort of Structural Insulated Panels, pre cut they simpy loaded rear and side walls in , ceiling lining sat on top of walls and floor was layed insulation, very fast to do. Concerned that leaving the corrugation voids unfilled creating a moisture or damp trap.

Another vid appeared to be using polystyrene bats bonded to the interior before lning with ply, again concerned creating a load of sealed voids in the corrugations.

Seen a few online where they have studded the interior and then filled with rockwool, before ply lining over.It`s lowest cost but can`t help but feel may get condenstaion on inside of corrugations soaking the rockwool over time.

Any words from the wise, including just wear the cost and buy an actual Potacabin?




Normal containers already have small vents but probly not enough
for these purposes.

Vents and calcium chloride dryer sticks are how they get through their working life apparently.

Probably good enough for plain storage, but not as a comfortable climate to keyboard bash in.


As it's inside could you buy a cheaper knacker with extra (rusty)
vent holes? Add some more holes to vent as necessary?


TBH like the off mains toilets question, hypothetical but imminent, assesing the merits of more space further away or less closer. Roughly 10K to fit a working flush and forget begins to skew the numbers.

Problem with really knackered containers is bottom floor joists rot out,floor is ply on 6" spaced joists not all metal, lose the structure integrity.

What got me thinking about SIP panels of a form , was this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3qXmP2EEhE

Structural Integrated Panels, new one to me , usually 2 sheets of 11mm OSB with either PIR foam or polystyrene in between, to total of 100mm+ a sheet.

Real SIPs can be used structurally and at 50 quid an 8*4 to double that with actual cerification, possibly something to consider to build whole with and leave out the 2 grand container.

Watching the vid again though, they are using some sort of faced insulation board, possibly metal facedpanel for insulated container bodies, insulated bodies are hens teeth in good condition second hand.

Faced, interior possibly ply or wall cladding, on PIR or polystyrene panel would seem to be ideal candidate, no need for the Structural part of a SIP.

Facing towards the outsidese of the container , foil face of PIR foam?

The method of construction they use appears to leave the voids in the corrugations sealed off though, is this a problem?


Or modify the wall/ floor junction to vent/drain the potential
trap points?

This was where was hoping that container conversion was by now a well understood subject with a lot of the wrinkles sorted out, possibly not.

Cant help but think the insulation must be prone to moisture absorbtion in this one, but recent repy claims not

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tm4oR3rvbA4

Spray PU foam not without its controversy

http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/...oisonous-fumes



Install an extractor fan to deal with vapour before it gets chance
to get to the steel?

That deals with the condensation but not temp stability.

It`s an area of conflicting information, one claims foil face bubble wrap is just the thing to keep damp at bay:

http://www.containersforsale.co.uk/condensation.html

Where as it gets a comprehensive kicking here

http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/...ed-bubble-wrap


Will it have a window in this office?

Have easier access to skilled metal workers than wood, window and person sized door probably on list.


--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

"Jonno" wrote in message ...

Adam Aglionby scribbled


Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a larger
uninsulated workshop.

Top option seems to be spray foam interior with studs to take dry lining
and insulate floor. it fills all the voids in the corrugations but it
costs.

A U.S. outfit was offering a container lining kit , that appeared to be
some sort of Structural Insulated Panels, pre cut they simpy loaded rear
and side walls in , ceiling lining sat on top of walls and floor was
layed insulation, very fast to do. Concerned that leaving the corrugation
voids unfilled creating a moisture or damp
trap.

Another vid appeared to be using polystyrene bats bonded to the interior
before lning with ply, again concerned creating a load of sealed voids in
the corrugations.

Seen a few online where they have studded the interior and then filled
with rockwool, before ply lining over.It`s lowest cost but can`t help but
feel may get condenstaion on inside of corrugations soaking the rockwool
over time.

Any words from the wise, including just wear the cost and buy an actual
Potacabin?


http://www.shippingcontainersuk.com/...containers.php

How the pro's claim they do it.

"Jonno" wrote in message ...

Adam Aglionby scribbled


Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a larger
uninsulated workshop.

Top option seems to be spray foam interior with studs to take dry lining
and insulate floor. it fills all the voids in the corrugations but it
costs.

A U.S. outfit was offering a container lining kit , that appeared to be
some sort of Structural Insulated Panels, pre cut they simpy loaded rear
and side walls in , ceiling lining sat on top of walls and floor was
layed insulation, very fast to do. Concerned that leaving the corrugation
voids unfilled creating a moisture or damp
trap.

Another vid appeared to be using polystyrene bats bonded to the interior
before lning with ply, again concerned creating a load of sealed voids in
the corrugations.

Seen a few online where they have studded the interior and then filled
with rockwool, before ply lining over.It`s lowest cost but can`t help but
feel may get condenstaion on inside of corrugations soaking the rockwool
over time.

Any words from the wise, including just wear the cost and buy an actual
Potacabin?


http://www.shippingcontainersuk.com/...containers.php

How the pro's claim they do it.


--
* I promise I will format my posts properly in the future.
* Windows Live Mail just can't quote! Luckily, I have found this:
* http://www.dusko-lolic.from.hr/wlmquote/"Jonno" wrote in message
...

Adam Aglionby scribbled


Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a larger
uninsulated workshop.

Top option seems to be spray foam interior with studs to take dry lining
and insulate floor. it fills all the voids in the corrugations but it
costs.

A U.S. outfit was offering a container lining kit , that appeared to be
some sort of Structural Insulated Panels, pre cut they simpy loaded rear
and side walls in , ceiling lining sat on top of walls and floor was
layed insulation, very fast to do. Concerned that leaving the corrugation
voids unfilled creating a moisture or damp
trap.

Another vid appeared to be using polystyrene bats bonded to the interior
before lning with ply, again concerned creating a load of sealed voids in
the corrugations.

Seen a few online where they have studded the interior and then filled
with rockwool, before ply lining over.It`s lowest cost but can`t help but
feel may get condenstaion on inside of corrugations soaking the rockwool
over time.

Any words from the wise, including just wear the cost and buy an actual
Potacabin?


http://www.shippingcontainersuk.com/...containers.php

How the pro's claim they do it.


I love the way that they say they use "Rockwool - a naturally occurring
substance, SO THERE IS NO HEALTH RISK". And there was me thinking ASBESTOS
is naturally occurring !!!!


Andrew

"Adam Aglionby" wrote in message
...

On Sunday, November 22, 2015 at 11:07:50 PM UTC, jim wrote:
Adam Aglionby Wrote in message:
Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a larger
uninsulated workshop.

Top option seems to be spray foam interior with studs to take dry
lining and insulate floor. it fills all the voids in the corrugations
but it costs.

A U.S. outfit was offering a container lining kit , that appeared to be
some sort of Structural Insulated Panels, pre cut they simpy loaded
rear and side walls in , ceiling lining sat on top of walls and floor
was layed insulation, very fast to do. Concerned that leaving the
corrugation voids unfilled creating a moisture or damp trap.

Another vid appeared to be using polystyrene bats bonded to the
interior before lning with ply, again concerned creating a load of
sealed voids in the corrugations.

Seen a few online where they have studded the interior and then filled
with rockwool, before ply lining over.It`s lowest cost but can`t help
but feel may get condenstaion on inside of corrugations soaking the
rockwool over time.

Any words from the wise, including just wear the cost and buy an actual
Potacabin?




Normal containers already have small vents but probly not enough
for these purposes.

Vents and calcium chloride dryer sticks are how they get through their
working life apparently.

Probably good enough for plain storage, but not as a comfortable climate to
keyboard bash in.


As it's inside could you buy a cheaper knacker with extra (rusty)
vent holes? Add some more holes to vent as necessary?


TBH like the off mains toilets question, hypothetical but imminent,
assesing the merits of more space further away or less closer. Roughly 10K
to fit a working flush and forget begins to skew the numbers.

Problem with really knackered containers is bottom floor joists rot
out,floor is ply on 6" spaced joists not all metal, lose the structure
integrity.

What got me thinking about SIP panels of a form , was this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3qXmP2EEhE

Structural Integrated Panels, new one to me , usually 2 sheets of 11mm OSB
with either PIR foam or polystyrene in between, to total of 100mm+ a sheet.

Real SIPs can be used structurally and at 50 quid an 8*4 to double that
with actual cerification, possibly something to consider to build whole
with and leave out the 2 grand container.

Watching the vid again though, they are using some sort of faced insulation
board, possibly metal facedpanel for insulated container bodies, insulated
bodies are hens teeth in good condition second hand.

Faced, interior possibly ply or wall cladding, on PIR or polystyrene panel
would seem to be ideal candidate, no need for the Structural part of a SIP.

Facing towards the outsidese of the container , foil face of PIR foam?

The method of construction they use appears to leave the voids in the
corrugations sealed off though, is this a problem?


Or modify the wall/ floor junction to vent/drain the potential
trap points?

This was where was hoping that container conversion was by now a well
understood subject with a lot of the wrinkles sorted out, possibly not.

Cant help but think the insulation must be prone to moisture absorbtion in
this one, but recent repy claims not

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tm4oR3rvbA4

Spray PU foam not without its controversy

http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/...oisonous-fumes



Install an extractor fan to deal with vapour before it gets chance
to get to the steel?

That deals with the condensation but not temp stability.

It`s an area of conflicting information, one claims foil face bubble wrap
is just the thing to keep damp at bay:

http://www.containersforsale.co.uk/condensation.html

Where as it gets a comprehensive kicking here

http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/...ed-bubble-wrap


Will it have a window in this office?

Have easier access to skilled metal workers than wood, window and person
sized door probably on list.


--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/


Why not buy a refrigerated container - they are already insulated and must
overcome the trapped moisture issue or they'd end up as a block of ice.

Andrew

Andrew Mawson wrote:
Why not buy a refrigerated container - they are already insulated and
must overcome the trapped moisture issue or they'd end up as a block
of ice.

Replace the reefer's refrigeration unit by a dual mode air condtioner?
Allows winter warming/summer cooling, and avoids the need for extra
ventilation or windows.

They do usually come with units which can be used to heat the trailer to
stop contents freezing on winter trips but I assume the staff wouldn't
fancy a steady 3 degrees

--
Robin
reply to address is (meant to be) valid

On 23/11/15 08:26, Andrew Mawson wrote:

Why not buy a refrigerated container - they are already insulated and
must overcome the trapped moisture issue or they'd end up as a block of
ice.

Andrew

There's a storage place at Johns Cross (up the road from you) that uses
these for their on site storage.

Metal skinned inside with about 70-100mm insulation. Floor is already
lined with ply.

These could be further lined with ply for comfort.

I could pass the OP their number if he wnats to ring them to see where
they source them from.

"Tim Watts" wrote in message ...

On 23/11/15 08:26, Andrew Mawson wrote:

Why not buy a refrigerated container - they are already insulated and
must overcome the trapped moisture issue or they'd end up as a block of
ice.

Andrew

There's a storage place at Johns Cross (up the road from you) that uses
these for their on site storage.

Metal skinned inside with about 70-100mm insulation. Floor is already lined
with ply.

These could be further lined with ply for comfort.

I could pass the OP their number if he wnats to ring them to see where they
source them from.


I enquired of them when I wanted to store my worldly goods during our house
refurb, but ended up buying a 40 foot hi-cube as I had to room for it.

Andrew

On Monday, 23 November 2015 08:22:29 UTC, Andrew Mawson wrote:
"Jonno" wrote in message ...
Adam Aglionby scribbled

http://www.shippingcontainersuk.com/...containers.php

How the pro's claim they do it.

I love the way that they say they use "Rockwool - a naturally occurring
substance, SO THERE IS NO HEALTH RISK". And there was me thinking ASBESTOS
is naturally occurring !!!!

no VB whatever there! Black mould will love it.


NT

On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 1:46:50 PM UTC, wrote:
On Monday, 23 November 2015 08:22:29 UTC, Andrew Mawson wrote:
"Jonno" wrote in message ...
Adam Aglionby scribbled

http://www.shippingcontainersuk.com/...containers.php

How the pro's claim they do it.

I love the way that they say they use "Rockwool - a naturally occurring
substance, SO THERE IS NO HEALTH RISK". And there was me thinking ASBESTOS
is naturally occurring !!!!

no VB whatever there! Black mould will love it.


That`s what has struck me, but would you put a vapour barrier between insulation and outer walls or is the inner space supposed to be sealed?




NT

On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 9:47:48 AM UTC, Tim Watts wrote:
On 23/11/15 08:26, Andrew Mawson wrote:

Why not buy a refrigerated container - they are already insulated and
must overcome the trapped moisture issue or they'd end up as a block of
ice.

Andrew

There's a storage place at Johns Cross (up the road from you) that uses
these for their on site storage.

Metal skinned inside with about 70-100mm insulation. Floor is already
lined with ply.

These could be further lined with ply for comfort.

I could pass the OP their number if he wnats to ring them to see where
they source them from.

Appreciate the thought, but in my investigations there is no end of people trying to sell or lease containers for storage in various forms.

Anti condensation paint on the roof and lock box appears to be the the minimal fit out.

Local Gumtree has several farmers growing container storage in the yard as sideline.

On Tuesday, 24 November 2015 13:35:39 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 1:46:50 PM UTC, wrote:
On Monday, 23 November 2015 08:22:29 UTC, Andrew Mawson wrote:
"Jonno" wrote in message ...
Adam Aglionby scribbled

http://www.shippingcontainersuk.com/...containers.php

How the pro's claim they do it.

no VB whatever there! Black mould will love it.

That`s what has struck me, but would you put a vapour barrier between insulation and outer walls or is the inner space supposed to be sealed?

VB needs to be on the warm side of the insulation


NT

On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 3:41:21 AM UTC, wrote:
On Tuesday, 24 November 2015 13:35:39 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 1:46:50 PM UTC, wrote:
On Monday, 23 November 2015 08:22:29 UTC, Andrew Mawson wrote:
"Jonno" wrote in message ....
Adam Aglionby scribbled

http://www.shippingcontainersuk.com/...containers.php

How the pro's claim they do it.

no VB whatever there! Black mould will love it.

That`s what has struck me, but would you put a vapour barrier between insulation and outer walls or is the inner space supposed to be sealed?

VB needs to be on the warm side of the insulation


NT

Thanks!

That`s what I thought, though there is a least one tube vid of someone framing interior of container , then conscientiously stapling VB to the studs before lining with rockwool.

Would have thought that this puts the vapour barrier on the cold side and actually likely to condensate?

It seems that insulation is very much the new snake oil. Theres the radiant barriers , the radiant barrier bubble wrap , the `who cares about trapped condensation you`ll be gone by the time that shows` container insulators and outstanding is the insulative ceramic paint `endorsed` by NASA.

On the original question, reefers , or specifically non-operational reefers, fridge containers, aren`t as rare as thought but tend to have lost a lot of space to redundant fridge plant, which then needs sealed up on conversion, leave out the bit about venting the refrigerant....

At moment top option appears to be ex truck insulated body, about same cost complete as insulation material alone for a container.

On Wednesday, 25 November 2015 12:30:32 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 3:41:21 AM UTC, nt wrote:
On Tuesday, 24 November 2015 13:35:39 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 1:46:50 PM UTC, nt wrote:
On Monday, 23 November 2015 08:22:29 UTC, Andrew Mawson wrote:
"Jonno" wrote in message ...
Adam Aglionby scribbled

http://www.shippingcontainersuk.com/...containers.php

How the pro's claim they do it.

no VB whatever there! Black mould will love it.

That`s what has struck me, but would you put a vapour barrier between insulation and outer walls or is the inner space supposed to be sealed?

VB needs to be on the warm side of the insulation

Thanks!

That`s what I thought, though there is a least one tube vid of someone framing interior of container , then conscientiously stapling VB to the studs before lining with rockwool.

Would have thought that this puts the vapour barrier on the cold side and actually likely to condensate?

yup

It seems that insulation is very much the new snake oil. Theres the radiant barriers , the radiant barrier bubble wrap , the `who cares about trapped condensation you`ll be gone by the time that shows` container insulators and outstanding is the insulative ceramic paint `endorsed` by NASA.

At moment top option appears to be ex truck insulated body, about same cost complete as insulation material alone for a container.

where on earth are you buying insulation.


NT

On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 1:21:31 PM UTC, wrote:
On Wednesday, 25 November 2015 12:30:32 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 3:41:21 AM UTC, nt wrote:
On Tuesday, 24 November 2015 13:35:39 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 1:46:50 PM UTC, nt wrote:
On Monday, 23 November 2015 08:22:29 UTC, Andrew Mawson wrote:
"Jonno" wrote in message ...
Adam Aglionby scribbled

http://www.shippingcontainersuk.com/...containers.php

How the pro's claim they do it.

no VB whatever there! Black mould will love it.

That`s what has struck me, but would you put a vapour barrier between insulation and outer walls or is the inner space supposed to be sealed?

VB needs to be on the warm side of the insulation

Thanks!

That`s what I thought, though there is a least one tube vid of someone framing interior of container , then conscientiously stapling VB to the studs before lining with rockwool.

Would have thought that this puts the vapour barrier on the cold side and actually likely to condensate?

yup

It seems that insulation is very much the new snake oil. Theres the radiant barriers , the radiant barrier bubble wrap , the `who cares about trapped condensation you`ll be gone by the time that shows` container insulators and outstanding is the insulative ceramic paint `endorsed` by NASA.

At moment top option appears to be ex truck insulated body, about same cost complete as insulation material alone for a container.

where on earth are you buying insulation.

Take a ex supermarket insulated bidy assume 40`

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/insulated-...-/161873238302

1k +VAT & Delivery

40ft conatiner going to need 30+ 8 x4 at 75mm leaving out insualting floor, plus framing, pallet of seconds at that thickness 639 + VAT + framing timber + container to frame.

http://www.secondsandco.co.uk/#!special-offers/c20fs


NT

On Wednesday, 25 November 2015 13:45:23 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 1:21:31 PM UTC, nt wrote:
On Wednesday, 25 November 2015 12:30:32 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 3:41:21 AM UTC, nt wrote:
On Tuesday, 24 November 2015 13:35:39 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 1:46:50 PM UTC, nt wrote:
On Monday, 23 November 2015 08:22:29 UTC, Andrew Mawson wrote:
"Jonno" wrote in message ...
Adam Aglionby scribbled

http://www.shippingcontainersuk.com/...containers.php

How the pro's claim they do it.

no VB whatever there! Black mould will love it.

That`s what has struck me, but would you put a vapour barrier between insulation and outer walls or is the inner space supposed to be sealed?

VB needs to be on the warm side of the insulation

Thanks!

That`s what I thought, though there is a least one tube vid of someone framing interior of container , then conscientiously stapling VB to the studs before lining with rockwool.

Would have thought that this puts the vapour barrier on the cold side and actually likely to condensate?

yup

It seems that insulation is very much the new snake oil. Theres the radiant barriers , the radiant barrier bubble wrap , the `who cares about trapped condensation you`ll be gone by the time that shows` container insulators and outstanding is the insulative ceramic paint `endorsed` by NASA.

At moment top option appears to be ex truck insulated body, about same cost complete as insulation material alone for a container.

where on earth are you buying insulation.

Take a ex supermarket insulated bidy assume 40`

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/insulated-...-/161873238302

1k +VAT & Delivery

40ft conatiner going to need 30+ 8 x4 at 75mm leaving out insualting floor, plus framing, pallet of seconds at that thickness 639 + VAT + framing timber + container to frame.

http://www.secondsandco.co.uk/#!special-offers/c20fs

they have kinspan at £120/pallet, and kingspan is way OTT, and if you use it you dont need framing.


NT

On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 4:21:11 PM UTC, wrote:
On Wednesday, 25 November 2015 13:45:23 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 1:21:31 PM UTC, nt wrote:
On Wednesday, 25 November 2015 12:30:32 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 3:41:21 AM UTC, nt wrote:
On Tuesday, 24 November 2015 13:35:39 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 1:46:50 PM UTC, nt wrote:
On Monday, 23 November 2015 08:22:29 UTC, Andrew Mawson wrote:
"Jonno" wrote in message ...
Adam Aglionby scribbled

http://www.shippingcontainersuk.com/...containers.php

How the pro's claim they do it.

no VB whatever there! Black mould will love it.

That`s what has struck me, but would you put a vapour barrier between insulation and outer walls or is the inner space supposed to be sealed?

VB needs to be on the warm side of the insulation

Thanks!

That`s what I thought, though there is a least one tube vid of someone framing interior of container , then conscientiously stapling VB to the studs before lining with rockwool.

Would have thought that this puts the vapour barrier on the cold side and actually likely to condensate?

yup

It seems that insulation is very much the new snake oil. Theres the radiant barriers , the radiant barrier bubble wrap , the `who cares about trapped condensation you`ll be gone by the time that shows` container insulators and outstanding is the insulative ceramic paint `endorsed` by NASA.

At moment top option appears to be ex truck insulated body, about same cost complete as insulation material alone for a container.

where on earth are you buying insulation.

Take a ex supermarket insulated bidy assume 40`

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/insulated-...-/161873238302

1k +VAT & Delivery

40ft conatiner going to need 30+ 8 x4 at 75mm leaving out insualting floor, plus framing, pallet of seconds at that thickness 639 + VAT + framing timber + container to frame.

http://www.secondsandco.co.uk/#!special-offers/c20fs

they have kinspan at £120/pallet, and kingspan is way OTT, and if you use it you dont need framing.


Not that great a bargain , pallet of 10 @ 120 * 4= 480 +VAT but they are random +/- 10mm thickness variants and warped , need some framing to bring them into line ;-)


NT

On Wednesday, 25 November 2015 19:47:36 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 4:21:11 PM UTC, nt wrote:

http://www.secondsandco.co.uk/#!special-offers/c20fs

they have kinspan at £120/pallet, and kingspan is way OTT, and if you use it you dont need framing.


Not that great a bargain , pallet of 10 @ 120 * 4= 480 +VAT

what does that mean?

but they are random +/- 10mm thickness variants and warped , need some framing to bring them into line ;-)

or just slice to flatten & glue. Yes it's crude, but you wanted cheap. Loft insulation roll would surely be cheaper, or frameless polystyrene.


NT

On Thursday, November 26, 2015 at 1:26:26 AM UTC, wrote:
On Wednesday, 25 November 2015 19:47:36 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 4:21:11 PM UTC, nt wrote:

http://www.secondsandco.co.uk/#!special-offers/c20fs

they have kinspan at £120/pallet, and kingspan is way OTT, and if you use it you dont need framing.


Not that great a bargain , pallet of 10 @ 120 * 4= 480 +VAT

what does that mean?

Compared against a pallet lot of 36 boards at 639 , need 4 pallets which works out at nearkly 160 quid cheaper but...


but they are random +/- 10mm thickness variants and warped , need some framing to bring them into line ;-)

or just slice to flatten & glue. Yes it's crude, but you wanted cheap. Loft insulation roll would surely be cheaper, or frameless polystyrene.

Its warped,and its random thickness, if the void your needing to insulate is over 100mm deep , it might kick into the space, but it will leave gaps, it won`t flatten in any meaningful manner.

Insulation roll , needs a vapour barrier somewhere and not convinced it dosen`t eventually end up as a sponge.

Polystyrene in FR grade dosen`t become cheap.

Didn`t say cheap was highest priority but 40` wind and watertight steel container running from around the 1500 quid mark, spending a grand to insulate it simply dosent make sense,site office with the insulation windows and door runs from around 3K.

What have learned so far is container conversions are trendy not cost saving, may also have something to do with being temporary buildings getting around some planning restrictions...

Scratch build from SIPs begins to look a possibilty.



NT

On Thursday, 26 November 2015 03:10:39 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Thursday, November 26, 2015 at 1:26:26 AM UTC, wrote:
On Wednesday, 25 November 2015 19:47:36 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 4:21:11 PM UTC, nt wrote:

http://www.secondsandco.co.uk/#!special-offers/c20fs

they have kinspan at £120/pallet, and kingspan is way OTT, and if you use it you dont need framing.


Not that great a bargain , pallet of 10 @ 120 * 4= 480 +VAT

what does that mean?

Compared against a pallet lot of 36 boards at 639 , need 4 pallets which works out at nearkly 160 quid cheaper but...

it's the size that's unclear. 12.2x4, what does that mean

but they are random +/- 10mm thickness variants and warped , need some framing to bring them into line ;-)

or just slice to flatten & glue. Yes it's crude, but you wanted cheap. Loft insulation roll would surely be cheaper, or frameless polystyrene.

Its warped,and its random thickness, if the void your needing to insulate is over 100mm deep , it might kick into the space, but it will leave gaps, it won`t flatten in any meaningful manner.

I did just address how to do that

Insulation roll , needs a vapour barrier somewhere

all insulation does. It's what al foil's for.

and not convinced it dosen`t eventually end up as a sponge.

whether insulation waterlogs depends on the VB

Polystyrene in FR grade dosen`t become cheap.

PB is the fire barrier

Didn`t say cheap was highest priority but 40` wind and watertight steel container running from around the 1500 quid mark, spending a grand to insulate it simply dosent make sense,site office with the insulation windows and door runs from around 3K.

What have learned so far is container conversions are trendy not cost saving, may also have something to do with being temporary buildings getting around some planning restrictions...

Scratch build from SIPs begins to look a possibilty.

What would it cost to build it out of polystyrene & render?


NT

"Adam Aglionby" wrote in message
...

Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a larger
uninsulated workshop.

OTTOMH

Shipping containers are primarily designed for carrying
material. Which makes them equally suitable for storage
but not for providing an equable environment for people.
More especially if those people are seated at a desk.

Simple respiration, people breathing in and out produces
a lot of condensation. The standard ventilation found in
some shipping containers is presumably to allow for damp
goods or materials at the time of loading, not for
condenstion being produced all the time.

So extra ventilation would be a must.

Shipping container doors go top to bottom and would allow
lots of heat to escape in use unless a second skin and door
was fitted inside the back. With one permanent door left
open al the time.

Shipping containers don't have windows, and without these
being fitted, could be an oppressive working environment.

Shipping containers are ply lined presumably for similar reasons
as are some vans, transits, trailers etc. Presumably to protect
the goods anfd facilitate loading and unloading rather than
insulation.

In such situations s/h portacabins, old caravans, and
sectional wooden sheds/workshops are all possible
solutions.


michael adams

....

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 09:34:39 +0000, michael adams wrote:

Shipping containers are ply lined

Not all are.

"Adrian" wrote in message ...
On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 09:34:39 +0000, michael adams wrote:

Shipping containers are ply lined



Not all are.

I never said they were.

Here's what I actually wrote, with the part you snipped, re-instated.

" Shipping containers are ply lined presumably for similar reasons
as are some vans, transits, trailers etc.

Thus -

People carry umbrellas presumably for the same reason others wear waterproof
clothing.

Doesn't imply that all people carry umbrellas; but only applies to those who do.

Similarly with containers.

Had I instead written that " Some shipping containers are ply lined presumably for
similar reasons
as are some vans, transits, trailers etc.

This could have been taken to imply that there were other shipping containers which are
ply
lined for other reasons.

michael adams


....

On 26/11/15 09:34, michael adams wrote:
"Adam Aglionby" wrote in message
...

Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a larger
uninsulated workshop.

OTTOMH

Shipping containers are primarily designed for carrying
material. Which makes them equally suitable for storage
but not for providing an equable environment for people.
More especially if those people are seated at a desk.

Simple respiration, people breathing in and out produces
a lot of condensation. The standard ventilation found in
some shipping containers is presumably to allow for damp
goods or materials at the time of loading, not for
condenstion being produced all the time.

So extra ventilation would be a must.

Shipping container doors go top to bottom and would allow
lots of heat to escape in use unless a second skin and door
was fitted inside the back. With one permanent door left
open al the time.

Shipping containers don't have windows, and without these
being fitted, could be an oppressive working environment.

Shipping containers are ply lined presumably for similar reasons
as are some vans, transits, trailers etc. Presumably to protect
the goods anfd facilitate loading and unloading rather than
insulation.


Indeed - but they can be adapted.

In London, you see towers (2, sometimes 3 levels high) of shipping
containers on building sites sometimes. Some are storage, but there are
loos and canteens and surveyors' offices - these have windows and
personal doors fitted, but are otherwise containers. I suspect they are
quite habitable inside - they look, through the windows, like they've
been fitted out with standard modular office stuff - sheet wall panels,
trunking, lights and power.

"Tim Watts" wrote in message
...
On 26/11/15 09:34, michael adams wrote:
"Adam Aglionby" wrote in message
...

Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a larger
uninsulated workshop.

OTTOMH

Shipping containers are primarily designed for carrying
material. Which makes them equally suitable for storage
but not for providing an equable environment for people.
More especially if those people are seated at a desk.

Simple respiration, people breathing in and out produces
a lot of condensation. The standard ventilation found in
some shipping containers is presumably to allow for damp
goods or materials at the time of loading, not for
condenstion being produced all the time.

So extra ventilation would be a must.

Shipping container doors go top to bottom and would allow
lots of heat to escape in use unless a second skin and door
was fitted inside the back. With one permanent door left
open al the time.

Shipping containers don't have windows, and without these
being fitted, could be an oppressive working environment.

Shipping containers are ply lined presumably for similar reasons
as are some vans, transits, trailers etc. Presumably to protect
the goods anfd facilitate loading and unloading rather than
insulation.


Indeed - but they can be adapted.

In London, you see towers (2, sometimes 3 levels high) of shipping containers on
building sites sometimes. Some are storage, but there are loos and canteens and
surveyors' offices - these have windows and personal doors fitted, but are otherwise
containers. I suspect they are quite habitable inside - they look, through the windows,
like they've been fitted out with standard modular office stuff - sheet wall panels,
trunking, lights and power.

Indeed. They can be adapted at a cost. And probably have the advantage
over portakabins of being rather more robust, especially if they're
going to be moved around from site to site, and usually out of doors.
All of which in the OP's situation would be rather expensive
overkill IMO.


michael adams

....

On 26/11/15 11:18, michael adams wrote:
"Tim Watts" wrote in message
...
On 26/11/15 09:34, michael adams wrote:
"Adam Aglionby" wrote in message
...

Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a larger
uninsulated workshop.

OTTOMH

Shipping containers are primarily designed for carrying
material. Which makes them equally suitable for storage
but not for providing an equable environment for people.
More especially if those people are seated at a desk.

Simple respiration, people breathing in and out produces
a lot of condensation. The standard ventilation found in
some shipping containers is presumably to allow for damp
goods or materials at the time of loading, not for
condenstion being produced all the time.

So extra ventilation would be a must.

Shipping container doors go top to bottom and would allow
lots of heat to escape in use unless a second skin and door
was fitted inside the back. With one permanent door left
open al the time.

Shipping containers don't have windows, and without these
being fitted, could be an oppressive working environment.

Shipping containers are ply lined presumably for similar reasons
as are some vans, transits, trailers etc. Presumably to protect
the goods anfd facilitate loading and unloading rather than
insulation.


Indeed - but they can be adapted.

In London, you see towers (2, sometimes 3 levels high) of shipping containers on
building sites sometimes. Some are storage, but there are loos and canteens and
surveyors' offices - these have windows and personal doors fitted, but are otherwise
containers. I suspect they are quite habitable inside - they look, through the windows,
like they've been fitted out with standard modular office stuff - sheet wall panels,
trunking, lights and power.

Indeed. They can be adapted at a cost. And probably have the advantage
over portakabins of being rather more robust, especially if they're
going to be moved around from site to site, and usually out of doors.
All of which in the OP's situation would be rather expensive
overkill IMO.

I was just wondering if the OP could adapt them? Angle grinder and fit a
uPVC window....

There, said "angle grinder" in a legitimate context!

"Tim Watts" wrote in message
...
On 26/11/15 11:18, michael adams wrote:
"Tim Watts" wrote in message
...
On 26/11/15 09:34, michael adams wrote:
"Adam Aglionby" wrote in message
...

Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a larger
uninsulated workshop.

OTTOMH

Shipping containers are primarily designed for carrying
material. Which makes them equally suitable for storage
but not for providing an equable environment for people.
More especially if those people are seated at a desk.

Simple respiration, people breathing in and out produces
a lot of condensation. The standard ventilation found in
some shipping containers is presumably to allow for damp
goods or materials at the time of loading, not for
condenstion being produced all the time.

So extra ventilation would be a must.

Shipping container doors go top to bottom and would allow
lots of heat to escape in use unless a second skin and door
was fitted inside the back. With one permanent door left
open al the time.

Shipping containers don't have windows, and without these
being fitted, could be an oppressive working environment.

Shipping containers are ply lined presumably for similar reasons
as are some vans, transits, trailers etc. Presumably to protect
the goods anfd facilitate loading and unloading rather than
insulation.


Indeed - but they can be adapted.

In London, you see towers (2, sometimes 3 levels high) of shipping containers on
building sites sometimes. Some are storage, but there are loos and canteens and
surveyors' offices - these have windows and personal doors fitted, but are otherwise
containers. I suspect they are quite habitable inside - they look, through the
windows,
like they've been fitted out with standard modular office stuff - sheet wall panels,
trunking, lights and power.

Indeed. They can be adapted at a cost. And probably have the advantage
over portakabins of being rather more robust, especially if they're
going to be moved around from site to site, and usually out of doors.
All of which in the OP's situation would be rather expensive
overkill IMO.

I was just wondering if the OP could adapt them? Angle grinder and fit a uPVC
window....

The main problem, and costs will probably arise from trying to strike a
balance between insulation and ventilation. The need to both maintain the
desired temperature inside, while providing sufficient fresh air for the
occupants to breathe. Aqualungs might offer one solution but then there's
the problem of their bashing the cylinders on the corners of filing
cabinets etc.


michael adams

....

On Thursday, November 26, 2015 at 4:46:38 AM UTC, wrote:
On Thursday, 26 November 2015 03:10:39 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Thursday, November 26, 2015 at 1:26:26 AM UTC, wrote:
On Wednesday, 25 November 2015 19:47:36 UTC, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 4:21:11 PM UTC, nt wrote:

http://www.secondsandco.co.uk/#!special-offers/c20fs

they have kinspan at £120/pallet, and kingspan is way OTT, and if you use it you dont need framing.


Not that great a bargain , pallet of 10 @ 120 * 4= 480 +VAT

what does that mean?

Compared against a pallet lot of 36 boards at 639 , need 4 pallets which works out at nearkly 160 quid cheaper but...

it's the size that's unclear. 12.2x4, what does that mean

Guess they are full width 1220 but run from 2000 -2400 length , probably damaged ends cut off.

All it indicates is a lot of wastage and spray can foam trying to correct, bargain kinda vanishes.


but they are random +/- 10mm thickness variants and warped , need some framing to bring them into line ;-)

or just slice to flatten & glue. Yes it's crude, but you wanted cheap.. Loft insulation roll would surely be cheaper, or frameless polystyrene.

Its warped,and its random thickness, if the void your needing to insulate is over 100mm deep , it might kick into the space, but it will leave gaps, it won`t flatten in any meaningful manner.

I did just address how to do that

Insulation roll , needs a vapour barrier somewhere

all insulation does. It's what al foil's for.

Until let a gap in somewhere, which needs good fitting panels...


and not convinced it dosen`t eventually end up as a sponge.

whether insulation waterlogs depends on the VB

Seen barn insulation kits that appear to be duvet style bagged insulation roll, its either keep it dry or let it breathe as far can understand.


Polystyrene in FR grade dosen`t become cheap.

PB is the fire barrier

Some SIPs are polystyrene cored, suppose FR retardence is on a par with PIR foam.

Didn`t say cheap was highest priority but 40` wind and watertight steel container running from around the 1500 quid mark, spending a grand to insulate it simply dosent make sense,site office with the insulation windows and door runs from around 3K.

What have learned so far is container conversions are trendy not cost saving, may also have something to do with being temporary buildings getting around some planning restrictions...

Scratch build from SIPs begins to look a possibilty.

What would it cost to build it out of polystyrene & render?

Beko Bloc or similar , good and fast but not cheap unfortunately.



NT

On 26/11/15 12:47, michael adams wrote:

The main problem, and costs will probably arise from trying to strike a
balance between insulation and ventilation. The need to both maintain the
desired temperature inside, while providing sufficient fresh air for the
occupants to breathe. Aqualungs might offer one solution but then there's
the problem of their bashing the cylinders on the corners of filing
cabinets etc.

But that is not a problem peculiar to containers

On 2015-11-26, Tim Watts wrote:

On 26/11/15 12:47, michael adams wrote:

The main problem, and costs will probably arise from trying to strike a
balance between insulation and ventilation. The need to both maintain the
desired temperature inside, while providing sufficient fresh air for the
occupants to breathe. Aqualungs might offer one solution but then there's
the problem of their bashing the cylinders on the corners of filing
cabinets etc.

But that is not a problem peculiar to containers

Your workplace must be interesting. ;-)

On Thursday, November 26, 2015 at 12:32:40 PM UTC, Tim Watts wrote:
On 26/11/15 11:18, michael adams wrote:
"Tim Watts" wrote in message
...
On 26/11/15 09:34, michael adams wrote:
"Adam Aglionby" wrote in message
...

Looking at container conversion as option for office space in a larger
uninsulated workshop.

OTTOMH

Shipping containers are primarily designed for carrying
material. Which makes them equally suitable for storage
but not for providing an equable environment for people.
More especially if those people are seated at a desk.

Simple respiration, people breathing in and out produces
a lot of condensation. The standard ventilation found in
some shipping containers is presumably to allow for damp
goods or materials at the time of loading, not for
condenstion being produced all the time.

So extra ventilation would be a must.

Shipping container doors go top to bottom and would allow
lots of heat to escape in use unless a second skin and door
was fitted inside the back. With one permanent door left
open al the time.

Shipping containers don't have windows, and without these
being fitted, could be an oppressive working environment.

Shipping containers are ply lined presumably for similar reasons
as are some vans, transits, trailers etc. Presumably to protect
the goods anfd facilitate loading and unloading rather than
insulation.


Indeed - but they can be adapted.

In London, you see towers (2, sometimes 3 levels high) of shipping containers on
building sites sometimes. Some are storage, but there are loos and canteens and
surveyors' offices - these have windows and personal doors fitted, but are otherwise
containers. I suspect they are quite habitable inside - they look, through the windows,
like they've been fitted out with standard modular office stuff - sheet wall panels,
trunking, lights and power.

Indeed. They can be adapted at a cost. And probably have the advantage
over portakabins of being rather more robust, especially if they're
going to be moved around from site to site, and usually out of doors.
All of which in the OP's situation would be rather expensive
overkill IMO.

I was just wondering if the OP could adapt them? Angle grinder and fit a
uPVC window....

There, said "angle grinder" in a legitimate context!

Thats where the thought started, cheap container , some s/h DG units, few lengths of angle iron, some insulation....

Most container conversion outfits advertise absolutely everything apart from shop conversions, wonder if that`s to do with the slime balls at Box Mall`s claim that they have a patent on the idea.

Travelodge Uxbridge was built dfrom container modules and there is the slightly ludicrous Snoozebox rolling around.

Steel containers are mainly used against Portacabins for vandal resistance as far as can understand.

Transportability actually adds to the cost and still end up with everything in 8ft wide modules.

Think Michael has hit the problem on the head, ply lining with rockwool works fine for storage, where no one is actually breathing for any length of time,otherwise its a potential mould magnet.

Mebbe need to try the plane breakers, airliner fuselage , just leave the drop down masks in ;-)

"Tim Watts" wrote in message
...
On 26/11/15 12:47, michael adams wrote:

The main problem, and costs will probably arise from trying to strike a
balance between insulation and ventilation. The need to both maintain the
desired temperature inside, while providing sufficient fresh air for the
occupants to breathe. Aqualungs might offer one solution but then there's
the problem of their bashing the cylinders on the corners of filing
cabinets etc.

But that is not a problem peculiar to containers

But in other contexts, there may be no other alternatives.
By providing air conditioning, rather than aqualungs, that is.

There's a world of difference between environments which are
air conditioned so as provide a controlled environment,
or where its impossible to open windows etc. and going
to the expense of adapting shipping containers for a purpose
for which they were clearly never designed. When there
are more economic alternatives.


michael adams

....

On 26/11/15 13:55, Adam Funk wrote:
On 2015-11-26, Tim Watts wrote:

On 26/11/15 12:47, michael adams wrote:

The main problem, and costs will probably arise from trying to strike a
balance between insulation and ventilation. The need to both maintain the
desired temperature inside, while providing sufficient fresh air for the
occupants to breathe. Aqualungs might offer one solution but then there's
the problem of their bashing the cylinders on the corners of filing
cabinets etc.

But that is not a problem peculiar to containers

Your workplace must be interesting. ;-)


Indeed. We have heating. And windows to open when the heating is too
hot. We could put the aircon instead, but I'm not convinced it works!

(Before any smart Alec says "turn the rads down" - our options there are
limited and the Asbestos signs scare us from fiddling too much...