We're having a fairly major redecorating push ATM. I have always bought
paint from our local old fashioned iron monger, who stocks Dulux, and
mixes colours on demand. Wifey bought a 5L tin and said to me how
expensive it is, at nearly 39 pounds a tin, or 22 pounds for 2.5L. Just
checked the B&Q site, where 5L is 38.99 and 2.5L 24 pounds.

No point to message other than support your local shop wherever
possible. Yes, we could probably buy the paint cheaper with a little
shopping around, but we're nearly 50 miles from any major town, so have
to factor in fuel costs and time.
--
Graeme

News wrote:

a 5L tin [...] at nearly 39 pounds

Whilst wielding a paintbrush and a 1 litre tin of woodstain that cost
£14, I wondered what is it that makes paints so expensive?

On 05/09/2014 09:17, Andy Burns wrote:
News wrote:

a 5L tin [...] at nearly 39 pounds

Whilst wielding a paintbrush and a 1 litre tin of woodstain that cost
£14, I wondered what is it that makes paints so expensive?


Well there was that TiO2 price rise a while back...

Lee wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

what is it that makes paints so expensive?

Well there was that TiO2 price rise a while back...

Is that used in all paint, or just white? This was black ash woodstain ...

Which reminds me, why IS paint so expensive these days. what critical
ingredient is worth this sum?
Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
"News" wrote in message
...

We're having a fairly major redecorating push ATM. I have always bought
paint from our local old fashioned iron monger, who stocks Dulux, and
mixes colours on demand. Wifey bought a 5L tin and said to me how
expensive it is, at nearly 39 pounds a tin, or 22 pounds for 2.5L. Just
checked the B&Q site, where 5L is 38.99 and 2.5L 24 pounds.

No point to message other than support your local shop wherever possible.
Yes, we could probably buy the paint cheaper with a little shopping
around, but we're nearly 50 miles from any major town, so have to factor
in fuel costs and time.
--
Graeme

On 05/09/2014 10:32, Andy Burns wrote:
Lee wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

what is it that makes paints so expensive?

Well there was that TiO2 price rise a while back...

Is that used in all paint, or just white? This was black ash woodstain ...



Here's some blurb from one woodstain manufacturer, "..contains
nano-particle sized, transparent, titanium dioxide as a sunscreen to
prevent ultraviolet light damage to the wood.."

So seems like there is at least one that does

On Friday, 5 September 2014 10:43:38 UTC+1, Lee wrote:
On 05/09/2014 10:32, Andy Burns wrote:

Lee wrote:



Andy Burns wrote:



what is it that makes paints so expensive?



Well there was that TiO2 price rise a while back...



Is that used in all paint, or just white? This was black ash woodstain ...







Here's some blurb from one woodstain manufacturer, "..contains
nano-particle sized, transparent, titanium dioxide as a sunscreen to
prevent ultraviolet light damage to the wood.."

titanium dioxide is also used in cake making ...
http://food.thefuntimesguide.com/200...um_dioxide.php

On 05/09/14 11:13, whisky-dave wrote:
On Friday, 5 September 2014 10:43:38 UTC+1, Lee wrote:
On 05/09/2014 10:32, Andy Burns wrote:

Lee wrote:



Andy Burns wrote:



what is it that makes paints so expensive?



Well there was that TiO2 price rise a while back...



Is that used in all paint, or just white? This was black ash woodstain ...







Here's some blurb from one woodstain manufacturer, "..contains
nano-particle sized, transparent, titanium dioxide as a sunscreen to
prevent ultraviolet light damage to the wood.."

titanium dioxide is also used in cake making ...
http://food.thefuntimesguide.com/200...um_dioxide.php



And it's been used in white emulsions for a long long time - this is a
not a new compound.

On 05/09/2014 11:27, Tim Watts wrote:

And it's been used in white emulsions for a long long time - this is a
not a new compound.

Of course not, just that there was a pricing spike a couple of years ago
which roughly doubled its cost...

On Friday, September 5, 2014 9:05:41 AM UTC+1, News wrote:

We're having a fairly major redecorating push ATM. I have always bought
paint from our local old fashioned iron monger, who stocks Dulux, and
mixes colours on demand. Wifey bought a 5L tin and said to me how
expensive it is, at nearly 39 pounds a tin, or 22 pounds for 2.5L. Just
checked the B&Q site, where 5L is 38.99 and 2.5L 24 pounds.
No point to message other than support your local shop wherever
possible. Yes, we could probably buy the paint cheaper with a little
shopping around, but we're nearly 50 miles from any major town, so have
to factor in fuel costs and time.

Glidden & Leyland are cheaper & good. I'm told Wilko are too.


NT

wrote in message
...
On Friday, September 5, 2014 9:05:41 AM UTC+1, News wrote:

We're having a fairly major redecorating push ATM. I have always bought
paint from our local old fashioned iron monger, who stocks Dulux, and
mixes colours on demand. Wifey bought a 5L tin and said to me how
expensive it is, at nearly 39 pounds a tin, or 22 pounds for 2.5L. Just
checked the B&Q site, where 5L is 38.99 and 2.5L 24 pounds.
No point to message other than support your local shop wherever
possible. Yes, we could probably buy the paint cheaper with a little
shopping around, but we're nearly 50 miles from any major town, so have
to factor in fuel costs and time.

Glidden & Leyland are cheaper & good. I'm told Wilko are too.

I don't know about topcoat but I recently tried Leyland Trade Brilliant
White Acrylic Primer Undercoat on skirting and architrave. After three coats
there was still showthrough. There may be some paint chemistry thing going
on but, by contrast, one coat (on top) of Dulux Primer and Undercoat for
Wood has done the job.

I wish I had bought the Dulux first but it was mightily expensive.

James

On Friday, 5 September 2014 11:27:02 UTC+1, Tim Watts wrote:


titanium dioxide is also used in cake making ...
http://food.thefuntimesguide.com/200...um_dioxide.php


And it's been used in white emulsions for a long long time - this is a
not a new compound.

Should that make a differnece? horse meat isn't new either but it really shouldn't be used as a secret beef replacement ingredient.

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Friday, 5 September 2014 11:27:02 UTC+1, Tim Watts wrote:


titanium dioxide is also used in cake making ...
http://food.thefuntimesguide.com/200...um_dioxide.php


And it's been used in white emulsions for a long long time - this is a
not a new compound.

Should that make a differnece? horse meat isn't new either but it really
shouldn't be used as a secret beef replacement ingredient.



Titanium dioxide was used to replace white lead oxide

"News" wrote in message
...

We're having a fairly major redecorating push ATM. I have always bought
paint from our local old fashioned iron monger, who stocks Dulux, and
mixes colours on demand. Wifey bought a 5L tin and said to me how
expensive it is, at nearly 39 pounds a tin, or 22 pounds for 2.5L. Just
checked the B&Q site, where 5L is 38.99 and 2.5L 24 pounds.

No point to message other than support your local shop wherever possible.
Yes, we could probably buy the paint cheaper with a little shopping
around, but we're nearly 50 miles from any major town, so have to factor
in fuel costs and time.

Not a bad price.

I've had colours mixed in the past few weeks by my local P&D trade centre.

Leyland trade emulsion mixed to any colour (dulux, crown, b&q etc) is £35
for 5L and £18 for 2.5L

The trade paint from B&Q is £40 for 5L, brilliant white or maggy, wheras
from the above centre, white and maggy trade are less than £40 for TEN
litres

All the rest of the paints B&Q sell are crap, IE Dulux, Jhonsons, Leyland
and Crown are all watered down, no pigment, 3 coats required, and even then,
when you do eventually manage to get a decent covering, it comes off onto
your clothes when you brush past it, and no, I'm not talking when it's wet -
a week later - they just seem like water and chalk to me.

There's a lot of things like this at B&Q, their 'De Walt' tools are nowhere
near as good as the same tool bought elsewhere, this is well known, and it
looks like they are asking manufacturers to 'cut the price whichever way you
can'.

I won't buy paint from B&Q after last time i used it - customer got 2.5L of
'Dulux' white silk at B&Q for a kitchen, the walls were originally pale blue
and the ceiling white, he wanted it all white.
Did the ceiling and walls two coats and it was all gone, trouble is, the
walls were still blue and the ceiling looked like someone had painted it
with custard.
Went to my trade centre and got 2.5l of trade silk and it took a litre and
half to do the whole thing perfect - if I'd got this paint first, I not only
would have saved him £8 on the cost of the paint, the ceiling would have
gone in one and the walls in two. False economy

In article ,
"Brian Gaff" wrote:

Which reminds me, why IS paint so expensive these days. what critical
ingredient is worth this sum?

Isn't the key word "Cartel"?
I noticed the other day that Dulux is [now] owned by Akzonobel -- dunno
how long they've owned them ... oh yes I do -- just wiki'd them: they
bought ICI in 2008, but I'm sure they didn't use to advertise the fact
on Dulux paint cans.

"All your base[coat]s [and topcoats] are belong to us"!

John

Another John wrote:
In ,
"Brian wrote:

Which reminds me, why IS paint so expensive these days. what critical
ingredient is worth this sum?

Isn't the key word "Cartel"?
I noticed the other day that Dulux is [now] owned by Akzonobel -- dunno
how long they've owned them ... oh yes I do -- just wiki'd them: they
bought ICI in 2008, but I'm sure they didn't use to advertise the fact
on Dulux paint cans.

"All your base[coat]s [and topcoats] are belong to us"!

John
Is it now time to go back to mixing your own paint as was done a
century ago?

On 05/09/2014 11:41, Lee wrote:

Of course not, just that there was a pricing spike a couple of years ago
which roughly doubled its cost...

Alibaba has it about USD2000/tonne. So there can't be more than a couple
of quids worth in a tin of paint.

Andy

In article ,
says...

We're having a fairly major redecorating push ATM. I have always bought
paint from our local old fashioned iron monger, who stocks Dulux, and
mixes colours on demand. Wifey bought a 5L tin and said to me how
expensive it is, at nearly 39 pounds a tin, or 22 pounds for 2.5L. Just
checked the B&Q site, where 5L is 38.99 and 2.5L 24 pounds.

Isn't paint pricing interesting.

We're painting the house ATM & buy (Dulux Trade Weathershield) from
Dulux on-line.

5L £25.20 ex vat
7.5L £21.99 ex vat
10L £47.88 ex vat

That's not a "short-term, we'll sort it out tomorrow" hiccup, those
prices were the same when we bought some in May.


--
Sam

On 05/09/14 23:53, Sam Plusnet wrote:
In article ,
says...

We're having a fairly major redecorating push ATM. I have always bought
paint from our local old fashioned iron monger, who stocks Dulux, and
mixes colours on demand. Wifey bought a 5L tin and said to me how
expensive it is, at nearly 39 pounds a tin, or 22 pounds for 2.5L. Just
checked the B&Q site, where 5L is 38.99 and 2.5L 24 pounds.

Isn't paint pricing interesting.

We're painting the house ATM & buy (Dulux Trade Weathershield) from
Dulux on-line.

5L £25.20 ex vat
7.5L £21.99 ex vat
10L £47.88 ex vat

That's not a "short-term, we'll sort it out tomorrow" hiccup, those
prices were the same when we bought some in May.

That's just stupid - encouraging waste.

There are also times I need 1l of emulsion but that's impossible to buy
even in common colours like white and magnolia.

In article ,
Andy Burns writes:
News wrote:

a 5L tin [...] at nearly 39 pounds

Whilst wielding a paintbrush and a 1 litre tin of woodstain that cost
£14, I wondered what is it that makes paints so expensive?

There's been a lot of R&D over the last 5 years as the EU keeps
banning the products they use in paints/varnishes, and they have
to find some alternatives which work anywhere near as well.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On Saturday, September 6, 2014 7:48:25 AM UTC+1, Tim Watts wrote:
On 05/09/14 23:53, Sam Plusnet wrote:

In article ,

says...





There are also times I need 1l of emulsion but that's impossible to buy

even in common colours like white and magnolia.

Our local shop does 1 litre tins of Dulux emulsion for mixed paints.

Jonathan

Andrew Gabriel wrote:

Andy Burns writes:

what is it that makes paints so expensive?

There's been a lot of R&D over the last 5 years as the EU keeps
banning the products they use in paints/varnishes

The septics don't fare much better, I had a glance at some Home Depot
prices for white gloss

1 quart (~1 litre) for $14 (£8.50)
5 gallons (~19 litres) for $135 (£83)

presumably plus taxes.

On Friday, September 5, 2014 8:58:40 PM UTC+1, Capitol wrote:

Is it now time to go back to mixing your own paint as was done a
century ago?

I've wondered that too. Where do you get white pigment for oil paint cheaply, ie not lime?


NT

/
I've wondered that too. Where do you get white pigment for oil paint cheaply, ie not lime?


NT /q

How much do you imagine you need?

Jim K

In article , Andrew Gabriel
writes
In article ,
Andy Burns writes:
News wrote:

a 5L tin [...] at nearly 39 pounds

Whilst wielding a paintbrush and a 1 litre tin of woodstain that cost
£14, I wondered what is it that makes paints so expensive?

There's been a lot of R&D over the last 5 years as the EU keeps
banning the products they use in paints/varnishes, and they have
to find some alternatives which work anywhere near as well.

Did you mean to say, " . . . . and they have _yet_ to find some
alternatives which work anywhere near as well."

That's certainly my view.
--
fred
it's a ba-na-na . . . .

On Fri, 5 Sep 2014 18:08:33 +0100, "harryagain"
wrote:


"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Friday, 5 September 2014 11:27:02 UTC+1, Tim Watts wrote:


titanium dioxide is also used in cake making ...
http://food.thefuntimesguide.com/200...um_dioxide.php


And it's been used in white emulsions for a long long time - this is a
not a new compound.

Should that make a differnece? horse meat isn't new either but it really
shouldn't be used as a secret beef replacement ingredient.



Titanium dioxide was used to replace white lead oxide


It's also used in Dye Solar Cells. I don't know whether the price
spike was anything to do with this recent technology development or
not. Maybe someone has decided to mass produce Dye Solar Cells and
increased demand for Titanium dioxide by a sudden and significant
amount. Just a thought (if not this, perhaps something else?).
--
J B Good

On 06/09/2014 17:33, Johny B Good wrote:
On Fri, 5 Sep 2014 18:08:33 +0100, "harryagain"
wrote:


"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Friday, 5 September 2014 11:27:02 UTC+1, Tim Watts wrote:


titanium dioxide is also used in cake making ...
http://food.thefuntimesguide.com/200...um_dioxide.php


And it's been used in white emulsions for a long long time - this is a
not a new compound.

Should that make a differnece? horse meat isn't new either but it really
shouldn't be used as a secret beef replacement ingredient.



Titanium dioxide was used to replace white lead oxide


It's also used in Dye Solar Cells. I don't know whether the price
spike was anything to do with this recent technology development or
not. Maybe someone has decided to mass produce Dye Solar Cells and
increased demand for Titanium dioxide by a sudden and significant
amount. Just a thought (if not this, perhaps something else?).

I first heard about those roughly six years ago, and as they can be made
virtually transparent, the idea was to put the coating on office
windows, and use the power while reducing the cooling load in Summer.
Pennies per square metre, for a power of a couple of watts per square metre.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On Friday, September 5, 2014 9:04:34 PM UTC+1, Vir Campestris wrote:
Alibaba has it about USD2000/tonne.

White lead / lead carbonate is USD 240 / tonne.

Of course I don't know how many tonnes you need of white lead compared to tit dioxide in paint.

Owain

In article ,
fred writes:
In article , Andrew Gabriel
writes
In article ,
Andy Burns writes:
News wrote:

a 5L tin [...] at nearly 39 pounds

Whilst wielding a paintbrush and a 1 litre tin of woodstain that cost
£14, I wondered what is it that makes paints so expensive?

There's been a lot of R&D over the last 5 years as the EU keeps
banning the products they use in paints/varnishes, and they have
to find some alternatives which work anywhere near as well.

Did you mean to say, " . . . . and they have _yet_ to find some
alternatives which work anywhere near as well."

That's certainly the case for gloss paint.
They can't match the original 'wet' look of dried gloss,
and found the binders which some new paints use change
colour rather quickly after they set, wrecking white
gloss colour in particular.

That's certainly my view.

and the paint industry's.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On Friday, September 5, 2014 11:53:35 PM UTC+1, Sam Plusnet wrote:

We're painting the house ATM

So the bank owns your home?

On Saturday, September 6, 2014 10:15:56 PM UTC+1, mike wrote:
We're painting the house ATM
So the bank owns your home?

It's the modern equivalent of having a payphone so the kids can pay for their calls.

Owain

On 06/09/2014 11:42, Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article ,
Andy Burns writes:
News wrote:

a 5L tin [...] at nearly 39 pounds

Whilst wielding a paintbrush and a 1 litre tin of woodstain that cost
£14, I wondered what is it that makes paints so expensive?

There's been a lot of R&D over the last 5 years as the EU keeps
banning the products they use in paints/varnishes, and they have
to find some alternatives which work anywhere near as well.


There are too many words in that sentence. :-)

All you needed to say was "The EU keeps banning products (that either
work or compete with German products)"

On 05/09/2014 20:18, Another John wrote:
In article ,
"Brian Gaff" wrote:

Which reminds me, why IS paint so expensive these days. what critical
ingredient is worth this sum?

Isn't the key word "Cartel"?
I noticed the other day that Dulux is [now] owned by Akzonobel -- dunno
how long they've owned them ... oh yes I do -- just wiki'd them: they
bought ICI in 2008, but I'm sure they didn't use to advertise the fact
on Dulux paint cans.

"All your base[coat]s [and topcoats] are belong to us"!

John

Visit your Dulux decorator centre, and you'd be suprised what Akzo Nobel
now own

Andrew wrote:

you'd be suprised what Akzo Nobel now own

Dulux
International
Glidden
Hammerite
Sikkens
Sadolin
Cuprinol

any more?

On 05/09/2014 09:05, News wrote:

We're having a fairly major redecorating push ATM. I have always bought
paint from our local old fashioned iron monger, who stocks Dulux, and
mixes colours on demand. Wifey bought a 5L tin and said to me how
expensive it is, at nearly 39 pounds a tin, or 22 pounds for 2.5L. Just
checked the B&Q site, where 5L is 38.99 and 2.5L 24 pounds.

No point to message other than support your local shop wherever
possible. Yes, we could probably buy the paint cheaper with a little
shopping around, but we're nearly 50 miles from any major town, so have
to factor in fuel costs and time.

If you have a Wilkinsons near, their paint is very good and very good value.


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

In article , Andy
Burns writes
Andrew wrote:

you'd be suprised what Akzo Nobel now own

Dulux
International
Glidden
Hammerite
Sikkens
Sadolin
Cuprinol

any more?

Feel free to rearrange into a sentence starting with:

It Sikkens me what Akzo Nobel has done with . . . . . .
--
fred
it's a ba-na-na . . . .

On Sunday, September 7, 2014 4:03:29 PM UTC+1, The Medway Handyman wrote:
On 05/09/2014 09:05, News wrote:

We're having a fairly major redecorating push ATM. I have always bought
paint from our local old fashioned iron monger, who stocks Dulux, and
mixes colours on demand. Wifey bought a 5L tin and said to me how
expensive it is, at nearly 39 pounds a tin, or 22 pounds for 2.5L. Just
checked the B&Q site, where 5L is 38.99 and 2.5L 24 pounds.

No point to message other than support your local shop wherever
possible. Yes, we could probably buy the paint cheaper with a little
shopping around, but we're nearly 50 miles from any major town, so have
to factor in fuel costs and time.

If you have a Wilkinsons near, their paint is very good and very good value.

Which of their paints do you know or good, or have you used the lot? Think I'll try going Wilko, Dulux is getting unnecessarily (I think) pricey.


NT

On Sat, 06 Sep 2014 12:01:41 +0100 Andy Burns wrote :
The septics don't fare much better, I had a glance at some Home Depot
prices for white gloss

1 quart (~1 litre) for $14 (£8.50)
5 gallons (~19 litres) for $135 (£83)

presumably plus taxes.

Try buying paint he one litre of Dulux wash and wear interior gloss
A$40.70, or about £23

http://www.bunnings.com.au/dulux-was...paint_p1405203

--
Tony Bryer, Greentram: 'Software to build on',
Melbourne, Australia www.greentram.com

Andy Burns wrote:

Andrew wrote:

you'd be suprised what Akzo Nobel now own

Dulux
International
Glidden
Hammerite
Sikkens
Sadolin
Cuprinol

any more?

Sadolin is owned by Akzo Nobel but the Sadolin website firmly says "Crown
Paints" at the bottom of the page. The Crown website lists Crown, Sandtex,
Sadolin and Berger as their product.

But the odd thing is that
https://www.akzonobel.com/brands_pro...nds/index.aspx lists
Sadolin among their huge list of brands but not Berger, Crown or Sandtex.

Tony Bryer wrote:

Try buying paint he one litre of Dulux wash and wear interior gloss
A$40.70, or about £23

http://www.bunnings.com.au/dulux-was...paint_p1405203

So Bunnings sell Dulux and "British Paints" which is an Aussie sub-brand
of Dulux, and Taubman's, so they're all Akzo Nobel brands?