So I seem to have to do something about a spring that's appeared. The
garden's got a bit of a slope to it, with fields next to it, and a semi-
derelict area directly above. There's been a couple of large and old
trees down over the winter, which probably used to slurp a lot of the
excess water up.

That bit of the garden's always been a bit boggy, I'm told, but has never
done anything like this in the last seven years.

The lawn's squelchy, the flowerbed's boggy, and the paving slab path is
awash. A temporary measure's seen a hosepipe lain next to the path, with
the worst rivulet running straight into it, and off into the handy drain
outside the kitchen. Without that, it was running down into next door's
garden (about a metre and a half lower level) and flooding their garage.
There's still plenty missing the hose, but what's going through is
probably a litre or so a minute.

The water company have investigated, and there's no pipes that could
possibly be responsible for the leak. It can really only be groundwater.

So... Suggestions?

I'm thinking in terms of pulling the slabs up, digging out, and laying
something to pull the water towards the drain - about 6-7m away, and mebbe
half a metre (at most) lower.

But what?

Shallow trench, perforated plastic pipe at the bottom, surrounded by
gravel, with the slabs relaid back on top? Would that be adequate?

On 27/05/2014 16:45, Adrian wrote:
So I seem to have to do something about a spring that's appeared. The
garden's got a bit of a slope to it, with fields next to it, and a semi-
derelict area directly above. There's been a couple of large and old
trees down over the winter, which probably used to slurp a lot of the
excess water up.

Snip
The water company have investigated, and there's no pipes that could
possibly be responsible for the leak. It can really only be groundwater.

So... Suggestions?

Go with the flow and make it a water feature?


--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On Tue, 27 May 2014 17:07:40 +0100, John Williamson wrote:

So... Suggestions?

Go with the flow and make it a water feature?

That suggestion was not very warmly received...

"Adrian" wrote in message ...

On Tue, 27 May 2014 17:07:40 +0100, John Williamson wrote:

So... Suggestions?

Go with the flow and make it a water feature?

That suggestion was not very warmly received...


Now remind me ... who was the bra-less bird that always put water features
in garden make overs ?

Andrew

On Tue, 27 May 2014 17:22:48 +0100, Andrew Mawson wrote:

So... Suggestions?

Go with the flow and make it a water feature?

That suggestion was not very warmly received...

Now remind me ... who was the bra-less bird that always put water
features in garden make overs ?

You're thinking of Ms Dimmock's Charlies.

But, to try to head back to topic, this really would be a crap location
for a water feature.

"Adrian" wrote in message
...
So I seem to have to do something about a spring that's appeared. The
garden's got a bit of a slope to it, with fields next to it, and a semi-
derelict area directly above. There's been a couple of large and old
trees down over the winter, which probably used to slurp a lot of the
excess water up.

That bit of the garden's always been a bit boggy, I'm told, but has never
done anything like this in the last seven years.

The lawn's squelchy, the flowerbed's boggy, and the paving slab path is
awash. A temporary measure's seen a hosepipe lain next to the path, with
the worst rivulet running straight into it, and off into the handy drain
outside the kitchen. Without that, it was running down into next door's
garden (about a metre and a half lower level) and flooding their garage.
There's still plenty missing the hose, but what's going through is
probably a litre or so a minute.

The water company have investigated, and there's no pipes that could
possibly be responsible for the leak. It can really only be groundwater.

So... Suggestions?

I'm thinking in terms of pulling the slabs up, digging out, and laying
something to pull the water towards the drain - about 6-7m away, and mebbe
half a metre (at most) lower.

But what?

Shallow trench, perforated plastic pipe at the bottom, surrounded by
gravel, with the slabs relaid back on top? Would that be adequate?

All you can do is put some sort of culvert/pipe in and conduct the water
away to a place where it causes no problems.
Dig down where the water has appeared and make a catchment filled with
rubbble.
Make sure you leave facitilty to clear out your pipe if it silts up.

Adrian scribbled...


So I seem to have to do something about a spring that's appeared. The
garden's got a bit of a slope to it, with fields next to it, and a semi-
derelict area directly above. There's been a couple of large and old
trees down over the winter, which probably used to slurp a lot of the
excess water up.

That bit of the garden's always been a bit boggy, I'm told, but has never
done anything like this in the last seven years.

The lawn's squelchy, the flowerbed's boggy, and the paving slab path is
awash. A temporary measure's seen a hosepipe lain next to the path, with
the worst rivulet running straight into it, and off into the handy drain
outside the kitchen. Without that, it was running down into next door's
garden (about a metre and a half lower level) and flooding their garage.
There's still plenty missing the hose, but what's going through is
probably a litre or so a minute.

The water company have investigated, and there's no pipes that could
possibly be responsible for the leak. It can really only be groundwater.

So... Suggestions?

I'm thinking in terms of pulling the slabs up, digging out, and laying
something to pull the water towards the drain - about 6-7m away, and mebbe
half a metre (at most) lower.

But what?

Shallow trench, perforated plastic pipe at the bottom, surrounded by
gravel, with the slabs relaid back on top? Would that be adequate?


How old is the house? I had a place once in Wales, loadsa water and the
gardens up the road were criss crossed with basic land drains leading
into one another. A couple were blocked and caused problems further up.
One created a large hole, deep enough for a neighbour to fall into when
she was putting out the washing.

On Tuesday, May 27, 2014 4:45:26 PM UTC+1, Adrian wrote:
So I seem to have to do something about a spring that's appeared. The

garden's got a bit of a slope to it, with fields next to it, and a semi-

derelict area directly above. There's been a couple of large and old

trees down over the winter, which probably used to slurp a lot of the

excess water up.



That bit of the garden's always been a bit boggy, I'm told, but has never

done anything like this in the last seven years.



The lawn's squelchy, the flowerbed's boggy, and the paving slab path is

awash. A temporary measure's seen a hosepipe lain next to the path, with

the worst rivulet running straight into it, and off into the handy drain

outside the kitchen. Without that, it was running down into next door's

garden (about a metre and a half lower level) and flooding their garage.

There's still plenty missing the hose, but what's going through is

probably a litre or so a minute.



The water company have investigated, and there's no pipes that could

possibly be responsible for the leak. It can really only be groundwater.



So... Suggestions?



I'm thinking in terms of pulling the slabs up, digging out, and laying

something to pull the water towards the drain - about 6-7m away, and mebbe

half a metre (at most) lower.



But what?

Bottle it. Peckham-like spring water.

No idea; I don't do drains and won't post ********.
I consult this site when I need information about such things;

http://www.pavingexpert.com/drainage.htm

Adrian wrote:
On Tue, 27 May 2014 17:07:40 +0100, John Williamson wrote:

So... Suggestions?

Go with the flow and make it a water feature?

That suggestion was not very warmly received...

Go for your own brand of spring water?

Capitol wrote:
Go for your own brand of spring water?

using a dibber on a very long pole to avoid footprints, mark out an image of the Madonna overnight then invite the local vicar round for morning coffee.

Owain

Adrian wrote:
So I seem to have to do something about a spring that's appeared. The
garden's got a bit of a slope to it, with fields next to it, and a
semi- derelict area directly above. There's been a couple of large
and old trees down over the winter, which probably used to slurp a
lot of the excess water up.

That bit of the garden's always been a bit boggy, I'm told, but has
never done anything like this in the last seven years.

The lawn's squelchy, the flowerbed's boggy, and the paving slab path
is awash. A temporary measure's seen a hosepipe lain next to the
path, with the worst rivulet running straight into it, and off into
the handy drain outside the kitchen. Without that, it was running
down into next door's garden (about a metre and a half lower level)
and flooding their garage. There's still plenty missing the hose, but
what's going through is probably a litre or so a minute.

The water company have investigated, and there's no pipes that could
possibly be responsible for the leak. It can really only be
groundwater.

So... Suggestions?

I'm thinking in terms of pulling the slabs up, digging out, and laying
something to pull the water towards the drain - about 6-7m away, and
mebbe half a metre (at most) lower.

But what?

Shallow trench, perforated plastic pipe at the bottom, surrounded by
gravel, with the slabs relaid back on top? Would that be adequate?

It would remove some of the water, but the drain would silt up in no time.

And when you say shallow, you do realise that most of the water will go
underneath it if you do it like this.

What's the ground structure? - clay, chalk, slate, sandstone etc...as you
are on a hill, I'm guessing either stone or clay?

On Tue, 27 May 2014 19:07:58 +0100, Phil L wrote:

I'm thinking in terms of pulling the slabs up, digging out, and laying
something to pull the water towards the drain - about 6-7m away, and
mebbe half a metre (at most) lower.

But what?

Shallow trench, perforated plastic pipe at the bottom, surrounded by
gravel, with the slabs relaid back on top? Would that be adequate?

It would remove some of the water, but the drain would silt up in no
time.

PavingExpert suggests membrane as a filter should prevent that. Not good
'nuff?

And when you say shallow, you do realise that most of the water will go
underneath it if you do it like this.

My thinking was that going deep is going to leave it too deep to get into
the drain. Plus I don't want to dig too deep, because I'm idle and
unfit...

The main issue is the surface water.

What's the ground structure? - clay, chalk, slate, sandstone etc...as
you are on a hill, I'm guessing either stone or clay?

Yeh, it's clay.

Adrian wrote:
On Tue, 27 May 2014 19:07:58 +0100, Phil L wrote:

I'm thinking in terms of pulling the slabs up, digging out, and
laying something to pull the water towards the drain - about 6-7m
away, and mebbe half a metre (at most) lower.

But what?

Shallow trench, perforated plastic pipe at the bottom, surrounded by
gravel, with the slabs relaid back on top? Would that be adequate?

It would remove some of the water, but the drain would silt up in no
time.

PavingExpert suggests membrane as a filter should prevent that. Not
good 'nuff?


Yes, weed membrane will work, but the plastic pipe will have to be
completely wrapped in it before you put it in.
You can tape it on - it doesn't matter if the tape deteriorates afterwards
as it will be held in place by the surrounding materials

And when you say shallow, you do realise that most of the water will
go underneath it if you do it like this.

My thinking was that going deep is going to leave it too deep to get
into the drain. Plus I don't want to dig too deep, because I'm idle
and unfit...

The main issue is the surface water.

What's the ground structure? - clay, chalk, slate, sandstone etc...as
you are on a hill, I'm guessing either stone or clay?

Yeh, it's clay.

You'd be as well starting at the drain and lay the pipe from there, allowing
a gentle slope upwards.

It's best the have the land drain actually sitting in the clay if possible.

When you cover the land drain with stone/shingle etc, this will silt up with
washed-down clay particles and will need annual attention to keep working

On 27/05/2014 17:16, Adrian wrote:
On Tue, 27 May 2014 17:07:40 +0100, John Williamson wrote:

So... Suggestions?

Go with the flow and make it a water feature?

That suggestion was not very warmly received...

Sorry, I missed out the smiley.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

In article ,
says...

I'm thinking in terms of pulling the slabs up, digging out, and laying
something to pull the water towards the drain - about 6-7m away, and mebbe
half a metre (at most) lower.


If it's like here, you can do all of that & at about the time you're
sitting back & congratulating yourself on a job well done - the spring
will shift to another spot & you'll have to start over.

Good luck.


--
Sam

On 27/05/2014 16:45, Adrian wrote:
So I seem to have to do something about a spring that's appeared. The
garden's got a bit of a slope to it, with fields next to it, and a semi-
derelict area directly above. There's been a couple of large and old
trees down over the winter, which probably used to slurp a lot of the
excess water up.

That bit of the garden's always been a bit boggy, I'm told, but has never
done anything like this in the last seven years.

The lawn's squelchy, the flowerbed's boggy, and the paving slab path is
awash. A temporary measure's seen a hosepipe lain next to the path, with
the worst rivulet running straight into it, and off into the handy drain
outside the kitchen. Without that, it was running down into next door's
garden (about a metre and a half lower level) and flooding their garage.
There's still plenty missing the hose, but what's going through is
probably a litre or so a minute.

The water company have investigated, and there's no pipes that could
possibly be responsible for the leak. It can really only be groundwater.

So... Suggestions?

I'm thinking in terms of pulling the slabs up, digging out, and laying
something to pull the water towards the drain - about 6-7m away, and mebbe
half a metre (at most) lower.

But what?

Shallow trench, perforated plastic pipe at the bottom, surrounded by
gravel, with the slabs relaid back on top? Would that be adequate?


The correct answer is to put a land drain across the highest point of
the garden and run that down to your drain. It will intercept the water
that is feeding this spring and dry out the land below it.

Colin Bignell

On Tue, 27 May 2014 19:52:15 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

The correct answer is to put a land drain across the highest point of
the garden and run that down to your drain. It will intercept the water
that is feeding this spring and dry out the land below it.

That makes a lot of sense. Sort the problem, not the symptom.

Digging a test hole or two should show whether it'd be effective, right?

On Tue, 27 May 2014 19:48:21 +0100, Sam Plusnet wrote:

Good luck.

Thanks... It sounds like I'm going to need it...

Adrian wrote:
So I seem to have to do something about a spring that's appeared. The
garden's got a bit of a slope to it, with fields next to it, and a semi-
derelict area directly above. There's been a couple of large and old
trees down over the winter, which probably used to slurp a lot of the
excess water up.

That bit of the garden's always been a bit boggy, I'm told, but has never
done anything like this in the last seven years.

The lawn's squelchy, the flowerbed's boggy, and the paving slab path is
awash. A temporary measure's seen a hosepipe lain next to the path, with
the worst rivulet running straight into it, and off into the handy drain
outside the kitchen. Without that, it was running down into next door's
garden (about a metre and a half lower level) and flooding their garage.
There's still plenty missing the hose, but what's going through is
probably a litre or so a minute.

The water company have investigated, and there's no pipes that could
possibly be responsible for the leak. It can really only be groundwater.

So... Suggestions?

I'm thinking in terms of pulling the slabs up, digging out, and laying
something to pull the water towards the drain - about 6-7m away, and mebbe
half a metre (at most) lower.

But what?

Shallow trench, perforated plastic pipe at the bottom, surrounded by
gravel, with the slabs relaid back on top? Would that be adequate?

Just to double check, turn off all taps dont use the loo for a period
and check the water meter before and after to see if water is being used.

During all that rain at the start of the year, I had water actually bubbling
up near a shed, so I can understand where you are coming from. Luckily its
stopped, but the difficult part is to find where its coming from Hear we are
on clay not far down, and it seems to be saturated pretty well and I guess
the water just tried to run off and found the path of least resistance. If
you are also on clay, then this might be a similar issue, and so I reckon
your idea is quite good. No need to go overboard as it might not be there
all the time, after all.
Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
"Adrian" wrote in message
...
So I seem to have to do something about a spring that's appeared. The
garden's got a bit of a slope to it, with fields next to it, and a semi-
derelict area directly above. There's been a couple of large and old
trees down over the winter, which probably used to slurp a lot of the
excess water up.

That bit of the garden's always been a bit boggy, I'm told, but has never
done anything like this in the last seven years.

The lawn's squelchy, the flowerbed's boggy, and the paving slab path is
awash. A temporary measure's seen a hosepipe lain next to the path, with
the worst rivulet running straight into it, and off into the handy drain
outside the kitchen. Without that, it was running down into next door's
garden (about a metre and a half lower level) and flooding their garage.
There's still plenty missing the hose, but what's going through is
probably a litre or so a minute.

The water company have investigated, and there's no pipes that could
possibly be responsible for the leak. It can really only be groundwater.

So... Suggestions?

I'm thinking in terms of pulling the slabs up, digging out, and laying
something to pull the water towards the drain - about 6-7m away, and mebbe
half a metre (at most) lower.

But what?

Shallow trench, perforated plastic pipe at the bottom, surrounded by
gravel, with the slabs relaid back on top? Would that be adequate?

Went down like a damp, erm...
Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
"Adrian" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 27 May 2014 17:07:40 +0100, John Williamson wrote:

So... Suggestions?

Go with the flow and make it a water feature?

That suggestion was not very warmly received...

On Wed, 28 May 2014 08:23:59 +1000, F Murtz wrote:

Just to double check, turn off all taps dont use the loo for a period
and check the water meter before and after to see if water is being
used.

The amount of water does come and go with rain, and there's no household
water anywhere near where it's surfacing - or uphill...

On Tue, 27 May 2014 23:57:42 +0100, Brian Gaff wrote:

During all that rain at the start of the year, I had water actually
bubbling up near a shed, so I can understand where you are coming from.
Luckily its stopped, but the difficult part is to find where its coming
from Hear we are on clay not far down, and it seems to be saturated
pretty well and I guess the water just tried to run off and found the
path of least resistance. If you are also on clay, then this might be a
similar issue, and so I reckon your idea is quite good. No need to go
overboard as it might not be there all the time, after all.
Brian

Thanks, Brian!

On 27/05/2014 22:08, Adrian wrote:
On Tue, 27 May 2014 19:52:15 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

The correct answer is to put a land drain across the highest point of
the garden and run that down to your drain. It will intercept the water
that is feeding this spring and dry out the land below it.

That makes a lot of sense. Sort the problem, not the symptom.

Digging a test hole or two should show whether it'd be effective, right?


I don't think there is any doubt that it will be effective. It is a
basic principle of land drainage that, on sloping ground, a drain dries
the land below it. Whether the holes will show you anything will rather
depend upon the exact route the water takes. However, you are going to
have to dig a trench for the drain anyway, so digging a couple of holes
first won't do any harm.

I would hire a mini-digger, so as not to be tempted to skimp on digging
the trench. It is something you only want to have to do once. This goes
into great detail about how to do the job:

http://www.pavingexpert.com/drain16.htm

Colin Bignell

On Wed, 28 May 2014 08:13:36 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

I would hire a mini-digger

Unfortunately, access is appalling. There's a couple of steps to the
narrow and very badly paved walkway which goes past a couple of
neighbours, then a tight 90deg bend part under the bungalow's eaves - and
the path involved is under trees, and right next to the heating oil tank.

On 28/05/2014 08:13, Nightjar wrote:
On 27/05/2014 22:08, Adrian wrote:
On Tue, 27 May 2014 19:52:15 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

The correct answer is to put a land drain across the highest point of
the garden and run that down to your drain. It will intercept the water
that is feeding this spring and dry out the land below it.

That makes a lot of sense. Sort the problem, not the symptom.

Digging a test hole or two should show whether it'd be effective, right?


I don't think there is any doubt that it will be effective. It is a
basic principle of land drainage that, on sloping ground, a drain dries
the land below it. Whether the holes will show you anything will rather
depend upon the exact route the water takes. However, you are going to
have to dig a trench for the drain anyway, so digging a couple of holes
first won't do any harm.

I would hire a mini-digger, so as not to be tempted to skimp on digging
the trench. It is something you only want to have to do once. This goes
into great detail about how to do the job:

http://www.pavingexpert.com/drain16.htm

Colin Bignell

+1

As long as your trench goes deep enough to intercept the water path.
Might be worth hiring a powered auger to do the test holes first?

In message ,
newshound writes
On 28/05/2014 08:13, Nightjar wrote:
On 27/05/2014 22:08, Adrian wrote:
On Tue, 27 May 2014 19:52:15 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

The correct answer is to put a land drain across the highest point of
the garden and run that down to your drain. It will intercept the water
that is feeding this spring and dry out the land below it.

That makes a lot of sense. Sort the problem, not the symptom.

Digging a test hole or two should show whether it'd be effective, right?


I don't think there is any doubt that it will be effective. It is a
basic principle of land drainage that, on sloping ground, a drain dries
the land below it. Whether the holes will show you anything will rather
depend upon the exact route the water takes. However, you are going to
have to dig a trench for the drain anyway, so digging a couple of holes
first won't do any harm.

I would hire a mini-digger, so as not to be tempted to skimp on digging
the trench. It is something you only want to have to do once. This goes
into great detail about how to do the job:

http://www.pavingexpert.com/drain16.htm

Colin Bignell

+1

As long as your trench goes deep enough to intercept the water path.
Might be worth hiring a powered auger to do the test holes first?

Hand digging in wet clay is easy.
I defer to Phil's expertise but *springing* here (Herts.) occurs where
chalk or pervious material, overlying clay has been exposed in a valley.

The springs in my garden have only just stopped running. Last winter was
exceptional judging by the height of the water table.

--
Tim Lamb

Adrian put finger to keyboard:

On Wed, 28 May 2014 08:13:36 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

I would hire a mini-digger

Unfortunately, access is appalling. There's a couple of steps to the
narrow and very badly paved walkway which goes past a couple of
neighbours, then a tight 90deg bend part under the bungalow's eaves -
and the path involved is under trees, and right next to the heating oil
tank.

Hiab? Or would it have to be craned over the house?

On Wed, 28 May 2014 12:55:30 +0000, Scion wrote:

I would hire a mini-digger

Unfortunately, access is appalling. There's a couple of steps to the
narrow and very badly paved walkway which goes past a couple of
neighbours, then a tight 90deg bend part under the bungalow's eaves -
and the path involved is under trees, and right next to the heating oil
tank.

Hiab? Or would it have to be craned over the house?

It would... But, even then, it'd have to be a VERY long-reach crane. It'd
have to go pretty much along a row of four bungalows.

On 28/05/2014 11:04, Adrian wrote:
On Wed, 28 May 2014 08:13:36 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

I would hire a mini-digger

Unfortunately, access is appalling. There's a couple of steps to the
narrow and very badly paved walkway which goes past a couple of
neighbours, then a tight 90deg bend part under the bungalow's eaves - and
the path involved is under trees, and right next to the heating oil tank.


The alternative is a couple of Polish navvies, which is what BT used
when they needed to dig a few hundred yards of trench to my house.

Colin Bignell

On 27/05/2014 17:29, Adrian wrote:
On Tue, 27 May 2014 17:22:48 +0100, Andrew Mawson wrote:

So... Suggestions?

Go with the flow and make it a water feature?

That suggestion was not very warmly received...

Now remind me ... who was the bra-less bird that always put water
features in garden make overs ?

You're thinking of Ms Dimmock's Charlies.

But, to try to head back to topic, this really would be a crap location
for a water feature.


What about a tree that needs lots of water? A willow or an alder would
love such a spot.

Colin Bignell

On Wed, 28 May 2014 15:41:27 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

What about a tree that needs lots of water? A willow or an alder would
love such a spot.

Yeh, that's definitely a suggestion I was planning on making...

On 28/05/2014 12:06, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message ,
newshound writes
On 28/05/2014 08:13, Nightjar wrote:
On 27/05/2014 22:08, Adrian wrote:
On Tue, 27 May 2014 19:52:15 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

The correct answer is to put a land drain across the highest point of
the garden and run that down to your drain. It will intercept the
water
that is feeding this spring and dry out the land below it.

That makes a lot of sense. Sort the problem, not the symptom.

Digging a test hole or two should show whether it'd be effective,
right?


I don't think there is any doubt that it will be effective. It is a
basic principle of land drainage that, on sloping ground, a drain dries
the land below it. Whether the holes will show you anything will rather
depend upon the exact route the water takes. However, you are going to
have to dig a trench for the drain anyway, so digging a couple of holes
first won't do any harm.

I would hire a mini-digger, so as not to be tempted to skimp on digging
the trench. It is something you only want to have to do once. This goes
into great detail about how to do the job:

http://www.pavingexpert.com/drain16.htm

Colin Bignell

+1

As long as your trench goes deep enough to intercept the water path.
Might be worth hiring a powered auger to do the test holes first?

Hand digging in wet clay is easy.
I defer to Phil's expertise but *springing* here (Herts.) occurs where
chalk or pervious material, overlying clay has been exposed in a valley.

The springs in my garden have only just stopped running. Last winter was
exceptional judging by the height of the water table.

Another place for springs can be along a sand layer between two layers
of clay or clay and an impermeable rock. Those are fun, because as soon
as you block it *here*, it starts coming out *there*, which can be a
foot away or a hundred yards, depending. Sometimes, they just move for
the fun of it.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On 28/05/2014 16:59, John Williamson wrote:
On 28/05/2014 12:06, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message ,
newshound writes
On 28/05/2014 08:13, Nightjar wrote:
On 27/05/2014 22:08, Adrian wrote:
On Tue, 27 May 2014 19:52:15 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

The correct answer is to put a land drain across the highest point of
the garden and run that down to your drain. It will intercept the
water
that is feeding this spring and dry out the land below it.

That makes a lot of sense. Sort the problem, not the symptom.

Digging a test hole or two should show whether it'd be effective,
right?


I don't think there is any doubt that it will be effective. It is a
basic principle of land drainage that, on sloping ground, a drain dries
the land below it. Whether the holes will show you anything will rather
depend upon the exact route the water takes. However, you are going to
have to dig a trench for the drain anyway, so digging a couple of holes
first won't do any harm.

I would hire a mini-digger, so as not to be tempted to skimp on digging
the trench. It is something you only want to have to do once. This goes
into great detail about how to do the job:

http://www.pavingexpert.com/drain16.htm

Colin Bignell

+1

As long as your trench goes deep enough to intercept the water path.
Might be worth hiring a powered auger to do the test holes first?

Hand digging in wet clay is easy.
I defer to Phil's expertise but *springing* here (Herts.) occurs where
chalk or pervious material, overlying clay has been exposed in a valley.

The springs in my garden have only just stopped running. Last winter was
exceptional judging by the height of the water table.

Another place for springs can be along a sand layer between two layers
of clay or clay and an impermeable rock. Those are fun, because as soon
as you block it *here*, it starts coming out *there*, which can be a
foot away or a hundred yards, depending. Sometimes, they just move for
the fun of it.

We have some like that in our horse paddock.

In article ,
says...

The correct answer is to put a land drain across the highest point of
the garden and run that down to your drain. It will intercept the water
that is feeding this spring and dry out the land below it.


The OP is dealing with a spring.
Your approach would be excellent for surface water, but might not work
for a spring.

I live on the side of a hill.
Rain sinks into the cracks in the bedrock, follows the interstices &
then emerges at unpredictable points on the slope where these come near
the surface. From time to time the water changes route & the point at
which the water comes to the surface shifts for no apparent reason.

Since the water comes out of cracks in the bedrock, it may go nowhere
near your land drain at the highest point - certainly true for my
garden.



--
Sam

On 28/05/2014 19:32, Sam Plusnet wrote:
In article ,
says...

The correct answer is to put a land drain across the highest point of
the garden and run that down to your drain. It will intercept the water
that is feeding this spring and dry out the land below it.


The OP is dealing with a spring.
Your approach would be excellent for surface water, but might not work
for a spring.

I live on the side of a hill.
Rain sinks into the cracks in the bedrock, follows the interstices &
then emerges at unpredictable points on the slope where these come near
the surface. From time to time the water changes route & the point at
which the water comes to the surface shifts for no apparent reason.

Since the water comes out of cracks in the bedrock, it may go nowhere
near your land drain at the highest point - certainly true for my
garden.

He says the ground is clay, which makes me think that surface water is
the most likely culprit.

Colin Bignell

On 28/05/2014 15:41, Nightjar wrote:
What about a tree that needs lots of water? A willow or an alder would
love such a spot.

Just so long as it's nowhere near the house.

We've got a report than 15 years before we bought the place they had to
take a willow down because it was causing subsidence. 50 yards from the
house concerned.

Andy

On 28/05/14 21:21, Vir Campestris wrote:
On 28/05/2014 15:41, Nightjar wrote:
What about a tree that needs lots of water? A willow or an alder would
love such a spot.

Just so long as it's nowhere near the house.

We've got a report than 15 years before we bought the place they had to
take a willow down because it was causing subsidence. 50 yards from the
house concerned.

Andy
willow and alder are shallow rooted but will suck hard in clay soils
causing heave in dry weather..

fondatins need to be about 750mm to a meter for willow


--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

On 28/05/2014 21:39, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 28/05/14 21:21, Vir Campestris wrote:
On 28/05/2014 15:41, Nightjar wrote:
What about a tree that needs lots of water? A willow or an alder would
love such a spot.

Just so long as it's nowhere near the house.

We've got a report than 15 years before we bought the place they had to
take a willow down because it was causing subsidence. 50 yards from the
house concerned.

Andy
willow and alder are shallow rooted but will suck hard in clay soils
causing heave in dry weather..

fondatins need to be about 750mm to a meter for willow


Some years ago, I wanted to build a porch on the side of the house. As
it was about 5m from a willow, building control wanted 3m deep mass
concrete foundations, which would have cost a lot more than the porch.

Colin Bignell

On Wed, 28 May 2014 22:35:10 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

What about a tree that needs lots of water? A willow or an alder
would love such a spot.

Just so long as it's nowhere near the house.

We've got a report than 15 years before we bought the place they had
to take a willow down because it was causing subsidence. 50 yards from
the house concerned.

willow and alder are shallow rooted but will suck hard in clay soils
causing heave in dry weather..

fondatins need to be about 750mm to a meter for willow

Some years ago, I wanted to build a porch on the side of the house. As
it was about 5m from a willow, building control wanted 3m deep mass
concrete foundations, which would have cost a lot more than the porch.

crosses willow idea off, firmly